
oldsmobile-digest         Saturday, 13 April 1996      Volume 01 : Number 146


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 09:52:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Entombed Cars 

At 08:52 AM 4/12/96 -0300, you wrote:

>We checked all the fluids, tried turning it over.  I was almost scared when it
>fired up 30 seconds after we first turned a key :)
>
>Drove it around the neighborhood... seemed fine.  Brakes worked, etc.
>
>$1500 later, it was mine.  Slowly drove it the 40 miles to my house.
>
>The rest is history :)
>
>Tim Churchill
>-------------
>'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
>'88 Cadillac Brougham, a.k.a. 'Big Blue' -- Olds 307 Powered!!
>'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'


Tim, enjoyed your story.  You found what I was HOPING to find
in my neighbor's father's garage...a car worth buying and
fixing up.


************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: Buddha <buddha@itw.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 10:19:01 -0300
Subject: Re: TH400 Modification Info 

ok...cool, now is there anyone who knows how to do this with a 4L60E (700R4)
               zack



At 00.18 04,12,96 -0300, you wrote:
>As I promised these are the instructions on how to modify a TH400
>transmission contained in the Spring, 1970 "SUPER TUNING AND BLUEPRINTING
>SPECIFICATIONS FOR 1970 OLDSMOBILE 350 AND 455 CU. IN. ENGINES AND
>"W-MACHINE" OPTIONS"
>
>I have placed a few suggestions at the end of this.
>
>******************************************************************************
>********************
>There are four ways to modify the Turbo Hydra-Matic 400 for quicker shifting.
>
>The methods are:
>
>A.   STREET PACKAGE - Quick Shifts
>

>*****************************************************************************
>OK guys, that's it.  I have not used the "C" or "D" packages but have built
>several "B" versions.  The "B" version loosens the fillings in my teeth every
>time it shifts.  It's been adequate for my 11 second street machine and all
>high throttle runs will lay rubber every shift.  Manual shifting an automatic
>is a pain in the butt and the shifts of the "C" and "D" are VIOLENT. Not just
>hard.
>
>If you study the hell out of an Olds service of that era (~'65-'75) you CAN
>figure out what these terms refer to.  Of course, if you have access to an
>experience auto transmission technician who will help you out it's sure a lot
>easier.
>
>If you buy the "master" rebuild kit you will get all the pieces you need.
> Just make sure you buy the kit that includes new clutches and plates.
> Plates of the type with P/N's above will be in the kit.  The wavy plate
>which comes in unmodified TH400 is there to smooth the shift.  That change
>alone will sharpen up shifting.
>  
>Modifying the governor involves drilling or grinding down the weights in the
>governor.  The lighter they are the higher the shift.
>
>Have fun!
>
>Bob Handren
>'67 442 W-30 Modified
>'70 Cutlass SX covertible
>
>
>
      ___
     /. .\
    _\_*_/_                     -<Buddha>-
   / /   \ \                   Buddha@itw.com
   \_\___/_/            HTTP://www2.itw.com/~buddha/
  /___\_/___\ "That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
 *************

------------------------------

From: Doug Ahern <doug@cobra.cosmic.uga.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 10:25:02 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine

> I'm still searching the entire Net for some info on the Olds 394 engine. 
> I found one out that looks good, and I think I'm gonna buy it, but I 
> would just like to know first:
> 
> 2) What are (roughly) the HP and TORQUE figures?

345hp in '64.

> 3) Can parts from a 400, 425 or 455 be swapped on the 394? Or from any 
> other Olds engine? If so, which ones?

part interchangablity is limited to pre-64 olds v-8.  I don't know about
cranks.  cams should be interchangable.

> 4) Anybody out there knows about mild performance parts for a 394 (like a 
> camshaft, a roller timing chain, high-volume oil pump, etc.)?

you could call some for the cam grinders that were doing cams back in the
50's, like Isky and Crane, so see if they may still have some laying around.
you'll probably need to have a stock cam reground.

as far as performance intakes.  Maybe a J-2 setup will bolt on.  Offy used
to make intakes, like dual quads, 4 2bbls' and things like that.  Your
best bet for high performance, is a stock 4GC intake with a 625CFM 
Carter AFB, unless you can find a old 2 4bbl intake, in which 2 625 CFM
Carters!  Hilborn had a fule inject setup of these things, at least 
I think it was hilborn (I remember seeing a trick dragster with a 
late 50's old, port fuel injection, and stock velocity stacks for each
intake).  there were blower intakes for these guys as well.

headers?? your on your own.

if you want to build these things, I suggest you get in touch with some
of the old timer nostaliga racers who used race these Olds v8's and who
still do.  The famous "Woods, Stone, and Cook" '41 Willys was powered by a
blown Olds.  these guys still race the car, at least they were about
10 years ago.    There are probably guys with garages full of trick 
Olds v8s parts.  the hard part will be finding them!!!  (good luck).
I'd start in southern california!

There is an old junkyard here in NE Georgia that has about 5-10 60-64
394's... if you need spare parts/engines.

Doug Ahern      doug@cosmic.uga.edu  1964 F-85 Cutlass 
http://www.cosmic.uga.edu/doug.html  1969 Dart 
Sys Admin, COSMIC, Univ. of Georgia  1974 Satellite ex-cop car

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:01:24 -0300
Subject: Re: Toro oil pan in G-Body... 

Tom:

The Toro pan is below the cross member of my '67 and it will kiss the
pavement if your not careful.

You will need the Toro oil pick-up.  The donor Toro should provide the old
oil pump.  The pickup can be pressed into your oil pump.  I use a Melling
high volume pump which has been very good.

Bob Handren
'67 442 W-30
'70 Cutlass SX Convert.

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 09:56:09 -0300
Subject: Re: Entombed Cars 

>Interesting that I should see this. Just read the same (sorta) story in
>the Fort Wayne (Ind.) Journal Gazette, except in this case it was in some
>woman's living room(?) in Florida. Seems herfather had bought the Vette,
>for some reason sealed it in a room in his grocery store, and when he died,
>the new store owner wanted it moved. Ergo, it ended up in her living room,
>then was purchased by a vette dealer in Napoleon, Ohio. Wonder how many of
>those cars there are?

I'm sure the leading Ch*vies are all alike: Cars & Parts had an item not
too long ago, with pictures, of a 1974 Chevy Vega with "Spirit of America"
option package (primarily white with red, white and blue detailing and
pinstriping) that some guy had bought new in 1974 for his, um, son or 
daughter, forget which, who was a newborn or toddler at the time. The car 
was built into his house for the, er, forseeable future back then. 
Fast-forward twenty years and the kid doesn't want it, so it gets 
trailered around to shows and auctions instead after they extricated it 
from the house.

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:19:58 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page 

At 01:30 PM 4/11/96 -0300, you wrote:
>everyone should check out my page.  its at
>http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
>
>
>

Charles,

I checked your page, and it looks good, but it
seems to have a problem.  Down near the bottom
of the upper page, there is a clickable link
which doesn't lead anywhere.  Also, there are no
PICTURES of your car!  We want to see it!


************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: urbanch@magi.com (Chris Urban)
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:21:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Toro oil pan in G-Body... 

>......
>
>Also, my 403 was rebuilt about 6 years ago and had about 15000 miles on it.
> When running 10W40, my oil pressure creeps down to under 20 lbs in gear at a
>stop.  At highways speeds, it is about 40 lbs.  I know that the service
>manual for a 70 Olds states that the pressure could be as low as 7 lbs, (for
>a 455) but that seems a little to low for me.  

A good rule to follow is 10 lbs of psi for evry 1000 rpm any less and I'd be
very careful.

>
>Some background:  I did not use Mondellos oil restrictors, because when I
>went to insert the first one (according to his instructions), it mushroomed

Your right they are crap best thing is to tap the block and screw in plugs
after you drill the proper size hole in them ( just stick a drill bit in
Mondello's till you get the proper size


>right over, so I scrapped that idea.  I also installed his oil pump spring,
>which is supposed to increase your pressure by 10-15 lbs, but that did squat,
>and my pressure remained the same.  
>So here is my question, if I install the Toro oil pan, what type of oil pump
>should I run?  Any thoughts?  And if possible, could I buy a Melling (etc)
>from Summit/Jegs instead on Mondello's ??   Any help would be appreciated!
> Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com 
>
>All after market supplier that carry high vol pumps for Olds are very good.
I have even used stock pumps with great success. Think about it you want to
keep the oil in the crankcase area (oil restrictors) but then you want a
high vol pump to get rid of it faster. Just make sure you buy the pump with
a longer pickup for the Toro pan
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:24:53 -0300
Subject: Re: wanted: est'd value 

At 02:27 PM 4/11/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Have a person here who has an old Starfire, wants to know what it's worth...
>1964 Starfire
>Presumably the big 394 engine
>Buckets, console, vacuum [?] gage not tach on it...
>Red exterior
>Some rust, some dings, I don't know the exact definitions, but prolly a #4 or a
>#3 after some cleanup.
>Runs, is driven. '64 98 parts car/ driver too, but it's a 4-door.
>
>I'm thinking some crazed Starfire lover might pay about $1000 for such a beast.
>Any input appreciated.
>
>--
>Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
>wittchri@pilot.msu.edu


Chris,

Yes, unless it was swapped with something else, the only engine available for
the '64 Starfire was the 394 V-8.  As far as its value, you don't mention the
body style, so I presume it's not a convertible, but rather the two-door
hardtop.  I think a value of $1000 in #4 condition sounds about right.  In #3
condition, it might fetch $2000-$3000.  

The '64 98 parts car would be able to contribute some mechanicals to the
Starfire, but, as you say, it's a four-door, and even if it was a two-door,
a lot of the sheet metal, particularly the rear quarters, would be
completely different.  The front bumpers are probably the same (but the
grills are probably not), but the rear bumpers are probably different.


************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:33:19 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine 

At 03:03 AM 4/12/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Hello!
>
>I'm still searching the entire Net for some info on the Olds 394 engine. 
>I found one out that looks good, and I think I'm gonna buy it, but I 
>would just like to know first:
>
>1) Does this engine have major weaknesses? 
>
>2) What are (roughly) the HP and TORQUE figures?
>
>3) Can parts from a 400, 425 or 455 be swapped on the 394? Or from any 
>other Olds engine? If so, which ones?
>
>4) Anybody out there knows about mild performance parts for a 394 (like a 
>camshaft, a roller timing chain, high-volume oil pump, etc.)?
>
>
>Any advice will be appreciated. Thanx.
>
>Isagil <isagil@cam.org>


Isagil,

I've got a lot of dealer literature at home (I'm at work, of course!) on 
1964 Oldsmobiles, and I think the performance information is included.  
I'll post it here tonight.

As far as what I've read, I know of no major weaknesses with this engine.  It
was used for a number of years by Olds for its full-sized cars.  It's
last year was 1964 (that much I'm sure of), and I pretty sure it was around
in 1959 if not earlier.  

I doubt that parts from the later 400, 425, and 455 engines could be swapped
with it, but I'm not 100% sure.  I'm not up at all on performance parts
for it.

But I'll let you know about the HP and torque.



************************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
Associate Professor and Graduate Chairman
Department of Chemical Engineering
Ohio University
Athens, Ohio  45701-2979
(614) 593-1495
(614) 593-0873 (fax)
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://www.ent.ohiou.edu/che/faculty/gulino.html
************************************************

------------------------------

From: MIKE COCCAGNA <mikec@kis.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 12:42:31 -0300
Subject: Zoinks!

Hey guys/gals:

I've got one to exercise the list today.....

This AM. I was parking my car ('91 Quad442 (FWD)), went to back up
and ZOINKS!  my reverse now thinks it's second gear.  hmm, lets try 
2nd to see if it thinks it's reverse........ Nope!  Randomly try 
other gears to see what they think they are...  The Odds are 1st, 
Evens are 2nd.  What could it be?  Begin the investigation in the 
garage under the hood with borrowed flashlight.  Hmmm, not the clutch 
since don't get that awful crunch, ignore that idea.  Fluid O.K..  
Wait a second, I don't remember any restriction when I was trying 
reverse, or when moving through the H.  Lets look at the shift 
cables....  Look O.K......  WAIT!  What's that strip of metal?  a 
broken part of the sheath.  Put car into a gear, and WOW!  all sorts 
of broken strand of cable.  Well...  Looks like the car will be 
getting a 50 mile ride home.

Now's here's the question:  
Given that there is a full schedule given to me by the little wife.  
What should I do?

1-  Take to transmission shop who quoted a price $200 less than the 
dealer for a clutch.   He said it was the cable.  About  $80 + a few 
hrs labor.  May want to do exploratory surgery to find cause... Heard 
he does good, but will have to wait until thurs or friday of next week.  :(

2-  Take to trusty ol' dealer.  Service staff has changed completely 
in last year.  Hasn't called me back w/ idea of cost for the stupid 
thing.  Probably soak me for the quicker service promise (last time 
the car visited for a while, it was a 7 day visit for a head gasket - 
they said "1 day tops... if it's here by 8AM"  Dropped of night 
before.)  Typical dealer.  Probably want to replace entire tranny 
instead of cable.

3-  Tell wife what she can do with list (prob. not a good idea) and 
give it a shot myself.  Well, I'll have to leave work early and get 
the cable.  Zoinks - no car to get the cable.  Where would I get it 
tomorrow?  Pep Boys? no they have crap parts according to emps.  Napa 
might have it....

Any suggestions?  

Mike 
'91 W-40 Quad442

------------------------------

From: Doug Ahern <doug@cobra.cosmic.uga.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:44:34 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine

> last year was 1964 (that much I'm sure of), and I pretty sure it was around
> in 1959 if not earlier.  

the 394 is the same basic block as the 1950 303, and everything inbetween.

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 12:21:34 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine 

The J-2 setup will NOT fit the 394.  There were differences between the 371
and 394, I believe in the port sizes. The 394 intake passages were much
larger.

You can save the carbs and linkage.  Offenhauser used to make a 3-2 manifold
for the 394.  Back in my youth when I spun a rod bearing on the 371 in my '56
88 (already exchanged the 324 out) I drove it the rest if the way home - like
15 miles!. Instead of rebuilding it I uped the cubes to a 394.  I drove it
home because I didn't want to rebuild the 371 when a 394 could be had, back
then, for less than the cost of a crank kit.

Besides, the Offy manifold is aluminum and looks better.

As for cams, differences in lifter angles plague selection for the current
Olds blocks, I really doubt they are interchangeable to the 394.  I've never
heard of any interchangeability. The early blocks are physically very
different from the later ones at least in appearance.

I also know from personal experience that the exhaust manifolds also differ
greatly.  The 324 and 371 can interchange a lot but not to the 394.

Bob Handren
'67 442 W-30 modified
'70 Cutlass SX convert.

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:20:16 -0300
Subject: Re: Zoinks! 

>3-  Tell wife what she can do with list (prob. not a good idea) and 
>give it a shot myself.  Well, I'll have to leave work early and get 
>the cable.  Zoinks - no car to get the cable.  Where would I get it 
>tomorrow?  Pep Boys? no they have crap parts according to emps.  Napa 
>might have it....

I got the cable for the '82 Cutlass (okay, it was an automatic) from
the dealer -- had to call around a bit but it turned up at last -- and
put it in myself. With visions of the agony and skinned knuckles involved
in tightening and adjusting cables on bicycles, I was expecting worse
than I got; getting access took more time than slapping it in.

Would getting it from the dealer fall under that new "Goodwrench Plus"
guarantee, whereby you only have to buy it once and it's guaranteed
for as long as you own it? Or would you have to pay them to install it
as well in order to get the guarantee?

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: MIKE COCCAGNA <mikec@kis.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 13:53:47 -0300
Subject: Re: Zoinks!

> >3-  Tell wife what she can do with list (prob. not a good idea) and 
> >give it a shot myself.  Well, I'll have to leave work early and get 
> >the cable.  Zoinks - no car to get the cable.  Where would I get it 
> >tomorrow?  Pep Boys? no they have crap parts according to emps.  Napa 
> >might have it....
> 
> I got the cable for the '82 Cutlass (okay, it was an automatic) from
> the dealer -- had to call around a bit but it turned up at last -- and
> put it in myself. With visions of the agony and skinned knuckles involved
> in tightening and adjusting cables on bicycles, I was expecting worse
> than I got; getting access took more time than slapping it in.
> 
> Would getting it from the dealer fall under that new "Goodwrench Plus"
> guarantee, whereby you only have to buy it once and it's guaranteed
> for as long as you own it? Or would you have to pay them to install it
> as well in order to get the guarantee?
> 
> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
> Datalogics, Inc.
> 441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
> Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473
> 
 
Don't know.  What is this 'Goodwrench Plus'?  Is it a 'lifetime of 
warranty'? like the F*rd guys had a few months age?

Dealer just called w/ quote of $216.   Sound right? (part + 3hr 
labor)

Mike
'91 W-40 Quad442 (travels 1 way.....slowly)

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@frame.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 11:57:58 -0300
Subject: Re: Zoinks! 

>Don't know.  What is this 'Goodwrench Plus'?  Is it a 'lifetime of 
>warranty'? like the F*rd guys had a few months age?

That's what I understand it to be. But after my second cup of coffee
soaked into my brain, I decided that it must only apply to repairs
done by them in-house; otherwise the lifetime warranty could apply
to every single light bulb sold at the parts counter.

>Dealer just called w/ quote of $216.   Sound right? (part + 3hr 
>labor)

Given the price of dealer labor these days, yes. If you are having it 
done by them, you should certainly ask about the Goodwrench Plus warranty
up front, too. Tell us what you learn.

The mind wanders: What's the difference between a warranty and a
guarantee, other than ease of spelling?

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 13:43:22 -0300
Subject: 442 Quiz: long, humorous

The following was based on the engine I built for the 68 hardtop, so a few Q's
had to be revised so that any Olds nut could answer them properly...

CAUTION: contains repeated use of the C word! Not for the squeamish! No other
foul language or inapropriate references, though!

                       The Oldsmobile Quiz
                 by C.Witt - v.2.0 - 4/11/96
[based on a stock Auto Trans 1968 442, without W30 option. Extra questions also
included, which apply to Olds in general.]

Q: What type engine came in a 1968 442?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  Big block.
    C)  Small block
    D)  Oldsmobile.
    E)  "Golden Rocket"
    F)  A and B only
    G)  C and D only
    H)  B and D only, and H_

Q: What is the engine displacement [CID]?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  425
    C)  455
    D)  403
    E)  400.
    F)  389
    G)  350
    H)  330
    I)  260
    J) None of the above

Q: Which is, of course, a bore & stroke of:
    A)  Chevy
    B)  4.000 x 3.500
    C)  4.125 x 4.250
    D)  4.250 x 4.000
    E)  4.057 x 3.385
    F)  a mile x a light year
    G)  4.000 x 3.975
    H)  3.800 x 4.250.
    I)  4.000 x 4.000
    J) None of the above

Q: What is the engine block ID number?  [Behind the coolant pump, just to the
right of the oil pressure sensor]
    A)  Uh, Chevy_ ? "010"? 4-bolt?
    B)  396021
    C)  396026.
    D)  389244
    E)  All of the above

Q: What is the engine block ID letter?  [Behind the coolant pump, just to the
right of the oil pressure sensor]
    A)  Uh, Chevy_ huh, huh_?
    B)  A
    C)  B
    D)  C
    E)  D
    F)  E
    G)  F
    H)  Fa
    I)  G.
    J)  All of the above

Q: What is the cylinder heads' ID letter?
    A)  Chevy "Camel backs" angle-plug
    B)  A
    C)  B
    D)  C.
    E)  Ca
    F)  D
    G)  E
    H)  F
    I)  G
    J)  Ga
    K)  H
    L)  J
    M)  K
    N)  Ka
    O)  All of the above

Q: Exhaust valve diameter is_
    A)  Chevy 2.02", dude!
    B)  More than 2"
    C)  Less than 2".
    D)  Greater than stock
    E)  None of the above

Q: Intake valve diameter is_
    A)  Chevy big block
    B)  More than 2".
    C)  Less than 2"
    D)  Greater than stock
    E)  None of the above

Q: Valves are_
    A)  Chevy units
    B)  Undercut
    C)  Swirl polished
    D)  Expensive
    E)  Stainless Steel
    F)  None of the above.

Q: What is the number of barrels of carburetion?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  2
    C)  4.
    D)  6
    E)  None of the above

Q: The cam has:
    A)  A standard Chevy profile
    B)  No detectable wear
    C)  290 degrees, or more, of duration.
    D)  All of the above

Q: The cam should be installed:
    A)  With a Chevy tool
    B)  Straight up
    C)  Advanced, to allow for chain stretch
    D)  Retarded
    E)  B-D until best results are achieved.

Q: Could this engine be considered a "W-30"?
    A)  Uhm, you mean, "Z-28" ?
    B)  Yes, they're pretty much identical
    C)  No, key components critical to performance are missing.
    D)  Maybe so

- ----- Now we expand into non-1968 442 territory -------

Q: What is the diameter of 1967 Toronado 425 lifters?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  0.842"
    C)  0.921".
    D)  All of the above
    E)  None of the above

Q: These 1967 Toronado 425 lifters are, of course_
    A)  Common Chevy parts
    B)  cheaper than most
    C)  more expensive than most.
    D)  unusually heavy
    E)  phenomonally light in weight
    F)  Titanium
    G)  None of the above

Q: How many lifters PER VALVE?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  1.
    C)  2
    D)  A hundred dozen
    E)  All of them
    F)  None of them

Q: OVERSIZE lifters are_
    A)  Standard Chevy parts
    B)  Impossible to find.

Q: Better performance comes from using_
    A)  Lots of Chevy parts
    B)  Lifter bore sleeve(s)
    C)  Oversize nitrous nozzles
    D)  Asbestos battery gaskets
    E)  Chrome muffler bearings

Q: What is the purpose of using a Toronado oil pan?
    A)  Clear the Chevy motor mounts
    B)  It holds more oil- a margin of safety.
    C)  Crank scraper helps keep oil off the crank- boosts power.
    D)  Clear the Toronado windage trays, if present.
    E)  All of the above

Q: What engine parts are normally made of Titanium?
    A)  Chevy valve spring retainers
    B)  Valve pocket osculators
    C)  Swirl-polished combustion chambers
    D)  Fuel injector nozzles
    E)  Metering jets & orifices
    F)  Power piston seat
    G)  You wish.

Q: What sort of rocker arms are used?
    A)  Chevy 1.5 ratio
    B)  Roller
    C)  Stock 1.6 ratio.
    D)  Adjustable

Q: What was the only year the tri-power option was available?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  1964
    C)  1966.
    D)  1968

Q: The best rear end is a_
    A)  Chevy positraction unit
    B)  10-bolt
    C)  12-bolt.
    D)  12-volt
    E)  W-27.
    F)  "Golden Posi"

Q: What is the standard rear end ratio?
    A)  Chevy "four-eleven"
    B)  2.73
    C)  3.08
    D)  3.90
    E)  None of the above

Q: The intake manifold is:
    A)  A modified Chevy unit
    B)  A rare "J-2" option
    C)  Nothing to rave about
    D)  Small and constrictive
    E)  All of the above
    F)  None of the above.

Q: What is the compression ratio of the stock engine?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  8.2:1
    C)  12.25:1
    D)  20.5:2.0.
    D)  Depends on head milling, gasket used, etc...

Q: What is the correct octane fuel to burn in this vehicle?
    A)  Whatever the Chevys are using
    B)  Racing
    C)  The best available.
    D)  97

Q: What is the gas mileage one might expect?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  Racing.
    C)  Lame.
    D)  Poor.

Q: What is the valve lifter bank angle of this engine?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  45x    <--- That's a 'degrees' symbol...
    C)  42.5x.
    D)  39x.
    E)  None of the above

Q: What is the purpose of feeding cold air to the W30 engine?
    A)  To be just like a Chevy
    B)  To pack more molecules of air and fuel into the cylinders.
    C)  To make more power.
    D)  To impress folks with visual underhood wizardry.
    E)  B-E.
    F)  All of the above

Q: The W30 gets cold air for the engine from:
    A)  A Chevy dealer
    B)  The under-bumper scoops.
    C)  A Cowl-induction hood
    D)  A rare W-25 fiberglass hood
    E)  A Cow-incuction hood
    F)  All of the above

Q: What is a practical RPM limit for this engine?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  1000
    C)  512K, Metric
    D)  6500.
    E)  None of the above

Q: What is the engine RPM limited or controlled by?
    A)  Extensive use of Chevy parts
    B)  Ignition system
    C)  Throttle opening.
    D)  Valve float.
    E)  All of the above

Q: What is the best type of muffler bearing to use for this engine?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  2.73 ratio
    C)  Chrome-moly steel
    D)  Metric
    D)  Dodge "Hemi"
    E)  None of the above; it's a trick question.

Q: In a drag race, this car could prolly beat 'most any:
    A)  Chevy
    B)  Ford
    C)  Dodge
    D)  Curved-dash Olds.
    E)  Cushman.
    F)  Pedestrian.
    H)  All of the above

Q: Funny, I thought '442' meant '4-barrel, 4-speed, dual exhaust', but this car
has:
    A)  a Chevy 400 small block
    B)  A 400 engine.
    C)  No 4 barrel carb
    D)  An automatic transmission.
    E)  Dual exhausts.
    F)  All of the above

Q: Who made the world's biggest small block engine, the 403?
    A)  Chevy
    B)  Oldsmobile.
    C)  Some other manufacturer

Q: A 454 *small block* can be made from:
    A)  No known combination of Chevy parts.
    B)  Oldsmobile diesel 350 block, 425 crank, special rods.
    C)  All of the above.
    D)  Swirl-polished dual exhausts

Q: Good instructions for driving might be:
    A)  Treat it just like a Chevy
    B)  Get in, sit down, shut up, and HANG ON.
    C)  Push, but never pull, during a drag race
    D)  Retard timing, set choke, easy on the gas
    E)  All of the above

Q: This engine has no "small block" parts because:
    A)  DUH! Only Chevy makes a "small block"
    B)  They wouldn't fit.
    C)  That'd suck.
    D)  It wasn't convenient at the time.
    E)  All of the above

Q: When you hear a lot of detonation from the engine, you should probably
    A)  Buy a Chevy
    B)  Turn the radio up to cover the offending noise
    C)  Stop accelerating so vigorously, and retard the spark at the earliest
convenience.
    D)  Install a new hyperbolic ring twister
    E)  Buy a new set of pistons.

- -------------------------------- End of quiz -------------------

There ya go, hope you enjoyed it. BTW, I put a period at the end of all the
answers I figured were 'correct', but I'm just a brother-appointed expert, not
a full-fledged one... so some answers are open to interpretation. It's all just
for fun anyhow. Use & distribute it as you wish. Include my name for credit/
blame...
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: MIKE COCCAGNA <mikec@kis.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 14:45:38 -0300
Subject: Re: Zoinks! Warranty v. Guarantee

I wondered too, so here it is

Warranty (from Websters Internet site):. written guarantee of the     
               integrity of a product and of the maker's 
               responsibility for the repair or replacement of defective parts 
Guarantee : an agreement by which one person undertakes to secure
               another in the possession or enjoyment of something    
               b: an assurance of the quality of or of the length of use to be 
               expected from a product offered for sale often with a promise 
               of reimbursement 

So... I guess a warranty is in writing while a guarantee is just a 
promise (like RWD cars will ALWAYS be made by Olds! :-)  )


 
> The mind wanders: What's the difference between a warranty and a
> guarantee, other than ease of spelling?
> 
> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
> Datalogics, Inc.
> 441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@frame.com
> Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473
> 
> 
> 
> 

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 13:45:42 -0300
Subject: *Correct* Corvette Restoration

For the curious... here's the essay I wrote mocking the Corvette crowd's
extreme efforts at attaining 'correctness' and 'originality' no matter what.
Enjoy, post, fwd as you like, just include my name for credit/ blame, thanks.

            *Correct* Corvette Restoration
                   by Chris B. Witt
                      v.2 10/95

Boy, it really galls my threads when these ignoramuses go off about how the
Corvette crowd is 'over-restoring' cars! I say, restored means *exactly* as the
factory  did it, no matter what. I spent 95 weeks last year doing an accurate
and complete ground-up restoration on my '67. And, let me tell you, some of
those rubber and glass pieces are *really* hard to restore after grinding them
up! Thankfully, the original engine and date-coded alternator diodes were
intact.

    For some folks, simply applying a bit of overspray while painting is 'good
enough.' I scoff at this. I meticulously copied onto the mufflers, droplet by
droplet, the exact overspray pattern that was there originally. Even the runs
and sags at the bottom of the door panels were duplicated.  Your average
'restorer' will just slap some new paint on, calling it 'original' if it is the
same color. Jeeez. I chemically removed every vestige of *the original paint*,
then broke it down, reformulated it, and re-applied it. Sure, I had to use
substitute volatile carrier (thinner), but since it evaporates anyway, I claim
that it was not originally 'on the car' when it left the factory gates.
    Some folks think using the 'correct' fasteners is good enough. Ha! I made
sure to cross-thread the left rear upper transmission crossmember bolt, just as
the (sometimes inebriated) factory worker was known to.  I removed the third
from the right lower grille attachment screw, which a previous owner had
erroneously installed, in spite of the well-documented fact that none of these
were installed at the factory until after 3:43 pm on October 17th, 1966. I made
sure to scratch the frame in the appropriate places, just as the handling
mechanisms at the factory did. Some previous owner had removed the scratches,
in an effort to make the car 'perfect.' What was he drinking? I even installed
the #3 cylinder's exhaust lifter upside down, which was a rare (1 of 3 such
built), but documented occurrence. Sure, it runs like hell, but hey, it's
_original_!

    Some folks get a new set of tires that LOOK like the originals, and call
that good enough. Not me. I got THE ORIGINAL tires out of a landfill, ground
them up, and restored them. I was able to find about 91.7% of the rubber which
had worn off, by vacuuming the roadside dust over the roads the car had
travelled, and separating out the correct molecules from the other debris with
a Mass Spectrographic Double-Diathermic Isopropa-diaphanometer molecular
identifier [MSDDID]. NOT cheap, let me tell you. But, correct is correct. Some
folks put on new valve stems and caps, and away they go. We purists know that
it IS important to align the seam line on the valve cap to the correct angle,
just as it left the factory ('indexed' valve caps).

    Changing the oil is considered routine by some 'restorers'. They throw out
the old, slap in some new, maybe even 'improved' oil, and a new filter. Not a
real purist. I have the original oil broken down and re-refined. The old
additives are removed, restructured, and re-added. I even recover as many
molecules of the burned or dripped oil as possible, and add them back in. Of
course, the filter must be dismantled, which ruins the case, so it has to be
remelted and reformed into a filter. Re-using the original paint, of course.
    Some bozos throw in a Sears Die-Hard, and off they go. Some so-called
restorers buy a reproduction 'tar-top' battery, and call THAT good enough
(*scoff*). I found my original battery and remanufactured it. No wimpy
replacing the innards with new, either. I melted down the original plates, then
recast them in the correct factory molds. Saving the original electrolyte, of
course. Now, you might think, gee, that seems pretty far-fetched, this guy is
extreme. Well, you ain't seen nothing yet. I also was able to procure the
original electrons which had come with the car, and reinstall them. It seems
that over the years, the car had given and recieved a few jump starts, and some
of the original electrons had thus transferred to other vehicles, and some from
other cars had contaminated my car. Thankfully, there is an electron sorting
and ID accessory for the MSDDID, which allowed me to correct this blatant slap
to _true_ originality.

    One thing holds me back from being 100% correct. Some fool of a previous
owner had changed the tires, and did not retain the original air. I know, hard
to believe, but it happened- some folks just don't 'get it.' Now, I have
located about 24.6% of the original air molecules with the MSDDID, but many of
them have been sucked into other engines, combusted, and turned into CO, CO2,
NOx, etc. If anyone is aware of a device to spot the correct air molecules
after they have been broken up and combined in other chemicals, please let me
know.  I guess I COULD settle for some air molecules from the St. Louis
tire-mounting area vicinity, captured about 9:47 am on September 5th, 1966. Ah,
well, it's only a few points off at showtime...
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: "Bill\"Dogga\"Ansell" <wansell@lynx.dac.neu.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 14:11:13 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page

Nothing at this site?

On Thu, 11 Apr 1996, Charles A Rogers wrote:

> everyone should check out my page.  its at
> http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
> 
> 

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 13:57:07 -0300
Subject: Misc stuffs: real content

Toro fever: Yeah, I think I got a touch... that Toro 425 block caused me to
rework it at great time/$ expense rather than just 'get another block' like
everyone said to do... Then, after ol' Ted knocked a sec off his ET with a
TIRED [broken in?] Toro 425, he wanted to keep that engine... "I bet you DO," I
replied, "but that one's for me... I can build you another just about like it,
though, use your intake,a new cam, etc..." I think he'll be hooked too...

Alternator conversion: I believe it goes like this:
Giant screw terminal: to battery, to charge it.
   Others are labelled 1&2 or R&2...
1 or R: to/from brown wire, for idiot light.
2: to/from battery, again. I have had success just jumping this right to the
big screw terminal, which is going to the battery anyhow... but the diagrams
all show it running separately to the battery + terminal. Fo Gigure.

JCWhitney:
I ordered an engine kit from another supplier, using it in the 425 now... gee,
the cam bearings are split-type... I open a set I got from JCW a while back...
Oh, what's this, CL77 full-circle bearings, just like the much-touted Mondello
version. Gotta wonder then, why Mr. Mondello needs to charge like $5 MORE a set
that JCW does... They are $15 a set at Whitney... Of course I used the
full-round units on this engine.

Toro oil pan onto 403: Have at it! If it sticks down too far, weld a skid plate
onto the frame to protect it :)   Oh, btw, since the Toro sump bottom is a bit
lower than the normal, you'd want to use the Toro engine's oil pump, or maybe
buy a new one. You COULD just extract the pickup and swap it, but that's asking
for trouble, getting it to re-fit properly. Buy a new Toro pump, if it comes w/
pickup attached.

TH400 mods: THANKS! Excellent hard technical stuff, that belongs right on the
Bryceman's web page!
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 14:17:48 -0300
Subject: dash out, v/springs

Dash extraction: Just keep plugging away at it, dude... Use a flashlight to
spot them... you know where most are, look for others in similar locations.
Seems to me like there is 1 or 2 over by the g'box... yank lightly on the dash,
see where it does not move yet, look there. I find that a cordless screwdriver
fitted with 1/4" socket driver, entensions, flexible extension, and a deep
socket are indispensible for this job. And a light. A hat-light would be great.
Also, there's often ONE like right under all the heater controls that simply
pushes into a nut-like thing; a good tug removes it. You can see the lack of
nut [barely] from the backside...

Valve springs: Oh, t'was a "heartbreak of  America" engine! Hmmm... seems to me
they have a lot of problems with valvetrain that we are not plagued with...
Let's start with press-in studs, shall we? Whose bright idea was THAT? I have
seen many an Olds valve spring come out of an engine after years of service, if
not as strong as the day it was made, at least very serviceable for ordinary
use. I'd not try to use 100K mike old springs on a 6000 rpm race motor, but
neither have I seen many weak or collapsed units. While measuring one off my 67
Toro engine, I decided to measure coil-bind height by compressing it to coil
bind in a vice.... fine, except that it never quite returned to its former
length. In fact, it's about 1/8" short now :)  Now, I measure coil bind height
by measuring the coils or the space between, and adding it up...
  Oh, how about 1.5 ratio rockers... As a innocent youngster, reading all those
glossy magazines, I was lulled into thinking that I, too, needed a set for high
performance... then I found out that even my lowly 330 engine already HAD 1.6
ratio rockers, from the factory...
  Shall we discuss rod bolts? Chevy folks pay extra to get fancy 3/8"
aircraft-quality rod bolts with funny-looking shanks and 12-point nuts. Guess
what's stock on the Olds engine...?
   And the list goes on...
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: Toronado66@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 14:41:11 -0300
Subject: Re: *Correct* Corvette Restoration 

Chris,

This has to be one of the funniest and most original things I have read in a
long time. I can't remember the last good belly laugh I had as good as this
one.

In most cases I would say don't quit your day job, in this case I'd say quit
your day job and persue a career in Ch*v** satire!

PS...glad your'e on our side!

Typhiod Toro 

------------------------------

From: Paul Elosge <elosge@eco.twg.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 16:29:05 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page

I'll throw my two cents in!

>> http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/

> Nothing at this site?

This is another one of those web pages that uses frames, that might be
it. I get nothing but the "views and opinions expressed in this page..."
when I bring it up with my browser. I did do a view source and found
it had frames. I extracted the references and went a little farther
manually, but don't remember what came next.

- - Paul Elosge

------------------------------

From: David Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 15:11:53 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine

At 03:03 AM 4/12/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Hello!
>
>I'm still searching the entire Net for some info on the Olds 394 engine. 
>I found one out that looks good, and I think I'm gonna buy it, but I 
>would just like to know first:
>
>1) Does this engine have major weaknesses? 
>
>2) What are (roughly) the HP and TORQUE figures?
>
>3) Can parts from a 400, 425 or 455 be swapped on the 394? Or from any 
>other Olds engine? If so, which ones?
>
>4) Anybody out there knows about mild performance parts for a 394 (like a 
>camshaft, a roller timing chain, high-volume oil pump, etc.)?
>
>
>Any advice will be appreciated. Thanx.
>
>Isagil <isagil@cam.org>
>

Engine rebuild parts are available from Kanter Auto Products, 76 Monroe St.,
Boonton, NJ, 07005, Phone 1-800-526-1096.  They also have a web page --
http://www.kanter.com, where you can order their catalog for free.  I don't
think they have any performance parts, just stock rebuild stuff.  
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: David Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 16:54:00 -0300
Subject: tires again

Well, I called the tire place today.  They don't have any 235/60/15's
available till Monday; I need tires _NOW_!  They do have a 245/60/15,
though.  Will they rub the frame on turns or anything?  Any fit problems
with that little bit of extra width and height?

Thanks  
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Rod Rickenbach <rod@hopi.dtcc.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:04:36 -0300
Subject: Re: tires again

On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, David Paulison wrote:

> Well, I called the tire place today.  They don't have any 235/60/15's
> available till Monday; I need tires _NOW_!  They do have a 245/60/15,
> though.  Will they rub the frame on turns or anything?  Any fit problems
> with that little bit of extra width and height?

I have fit 295/50/15's on my convertible - Just a little bit of tire 
bulge on the rim... ;)

The only problem I had was rubbing on the exhaust pipe - otherwise they 
fit fine.

BTW, this is on a '69 442 convertible...

- -Rod
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Rod Rickenbach                                       Delaware Tech
     rod@dtcc.edu                                 Computer Services Department
http://www.dtcc.edu/~rod                            Stanton/Wilmington Campus

------------------------------

From: David Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:02:57 -0300
Subject: Transmission swap

Since my transmission (a TH350) appears to be on its way out and in need of
a rebuild soon, I was wondering how hard it would be to replace it with a TH400.
Would it be a "bolt in" replacement?  Any major mods to make?  Could I use
the same torque convertor?  I was thinking of putting in a switch pitch
convertor instead...is that possible?  What about driveshaft/tailshaft
housing/bellhousing length?  Is the output shaft of the TH400 the same
diameter as a TH350, and does it have the same number if splines?  

Sheesh!!

Thanks for the help...
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Rod Rickenbach <rod@hopi.dtcc.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:05:23 -0300
Subject: Re: tires again

On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, David Paulison wrote:

> Well, I called the tire place today.  They don't have any 235/60/15's
> available till Monday; I need tires _NOW_!  They do have a 245/60/15,
> though.  Will they rub the frame on turns or anything?  Any fit problems
> with that little bit of extra width and height?

Oops - make that 295/60/15 (NOT 295/50/15)

Hoosier Quicktimes

- -Rod
- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Rod Rickenbach                                       Delaware Tech
     rod@dtcc.edu                                 Computer Services Department
http://www.dtcc.edu/~rod                            Stanton/Wilmington Campus

------------------------------

From: David Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:23:55 -0300
Subject: Re: tires again

At 05:05 PM 4/12/96 -0300, you wrote:
>On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, David Paulison wrote:
>
>> Well, I called the tire place today.  They don't have any 235/60/15's
>> available till Monday; I need tires _NOW_!  They do have a 245/60/15,
>> though.  Will they rub the frame on turns or anything?  Any fit problems
>> with that little bit of extra width and height?
>
>Oops - make that 295/60/15 (NOT 295/50/15)
>
>Hoosier Quicktimes
>
>-Rod
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>    Rod Rickenbach                                       Delaware Tech
>     rod@dtcc.edu                                 Computer Services Department
>http://www.dtcc.edu/~rod                            Stanton/Wilmington Campus
>
>
>
Thanks for the help...69 442 convertible...sweet!
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Toronado66@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:41:11 -0300
Subject: Latest Data on Toro-Virus 

TO ALL:


A MUST read for all who think they are infected, are carriers, or otheriwse
desire to prophylactically avoid this alleged condition.

Since I feel partially responsible for the recent "outbreak" of the alleged
T-Virus, I have conducted an investigation/research project. Myself, in
conjunction with the CDC (Center for Disease Control), Toronados Anonymous,
Oliver Stone, and several leading Auto-Epidemiologists have sought out to
determine the etiology of said virus in order to disspell myths, rumor,
inuendo, and hopefully de-stigmatize the car collecting public. 

I have purposely been quiet on this issue, until now, in order to collect
unskewed data and otherwise reduce the amount of researcher influence.
Further, this study was conducted in the double-blind format to exclude
researcher bias and data manipulation.

STUDY OVERVIEW & ABSTRACT

Purpose:
To determine the causative agent(s) as it relates to human behavior when
exposed to Oldsmobile Toronados.

Benefits:
To attain piece and harmony among all Oldsmobile enthusiasts regardless of
model.

Population Studied: (Target Group)
Using Systematic Random Sampling    k=n/mn    k=3.7
General Motors automobile owners n=47      
Toronado owners n=29
Oldsmobile owners (regardless of model) n=82
Total number of population sampled n=158

Control Group:
Ford owners n=55

Standard Deviation:
sd=.23

Statistical Error:
se=.78

Bivariant Inferential Parameter:
Not significant (as I have no clue what it is!)

Samples taken:
28 cc venous blood
Throat culture
Sputem culture
Urinalysis
Scrapings from underneath fingernails

Family History also Taken:


RESULTS: (as compiled by the Boss Kettering Insitute of Reciprocating
Engines)

IN TARGET GROUP:
No Viral, bacterial, prionic, or otherwise pathogenic organsims were found.

Genetic (DNA & RNA recombinates) show an abnormal grouping and close
association with the proximal intellengence allele in the Toronado owner
sub-group only.

Family history reveals a careing and loving upbringing where artisitc,
mechanical, and appreciation are fostered. (This demonstated accross the GM
line)

Extreme mechanical aptitude and predisposition to memorize countless part
numbers and interchange indsexies. This was remarkedly pronounced in the Olds
"all other" group that exludes Toronado.
 
IN CONTROL GROUP:
No data was useable as the Ford owners could not fill out questionaire. Also
blood samples, in most cases, were deemed tainted...... as the blood alcohol
levels were extrordonarily excessive. Also no genetic samplings could be
assayed as to the confounding influences of Neandrathillic retro-coupleing.

THEORIES/HYPOTHESES
The Oliver Stone Theory was disregarded for in his conclusion he states,
"It's obviously a conspiracy. The Order of the Pacific Rim has poisoned the
US drinking water with a virus that alters the psychie of Olds enthusiasts to
seek out all Toronados, painstakingly rebuild them, and sell them to rich
Japanese businessmen for peanuts who will eventually corner the market on
them and inturn sell them back to us at 25 times the original price, thus
garnering money to control global economies."   <----he is whacked! 

CDC's RESPONSE:
"We are too damn busy trying to come up with an AIDS vaccine for such
dribble"

TORONADOS ANONYMOUS RESPONSE:
Unfortunatley no members could be contacted as they live in traveling bands
roaming from junk yard to junk yard looking for that elusive rustless body
and parts to keep them on the road to continue thier quest!

MY PERSONAL FINDINGS

To each, his own! Although we do seem to be a miss-understood group. We are
 innocuous and mean no harm to any car form.... (within the Oldsmobile line
that is).
Collectively, we seek colaboration and brotherhood among all Olds
enthusiasts, as we are all family in many ways. If anything, the only thing
that is infectious around here is our sprit and affection of the Toronado.

I'm sure there will be other studies done, and I encourage the prospect.
Perhaps there may be other interesting theories on the subject.  (:

Greg  (Typhoid Toro)   

PS...Its a cold and rainy day here in Milwaukee. It was 80 yesterday and 40
today. I just had a little time to kill...hope you all enjoyed this
spoof...its all in fun!  (:


      

------------------------------

From: urbanch@magi.com (Chris Urban)
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 17:46:16 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page 

I couldn't get to this site.


>Nothing at this site?
>
>On Thu, 11 Apr 1996, Charles A Rogers wrote:
>
>> everyone should check out my page.  its at
>> http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
>> 
>> 
>
>
>

------------------------------

From: Charles A Rogers <roger035@gold.tc.umn.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 18:03:30 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page

On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, Paul Elosge wrote:

> I'll throw my two cents in!
> 
> >> http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
> 
> > Nothing at this site?
> 
> This is another one of those web pages that uses frames, that might be
> it. I get nothing but the "views and opinions expressed in this page..."
> when I bring it up with my browser. I did do a view source and found
> it had frames. I extracted the references and went a little farther
> manually, but don't remember what came next.
> 
> - Paul Elosge
> 
> 
im sorry. i just dont have time to make it without frames.  ill try to 
sometime.  thanks for your input!

------------------------------

From: Charles A Rogers <roger035@gold.tc.umn.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 18:01:49 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page

On Fri, 12 Apr 1996, Bill"Dogga"Ansell wrote:

> Nothing at this site?
> 
> On Thu, 11 Apr 1996, Charles A Rogers wrote:
> 
> > everyone should check out my page.  its at
> > http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
> > 
> > 
> 
> 
try http:/www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/delta.html

info on my car.  just go there anyway. even if you dont care.

------------------------------

From: David Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 18:06:59 -0300
Subject: Re: My home page

http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035
                              ^        ^
Make sure you put zeros(0) here and not capital O's..it will work.

>I couldn't get to this site.
>
>
>>Nothing at this site?
>>
>>On Thu, 11 Apr 1996, Charles A Rogers wrote:
>>
>>> everyone should check out my page.  its at
>>> http://www.tc.umn.edu/nlhome/g021/roger035/
>>> 
>>> 
>>
>>
>>
>
>
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: jsmith@radware.net (James Smith)
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 19:37:35 -0300
Subject: RE: Transmission swap

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BB2897.0518BA60
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
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There are small mods but it is still a bolt in replacement. The =
cross-member must be moved back but the holes should already be there. =
as far as the length thay are all different by changing the tail shaft =
housings I think that there is three different tail shaft housings. the =
drive shaft yoke must be changed but you can get that at any salvage. =
the TH400 is bigger then TH350. The converter is the same but I dont =
know about the vpitch you want

- ----------
From: 	David Paulison[SMTP:dpauliso@metrolink.net]
Sent: 	Friday, April 12, 1996 3:02 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca
Subject: 	Transmission swap

Since my transmission (a TH350) appears to be on its way out and in need =
of
a rebuild soon, I was wondering how hard it would be to replace it with =
a TH400.
Would it be a "bolt in" replacement?  Any major mods to make?  Could I =
use
the same torque convertor?  I was thinking of putting in a switch pitch
convertor instead...is that possible?  What about driveshaft/tailshaft
housing/bellhousing length?  Is the output shaft of the TH400 the same
diameter as a TH350, and does it have the same number if splines? =20

Sheesh!!

Thanks for the help...
- --
Dave Paulison             Melbourne, FL          69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net




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------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 18:45:59 -0300
Subject: Toro Oil Pump & Misc... 

Is swapping the pickup from the Toro pump to the new pump really asking for
trouble?  I have never done this before, but I was an add from Summit where
they put a small mig weld between the pickup and pump for insurance.  I can
understand that if the pickup doesn't fit too well that you can suck air
around where it inserts.  Any thoughts???? Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: JK McCall <jkmccall@clic.net>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 19:49:30 -0300
Subject: Re: Toro Oil Pump & Misc...

OLDSPWR@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Is swapping the pickup from the Toro pump to the new pump really asking for
> trouble?  I have never done this before, but I was an add from Summit where
> they put a small mig weld between the pickup and pump for insurance.  I can
> understand that if the pickup doesn't fit too well that you can suck air
> around where it inserts.  Any thoughts???? Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com


Tom:

I just replaced the rear mail seal in my P/U (ch*vy) and while I was at it thought I'd 
play it safe and replace the oil pump.  I bought a Melling high volume unit from a local 
parts outlet and had to swap the pickup.  I never did get it seat fully and I think 
it'll always be on the back of my mind but to date I haven't had any probs with it and 
have noticed the change in pressures on the gauge.

So if you don't want to be worring about it all the time make sure its fully seated.

JK McCall

------------------------------

From: DeHon Williams <dwilliam@arb.ca.gov>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 19:57:39 -0300
Subject: Vacuum Diagram

I live in California and have a 1970 Cultass 350 with a 4-barrel carb and 
 am in need of some information on the vacuum diagrams for this car.

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 12:21:04 -0300
Subject: Downtime

Just in the off chance that anyone was expecting a reply from me, my 
email went down yesterday afternoon.  (Netscape took a dump on my 
inbox.)  Just got it back up so it'll take awhile to get through the 
70-80 messages that piled up on the server.

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO
Edison3, Incorporated
Tampa, Florida
(813) 210-8649

------------------------------

From: Toronado66@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 22:08:15 -0300
Subject: Re: Downtime 

Have fun Mikie!

There's some good stuff in that mail somewhere!

Typhoid Toro!

------------------------------

From: Daniel Gulino <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 22:20:05 -0300
Subject: 394 Engine

>From the 1964 Oldsmobile Dealer Literature:


The 394 was available in the 98, Starfire, Super 88, Dynamic 88, and the 
Jetstar I.  

For the 98, it produced 330 HP at 4600 RPM and 440 ft-lbs of torque at 2800.
For the Starfire, 345 HP at 4800 RPM, 440 ft-lbs of torque at 3200 RPM.
For the Super 88, exactly the same as the 98.
For the Dynamic 88, 280 HP at 440 RPM, 430 ft-lbs of torque at 2400 RPM.
For the Jetstar I, exactly the same as the Starfire.

The 98, Starfire, Super 88, and Jetstar I all came standard with 4-bbl 
carbs, the Dynamic 88 came with a 2-bbl.

The 98, Super 88, and Dynamic 88 all had 10.25 to 1 compression ratios.
The Starfire and Jetstar I had 10.5 to 1.

These are general specs.  In actuality, the Starfire engine was standard 
on the 98 Custom-Sports Coupe (the "top of the line" 98).
It was available as an option all the other 98s and the Super 
88.  The 330 HP version was an option on the Dynamic 88, which came 
standard with a 280 HP version.


Hope this helps.



Dan Gulino

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 22:27:21 -0300
Subject: Re: 394 Olds engine 

In a message dated 96-04-11 23:02:46 EDT, you write:

>I'm still searching the entire Net for some info on the Olds 394 engine. 
>I found one out that looks good, and I think I'm gonna buy it, but I 
>would just like to know first:
>
>1) Does this engine have major weaknesses? 
>
>

Isn't it true that cracked heads are not uncommon on these engines?  I had a
'64 with a cracked head, and a buddy's dad had a '60 with a cracked head.
 Were these just flukes, or are they know for this affliction?

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 14:36:37 -0300
Subject: As requested, Info on W-40 Option 

     Sorry, I was wrong, the '84 H/O was the W-40 option, NOT the w-35 
     option.
     
     The W-40 Hurst/Olds option was based on the Cutlass Calais K47 Style.  
     3500 were built in 1984, and 2500 were built in the first run of 1983, 
     folled by a second run of 500 for a total of 3000 '83 models.
     
     According to the '84 Olds Specs book:
     
     W40 Hurst/Olds Package     $1995.00
     
     Includes Silver Metallic and Black special paint scheme with Red and 
     Black accent stripes on Upper Sides and Front-End Panel.  Blacked-out 
     Bumpers, Bumper Guards, Headlamp Doors, Tail Lamp and BAckup Lamp 
     Bezels with Black and Bright Grille, Amber Park/Turn Lamp lenses, 
     Chrome and Silver Super Stock Wheels with Red accent stripe (N83), 
     Black Front Lower Air Dam, Silver Deck Lid Spoiler, Non-functional 
     Hood Scoop and Bumper Rub Strip Moldings.  Includes all Calais 
     interior features such as Reclining Bucket Front Seats (AR9), Outside 
     Mirrors (D35) Silver, Sport Console (D55), Firm Ride and Handling 
     Package (F41) plus superlift Air Shock Absorbers, Custom Sport 
     Steering Wheel (NK3), P215/65R15 Goodyear Eagle GT Tires (QYH), 
     Instrument Panel Rallye Cluster (U21) and Tungsten Halogen Headlamps 
     (TT5), 5.0-liter V8 engine (LV2) with high-performance camshaft and 
     dual-outlet exhaust system: 4-speed Automatic Overdrive Transmission 
     (MX0) with special Hurst "lightning Rod" shifter and a 3.73 Axle Ratio 
     (GT4).  (Available on on K47 with exterior color 17 Silver Metallic 
     and Interior Trims 23 Royal Blue Cloth, 25 Maple Red Cloth or 55 Maple 
     Red Vinyl - D68 available C60 and V08 required - N.A. with B84, B93, 
     C04, N66, N91, QHW, QJR, QMW, QMX, U35, U46 or Y71)
     
     -------------------------- end of brochure --------------------------
     
     According to this the interior can also come in a Royal Blue Cloth.  
     I've only seen the red vinyl and red cloth.  Can anyone else verify 
     ever having seen a blue-interiored '84 H/O?
     
     The only options not included or limited by the W40 package were:
     CC1 Removable Roof Panels                          $825.00
     G80 Differential, Limited Slip                     $95.00
     K07 Heater, Engine Block                           $18.00
     Plus a choice of 5 different radios, an upgraded speaker package, and 
     a power antenna.
     
     Tom Lentz
     

------------------------------

From: "Paul R. K. Kuromoto" <suntzu@ohana.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 1996 23:26:21 -0300
Subject: Re: Toro Oil Pump & Misc...

Well you weld the pickup to the pump to assure that it does not fall 
out!  That's engine failure for sure.  When welding, you must be careful 
not to heat up the body of the pump too much, or the pressure relief 
spring will go limp on you.  Not sure if you can just take the darn thing 
out and reinstall after you weld.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 I used to think that the Information age would spawn a great
 revolution as more people got smarter due to access to more
 information.  To the contrary, now that any idiot can use the
 Net, the integrity of the information contained therein has
 been corrupted.                          --Suntzu@ohana.com
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

------------------------------

From: Buddha <buddha@itw.com>
Date: Sat, 13 Apr 1996 00:04:01 -0300
Subject: Re: Downtime 

use Eudora...its ALOT better
          zack

At 12.21 04,12,96 -0300, you wrote:
>Just in the off chance that anyone was expecting a reply from me, my 
>email went down yesterday afternoon.  (Netscape took a dump on my 
>inbox.)  Just got it back up so it'll take awhile to get through the 
>70-80 messages that piled up on the server.
>
>The 66 Toro and Mike
>
>
>-- 
>Michael R. Frederick, CEO
>Edison3, Incorporated
>Tampa, Florida
>(813) 210-8649
>
>
>
      ___
     /. .\
    _\_*_/_                     -<Buddha>-
   / /   \ \                   Buddha@itw.com
   \_\___/_/            HTTP://www2.itw.com/~buddha/
  /___\_/___\ "That which does not kill us makes us stronger"
 *************

------------------------------

From: "Dink" <heinle@jake.udayton.edu>
Date: Sat, 13 Apr 1996 01:36:07 -0300
Subject: Re: Downtime

lets not start a war here but..

PMail is the best.  Is has filtering and folders for seperate stuff.  
I have filtering for my family mail and all my mailing lists, it is 
very cool and i don't have to sort any mail. And it's free!

> use Eudora...its ALOT better

Dink
80 Delta 88 Royale

{
Dink           Dayton, Ohio
http://homepages.udayton.edu/students/heinle/
Computer Information Systems Major @ UD
}

------------------------------

From: gludlam@bcinet.net (Gregg Ludlam)
Date: Sat, 13 Apr 1996 10:12:07 -0300
Subject: Re: '69 Toro questions 

>On Thu, 11 Apr 1996, Gregg Ludlam wrote:
>> Here's what I found in some reference material:
>>         -Other than a different front grille design, the '69 is nearly
>> identical to the '68
>> 
>> -Gregg, the '67 Toro guy
>> 
>
>Just let me get this straight, G.L.; are you saying it's more or less 
>butt-ugly than the '68 whose front-end design you admired so much a few 
>weeks back?
>
>Just curious...  ;)

Man, Greg, you have the memory of an elephant!  Did I really say that?!  Ok,
so I did...

...I'd still TAKE one if someone would give it to me!!!      :)


- -Gregg, the '67 Toro guy

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #146
********************************

