
oldsmobile-digest     Wednesday, January 7 1998     Volume 01 : Number 1045



yr id by t'lites
Re: was Mondello, now Miller
Re: 1965 Oldsmobile Cutlass
[none]
[none]
[none]
Re: 54 olds oil problem
[none]
[none]
Re: cc'ing with plate
HEI Conversion - Again/Still
[none]
re; scottsdale auction and parts hunting
Re: Info on Alero
1931 oldsmobile
Mexican chrome
Congrats in order
Re: Engine Repair Software
Re: engines
Re: My engine number
Re: **VERY IMPORTANT QUESTION**
subscribe digest
She will not start! Arrghhh!
Side Marker Lites
1995 OLDS SUPER 88 CONVERTIBLE
Re: Web pages...
Re: Mexican chrome
Red fender wells
Re: She will not start! Arrghhh!
Panel controvery
Re: yr id by t'lites
Re: HEI Conversion - Again/Still
Re: She will not start! Arrghhh!
Re: Engine Repair Software
UNBOUNCE: HEI Conversion - Again/Still
UNBOUNCE: 1931 Olds
UNBOUNCE: 1955 Super 88 Convert
Re: Info on Alero
Re: Panel controvery
Mime-Version: 1.0
Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible
Re: engines
Re: Info on Alero
Re: Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible
Re: Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible
non olds diy repair help request
Re: Info on Alero
Re: Side Marker Lites
Re: Side Marker Lites
Re[2]: Side Marker Lites
Re: Side Marker Lites
DeNovi's parts
Re: Rear Side Markers
Re: Info on Alero
Re: UNBOUNCE: HEI Conversion - Again/Still
'68 Safety Equipment
Re: DeNovi's parts
Original Dies(was: Panel controvery)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:36:29 -0500 (EST)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: yr id by t'lites

When I was a kid we always used to tell the year of a car by the numbers
cast in the tail light bezels.  Which would make these 1968 parts (or
originally produced for 1968 cars).
=================
That's a neat trick. I have noticed, however, that certain lenses that do not
change every year will retain the year of the first year used.

Also, I believe that the side marker lights were 1st required in '68, thus some
from many years later even will say "68" on them- as in they comply with that
rule...
- --
Chris  B. Witt :=: wittchri@pilot.msu.edu :=: Location: Mecca [Lansing, MI]
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
         >>> Please snip the excess lines from posts <<<

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:05:23 -0500
From: "W-MACHINES" <wmachine@en.com>
Subject: Re: was Mondello, now Miller

> Kurt,
> 
> I take it from your response that you have attended the Mondello
> meet in the past. 
Been there every year!

>  Appreciated Joe for hosting this event but must confess that the way
> he treated the participants left much to be desired.
Very true, but 'nuff said.

>  Good friend of mine won class in 97 and didn't get 14 of the posted
> contingency
> awards.  That was very disappointing.
Happened to me when I was class runner-up a few years ago. 

>  What car and class did you participate in / with.  I have video from the
> past 5 years and could probably find ya on it..
Look for the big green watermelon!  I've had my Jade Green '70 Toronado
W-34 there every year.  Runs low to mid 15s all day long.

>  As a longtime Olds performance buff I would encourage all other Olds
owners
> that like to race/watch or show their cars try to catch this event at
Norwalk
> raceway
> in Norwalk Ohio ,on Aug. 16.  We need to show our support for Dick as he
has
> now
> taken on the finacial responsibility to host this event for our
enjoyment.
> Those of you
> that are in reasonable range of this track and have never been to an
event at
> Norwalk are in for a real treat. This track is probably one of the nicest
> tracks operating in the country. Everyone from the owner to the lowest
person
> on the totem pole go out of their way to ensure that all visitors enjoy
the
> event whatever it takes.
>  For those that are not into the racing as much there is a car show on
site
> the same
> day of which was never pushed as much as the racing event.  Let's turn
this
> event
> into the largest Midwest gathering or Oldsmobile's second only to the OCA
> nat's.
> The grounds at Norwalk can easily accomodate 1000 cars for show without
even
> getting into the pit area or mingling among the racers. 
> 
> What'a say folks....... they get thousands attending the Buick meet every
year
> in Bowling Green Ky. What better way to get our marque RECONIZED for the
> beauty and power we all hold keys to......
> 
> Happy E.T.'s to all
> 
> Rgds,
> Rob Thomas
> 69 442

Rob is absolutely right!

Kurt    wmachine@en.com
'65 Jetstar 1 4-speed                   '70 Toronado GT W-34 4-sale
'66 442 Sport Coupe 4-speed       '92 Achieva SCX W-41
'66 442 F-85 Deluxe factory L-69  '90 Trofeo

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:13:59 -0500
From: "W-MACHINES" <wmachine@en.com>
Subject: Re: 1965 Oldsmobile Cutlass

Lisa- are you looking for stick or auto?  I have an auto with an *unbroken*
T-top.

Kurt    wmachine@en.com
'65 Jetstar 1 4-speed                   '70 Toronado GT W-34 4-sale
'66 442 Sport Coupe 4-speed       '92 Achieva SCX W-41
'66 442 F-85 Deluxe factory L-69  '90 Trofeo

- ----------
> From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: 1965 Oldsmobile Cutlass
> Date: Tuesday, January 06, 1998 12:53 AM
> 
> Would you happen to have a floor shifter available?
> 
> 
> Lisa Madsen
> Anaheim, CA
> 
> '64 Cutlass, '66 Toronado, '67 Delta 88 Custom, '69 Toronado, '72 Vista
> Cruiser (twin hauler)
> 
> Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com
> 
> My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/
> 
> Subscribe To : Lisa's Classic Oldsmobile Bulletin Board Mailing List:
> Glass Line's Bulletin Board: http://exo.com/~jht/wwwboard/olds/
> 
> *** NEW ***
> Lisa's Oldsmobile FREE Banner Exchange
> http://exo.com/~jht/olds/banners/

------------------------------

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 21:57:03 EST
From: Mr57olds <Mr57olds@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 54 olds oil problem

In a message dated 98-01-03 23:00:21 EST, you write:

<< Hi everybody.  Recently bought a 54 olds 88 with (supposedly) 26,000 miles
on it. It has the 324 ci engine. I have a problem which has me perplexed. When
first started, the engine is quiet but after a few minutes it has a lot of
valve clatter. >>
Dan, most likely the noise is lifter noise and the result of lack of oil in
the lifters.  Pulsating oil to the rocker shaft stand is normal.  oil does not
go from lifter to rockers in this engine.  Oil is fed into cam bearings from a
passage between mains and cam then back out of cam bearing at 120 degrees up
through block & head to rocker stand.  Cam is drilled through bearing journel
and holes only line up for and instant thus the pusation.  This also meters
the amount of oil that goes up top so as not to pump all oil up there.  You
can increase the oil to the rockers by grooving the cam journel so that oil
can go between cam and bearing between oil passages.  I don't think lack of
oil to rockers is your problem.  the rockers would squeak not clatter.  Most
likely the lifters are running out of oil or the oil contains air when it gets
to the lifters.  The oil may not be draining back to oil pan properly.  Oil
level is ok when engine is not running but is pumped up through engine until
it gets low in pan.  The reason for quiet when first started but noisy after
running a while.  Solvent will likely cause more problems then fix.  The stuff
you break loose will not go through lifters!!  Good luck.  contact me if you
have further questions. 
Mr57olds

54 olds
57 olds
64 442
98 intrigue 

------------------------------

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------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 00:09:53 -0500
From: Jerry Christopher <IThEFunKI@ViperLink.Net>
Subject: Re: cc'ing with plate

KS7RACING wrote:

> told by a long-time racer a few years ago. They found that placing a SMALL
> amount of dishwashing liquid into water did the trick. 
> What they used it for was to enhance the cooling ability of plain water
> in the radiator, since we have a "no anti-freeze" rule on our local asphalt
> circle tracks. They said that if you lower the surface tension of the water,
> it can transfer heat better. I tried it, and didn't have a problem with
> overheating the entire season, and with the numerous times we had the engine
> apart (cam change, head change, etc.), the cost of this "coolant" couldn't be
> beat.

Added bonus, I guess is that the engine was clean???  <G>

- -- 
- - Jerry Christopher
- - HTTP://WWW2.Viperlink.Net/Members/IThEFunKI
- - 1987 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
- - Here we go Steelers!!!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 22:51:27 -0500
From: "M&D Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: HEI Conversion - Again/Still

Well, The HEI distributor is in the car and I'm having problems. This
is the first time I have changed a distributor let alone taking on my
favorite nemesis: ELECTRICITY!!
The HEI is a rebuilt GM specified for a 75 Olds. The cap rotor and
coil are aftermarket replacements.
After getting the #1 cylinder to TDC on compression stroke (actually
the timing mark is about 8 deg. before TDC), I installed the dist.
with the rotor on #1 terminal. When the gear engaged with the cam, the
rotor also was a few deg. before #1 terminal.
I found an ignition switched 12v source and connected the wire to the
red wire where the coil plugs into the plastic connector on the HEI
(also red). This corresponds to the "B" terminal in the ASCII sketch
in the FAQ. After connecting them, I rechecked the voltage at the red
terminal on the coil and it was still a strong 12 volts.
PROBLEM: There is no spark at the plugs when I crank the engine. I
know I missed something, but I dont know what.
Question: The FAQ mentions that new kits don't include a ground strap
and that a lot of people forget them. I did connect the black
(ground ) wire from the coil to the coil body, under a mounting screw
on the coil to dist. (per instructions with the coil). Is there some
other ground strap that I need? Could this be my problem?

While my wife was cranking the car, I tested for spark with a plug
attached to the #1 wire; I saw and heard a spark from the vicinity of
the distributor housing. Otherwise no juice at the plugs. I don't know
where to go from here and need some help from anyone who has done
this. When responding, please appreciate that I know next to nothing
about electricity and need very simple how tos.
Thanks in advance for any help you can give.

Mick Gillespie
69 Cutlass S convertible
OCA# 29770
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

------------------------------

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 20:48:25 -0800
From: "dan cox" <peachyst@earthlink.net>
Subject: re; scottsdale auction and parts hunting

friends - might drive my '60 super - 88 from here [l.a] to phoenix.  this
weekend is the big annual classic car auction in scottsdale.  plus, how far
can tucson be from there, anyway.  no problem for a 'rocketeer', right? 
plus, my friend is 'giggin' at some club, playing some hilljack music.  ya
gotta love it.

r.i.p. sonny bono
driver dan

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:28:48 EST
From: DByers4601 <DByers4601@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Info on Alero

The new Oldsmobile Alero was rolled out at the Detroit International Auto Show
today !!!    There should be a lot of press about it in the upcoming days.

The car will be produced in Lansing, MI only !!!    I believe that full
production starts sometime in March.   The 1999 Pontiac Grand AM is starting
production next week at the plants here in Lansing.

                                                       Dave Byers
                                                       Small Car Group -
David_Byers@Bigfoot.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:12:22 -0600
From: Unknown@cc.recorder.ca
Subject: 1931 oldsmobile

I AM LOOKING FOR INF. ON A 1931 4 DOOR SADDEN FOR MY DAD HE AS A FRIENDS
CAR ALL THE PARTS ARE IN BOXS  HE NEEDS INF TO HELP REBULID IT BACK TO ITS
REG. STATE IF ANYONE KNOWS WERE HE CAN GET INF. IT WOULD BE OF MOST HELP   
    


                                           THANK YOU
                                              ROBIN BLAIR

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:12:45 EST
From: W MACHINES <WMACHINES@aol.com>
Subject: Mexican chrome

I seam to remember a story about a fella having his chrome done
in Mexico.  Does anybody have the phone number or email address.

I would like to contact them on rechroming some 87 442 rims.

any help would be appreciated.

W MACHINES (Mark Prince)
1972 442 W-30 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:15:09 EST
From: W MACHINES <WMACHINES@aol.com>
Subject: Congrats in order

I want to take the bandwidth to congrats Larry on his victory.  Its good
to see an Olds win.  
Also, I would like to take the time to thank all the fellow Oldsmobilers for 
voting me second on MCC online.  

Thanks again 
W MACHINES (Mark Prince)
1972 442 W-30 Race Rocket

remember, I am not conceided, just convinced

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 17:39:57 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Engine Repair Software

>Jim H asked:
>
>        Does anyone know if there is software available in which you can
>plug your laptop into the ECM/ALCL and get current readings (timing, fuel
>adjustment, etc.) or change these settings to your own.
>
>

I have been following this on the various auto newsgroups for quite a while
as it comes up quite often.  It seems that the biggest problem is
interfacing to the data stream which is at an odd baud rate (I have the
protocol somewhere if anyone wants it) and the much more difficult task of
deciphering what the data means when you have decoded it (not in the
protocol).  The unit I heard of was an interface cable and most importantly
the software to figure it all out.  From Memory it cost about $200.

I have noticed that you can get the Auto XRay XP240 Scan Tool which does
all this for under $200 (if you shop around).  Has anyone had any
experience with this and is it a worthwhile investment? All I would use it
for would be to diagnose any CCC problems in my '84 Riv and I have been
able to do that up to now with the service manual, a DVM and a paper clip
(the manual never mentions a SCAN tool).


Lloyd Ferguson
ferguson@1stnetusa.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 21:13:28 -0600
From: "Samuel E. Johnson, Jr" <cutlass403@ameritech.net>
Subject: Re: engines

I have a 350 in my 71 cutlass. I would love to know how to get 397 horses out of
a 350.
Please give me this information. This will save me from going out and trying to
find a 455 olds block to build. I already have a 71 350 with #7 heads in it. I
have a buddy with the #5 heads already.

Thanks Sam Johnson
71 Cutlass S 350 2b

BIG JERMES wrote:

> In a message dated 98-01-05 22:01:14 EST, you write:
>
> << what would a 403 engine run like with the full edelbrock rpm kit in it?
> has
>  anyone ever done this? >>
>
> well, ill put it to you like this.  if you put that rpm package on a 350, you
> get 397hp! (this is with #5 heads and a few other minor things.) go to
> edelbrock's website.  they have some info on it.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 22:20:36 -0500 (EST)
From: Robert Barry <RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu>
Subject: Re: My engine number

>Well, I scraped the layer of goo off the front of my engine, (I'm thinking
>of getting the engine professionally steam cleaned, I'd appreciate any
>input on that, too :¬)) and low and behold, the number 395558 and maybe a 2
>or a Z a little past that.  I am not sure what that tells me, but the
>engine surface appears to be a gold? kind of color (I cannot describe it
>well, but it matches the gold Oldsmobile valve covers).  I don't know what
>that tells me either.  Back to the goo...

The 395558 2 casting number tells you it's a '68-'76 350 block. The gold
tells you it's likely a '68-'72 engine. Now, tell us what number and casting
number you find on the heads, and we'll narrow it down even more.

All of this is in the FAQ, btw, if anyone is interested...
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 22:20:33 -0500 (EST)
From: Robert Barry <RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu>
Subject: Re: **VERY IMPORTANT QUESTION**

>>You'd go with the torque for the bolts (here, 1/2" bolts), which is 130
>>ft/lbs (with oil on the threads and under the head of the bolt)...       
>
>Hi Doc
>I am in the process of putting together a non-Olds motor, and recent posts
>have raised a question about *wet* torque specs. Do you know if oiling
>bolts/nuts before assembly and torque is a universal for all motors and
>manufacturers. Or, is this an Olds thing?

It's common, but not absolutely universal; for critical things like rods,
heads and main cap bolts, you absolutely want to follow whatever the factory
recommendations are (in fact, you might find a couple different torque specs
for the same bolt, depending on whether it was installed dry, and which type
of thread lubricant was used on it). So the moral is, always check the shop
manual.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:35:57 -0800
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Subject: subscribe digest

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:20:27 EST
From: KarlAune <KarlAune@aol.com>
Subject: She will not start! Arrghhh!

Hey all. 

Got a poser for ya.

Monday morning, Soylent Ocean Mist would not start.

Normally, she kicks right over, and away we go. Admittedly, on reflection, she
has been getting harder and harder to start in the mornings and less difficult
in the afternoons. 

Drove to work and back last Tuesday, and got a full tank of gas on the way
back. I wanted to not drive her over my following five-day weekend, but ended
up running a small errand on Friday, which was uneventful. Sunday (much good
Foot-ball) was warm for a change, but very wet. Monday was no different. I
spent about an hour trying to start her, but just drained the battery, and
spent the rest of the day recharging it. 

Today, I went to work (with the money left over from buying gas, I usually buy
a loaf of bread to feed myself for that month) and thanks to an interesting
problem on the Jefferson Park-O'Hare line I did not have enough time today for
tinkering (plus I was too damn lazy).

Other information; the battery, starter, and (I firmly believe) spark plugs
are good. In point of fact, I removed the plugs, cleaned them, re-gapped them,
reinstalled them, read the Chassis manual, swore, cussed, stormed, and in a
fit of high dudgeon I removed the plugs again and re-re-gapped them to the
_proper_ distance of 0.030, which is very likely exactly what they were in the
first place. My cap, rotor, and points are Accell parts that are 5 months old,
and dwell was right on the money at that time.

I know what many of you are thinking; "Aha! Wet weather! His distributor
(points) is wet." Well, I have not pointed the heat gun at it yet, but it
looked dry in there and I did not want to drag cords and 110v equipment out
into the wet. While I will do that, I did notice that the points were awfully
close together and wondered if the points or lifting block could wear
appreciably in this short a time.

Thank you in advance for your suggestions.

BTW There is a bimetallic-type coil spring and large pivoting block near the
bottom of my driver's side exhaust manifold. What in the heck is that thing?

Great new year, huh?

Karl Aune and Soylent Ocean Mist
1965 Dynamic 88 Celebrity Sedan

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 23:32:49 -0500
From: Trevor Lee <lee@mergetel.com>
Subject: Side Marker Lites

> Also, I believe that the side marker lights were 1st required in '68, thus some

Just thought I'd throw in here that, yes, indeed it was in '68 that the side
markers were required, because if you even look at the '68 Ford Mustang, it looks
almost exactly the same as a '67 (the year my dad had, and he pointed this fact out
to me) except that it has the side marker lights.  I don't know of any other way of
telling those 2 cars apart.  So there you have it - that must be the year if even
Ford started the same year.  I'm trying to recall what the side of a '68 Charger
looks like, but it's escaping my memory.
- --
Trevor Lee (aka Screech), Owner - TL Tech
Rat-Powered '76 Cutlass Supreme Brougham
http://www.mergetel.com/~lee/cutlass/
mailto:lee@mergetel.com
Welland, Ontario, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 00:36:31 -0500
From: STEVE SENIOR <STEVE5X5@BLAST.NET>
Subject: 1995 OLDS SUPER 88 CONVERTIBLE

I BELIEVE THAT I MAY HAVE ONE OF FIFTY REMAINING 55 SUPER 88'S STILL IN
EXISTENCE.  I PLACED AN ADVERTISMENT ONLINE LAST MONTH, AND GOT MORE
HITS THAN MICROSOFT.  NEEDLESS TO SAY, I'M OVERWHELMED, AND I WOULD 
APPRECIATE ANY HELP THAT YOUR ORGANIZATION OR INDIVIDUAL MEMBERS MIGHT 
PROVIDE, OR BE INTERESTED IN.

THANKS,      STEVE
STEVE5X5@BLAST.NET

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 00:57:41 -0500
From: dgerow@student.stonehill.edu (Daniel R. Gerow)
Subject: Re: Web pages...

Hey all,

I figured I'd get my two cents in here....my page address is below:

http://www.stonehill.edu/~dgerow

Stuff all about my '69 442 and my other vehicles there.
Enjoy!

Dan

- --
Daniel R. Gerow
WSHL-FM 91.3
General Manager
Stonehill College Radio
- -----------------------
http://www.stonehill.edu
http://www.stonehill.edu/wshl
http://www2.stonehill.edu/~dgerow
- ---------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 01:09:18 EST
From: COUPE KING <COUPEKING@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Mexican chrome

Guy to reach is Mile Aldana in Calexico, CA.. Phone number is in the 760 area
code. Email him at: maldana@digitalwave.net

Did some nice work on some '67 CS pot metal and a very nice '68 442 rear
bumper for me. Good work. Good guy.

Peter 
CoupeKing@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 00:32:08 -0500
From: "Ulysses Melen" <Master-Stile@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Red fender wells

The question of the day is:

Can you re-dye the 71 Olds 442 W-30 red inner fender wells and have them
come out looking reasonably like the originals, or should I leave them
looking faded

- - Ulysses
- - Master-Stile@worldnet.att.net
- - 71 Cutlass S
- - 85 Indy Calais 500

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 01:24:50 EST
From: JCutlass <JCutlass@aol.com>
Subject: Re: She will not start! Arrghhh!

In a message dated 98-01-07 01:07:42 EST, you write:

> Drove to work and back last Tuesday, and got a full tank of gas on the way
>  back. I wanted to not drive her over my following five-day weekend, but 
> ended
>  up running a small errand on Friday, which was uneventful. Sunday (much
good
>  Foot-ball) was warm for a change, but very wet. Monday was no different. I
>  spent about an hour trying to start her, but just drained the battery, and
>  spent the rest of the day recharging it. 
>  
Maybe a bad tank of gas (water in fuel)? Might crank a little into a container
and see if you have a little water bubble in the bottom. Just guessing, but
I'd rule that out before tearing into her.
Tim in Oklahoma 68 Cutlass conv

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Jan 1998 21:47:22 -0800
From: mrada <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Panel controvery

Hi all,

I cleared this e-mail with Greg earlier today so that I can talk about
the panel controvery one last time.

What I want to first do is apologize to the list.  Second in speaking
with Steve Kenney yesterday, I realized that Steve's e-mail provider
doesn't deliver e-mails immediately like my server does.  So when I
thought Steve was responding to my personal e-mail to him, his e-mail
was in response to something I previous wrote globally to the list.  I
thought, based on the time stamps, that he was responding globally to
my e-mail I sent him when he really wasn't (20 minutes after I sent him
e-mail, I got an e-mail from him to the list).  So I guess maybe I
started this whole message to begin with.  It wasn't my intention to
start a roaring flame, however, I still feel that it had some merit to
discuss.

To sum up the results of my conversation with Steve, he agreed to put
some form of disclaimer in his web site and eventually his catalog.  At
least now other buyers can be more informed when buying.  Even though I
decided to drop the issue with Steve, I still think GM needs an earful
since they are getting a percentage of every panel made.  This I still
am pursuing.

Thanks to all,

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 19:27:48 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: yr id by t'lites

>=================
>That's a neat trick. I have noticed, however, that certain lenses that do not
>change every year will retain the year of the first year used.
>
>Also, I believe that the side marker lights were 1st required in '68, thus
>some
>from many years later even will say "68" on them- as in they comply with that
>rule...
>--
>Chris  B. Witt :=: wittchri@pilot.msu.edu :=: Location: Mecca [Lansing, MI]
>*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
>         >>> Please snip the excess lines from posts <<<

You're right that's why I said when I was a kid, they seemed to change the
tail-light styles every year (although not the marker lights).

That seems to be long gone, I have a '84 Riviera and I think the lenses in
the rear lights say '79 (the first year of that style).  About the only way
you can tell the difference for '79 to 85 is by the grille.  I actually
think they used similar grilles a couple of years but not
consecuitivly(sp).

Sorry about discussing B**cks although I think E-Body Toronodos are the same.


Lloyd Ferguson
ferguson@1stnetusa.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:33:01 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: HEI Conversion - Again/Still

>Well, The HEI distributor is in the car and I'm having problems. This
>is the first time I have changed a distributor let alone taking on my
>favorite nemesis: ELECTRICITY!!
>The HEI is a rebuilt GM specified for a 75 Olds. The cap rotor and
>coil are aftermarket replacements.
>After getting the #1 cylinder to TDC on compression stroke (actually
>the timing mark is about 8 deg. before TDC), I installed the dist.
>with the rotor on #1 terminal. When the gear engaged with the cam, the
>rotor also was a few deg. before #1 terminal.
>I found an ignition switched 12v source and connected the wire to the
>red wire where the coil plugs into the plastic connector on the HEI
>(also red). This corresponds to the "B" terminal in the ASCII sketch
>in the FAQ. After connecting them, I rechecked the voltage at the red
>terminal on the coil and it was still a strong 12 volts.
>PROBLEM: There is no spark at the plugs when I crank the engine. I
>know I missed something, but I dont know what.
>Question: The FAQ mentions that new kits don't include a ground strap
>and that a lot of people forget them. I did connect the black
>(ground ) wire from the coil to the coil body, under a mounting screw
>on the coil to dist. (per instructions with the coil). Is there some
>other ground strap that I need? Could this be my problem?
>
>While my wife was cranking the car, I tested for spark with a plug
>attached to the #1 wire; I saw and heard a spark from the vicinity of
>the distributor housing. Otherwise no juice at the plugs. I don't know
>where to go from here and need some help from anyone who has done
>this. When responding, please appreciate that I know next to nothing
>about electricity and need very simple how tos.
>Thanks in advance for any help you can give.
>
>Mick Gillespie
>69 Cutlass S convertible
>OCA# 29770
>mgillespie@sprynet.com
>http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

From memory, there should be a metal strap one end of which is one of the
terminals on the connector which comes up from the module and the other has
a hole in it which lines up with one of the mounting screws in the coil
(the same screw which has the ground wire under it.  This carries the
ground up from the base of the distributor to the secondary of the coil.
Without it you can't develop any spark because the secondary has one end
open.  Screwing the ground wire into the plastic cap just doesn't make it.
A check would be to see if you have as many pins on the underside of the
cap as there are wires going down to the base of the distributor (3 I
think).

When you get it working let me know how it runs, I have the same car and am
thinking about converting.


Lloyd Ferguson
Glendale, California
ferguson@1stnetusa.com

1969 Cutlass Convertible
1984 Buick Riviera

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Jan 1998 23:37:48 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: She will not start! Arrghhh!

>
>BTW There is a bimetallic-type coil spring and large pivoting block near the
>bottom of my driver's side exhaust manifold. What in the heck is that thing?
>
That's the heat riser.  It is supposed to divert the exhaust under the
carburator during warm-up to make the fuel burn easier.


Lloyd Ferguson
ferguson@1stnetusa.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 05:47:48 -0500 (EST)
From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Subject: Re: Engine Repair Software

>         Does anyone know if there is software available in which you can
> plug your laptop into the ECM/ALCL and get current readings (timing, fuel 
> adjustment, etc.) or change these settings to your own.

Diacom, like the dedicated scantools on the market, can only report sensor
readings and ECM outputs like M/C duty.  The only way to change
any of the timing settings would be to burn a custom PROM.

>      information.  It has an added advantage of being able to record these 
>      readings for a few seconds at a time when you hit the space bar.  This 
>      feature is extremely valuable for capturing intermittent problems - 

The standard Diacom package is capable of recording about 20 seconds worth
of data on a fuel injected car.  Carbureted models have slower ECM's, so
the data output rate is correspondingly lower.  I'd estimate that the
capture period is about 6 minutes for such models.  Diacom-Plus
offers some flexibility in setting the maximum number of frames to
capture.  The following is a rough idea of what Diacom looks like:

============================================================================
 VEHICLE TYPE: 1987 OLDSMOBILE           ENGINE TYPE: 5.0 Liter V8
 ECM MODE STATUS: NOT LINKED             ECM PROM ID: 1283
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Engine Speed................ 4300 RPM   4th Gear Switch.............   On
 Vehicle Speed...............   82 MPH   EGR Solenoid................  Off
 Coolant Temperature.........  214 F     Wide Open Throttle..........  Yes
 Throttle Sensor Voltage..... 3.84 VDC   Idle Load Compensator.......   On
 MAP / Vacuum Sensor Voltage. 0.68 VDC   Rear Vacuum Break...........  Off
 Baro Sensor Voltage......... 4.64 VDC   Air Divert Solenoid.........  Off
 Mixture Control Duty Cycle..   10 %     Air Switch Solenoid.........  Off
 Oxygen Sensor Voltage.......  889 mV    A/C Request.................   No
 Oxygen Sensor Transitions...   13 #     A/C Clutch..................   On
 Battery Voltage............. 14.0 VDC   Blended Enrichment..........  Off
 Closed Loop Status..........   On       ............................
 Fuel Mixture Status......... Rich       ............................
 Torque Converter Clutch.....  Off       ............................
 Park/Neutral Switch.........  Off       ............................
 3rd Gear Switch.............  Off       ............................
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Configure   Disk   Exit   Info   Link   Mode   Options   Print  Trbl_codes
Diagnostic data trace:      Relative time frame =+159
COMMAND=> USE  ARROW KEYS or SPACE BAR TO SELECT OPTION THEN PRESS "Enter"
============================================================================

Don't ask me why it's indicating closed loop at WOT or why the A/C clutch
is reported as on. <g>  BTW, these readings were taken with a 195F
thermostat and stock 2 core radiator.  With a 180F thermostat and 4 core
aluminum radiator, coolant temperature has never exceeded 190F.  
 
Kevin Wong       mailto:brougham@geocities.com       Toronto, Ontario, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 06:51:49 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: HEI Conversion - Again/Still

Lloyd, posts from this account will bounce since it's not the one you're 
subscribed under... forwarding.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: HEI Conversion - Again/Still

>Well, The HEI distributor is in the car and I'm having problems. This
>is the first time I have changed a distributor let alone taking on my
>favorite nemesis: ELECTRICITY!!
>The HEI is a rebuilt GM specified for a 75 Olds. The cap rotor and
>coil are aftermarket replacements.
>After getting the #1 cylinder to TDC on compression stroke (actually
>the timing mark is about 8 deg. before TDC), I installed the dist.
>with the rotor on #1 terminal. When the gear engaged with the cam, the
>rotor also was a few deg. before #1 terminal.
>I found an ignition switched 12v source and connected the wire to the
>red wire where the coil plugs into the plastic connector on the HEI
>(also red). This corresponds to the "B" terminal in the ASCII sketch
>in the FAQ. After connecting them, I rechecked the voltage at the red
>terminal on the coil and it was still a strong 12 volts.
>PROBLEM: There is no spark at the plugs when I crank the engine. I
>know I missed something, but I dont know what.
>Question: The FAQ mentions that new kits don't include a ground strap
>and that a lot of people forget them. I did connect the black
>(ground ) wire from the coil to the coil body, under a mounting screw
>on the coil to dist. (per instructions with the coil). Is there some
>other ground strap that I need? Could this be my problem?
>
>While my wife was cranking the car, I tested for spark with a plug
>attached to the #1 wire; I saw and heard a spark from the vicinity of
>the distributor housing. Otherwise no juice at the plugs. I don't know
>where to go from here and need some help from anyone who has done
>this. When responding, please appreciate that I know next to nothing
>about electricity and need very simple how tos.
>Thanks in advance for any help you can give.
>
>Mick Gillespie
>69 Cutlass S convertible
>OCA# 29770
>mgillespie@sprynet.com
>http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

>From memory, there should be a metal strap one end of which is one of the
terminals on the connector which comes up from the module and the other has
a hole in it which lines up with one of the mounting screws in the coil
(the same screw which has the ground wire under it.  This carries the
ground up from the base of the distributor to the secondary of the coil.
Without it you can't develop any spark because the secondary has one end
open.  Screwing the ground wire into the plastic cap just doesn't make it.
A check would be to see if you have as many pins on the underside of the
cap as there are wires going down to the base of the distributor (3 I
think).

When you get it working let me know how it runs, I have the same car and am
thinking about converting.


Lloyd Ferguson
Glendale, California
ferguson@1stnetusa.com

1969 Cutlass Convertible
1984 Buick Riviera

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 07:17:40 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 1931 Olds

Not a list member...

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Unknown@cc.recorder.ca
Subject: 1931 oldsmobile

I AM LOOKING FOR INF. ON A 1931 4 DOOR SADDEN FOR MY DAD HE AS A FRIENDS
CAR ALL THE PARTS ARE IN BOXS  HE NEEDS INF TO HELP REBULID IT BACK TO ITS
REG. STATE IF ANYONE KNOWS WERE HE CAN GET INF. IT WOULD BE OF MOST HELP   
    


                                           THANK YOU
                                              ROBIN BLAIR

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 07:18:42 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 1955 Super 88 Convert

Also not a list member, reply directly...

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	STEVE SENIOR <STEVE5X5@BLAST.NET>
Subject: 1995 OLDS SUPER 88 CONVERTIBLE

I BELIEVE THAT I MAY HAVE ONE OF FIFTY REMAINING 55 SUPER 88'S STILL IN
EXISTENCE.  I PLACED AN ADVERTISMENT ONLINE LAST MONTH, AND GOT MORE
HITS THAN MICROSOFT.  NEEDLESS TO SAY, I'M OVERWHELMED, AND I WOULD 
APPRECIATE ANY HELP THAT YOUR ORGANIZATION OR INDIVIDUAL MEMBERS MIGHT 
PROVIDE, OR BE INTERESTED IN.

THANKS,      STEVE
STEVE5X5@BLAST.NET

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 08:22:00 -0500
From: "Jacobs, Steven G." <steven_jacobs@merck.com>
Subject: Re: Info on Alero

Dave Wrote:
The new Oldsmobile Alero was rolled out at the Detroit International
Auto Show
today !!!    There should be a lot of press about it in the upcoming
days.

The car will be produced in Lansing, MI only !!!    I believe that full
production starts sometime in March.   The 1999 Pontiac Grand AM is
starting
production next week at the plants here in Lansing.

                                                       Dave Byers
                                                       Small Car Group -
David_Byers@Bigfoot.com


List,
I found some information on the WEB last night.  Also a "spy" picture.
The Alero will  be the sister to the Pontiac Grand AM .  The sharp
lines, 17 wheels, and rear end from the Alero Alpha have been changed.
:-(    It stated that the Alero would come out a couple of months before
the Grand AM.

Is there a WEB site for the Detroit Auto Show?  Can't wait to see the
roll out pictures.

Steve

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 08:59:52 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Panel controvery

mrada wrote:

>in speaking
> with Steve Kenney yesterday, I realized that Steve's e-mail provider
> doesn't deliver e-mails immediately
 (snipping and cutting throughout)

Sounds like Steve needs to investigate a different ISP if that is the
kind of (dis)service they are giving him.

>however, I still feel that it had some merit to discuss.

I would have to agree with this also.  If the best available is lousy
quality it still doesn't help the hobbyist or the retailer/wholesaler,
but causes bad feelings all around.  Besides, it isn't all that
difficult to make the correct panels assuming the manufacturer wants to.
Too many things in this world are manufacturered to incredibily small
tolerances for something to be that far off if checked for quality
control from time to time.
 
> ... I still think GM needs an earful since they are getting a >percentage of every panel made.  This I still am pursuing.

So, what can we do individually or as a group to help on this project? 
It would appear to me that everyone who will EVER need these parts have
a stake in this project.  I don't have a problem with the panels being
made in Tawain (sp?) as long as they are right.  Wonder what happened to
the original dies, etc?  Probably recycled into desks or chairs or
something by now.  I would more than agree that GM should have something
to say about the quality of this and like projects.   Of course GM could
take the attitude of give me the money (from the repo people) and don't
bother us (from the repo end users, us).  A lot of people are very brand
loyal for a long time. GM might have a bigger stake in this than they
think.......

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 08:53:09 -0800
From: evans1@serv01.net-link.net
Subject: Mime-Version: 1.0

subscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 09:03:38 +0000
From: tcjmiami@ix.netcom.com
Subject: Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible

Last night I got hit by a flying object on the freeway. I now need to 
replace the windshield and chrome across the top of my windshield on 
my 1970 Cutlass S convertible.

Can anyone sell me or tell me where to buy the chrome?

Thank you for your help
Tom Johnson
1970 Cutlass S Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 09:30:04 -0500
From: "M&D Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: engines

- -----Original Message-----
From: Samuel E. Johnson, Jr <cutlass403@ameritech.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wednesday, January 07, 1998 1:11 AM
Subject: Re: engines


>I have a 350 in my 71 cutlass. I would love to know how to get 397
horses out of
>a 350.
<snip>

Sam, This location gives you the info:
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/7111pp.html

It's probably cheaper to buy an already built 455 but I'm going this
route to keep my numbers matching 350 block.

Mick Gillespie
69 Cutlass S convertible
OCA# 29770
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 11:01:23 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: Info on Alero

On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Jacobs, Steven G. wrote:
> Is there a WEB site for the Detroit Auto Show?  Can't wait to see the
> roll out pictures.

Isn't there a live CNN special from the Detroit show either tonight or 
tomorrow night at 10PM Eastern?

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 09:18:06 -0000
From: "Lloyd W. Culp" <bculp@HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Re: Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible

Any junque yarde with a 1968-72 Chevelle, Tempest, Skylark, or Cutlass
convertible will have what you want in the way of stainless trim.  Many list
members will have some too.  I do, but shipping would probably cost more
than it is worth.

Bill Culp    bculp@HiWAAY.net
Decatur, Alabama
'62 Jetfire - '67 Toronado - '68 442 convertible



Last night I got hit by a flying object on the freeway. I now need to
replace the windshield and chrome across the top of my windshield on
my 1970 Cutlass S convertible.

Can anyone sell me or tell me where to buy the chrome?

Thank you for your help
Tom Johnson
1970 Cutlass S Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 07:31:49 -0800
From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Re: Windshield Chrome for 1970 Cutlass S Convertible

tcjmiami@ix.netcom.com wrote:

> Last night I got hit by a flying object on the freeway. 

Sorry to hear about that.

> Can anyone sell me or tell me where to buy the chrome?

Try Jim Chermack.  Jim can you respond to Tom please?





Chris Sparks

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 08 Jan 1998 00:28:26 +0900
From: James Zito <jimzito@uriel.net>
Subject: non olds diy repair help request

I'm sorry about bringing a non olds question to the list but
I really  need some help with a repair I doing on my 87 nissan pick up.
Don't flame me too badly since my other car is a '69 442 convertible.

I live in Korea and am freezing to death since my heater core sprung a
huge leak.

I can't get the old core out of the car.  I've tried to follow the
instruction in my haynes manual but the sucker won't budge.  I think
I've removed all the nuts and screws holding it in.  2 nuts on the
bottom and one screw on top.  The heater core housing will wiggle but
won't come out.
Right now I'm thinking about pulling the whole dash pad.
Any advice would be appreciated.

I need to get the truck fixed so that I can bring it back to the states
when I transfer back to the real world and start to do a full
restoration of the convertible.

Thanks,

Jim

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 10:38:00 -0500
From: "Jacobs, Steven G." <steven_jacobs@merck.com>
Subject: Re: Info on Alero

Not sure about the CNN special.  The Alero can be seen at
http://www.newscom and
http://carpoint.msn.com/AutoShow98/Article/Oldsmobile.  It's a big
change from the Alpha Alero.

 If you are a NASCAR fan, also check out the Chevy Intimidator concept
car at www.newscom.com.  Dale Earnhardt and The Tasmanian Devil helped
roll it out.
Steve
 ----------
From: Greg Beaulieu
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: Re: Info on Alero
Date: Wednesday, January 07, 1998 10:01AM

On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Jacobs, Steven G. wrote:
> Is there a WEB site for the Detroit Auto Show?  Can't wait to see the
> roll out pictures.

Isn't there a live CNN special from the Detroit show either tonight or
tomorrow night at 10PM Eastern?

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 10:48:22 -0500
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Side Marker Lites

At 11:32 PM 1/6/1998 -0500, you wrote:
>> Also, I believe that the side marker lights were 1st required in '68,
thus some
>
>Just thought I'd throw in here that, yes, indeed it was in '68 that the side
>markers were required, because if you even look at the '68 Ford Mustang,
it looks
>almost exactly the same as a '67 (the year my dad had, and he pointed this
fact out
>to me) except that it has the side marker lights.  I don't know of any
other way of
>telling those 2 cars apart.  So there you have it - that must be the year
if even
>Ford started the same year.  I'm trying to recall what the side of a '68
Charger
>looks like, but it's escaping my memory.

As I recall, two other safety features became required in 1968 as well, and
these could help you tell the two cars apart, but both require you to look
inside.

As I remember, 1968 was the first year that cars were required to have the
four-way hazard flashers.  That required the addition of that little
button/whatever that's been gracing steering columns ever since.  Also (but
I'm a little less sure of this) '68 was the first year that most cars had
the locking steering wheel that required that the ignition switch be moved
from the dashboard to the steering column.



*********************************************
Dan Gulino
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
*********************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 08:16:53 -0800
From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Re: Side Marker Lites

Daniel A. Gulino wrote:

> As I remember, 1968 was the first year that cars were required to have the
> four-way hazard flashers.  That required the addition of that little
> button/whatever that's been gracing steering columns ever since.  Also (but

Yup!

> I'm a little less sure of this) '68 was the first year that most cars had
> the locking steering wheel that required that the ignition switch be moved
> from the dashboard to the steering column.

Nope.  1969 was probably the first year for this.  My 68 has ignition on
dash.

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 98 11:23:26 -0500
From: "Padavano.Joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: Side Marker Lites

Dan Gulino wrote:

As I recall, two other safety features became required in 1968 as well...the 
four-way hazard flashers....Also (but I'm a little less sure of this) '68 
was the first year that most cars had the locking steering wheel that 
required that the ignition switch be moved from the dashboard to the 
steering column.
     
     Actually Dan, the locking steering column wasn't Federally mandated 
     until the 1969 model year.  Some of the Government requirements and 
     the model year they were required are listed below:
     
     Side marker lights                 1968
     Shoulder belts                     1968
     
     Locking steering column/shifter    1969
     Front seat head restraints         1969
     
     EGR                                1973
     5 mph front bumper                 1973
     
     5 mph rear bumper                  1974
     
     Catalytic converter                1975
     
     Center high-mounted stop light     Cars built after Jan 1, 1985
     
     Note that there will be exceptions to some of these requirements for 
     foreign-built and low volume cars.  In addition, I seem to recall that 
     there were certain cars which met the 1975 emissions requirements 
     without catcons, but I don't recall what they were at the moment.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 11:28:24 -0500
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Side Marker Lites

At 08:16 AM 1/7/1998 -0800, you wrote:
>> I'm a little less sure of this) '68 was the first year that most cars had
>> the locking steering wheel that required that the ignition switch be moved
>> from the dashboard to the steering column.
>
>Nope.  1969 was probably the first year for this.  My 68 has ignition on
>dash.
>
>Chris Sparks

Chris,

Maybe yours was built with parts left over from '67?  :)




Dan

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 07 Jan 1998 10:38:19 -0600
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: DeNovi's parts

yeah, too bad that he, too, is of the sort to hold parts hostage. His ad says
that if you won't pay the $100 ? he's asking, he'll scrap the parts to make
room.

HELLO! It's OK to sell them for 2c/# as scrap but not for 5c/# to Olds fans who
could use them?! Someone please explain this to me.

When I get out of the hobby, I'm having a "by the pound" sale. Anything too
crappy to buy at 5 cents a lb goes to the scrap yard AFTER the hobbyists pick
over the goodies.
- - --
Chris  B. Witt
- ----------
I hear you Chris! I think DeNovi's attitude "if I don't get $100 per they're
going to the junk man" is s***. He has no business being an OCA officer if that
is his attitude. His part business isn't a charity, but what a p****! His little
blurb, a couple of months back, about Hall's going out of business was about as
good. 

Good to see him stepping down. Time for maybe the candidate that was running
against him (or was that a recall attempt) last year? I'm off the soapbox for
now.
- -- 
David Brown              Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.1 at:
http://www.442.com      OR     http://www.en.com/users/thall
    http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/oldsfaq.htm

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/zip/oldsfaq4.zip

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 10:23:41 -0600
From: "Green, Andrew" <acg@datalogics.com>
Subject: Re: Rear Side Markers

>The limit to the usefulness of that year cast in 
>the taillights is that it refers to the "calender 
>year of production" (Jan.-Dec.), while the car is
>produced in a "model year" (Sept.-Aug.), so a '69 
>produced from September 1968 through December 1968 
>would wear a light with a 1968 casting (so might
>the cars produced in the first few months of 1969, 
>as the parts produced at the end of 1968 worked 
>their way through the supply inventory).

Um, really? My understanding was that the date will
indicate the _first_ year of production, but was not
updated at all unless the taillight (and thus the mold)
was redesigned. I knew of the taillight code thing as
a boy, and remember our late-production '69 Custom S
wagon carried '68 codes, since the taillights were not
changed for two years.

Since Cutlass taillights were not changed from 1981
until 1984 (when the chrome vertical split was removed),
maybe there's a 1983 owner who can take a look and see
what code is in his taillights?
- --
Andrew C. Green             (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.            email: acg@datalogics.com
101 N. Wacker, Ste. 1800    http://www.datalogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301     Fax: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:08:47 EST
From: Orangetrak <Orangetrak@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Info on Alero

   3.4 V6 or 2.4 TC, NO manual tranny for either motor, looks really good,
won't be cheap, nice wheels and tires. I just got back from the L.A. auto
show. No manual tranny now availible in ANY new Olds. How did we get to this
point???       Doug 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:36:32 -0500
From: "M&D Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: UNBOUNCE: HEI Conversion - Again/Still

- -----Original Message-----
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
To: Oldsmobile <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wednesday, January 07, 1998 5:53 AM
Subject: UNBOUNCE: HEI Conversion - Again/Still


Lloyd Ferguson wrote:
>From memory, there should be a metal strap one end of which is one of
the
>terminals on the connector which comes up from the module and the
other has
>a hole in it which lines up with one of the mounting screws in the
coil
>(the same screw which has the ground wire under it
<snip>

Thanks Lloyd, you were right about the ground strap. I had to go to
the Junqe yarde to get one. It's a discontinued part and the parts
stores don't have them either. Lots of fun in the rain. Ok, so i took
a complete cap because I was missing the dust cover. I also got the
conector plug too, (all for $5). Amazing, the dust cover has stamped
into it, where to make the connections. It's now back together exactly
like the one from the yard, but still no spark at the plugs.
Since I was cranking it over without the ground strap, and I did see a
spark from the vicinity of the distributor, is it possible that I blew
something? the HEI module maybe? grrrrr!!!

Mick Gillespie
69 Cutlass S convertible
OCA# 29770
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 13:57:08 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: '68 Safety Equipment

On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, Padavano.Joe wrote:
>      Actually Dan, the locking steering column wasn't Federally mandated 
>      until the 1969 model year.  Some of the Government requirements and 
>      the model year they were required are listed below:

Yep... the key is on the dash on my '68. I recall that '69 was the first 
year for the column lock. 

>      Shoulder belts                     1968

Did'ya know... that these belts actually were not required until Jan. 1, 
1968? My '68, being an early (Sept./67) production car, does not have 
shoulder belts.


Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 13:58:21 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: DeNovi's parts

On Wed, 7 Jan 1998, David Brown wrote:
> I hear you Chris! I think DeNovi's attitude "if I don't get $100 per they're
> going to the junk man" is s***. He has no business being an OCA officer if that
> is his attitude. His part business isn't a charity, but what a p****! His little
> blurb, a couple of months back, about Hall's going out of business was about as
> good. 

Hehehe... maybe I'll call him, offer him $50 including shipping for it... ;-)


Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 7 Jan 1998 12:50:49 EST
From: CRuper1 <CRuper1@aol.com>
Subject: Original Dies(was: Panel controvery)

In a message dated 98-01-07 09:00:58 EST, you write:

<<  
 > ... I still think GM needs an earful since they are getting a >percentage
of every panel made.  This I still am pursuing.
 
 So, what can we do individually or as a group to help on this project? 
 It would appear to me that everyone who will EVER need these parts have
 a stake in this project.  I don't have a problem with the panels being
 made in Tawain (sp?) as long as they are right.  Wonder what happened to
 the original dies, etc?  Probably recycled into desks or chairs or
 something by now.  I would more than agree that GM should have something
 to say about the quality of this and like projects.   Of course GM could
 take the attitude of give me the money (from the repo people) and don't
 bother us (from the repo end users, us).  A lot of people are very brand
 loyal for a long time. GM might have a bigger stake in this than they
 think....... >>

I was wondering this point myself (what happened to the original dies).  I've
had some thoughts on this, first, can anyone verify that the die used for
these on the car is the same basic area as what the replacements are supposed
to be?  What I'm thinking is that the original dies may not be used because
they are alot larger than most people would use/want (possibly covering up
into the rear pillar, etc.).
Next, at some point these dies wear out, and need to be replaced, or reworked.
When this is done, why wouldn't they be restored to original specs, rather
than incorrectly?  It would cost them more money (in design, and re-
programming fees, etc.) to NOT supply the original spec. design, unless my
first thoughts are true.

I'm interested to find out from some of you, where this panel goes to on the
original car, and where the replacements re supposed to cover.

My last thought is this.  There aren't alot of places that have the ability to
do this type of work (in fact the company I work for most likely supplies
tools, or machines to all of them, these would be some very large dies!).  It
would be interesting to find out where these ARE MADE, and what GM's response
to this whole deal is.

Chris Ruper

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End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1045
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