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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1387


oldsmobile-digest        Friday, July 24 1998        Volume 01 : Number 1387



Re: Type O 700R4?
Re: Type O 700R4?
Re: Ported vacuum to distributer? (mail #2)
Re: 69 brake drum color
Re: Looking for Qudrajet
RE: 69 442 Parts
Re: Rocket Talk
69 hood trim
Re: Rocket Talk
Re: Rocket Talk
Please Take Me Off The List
'58 Fiestas
700-R4
2004R/700R4 Torque
Re: Rocket Talk
67 Delta 88
4L80-E/4L60-E
Re: More Olds on TV...
Re: Soylent no Start is hotwiring to Solenoid Bad?
Pronouncing 4-4-2
FENDER CAP
Re: '68 Toro for parts
Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2
Posi Q
Re: 2004R/700R4 Torque
Re: Posi Q
Looking for a '70-'72 442 Convt.
test only do not read
Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2
more about vacuum
Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2
I Need Opinions
OOPS
Re: Posi Q
Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2
Re: Voltage vs Current
Re: What to do?
Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!
86 W30
Re: Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!
Re: 69 brake drum color
Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2
Re: media for paint stripping??
Store Closed
Re: Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!
RE: Bucket seats
Carter Carburator problem
RE: Transmissions
Re: Posi Q
Unsubscribe
RE: Voltage vs Current
Re: How much oil?
72 442 Convertible
Re: BOP 700-R4
Re: Still More Olds on TV/movies
Re: Ported vacuum to distributer?
Re: Transmissions
MY NEXT HOT ROD
Re: 69 442 Parts
Re: 69 brake drum color
RE: 69 brake drum color
(no subject)
70 color chart
RE: 70 color chart
[none]
head gasket help
Re: head gasket help
RE: head gasket help
Re: '68 Toro for parts

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 20:50:18 -0400
From: "Dave Cullen" <david.cullen@snet.net>
Subject: Re: Type O 700R4?

>Buddy says that he has seen an Olds 700R4 before out of another Delta 88
>and
>that they put them in GMC's too.

FWIW There was an add in  www.bargainnews.com last week for a 700R4 for sale
that had come from a 307 equipped Olds. This week there's 2 for sale, one
Ch*vy and one from an 87 Firechicken.

drc

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:00:48 EDT
From: <DYeager535@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Type O 700R4?

In a message dated 98-07-23 20:53:46 EDT, you write:

<< FWIW There was an add in  www.bargainnews.com last week for a 700R4 for
sale
 that had come from a 307 equipped Olds. This week there's 2 for sale, one
 Ch*vy and one from an 87 Firechicken. >>


Bet that 87 Firechicken's runnin a chev 305. Dorian

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:06:20 -0400
From: "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
Subject: Re: Ported vacuum to distributer? (mail #2)

> << There is also a thermal vacuum switch in line. >>
>
> there are three hoses hooked up to this line.  one is indeed manifold vacuum.
> one is ported vacuum.  the last one goes straight to the distributer.

	Yes.  Top port goes to ported carb connection.  Center port
	goes to distributor, and bottom port goes to manifold.

  someone
> told me how it works.  as i remember, the engine when cold gets manifold
> vacuum for the distributer.  this works in conjunction with the electric
> transmission downshift switch.  when you have the accelerator on the floor,
> the swith changes from manifold vacuum to ported vacuum.

	I assume you are talking about the TCS system of the
	early 70s.  The auto tranny has a pressure switch in it to
	allow vacuum to the advance canister when cold, only when
	the car	is in high (3rd) gear.  Once the engine warms up,
	vacuum is restored.


 now listen to this.......when the engine is
> idleing, the spark plug wires can keep up with engine speed and the spark
> doesn't need to be too far advanced.  as engine speed increases, the plug
> wires tend to slow down the signal.  now the timing is now as far advanced as
> it should be.

	Somewhat.  I think you are confusing then plug wires with 	the 
position
of the rotor to cap in relation to the point
	in the engine cycle.  As engine speed increases, at say, part
throttle, the vacuum can, and flyweights do
	their job by ADVANCING the spark.  Mechanical and vacuum
	advance is working here.  You want to get the spark to burn
	the fuel completely at the SAME TIME in the combustion
	chamber regardless of engine speed.  To do that, you have
	to "lead" the spark when the engine is running faster,
	similar to leading a duck during a hunting expedition.
	If he slows, you're lead does not have to be as much.
	You want the shot and duck to meet at the same place at
	the same time.  Same with the ignition of the fuel.
	Plug wires are just a means to get the spark from
	distributor to plugs.

> with manifold vacuum, the timing will be advanced at an idle, and when
> accelerating the timing will retard.  then when at a cruising speed the 
timing
> advances.  this final advance will not exceed the initial timing at idle.
> giving you about 8 degrees final timing compared to 28 with ported vacuum.

	Again true, somewhat.  As manifold vacuum varies, so could
	your canister advance.  But with the flyweights, if they
	aren't sticking, should advance the spark more anyway at
	higher speeds.  Remember, most GM vacuum cans run ABOUT
	16-18 max degrees of advance (point type).

	The cool thing about ported vacuum is it varies in relationship
	with the throttle position, because it's on the TOP side of
	the throttle plates.

More observations,
Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:18:19 -0400
From: "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
Subject: Re: 69 brake drum color

> I have a 69 442 with ssII and the drums are not painted that doesnt mean
> anything they could have been replaced however just because the manual says
> it doesnt make it so there was nothing set in stone

You are correct in the fact that WHO knows what went on the day YOUR car
was built.  If the drums were NOT painted, it was a simple matter of
them not following their own policy (assembly manual guidelines).  Like
that would be anything new.  However, unless there is documentation
otherwise, painting them with the mystery 384 code paint will yield a
"correct" finish.  I really don't think that you would lose points by
not painting them if you choose to go this route.  And I agree that it
was PROBABLY some sort of black if at all.  In my opinion anyway.  And
my opinion states, that when in doubt, read the directions.  In this
case, the assembly manual.  The assembly manual will ALWAYS be my
failsafe guide unless it is definitively proven otherwise.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:18:23 EDT
From: <HOFFAX181@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Looking for Qudrajet

i have a quadrajet  don't know if it's any good to you it's off of a 84 delta

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:23:16 -0400
From: urbanch <urbanch@magi.com>
Subject: RE: 69 442 Parts

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Wayne email me at urbanch@magi.com. I would like some information about this.

Chris Urban

- ----------
From: 	Wayne Schwartz
Sent: 	Thursday, July 23, 1998 12:02 PM
To: 	olds chat
Subject: 	69 442 Parts

I've finished my restoration and have the following spare parts for
sale:

- --nearly new mirror, LH door				$60
- --442 grills (bolt tabs need repair)		 	 90 pr
- --14" SSII trim rings, no dents				100 set of 5
- --door moldings						 15 ea
- --various hood & eyebrow moldings			ask
- --pr new after market rocker panels			 30
- --headers (Hooker I think) were on my 400ci		 70
Need headlight housings.  Will trade.




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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:27:11 -0400
From: "Gib Loudon" <cutlass@mill.tds.net>
Subject: Re: Rocket Talk

ATTENTION.....
Anyone who gets this message, A bunch of us List members are using Rocket
Talk, Charlies Chat room, right now.....it is 9:30 Michigan time.  Come on
and join us.  The URL is http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner/oldschat.htm .   Hope
to see you there.

Gib Loudon (a.k.a. "The Rocketman")
1969 Cutlass "S" Holiday Coupe
Check out Cutlass Net at:
http://apollo.kettering.edu/~loud5269
cutlass@mill.tds.net

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:40:07 -0400
From: Wayne Schwartz <wschwart@iaw.on.ca>
Subject: 69 hood trim

Glen: I'll be travelling for the next few days and won't be able to
inspect the parts you asked about till monday.  If I remember correctly,
all the die cast hood/fender trim I've collected had some pitting.  When
I restored my 442 I had the hood trim filled and rechromed...did a real
good job.  Wayne

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:39:21 EDT
From: <Cnvrt67@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Rocket Talk

would love to go but my stupid browser isnt jave inhansed or somethin.

Brent
1967 Cutlass Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:43:48 -0400
From: "Gib Loudon" <cutlass@mill.tds.net>
Subject: Re: Rocket Talk

Brent,
 What browser do you use?

Gib

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:48:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: mputz@interhop.net (Mike Putz)
Subject: Please Take Me Off The List

Going on vacation for awhile,

Please take me off the list.  Thanks

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:49:33 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: '58 Fiestas

Where's that '58 Fiesta guy at?  I have some more information for him...

Look closely at that picture that we've been discussing (the one that
shows the cowl vent grills).  On Ninety Eight/Super 88 models these
grills are chrome/stainless, on Dynamic 88 models they are painted body
color.  I looked at the '58s at Springfield last week and noticed this
difference.  Can you tell what they are in your photo?

Also, there was a '57 Fiesta on the Bulletin Board for sale, but I
didn't get the information - figured you were stuck on the '58s.

Hope this helps,

Paul
- --
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:51:12 -0400
From: Steve Ochs <Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com>
Subject: 700-R4

Message text written by Ben
> My suggestion
pay a hair more for a strong BOP 200 instead of the tratorous CH*VY
700R4. <

Just for information - the 700-R4 (and now the 4L60-E) is basically a
THM-350 with overdrive.  Yes, some of the components (pump, valve body) are
aluminum now, but many components are carryovers from the 350.

Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
Transmission Division (4T60/65-E & 4L60-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

'96 DCM Impala SS   '87 Olds Cutlass 442   '95 Grand Prix

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:57:32 -0400
From: Steve Ochs <Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com>
Subject: 2004R/700R4 Torque

Message text written by Chris
>One slight problem.  The torque rating of an early 70's 455 is like 510
ft./lbs. of torque >stock<, even the two barrels......  I<

The only solid, bulletproof solution is the THM-400, which was the original
tranny.  The 4L80-E is the overdrive replacement (using many carryover
components) but is expensive because you need a controller for it (it is
electronic shift.)  A 4L80-E wiht controller is around $1800-2600 I
believe.

Yes a 200-4R can be built to withstand 450 lb/ft of torque, but if it is in
a heavy vehicle - it won't take much abuse.  The Grand National is a
lighter vehicle.  It really is a combination of torque and gross vehicle
weight that affect the capacity of the transmission

Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
Transmission Division (4T60/65-E & 4L60-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

'96 DCM Impala SS   '87 Olds Cutlass 442   '95 Grand Prix

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:54:53 EDT
From: <Cnvrt67@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Rocket Talk

i use the aol browser. some time soon i plan on getting another one.

Brent
1967 Cutlass Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:06:26 -0500
From: "Ryan Hehn" <ryanh@mb.sympatico.ca>
Subject: 67 Delta 88

Hello all,

My brother recently acquired a 67 Delta 88 4-dr sedan.  Overall condition
very good - the body is straight, no rust, good interior.

It has the 425 hi-compression engine, which is unfortunately seized.

If one were to rebuild this engine to run on today's gasoline, what would
have to be done?  I understand it originally required the old no. 1 gas.

Ryan Hehn

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 22:17:27 -0400
From: Steve Ochs <Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com>
Subject: 4L80-E/4L60-E

Message text written by Joe Padavano
>Whoa!  Now that _is_ interesting.  From my understanding, the 4L60-E is
basically the computer controlled 700R4, right? <<

Yes, the 4L60-E is just an electronic version of the 700-R4 (4L60) with
some other updates such as a better pump, etc.


>> Better yet, does the 4L80-E also have the replaceable bellhousing? <<

No, I believe the 4L80-E is still an integral bellhousing.

>> What other bellhousings are available for RWD applications?  <<

The 4L60-E has Chevy, BOP and they also ship to Holden (Australia)

I believe the 4L80-E uses Chevy mainly but since it is sold to other
customers, it might have another bolt pattern available.

The 4L40-E, 5L40-E, and 3L40-E have replaceable bellhousings, but are
mainly European applications.
Side Note: BMW purchase many of the transmission for their newer models
from Powertrain.  These trannys are made in Strasburg, France

>>Does the 3800 V6 still use the BOP bolt pattern (as used in the
F-bodies)?  Actually, in the post-1995 world, are there _any_ GM motors
that still use the BOP bolt pattern?<<

Yes, the 3800 is still a non-chevy boltpattern, although I am not positive
if it is the old BOP pattern, or if it is a modified FWD pattern.

An interesting website for GM engines and trannies is www.gmpowertrain.com
It has the spec sheets for all current models.

Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
Transmission Division (4T60/65-E & 4L60-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

'96 DCM Impala SS   '87 Olds Cutlass 442   '95 Grand Prix

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 22:39:14 -0400
From: "Dave Cullen" <david.cullen@snet.net>
Subject: Re: More Olds on TV...

Subject: More Olds on TV...


Caught part of a re-run of the campy series "The A-Team" from the 80's. The
bad guys were driving my car!!! An 84 or 85 Delta-88, dark grey just like
mine. Bad news is the good guys shot it full of bullet holes, then it went
over a very conveniently placed ramp and crunched on it's roof :(

Always hated that show any way...

drc

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:55:16 -0500
From: bloom@mail.gorilla.net
Subject: Re: Soylent no Start is hotwiring to Solenoid Bad?

I am thinking that Karl is missing calling to be a writer. Also, Karl is
correct: Almighty Joe P. is excellent source for what I don't know about
Olds cars.

At 09:31 PM 7/21/98 EDT, you wrote:

>
>Home again, home again, jigetty jig.
>
>Get to work.
>Yellow wire OK (I think).
>Purple one (got solid 12v earlier) is suspect.
>Pull male connectors from connector housing.
>Insert male connectors into female housing.
>((Ooooooh! I feel giddy....))
>Idiot lights, No start.
>Karl get out electrical stuffs.
>Cut purple wire before female connector.
>Crimp on a female coupling that fits male one.
>Tries to start, shorting somewhere.
>Waiting for car to cool so I can examine connections to starter.
>BTW, Karl Thanks the Almighty Joe Padavano for M/C information!
>
>Thanks in advance.
>KA
>&SOM
>
Fred K. (bloom@gorilla.net)
Tulsa,OK. area
'67 442
'67 Cutlass
		44   44  44   44  222222
		44   44  44   44   2  2
		4444444  4444444   2  2
		     44       44   2  2
		     44       44  222222
	

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 22:07:27 -0500
From: senator@itis.com (Robert F. Newbegin Jr.)
Subject: Pronouncing 4-4-2

Ok, I'll admit it, my knowledge of muscle cars isn't that great, but how do
you pronounce 4-4-2?  I've always heard Four Forty Two, so that's all I
know.

Please help, it was just last year that I converted from Buick to Olds.

Bob
'78 CS  (was '78 Regal until last August  :¬)   )

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:22:10 EDT
From: <R442@aol.com>
Subject: FENDER CAP

I am looking for a drivers side front fender cap for my 1966 442 .

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:25:03 EDT
From: <TORO1968@aol.com>
Subject: Re: '68 Toro for parts

I need several parts, bumpers, emblems, body panels, interior parts, and
more!!  Please notify me of what parts you will sell and how much you want for
them.

Jordan Panich
TORO1968@aol.com

1968 Toronado
1978 Toronado
1978 Toronado
1998 88 LS

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 20:26:32 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2

At 10:07 PM 7/23/98 -0500, you wrote:
>Ok, I'll admit it, my knowledge of muscle cars isn't that great, but how do
>you pronounce 4-4-2?

four four two

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:52:47 EDT
From: <Cnvrt67@aol.com>
Subject: Posi Q

So let me get this straight. I have a 67 cutlass convertible. Now, a 65 or 66
posi will also bolt up to my car? Is this correct? Asking because i know of a
65 posi out of a 442 for sale. The guy wants $350 for it, it has 3:42 gears in
it. is this a good price??? Thanks

Brent
1967 Cutlass Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:56:41 EDT
From: <CRuper1@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 2004R/700R4 Torque

In a message dated 98-07-23 21:59:22 EDT, you write:

<<
 Message text written by Chris
 >One slight problem.  The torque rating of an early 70's 455 is like 510
 ft./lbs. of torque >stock<, even the two barrels......  I<

 The only solid, bulletproof solution is the THM-400, which was the original
 tranny.  The 4L80-E is the overdrive replacement (using many carryover
 components) but is expensive because you need a controller for it (it is
 electronic shift.)  A 4L80-E wiht controller is around $1800-2600 I
 believe.

  >>

So you are saying that this tranny would be a good replacement when thinking
of using an overdrive trans and want the same strength as a TH-400?  I take it
you can build these trannys up good, and they will withstand the same power
inputs (or are there some limiting internals that are put in, that the TH-400
doesn't have)?  Really, with the cost of building an overdrive trans (that
may, or may not be buttetproof behind your monster Olds engine...), or the
option of a standard TH-400 (built, of course) and using an overdrive unit...
this may be a good choice, just a high dollar item....  Bulletproof has it's
prices....  And the cost of a >second<  "built" overdrive tranny would cover
your cost for the trans and shift module.

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 00:01:31 EDT
From: <DEOVIVERE@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Posi Q

In a message dated 98-07-23 23:54:56 EDT, you write:

<< So let me get this straight. I have a 67 cutlass convertible. Now, a 65 or
66
 posi will also bolt up to my car? Is this correct? Asking because i know of a
 65 posi out of a 442 for sale. The guy wants $350 for it, it has 3:42 gears
in
 it. is this a good price??? Thanks

 Brent
 1967 Cutlass Convertible >>


Brent -

I've got a 65 Cutlass and a posi rear is on my list of items to get.  If you
don't want that rear end, let me know, I'm definitely in the market for one.
Where is it?

Tom SImmons

65 Cutlass
70 SX W-32

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 00:03:12 -0400
From: Kevin Hoopingarner <khooping@bright.net>
Subject: Looking for a '70-'72 442 Convt.

All,

My father is looking for a '70 - '72 442 Convt.  OAI a must.  He is
looking for a  nice driver somewhere in the midwest but will travel if
needed.   Please email privately if you have or know of any cars.
Serious buyer.

Best Regards,

Kevin Hoopingarner
'70 Olds 442 W-30
Findlay OH.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 00:19:35 EDT
From: <AGUY4RUMLI@aol.com>
Subject: test only do not read

:)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 00:22:50 -0000
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2

<how do you pronounce 4-4-2?>

four...four...two


Randy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 00:51:23 EDT
From: <JuGgaLo893@aol.com>
Subject: more about vacuum

ok today i checked to see if the engine is mechanically sound and if timing is
correct and all that.ok now i've narrowed it down to either the intake or the
carb. now i've heard rumors about the intakes on olds 350 cracking and leaking
i'm not sure as to how true butthis is what i've heard .  ok now this is the
part that really worries me i have enough money right now to get either an
intake or a carb (not both) so i want to be very sure about the problem.
i feel bad about not figuring out the problem i am just completing two years
of tech school for auto mech. and i'm stumpped. i geuss i'm just worried about
my baby    it's a 76 olds cutlass supreme by the way.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:50:49 -0700
From: babyboo@pacbell.net
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2

Its simple..FOUR FOUR TWO

Robert F. Newbegin Jr. wrote:

> Ok, I'll admit it, my knowledge of muscle cars isn't that great, but how do
> you pronounce 4-4-2?  I've always heard Four Forty Two, so that's all I
> know.
>
> Please help, it was just last year that I converted from Buick to Olds.
>
> Bob
> '78 CS  (was '78 Regal until last August  :¬)   )

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 22:02:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: John M <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: I Need Opinions

Hi all,
      I need opinions from you all.On my site I've posted a link to a
picture of an '86 (I think),with a W-30 hood.Thinking about one of
these maybe for my car or frogs442's car.Can ya'll check it out and
give me some input?
    http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/GW30.html

            Thanks,John




==
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
1985 Cutlass-----T-Tops--307 H.O./3.73 http://www.442.com/mcjunkin.html
1984 Cutlass-Moonroof-307 http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/PatsCar.html
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be 403!
 mailto:super442@yahoo.com


_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 21:58:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: John M <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: OOPS

sorry,make that :
        http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/GW30
     John




==
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
1985 Cutlass-----T-Tops--307 H.O./3.73 http://www.442.com/mcjunkin.html
1984 Cutlass-Moonroof-307 http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/PatsCar.html
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be 403!
 mailto:super442@yahoo.com


_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 01:02:09 EDT
From: <Cnvrt67@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Posi Q

waiting for the guy to reply about his where abouts

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 01:25:05 -0400
From: "Peter Berusch" <pber710840@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2

I have also heard it called "double four and the duece."
- -----Original Message-----
From: babyboo@pacbell.net <babyboo@pacbell.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Friday, July 24, 1998 12:54 AM
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2


Its simple..FOUR FOUR TWO

Robert F. Newbegin Jr. wrote:

> Ok, I'll admit it, my knowledge of muscle cars isn't that great, but how
do
> you pronounce 4-4-2?  I've always heard Four Forty Two, so that's all I
> know.
>
> Please help, it was just last year that I converted from Buick to Olds.
>
> Bob
> '78 CS  (was '78 Regal until last August  :¬)   )

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:23:43 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: Voltage vs Current

I always thought of it in water pressure terms.  Voltage is the pressure of the
water.  Current is the amount of water flow (gallons per hour, etc.).  It's 
easy
to see from that mental picture how more voltage (pressure) will cause more
current (flow) through a given resistance (size of the opening or hose letting
out the water).  That's why voltage by itself is harmless (it only has 
POTENTIAL
to create a current), it's the amps that kill ya (water under a lot of pressure
is harmless, it just sits there, untill there's a leak).

You can extend this train of thought too.  A resistor would be a pinch in the
hose.  A capacitor would be a wide spot.  A diode is a check valve, etc. . .

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

Oldsmagnet wrote:

> > Huh!  I thought voltage carried current?!
>
> OK, how about this way.  Voltage is the ~supplier~ of electricity.  Current 
is
> the ~motion~ of electricity.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 23:30:51 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: What to do?

I think I may be familiar with that particular H/O, somebody mentioned finding
it to me before.  If it's the same one, it was a theft recovery that was sent 
to
the junkyard, where a kind-hearted olds-fan rescued it and is now selling it
rather than fixing it up himself.

I'd double and triple check on the title and VIN number with the police.  If it
turns out okay, sell the Delta, buy the H/O, and use the balance to get a new
steering column and fix up the H/O.  I can't bear to see you part out the H/O!
But if you do, I'd buy the carcass if within a days drive of me.

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 02:04:45 -0600
From: Oldsmagnet <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!

I think we had a new record tonight. Went for about 7.5 hours.  Not bad at all.
Logged in 24 users in all, or 28 if you count spouses and multiple 
personalities
;)

Thanks all that took part.  We'll shoot for next Thursday again...
Happy Rocketting from [Oldsmagnet] [BTUR4D] [ROCKIT1] and [TEZROFF]

- --
Oldsmagnet - Charley Buehner @ Sidney Montana |\      |-------|
mailto:buehner@lyrea.com To mail direct to me |/\|=|  |   |   |
http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner See my homepage |\ |=|  |   |   |
   \ | / =========================== \ | /    |<||=|  |   |   |
    \|/  List Removal and Guidelines  \|/     |/ |=|  |  / \  |
     V   ===========================   V      |\/|=|  | / | \ |
  http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner/listfaq.htm   |/      |___|___|

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 02:20:34 -0600
From: Oldsmagnet <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: 86 W30

Looks way cool.  The hood lines are a bit off, though.  Wonder if the scoops
would be better if narrow, and within the hood's lines...  (you can see at the
front where the scoop ends, the line sticking out from inside the scoop.)

I've been wanting to see one of those on a Gbody for years, though.  I'd always
wanted to make one, somehow...

http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/GW30

Oldsmagnet - Charley Buehner @ Sidney Montana |\      |-------|
mailto:buehner@lyrea.com To mail direct to me |/\|=|  |   |   |
http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner See my homepage |\ |=|  |   |   |
   \ | / =========================== \ | /    |<||=|  |   |   |
    \|/  List Removal and Guidelines  \|/     |/ |=|  |  / \  |
     V   ===========================   V      |\/|=|  | / | \ |
  http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner/listfaq.htm   |/      |___|___|

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 04:25:19 -0400
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!

Oldsmagnet wrote:
>
> I think we had a new record tonight. Went for about 7.5 hours.  Not bad at
all. > Logged in 24 users in all, or 28 if you count spouses and multiple
personalities > ;)

If I can figure out how to make my Netscape software get me there, I
might try it next week.  Tried once before and got a message something
about not being "something enhanced".  When I figure out what that means
I will try again.  Until then I guess I will have to talk to myself via
the schzoid personalities currently available locally.  Sure wish I
would quit answering myself though.  That part is starting to worry me.
:)

Later fellow Oldsmonuts.....

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 04:29:03 EDT
From: <CCRR12@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 69 brake drum color

In a message dated 98-07-23 20:50:27 EDT, you write:

<<  have a 69 442 with ssII and the drums are not painted that doesnt mean

Kerry Kroger wrote:

anything they could have been replaced however just because the manual says
 it doesnt make it so there was nothing set in stone
 the drums were plain when they left the factory that made them then they
 were assembled with a subassembly and installed on the car
 that means they were probably painted with that assembly such as the spindel
 assy or the axle assy that means they were probably semigloss black if
 painted at all I doubt that they were painted as a seperate part backing
 plates were semigloss black but spindels were plain control arms were
 semigloss but the shafts were plain rotors were always plain  bottom line I
 dont know I wasnt there but the evidence points me toward the semigloss
 black coloring any takers? >>


Kerry,

Man, you are a bundle of information for sure. Don't get frustrated with the
opinions you may receive from this list.  Good arguments and debate are a
vital part of learning, by creating brain activity that was otherwise
stagnant. The best opinions are based on experience, of which we have all had
different ones, and some remember  those, not so clearly. The opinions
developed on the basis of heresay, we all must weigh accordingly. So if you
been there and done that. Tell us your opinion.

As Will Rogers said: " Everybody is ignorant, just on different subjects"

Just one thing Kerry. Take a breath every once in a while. You talk too fast
for some us. You know , use a period.............

Thanks,

Randy in Okla
57 88 J2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 04:40:36 EDT
From: <CCRR12@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Pronouncing 4-4-2

Bob,

Pronunciation could depend on the dialect from your part of the country, so
there could be several correct ways of saying  '442'.

Such as in our neck of the woods, on some sides of the tracks, some might call
your Buick a ' Deuce & a Quotah' instead of a two-twenty- five (as in Electra
225).

Did you know that Olds' pronunciation of  'Holiday Coupe' during the 59's was
quite different from that they used in the 60's. Anyone think they know?

Randy in Okla
57 88 J2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 04:50:07 EDT
From: <CCRR12@aol.com>
Subject: Re: media for paint stripping??

Aluminum Oxide pellets should be your best choice

Cost less, faster, and leaves a protective residue on the metal so that you
don't have to prime immediately. All it will require is some light sanding
before painting.

E-mail me for more details on how I did my frame up using this method.

Randy in Oka
57 88 J2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 06:01:18 -0400
From: Jim & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Store Closed

Hey All

        Had fun last night at RocketTalk. Hope to see you all again when I
get back. I have to close C&M until the 1st of August (a week from Sat.).
Business trip. Happy Oldsmobiling!

Jim Chermack
C&M Classic Parts
Virginia Beach, VA

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 05:26:36 -0000
From: "Lloyd W. Culp" <bculp@HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Re: Holy RocketTalk, Oldsman!

Don,

Which worries you the most; the fact that you get answers or the crazy
answers that you get?

Bill Culp    bculp@HiWAAY.net
Decatur, Alabama
'62 Jetfire - '67 Toronado - '68 442 convertible

P.S.  I'll have to try the talk also as soon as I get the time.



<snip>
 Until then I guess I will have to talk to myself via
>the schzoid personalities currently available locally.  Sure wish I
>would quit answering myself though.  That part is starting to worry me.
>:)
>
>Later fellow Oldsmonuts.....
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:05:12 -0500
From: "Johnson, Sam" <SAJOHNSON@usds.com>
Subject: RE: Bucket seats

A friend of mine from Chicago had an 88 like that too.  I think it was a
made in 1978
======================
Sam E. Johnson, JR.
>  <mailto:Cutlass403@ameritech.net> Cutlass403@ameritech.net
>1971 Cutlass S 455
>Westside! Chitown IL
11 Wins 7 Losses
======================


	-----Original Message-----
	From:	Peter Berusch [SMTP:pber710840@email.msn.com]
	Sent:	Thursday, July 23, 1998 6:48 PM
	To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
	Subject:	Re: Bucket seats

	I have a Delta 88 with bucket seats, center console dual exhaust.
The car
	is factory stock and original.  So, indeed, Oldsmobile made such a
car.
	Peter.

	

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:16:51 -0500
From: "Brett Wilson" <bwilson@dmotorworks.com>
Subject: Carter Carburator problem

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BDB6D3.0788C340
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

   =20
    I have a Carter carburetor (650) and the other day I decided to =
rebuild it.
All went well except that my carburetor bogs down on idle.  right now it =
dies on idle.  at WOT it is awesome but at low rpm's with little gas =
pedal it dies and acts like it is running out of gas.
I set the floats "up" position to 5/16 and down position to 15/16 like =
the instructions said.=20

=B7 what could be the cause of this problem?

any help is well appreciated.

Brett Wilson
67 Cutlass Convertible



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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
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<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<FONT size=3D3> I =
have a Carter=20
carburetor (650) and the other day I decided to rebuild =
it.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>All went well except =
that my=20
carburetor bogs down on idle.&nbsp; right now it dies on idle.&nbsp; at =
WOT it=20
is awesome but at low rpm's with little gas pedal it dies and acts like =
it is=20
running out of gas.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>I set the floats =
&quot;up&quot;=20
position to 5/16 and down position to 15/16 like the instructions=20
said.&nbsp;</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&middot; what could be the cause of this problem?</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>any help is well appreciated.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Brett Wilson</DIV>
<DIV>67 Cutlass Convertible</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_00B9_01BDB6D3.0788C340--

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:19:55 -0500
From: Thomas Martin <Thomas_Martin@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE: Transmissions

Some neat characteristic of a Turbo engine.  When you upshift under
boost, and say are making 400 hp at 5000 rpm, and making 15 psi boost,
then upshift, you FORCE the rpm lower, when this happens your turbo is
still spinning to make boost at 5000 rpm, and the rpm just dropped to
say 3800 rpm, but your lead foot is still on the loud pedal, you are now
in an overboost condition momentarily.  Yes, the wastegate will
compensate, but it does not anticipate it, and is slow compared to what
is now going on (yes, pinging here can destroy a set of forged pistons
in milliseconds!).  This makes a TREMENDOS amount of torque at shift.  I
have a 301 Turbo V8.  And at 90 mph when I shift INTO 3rd, I can lay a
hard scratch, I have a THM350 (not C) and 3.08 gears, pushing around
4030 lbs, even before I installed the shift kit she shifted hard in all
gears.  1st to 2nd was nearly all the time if any boost at all was
present.  If I powerbraked it, when I hit positive pressure in the
intake, there was nothing I could do on the brakes to keep the car from
moving.  But at "normal" driving she was as tame as a 301 4bbl.  Mash
it, and hang the heck on!  (She ran a best of 14.21 @ 97.3, at 7 psi
boost, which is lower than stock, stock was 10 psi.  No ECM control.
And the 60 foot time was approx. 2-2.5 sec.  (not recorded)  She was
slow off the line, but midrange is incredible, every bit as strong as my
455 I installed later, even with a mild cam.  The 455 was just better
all around.

As for how much torque the GN makes at 1500 without the turbo, probably
200 lbs ft.  Remember, turbos are cammed VERY mild, a race cam is like
200/200 degrees at .050.  A street cam would be more like 185/190 @
.050.  And they can make 300+ hp on .400 lift too.  So cyl pressure is
high at low rpm even without a turbo.  The Turbo makes up for it at
higher rpm.

No you cannot compare a 455 to a 231 Turbo, except maybe at the end of a
1/4 mi.  They are very different engines.  The WOT shifts are probably
much harder with the Turbo motor.

I would not hesitate a built THM 200 4R in a 455 car, as long as a
competent shop built it.  And they knew exactly what it was going into.
But the THM400 is still the trans of choice for the really fast GN guys.
 Ask them, they run in deep in the 8's!

http://ni.umd.edu/gnttype/www/readers_times.html
Also visit http://ni.umd.edu/gnttype/www/transpage.html

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac


>A 455 at 1500 RPM probably puts out twice as much torque as the GN does at
the same RPM, without
>the turbo going....you can kind of control the power output of the engine by
>keeping out of the turbo on the street, no?   Dorian

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 08:40:38 EDT
From: <R4C442@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Posi Q

Hey Brent!
        I am not an expert on rear-ends (unless you count the physiological
types) but I don't think that one will fit your car. Something to do with the
number of splines. I, on the other hand would be interested if you're not.

                                                                Ron Forsee
                                                                65 442-Meister

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 08:39:02 -0400
From: "Joanne Beausoleil" <jbeausol@ftp.com>
Subject: Unsubscribe

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:56:03 -0500
From: Lance Kistner <lkistner@insul-8.com>
Subject: RE: Voltage vs Current

Well put.  That is exactly how I understand the analogy.

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Tom Lentz [SMTP:tlentz@ior.com]
Sent:	Friday, July 24, 1998 1:24 AM
To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:	Re: Voltage vs Current

I always thought of it in water pressure terms.  Voltage is the pressure of the
water.  Current is the amount of water flow (gallons per hour, etc.).  It's 
easy
to see from that mental picture how more voltage (pressure) will cause more
current (flow) through a given resistance (size of the opening or hose letting
out the water).  That's why voltage by itself is harmless (it only has 
POTENTIAL
to create a current), it's the amps that kill ya (water under a lot of pressure
is harmless, it just sits there, untill there's a leak).

You can extend this train of thought too.  A resistor would be a pinch in the
hose.  A capacitor would be a wide spot.  A diode is a check valve, etc. . .

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

Oldsmagnet wrote:

> > Huh!  I thought voltage carried current?!
>
> OK, how about this way.  Voltage is the ~supplier~ of electricity.  Current 
is
> the ~motion~ of electricity.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 09:06:03 EDT
From: <JonKrisInc@aol.com>
Subject: Re: How much oil?

In a message dated 98-07-23 20:25:28 EDT, you write:

<< How much oil should a 62 F-85 hold? The dipstick says 4 qts but it may not
 > be the correct dipstick.  >>
 Did you count one quart for the oil filter?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 09:12:48 -0400
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: 72 442 Convertible

A while ago i mentioned a car forsale and asked if anyone was interested
I had a few reponses, and felt its best to send the guys name and number
over the whole list so as to not miss anyone.

The car was a 72 442 convertible
$2500 Canadian
About $1750 US

I don't know the car nor the owner, so I can't help much
But Please mention my name if you call for the car

His name is Tom
His Number is  1-519-522-1146

Robert Schinkel
docbob@caninet.com
Niagara Falls, Canada
905-357-4454
1970 442 Convertible  (PARTING OUT)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 10:05:13 -0400
From: Dan Boone <boone.dan@acd.net>
Subject: Re: BOP 700-R4

Actually there are a few composite case 700's out there, I have seen them. I
worked in engineering in lansing for 15 years. These cases are very limited
and expensive but can be found. It has been rumored that some one is going to
start producing a BOC case for the 700. The advantages are not worth the cost,
build a 200 that is capable of living in your application.

Steve Ochs wrote:

> Message text written by Clayton
> >Actually the '84 Olds Delta 88 I'll be towing home soon has a BOP pattern
> 700R4 in it.  No adapter needed here... currently attached to the original
> OLDSMOBILE 307!<
>
> Actually - there never was a BOP 700-R4 (there is a BOP 4L60-E due to
> replaceable bellhousing - started in 1995).  You have a BOP 200-4R which
> was commmon with the 307 in mid-80s Olds's
>
> Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
> Transmission Division (4T60/65-E & 4L60-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
> The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
> statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division
>
> '96 DCM Impala SS   '87 Olds Cutlass 442  '95 Grand Prix

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:01:17 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Still More Olds on TV/movies

> Well, coincidentally, I found out today that the '67 GTO
> from Seinfeld (driven by Costanza, the "videotape bootlegger"
> bad boy) belongs to an assistant at my real estate office.

BTW, I've seen some more promos for "That '70's Show" on the
Fox network which starts 8/23/1998 (I think), and the car in
question looks to be a '68 or '69 Vista Cruiser. What I can
see for sure, anyway, is that it's a wagon, looks to be a
Cutlass-derived one (unless they all were back then anyway),
and has fake woodgrain along the lower body.

This show looks promising.  :-)

- -- Andy

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 10:02:20 EDT
From: <Knightvd@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Ported vacuum to distributer?

In a message dated 98-07-22 23:46:00 EDT, you write:

<< One hose from the distributor can, one from the carb port, and
 another to the intake manifold.  The engine is idling on a 100 degree +
 day, with static timing at 8 degrees BTDC.  Engine starts getting hot.
 Distributor vacuum which is NORMALLY ported through the switch to the
 carb when it's cooler, now switches to the manifold port.  The
 distributor now runs on manifold vacuum.  Idle speed increases slightly,
 coolant flow increases due to the water pump speed up, and the engine
 now should drop in temperature.  When it's cooled off to "reset" the
 thermo-vacuum switch, the distributor vacuum switches back to the carb
 port.  The cooling in effect came from the advancing of the distributor
 at idle.  Bottom line was idle speed increased and water flow increased,
 which did the cooling. >>

This clears things up a bit.  I think that the TVS on both the engines I had
seen had been bypassed directly to manifold vacuum.  I have an old switch,
I'll try hooking it up again.

Thanks!

Vince Knight
71 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 09:12:32 -0500
From: Chad Schwartz <ChadS@pcsco.com>
Subject: Re: Transmissions

>Chad, you are also running Turbo. If you don't get on the throttle heavy,
you
>don't have a whole lot of power going through the trans. A 455 at 1500 RPM
>probably puts out twice as much torque as the GN does at the same RPM,
without
>the turbo going....you can kind of control the power output of the engine
by
>keeping out of the turbo on the street, no?   Dorian

You have a pretty good point.  I couldn't tell you if having a V8 vs. V6
Turbo (no boost) at the same throttle position would make that much of a
difference in how hard the shift are.  I personally doubt it because the
more the dent cable is pulled the more pressure is created in the
transmission.  When I was breaking in my new engine I had the wastegate set
wide open so I wouldn't create any boost.  The shifts still increased in
firmness the more throttle I gave it.   The same as under boost.  I can
adjust the dent cable tighter and it will increase the shift firmness at
light throttle and full throttle also.  If I adjust the dent cable all the
way tight it will chirp the tires in every gear change at light throttle (no
boost) including going into 4th.  When I had the stock transmission in it it
would shift like a caddy driving around and when I gave it part throttle
with no boost it would chirp the tires.  Anyone using a built 200R4 behind a
V8 that could help us out here?

I can control the power by keeping out of the turbo or adjusting the waste
gate and fuel pressures on the street.  That's one advantage of being able
to drive a 10 sec GN on the street and be perfectly streetable with good gas
milage.  It's just a fuel injected 8:1 compression 3.8 V6 without the boost
and other goodies kicking in.

Chad Schwartz
chads@pcsco.com
mIRC: ROCKN6
Denison, IA
'87 GN  T-Tops (TE-44, 40lb Inj, Modified Stock IC, ATR Cam, JC Chip,
			 ATR 2 ½" SS Exhaust, TH 3" DP, 3" Test Pipe, ATR
Ram Air)
'79 H/O T-Tops (400 HP/430 TQ ZZ4 350 H.O. Chevy, TH350, 3.73 Posi)

"Poverty Is Owning A Race Car"  "Happiness Is A Low E.T."

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 09:27:17 -0500
From: "Brett Wilson" <bwilson@dmotorworks.com>
Subject: MY NEXT HOT ROD

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------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 23:32:17 +0900
From: James Zito <jimzito@uriel.net>
Subject: Re: 69 442 Parts

I"ve lost the original or I'd have sent back to the originator,

But I'm always looking for healthy '69 442 parts to make the restoration
of my convertable that much easier.  Please let me know hat is available
in your locale, especially for sheetmetal.

TIA
Jim
'69 442 conv

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 07:19:31 -0700
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@MCI2000.com>
Subject: Re: 69 brake drum color

I was never too good at punctuation. Just thought you guys could put that
stuff in yourselves. Will try to be more correct.
- -----Original Message-----
From: CCRR12@aol.com <CCRR12@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Friday, July 24, 1998 1:30 AM
Subject: Re: 69 brake drum color


>In a message dated 98-07-23 20:50:27 EDT, you write:
>
><<  have a 69 442 with ssII and the drums are not painted that doesnt mean
>
>Kerry Kroger wrote:
>
>anything they could have been replaced however just because the manual says
> it doesnt make it so there was nothing set in stone
> the drums were plain when they left the factory that made them then they
> were assembled with a subassembly and installed on the car
> that means they were probably painted with that assembly such as the
spindel
> assy or the axle assy that means they were probably semigloss black if
> painted at all I doubt that they were painted as a seperate part backing
> plates were semigloss black but spindels were plain control arms were
> semigloss but the shafts were plain rotors were always plain  bottom line
I
> dont know I wasnt there but the evidence points me toward the semigloss
> black coloring any takers? >>
>
>
>Kerry,
>
>Man, you are a bundle of information for sure. Don't get frustrated with
the
>opinions you may receive from this list.  Good arguments and debate are a
>vital part of learning, by creating brain activity that was otherwise
>stagnant. The best opinions are based on experience, of which we have all
had
>different ones, and some remember  those, not so clearly. The opinions
>developed on the basis of heresay, we all must weigh accordingly. So if you
>been there and done that. Tell us your opinion.
>
>As Will Rogers said: " Everybody is ignorant, just on different subjects"
>
>Just one thing Kerry. Take a breath every once in a while. You talk too
fast
>for some us. You know , use a period.............
>
>Thanks,
>
>Randy in Okla
>57 88 J2

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 09:54:30 -0500
From: "Smetana, Christopher" <csmetana@dowagro.com>
Subject: RE: 69 brake drum color

>> dont know I wasnt there but the evidence points me toward the semigloss
>> black coloring any takers? >>

That would be my guess.  I did some more digging and found out they
where painted 'ebony black' with P05, N66 and I believe P37, which is
the SSI, SSII and ??. (don't know P37 and I didn't look it up)
Ebony black was listed as code 10 for GM I think and it looked like a
348 for some paint code or sales code (can't remember), instead of the
384 that is listed further on down the page.

Another interesting item I read was the wheels were painted black if
wheel disc where used.  They where painted body color if hubcaps were
used.  Whats the difference between wheel discs and hubcaps?  Are we
talking the dog dish hubcaps that more or less only cover the lug nuts.
And the wheel discs cover the whole wheel, essentially.  Or what?

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
work: csmetana@dowagro.com

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 08:11:21 -0700
From: Eric Spence <ericsp@mail.ocis.net>
Subject: (no subject)

unsubscribe oldsmobile ericsp@mail.ocis.net



- --
Eric Spence
ericsp@mail.ocis.net
Kamloops, BC, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 11:38:10 -0400
From: D Frizsell <dfrizsell@WCUVAX1.WCU.EDU>
Subject: 70 color chart

Didn't someone post a web page that had all the colors and codes for a 70 model
Olds? Does anyone have that address?

Thanks

D-man

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 11:57:24 -0400
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: RE: 70 color chart

That would be me.

http://home1.gte.net/betzel/be.html <http://home1.gte.net/betzel/be.html>

Go to 1970 Paint Chips.

Bobby
70 442 Escape Back to the...Past

	-----Original Message-----
	From:	D Frizsell [SMTP:dfrizsell@WCUVAX1.WCU.EDU]
	Sent:	Friday, July 24, 1998 11:38 AM
	To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
	Subject:	70 color chart

	Didn't someone post a web page that had all the colors and codes for
a 70 model
	Olds? Does anyone have that address?

	Thanks

	D-man

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 11:12:45 +0000
From: "Fred Noel" <fnoel@siue.edu>
Subject: [none]

subscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 12:19:40 EDT
From: <RICH6986@aol.com>
Subject: head gasket help

does anybody know how I could check to see if my head gasket is ok whan i got
the car the guy told me it had a blown head and for the past week it has been
fine but i am doing alot of work to it saturday and i what to know if there is
anything that i can look at  to see oh and its an 82 cutlass supreme v-6
3.8ltr

checked antifreeze thats fine oil is fine hasnt over heated no smoke replacing
the thermostate and hose          please help me
Rich6986@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 12:29:32 -0400 (EDT)
From: The Viking <avar@infinet.com>
Subject: Re: head gasket help

On Fri, 24 Jul 1998 RICH6986@aol.com wrote:

> does anybody know how I could check to see if my head gasket is ok whan i got
> the car the guy told me it had a blown head and for the past week it has 
been

Do a compression and/or leak down test. Leak down test should be below
10%..(The lower % the better) If it is not you have valve/rings/head gasket
problems.. One or all of the above

Good luck



Al Varhus
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.infinet.com/~avar
http://www.infinet.com/~avar/olds.html
Oldsmobile Club of America # 29111
  Mid Ohio Chapter #136
  Gem City Rockets


------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 12:46:04 -0400
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: RE: head gasket help

You can also pressurize the radiator and see if it holds pressure over a
period of time. A slow leak will only show up over (say) 24 hrs. Of course
if it is a bad leak you will see it right away. Look at your oil fill cap
and if you see any gray/white residue or moisture that is a good sign of a
leak. It could be an intake or head gasket leak. If you have to add water
real often and can not see any external leaks, than I would suspect a
gasket.

Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the...Past

	
	> does anybody know how I could check to see if my head gasket is ok
whan i got
	> the car the guy told me it had a blown head and for the past week
it has been

	Do a compression and/or leak down test. Leak down test should be
below
	10%..(The lower % the better) If it is not you have valve/rings/head
gasket
	problems.. One or all of the above


	

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 1998 12:09:56 -0500
From: "Ed Binnix" <comid@jellico.com>
Subject: Re: '68 Toro for parts

Like most, I'd like the oil pan and pickup.
comid@jellico.com

- -----Original Message-----
From: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
To: Comid <Comid>
Date: Thursday, July 23, 1998 12:05 PM
Subject: '68 Toro for parts


>
>Received: from halifax.chebucto.ns.ca [129.173.4.205] by jellico.com with
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> id AMAFBDCM ; Thu, 23 Jul 1998 12:05:20 -0500
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>From: <COUPEKING@aol.com>
>Message-ID: <9003739f.35b75e02@aol.com>
>Date: Thu, 23 Jul 1998 12:00:01 EDT
>To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
>Subject: '68 Toro for parts
>X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 52
>X-Orcpt: rfc822;"|/csuite/etc/majordomo/wrapper resend -l oldsmobile -h
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>Reply-To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
>
>List-
>Will be looking at a '68 Toronado tonight that is being parted out.
Supposedly
>a straight and clean SoCal car. I am interested in the core motor, and may
>have to buy the whole car to get it.
>
>My question is this:  is anybody on this list interested in parts from one
of
>these? If I do get it I will not be able to keep it around long after I
remove
>the motor, and it'll be off to the local 'Pick Your Part'.
>
>Are there any parts of special interest i should examine especially closely
>for anybody? If there are any special needs out there, let me know now
before
>I look at this beastie, and I'll get back to you privately with info after
I
>examine the car this PM.
>
>Not looking to get rich here, just to defray my expenses and to help any
>'listers' in need of Toro bits. If things do move, they will move quickly.
>
>Let me know.
>
>Peter
>Coupeking@aol.com
>San Pedro, CA
>

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1387
*********************************
