
oldsmobile-digest          Tuesday, 2 April 1996       Volume 01 : Number 135


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: bryce_smith@442.com (Bryceman)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:05:35 -0400
Subject: Re: Diagnosing Bearing Problems 

>My question: is that the main symptom? How can you tell exactly which set of
>bearings has gone bad (main, rod, cam) without tearing down the engine? 
>Are there other symptoms that indicate bearing problems without a knock? 

I believe lack of normal oil pressure would also be a symptom. If someone had a spun bearing or a couple of badly worn ones, wouldnt the oil pressure drop greatly?



 EXCESSIVE IRON rules the road!
'65 442
'66 Dynamic 88 B07 Apprehender
 bryceman@442.com
 www.442.com

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:16:14 -0400
Subject: 67 330 engine

To the guy inquiring as to the ID of his engine, casting #???417-3 or ???917-3,
with #4 heads and the W######G code:

Yep, that's a 330 block. Looks correct for your application. The heads' code
indicates 1966 or '67 Cutlass-line with a 4V carb.
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:18:28 -0400
Subject: *.dat Files 

Someone else posted a good question and I haven't seen an answer.

Several messages include a *.dat file.  I've downloaded several but they
don't read anything.

How does one access these files?

Bob Handren
'67 442 W-30 modified
'70 Cutlass SX convert.

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:23:30 -0400
Subject: 330 engine AGAIN

OOOPS! Forgot to include:
you mentioned that the ID tag on the filler tube seemed to be missing but used
to be there. Easy spot: Early [pre-68] oil fill tubes had a simple smooth
tubular top with a press-on oil fill cap. Late [68-up] oil fill tubes have a
twist-on cap with correspondingly enhanced tube shape, AND an engine unit
number stamped into the tube, the first digit of which matches the last digit
of the year in which that engine hit the streets [well, model year, you
know...]

A few more differences:

    Early                               Late
Big-neck PS pump                    Little 1" or so PS fill hole
forged crank                        cast crank [almost universally]
early pattern flywheel/flexplate    Late pattern flywheel/flexplate
45 degree cam required              39 degree cam required
  [except .921" lifter BB's]            [all engines]
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: bryce_smith@442.com (Bryceman)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:36:04 -0400
Subject: TH 400 Shifting 

I have a question for the transmission gurus out there... 
The transmission (TH 400) in the Apprehender used to give really firm shifts, even spank the tires when I wasnt trying, but since I installed the rebuilt engine the transmission shifts way to early from 1st to 2nd and to 3rd (too low RPM). I put on new vac modulator and adjusted it to shift at higher RPM but the adjustment only seems to affect the 2nd to 3rd shift. When I manually shift from 1st to second at what I consider to be the ideal RPM I get the kind of firm shift I was used to.
My assumption is this... the new camshaft I bought for the rebuild is alot larger than stock and probably provides less vacuum. Maybe this difference is responsible for the poor 1st-2nd shift. Is the 1st-2nd shift indeed controlled by vacuum strength? My vac modulator is now fed from a port on the carb. If I use a port on the intake as my vacuum source will I get stronger vacuum there?
I have checked the entire system thoroughly and can find no vac leaks. Thanks.


 EXCESSIVE IRON rules the road!
'65 442
'66 Dynamic 88 B07 Apprehender
 bryceman@442.com
 www.442.com

------------------------------

From: Stan Hartfelder <stanh@smartnet.ab.ca>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 16:54:32 -0400
Subject: subscribe olsmobile

Hi.  I have a 1938 Oldsmobile and would like to join your e-mail group.

Thank-you,

stanh@compusmart.ab.ca

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 16:16:34 -0400
Subject: Re: TH 400 Shifting 

>My assumption is this... the new camshaft I bought for the rebuild is a lot
>larger than stock and probably provides less vacuum. Maybe this difference 
>is responsible for the poor 1st-2nd shift.

But you said that the shifts occur too soon. I'd have thunk, unscientifically,
that low vacuum would by design trigger a _later_ shift, since a low vacuum
implies a wider-open throttle; i.e. hard acceleration is wanted.

>If I use a port on the intake as my vacuum source will I get stronger vacuum
>there?

Teeing in a vacuum meter temporarily will give you that answer. I'd _guess_
that a manifold vacuum source would have less fluctuation than a carb source
since the intake has a larger volume than the carb chamber, but whether it
would be _stronger_ as well is what a meter will tell you.
- --
Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: Doug McClanahan <mcclan@wsdot.wa.gov>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 16:25:15 -0400
Subject: free stuff

Thanks Chris!  So now that I have found an Egyptologist who can decipher 
"Olds Code", can you tell where I can get a new center link?  I have 
looked in year one, fusick, and kanter.  No dice, though Super cars 
unlimited might have one.

By the way, do you know of anyone who would want free '67 olds CS parts?  
I am replacing quite a few parts on my car that are still usable or could 
be fixed up/cleaned up.  I'll trade some parts but most things I'll be 
giving away.  Things like a good rug, front door arm rest brackets, 
repairable front bucket seat covers, a truck load of suspension parts (a 
stock front anti-sway bar, all four springs in good shape (the car sat 
level), a two year old single exhaust system in great shape, a water 
pump, all 4 working T-3 headlights, a jetaway (rebuilt two years ago), 
etc there are many more pieces that I just can't think of right now.  For 
most of my stuff, who ever wants the parts can just pay the mail man and 
take 'em.  For the big items, it would be nice to get somethin' for 'em 
like a part or two?.

Anyone want this stuff, just write me at:
mcclan@wsdot.wa.gov

Thanks,

Doug the "bolt on" boy - I don't deny it.
- ----------
From: oldsmobile-owner
To: oldsmobile
Subject: 67 330 engine
Date: Monday, April 01, 1996 3:16PM

To the guy inquiring as to the ID of his engine, casting #???417-3 or
???917-3,
with #4 heads and the W######G code:

Yep, that's a 330 block. Looks correct for your application. The heads' 
code
indicates 1966 or '67 Cutlass-line with a 4V carb.
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: "Timothy A. Churchill" <tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 16:47:23 -0400
Subject: Re: free stuff

Doug:

It's funny, I just posted Friday about some '67 CS stuff I'm lookin to buy
or trade for... I'd gladly pay the shipping for most, if not all yer stuff!
You wouldn't happen to have a rear bumper there too, would ya?  (that's the
biggest part I'm looking for).  What's the body style?

In trade, I have a few things, like 4 - NOS 14" rims, still in the GM boxes,
painted red.  A coupla other things too, I'll have to look...

P.S.  This isn't an April Fools joke, is it? :)



Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'88 Cadillac Brougham, a.k.a. 'Big Blue' -- Olds 307 Powered!!
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.EDU>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:05:59 -0400
Subject: Re: Amazing, incredible story

>      Ha!  That's nothing.  The Little Old Lady next door saw me working on 
>      my car and asked if I might be interested in one she had.  In her 
>      garage was nothing other than a '69 Hurst/Olds with 75 miles.  Seems 
            						   ^^^^^^^^

Did you mean to put a "K" on the end of 75, or is that for real?!?!???  
How much did you take it off her hands for?

------------------------------

From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.EDU>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:07:26 -0400
Subject: Re: Amazing, incredible story

> 
>      Ha!  That's nothing.  The Little Old Lady next door saw me working on 
>      my car and asked if I might be interested in one she had.  In her 
>      garage was nothing other than a '69 Hurst/Olds with 75 miles.  Seems 
>      she stopped driving it because "a few things went wrong".

Never mind.  Duh.  4-1-96.  Wishful thinking sure does make me 
gullible... :)

------------------------------

From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.EDU>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:16:07 -0400
Subject: Re: *.dat Files

> Several messages include a *.dat file.  I've downloaded several but they
> don't read anything.

Are these the uuencode and uudecode files?  If so, you can get those 
programs for free and use them to decipher the files.  If you're speaking 
about downloading a bunch of messages and then converting them . . . you 
should probably use an export command, depending on whatever mail program 
you're using.  Or you could print out a hard copy to begin with.
Not sure this helps . . . . ?

------------------------------

From: MIKE COCCAGNA RM508 <coccagna.mike@epamail.epa.gov>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 12:21:15 -0400
Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?

 
> This is for those members who have newer-model Olds with the
> factory keyless-entry option (with the little keyring transmitter).
> If you have this feature on your car (the _Oldsmobile_ option, not
> an aftermarket brand; it presumably will have either an Olds logo
> or a GM logo on the keyring remote), I'd appreciate hearing from
> you with answers to the following questions. I am trying to put 
> together some FAQ info on this for the FAQ file, and yes, there is 
> one in development by some guys on the list.
> 
> 1) Year and Model of your Olds?

'91 W-40 Quad442 (Calais).  Also had a '89 Cutlass Supreme w/one

 
> 2) Did you buy it new or used? If used, was it from a dealer?

New, New

> 3) How many remote keyring transmitters did you receive with your car?

'89 had one, '91 has two
 
> 4) How many buttons are on it, and what features do they operate? (Just
> briefly list what each button says on its label, or what it does.)

Three - Upper left has a 'picture' of a key and DOOR.
              Upper Right has UN LOCK
              Middle has a 'picture' of a car w/open trunk

 
> 5) Were the transmitter(s) working when you got them? Have they broken?
> If so, what went wrong? Did you fix them yourself, have someone else
> fix them, toss them in a drawer or throw them away?

Started out working.  But have replaced several.  They usually have 
one of the following problems:  (1) part that holds key breaks off 
(3x), (2) car becomes 'posessed and doors keep locking/unlocking and 
trunk repeatedly opens while driving (lots o' fun) (1x), (3) degraded 
range, and (4) Stops working alltogether.  Fixes were (1) - replace 
keychain w/new redesigned one (self/dealer under warranty), 
(2) replace receiver unit (dealer because under warranty at the time),
(3) replace battery, and (4) replace battery, keychain, and receiving 
unit (in that order hoping each would fix it).



> 6) Have you ever changed the battery or batteries? If known, what number
> (type; e.g. 2016) of battery is used?

 Yes, all of the sending units have had CR2016 batteries.


> 7) Do you know how to program the transmitter(s) for the car? Have you
> ever paid anyone else to do it?

To program the 442 (Calais) there is a male spade plug in the trunk, 
on the drivers side above the wheelwell.  It is located on the right 
side in the late Cutlass Supreme's, on the antenna motor towards the 
back.  Ground the plug to the chasis and the locks will recycle 
(don't leave the keys in the car. it WILL lock you out). Then press the 
trunk button (I think) on the new sender and the locks should recycle 
signaling the receipt.  This works for up to two sending units 
(on both cars I've tried).  Unground the wire when complete.

 
> 8) Have you ever bought replacement transmitters? If so, from where and
> for how much?

Several.  They currently list at about $80.  I bought the last  one 
for about $60 (wholesale price) from Lou Fusz Pontiac in MO.  Call 
them and say you saw their ad in Car and Driver and they give you the 
wholesale price.
 
> Thanks for your input.
> --
> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431

No problem.  Anything to help another Olds guy.... :-)


Mike
'91 W-40 Quad442

------------------------------

From: Jeff Hunter <jchunter@xcelco.on.ca>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:30:52 -0400
Subject: Re: *.dat Files 

At 03:18 PM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Someone else posted a good question and I haven't seen an answer.
>
>Several messages include a *.dat file.  I've downloaded several but they
>don't read anything.
>
>How does one access these files?
>
>Bob Handren
>'67 442 W-30 modified
>'70 Cutlass SX convert.

I don't think that these can or have a reason to be accessed.  I believe
that they are just data that a server uses??? Am i right???

Jeff Hunter

------------------------------

From: Roger Saladin <rsaladin@bright.net>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:07:07 -0400
Subject: Re: Delta Custom 

At 11:50 AM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:

>Trivia question:
>
>What the model year for the last, TRUE, 98?
>
Are we referring to "98" as opposed to "Ninety-eight"? If so, my
vote goes for '65.

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:59:41 -0400
Subject: Re: 98 Toro Flame War? Was...Re: Misc.

On Sun, 31 Mar 1996 PHartlieb@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 96-03-30 20:21:10 EST, you write:
> 
> >To quote from the inside cover of my 1966 Toronado Owners manual:
> >
> >    "As the owner of a TORONADO by Oldsmobile, you now drive a
> >     distinctive car with appearance features and performance 
> >     benefits unlike anything on the road today.  Never has there
> >     been a car with so many distinguising characteristics."
> >
> >Their words, not mine.
> >
> >The 66 Toro and Mike
> >
> >
> 
> And here's what the '66 98, Starfire &  88 om says (shows a 98 Luxury Sedan
> on the cover):
> 
> "Your 1966 Oldsmobile is without question, the finest Oldsmobile ever
> produced.  This magnificent automobile has many years-ahead features in
> engineering and styling designed to provide you with many thousands of miles
> of pleasurable driving."
> 
MAN, Startin' to sound like Ford vs. Chevy here!  ('Course, that would 
imply TWO cars that suck, rather than NONE, but...)

	Charley Buehner		Rockit 1

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:02:47 -0400
Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system? 

>'91 W-40 Quad442 (Calais).  Also had a '89 Cutlass Supreme w/one

Thanks for the detailed answer, Mike; it had some useful new details
in it. Yours is the first from someone who knew any programming details,
and the location of programming jumper socket was intriguing -- first 
I've heard about in a location other than the under-dash datalink.

>(2) car becomes 'possessed and doors keep locking/unlocking and 
>trunk repeatedly opens while driving (lots o' fun)

*chuckle*  *snort*  :-)

>Fixes were (1) - replace 
>keychain w/new redesigned one (self/dealer under warranty), 
>(2) replace receiver unit (dealer because under warranty at the time),
>(3) replace battery, and (4) replace battery, keychain, and receiving 
>unit (in that order hoping each would fix it).

Typical GM practice, all right!
- --
Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:19:09 -0400
Subject: Re: 98 Toro Flame War? Was...Re: Misc. 

>> >    "As the owner of a TORONADO by Oldsmobile, you now drive a
>> >     distinctive car with appearance features and performance 
>> >     benefits unlike anything on the road today.  Never has there
>> >     been a car with so many distinguishing characteristics."
>> 
>> "Your 1966 Oldsmobile is without question, the finest Oldsmobile ever
>> produced.  This magnificent automobile has many years-ahead features in
>> engineering and styling designed to provide you with many thousands of miles
>> of pleasurable driving."

...and then there's the owner's manual for my Cutlass:

"Congratulations on the purchase of Your New Oldsmobile. While your
income is regrettably not what we require in terms of acquisition of
a fine Ninety-Eight or Toronado, you should keep in mind that your
choice of a lesser Oldsmobile motor car signals your appreciation for
the finer appointments of life. We urge you to refrain from "looking 
down" upon other motorists who, quite possibly through no misfortune 
of their own, have regrettably found themselves in vehicles of lesser, 
poor or disreputable quality. Remember that they may be operating vehicles
of rival manufacturers simply to spare their Oldsmobile from foul weather 
which would besmirch its fine finish, and in fact they may have a Toronado
or Ninety-Eight of their own at home in a garage. You should not pity them,
but ascribe to follow them."
- --
Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:39:21 -0400
Subject: Re: Gentlemen, Gentlemen!!!

On Sun, 31 Mar 1996, Greg Beaulieu wrote:

> 
> Folks, one of the unique things about this list is the fine behavior 
> generally followed by all of the members. Despite the title of the post 
> that led to this message, we have never had a flame war here and I do not 
> intend to let one develop. 
> 
> There are a lot of new members here lately and so I can understand if
> people aren't totally accustomed to the idea of not shooting from the hip.
> But if you disagree with an individual's behavior in using the list,
> please, EMAIL THEM DIRECTLY! The rest of us do not care. We all get tired
> of certain topics but people don't ask these questions just to irritate
> others, they're looking for information. If you don't like it, well you've
> wasted maybe 10 seconds of time reading it and then it goes away. That's
> what the delete message command is for. 
> 
> I have never had to use my authority (such as it is :-) ...) to toss
> anyone off the list for "behavior" problems but that doesn't mean I can't
> or won't. But look, this isn't usenet, and we're all friends here. We
> don't have flame wars because we don't need them. There's no need to take
> this so seriously. Let's just all have a good time and enjoy ourselves,
> OK? 
> 
> Good!
> 
> :-)
> 
> Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
> 
> 
> 
   I second that, Greg!  (Except for that "flame" part, we CAN still 
flame Ford and Chevy, right!!!)   :)

	Charley Buehner		Rockit 1

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:38:10 -0400
Subject: Re: free stuff

On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Doug McClanahan wrote:
> Thanks Chris!  So now that I have found an Egyptologist who can decipher 
> "Olds Code", can you tell where I can get a new center link?  I have 
> looked in year one, fusick, and kanter.  No dice, though Super cars 
> unlimited might have one.

Did you try your local parts place/front end shop? I had to replace the 
center link in my '64 Skylark a couple of years ago and they were able to 
just order the part from TRW. I think Whitney has them too. 

Man, I'd love to get some of those free parts but I think I better resist 
the temptation - no place to put them!

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:52:08 -0400
Subject: Re: Amazing, incredible story

On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Tom Lentz wrote:

> 
>      Ha!  That's nothing.  The Little Old Lady next door saw me working on 
>      my car and asked if I might be interested in one she had.  In her 
>      garage was nothing other than a '69 Hurst/Olds with 75 miles.  Seems 
>      she stopped driving it because "a few things went wrong".
>      
>      So, a rebuilt washer-pump and some WD-40 on the clock later and it's 
>      good as new and now sitting in my parking space.
>      
>      Tom L.
>      
>      Did I mention the trunkfull of NOS dual-snorkel intakes and 
>      rear-wings?

	ALL this, and MONDAY, TOO!  Man, I'm too old for this!!!

	--Charley Buehner     Rockit 1



> ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
> Subject: Amazing, incredible story
> Author:  oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca at INTERNET
> Date:    3/31/96 9:45 PM
> 
> and what should be there... Oh, 3-4 complete engines, 455's... a G-400 
> engine.. what's this? a pair of D heads! Oh, my, and another, both brand new!
>      
>    The driver is clueless, and I convince him that I need the cast iron for the
> farm, and with a small bribe talk him into just weighing the truck, then selling
> me the 'scrap iron' for 50% more than Padnos was paying that day. Heh.
>      
>   He brings it to my house, where I get the cherry picker out, much to my
> wife's consternation [until I explain the load's nature!], and as we're 
> unloading, I notice the forged cranks in the big engines. Oh, what's this down 
> at the bottom of the pile? An experimental AL 4V intake, with casting ID 
> "EE1123" just like at the museum! Heh Heh!
>      
>   As if that weren't enough, there's a pair of F heads in there, too, kinda
> used and beat up, but better than most I get there...
>      
>      Now, what's to DO with all this good stuff???
> 

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:50:55 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Heads 

That's telling 'em Chris!  Plus, if you are using a Cutlass body, it will 
probably out handle the other division, assuming the other division didn't 
restrict changes.  Let us know how it turns out.

David Brown
dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu    (312) 702-9157
"Oldsmobile - powerful roadsters with big V8s"
- -----------------------------
Your right that would be my selection also, but.... I have a very small =
wallet and a lot of 350 olds parts laying around. The worst part about =
it is all my friends are trying to get me to put in a small block chevy
but I don't see that happening I told them that I would take my stock =
olds and thay could take there stock chevy and we could put in a cam =
with the same specks and my olds would drive around them any day!!!!!

------------------------------

From: JMorgan689@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:59:09 -0400
Subject: 4-4-2 

I want to verify that seat belts with shoulder harnesses were an available
option for 1970 442 convertibles.  Do you know if this is the case?  I have a
70 convertible and would like to have shoulder harnesses in it.  

Thank you.

Jim Morgan

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:57:58 -0400
Subject: Re: 98 Toro Flame War? Was...Re: Misc.

On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Andrew C. Green wrote:

> >> >    "As the owner of a TORONADO by Oldsmobile, you now drive a
> >> >     distinctive car with appearance features and performance 
> >> >     benefits unlike anything on the road today.  Never has there
> >> >     been a car with so many distinguishing characteristics."
> >> 
> >> "Your 1966 Oldsmobile is without question, the finest Oldsmobile ever
> >> produced.  This magnificent automobile has many years-ahead features in
> >> engineering and styling designed to provide you with many thousands of miles
> >> of pleasurable driving."
> 
> ...and then there's the owner's manual for my Cutlass:
> 
> "Congratulations on the purchase of Your New Oldsmobile. While your
> income is regrettably not what we require in terms of acquisition of
> a fine Ninety-Eight or Toronado, you should keep in mind that your
> choice of a lesser Oldsmobile motor car signals your appreciation for
> the finer appointments of life. We urge you to refrain from "looking 
> down" upon other motorists who, quite possibly through no misfortune 
> of their own, have regrettably found themselves in vehicles of lesser, 
> poor or disreputable quality. Remember that they may be operating vehicles
> of rival manufacturers simply to spare their Oldsmobile from foul weather 
> which would besmirch its fine finish, and in fact they may have a Toronado
> or Ninety-Eight of their own at home in a garage. You should not pity them,
> but ascribe to follow them."
> --
> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
> Datalogics, Inc.
> 441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
> Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473
> 
> 
	Umm,  cute...   :)

	Charley Buehner		Rockit 1

------------------------------

From: Scott R Clark <mickeyd@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 19:01:00 -0400
Subject: Knockin' on Heavens' Door...was Re: Diagnosing Bearing Problems

> My question: is that the main symptom? How can you tell exactly which set of
> bearings has gone bad (main, rod, cam) without tearing down the engine? 

	Seems like a bad main sounds a little "deeper"...both in pitch 
and like it's deeper in the block.  A bad rod bearing sounds higher 
pitched (but still a deep knocking...not high as in noisy valve high) and 
the rod may also have a faster rate of knock (at least it has seemed that 
way to me before...could all be relative).  It's kind of hard to 
describe, without actually being able to show...ya know?  Maybe next time 
someone chews a bearing they can record it and put a couple .wav files on 
Brycemans web page :)  

> Are there other symptoms that indicate bearing problems without a knock? 
> 
	I think it was Bryce who brought up the oil pressure thing.  
Thats a possibility, but also a possible cause of bearing failure.  
Chicken or the egg?  If you find little metal shavings in your oil, I'd 
say there's a pretty good chance it was a bearing too.  

>If I pull my cam and intake, what visual clues indicate bad cam bearings,

	If you can get a good look at them, you should be able to tell if 
there is a bad one.  If it has abnormal ware patterns or any nicks/deep 
scratches, etc. it would be a good idea to replace them.  And of course, 
it's only prudent to replace them when you do a rebuild (mightaswell) or 
install a new cam (would'nt want to eat a new cam on old bearings...)
 
> and how big a job is it to pull and replace them with the engine in the 
> car? I read the service manual on this but they described doing it with a 
> bunch of special tools, etc., and it was hard to tell how major a job 
> this is. Anyone done this?

	Boy, it just looks like a pain in the patootie.  I had new cam 
bearings installed in my block right after I had it hot-tanked.  What 
they do is start with the one farthest to the back, and use a special 
tool to drive them into place, working forward as they go.  (And of 
course, making sure the oil holes line up :)  I've never heard of anybody 
trying to do it in-car, but I don't see why you could'nt.
	On a whole, though, I get the feeling that cam bearing failure is 
pretty rare, since a). they are exposed to comparativly little stress 
(compared to the other bearings, anyway)
		   b). the rod and main bearings wear out faster, and the 
cam bearings often get replaced during the rebuild, before they have a 
chance to completly wear out.  

		
			Scott
		1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98

------------------------------

From: Jeffrey King <jking@exame2.dseg.ti.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 21:04:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Delmont 88

Many thanks for the responses on my '61.  Yes, I said "sedan",
but as another reader pointed out, this was the correct term
Oldsmobile used for their "hardtop sedans" back then.  I don't
know if it's a "20 footer" or not, but I wouldn't dispute it
being a 10 or 15 footer.  I think I'm setting the price at
$3500 if anyone is interested.  It still needs a few items,
and I'm strapped for cash at the moment.  BTW, I've also just
regestered it as an antique with the State of Texas.  This lets
me A) Use 1961 Texas license plates on it.
   B) Lets me register it for something like $54 for 5 years.
   C) Gets me out of yearly inspections.
   D) Lets me explain to cops who are unfamiliar with this law
      why I'm running around on 35 year old license plates!

- -- 
================================================================
Jeffrey W. King(N5PNU) Internet: -----> jking@exame2.dseg.ti.com
Route 1, Box 290       Internet/packet:   n5pnu@dfwgate.ampr.org
Krum, TX. 76249        Packet:    N5PNU @ N5AUX.#DFW.TX.USA.NOAM
817-482-3446 (home)    214-597-1021 (pager)
214-956-6714 (work)    If none of the above works:    HEY YOU!!!
================================================================
       1961 Oldsmobile Super 88 Holiday (hardtop) Sedan
================================================================

------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:41:22 -0400
Subject: RE: Diagnosing Bearing Problems

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One of the easy ways to tell if you have a bad main or rod problem is to =
pull off one spark plug wire at a time and see if it stops knocking if =
it did not then put it back on and try another, if none of them will =
stop it then I guess you will have to start to tear in to it. REMBER it =
you don't have new or good plug wires then I would shut off the engine =
before you grab the wires, if thay are in good shape then you will be =
fine if not then you will have a new hair style, cam bearing I think you =
would just have to pull the cam and look at the journals and as far as =
changing them I have always had the machine shop change them never done =
it my self. Low oil pressure is all so a good sine that you have bad =
bearings

- ----------
From: 	Greg Beaulieu[SMTP:ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 12:19 PM
To: 	Oldsmobile
Subject: 	Diagnosing Bearing Problems


I had always heard bad bearings described as causing a loud knocking=20
sound. In fact, it seems like every second K-car that I hear at an=20
intersection has that distinctive rap.

My question: is that the main symptom? How can you tell exactly which =
set of
bearings has gone bad (main, rod, cam) without tearing down the engine?=20
Are there other symptoms that indicate bearing problems without a knock? =

If I pull my cam and intake, what visual clues indicate bad cam =
bearings,=20
and how big a job is it to pull and replace them with the engine in the=20
car? I read the service manual on this but they described doing it with =
a=20
bunch of special tools, etc., and it was hard to tell how major a job=20
this is. Anyone done this?

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, =
Canada





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------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:47:44 -0400
Subject: RE: TH 400 Shifting

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- ----------
From: 	Bryceman[SMTP:bryce_smith@442.com]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 1:36 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	TH 400 Shifting

I have a question for the transmission gurus out there...=20
The transmission (TH 400) in the Apprehender used to give really firm =
shifts, even spank the tires when I wasnt trying, but since I installed =
the rebuilt engine the transmission shifts way to early from 1st to 2nd =
and to 3rd (too low RPM). I put on new vac modulator and adjusted it to =
shift at higher RPM but the adjustment only seems to affect the 2nd to =
3rd shift. When I manually shift from 1st to second at what I consider =
to be the ideal RPM I get the kind of firm shift I was used to.
My assumption is this... the new camshaft I bought for the rebuild is =
alot larger than stock and probably provides less vacuum. Maybe this =
difference is responsible for the poor 1st-2nd shift. Is the 1st-2nd =
shift indeed controlled by vacuum strength? My vac modulator is now fed =
from a port on the carb. If I use a port on the intake as my vacuum =
source will I get stronger vacuum there? Yes you will get stronger =
vacuum and it will also help your shifting
I have checked the entire system thoroughly and can find no vac leaks. =
Thanks.


 EXCESSIVE IRON rules the road!
'65 442
'66 Dynamic 88 B07 Apprehender
 bryceman@442.com
 www.442.com





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------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 22:29:37 -0400
Subject: Re: 98 Toro Flame War? Was...Re: Misc.

> Andrew C. Green writes:
>
>...and then there's the owner's manual for my Cutlass:
> 
> "Congratulations on the purchase of Your New Oldsmobile. While your
> income is regrettably not what we require in terms of acquisition of
> a fine Ninety-Eight or Toronado, you should keep in mind that your
> choice of a lesser Oldsmobile motor car signals your appreciation for
> the finer appointments of life. We urge you to refrain from "looking
> down" upon other motorists who, quite possibly through no misfortune
> of their own, have regrettably found themselves in vehicles of lesser,
> poor or disreputable quality. Remember that they may be operating vehicles
> of rival manufacturers simply to spare their Oldsmobile from foul weather
> which would besmirch its fine finish, and in fact they may have a Toronado
> or Ninety-Eight of their own at home in a garage. You should not pity them,
> but ascribe to follow them."


Uncle ... Uncle already!

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO
Edison3, Incorporated
Tampa, Florida
(813) 210-8649

------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:55:26 -0400
Subject: RE: TH 400 Shifting

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- ----------
From: 	Andrew C. Green[SMTP:acg@frame.com]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 2:16 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	Re: TH 400 Shifting

>My assumption is this... the new camshaft I bought for the rebuild is a =
lot
>larger than stock and probably provides less vacuum. Maybe this =
difference=20
>is responsible for the poor 1st-2nd shift.

But you said that the shifts occur too soon. I'd have thunk, =
unscientifically,
that low vacuum would by design trigger a _later_ shift, since a low =
vacuum
implies a wider-open throttle; i.e. hard acceleration is wanted. yes but =
no.=20
They shift at a set vac point. If you have low vac then it gets there =
sooner. if the vac is high it takes longer to drop to the shift point..

>If I use a port on the intake as my vacuum source will I get stronger =
vacuum
>there?

Teeing in a vacuum meter temporarily will give you that answer. I'd =
_guess_
that a manifold vacuum source would have less fluctuation than a carb =
source
since the intake has a larger volume than the carb chamber, but whether =
it
would be _stronger_ as well is what a meter will tell you.
- --
Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473




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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1FF0.E369E280--

------------------------------

From: "Andrew A. Senko" <senko@reston.ans.net>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 19:51:03 -0400
Subject: FS: 1959 Super 88 parts

I was browsing the rec.autos.marketplace newsgroup and came across the
following.  If interested, contact the name below, not me.
- --
Drew  (senko@reston.ans.net)

**********************************************************************
From: HFAN38B@prodigy.com (John Allen)
Subject: Olds 1959 Super 88 parts********************

For Sale: All 4 hubcaps; 394 ci Carter AFB 4bbl carburetor; Chrome turn 
signal lever; Nice front parking lenses; hood emblem, all parts in good 
shape & been inside for years, $75/all.

- -John Allen
PO Box 8001
Madeira Bch., FLA 33738-8001
FAX: (813)-393-4967
E-Mail: hfan38b@prodigy.com

------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:55:26 -0400
Subject: RE: TH 400 Shifting

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1FF0.E369E280
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable



- ----------
From: 	Andrew C. Green[SMTP:acg@frame.com]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 2:16 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	Re: TH 400 Shifting

>My assumption is this... the new camshaft I bought for the rebuild is a =
lot
>larger than stock and probably provides less vacuum. Maybe this =
difference=20
>is responsible for the poor 1st-2nd shift.

But you said that the shifts occur too soon. I'd have thunk, =
unscientifically,
that low vacuum would by design trigger a _later_ shift, since a low =
vacuum
implies a wider-open throttle; i.e. hard acceleration is wanted. yes but =
no.=20
They shift at a set vac point. If you have low vac then it gets there =
sooner. if the vac is high it takes longer to drop to the shift point..

>If I use a port on the intake as my vacuum source will I get stronger =
vacuum
>there?

Teeing in a vacuum meter temporarily will give you that answer. I'd =
_guess_
that a manifold vacuum source would have less fluctuation than a carb =
source
since the intake has a larger volume than the carb chamber, but whether =
it
would be _stronger_ as well is what a meter will tell you.
- --
Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473




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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB1FF0.E369E280--

------------------------------

From: "C. K. Yee" <yu135008@yorku.ca>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 20:24:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Diagnosing Bearing Problems

On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Greg Beaulieu wrote: 

> I had always heard bad bearings described as causing a loud knocking 
> sound. In fact, it seems like every second K-car that I hear at an 
> intersection has that distinctive rap.
> 
> My question: is that the main symptom? How can you tell exactly which set of
> bearings has gone bad (main, rod, cam) without tearing down the engine? 
> Are there other symptoms that indicate bearing problems without a knock? 
> If I pull my cam and intake, what visual clues indicate bad cam bearings, 
> and how big a job is it to pull and replace them with the engine in the 
> car? I read the service manual on this but they described doing it with a 
> bunch of special tools, etc., and it was hard to tell how major a job 
> this is. Anyone done this?

Hi everyone!  Although I've been a member for several months now, this
is my first post to the list.  I have an '83 Olds Delta 88 Brougham, and
an '88 Cadillac Brougham (both with 307s).  Here are a few excerpts from
an engine knock diagnosis section I came across:
 
Main Bearing Noise
- ------------------
 
Damaged or worn main bearing noise is revealed by dull thuds
or knocks which happen on every engine revolution, and this noise
is loudest when the engine is under heavy load.  Excessive crankshaft end
play is indicated by an intermittent rap or knock sharper than a
worn main bearing.  Causes of main bearing noises include:

- - low oil pump pressure.
- - thin, diluted oil and/or filter
- - excessive main bearing clearance
- - excessive crankshaft endplay
- - out-of-round crankshaft journals
- - excessive belt tension.
- - loose crankshaft pulley
- - loose flywheel or torque converter
- - loose main bearing cap
 
Connecting Rod Bearing Noise
- ----------------------------
 
A damaged or worn connecting rod bearing will produce a knock under all
speeds.  During the early stages of wear, connecting rod noise may be
confused with piston slap or loose wrist pins.  Connecting rod knock
noise increases with engine speed and is at its loudest on deceleration.
Causes of connecting rod bearing noise include:
 
- - excessive bearing clearance
- - worn crankshaft connecting rod journal
- - thin, diluted or dirty oil and/or filter
- - low oil pressure
- - crankshaft connecting rod journals out of round
- - misaligned connecting rod
- - connecting rod bolts not properly torqued
- - wrong bearing inserts or misaligned bearing half.
 
Piston Noises
- -------------

Piston pin, piston, and connecting rod noises are hard to
separate.  A loose piston pin, for example, causes a sharp
double knock usually heard when the engine is idling, or 
during sudden acceleration then deceleration of the engine.
A piston pin that has been improperly fitted will emit a light ticking
noise that is more noticeable with no load on the engine.

<clip>
=====================

I realize that all service manuals contain a knock diagnosis
section, but I felt that this one was particularly comprehensive.
(1995 LT1 manual)  BTW, how frequently do cam bearings wear out?
 
Kevin Wong
 

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 12:24:23 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Amazing, incredible story 

     Oh, man. . .  You mean someone actually believed me?!?  Cool, I must 
     be gettin' good at this.
     
     Check the calendar, dude!  April fools ya know!
     
     Sorry for the waste of bandwitdth guys, I just thought I stop it 
     before it got worse.

______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
Subject: Re: Amazing, incredible story
Author:  oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca at INTERNET
Date:    4/1/96 1:45 PM


>      Ha!  That's nothing.  The Little Old Lady next door saw me working on 
>      my car and asked if I might be interested in one she had.  In her 
>      garage was nothing other than a '69 Hurst/Olds with 75 miles.  Seems 
                     ^^^^^^^^
     
Did you mean to put a "K" on the end of 75, or is that for real?!?!???  
How much did you take it off her hands for?
     

------------------------------

From: BYLN96A@prodigy.com ( GLENN CONNORS)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 20:35:46 -0400
Subject: Re: *.dat Files 

It must have to be the server...yeah that's it..the server did it.  I 
found one of those .dat files at the end of a mailnote I posted to 
this list a little while ago and I don't know no IBManese...believe 
me.

Glenn
'69 4-4-2


<< Start of Forwarded message via prodigy (R) mail >>

From:	 Jeff Hunter
Subject:	 Re: *.dat Files
Date:	 04/01
Time:	 04:37 PM

Date:     	Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:30:52 -0400
From:     Jeff Hunter  [jchunter@xcelco.on.ca]
Sender:   oldsmobile-owner@ccn.cs.dal.ca  [oldsmobile-owner@ccn.cs.
dal.ca]
Reply-To: oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca  [oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca]
Subject:  Re: *.dat Files

At 03:18 PM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Someone else posted a good question and I haven't seen an answer.
>
>Several messages include a *.dat file.  I've downloaded several but 
they
>don't read anything.
>
>How does one access these files?
>
>Bob Handren
>'67 442 W-30 modified
>'70 Cutlass SX convert.

I don't think that these can or have a reason to be accessed.  I 
believe
that they are just data that a server uses??? Am i right???

Jeff Hunter


 -------- Original message header follows --------
>From oldsmobile-owner@ccn.cs.dal.ca  Sun Mar 31 16:37:45 1996  [PIM 3.
2-030.47]
Received: from ccn.cs.dal.ca (root@ccn.cs.dal.ca [205.150.72.25]) by 
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1996 16:35:38 -0500
Received: by ccn.cs.dal.ca id <13093(1)>; Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:33:43 -
0400
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(8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id QAA13743 for <oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca>; 
Mon, 1 Apr 1996 16:30:52 -0500 (EST)
Date: 	Mon, 1 Apr 1996 17:30:52 -0400
Message-Id: <2.2.16.19960401162032.1e6ffa4e@xcelco.on.ca>
X-Sender: jchunter@xcelco.on.ca
X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16)
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
To: oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
From: Jeff Hunter <jchunter@xcelco.on.ca>
Subject: Re: *.dat Files
Sender: oldsmobile-owner@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca

 --------------   End of message   ---------------



<< End of Forwarded message >>

------------------------------

From: "Meyer I. Stolberg" <mas@cci.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 18:32:53 -0400
Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?

On Apr 1, 12:21pm, MIKE COCCAGNA RM508 wrote:
> Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?
>
.
> Mike
> '91 W-40 Quad442
>
>-- End of excerpt from MIKE COCCAGNA RM508


I have a 91 Cutlass Calais Quad 442 W-41.  Is that the same as the W-40?

My dealer told me that the W-41 wasn't available with power locks nor power
windows.

Meyer
'91 Quad442 (not a real 442) W-41

------------------------------

From: gludlam@bcinet.net (Gregg Ludlam)
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 22:32:36 -0400
Subject: Parting out 1966 Toro! 

This is from a fellow Toro nut...thought you guys might be interested.  He's
got 6 or 7 Toros of various years, of which this is his latest aquisition.
Tell him I "sent" you!

>I mailed many of you a short message a few months ago regarding a 1966 I
>recently purchased. I have decided that I am going to parts it out or sell it
>whole. There are only a few things off it that I really need or want. The car
>runs but no brakes. It by no means is a total junker, as I was close to
>making it into a winter beater. It has the typical rust and ripped seats etc.
>Cosmetically its a dog, but mechanically its sound. It only has 85K
>documented miles on it and it is LOADED! Replete with factory engine block
>heater.
>
>If anyone is looking for an original strong motor and drivetrain, this is the
>one to carcass! Unless someone buys it whole, I plan to have this one apart
>down to the tub and frame. What is left will fit into a large dumpster
>Right now the car is in Brookfield, WI. It will be towed in a few weeks to
>Fond du Lac, WI for dissmanteling. Bring your tools, torch, engine hoist,
>whatever you need to remove the part of your choice! I'll supply the beer and
>technical assistance! (also bandaids for skinned knuckles)
>
>For serious inquiries, I can take pictures and send to you. Pass this info
>around to other Toro addicts, this is a deal! 
>
>You can E-mail me or call me at 1-414-447-7500
>
>Happy Toroing!
>
>Greg Kalkhoff


- -Gregg, the '67 Toro guy

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 23:25:39 -0400
Subject: Come on! 

Ok guys & girls, someone has to know what the hell I'm talking about!
 Something tells me it has to do with MS Mail???????    How about some more
input!!!!!!!!!!

>I know this is a stupid question, but how do I access the .dat files I
>download from the mail list??????  I don't have any (IBM) software that
>recognizes them.  Thanks for the help... Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 23:34:20 -0400
Subject: For Sale... 

Here are some Olds parts I have for sale.  If you have any questions, feel
free to give me a call at 717.842.4181 after 5:30 est or drop me a line.

Big Block Heads:
1 set of G's with 2.072"/1.625" valves Casting # 409 100 (all rotators)
(complete)
$75.00
2 sets of E's with 2.00"/1.625" valves Casting # 403 686 (all rotators)
(complete)
$75.00 a pair

Big Block Intakes:
4 barrel intake, lo-rise, non egr, from '71 Toro, Casting # 407 569 D1D (S),
  with original air cleaner and chrome/blue Toro insert   $45.00
4 barrel intake, non-egr, Casting # 404 521 D1V   $45.00

I'm not sure if any one has any need for this at all, but I also have a 2
barrel intake from a '67 425, Casting # 397 357 D2A.  Cheap....Cheap.....
Anyone interested????????

Exhaust manifolds:
>From the '71 Toro, 
Driver Side Casting Number 407108 LH D2 338 (J) (Cracked).  The only reason I
mention this part is because the heat shield for the hot air tube is
complete.  I know most of them rot out, so I figured someone might need this
for a correst resto..... Cheap

Pass. Side Casting Number 395 752 RH D1 98 (G) Cheap...

As for the above mentioned exhaust manifolds, I am not to familiar with
Toro's and I thought somebody just might be interesed in them.  Remember,
cheap....  I don't want to get rich off of them, just pass them on to
somebody who needs them....


Like I said, give me a buzz at 717.842.4181 or drop me a line... Tom Millard
OLDSPWR

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 15:54:45 -0400
Subject: Help ID-ing small block. 

     I'm trying to exactly ID the small block in my fiance's truck (diesel 
     conversion).  It failed emissions (high CO at cruise), and has had 
     choke and carb problems since day one so I think we're just going to 
     replace the carb.  I'd like to know the exact application this engine 
     came out of, to try to find another carb, and for future reference 
     when parts are needed.
     
     What I know:  The previous owner said it was out of a '79 Olds that 
     had 40k miles, she didn't know what model.  The air cleaner says it's 
     a 350.  From the air cleaner element (AC 212CW), the books say it has 
     to be an 88, 98, or Toro.  It has a 7qt with filter oil pan, but that 
     may be a hold-over from the original diesel block??  It's a 4bbl, and 
     the number stamped on the block above the water pump is 557752 3B.  If 
     I'm deciphering it correctly that second 5 means it a '75 block?  
     Which contradicts everything else I think I know.  Is there another 
     number on the block I'm missing?  I double checked the number, but 
     it's possible that I didn't get all the grime off. . .
     
     I tend to believe the 40k miles.  It runs great and sounds great once 
     it's warmed up, and doesn't use any fluids.  I think the whole 
     emissions thing is a farce anyways, if it were still a diesel we'd be 
     emitting several times the amount of noxious gasses, and wouldn't hav 
     e to take emissions either, so I think we should be exempt.  Mr. State 
     doesn't agree.

     TIA!
     
     Tom L.

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 00:10:58 -0400
Subject: Re: Delta Custom

On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Roger Saladin wrote:

> At 11:50 AM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
> 
> >Trivia question:
> >
> >What the model year for the last, TRUE, 98?
> >
> Are we referring to "98" as opposed to "Ninety-eight"? If so, my
> vote goes for '65.
> 
> 
"Ninety-eight," "98," same thing, I think.

'65 isn't the answer, either.



Dan 

------------------------------

From: OLDSMOBILE 442 <S_WTJAMES@vaxa.clarion.edu>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 22:03:25 -0400
Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system? 

Did you say your keyless entry system wont work? Try;
A) BREAK YOUR WINDOW OUT
B) CLIMB THROUGH THE WINDOW LIKE "THE DUKES OF HAZZARD"
problem solved.

WES JAMES
1986 OLDS 442
(a almost real 442, but better than the Quad"

*it is still an Olds!

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 01:02:21 -0400
Subject: Re: Open Letter 

In a message dated 96-03-31 19:27:47 EST, you write:

>Well I apologize for "overstepping your bounds" but it just got annoying to
>see one of your letters every time that I checked my mail for three days
>maybe it is just me and maybe I should have just kept my mouth shut (my
>fingers off the keyboard) I will try to be more understanding in the future

I am truly sorry that you became so annoyed, but there is more to life than
valves and cams and stuff mechanical.

I feel as though I have contributed some worthwhile information here recently
and thought it was about time to have a little fun.

One feels that they have to be afraid to respond to someone else's message
for fear of annoying those that aren't interested.  Just today there were
quite a few messages that I would have liked to respond to, but it seems the
fun in it is gone.  Thanks.

Now, let's get over this stuff and get on with out lives and worry about the
important things in life.  Don't sweat the petty stuff!

And in the future I think I would have to go along with the advice of my
friend and suggest that you utilize your delete key when something looks
"old" or un-interesting.  I do that quite frequently.

'Nuf said!

Paul

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 01:02:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Open Letter 

In a message dated 96-03-31 18:32:36 EST, you write:

>It would seem that the recent banter between Mr Hartlieb and myself 
>concerning the relative merits of various models of Oldsmobiles has been 
>taken a little too seriously by a few members of the group.  It certainly 
>was not my intention to upset anyone and I considered the converstion to 
>have been toungue-in-cheek and in good fun.  I'm sure Mr Hartlieb would 
>be the first to agree with me.

You bet I do!
>
>While I admit that I am relatively new to the group, it has been my 
>perception that good humor prevailed over thin skin.  Apparently, this 
>has been a misjudgement on my part in some cases.
 
Ditto.
>
>I extend my apology to the group (with the possible exception of James 
>Smith whose response I consider to be over the top) for overstepping my 
>bounds and I will try be more considerate in the future.

My feelings exactly.
>
>
Paul

------------------------------

From: Bob0Barry@aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 01:12:11 -0400
Subject: Vista Cruiser, Part Twoser: The Parting (Out) -and yeah, it's long... 

(Warning: The following story contains lengthy graphic depictions of blood,
grease and stripped parts, which may not be suitable for young readers.
Parental discretion is advised...)

Thanks to all the people who have responded to my posts on the Vista Cruiser
last week, I gathered the knowledge and courage to go out there and begin
parting it out this past weekend. During that time, my Vista has gone through
many transformations:

First, it was a vague image of a wagon, rusted and lonely; then, it was an
actual existing wagon, rusty and lonely. Then, it was a pile of problems
resisting my effort to possess (and tow) it; then, alternately, it was either
a waste of money or a gold mine, as I pondered my acquisition and what to do
with it. Then, it was a beautiful gleaming family wagon as I wondered how to
remove the woodgrain to reveal the beautiful shining factory paint (thanks
for all the advice! If I actually did such a thing, the trick would be a heat
gun and fingernails, both gently applied). 

Now, it is a shell and a pile of parts, as a result of the events of this
past weekend.

The "Plan": Begin Saturday at noon and work until it gets dark at 6:00;
remove the 7a heads and the flippin' radio. Maybe get the tailgate open.
Anything else is gravy.

"Reality": As usual, arrive later than planned. I did have the presence of
mind to give a spritz of (insert your favorite brand penetrating oil here) to
every bolt I can find, and let it seep in while I eat lunch and attend to the
ten-thousand minor chores, annoyances and details that plague our everyday
existence (true fact: Albert Camus wrote "The Myth of Sisyphus" after parting
out a '31 Olds Business Coupe...) I also coat the engine with "Foamy Engine
Brite" to keep the tear-down mess to a minimum.

Before I actually remove everything, I hook up a battery and try the tailgate
window. It's warmer out, so the battery should be stronger, and I've dumped a
whole can of WD-40 past the weatherstripping at the top of the door, so if
anything was sticking, it shouldn't be now. I turn the key in the tailgate,
and "whirr-groan-whirr-clunk", the glass starts to move downward. I give it a
little help, spray some more WD-40 down there, and ooh-la-la, in no time,
I've got it going up and down at a snail's pace. Thanks to all the advice
people gave me here, I lower the window, grab the latch to pull the tailgate
down, and "uuuugh"- nothing! Try harder, but no motion inside the door, and
no amount of reaching down there does anything; window interlock must be
jammed, so I give up on the gate for now.

BTW, thanks to those who gave the advice on the seats, I was able to get them
folded up in no time at all. There is nothing like the view from the third
seat of a Vista Cruiser; it's like looking down a bowling alley toward that
dash! For a moment I reconsidered my parting-out idea, but a memory of the
look on my wife's face when she saw this heap ("Ugh, yeah, you're getting rid
of that thing!") rekindles the parting spirit.

We begin, as all good partings should, by taking off the hood. This is the
*only* thing my non-mechanically-inclined father is willing to help me with,
and after disconnecting the washer lines and the underhood light at the
connector, undoing the four bolts, it glides right off (definitely a
two-person job; otherwise, you risk the hood making your windshield a
"two-piece").

   (Parting Note #1: If possible, remove as large a piece as possible with
all its trim and accessories when parting out a car; this saves you time and
effort like you wouldn't believe.)

Now that I have a clear shot at the engine, I spray it again with my good
friend "Foamy Engine Brite", and get ready to hose it off.

   (Parting Note #2: Make sure you have a garden hose that will actually
reach the engine compartment to spray off "Foamy Engine Brite"...)

Well, it looks like today will be the opening show of Greasefest '96, the
Summer Tour...

Hmmm, now what... I could remove the fenders to get better access to the
heads, but that is about a dozen bolts per fender, and then you have to
remove the inner panels, all the brackets and stuff... While I'm standing
there looking at the radiator support, it occurs to me that the entire front
end is held onto the car by only 16 bolts, and the rust on my fenders has
already taken care of three of them! 

The whole front end is serviced by one half of the wiring harness from the
firewall (which mysteriously also includes one lone wire going to the brake
warning switch on the frame; don't ask me why the designers threw this
complication in on an otherwise perfect design), so I unbolt the harness as
one piece. The coolant lines need to be removed, so I unhook them, undo the
remaining fender bolts, tackle the radiator support bolts (one is a
two-person job; the other is just about eaten away by battery acid), and get
my sister to help pull off the entire front end. With a little resistance, it
breaks free, and I've got the run of the place!

    (Parting Note #3: The fitting on the lower tranny coolant line to the
radiator is *always* rusted to the line itself. Just use your diagonal
cutters and be done with it)

Now where to begin on the engine... Alternator and A/C compressor come off
brackets and all (remember Note #1), power steering pump stays for now
(forgot my flare wrenches-d*mn!), and intake manifold is next. Carb and coil
(great name for a restaurant!) have to be removed to get its bolts off, I
remove all the bolts, and before prying off the manifold with a GM lug wrench
(they make great pry bars), I brush the acorns and leaves off the intake to
make sure nothing falls into the lifter valley. I also notice that there's a
bit of tranny fluid on the intake; hmmm, where'd *that* come from?

Pop the manifold off *with* the distributor in place (heh- try THAT,
Ch*vy-boy!), and find the valley covered by the intake gasket (oh yeah,
that's how they do it; forgot entirely about that). Well, let me just lift
that up and throw it... HOLY SHEEP SKITS!!! look at that lifter valley! I
suppose the former owner went with an unpublished Maintenance Schedule IV,
which specifies oil changes every 100,000 miles, because there is a buildup
of crud in there that is *surrounding* some pushrods! I have never seen or
imagined anything like this, but after regaining my senses, continue on with
one more story to tell my grandchildren...

Now the sun is starting to get low in the sky, and the heads are nowhere near
off, so I start to get serious about things. First are the valve covers, so
10 bolts later, I see that the rockers are all in one piece (and apparently
all the springs are the same size; does that mean I don't have the
mixed-depth spring pockets? How can you tell if the valves are rotating or
not?) I also notice more of that "tranny fluid" around the ports...hmmm...

The exhaust comes off surprisingly easily (only one broken bolt- a record for
me!), but the manifolds are coming off with the heads whatever the case. I
undo the ground strap to the firewall, hook up my 13/16" socket to a looong
extension bar, and speed-ratchet out most of the head bolts. Pop off the
head, and SPLOOSH!!! ooops, forgot to drain the block! Oh, yeah, *that's*
what that little 9/16" on each side of the block is for...

    (Parting Note #4: drain EVERYTHING! All at once, when you start the job,
otherwise you will be taking unnecessary breaks during your work to hunt down
a pan, getting things wet, etc. Just Drain It!)

    (Parting Note#5: There should be *no* tranny fluid around the vicinity of
the intake manifold. On the other hand, BLOOD looks amazingly like tranny
fluid...)

Through Empirical Observation, I have discovered there are three stages of
auto disassembly:

Stage One: Magazine-Article Quality- You carefully remove each bolt and
piece, mark their identity and location, and carefully seal them away in
plastic baggies. You discard unuseable items, and degrease and save the parts
you want. You wash your hands with waterless hand cleaner whenever they get
greasy, and keep your tools free from grease so you can grip them well. You
return the tools to their respective holders when you are done.

Stage Two: Been At This A While And Now You're Tired- You throw all the bolts
into a large bucket, figuring you'll "sort them out later", and toss all the
parts into a single pile, whether you are keeping them or not. You wipe your
greasy hands off on your pants occasionally, and keep the tools in one
general area.

Stage Three: It's Now Dark and You're Just Pissed- You break the bolts off,
or rip the parts off leaving the bolt behind. You leave the parts dangling or
on the ground near your feet. Your skin is indistiguishable from the grease
embedded in it, and is shredded like Mozzarella from slipping off of your
black greasy tools. You've lost half your tools in the dirt or dropped them
into the frame.

At this point, I've got one head off, the sun is long gone, and I'm *well*
into Stage Three. I hook up a 250W halogen worklight (hint: spend the extra
$$$ for a 500W one; you can't have too much light), and get to work on the
driver's side head. Off it comes, head bolts go into a bucket with the
pushrods (rockers can stay on the head; just take the pushrods out the bottom
once you tilt it out), just in time to go inside and help put the baby to
bed. I leave the greasy carnage scattered around the yard, looking like some
grim Mechanical Civil War scene.

Next afternoon, at the time I was planning on heading home, I'm stripping the
remaining parts off the motor- starter, water pump, etc. (Olds Joke: Q.-What
do you call a guy working on an Olds without an 11/32" socket? A.-Screwed)
Luckily my 11/32" socket is not broken or missing, so I can remove the small
wires on the starter solenoid. Curiously, the other small terminal on the
starter is 12/32" (or 3/8", if you are into reducing...); I'd like to see the
engineering rationale for the 1/32" difference on the two bolts on that part!
I also see what a total b*tch it would be to get at these starter wires with
the car assembled; basically, you would be working blind, and the wires are
covered, not only in the oil that leaks from the valve cover gasket, but also
by a starter strap that has to come off in order to do *anything* down there.
Guys, if you ever have to do any work or testing on the starter while the car
is assembled, just drop the whole thing!

Well, no more of the engine is coming off that day, and the brake system is
just different enough from my '70 that I can't transfer the whole thing over
(the '72 has a single combination valve, while my '70 has two pieces). Once I
get a spring compressor, I'll transfer the whole suspension to make my SX a
roller again (prolly this Thursday). The discs are a little unusual; they
have a circular groove on each rotor face- is this factory? (No, it is not
from the rivet in the pad, as I first thought)

Now on to the radio, the last thing before I go. Thankfully, the lower A/C
vents are only 1/4" bolts, and they come off easily, as does the lower air
manifold. The flippin' radio didn't work before, but I suspect a blown
speaker, so I'll have to bench-test it. It comes out easily enough, only the
faceplate nuts and one 11/32" nut (of course...) holding it onto a bracket.

The dash is in really nice shape (blue dash pad is completely uncracked,
though the chromed-plastic strip has shrunk as they all have), so I don't
bash open the glovebox door. When I looked at my '70, though, I noticed that
the inner glove-box is simply folded fiberboard, with large gaps at the top
that you could reach through. So, I pull the vent ducts out of the way, get a
face full of firewall insulation (ugh), and reach up to see what might be in
there... hmmm, this glove box feels *stuffed*! Lets see, hmm, *more*
insulation in the glove box! Sudden realization: the over-stuffed glovebox
was probably not a factory installed option for keeping the owner's manual
warm, but rather an aftermarket mouse-installed option. I decide not to tempt
fate or rabid rodents, and leave the dash alone.

Well, it is time to go, and I have run out out tools to do the work I want to
do. I've got my 7a heads and my flippin' radio, and I'm lookin' forward to
giving my SX a new lease on life with the VC's suspension. All-in-all, not a
bad couple days of parting out, though I've learned a few things:

1) Degreasing the entire engine bay before you begin parting falls under the
category of a REALLY GOOD IDEA. It saves a lot of time and energy later on
(just make sure you can rinse off the degreaser...;)

2) Penetrating oil a day before hand, or even an hour beforehand, is also a
REALLY GOOD IDEA. I actually did this, and it saved me lots of work.

3) Clean hands are happy hands. A can of waterless hand cleaner is $.69 at
the local discount parts store, and a roll of paper towels is only $1 or so.
The little bit of time you take to keep clean will make disassembly much
easier (try loosening head bolts with greasy hands on slippery tools).

4) A REAL GOOD PROJECT that would BENEFIT OLDSMOBILE OWNERS EVERYWHERE would
be a chart of the bolt sizes on an Olds motor. Not just the head bolts and
such, but accessory bolts, intake bolts, block plugs, etc. Then someone
tearing down a motor could toss the bolts into one bucket, clean them all up,
sort them by size, and know just where each went to.

Thanks for all your support on this project of mine; it's nice to get good
advice from people who know what they're talking about here on this list.

------------------------------

From: "Meyer I. Stolberg" <mas@cci.com>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 1996 23:30:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?

On Apr 1,  6:32pm, Meyer I. Stolberg wrote:
> Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?
> On Apr 1, 12:21pm, MIKE COCCAGNA RM508 wrote:
> > Subject: Re: Do you have a keyless entry system?
> >
Sorry, I don't know what happened to the rest of my letter.  I'll try again:

Mike wrote to sat he had a '91 W-40 Quad442 (Calais).  I wonder if it is the
same as my '91 W-41 Quad442 (not a real 442) Cutlass Calais.

I tried to order it fully loaded but the only options I received were air
conditioning, upgraded stereo, and rear defogger.

I hope this message makes it this time.

>-- End of excerpt from Meyer I. Stolberg

------------------------------

From: Bob0Barry@aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 01:29:50 -0400
Subject: Re: Come on! 

In a message dated 96-04-01 22:34:01 EST, you write:

>Ok guys & girls, someone has to know what the hell I'm talking about!
> Something tells me it has to do with MS Mail???????    How about some more
>input!!!!!!!!!!
>
>>I know this is a stupid question, but how do I access the .dat files I
>>download from the mail list??????  I don't have any (IBM) software that
>>recognizes them.  Thanks for the help... Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

I get these files too, and don't know what to do with them. They are not UUE
files, though they appear to be binary files. I do get *.txt files attached
to some longer mail messages, but those are regular ASCII files. I don't know
what is up with these AOL *.dat files, but they don't seem to be anything
missing from the original message, so I just ignore them. If a message is too
long for AOL's mail system, AOL will add that fact to the header of the
message.

My advice is to ignore them.

------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 02:04:40 -0400
Subject: RE: Come on!

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 Tom try to go to the DOS prompt and edit the .dat files (edit olds.dat) =
and see if you can access them that way. I haven't seen them so I dont =
know. Where are thay located and I will download one and help?


- ----------
From: 	OLDSPWR@aol.com[SMTP:OLDSPWR@aol.com]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 9:25 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	Come on!

Ok guys & girls, someone has to know what the hell I'm talking about!
 Something tells me it has to do with MS Mail???????    How about some =
more
input!!!!!!!!!!

>I know this is a stupid question, but how do I access the .dat files I
>download from the mail list??????  I don't have any (IBM) software that
>recognizes them.  Thanks for the help... Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com




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------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 02:08:18 -0400
Subject: RE: Delta Custom

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1998


- ----------
From: 	Daniel Gulino[SMTP:gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu]
Sent: 	Monday, April 01, 1996 10:10 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	Re: Delta Custom



On Mon, 1 Apr 1996, Roger Saladin wrote:

> At 11:50 AM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
> 
> >Trivia question:
> >
> >What the model year for the last, TRUE, 98?



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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB202C.22AAF660--

------------------------------

From: Willie <aceface@ohana.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 07:13:00 -0400
Subject: Re: Delta Custom

Daniel Gulino wrote:
> 
> At 11:30 AM 4/1/96 -0400, you wrote:
> >>The Delta name was first used in 1965.
> >>Also, I don't know if there was simply an "88" in 1960.  I think that
> >>all the 88 lines were preceded by "Super" or "Dynamic."
> >
> >As a matter of fact, I was just going to turn my gas station calendar
> >over to April when I noticed the feature car for March (shows how much
> >I pay attention...): a 1954 Olds F88 concept car, according to the
> >caption. It's a gold 2-door convertible looking very much like the
> >mid-50's Olds and Buicks which would follow it, and has a huge forward-
> >slanted "88" insignia on the front fenders behind the front wheel.
> >
> >Don't know much else about this other than that the photo is by Dennis
> >Adler and the owner is listed as Bruce Lustman. The calendar itself was
> >a Christmas freebie giveaway from the local Amoco station, with their
> >local address printed on the bottom. Really nice quality, though...
> 
> My comment applied only to 1960.  I think that earlier, the name "88" was
> used as the only name, and it was the only script on the cars.  But Olds
> referred to them as "88 Holiday," "Golden Rocket 88," and so forth.
> 
> Trivia question:
> 
> What the model year for the last, TRUE, 98?
> 
> ************************************************
> Daniel A. Gulino
> Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
> Department of Chemical Engineering
> Ohio University
> Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
> (614) 593-1495
> (614) 593-0873 (fax)
> gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
> http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
> ************************************************



Well, Daniel, that depends on YOUR definition of a TRUE 98. It depend if you are talking engines, bodies, etc... If you are 
talking engines, the answer would be 1948. That's when the last year of the straight-8's were in production before the 
rockets came out. Tell us? What is a TRUE 98? Or are you talking name's? Before they started to add cute little names like 
"Futurematic" 98 and stuff like that? I believe that would be in 1942? Although, if you want to get personal, which I will, 
in my opinion I think it was 1958. The last of the J-2's!


Willie!

1957 Olds Super 88

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 07:23:10 -0400
Subject: Year One

Just thought I'd mention that the Year One catalogs I requested from 
their web page came yesterday. Nice deal... *free* catalogs that came 
with a $5.00 discount coupon.

Having said that, though, I have to say that I was a bit disappointed in 
them. The previous catalogs I had were 2-3 years old and while these are 
larger it seems there's less in them. Probably it's a symptom of GM 
discontinuing more and more parts for these cars, though lots of 
aftermarket stuff seems to have disappeared too. The other thing I 
noticed is that their prices seem even higher than before. They are still 
an easy source for lots of stuff, though, so I guess that's what they're 
counting on.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 07:27:35 -0400
Subject: 403 Cams

After realizing that the 403 cams noted here last week for marine 
applications (part #s 562301 and 562302) were similar to Mondello grinds, 
I called my local Olds dealer today to get a price. They tell me they're 
both discontinued items. No stock and no price. Didn't get them to do a 
dealer search - since they're marine items I wonder if anyone would 
bother stocking them.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 07:32:22 -0400
Subject: 100th Anniversary Meet

I was curious to know how many of you are thinking or planning to attend 
the Olds 100th anniversary event in Lansing in 1997. A few of us from 
Atlantic Canada are thinking of going... the question now is to fly in or 
drive our cars convoy-style. We'd like to take the cars but it's a long 
run and there will be a zillion cars there. What's everyone thinking 
about doing?

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 09:17:20 -0400
Subject: Re: Delta Custom 

At 07:13 AM 4/2/96 -0400, you wrote:

>Well, Daniel, that depends on YOUR definition of a TRUE 98. It depend if
you are talking engines, bodies, etc... If you are 
>talking engines, the answer would be 1948. That's when the last year of the
straight-8's were in production before the 
>rockets came out. Tell us? What is a TRUE 98? Or are you talking name's?
Before they started to add cute little names like 
>"Futurematic" 98 and stuff like that? I believe that would be in 1942?
Although, if you want to get personal, which I will, 
>in my opinion I think it was 1958. The last of the J-2's!
>
>
>Willie!
>
>1957 Olds Super 88
>
>
OK, OK, OK, here's the answer.  And my source is none other than the
Oldsmobile History
Center itself.

The last year of the true 98 was 1984.  That was the last year that you
could buy a "90 Series"
Oldsmobile with an 8-cylinder engine.  After 1984, all 98s came with V-6's.
According to the
info I read, no distinction was made between straight-8 and V-8.

As was posted by someone else earlier (I'm sorry, I don't recall your name),
Oldsmobile series
designations, such as 66, 68, 76, 78, 98, and so forth at one time indicated
first the series
and then the number of cylinders.  


************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: Bneuw30@aol.com
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 09:24:54 -0400
Subject: Re: 100th Anniversary Meet 

Greg, 

I am in the process of purchasing a 1929 Olds 2dr and will drive it there,
but I live in Marysville,MI which only 120 miles away.  I am also rebuilding
my original 4-4-2 which had been destroyed, but the new owner saved enough
parts to pu the W-30 back together with a new frame and bodyshell.

Bob Neumann

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 09:23:33 -0400
Subject: Re: 100th Anniversary Meet 

At 07:32 AM 4/2/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I was curious to know how many of you are thinking or planning to attend 
>the Olds 100th anniversary event in Lansing in 1997. A few of us from 
>Atlantic Canada are thinking of going... the question now is to fly in or 
>drive our cars convoy-style. We'd like to take the cars but it's a long 
>run and there will be a zillion cars there. What's everyone thinking 
>about doing?
>
>Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada


I'm planning to go, and if you're thinking of going, you'd better get 
moving (so to speak).  There was an insert in the January JWO that you
needed to send in to register your interest.  Then, in the Feb or March
issue there was a hotel reservation request form.  I've already sent both
of those in, and I've already gotten my hotel confirmation.  If you
don't at least send in the info request form, you won't be on the mailing
list to receive any more information.  I've spoken with Steve DeNovi about
this, and they're expecting hotels to fill up rapidly.  This is probably
going to be a lot like the Olympics in that you won't be able to decide
a few months ahead of time that you want to go and expect to find hotel
rooms anywhere in town.  Reservations will have to be made well in advance
(at least a year, according to Steve).

I know it's a long ways away for a lot of people, but on the other hand,
how many times will Oldsmobile celebrate its 100th anniversary, and how
many times in your life will you be able to see 3000 Oldsmobiles (that's
what they're expecting) at one time in one place, including 100 Curved
Dash Olds's?



************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 12:37:28 -0400
Subject: Re: Parting out 1966 Toro!

Gregg Ludlam wrote:
> 
>...around to other Toro addicts, this is a deal!
>
>You can E-mail me or call me at 1-414-447-7500
>
>Happy Toroing!
>
>Greg Kalkhoff
> 

Is he on here or do you have an email address for him?

The 66 Toro and Mike


Michael R. Frederick, CEO
Edison3, Incorporated
Tampa, Florida
(813) 210-8649

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 12:53:17 -0400
Subject: Re: 100th Anniversary Meet

Greg Beaulieu wrote:
> 
> I was curious to know how many of you are thinking or planning to attend the Olds 100th anniversary event in Lansing in 1997...


It would be really cool to convoy ... hellava drive from Tampa though!

I probably missed it but what are the dates?  I'd have to have the beast 
back together by then.

The 66 Toro and Mike

- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO
Edison3, Incorporated
Tampa, Florida
(813) 210-8649

------------------------------

From: clark@sh28.dseg.ti.com (Pat Clark 952-3776)
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 09:54:50 -0400
Subject: Witt's Wit

> As if that weren't enough, there's a pair of F heads in there, too, kinda
>used and beat up, but better than most I get there...

>  Now, what's to DO with all this good stuff???


- --
>Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
>wittchri@pilot.msu.edu




Chris, if the guys here didn't know you better I would swear that you make this
stuff up! ;>) You have to be the luckiest guy alive!


          ___              ___        _________
         /   |            /   |      /         \
        /    |           /    |     |   ___    |
       /     |          /     |     |__|   |   |
      /      |         /      |           /   /   
     /       |        /       |          /   /   
    /   /|   |       /   /|   |         /   /
   /   /_|   |__    /   /_|   |__      /   /
  |             |  |             |    /   /
  |______     __|  |______     __|   /   /_____
         |   |            |   |     |          |      Pat Clark
         |___|            |___|     |__________|       69 442
						      400/400

   "Just your average 300+hp garage hogging, gas sucking, money pit"

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 10:04:54 -0400
Subject: Re: 100th Anniversary Meet 

At 12:53 PM 4/2/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Greg Beaulieu wrote:
>> 
>> I was curious to know how many of you are thinking or planning to attend
the Olds 100th anniversary event in Lansing in 1997...
>
>
>It would be really cool to convoy ... hellava drive from Tampa though!
>
>I probably missed it but what are the dates?  I'd have to have the beast 
>back together by then.
>
>The 66 Toro and Mike
>
>-- 
>Michael R. Frederick, CEO
>Edison3, Incorporated
>Tampa, Florida
>(813) 210-8649


I don't have the dates in front of me, but I believe it's the third week
of August 1997.  I know it's in August.


************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #135
********************************

