Please respond to oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
To:	oldsmobile-digest@chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1300


oldsmobile-digest        Tuesday, June 9 1998        Volume 01 : Number 1300



Re: Silver Gauge Cluster
Re: Tune-Up/Emission Decal (was schematic)
Re: Curve kits
Re: Silver Gauge Cluster
Re: f/s  69 cutlass s conv
Paint Samples
Danbury Mint
It was just my 'pinion
Re: Racing Gas or High Octane additive
Re: Rear Disc Brakes 1968 442 (long)
Wanted: Rallye Pack Gauges/ Tach
Re: Paint Samples
Octane for 455
Re: first time out
Re: f/s  69 cutlass s conv
Re: 67 Delta 88 convertible
cryosoak
Re: Octane for 455
Re: 87 Cutlass Production #'s
Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.
Re: Heat riser question
Re: Gas Tank Question
Re: Oklahoma City Chapter
Re: any 64 olds for sale or any 64 olds parts for sale?????
Re: any 64 olds for sale or any 64 olds parts for sale?????
deleted  mail
Re: 780 vacuum sec 4 sale& other acc.
Re: Silver Gauge Cluster
Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.
RE: value of car wanted
RE: value of car wanted
Re: Danbury Mint
gauges..
Re: first time out
Re: 87 Cutlass Production #'s
Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.
Re: gauges..
Re: gauges..
Re: gauges..
Re: Driving a '68 98
Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.
Re: engine swapping
Re: Danbury Mint
Re: gauges..
Re: first time out
Re: first time out

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:58:16 EDT
From: <JCRASH7@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Silver Gauge Cluster

I think they might be.  They basically are the same design, but I might
(probably) be wrong.  I haven't seen the inside of a Cutlass since we sold our
81 five yrs ago.

Joe Sherbanenko
84 Delta 88 Royale Brougham Coupe
88 Cadillac Sedan DeVille
http://members.aol.com/jcrash7

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 17:06:47 EDT
From: <ANTIQOLDS@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Tune-Up/Emission Decal (was schematic)

In a message dated 98-06-08 11:24:49 EDT, you write:

<<
 My 81 Toro I believe is a "G" body.  It has a 307 engine and the sticker you
 talk about is on the rad shroud, but is not labeled very well.  It refers to
a
 module >>
All Toro's are  "E" bodies, the "G" body is the 82-88 Cutlass, The "G" body
started again in 95 with the Aurora


Everett   OCA# 1961    1961 Starfire

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:09:59 -0600
From: Eric <big_olds@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Curve kits

I like the idea of this, could you please enlighten me (Price / basic
idea / where do I get)

Thanx a pzillion

Eric Aksomitis
http://www.dlcwest.com/~jed/eric.shtml

> And if you don't care about originality, an adjustable vacuum canister
> provides even MORE tune-ability.
>
> Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:27:07 -0500
From: "Green, Andrew" <acg@datalogics.com>
Subject: Re: Silver Gauge Cluster

>> When did Olds use the silver/aluminum gauge cluster?  Instead of the
>> black ones I am used to seeing???
>
> Is it 100% compatible with the 87 Cluster I have now....
>
> For reference, it was a sweeper gauge cluster, and I have an 87 with a
> sweeper gauge cluster.

Dunno about Olds, but Buick and Pontiac had silver gauges in 1978,
as in the LeSabre that Jerry's got on his web page at
http://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI/Rocket/Rocket.Html
(um, that's right, isn't it, Jerry?)

I drove a bunch of those '78's over the years, and at night the lighting
was truly weird because the silver faces reflected the backlighting
like you wouldn't believe; in the darkness it was like having a bunch
of little greenish-blue planets hovering in front of you. (Okay, well,
I was in college back then, too, but maybe that's a topic I shouldn't
get into... :-)

I think they only did that for one year, and by 1979 they were back
to more-conventional white-on-black dials.

If you want a _really_ stunning effect with those silver faces,
swap in 194A amber bulbs into the backlighting sockets.
- --
Andrew C. Green             (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.            email: acg@datalogics.com
101 N. Wacker, Ste. 1800    http://www.datalogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301     Fax: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 15:55:45 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: f/s  69 cutlass s conv

On Mon, 8 Jun 1998 Mikeytvb@aol.com wrote:
> who said the 455 was origional?  surely not me.  and it's not a cutlass
> suprime convertable.  it's a 1969 cutlass "S" convertable with a 455 rocket 
in
> it.
>
> some people......

Now hold on a sec...

As I recall the progression of this thread, you posted a question re
the value and scarcity of a '69 convertible. My copy of the original
post is long gone, but I recall being left with the impression that
the seller was trying to make a big deal out of the scarcity of it
since it wasn't a Supreme. Others subsequently pointed out that
converts in those years were only available in "S" and 4-4-2 models
and were not extraordinarily rare -- at least not in the couple of
hundred range you indicated he said.

A 455 is a nice addition if done correctly, or could be a hack job.
For me it would have to be very well done indeed to add significantly
to the car's value. I think that's the point that was trying to be
made. In any event, no one is trying to make you or the car look bad
the way I see it. Take it easy.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:35:05 -0700
From: "David E. Cohen" <thunder@onr.com>
Subject: Paint Samples

I have a '72 Olds Cutlass Supreme Conv.  I am trying to find a
complete selection of original paint splotches for my make and model
because I don't particularly like the original color.  Do you know how I
can get a set of original color samples?

Also, does repainting the car to its original color inhance the value
more than another color from that year model?  If so, by how much?

Thanks in advance!

Sincerely,

David Cohen
Austin, TX

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:54:34 -0600
From: Scott.Wheeler@pinnacle-brands.com
Subject: Danbury Mint

Doug Newman wrote:
"All die-cast collectors, rejoice!  They finally made an Olds..."

I thought I saw a post a long time ago about a car someone was selling or
had sold that had been a measurement car for the 70 W-30 Conv that they
were going to make.

Anybody heard any more details about it?

I'd gladly spend the $100 for that one!

Scott Wheeler
68 442 Conv (WHEE!)
Dallas

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 17:21:19 -0500
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: It was just my 'pinion

I've got to agree with Chris here.

Whenever you post a message or response, consider what you can do to make it
easier to read, and to be considerate of other's time. You are not the only one
on the list, nor the only one using bandwidth of the Internet.
- --
David Brown          Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
          Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.1 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/oldsfaq.htm
Conserve bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
           ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/zip/oldsfaq4.zip

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:33:01 EDT
From: <KS7RACING@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Racing Gas or High Octane additive

Sam,

Depending on the compression level of your engine and level of your tuning
will play a big factor in whether you need the racing gas or the octane
booster.  I know there are many additives in racing gas that the octane
booster might not have. It has to do with distillates that they add to
stabilize the mixture and other ingredients, there was an article in Circle
Track Magazine a few years back all about the things in racing gas vs. street
gas vs. aviation fuel.

Also, you need to think about if you have hardened seats in your cylinder
heads and how much / how hard you are going to be running this engine.  On our
last circle track street stock engine we did well with mixing 5 gallons
premium unleaded with 5 gallons leaded racing gas.  This engine was somewhere
around a stock low-compression 350 (was a 2-barrel before the Q/J was
installed on top) with a fairly stout cam and a lot of locked-in advance.  By
comparasion, the 11-to-1 Sportsman engines will get a steady diet of Sunoco
racing leaded, and the '80 Starfire SCCA Stock got nothing more than Amoco
Premium the day of an autocross, with the rest of the time plain unleaded.

It won't hurt to give most engines too much octane, but extra lead can mess up
a catalytic converter real quick (for those who must have those nuisances).
First, consider what the engine needs and then what the wallet will be happier
with.

Best Wishes,

Ken Snyder

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:47:32 EDT
From: <KS7RACING@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Rear Disc Brakes 1968 442 (long)

Thanks Joe!
By the time I get the chance to work on the Supreme maybe someone will have
found a reasonable way to do this.

Is there any reason you want rear discs as large as the fronts?  Since your
primary braking is on the front (where all that killer Olds engine's weight
is), I'd think you could get by with smaller discs on the rear.  I know the
RX-7 has solid rotors on the back and they're much smaller than the front
vented rotors.

Thanks again, keep us informed!

Ken Snyder
Kansas City, Kansas

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 19:59:04 -0400
From: "Andersons" <robertan@cfw.com>
Subject: Wanted: Rallye Pack Gauges/ Tach

From a 71/72 Cutlass, working or non-working condition.
Bob, Covington, VA
robertan@cfw.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 19:47:36 -0400
From: "Howard Tarnoff" <tarnoffh@norfolk-county.com>
Subject: Re: Paint Samples

I just ordered paint chip set from Faxons.  They are listed
in Hemmings under "O" Parts and Lit.

Just my $.02...if you ever plan to show it the paint should
match the data plate.

Howard Tarnoff
55 F**D F100
68 98 Convert

- ----------
> From: David E. Cohen <thunder@onr.com>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Paint Samples
> Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 6:35 PM
>
> I have a '72 Olds Cutlass Supreme Conv.  I am trying to find a
> complete selection of original paint splotches for my make and model
> because I don't particularly like the original color.  Do you know how I
> can get a set of original color samples?
>
> Also, does repainting the car to its original color inhance the value
> more than another color from that year model?  If so, by how much?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Sincerely,
>
> David Cohen
> Austin, TX

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 20:08:09 -0400
From: "Howard Tarnoff" <tarnoffh@norfolk-county.com>
Subject: Octane for 455

I am going to drive a 1968 Olds 98 from Wisconsin
to Massachusetts the end of June.  Can it stand
todays Premium Lead Free (Amoco Ultimate, Mobile Plus, etc)
or do I need to put in an some type of lead substitute?

If someone suggests to add something, then what?

Also, anyone have any ideas on what kind of MPG I
should expect from this 30 year old?

Thanks

Howard

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 19:19:02 -0500
From: "Ryan Hehn" <ryanh@mb.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: first time out

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I don't think you guys can generalize that the 307 will always outpower =
a 305.  These guys with the 305's must've had them in terribe shape.  My =
86 Cutlass with 305 (Canadian built) moves quite a bit quicker than by =
brother's 81 Delta with 307 (in good shape).  He even admits it.  In =
fact, that 305 will often squeal the tires.  It surprises a lot of newer =
cars.  I should mention it has 2.73s.

Let's face it, the power ratings are pretty much identical between the =
305 and 307.  Not trying to start a stupid debate here.  Just sometimes =
I wish GM had done to US cars what it did to the entire G-body line in =
Canada - Chevy V8s.  That way there wouldn't be as much hostility =
towards the Chevy brand.

Ryan

> I just bought a 84 olds delta 88 with a 307 today I finally took it =
out I
> love
> this car I had my friend who has a 84 chevy monte carlo with me he =
runs a
>305
> the delta with the 307 pounds right by his like he was standing still=20
>other
> than body work and the fact that I can never have enough hp the car is =
in
> perfect cond

>NEVER doubt the power of the 307.  Besides the fact that the Monte has =
the
>Chevy engine, the other thing going against it as well are the rear =
gears.
>The '84 monte should have 2.29s and you should have 2.41s or 2.56s.=20
>Despite the weight difference, you can take him.  The same thing =
happend to
>my friend as well who has a Malibu with the 305/2.29s.  His car is a =
two
>door, with no options but the 305.  It weighs only aprox. 3100lbs =
compared
>to the Delta, which is over 3800lbs (mine at least).  With my 307 and =
good
>exaust  and the 2.41 gears, the Malibu looked like it was standing =
still
>off the line compared to me, and past 30mph, the Malibu looks like it
>stalled.  My Delta ran pretty good with the 307 though, a whole lot =
better
>then when I started tweeking with it.  But at the end of the day, a 455 =
is
>waiting to be droped it.  It just would not go as fast as I wanted it =
too.=20
>But since this Delta is my first car (got it when I was sixteen from my
>dad), now, three years later, I have had 3 more cars + my dads, but my =
hart
>is still set on the big Delta.  Awsome car.    On another note, my =
other
>friend has a '76 Cutlass with 2.29s and a 350 in terrible shape.  Still
>though, it is one fast car.  My 307 Delta looked like IT was standing =
still
>compare to him.  Oh well, this will soon change.=20

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.2106.6"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I don't think you guys can =
generalize that the=20
307 will always outpower a 305.&nbsp; These guys with the 305's must've =
had them=20
in terribe shape.&nbsp; My 86 Cutlass with 305 (Canadian built) moves =
quite a=20
bit quicker than by brother's 81 Delta with 307 (in good shape).&nbsp; =
He even=20
admits it.&nbsp; In fact, that 305 will often squeal the tires.&nbsp; It =

surprises a lot of newer cars.&nbsp; I should mention it has =
2.73s.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Let's face it, the power ratings are =
pretty much=20
identical between the 305 and 307.&nbsp; Not trying to start a stupid =
debate=20
here.&nbsp; Just sometimes I wish GM had done to US cars what it did to =
the=20
entire G-body line in Canada - Chevy V8s.&nbsp; That way there wouldn't =
be as=20
much hostility towards the Chevy brand.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Ryan</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&gt; I just bought a 84 olds delta 88 with a 307 today I finally =
took it=20
out I<BR>&gt; love<BR>&gt; this car I had my friend who has a 84 chevy =
monte=20
carlo with me he runs a<BR>&gt;305<BR>&gt; the delta with the 307 pounds =
right=20
by his like he was standing still <BR>&gt;other<BR>&gt; than body work =
and the=20
fact that I can never have enough hp the car is in<BR>&gt; perfect=20
cond<BR><BR>&gt;NEVER doubt the power of the 307.&nbsp; Besides the fact =
that=20
the Monte has the<BR>&gt;Chevy engine, the other thing going against it =
as well=20
are the rear gears.<BR>&gt;The '84 monte should have 2.29s and you =
should have=20
2.41s or 2.56s. <BR>&gt;Despite the weight difference, you can take =
him.&nbsp;=20
The same thing happend to<BR>&gt;my friend as well who has a Malibu with =
the=20
305/2.29s.&nbsp; His car is a two<BR>&gt;door, with no options but the=20
305.&nbsp; It weighs only aprox. 3100lbs compared<BR>&gt;to the Delta, =
which is=20
over 3800lbs (mine at least).&nbsp; With my 307 and =
good<BR>&gt;exaust&nbsp; and=20
the 2.41 gears, the Malibu looked like it was standing still<BR>&gt;off =
the line=20
compared to me, and past 30mph, the Malibu looks like =
it<BR>&gt;stalled.&nbsp;=20
My Delta ran pretty good with the 307 though, a whole lot =
better<BR>&gt;then=20
when I started tweeking with it.&nbsp; But at the end of the day, a 455=20
is<BR>&gt;waiting to be droped it.&nbsp; It just would not go as fast as =
I=20
wanted it too. <BR>&gt;But since this Delta is my first car (got it when =
I was=20
sixteen from my<BR>&gt;dad), now, three years later, I have had 3 more =
cars + my=20
dads, but my hart<BR>&gt;is still set on the big Delta.&nbsp; Awsome=20
car.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; On another note, my other<BR>&gt;friend has a '76 =
Cutlass=20
with 2.29s and a 350 in terrible shape.&nbsp; Still<BR>&gt;though, it is =
one=20
fast car.&nbsp; My 307 Delta looked like IT was standing =
still<BR>&gt;compare to=20
him.&nbsp; Oh well, this will soon change.&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 20:33:31 -0400
From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Subject: Re: f/s  69 cutlass s conv

> > who said the 455 was origional?  surely not me.  and it's not a cutlass
> > suprime convertable.  it's a 1969 cutlass "S" convertable with a 455 rocket
in > > it. > > > > some people...... > > Now hold on a sec... > > As I recall
the progression of this thread, you posted a question re > the value and
scarcity of a '69 convertible. <snip>

Thanks Greg,
I hate to waste more bandwidth, and I definately don't want to single
anybody out, but this is is the type of response that I'm sure keeps
some list members quiet (or drives them away).

** The original post had this line about the sellers claim to rarity:

> he told me it was a 1969 oldsmobile cutlass s convertable.  he
> said it was a very rare car because it wasn't a suprime.

** I responded with the production numbers below, indicating it wasn't
rare (unless it was the V6):

Well, the Cutlass S with the 350 there were only 13,498
produced...unless of course it's the V6 with a whopping 236 produced

** Another line from the original post:

> it has a 455 rocket

** To which I added the comment below.  The meaning behind which is if
it had been a rare car, it no longer held the same value as the original
engine was gone.  Notice the wink at the end of the sentence?

Oh, it's got the 455, 0 produced like that ;)
BTW, the Cutlass Supreme was not available as a convertible until 1970.

- --
Kurt Heinrich  (mailto:old442@erols.com)
71 442         (see it at http://www.442.com/heinrich.html)
OCA# 30442

*****************************************************
* visit my home page at http://www.erols.com/old442 *
*****************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 20:32:07 EDT
From: <OldsGuyGA@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 67 Delta 88 convertible

peter,sure the ht parts interchange!!!!!

olds guy..mr pres call me my boy, your a genious

770  723-9345

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 20:28:40 -0400
From: Hekimian Racing Engines <hre@dfront.net>
Subject: cryosoak

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Cryosoak Tempering Service
Deep Cryosoak Tempering creates a significant increase in abrasive wear
resistance and durability. The increases in strength, toughness and
stability may couple with the release of internal residual stresses. The
end results are longer engine life, higher Horsepower and less breakage.

Cryosoak treatments of metals to improve strength and toughness have
been around for a number of years.
Recently, however, the process has been applied to race engines with
amazing results.


  As any machinist knows, working metal introduces stresses into the
finished parts.  Forging, welding, cutting, and machining all cause
stress to build up in the structure of a part.  Stress relieving
(usually by heating to a specific temperature and then cooling at a
controlled rate) can restore the part to a lower level of internal
stress.

 Unlike some heat treatment, deep Cryo treatments create a denser
molecular structure that goes completely through the part.  This results
in a large, internal contact area, which improves the heat, and wear
properties and reduce friction.

 Another plus is the increase in thermal dimensional stability exhibited
by parts that have been subjected to a deep Cryo treatment.  In plain
English, parts subjected to heat (internal engine parts for example)
tend to grow causing clearances to change.  Cranks flex under the
stresses of operation causing harmonics to be introduced, which can lead
to hammered caps and bearings and increased friction.  By deep Cryo
treating these engine internals, parts ?growth? and deflection can be
greatly reduced.  The end result is more efficient engine with less
frictional losses and greatly enhanced strength.  And, as we all know,
if we decrease the frictional losses in an engine, you increase the
horsepower that the engine is capable of making.

 This is the pioneer of the process.  The computer-controlled deep Cryo
process cools the part dry (other less efficient processes expose the
parts directly to liquid nitrogen with sometimes-disastrous results?drop
an ice cube into some hot coffee for a quick demonstration).

 These parts are cooled at a controlled rate and the computer determines
the optimum time the part must remain at temperature for proper
treatment.

 This process is not just for the ?high buck? corporate racer either.
It is an affordable process that can add extra life to your engine
components and increase the power that you can make with the components
that you already have.  It is also compatible with ceramic engine
coatings.  The  price to treat a V8 engine is $ 1,300.00







TOP GUN SECRET FOR PERFORMANCE AND DURABILITY

 For those who don?t know what Cryogenics means, just think (COLD).  The
word Cryogenic is derived from two Greek words, ?Kayos?, which means
cold or freezing, and ?Genes?, meaning born or produced.  Deep
Cryogenics is anything below 300 degrees Fahrenheit.  The process has
created many new applications in ultra cold temperature physics.  It is
found that Cryogenic treatment to metal tools and machine parts can
increase their life by some 200-400%.  Just recently, this process has
been applied to engine parts and components.

 Cryogenics has been around to 30 years, but it wasn?t until the advent
of computers and computer-regulated controls, that the process became
viable.

 The heat treating process is not really where the dynamics come into
play but rather when the cool down stage comes in.

Cryosoak is a big extension of this process.  In fact, heat-treating is
a misnomer.  It should be called cold treating. If you have been around
Motorsports for any length of time, you know this idea isn?t new. We all
know someone who has tried to cover a part or a component with dry ice,
or put it in his Wife?s freezer or in an oven to attempt to find an
edge. Liquid Nitrogen has even been tried by some. Dropping a part into
a Vat of Liquid Nitrogen is like dropping an ice cube into a cup of hot
water, it cracks from the stress points inside the cube.

 Although not apparent to the naked eye, the changes to the parts are
significant. First, it creates a much more durable molecular structure.
The results are a large contact surface area that decreases friction and
wear. Second, it relieves stress, a result from manufacturing,
eliminating potential failure points in the part. And contrary to
popular belief, this process actually decreases brittleness when done
properly.

 For the competitor it decreases wear on your treated parts. Hekimian
Racing Engines has seen Racing engines run a full year of racing at
8,500 RPM with no broken parts, and seen only ¼ of a thousandth of wear.

 Fact: No Cryosoaked parts of ours have ever been broken to date. As a
rule Hekimian Racing Engines rip all racing engines down and the
bearings look just like new! We also found that Cryosoaked Chevy heads
are not prone to cracking even at 240 degrees F. Untreated heads show
cracks at these temperatures.

 Transmission parts will not break or wear, rear end axles, pumpkins,
gears, and bearings as well.

Another advantage is increased Horsepower and Torque. During the up and
down piston travel, heat is a main factor here with cast iron and
aluminum blocks walking and flexing big time. And during this time your
bores become eccentric thus causing cylinder pressure blow-by, resulting
in loss of power, torque and at the same time fuel wash. A Cryosoaked
block will not walk, shift or flex---- results , serious horsepower &
torque gains. The strength that Cryosoaking does is awesome. Several
Drag race teams, Winston Cup, Indy, Motorcross use this process to their
success. Snowmobile?s , ATV?s, Motorcycles, any form of Motorsports.
Deep Cryosoak process is proven to decrease wear and breakage, increase
reliability, and provide improve performance. It works on all metal
parts of your engine and can significantly reduce your racing costs.
Cryosoaked aluminum heads can accept more advanced ignition timing
without detonation.
Tighter tolerances can be achieved, example: Aluminum Connecting Rod
Cryosoaked will have a 40% less stretch , therefore you now can go
closer to your real number tolerance.
Forged Pistons can be placed in the bores tighter, real close to a
Hypereutectic Piston??
You can run hotter temperatures without any adverse effect.

 Cryosoaked aluminum is much harder and tighter and it machines very
easy and smoother.

 The process of Cryosoak releases the stress and stabilizes the metal.
This means when the metals in the engine are heated up and cooled down.
It will not be impeded by the residual stress. Distortion of the engine
components will no longer occur. A stressed cylinder will take on an
elongated shape.
This would be visible in wear patterns when you tear the engine down
after a racing season. These exaggerated wear patterns are formed under
relieved stresses in the engine metals that cause distortion.
With a distortion of that nature you will get blow-by in the combustion
chamber and you will not get as high compression as you planned. After
the stress relief process of Cryosoak, the cylinder and pistons will
stay round and the rings will get a very good seal. The compression will
then come up to what equates to an increase in Horsepower. Torque is
increased and you get a real boost from this additional power. The
benefit is evident at the lower & upper rpms.

This process works regardless of the engine metal. Whether it?s aluminum
on aluminum, a cast iron sleeve in an aluminum block, or steel involved,
the slow computer controlled process of lowering the temperature slowly
and evenly keeps the metals cooling at the very same rate.

 Welded parts often create new stresses, but with Cryosoaked welded
parts these stresses are relieved. Normally when the engine parts are
assembled, they will (move) as engine heat builds, creating undue
eccentric wear as a result of warpage. Parts which are finished machined
after deep Cryosoak processing will not move, hence there is less wear
and abnormal tensions.

Hekimian Racing Engines
876 Belmont Street
Watertown, MA 02172
Office?617-926-0608


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 21:10:19 -0400
From: "Gib Loudon" <cutlass@mill.tds.net>
Subject: Re: Octane for 455

Howard,
It all depends on what year the engine was made.  If it is pre-1972, I would
highly recommend that you use lead substitute.  After 1972 they had hardened
valve seats which allowed you to run no-lead fuel.  The pre-72 engines
required the lead to "cusion" the valve seats when the metal "wore
away"....the lead deposited itself in the places where the metal had wore
away.  This will ensure that the engine has a long and happy life.   Hope
this helps.

Gib Loudon (a.k.a. "The Rocketman")
1969 Cutlass "S" Holiday Coupe
Check out Cutlass Net at:
http://apollo.kettering.edu/~loud5269
cutlass@mill.tds.net

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 20:34:46 -0400
From: Jason Adcock <rocketolds@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: 87 Cutlass Production #'s

At 09:36 AM 6/8/98 -0400, you wrote:
>List,
>
>        Does anyone know, or know where I can find the production totals for
>Cutlai in 1987.
>
>Cutlass Supreme Cpe
>Cutlass Supreme Brougham Cpe
>Cutlass Salon Cpe
>Cutlass 442 Cpe
>
>Jim H.
>'87 Salon

Yessir...

Cutlass Supreme Coupe: 50713
Cutlass Brougham Coupe: 30100
Cutlass Salon Coupe: 9221

The 442 was an option on the Salon models.  I don't know exactly how many
were produced, 3000?  I also don't know if the 442 production number is
included in the Salon models.  For example, if there were say 3000 442
coupes produced, would there be only 6221 "regular" Salon Coupes?

Hope this helps out anyway...

Jason Adcock      OCA# 28044       1984 Cutlass Calais Coupe
mailto:rocketolds@vt.edu       http://www.erols.com/adcockjk

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:08:15 -0400
From: "Dave Cullen" <david.cullen@snet.net>
Subject: Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.

- -----Original Message-----
From: Jerry Christopher <ithefunki@viperlink.net>
To: Olds Mail List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 11:41 AM
Subject: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.


>Will I lose the Cruise if I yank the Computer Controlled Carb off, and
>stick a normal carb on?


nope - the cruise is a separate module and doesn't need the computer.

drc

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:18:44 EDT
From: <JohnMonnin@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Heat riser question

In a message dated 98-06-07 21:49:24 EDT, you write:

<< Has anyone used the stainless steel block off plates (like the one
 Dave Smith sells) or the plugs that Edelbrock sells to plug their heat
 riser in their heads?  >>

I am interested in this question too because I just bought a used RPM intake
manifold for my 350.  I really don't want to pay to have the exhaust ports in
the heads welded up by some one who might warp the heads.  Does the Dick
Miller  or Eldebrock plug go all the way to the valve pocket or does it just
block the face near the intake manifold?

The person the RPM manifold from said it was too much manifold for his stock
engine.  Hopefully the modifications I am making to my car will agree with the
manifold.  I am doing a basic hand port job on the heads.  I  have already
ground away the EGR bumps in the exhaust valves, tapered the intake valve
guides and gasket matched the intake ports as well as I could, emphasizing
raising the port roof and leaving the port floor shape alone.   I would like
to thank who ever suggested that I look at a previous car craft for pictures
of a Mondello machined head, it was a helpfull guide.  As soon as I taper the
exhaust guides and do a basic bowl polish I will be ready to lap the valves
and put the heads back on the car.  As soon as my wife finds another job the
checking account will be unfrozen and I will be able to buy a set of headers
and Eldebrock 4 barrel carb to match my new intake.  Wish me luck!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:20:44 EDT
From: <KarlAune@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Gas Tank Question

In a message dated 98-06-08 03:50:41 EDT, you write:

<<  The hose that went from
 my gas tank to the fuel line had a hairline crack, gas would evaporate,
 I couldn't find it.  But my gas guage still indicated a quick loss.  A
 day later and the fuel hose had a hole.  I replaced it and it was fine.
 Look closely you may find another culprit.  No offense Karl.
  >>

None taken.

Because mine only leaks when it is very full. Not after. Gas tank itself does
not get wet.

But that is yet another project.


In another unrelated matter. Somehow I accidentally attached a snippet to a
previous post that should by no means have been sent public like that. For
those actally concerned by that addition, I do humbly apologize, I cannot
imagine how something so off-subject got attached. To all others; please
delete that message outright.

 Greg, can I keep that from getting into a digest?



Karl Aune
and Soylent Ocean Mist
1965 Dynamic 88 Celebrity Sedan
Members; IVOC and OCA (#029458)
Chicago, IL

KarlAune@aol.com
http://members.aol.com/KarlAune/rage.html

KarlAune is a trademark of World Domination Ltd., a subsidiary of Microsoft

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:27:07 EDT
From: <W30442CS@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Oklahoma City Chapter

steven bloom,  w30442cs@aol.com,  okc member

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 22:29:38 -0400
From: Jim & Jo Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: any 64 olds for sale or any 64 olds parts for sale?????

Joe

        We have a few parts for a 64. What do you need?

Jim Chermack
C&M Classic Parts
(757)474-0869

At 03:03 PM 6/7/1998 EDT, you wrote:
>im looking for parts for a 64 olds cutlass or f-85.im desperate.u guys gotta
>help me.thanks
>              joe		
>
>1964 olds cutlass f-85
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:55:24 -0500
From: "Rod" <holum@discover-net.net>
Subject: Re: any 64 olds for sale or any 64 olds parts for sale?????

I just started in this mailing list...I too am looking for parts for a 64
cutlass so a list of what you have would be helpfull I am looking for Rear
Bumper,shifter knob,left hood hindge......can you help?
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jim & Jo Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: any 64 olds for sale or any 64 olds parts for sale?????


>Joe
>
>        We have a few parts for a 64. What do you need?
>
>Jim Chermack
>C&M Classic Parts
>(757)474-0869
>
>At 03:03 PM 6/7/1998 EDT, you wrote:
>>im looking for parts for a 64 olds cutlass or f-85.im desperate.u guys
gotta
>>help me.thanks
>>              joe
>>
>>1964 olds cutlass f-85
>>
>>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:04:44 EDT
From: <Hoffa11081@aol.com>
Subject: deleted  mail

I deleted one of the mails I was waiting for from the list is there anyway to
get it back

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:22:58 EDT
From: <RPTW32@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 780 vacuum sec 4 sale& other acc.

In a message dated 98-06-04 11:13:16 EDT, you write:

<< i figured i would sell mine. Its a holly 780 vac
 sec. Has quick change fuel bowls with the holley jet assortment kit. The
quick
 change fuel bowls were about 30 each the jet kit was 30. i want $125 for the
 carb. >>

Second request. Does it still have the choke plate in tact and what is the
size
range of the jet kit ??  Again very interested possible if not already sold

Pls advise

Thanks,
Rob Thomas
69 442
RPTW32@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 23:50:22 -0400
From: Jerry Christopher <ithefunki@viperlink.net>
Subject: Re: Silver Gauge Cluster

Green, Andrew wrote:

> > For reference, it was a sweeper gauge cluster, and I have an 87 with a
> > sweeper gauge cluster.
>
> Dunno about Olds, but Buick and Pontiac had silver gauges in 1978,
> as in the LeSabre that Jerry's got on his web page at
> http://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI/Rocket/Rocket.Html
> (um, that's right, isn't it, Jerry?)

But I know Buick used square and rounds ones...  No sweeper style...
And the gauges them selves were compatible between car lines...
- --
                 Jerry Christopher
           Mailto:ithefunki@viperlink.net
IRC - EFNet:IThEFunKI - #SouthCarolina -#Olds - #Ford
        HTTP://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 23:51:45 -0400
From: Jerry Christopher <ithefunki@viperlink.net>
Subject: Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.

Dave Cullen wrote:

> >Will I lose the Cruise if I yank the Computer Controlled Carb off, and
> >stick a normal carb on?
>
> nope - the cruise is a separate module and doesn't need the computer.

On an 87, what controls the accel and decel of the car under cruise
condition?  Where's the module, and how's it work <G>...  I was under
the assumption that it controlled a vaccuum on older models, and
electronically on the newer ones.

- --
                 Jerry Christopher
           Mailto:ithefunki@viperlink.net
IRC - EFNet:IThEFunKI - #SouthCarolina -#Olds - #Ford
        HTTP://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:00:35 -0600
From: "Kevin Meredith" <bkmeredith@telusplanet.net>
Subject: RE: value of car wanted

What about a 70' Vista Cruiser in original, no rust shape. Does $2500 sound
like too much for it? Opinions Welcome!

Kevin

- -----Original Message-----
From:	oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
[mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca] On Behalf Of D Frizsell
Sent:	Monday, June 08, 1998 8:51 AM
To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:	Re: value of car wanted


Mikey,
I bought my 71 convertible for a little less than that. It was in a little
better
shape than that one sounds like too. I had good fenders and carpet but the
top
was shoot. I gave $1800 for it. If you could get him down to around that
you'd be
in great shape.

D-man


Mikeytvb@aol.com wrote:

> i found a 71 cutlass convertable...i was wanting to know if anyone knows
about
> how much a car like this is worth...he wants 2500 for it how it sits...

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:00:36 -0600
From: "Kevin Meredith" <bkmeredith@telusplanet.net>
Subject: RE: value of car wanted

Chris, is the 'Olds Cars Price Guide' something that's available online?
I've not heard of it and would welcome some pricing information on a Vista
Cruiser I'm looking at.

Kevin

- -----Original Message-----
From:	oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
[mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca] On Behalf Of Chris Rivier
Sent:	Monday, June 08, 1998 1:02 AM
To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:	Re: value of car wanted


Hi,

I came across one in Austin, Tx.  The guy wanted about $2500 too.  It
needed a lot of work.  Almost bought it.  He was willing to settle for
$1600.  Most of the body was in ok shape but it had the cancer.  I
decided to pass... I came this close.

I looked it up the Olds in Old Cars Price Guide.  It is probably worth
that much in 3 to 4 condition, but you could probably talk him down, at
least under $2000.

You left a lot out.  Does the car run? How long has it been sitting?
The pros and cons of restoration.  I have found decent looking and
running convertibles in the $3800-$5000+ range.

Good Luck,

Chris Rivier
'66 Delta 88..."The Beast," in progress.
'88 Festiva..."Zippy"  160K+@ 40 mpg, neeed I say more.


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:24:51 -0500
From: Doug Newman <newmand@WCBI.com>
Subject: Re: Danbury Mint

Scott Wheeler wrote:

	I thought I saw a post a long time ago about a car someone was
selling or
	had sold that had been a measurement car for the 70 W-30 Conv
that they
	were going to make.

	Anybody heard any more details about it?

	Scott, that car was/is owned by Tracey Cleeton.  The pics are
still up, they're at http://www.mcmsys.com/~tcleeton/
	He's got some pictures of the Danbury Mint guys measuring the
car.  I never did hear of it being available, though.
	(He later posted that their version would be yellow, instead of
red, like the actual car.)

	Later,

	Doug Newman         OCA # 30311
	Columbus, MS
	1987 442

	http://www.442.com/newman.html
	http://www.442.com/newmantape.html
	

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:23:44 EDT
From: <DYeager535@aol.com>
Subject: gauges..

Does anyone know if Olds ever put any over 85 mph speedos in the gauge
clusters of the Cutlass'? (the round style) 78-88? Also, no one knows what
casting #581798 on my exhaust manifold is? I remember that it came off a motor
that I put the crank pulley on my 403. Not that that may make any difference.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:32:19 -0400
From: "Angel Castrodad" <angleki@prtc.net>
Subject: Re: first time out

>I don't think you guys can generalize that the 307 will always outpower a
>305.  These guys with the 305's must've had them in terribe shape.  My >86
Cutlass with 305 (Canadian built) moves quite a bit quicker than by
>brother's 81 Delta with 307 (in good shape).  He even admits it.  In fact,
>that 305 will often squeal the tires.  It surprises a lot of newer cars.  I
>should mention it has 2.73s.

I beg to differ. You see your Cutlass is "less heavy" than your brother's
Delta. And second, I used to have an '86 Cutlass Supreme with the roller (7A
heads) and a TH-350 (2.-something gears) and I din't squeal the tires, I
left a long "I was here" written in the road with tire rubber. So I guess
YOUR Delta motor was a bit out of shape. I won't even go talking about the
'86 442 leaving his signature where he wants.

Sorry guys, I just had to vent that. I'm much better now.

Angel

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:33:33 -0500
From: "Mark Tupper" <mtupper@palacenet.net>
Subject: Re: 87 Cutlass Production #'s

Jason,

>The 442 was an option on the Salon models.  I don't know exactly how many
>were produced, 3000?  I also don't know if the 442 production number is
>included in the Salon models.  For example, if there were say 3000 442
>coupes produced, would there be only 6221 "regular" Salon Coupes?

Interesting, as I assumed I have the 442  option on a Cutlass Supreme Coupe.
I'm basing this info on the VIN decoder at:
http://members.aol.com/drewinva/vin/vin81_88.htm

My VIN is 1G3GR1192HPxxxxxx where the GR is the Cutlass Supreme.
The code for Cutlass Salon is GK. There's something wrong however, because
according to the decoder, the numbers after the Gx code should be 47 for 2
Door.
 Not quite sure where the 11 in mine came from. It's not an option in the
decoder.

I'm quite positive it's a real 442.

BTW, Mike Rothe's page ( http://www.xtalwind.net/~hurstolds/ ) states that
about
4200 442's were produced in 86 and 87. I hope he doesn't mind that I stole
the
following paragraph from his page:

"I've received a few inquiries about mid 80's 442 items. Notably, how many
were
made. In 1985, 3000 units were made public. In 1986 and 1987, around 4200
units
were sold each year. That's a total of around 11,400 mid-80's 442s. While
not
considered real RARE, this is not a large number in the scheme of things.
Couple
that with the 6000+ 83/84/88 H/Os, and that is less than 18,000 performance
RWD
Cutlasses from '83 to '88."

Anyone have any ideas?

- -Mark Tupper    '87 442 (?)
 mtupper@palacenet.net        http://www.cyberglyphs.com/442/

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 22:34:15 -0600
From: Lloyd Ferguson <lloyd.ferguson@usa.net>
Subject: Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.

I can only speak for my '84 Riv, (I didn't catch what car this thread was
about) it has an electronic cruise conrol module, about 6" x 4" x 2"
roughly in the center of the dash above the ash tray and below the A/C
control head.  It is not well labeled, someone had to tell me what it was
for.  It basically takes inputs from a sensor on the speedo head (different
if you have an electronic cluster) and from the multi-function switch (aka
turn-signal lever) and modulates a solenoid in the cruise control servo on
the engine block.  If you want more details I have a complete description
somewhere that I could send.

At 11:51 PM 6/8/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Dave Cullen wrote:
>
>> >Will I lose the Cruise if I yank the Computer Controlled Carb off, and
>> >stick a normal carb on?
>>
>> nope - the cruise is a separate module and doesn't need the computer.
>
>On an 87, what controls the accel and decel of the car under cruise
>condition?  Where's the module, and how's it work <G>...  I was under
>the assumption that it controlled a vaccuum on older models, and
>electronically on the newer ones.
>
>--
>                 Jerry Christopher
>           Mailto:ithefunki@viperlink.net
>IRC - EFNet:IThEFunKI - #SouthCarolina -#Olds - #Ford
>        HTTP://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:40:03 -0400
From: "Angel Castrodad" <angleki@prtc.net>
Subject: Re: gauges..

I can help with the gauges. If I recall correctly, '84-'86 442's had 120 MPH
speedos, at least mine does. These are the round, rally gauges indeed. I
don't know about the Hurst/Olds but I guess so too.

Angel
- -----Original Message-----
From: DYeager535@aol.com <DYeager535@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Tuesday, June 09, 1998 12:21 AM
Subject: gauges..


>Does anyone know if Olds ever put any over 85 mph speedos in the gauge
>clusters of the Cutlass'? (the round style) 78-88? Also, no one knows what
>casting #581798 on my exhaust manifold is? I remember that it came off a
motor
>that I put the crank pulley on my 403. Not that that may make any
difference.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 00:39:13 -0400
From: super442@mindspring.com
Subject: Re: gauges..

At 12:23 AM 6/9/98 EDT, you wrote:
>Does anyone know if Olds ever put any over 85 mph speedos in the gauge
>clusters of the Cutlass'? (the round style) 78-88? Also, no one knows what
>casting #581798 on my exhaust manifold is? I remember that it came off a
motor
>that I put the crank pulley on my 403. Not that that may make any difference.
>

YES,I know the 87 442's have 120mph ,if you want to see what it looks like
, hit me direct at:

                 super442@mindspring.com
Sorry I only have one but I've got several 85 mph pacs for sale.
 John

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:45:58 EDT
From: <DYeager535@aol.com>
Subject: Re: gauges..

Thanks Angel! Anybody know where you can get original or repro of the 120 mph
442 speedo from 78-88?

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:25:57 -0600
From: "Igor" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Subject: Re: Driving a '68 98

I think that the premium will work OKAY, but as far as I know the early
heads need hardened exaust seats to live with unleded gas.  I think though
you should be fine for your trip with unleaded, but make sure you check
with someone else first.  Maybe you will need lead adatives of something.
Check.

As far as MPG goes, HUH, more like GPM.  No, just kidding.  My uncle said
he once had a Delta '68 or so with a 455 and said it was all right with
something like 12-15mpg.  That is all-right with a big block big car.  My
307 '81 Delta hardly pulled 20mpg with 3-speed auto on highway.

- ----------
From: Howard Tarnoff <tarnoffh@norfolk-county.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: Driving a '68 98
Date: Sunday, June 07, 1998 7:39 AM

I will be driving a 1968 98 455 from Wisconsin to Massachusettes.  Two dumb

questions:

Will premium unleaded perform well?

What kind of mpg range can I expect?

Thanks.

Howard

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:00:29 -0600
From: "Igor" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Subject: Re: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.

- ----------
> From: Jerry Christopher <ithefunki@viperlink.net>
> To: Olds Mail List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> Subject: Taking the Computer Controlled Carb off.
> Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 9:37 AM
>
> Will I lose the Cruise if I yank the Computer Controlled Carb off, and
> stick a normal carb on?
>
> If so, can I use the older style cruises that hook inline with the
> speedometer cable?
> --
>                  Jerry Christopher
>            Mailto:ithefunki@viperlink.net
> IRC - EFNet:IThEFunKI - #SouthCarolina -#Olds - #Ford
>         HTTP://Members.Viperlink.Net/IThEFunKI

Cruise Controls are dead simple, and you can adapt almost any older cruise
to fit your car.  I don't even think that you will have to, but am not
sure.  The most important thing you must do is make sure that the parts you
are getting from another car are in GOOD shape.  I have put 4 different
cruise control systems on one of my cars.  The first did not work, second
and third worked but were erratic, did not shut-off/engage at times, exc.
The one that finally worked was off an old car that was totally different
from OEM.  Later I found out what to look for in a cruise control to make
sure it is fine.  The erratic two were both worn.  Good luck.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:52:54 -0600
From: "Igor" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Subject: Re: engine swapping

I am swaping a 455 instead of a 307 in my '81 Delta 88.  The 307 and 350
are same external size so all should be same.  If you have a 455 complete
from a car, then you are okay, couse you will have all the big-block
mounting brackets for accesories.  If you don't, then by just buying the
remanufactured motor, you will have to buy a few little things.

Any 455 pan will fit, but make sure if the TORONADO pan will fit your car.
I am not sure, but I think your 350 pan may fit as well.  Check.

The waterpump should be a direct swap over to a 455 from 350, but by a new
one.  Same for the fuel pump.  They are cheap and a worth the money.

The alternator and power-steering and AC will swap from the 350, but you
need those big-block mounting brackets (cheap at scrap yards).

Your cab will swap no porblem, you may have to rejet it though for more
CIDs ($5 or so for jets) and retune it.  This is simple

The distributor is identical from the 455 and 350 so no problems there.

You will need, however, a Intake manifold.  The 350 one would NOT fit.
Your options here are to get a '72-'76 EGR manifold (don't unless you need
emissions or can't find any other), pre '72 with no EGR.  These two can be
found on the scrap yards and are dirt cheap.  The other option is Edelbrock
Performer 455 aluminum intake.  A good intake (a whole lot lighter then
stock, some 30LBS or so) but you wallet would have to be heavy couse they
are about twice the price of those SB Chevy ones.  Unless you have money or
want a top notch motor, don't bother.  You can always change it later.
Vary easy on OLDS.  And the stock one would set you back $10 bucks instad
of $400 Can.

Fan clutch and assebly should be fine from the 350.  But since the 455 is
taller, you may have to shim your fan shroud for clearance.  No problem.

You need to get frame mounts for a 455 so that your engine sits properly.
Then you may not need to modify the fan shroud, should be fine.  Again,
simple and cheap.

You COULD use your stock exaust manifolds but I would not.  At least get
some BB exaust manifolds (can do this when you look for a intake manifold
at scrap yard).  But if you can afford, RUN headers.  Sounds lots better,
free HPs as well.  Here you can pick up a whole lots of HPs from a big
block AND fuel economy as well.  From a scrap yard, BB exaust manifolds are
cheap, like $5 each.

Just by the new belts.  They are not worth the headake, and since you will
be droping a fresh nice 455, how would it look to put used belts in.

This is all I can think of now.  Sounds like lots of work but DON'T get
discouraged.  It now big deal and is all cheap.  You would like the new
motor lots.  Other then what I listed (or missed) everything should be a
easy no problem bolt on.  Cruise, trans lines, etc.  If you have any
questions let me know.  Good luck.

Igor Todorovic, UofC
1981 Delta 88 (455/TH400, 255/60/15 BFG, 2.41limited slip(soon change))
1981 98 Regency (every option, 307/200r4/propane)
1976 Delta 88 (now parts car, was 455)
1981 Dodge MaxiVan (360, RVcam, 4:10 gears, tire smoker, king off the line)
1995 Intrepid (3.3L, dads car, okay, but no Delta)

- ----------
> From: Chris Kugler <talcarol@erie.net>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: engine swapping
> Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 2:05 PM
>
> I have some more questions about what I can swap from my 1977 350 to a
455.
> I've been thinking about getting a remanufatured 1972 Olds engine from
> Marshal.
> Could I swap the alternator?  What about the power steering stuff?  What
> about the fan and the fan clutch?  Could I use some of the same belts?
If
> I were to get this engine all I would get is the block, heads, oil pump,
> and internal workings.  Would any 455 oil pan fit? I'd get a new water
> pump. If you think of anything else let me know.
>
> Thanks
> Chris Kugler
> 1977 442

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:01:59 -0500
From: "Mark Tupper" <mtupper@palacenet.net>
Subject: Re: Danbury Mint

Doug,

> He's got some pictures of the Danbury Mint guys measuring the
>car.  I never did hear of it being available, though.
> (He later posted that their version would be yellow, instead of
>red, like the actual car.)


I specifically remember the ad in the classifieds at www.442.com earlier
this year. Can't remember what the asking price was but I do remember
I woke up on the floor an hour later. <bg>

- -Mark Tupper        '87 442
 mtupper@palacenet.net        http://www.cyberglyphs.com/442/

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:04:39 -0500
From: "Mark Tupper" <mtupper@palacenet.net>
Subject: Re: gauges..

You wrote:


>Does anyone know if Olds ever put any over 85 mph speedos in the gauge
>clusters of the Cutlass'? (the round style) 78-88?

My '87 442 has a 120mph round style guage.

- -Mark Tupper        '87 442
 mtupper@palacenet.net        http://www.cyberglyphs.com/442

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:24:46 -0600
From: "Igor" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Subject: Re: first time out

>From: Ryan Hehn <ryanh@mb.sympatico.ca>
>To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
>Subject: Re: first time out
>Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 6:19 PM
>
>Let's face it, the power ratings are pretty much identical between the 305
and 307.  Not trying to start a >stupid debate here.  Just sometimes I wish
GM had done to US cars what it did to the entire G-body line >in Canada -
Chevy V8s.  That way there wouldn't be as much hostility towards the Chevy
brand.
>
>Ryan

Are you sure.  I am from Canada and have seen lots of Cutlasses with 307s.
There are a few with 305s as well, but lots with 307s, some of which I know
were bought new here.

I think Chevy is good, but WHY on earth would you put an inferior engine in
a car.  What they should have done is put the 307s in all G-bodies, since
they abandoned the 350.  Just kidding.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:18:11 -0600
From: "Igor" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Subject: Re: first time out

The 305 has 5 more HPs at 400RPM above the 307 of the same '81 or so
origin.  BUT, the 305 has less overall torque through the entire powerband,
SO in equally equiped and wheight car, the 307 WILL prevail in stock form.
We are not generalizing that the 307 is tons better then the 305.  In your
case, the Cutlass has two BIG advantages.  IT is a lot lighter then the
Delta (remeber, power to weight ratio) and the 2:73s help a LOT.  Even with
the Deltas 2:41s (if you had them), you should still win couse the Delta is
just plain HEAVY.  BUT, put the 2:73s in the Delta, take out the spare
tire/jack, take out the front passanger and rear seats, run little gas in
the gas tank, you will still be lighter but BEHIND the Delta. (providing
that both engines are in the same shape/tune). Heck, just put the 2:73s and
all else should be okay for Delta.  I put 255/60/15 BFG tires instead of my
old 215/75/15s.  The 255s were shorter, so altering the final drive ratio
to little numerically higher (like runnig 2.50s or so) and I could still
notice a lot of difference off the line.

My uncle had  a Chevy Impala (1981, 305, TH350/2:41 posi).   No options and
a couple hundred pounds lighter.  It was a great engine.  Purred nice and
run like a clock.  My Delta, heavier, 307, TH250/2.41 limited slip) a
little more worn engine, BUT still lots quicker then the Impala.  Why! 307.
 On that note, the 305 Impala was a great car and a great engine.  He sold
it without even telling me he will, otherwise I would have bought it.  No,
the 307 is not a lot better then the 305, but is better.  (not to mention
durability)

To set a record straight, look for a Cutlass with a 307 and 2:73 gears,
race him, then draw your conclusions.
- ----------
From: Ryan Hehn <ryanh@mb.sympatico.ca>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: Re: first time out
Date: Monday, June 08, 1998 6:19 PM

I don't think you guys can generalize that the 307 will always outpower a
305.  These guys with the 305's must've had them in terribe shape.  My 86
Cutlass with 305 (Canadian built) moves quite a bit quicker than by
brother's 81 Delta with 307 (in good shape).  He even admits it.  In fact,
that 305 will often squeal the tires.  It surprises a lot of newer cars.  I
should mention it has 2.73s.

Let's face it, the power ratings are pretty much identical between the 305
and 307.  Not trying to start a stupid debate here.  Just sometimes I wish
GM had done to US cars what it did to the entire G-body line in Canada -
Chevy V8s.  That way there wouldn't be as much hostility towards the Chevy
brand.

Ryan

> I just bought a 84 olds delta 88 with a 307 today I finally took it out I
> love
> this car I had my friend who has a 84 chevy monte carlo with me he runs a
>305
> the delta with the 307 pounds right by his like he was standing still
>other
> than body work and the fact that I can never have enough hp the car is in
> perfect cond

>NEVER doubt the power of the 307.  Besides the fact that the Monte has the
>Chevy engine, the other thing going against it as well are the rear gears.
>The '84 monte should have 2.29s and you should have 2.41s or 2.56s.
>Despite the weight difference, you can take him.  The same thing happend
to
>my friend as well who has a Malibu with the 305/2.29s.  His car is a two
>door, with no options but the 305.  It weighs only aprox. 3100lbs compared
>to the Delta, which is over 3800lbs (mine at least).  With my 307 and good
>exaust  and the 2.41 gears, the Malibu looked like it was standing still
>off the line compared to me, and past 30mph, the Malibu looks like it
>stalled.  My Delta ran pretty good with the 307 though, a whole lot better
>then when I started tweeking with it.  But at the end of the day, a 455 is
>waiting to be droped it.  It just would not go as fast as I wanted it too.

>But since this Delta is my first car (got it when I was sixteen from my
>dad), now, three years later, I have had 3 more cars + my dads, but my
hart
>is still set on the big Delta.  Awsome car.    On another note, my other
>friend has a '76 Cutlass with 2.29s and a 350 in terrible shape.  Still
>though, it is one fast car.  My 307 Delta looked like IT was standing
still
>compare to him.  Oh well, this will soon change.

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1300
*********************************
