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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1345


oldsmobile-digest       Saturday, July 4 1998       Volume 01 : Number 1345



Re: 350 valve seal trouble
Who's Who at Nats
Re:
Rocket
Re: Oxygen sensor
Re: 350 valve seal trouble
Tires
Re: K&N filter top & homemade ramair
Re: Rocket
Re: Head bolt confusion
RE: Timing Tapes (Was Re: Advance Ignition Timing problems)
Re: Tires
Re: Rocket
Re: Head bolt confusion
Re: Tires
Re: Tires
Heading for the boneyards
Re: Tires
Olds for sale
RE: 442 means???  Was: Dumb-*ss
New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Re: Rocket
Re: 442 means this
Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Where is red 442
77 Toro 403
Lightning Rods
Returned mail: User unknown
Nearly Free Parts - Long
Re: 77 Toro 403
RE: 5-speed 442
lowering compression
W-27 question/need steering wheel
442 console.???
RE: W-27 question/need steering wheel
Re: Greg Rollin "4-4-2 by the Numbers" book
Carb and Manifold question
Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Re: Lightning Rods
Classic nameplates Now part of History
alot of olds info
Need help--Sort of OLDS content
Re: Who's Who at Nats
Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Re: alot of olds info
Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Re: Dumb-ass
Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!
Re: Dumb-ass
78 cutlass race car
toro list serve ?
Re: toro list serve ?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 04 Jul 98 02:33:18 PDT
From: "tom helstern" <thelstern@monmouth.com>
Subject: Re: 350 valve seal trouble

I drove a 71  Malibu with the same problem for years without any problems. If
smoke is coming thru the crankcase breather then something is putting pressure
on the crankcase. One possibility is to check your PCV valve which should suck
air from the crankcase. You should be able to feel the suction at the bottom of
the PCV valve.

tom helstern


- ----------
> The 350 in my 72 Cutlass Supreme runs beautiful for having 180K miles, but it
> has blow by smoke coming out the valve
> cover breathers pretty good.  A leak down test on each cylinder surprisingly
> showed all 8 as tight, all within
> specifications.  I take it that my valve seals are bad? Is this a hard item 
to
> replace? I would like to try this myself
> but if it is too much trouble I will just have a shop do it.  Also, will it
> hurt the car to drive it around with those
> seals bad? Thanks
>
> Jason Labay (jlabay@ee.net)   Akron, OH
> 98 Silverado C2500.....Vortec 350, A4, 4.10
> 80 Olds 442 W-30........350, A3, 2.73
> 75 Hurst/Olds W-25.....350, A3, 2.56
> 72 Cutlass Supreme.....drag car project
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 02:49:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.edu>
Subject: Who's Who at Nats

As of 7/2/98 very, very late at night :)

Name            Dates           Hotel           Car(s)
- --------------------------------------------------------
Mark Prince     7/17-7/18       none yet        72 442 W-30
Mark Cornea     7/17-7/18       none yet        70 442 W-30
Bryce Smith     7/14-7/19       Crowne Plaza    none
Chris Casteel   7/17            Comfort Inn     none
Peg O'Connor    7/14-7/19       Holiday Inn     none
Brent Ardo	7/16-7/19	Holiday Inn	72 CS conv.
Chris Smetana	7/15-7/18	Days Inn	69 S W-31
Jim McKeague			Crowne Plaza	70 W-31 &
						70 Rallye 350
Everett Horton	7/14-7/19	Campground	61 Starfire
Kurt & Rose	7/15-7/17	Holiday Inn	90 Trofeo
Leigh Tenenholtz7/15-7/19			68 CS conv.


Drop me a line at peg@grove.ufl.edu with your info and I'll add you to the
list.

Seems that lots of people will be there the 17th.  I don't have the
schedule in front of me -- any chance for a meeting sometime that day at
either one of the host hotels?  Or is that the actual show date?

8)
peg

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 02:53:41 -0000
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re:

I had multiple messages earlier in the week, but the problem stopped after a
day. Didn't have 300 though.

Randy

>I read messages ... delete those I do
>not want ...
>
>And everytime I check my email ...
>the same messages are there ...
>up to 300 per day ...
>
>Anyone else having this duplicated
>message problem.
>
>Ken Swick

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 03:41:53 EDT
From: <OJUNEBUGGO@aol.com>
Subject: Rocket

Why did Oldsmoible decide to call some engines Rockets? How did they get that
name?


$Roger
72 Cutlass

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 04:43:54 +0000
From: krzy4evr@usit.net
Subject: Re: Oxygen sensor

> > And make sure you use antiseize compound on the threads, otherwise you
> > may never get that one out again.  Or you could risk breaking it off,
> > READ:  BAD.
>
> Can't speak for aftermarket, but the GM ones come with a "glass bead"
> anti sieze compound on them.

I just purchased and installed a Bosch O2 sensor and it also comes
with anti-seize on the threads.!!

Mike........................


"If you could explain everything.........
 What be be left to believe in........??

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 07:24:32 -0400
From: "Peter Berusch" <pber710840@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: 350 valve seal trouble

If you have pressurizes smoke under your valve covers, the odds are you have
bad rings.  Bad stem seals will reveal themselves when the engine is started
cold.  If then it smokes from the tail pipe, and the smoke clears within
seconds, then stem seals are indicated.  Another possibility for your
problem could be a clogged crank vent, or lack of vacuum to the pcv.  Peter.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jason P. Labay <jlabay@ee.net>
To: Oldsmobile Mailing List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Thursday, July 02, 1998 9:46 PM
Subject: 350 valve seal trouble


>The 350 in my 72 Cutlass Supreme runs beautiful for having 180K miles, but
it has blow by smoke coming out the valve
>cover breathers pretty good.  A leak down test on each cylinder
surprisingly showed all 8 as tight, all within
>specifications.  I take it that my valve seals are bad? Is this a hard item
to replace? I would like to try this myself
>but if it is too much trouble I will just have a shop do it.  Also, will it
hurt the car to drive it around with those
>seals bad? Thanks
>
>Jason Labay (jlabay@ee.net)   Akron, OH
>98 Silverado C2500.....Vortec 350, A4, 4.10
>80 Olds 442 W-30........350, A3, 2.73
>75 Hurst/Olds W-25.....350, A3, 2.56
>72 Cutlass Supreme.....drag car project
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 04:30:14 PDT
From: "David Popadic" <olds67cutlass@hotmail.com>
Subject: Tires

Help....I'm going nuts.

My problem : The 67 Cutlass convertible I bought has mid to late 70's
Corvette rims (which I didn't care for too much but they grew on me).
The tire size (if I remember correctly) are 255 60 15 (or 16).  My
problem is when I turn (usually right) the tire will rub on the fender
(not bad but annoying).  It usually never did it on the driver's side.
So I "assumed" the springs were bad and they did have helpers in the
springs.  So I had the springs replaced and it seemed to get much
better.  So I decided to test them (BAD IDEA), by taking a, how do I put
this nicely, heavy person with me.  I knew as soon as they got in I was
going to have problems.  So the tires rubbed when I turned worse then
before I had the springs changed.  So I made it a SHORT trip.  Now with
just me in the car it still rubs worse then before the springs were
changed.  Did I break something?  Are the tires just too big?  What do
most of you have on that type of car.  I figured I would try to get just
to smaller front tires but when I went to Goodyear they said they
discontinued those tires and if I wanted them to match I would have to
buy 4 new ones (at $91 a pop).  Is there any relatively cheap way of
fixing this?  I just bought the car and shelled out another $200 for the
springs to be done.  I guess what "might" be ideal is to find someone
who would want to swap tires/rims or just sell the tires/rim and buy
different ones, which would be harder since I don't have the money to go
and buy new ones first!  H E L P ! ! ! !

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 08:49:27 +0100
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: K&N filter top & homemade ramair

Gregory Zimmerman wrote:
>
> I was browsing through a non-olds car magazine (don't ask) and noticed
> in their buyers guide that K&N now has a new lid for 14" aircleaners
> that is actually a huge pleated filter!  Just the top flows 1000cfm.
[snip]
> of filtering through the top of the lid, so now I need to figure how
> and what to use on the bottom to meet up with the hood.
>
> Any ideas?

Yeah, K&N needs to stop stealing my ideas! I should sue for this one! I
had that idea eons ago, just never had the facilities to create a
prototype!

- --
*************
Matt Cremean
mailto:ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
         777777 33333
            77      33
Cutlass    77    3333   Supreme
          77        33
         77     33333
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/
**************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 08:58:03 +0100
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: Rocket

OJUNEBUGGO@aol.com wrote:
>
> Why did Oldsmoible decide to call some engines Rockets? How did they get that
> name?

Actually, from 1949(?) on, all Olds engine were called Rockets. Don't
let that late 70's-early 80's thing of putting Ch*vy motors in Oldses
fool you.

- --
*************
Matt Cremean
mailto:ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
         777777 33333
            77      33
Cutlass    77    3333   Supreme
          77        33
         77     33333
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/
**************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 09:34:44 -0400
From: THOMAS JACQUILLARD <tjacquillard@InfoAve.Net>
Subject: Re: Head bolt confusion

Bob Blanchard wrote:
>
> At 08:45 AM 7/2/98 -0500, you wrote:
> >In trying to put back together what I have torn apart (the 350 engine from
> >my 68 Cutlass S conv), I'm trying to make sense of the head bolt situation.
> >
> >On the passenger side, I have 8 bolts & 2 studs,

I don't know about both, but I have one on the second position from the
front (from the fan) for the AC bracket. This is on the bottom row of
the head, of course.

> >On the drv side, I have 9 bolts & one stud>
The one on the passenger side is for my alternator bracket. I believe
all AC cars have the alt. on the driver's side. It is in the same
position. Second from the front, bottom row.
my car is a '68 cutlass with a '68 Toro 455. Hope this helps.
T.J.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 09:47:58 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: Timing Tapes (Was Re: Advance Ignition Timing problems)

I made my own. Remember you don't need a tape that goes completely around
the balancer. All you need is about 3" worth of tape with 1/2" increments.
Place the tape (masking tape will work great) with  1/2" increments
clockwise, starting from the scribe mark on the balancer. Each 1" will
represent 17.5 deg (assuming the balancer is 20.5"), so each 1/2" will yield
8.75 deg.

No one has gotten back to me, wrt the actual GM size of a '70-'72 350-455
balancer. I measured 20.5".  Your car maybe different. Just measure the
balancers circumference and then use 360 deg divided by that measurement.
That will give you how many degrees each inch (or whatever unit you choose
to measure with) is. For example: my balancer is 20.5", 360/20.5=17.5
deg/inch. You don't need to wrap the entire balancer with tape, just about
3" worth. 3" will give up to 52.5 deg of measurement which is plenty,
considering 30-35 deg of advance is only required.



> -----Original Message-----
> From:	KS7RACING@aol.com [SMTP:KS7RACING@aol.com]
> Sent:	Thursday, July 02, 1998 5:59 PM
> To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject:	Timing Tapes (Was Re: Advance Ignition Timing problems)
>
> Listmembers,
>
> Has anyone found a timing tape that is really accurate?  Once I bought a
> Mr.
> Gasket timing tape for an Olds and it was not accurate, where it should
> have
> went around the balancer and wound up back at 0degress was not close.
>
> If there's a better one out there I could sure use them
>
> TIA,
> Ken Snyder
> Kansas City, Kansas

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 09:45:22 -0400
From: Jim & Jo Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Tires

        On my hot street cars (66 W-30 442, 67 W-30 442) I can run
275/60-15's in the rear with no tire rub whatsoever. I put them on factory
steel (plain wheels) and run the small dog dish caps. The problem your
having is cause by the wrong offset of the wheel (pushing it too far towards
the curb) If you ran a different wheel that tucked the wheel closer to the
frame rails of the car you would not have rubbing problems.

Jim Chermack

At 04:30 AM 7/3/1998 PDT, you wrote:
>Help....I'm going nuts.
>
>My problem : The 67 Cutlass convertible I bought has mid to late 70's
>Corvette rims (which I didn't care for too much but they grew on me).
>The tire size (if I remember correctly) are 255 60 15 (or 16).  My
>problem is when I turn (usually right) the tire will rub on the fender
>(not bad but annoying).  It usually never did it on the driver's side.
>So I "assumed" the springs were bad and they did have helpers in the
>springs.  So I had the springs replaced and it seemed to get much
>better.  So I decided to test them (BAD IDEA), by taking a, how do I put
>this nicely, heavy person with me.  I knew as soon as they got in I was
>going to have problems.  So the tires rubbed when I turned worse then
>before I had the springs changed.  So I made it a SHORT trip.  Now with
>just me in the car it still rubs worse then before the springs were
>changed.  Did I break something?  Are the tires just too big?  What do
>most of you have on that type of car.  I figured I would try to get just
>to smaller front tires but when I went to Goodyear they said they
>discontinued those tires and if I wanted them to match I would have to
>buy 4 new ones (at $91 a pop).  Is there any relatively cheap way of
>fixing this?  I just bought the car and shelled out another $200 for the
>springs to be done.  I guess what "might" be ideal is to find someone
>who would want to swap tires/rims or just sell the tires/rim and buy
>different ones, which would be harder since I don't have the money to go
>and buy new ones first!  H E L P ! ! ! !
>
>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 09:46:42 -0400
From: Jim & Jo Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Rocket

Roger

        The name started in 1949. It was dropped in 1973. After that they
were just Oldsmobile 455 or 350's on the aircleaner.

Jim Chermack

At 03:41 AM 7/3/1998 EDT, you wrote:
>Why did Oldsmoible decide to call some engines Rockets? How did they get that
>name?
>
>
>$Roger
>72 Cutlass
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 09:52:20 -0400
From: Jim & Jo Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Head bolt confusion

        The head bolts on the lower #2 had the studs. On early cars 64-67
they were used for A/C on the pass. side and pwr steering on the drivers
side (alt was in the middle on A/C cars) 68- and later were used for A/C on
the pass side and Alt on the drivers side) pwr steering was on the lower
drivers side head.

Jim Chermack

At 08:45 AM 7/2/98 -0500, you wrote:
In trying to put back together what I have torn apart (the 350 engine from
my 68 Cutlass S conv), I'm trying to make sense of the head bolt situation.

On the passenger side, I have 8 bolts & 2 studs,

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 07:01:27 PDT
From: "David Popadic" <olds67cutlass@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Tires

I guess I forgot to mention that it's the front tires that are rubbing
the back ones are fine.....Any ideas?


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 10:20:17 EDT
From: <COUPEKING@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Tires

Davis-
The Corvette alloys you have are pretty desireable to Chevy guys. But as Jim
Chermac said, your offset is incorrect and the wheel sits out away from the
hub too much.
 Why don't you buy a pair of Olds steel rally wheels, 15X7" and mount your
tires onto them.Then see if the tires rub. I bet they won't.

The corvette alloys are probably worth $200-$250 on the market. Sell 'em and
buy something that will fit.

Using AR Torque-Thrusts 15X7" on the front of my '67 rag with 245-60-15's and
no rubbing.

Peter Sliskovich
Coupeking@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 08:21:02 -0700 (PDT)
From: John M <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Heading for the boneyards

Hi Gang,
      Found a boneyard here in Ga that doesn't stock the NEW stuff
only pre 74--Keep my eyes out for all,hope everybody has a nice holiday.
John




==
mailto:super442@yahoo.com
1985 Cutlass-----T-Tops--307 H.O./3.73 http://www.442.com/mcjunkin.html
1984 Cutlass-----Moonroof--307
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be 403!



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 11:27:14 EDT
From: <HOFFAX181@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Tires

i have an 84 delta 88 royale with z28 rims i'm running 255/60 r15 on back what
can i fit up front

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 08:39:08 -0700
From: Erik Badzinski <erikreb@netbridge.net>
Subject: Olds for sale

Olds for sale in the Oregon autotrader:

1969 OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS SUPREME, 350 V8, 4bbl, automatic
transmission, power steering, power brakes, tilt. $1000 /offer.
503-606-9416 days or eves. Monmouth, Or

1976 OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS, Stage 1, 455 steel forged crank cam, shift kit,
Spicer rearend, new paint, new carpet, bkt seats, flr shift, fast CAR,
needs a little work to be perfect. $1800 or best offer 541-752-2044.
Corvallis, Or

1979 OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS, supreme, low rider, lover, must see, new
CENTURY candy paint w/metal flake, new 14X7 roadsters, new Sony tape
detach, with 10 speakers, new tires, runs xlnt. $2995 or best offer
Pager 529-9287. 503-978-9419. Portland, Or

1979 OLDMOBILE CUTLASS, new top, new brakes & MASTER cylinder, new
battery, 305, V8, tags 2000. $1100 or best offer 503-657-4971 after 11am
please. Milwaukie, Or

1969 OLDSMOBILE CUTLASS, xlnt mech condition, needs small amount of
work in front, have grill and all chrome plus matching spare tire, pull
out stereo & amp included. $2500 or best offer 503-639-2817. Lake
Oswego, Or

Please call them directly if interested.

Erik Badzinski,
'72 Cutlass "S"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 00:11:44 -0400
From: "P. Coscarelli" <squaleferd@voyager.net>
Subject: RE: 442 means???  Was: Dumb-*ss

and also it depends on the year. when the automatic was introduced, they had to
change it.

On Thursday, July 02, 1998 10:13 PM, Oldsmagnet [SMTP:buehner@lyrea.com] wrote:
> > I've always had the question of how come 442 stands for 400 ci.  4 brl.
dual > > exhaust, but yet the come w/all different size engines 260, 307 400,
403, > > 455.....who knows what else.......???? > > How about 4 speed 4 bbl
dual exhaust.  That's the generally accepted meaning. > They've strayed from
that once or twice, but for the most part it's coverred. > > Oh, the other one
was 4 cylinder, 4 valves/cylinder, and 2 seconds slower than > the real 442!!! 
>
 > JUST KIDDING!!!!!!  Just checking your pulse, seeing if anyone's awake out
there > ;)  (No flames on that thread again, OK?) > > -- > Oldsmagnet -
Charley Buehner @ Sidney Montana |\      |-------| > mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
To mail direct to me |/\|=|  |   |   | > http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner See my
homepage |\ |=|  |   |   | >    \ | / =========================== \ | /
|<||=|  |   |   | >     \|/  List Removal and Guidelines  \|/     |/ |=|  |  / 
\
| >      V   ===========================   V      |\/|=|  | / | \ | >
http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner/listfaq.htm   |/      |___|___|

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 11:51:38 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

I had an Olds 455 rebuilt with Mondello parts It was dynoed and made 440 HP
and 540 LBS of torque.  While on the dyno it had a stock Pep Boys starter
and the motor had a hard time turning over. It would crank with a "rooor,
(1/2 second pause) rooor" and then fire up. When running for awhile and
then we would shut it down it would not even start.
 It has nothing to do with initial timing cause it does it with the
distributor disconnected. The clearances on the motor were triple checked,
so the motor can't be "too tight". It would have seized anyway on the dyno
if it was. The motor was run for over an hour on 2 seperate days with
6000RPM loads.
 Well I put it in my 72 442 convert. and the same dang problem is
happening. New battery(checked) and still has a hard time cranking.
 I have headers and a stock starter. What do I have to do? Get a
high-torque mini-starter? What could the problem be?? Who selld those
starters?? HELP HELP !!! $5,000.00 motor!!

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 12:57:35 EDT
From: <Dons5043@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Rocket

Roger wrote:

>Why did Oldsmobile decide to call some engines Rockets? How did they get that
>name?

It was in the years 1947 to 49 that this engine was taken from the drawing
board to production. The motor was to be called "The Kettering" after Charles
Kettering, the engineer who finally put this motor together. This however
followed many inputs from engineers such as Gilbert Burrell, chief draftsman,
Jack Wolfram, chief engineer and Gibson Butler, senior layout man. Some of the
first to be produced even had "Kettering" on the rocker boxes.

GM's policy was at that time not to name products after living beings, so Jack
Wolfram came up with the name "Rocket". This being the time of missiles, Von
Braun, V2's and all of that.

See pages, 217 thru 239 of "Setting the Pace" for the full story.

Tony.
'79 Toro'
'56 88

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 10:00:46 -0700
From: "mr. coy d. arbogast" <coyster@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: 442 means this

4 speed 4 bbl and dual exhaust

- ----------
> From: P. Coscarelli <squaleferd@voyager.net>
> To: 'oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca'
> Subject: RE: 442 means???  Was: Dumb-*ss
> Date: Thursday, July 02, 1998 9:11 PM
>
> and also it depends on the year. when the automatic was introduced, they
had to change it.
>
> On Thursday, July 02, 1998 10:13 PM, Oldsmagnet [SMTP:buehner@lyrea.com]
wrote:
> > > I've always had the question of how come 442 stands for 400 ci.  4
brl.  dual
> > > exhaust, but yet the come w/all different size engines 260, 307 400,
403,
> > > 455.....who knows what else.......????
> >
> > How about 4 speed 4 bbl dual exhaust.  That's the generally accepted
meaning.
> > They've strayed from that once or twice, but for the most part it's
coverred.
> >
> > Oh, the other one was 4 cylinder, 4 valves/cylinder, and 2 seconds
slower than
> > the real 442!!!
> >
> > JUST KIDDING!!!!!!  Just checking your pulse, seeing if anyone's awake
out there
> > ;)  (No flames on that thread again, OK?)
> >
> > --
> > Oldsmagnet - Charley Buehner @ Sidney Montana |\      |-------|
> > mailto:buehner@lyrea.com To mail direct to me |/\|=|  |   |   |
> > http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner See my homepage |\ |=|  |   |   |
> >    \ | / =========================== \ | /    |<||=|  |   |   |
> >     \|/  List Removal and Guidelines  \|/     |/ |=|  |  / \  |
> >      V   ===========================   V      |\/|=|  | / | \ |
> >   http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner/listfaq.htm   |/      |___|___|

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 13:27:36 -0400
From: "B. Vosburgh" <bob442@svic.net>
Subject: Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

I had the same problem, instaled after market mini starter { Tilton} no
problems yet and battery is in trunk.  Butch 68 442  post

Peter Landowski wrote:

> I had an Olds 455 rebuilt with Mondello parts It was dynoed and made 440 HP
> and 540 LBS of torque.  While on the dyno it had a stock Pep Boys starter
> and the motor had a hard time turning over. It would crank with a "rooor,
> (1/2 second pause) rooor" and then fire up. When running for awhile and
> then we would shut it down it would not even start.
>  It has nothing to do with initial timing cause it does it with the
> distributor disconnected. The clearances on the motor were triple checked,
> so the motor can't be "too tight". It would have seized anyway on the dyno
> if it was. The motor was run for over an hour on 2 seperate days with
> 6000RPM loads.
>  Well I put it in my 72 442 convert. and the same dang problem is
> happening. New battery(checked) and still has a hard time cranking.
>  I have headers and a stock starter. What do I have to do? Get a
> high-torque mini-starter? What could the problem be?? Who selld those
> starters?? HELP HELP !!! $5,000.00 motor!!

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 12:34:33 -0500
From: Bill Bussell <photographer@trader.com>
Subject: Where is red 442

Dear Olds Enthusiasts,

I wish I had found this list sooner.  I am curious if anyone on the list
knows of a particular 68 Oldsmobile 442 that I sold several years ago.
This car was ordered from the factory by my dad and myself, and had what
I would guess to be some unusual features.  It had an on-column shift
lever and a bench seat.  It also featured electric windows, cruise and
power antenna.  It had a 400 cu engine.  It was all original as it sat
in my Speedway Indiana driveway awaiting restoration.  With urging from
my wife, and being a bit depressed, I sold it for practically nothing. I
still have 3 of the 4 original wire wheel covers.  Anyone need three
wheel covers?  I am toying with the idea of driving to the National at
Springfield in my 87 Crusier.

Thanks...

Bill Bussell
Speedway, Indiana

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 14:35:34 -0400
From: "Jason P. Labay" <jlabay@ee.net>
Subject: 77 Toro 403

First off, thanks to those who gave me advice on my valve seal problem. In our
salvageyard I discovered what I think is a 77 Toro (could be 78, didn't check
close)..car is huge.  Under the hood I noticed it has a 403. Are the Toro 403's
from that year a good basis for a performance rebuild? I thought I heard that
those were the same 403's that went in the TA's of that area, but didn't the
Toro have more HP? Just curious as this is a fairly low mile motor for its age
(70,000) and it looks fairly clean. I figure a basic rebuild with a few high
performance parts should yield a 350 hp 403?

Jason Labay (jlabay@ee.net)   Akron, OH
98 Silverado C2500.....Vortec 350, A4, 4.10
80 Olds 442 W-30........350, A3, 2.73
75 Hurst/Olds W-25.....350, A3, 2.56
72 Cutlass Supreme.....drag car project

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 14:35:38 -0400
From: "Angel Castrodad" <angleki@prtc.net>
Subject: Lightning Rods

    I have a question for those of you running Hurst Lightning Rod shifters.
What tranny are this shifters used for? I ask this because I have been
pondering getting them for my '86 442. I'm currently running a TH-350 (not
my fault, previous owner). Will the shfter fit my console or even be
compatible with my tranny? How hard are they to install?

TIA,

Angel Castrodad
angleki@prtc.net
'86 442------> 307 (5A), TH-350, 3.73 gears

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 14:29:01 -0400 (EDT)
From: MAILER-DAEMON@merge1.mergetel.com (Mail Delivery Subsystem)
Subject: Returned mail: User unknown

The original message was received at Fri Jul  3 14:29:00 EDT 1998
from  oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

- ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors -----
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<003701bda6b1$65df5800$2658bed1@default> From: "Jason P. Labay" 
<jlabay@ee.net>
To: "Oldsmobile Mailing List" <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca> Subject: 77 Toro 403
Date: 	Fri, 3 Jul 1998 14:35:34 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type:
text/plain; 	charset="koi8-r" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 
X-Priority: 3
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Reply-To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca X-SpamBouncer: 1.00h (5/20/98) X-SBRule:
Small Fry X-SBRule: Pass-No Pattern Matching

First off, thanks to those who gave me advice on my valve seal problem. In our
salvageyard I discovered what I think is a 77 Toro (could be 78, didn't check
close)..car is huge.  Under the hood I noticed it has a 403. Are the Toro 403's
from that year a good basis for a performance rebuild? I thought I heard that
those were the same 403's that went in the TA's of that area, but didn't the
Toro have more HP? Just curious as this is a fairly low mile motor for its age
(70,000) and it looks fairly clean. I figure a basic rebuild with a few high
performance parts should yield a 350 hp 403?

Jason Labay (jlabay@ee.net)   Akron, OH
98 Silverado C2500.....Vortec 350, A4, 4.10
80 Olds 442 W-30........350, A3, 2.73
75 Hurst/Olds W-25.....350, A3, 2.56
72 Cutlass Supreme.....drag car project

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 15:03:23 -0400
From: "Thomas G. Stoner" <tgstoner@umich.edu>
Subject: Nearly Free Parts - Long

NEARLY FREE CAR PARTS - You pay the shipping costs plus $1.00 or come
pick them up from my house in Ann Arbor, and you can have any or all of
the following items for no additional cost.  Contact me privately, if
you€re interested in any of this.  I can send you a digital photograph
of any item as an E-Mail attachment, if you give me a few days to borrow
the camera from work.  NOS = the usual €new, old stock².  NOS/IB = €new,
old stock - in original box².  Gr = GM Parts Group Number.  PN = Part
Number.  NL = Not listed in my 1975 Oldsmobile Parts Manual.  Any of
this stuff which is still around here in about six weeks, will be sent
to the recycle center.

Diecast clip on-type center cap for an Oldsmobile Super Stock wheel.
Found by the side of the road.  Not dinged up or corroded too badly and
better than nothing, if you need one.

1950€s vintage Sun Dwell-Tach Tester.  6 volt / 12 volt.  4-6-8
cylinder.  This uses two D-cell batteries and has quite a bit of
corrosion damage from some batteries which leaked in it in the past.
Diecast metal and hard rubber case.  Is it restorable?

NOS/IB soft plastic fender filler.  Gr 7.831.  PN 414219.  NL.

NOS/IB Bumper Insert.  Gr 7.828.  PN 410129.  NL.

NOS Floor Shift Seal (at floor pan) for 1964 and 1965 (first-type) F-85
with manual transmission, except with console.  Apparently does not
include 442, as there is a different part number listed for them.  Gr
4.015.  PN 384431.  I have two.

NOS Front Fender Filler Baffle.  Gr 8.153. PN 369923.  NL.

NOS, but very dirty black plastic coolant overflow reservoir.  Number
391973-M moulded into one side.  PN NL.

1978, 79, or 80 Cutlass dash trim panel for center airconditioning vents
and rear defogger switch.  Without clock.  New car takeout?

1978, 79, or 80 Cutlass dash trim panel for center airconditioning vents
and clock.  Without rear defogger switch.  New car takeout?

NOS/IB Heater Control Assembly for 1973 to 1975 Omega, excpet with
airconditioning.  Gr 8.849.  PN 6273371.

NOS/IB Door Hinge.  No GM PN, but box hand marked €73 Omega².

1979 Chevrolet Service Manual Set.  4 manuals.  Service Manual for
Camaro, Malibu, Monte Carlo, and Nova; C-4 System and 200C Transmission
Supplement; Electrical Troubleshooting Manual for Malibu, Monte Carlo,
and ElCamino; Wiring Diagram Manual for all Chevrolet Passenger Cars.

Approximately 50 pounds of assorted 1960€s and 1970€s Kent-Moore and
Bouroughs GM Essential Tools.

NOS/IB Exhaust Pipe Hanger.  Gr 3.708.  PN 357220.  NL.

NOS Rear Anti-Sway Bar for 1978 - 1980 Cutlass.  7/8 inch diameter.  Gr
7.241.  PN 10000095.  NL.

NOS Front Bumper Rub Strip for 1973 Cutlass and Cutlass S with VE5
option.  PN 412155.

Air Lift Polyair rear coil spring airbags.  Complete used kit, with
single fill valve.  Air lines were cut at the airbags when removed from
a 1979 ElCamino.  These should fit most years of Cutlass.

Dashboard trim for instrument panel and lefthand airconditioning vents
on a mid-70€s 98.  PN 554483, NL.  New car take-offs, in very good
condition.  I have two.

Used Rochester Quadrajet carb.  Production Number 7043251.  Pre-smog,
unsealed adjustments and with apparently good fuel inlet threads.

RH V-8 Exhaust Manifold.  PN 389268 RH cast into it.  Used, and I don€t
see any cracks or other damage to it.

NOS/IB Idler Arm Stop Package for all 1973 A-Body (Cutlass) cars.  Gr
6.896.  PN 231640.

Used medium grey rubber front floor mats.  LH mat has a hole for a floor
dimmer switch and the RH mat has a 2-1/2 inch €chicken track² Rocket
emblem moulded in.  Based on the size, I€d guess there were from a B. C.
or E-Body car.  Good condition.

NOS Drive Shaft for 1954 or 1955 Super 88 and 98, with standard
transmission.  PN 5667608 (?).

NOS/IB Drive Shaft.  May be PN 279683, NL.

NOS RH Exhaust Pipe for 1967 with 425 and 1968 - 1970 with 455, except
98 and Toronado.  Unmarked, but should be PN 394591.

NOS LH Exhaust Pipe for 1965 to 1967 442.  Unmarked, but should be PN
389465.

NOS LH Exhaust Pipe for 1966 with 425, except 98 and Toronado.
Unmarked, but should be PN 392313.

NOS Exhaust Crossover Pipe for 1962 and 1963 F-85 with manual
transmission and 2 barrel carb engine.  PN 578279.

NOS Exhaust Pipe.  Believed to be PN 390961, NL.

NOS/IB Oldsmobile Dark Pewter Rear Floor Mats.

Send private E-Mail concerning these items to me at tgstoner@umich.edu.
Or you can call me in Ann Arbor at (734) 663-3232.  Thank you.

          ===
+======= | | | =======================+
|        | | |   Tom Stoner           |
|        |/|\|   OCA #3943            |
|        | | |   Ann Arbor, Michigan  |
|         ===    tgstoner@umich.edu   |
+=====================================+

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 15:07:37 EDT
From: <MNManiac@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 77 Toro 403

In a message dated 98-07-03 14:35:06 EDT, you write:

> First off, thanks to those who gave me advice on my valve seal problem. In
> our salvageyard I discovered what I think is
>  a 77 Toro (could be 78, didn't check close)..car is huge.  Under the hood I
> noticed it has a 403. Are the Toro 403's

Yes.  All of the 77s and 78s are 403s.  (And you need it to pull that
incredible hulk!)

- -Drew in Windy Western Kansas-

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 15:46:39 -0400
From: "Thomas G. Stoner" <tgstoner@umich.edu>
Subject: RE: 5-speed 442

On Thu, 02 Jul 1998 Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com> wrote:

> I was at a local cruise-in last night checking out the rides (I love
> watching the confused look of people who look into my H/O and see
> Lightning Rods for the first time :-), and in addition to a beautiful
old
> Starfire, there was a '78 442 with a factory 5-speed and a 260 V8.  It
was
> the butt-ugly 2-door hatchback version too.
>
> Weird...  I guess back then the 5-speeds weren't strong enough to hold
up
> behind anything bigger than a 260?

*************
Wow, where was this at?  Those cars are very rare, particularly with the
5-speed transmission.  I've always wanted one of those slantback
(despite the appearance, they're not hatchbacks you know) '78 or '79
442s.  I saw a new-looking black and gold one over in Ontario just last
week that almost caused me to drive off the road.  I would have turned
around and followed it, except that my wife was with me and wouldn't
have put up with such foolishness.  The closest I've come to having one
so far, was the '79 Buick Century Turbo Coupe which I owned.  That car
had the same slantback body, with a bolt-on rear spoiler much like the
early Z-28s had.  Lots of other trick parts from the factory too.  I
understand that there were only about 500 Turbo Coupes built, which made
it even rarer than those 442s.  To each his own, eh?

By the way Tom, you're right.  That early 5-speed transmission wasn't
able to handle the torque from anything larger than the 260 engine.  At
least this meant that that particular 442 had an Oldsmobile engine under
the hood.  I think that some of the ones with an automatic transmission
were equipped with 305 Chevy engines.  Now that's ugly.  I think that
same 260 / 5-speed drivetrain was also available in the 1976 and 1977
442, which was quite a bit heavier car.  I don't know for certain, but
it seems that the transmission would have held up less well in them.
Anyone out there have any experience with a stock rear wheel drive 5
speed 442?

          ===
+======= | | | =======================+
|        | | |   Tom Stoner           |
|        |/|\|   OCA #3943            |
|        | | |   Ann Arbor, Michigan  |
|         ===    tgstoner@umich.edu   |
+=====================================+

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 14:57:05 -0700
From: Steve Meyer <smeyer@provide.net>
Subject: lowering compression

Need some help.
I have a 62 olds 394 10.25 compression engine.  I would like to drive it
on a daily basis using unleaded gasoline - 92 or 93 octane.  What do I
have to do to the engine to allow it. Double the head gasket?  I can use
an additive for the lead substitute, but would prefer not to have to use
octane boost because of cost.

Thanks,
Steve Meyer  smeyer@provide.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 13:30:16 -0700 (PDT)
From: John M <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: W-27 question/need steering wheel

Hello gang,
        Does anyone out there know if a W-27 Rear cover will fit on a
late 8.5 rear end?
        Also anyone have any sport steering wheels they are willing to
part with?Doesn't have to be a 442 wheel,just looking for something to
replace this ugly thing I've got on my 84.Thanks
                            John




==
mailto:super442@yahoo.com
1985 Cutlass-----T-Tops--307 H.O./3.73 http://www.442.com/mcjunkin.html
1984 Cutlass-----Moonroof--307
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be 403!



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 16:32:10 +0000
From: krzy4evr@usit.net
Subject: 442 console.???

Anybody out there got or know of an '86 442 someone might be parting
out? I am in need of some console parts. Arm rest cover is broken and
so is ash tray lid. Will these parts interchange with those from
Montes or Skylarks???

Mike.......




"If you could explain everything.........
 What be be left to believe in........??

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 16:48:55 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: W-27 question/need steering wheel

They make W-27 covers for both 12 & 10 bolt rear diff's. I have one on my
'72 442 and it's a 8.5 10-bolt. Around $100 .

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	John M [SMTP:super442@yahoo.com]
> Sent:	Friday, July 03, 1998 4:30 PM
> To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject:	W-27 question/need steering wheel
>
> Hello gang,
>         Does anyone out there know if a W-27 Rear cover will fit on a
> late 8.5 rear end?
>         Also anyone have any sport steering wheels they are willing to
> part with?Doesn't have to be a 442 wheel,just looking for something to
> replace this ugly thing I've got on my 84.Thanks
>                             John
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 15:25:16 -0700
From: Greg Rollin <supercars@transport.com>
Subject: Re: Greg Rollin "4-4-2 by the Numbers" book

Brad Otto wrote:

> Hi Greg,
> You may already be aware of this, but there are a couple of errors regarding
> date coding of parts in the current "4-4-2 by the Numbers" book.  I found
> that the date coding information regarding Transmissions and Rear Axles in
> my 1970 Assembly Manual (Section 0, Page 22) differ from the ones published
> in your book.  The "month" codes in the Assembly manual are different than
> the ones in your book.
>
> It would also be great if you could add info regarding the use of the Julian
> date code on castings and information regarding the model year production
> schedule (Mid-July to the end of June, I think).
>
> I noticed on the Olds E-mail list that you are planning to release an
> updated "4-4-2 by the Numbers" soon, and I thought this might help. I look
> forward to its release.
>
> Hope I'm not asking for too much !
>
> Thanks,
> Brad
> Brad Otto
> '69 442 Convertible, 4 Speed
> '70 442 W-30 Hardtop

 Brad,
 In our book "4-4-2 By The Numbers" we used a variety of sources for the
information. Some examples include:  Chassis manuals, Fisher body manuals, GM
parts books, Oldsmobile Service Guild technical bulletins, Delco parts books,
Demmer Tool H/O conversion bulletins, etc., etc., etc.  Often, we found there
would be conflicting information contained within these factory manuals.  So in
order to be as accurate as possible, we confirmed the numbers with actual cars.
Several years and literally hundreds of Cutlass', 4-4-2's and Hurst/Olds'
later, we printed what we felt were (and are) the correct codes.  Although we
did overlook a few codes that should have been in there and did discover an
error or two.  These will be addressed in the re-release.  However, we stand
behind the date codes as listed in the book.  The differential date codes are 
as
you will find them listed in the chassis manual.  Again, these were confirmed 
by
MANY cars.
  As another example of  conflicting information, we were going print the 
codes
for starters and alternators in the book.  However, we found virtually every
Olds/GM book contained conflicting numbers!  Considering both of these
components stand a very high chance of being replaced over the years, 
confirming
the numbers from cars would be all for naught, so we elected not to include any
numbers in the book regarding starters or alternators.
  Additionally, our intent with the book was to be a small size so it could be
taken to swap meets, wrecking yards, etc.  So the chances are we would have 
left
out the starter and alternator codes even if we could have confirmed them.  In
fact as we were editing the book, we opted to leave out many items that were
confirmed for the sake of keeping the book at its smaller size.
  We are planning on (as you suggest) including the Julian codes for dates on
blocks, heads and intakes in the next printing.  As we do get asked this
question from time to time, and it won't take up too much room to list.
  However, we have no plans to list the production dates of the exact span of
each model year.  This would require a fair amount of space to list each
specific plant and the exact date for which production began and ended there.
Plus, I can't say that has been a question asked often enough to warrant
including it in the book.  Besides, I have no idea of where to even find
accurate exact dates each plant's work schedule  (i.e.: On February 4th 1965,
the Baltimore, MD  plant was shut down due to conveyer belt problems.  Or the
UAW strike in 1970 lasted from X date to X date).  Additionally, I just don't
feel this would be relevant enough to warrant the space it would take to list.

Look for the re-release of 4-4-2 By The Numbers sometime this fall.

I hope the book has been helpful for you.  Thanks for your thoughts and
input.

Sincerely,
Greg Rollin
Supercars Unlimited (Where Cutlass/4-4-2 is ALL we do!) 503-244-8249
http://www.supercarsunlimited.com
E-mail: supercars@transport.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 15:48:27 -0700
From: Erik Badzinski <erikreb@netbridge.net>
Subject: Carb and Manifold question

Dear all,

I'm planning to put a new Edelbrock Performer intake manifold on my '72
Cutlass 'S'.  They have two kinds, EGR and NON-EGR.  The 350 originally
had EGR on it, but it is now blocked off.  Do I have to get the EGR
model and block it off or can I just get the NON-EGR version?

I also plan to use the Edelbrock 600 cfm squarebore carb with electric
choke.  In the summit catalog, I didnt see any accelerator hookup kits.
Can I just use the same accelerator wire that is on my Holley carb right
now, or do I have to purchase a new one?

Last question:  On the electric choke wiring, I can hook it up to the
alternator wiring correct?  I know there was just several posts about
this, but my hard drive crashed and I lost all my messages.

Thanks everyone,

Erik Badzinski,
'72 Cutlass 'S'

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 15:49:01 -0700
From: Greg Rollin <supercars@transport.com>
Subject: Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

Peter Landowski wrote:

> .............. Well I put it in my 72 442 convert. and the same dang problem
> is
> happening. New battery(checked) and still has a hard time cranking.
>  I have headers and a stock starter. What do I have to do? Get a
> high-torque mini-starter? What could the problem be?? Who selld those
> starters?? HELP HELP !!! $5,000.00 motor!!


Peter,
This situation is not that uncommon with modified big blocks.  And we do offer
a cure.  We have a gear reduction type starter (Our design and made to our
specs) that will eliminate the hard start condition.  It will fit with all oil
pans (except some marine) and all brands of  headers or even stock exhaust
manifolds.  We tried many so called high perf  Delco starters as well as many
of the mini starters available for Oldsmobiles.  None of them performed as well
as ours does and several would have required pan and/or header modifications to
make fit.  (With #3101 Hookers on our 67 4-4-2 Super/Pro car, the starter can
be removed and installed without even loosening the headers).  Price is
$299.95.  I realize that may seem a bit much for a starter, but to me it's
worth it sitting in the staging lanes without having to worry about whether or
not the car will start!
- --
Greg Rollin
Supercars Unlimited (Where Cutlass/4-4-2 is ALL we do!) 503-244-8249
http://www.supercarsunlimited.com
E-mail: supercars@transport.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 17:06:38 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: Lightning Rods

They're for the 200-4R.  I'll bet you could get it to work with the TH-350, but
the right rod would be useless.

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 20:45:37 EDT
From: <BradRoss79@aol.com>
Subject: Classic nameplates Now part of History

Well, now that the Eighty Eight and Ninety Eight nameplates are both gone, It
seems like something will be missing from the Oldsmobile new car lineup.
I am sad to see them both go, even though the Ninety Eight has been gone for a
while now.  These are classic nameplates, both with long production runs.
I guess we will just have to add the 88 to the history books along with the
others, and either drive one every day, or buy a new Intrigue or Aurora or
something.

Brad Ross
71 Delta Custom
71 Delta Royale
79 Ninety Eight Regency

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 17:50:38 PDT
From: "Ryan D" <riviera72sss@hotmail.com>
Subject: alot of olds info

hey gang, just fond this page of olds (and ch*vy ,pont$ac,puick)
info (well ,stuff i did not know )that you mite like.

Thanks
      Ryan



          http://www.en.com/users/thall/olds/ofeng.htm

  My  -------   -------
            /  |
           /   |
          /     ------
         /            |
        /             |
       /        ------    DELTA 88
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 18:02:28 -0700 (PDT)
From: John M <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Need help--Sort of OLDS content

Hi gang,
       This is sort of OLDS related,most everyone on the list has some
really nice webpages(hint hint CHARLEY MIKE JASON),Can anyone give
some pointers on what software,etc. is needed?We need to have at least
ONE more OLDS site to visit don't we?
        Thanks in advance,
                         John



==
mailto:super442@yahoo.com
1985 Cutlass-----T-Tops--307 H.O./3.73 http://www.442.com/mcjunkin.html
1984 Cutlass-----Moonroof--307
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be 403!



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 21:07:00 EDT
From: <OldsGuyGA@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Who's Who at Nats

hay peg,jeff dixie olds club (pres)  i'll be there wed thu fri..several
hotels..
know everett horton...any leads fender and door 67 delta 2dr..

maybe we can meet somehow at the nat'l   jeff..

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 21:31:02 EDT
From: <KarlAune@aol.com>
Subject: Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

In a message dated 98-07-03 12:50:49 EDT, you write:

<< I had an Olds 455 rebuilt with Mondello parts It was dynoed and made 440 HP
 and 540 LBS of torque.  While on the dyno it had a stock Pep Boys starter
 and the motor had a hard time turning over. >>

It is my understanding (and please correct if this is totally wrong [Mr. Witt
will tell you that this has in fact happened]), that this is not uncommon for
brand-new engines and some rebuilds with very tight tolerances.

Did your rebuild include honing cylinders and new, overbore pistons...et
cetetera?

If so, your starter (is your starter the Pep Boys starter?) has to turn a
reciprocating assembly that is much more of a load at startup than before the
rebuild, due to the tighter fit of everything.

I think that the engine wear during the first few days of operation will
smooth out the piston/cylinder surfaces to where load at startup will be less.

Something like this was the case when my brother put a new engine (from the
block on out) in his 1968 Camel.

Did not want to start and would run. He said he was running it for short
periods to "break it in."

Just another offhand hallucination from

KA
&SOM

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 21:45:21 +0000
From: krzy4evr@usit.net
Subject: Re: alot of olds info

> From:          "Ryan D" <riviera72sss@hotmail.com>
> To:            oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject:       alot of olds info
> Date:          Fri, 03 Jul 1998 17:50:38 PDT
> Reply-to:      oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

>
>
> hey gang, just fond this page of olds (and ch*vy ,pont$ac,puick)
> info (well ,stuff i did not know )that you mite like.
>
> Thanks
>       Ryan
>
>
>
>    http://www.en.com/users/thall/olds/ofeng.htm
>
>   My  -------   -------
>             /  |
>            /   |
>           /     ------
>          /            |
>         /             |
>        /        ------    DELTA 88
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





>
>
"If you could explain everything.........
 What be be left to believe in........??

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 21:46:31 -0400
From: "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
Subject: Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

> << I had an Olds 455 rebuilt with Mondello parts It was dynoed and made 440 
HP
>  and 540 LBS of torque.  While on the dyno it had a stock Pep Boys starter
>  and the motor had a hard time turning over. >>
>
> It is my understanding (and please correct if this is totally wrong [Mr. Witt
> will tell you that this has in fact happened]), that this is not uncommon for
> brand-new engines and some rebuilds with very tight tolerances.

Karl Aune is correct on all accounts.

Not to mention that your compression ratios were restored, stiffer
resistance from new valve springs, tighter clearances, and basically
rougher cylinder walls, hence tighter, grabbier rings.

MORE friction and resistance means MORE power needed to turn it over.
Shouldn't worry though.  After a few weeks during break in, you'll
notice that the engine will start turning over smoother.  It's really
amazing to see a new engine shut down however.  Sorta just "locks" when
the key is shut off.  As long as all the clearances are correct, and
everything is working properly, you can expect another 100K + out of the
engine.  Treat IT right, and it will treat YOU right.
2 cents,
Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 21:54:23 EDT
From: <GT5726@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Dumb-ass

442 originally stood for 400,4barrel, duel exhaust,...but that lasted only for
the first two years...64&65...It was supossedly changed to
signify...4-speed,4barrel,duel exhausts...:)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 22:21:49 EDT
From: <KarlAune@aol.com>
Subject: Re: New Olds 455 has hard time turning over! HELP!!

Hi!

Howya doin?

<< Not to mention that your compression ratios were restored, stiffer
 resistance from new valve springs, tighter clearances, and basically
 rougher cylinder walls, hence tighter, grabbier rings.   >>

I was right?

Cool.

BTW:
(A trivial point really)

Not seally significant, but an overbore results in a *higher* compression
ratio than stock.

This according to the FAQ, as submitted by Chris Wit, who provided sample
math.

Amazing the things I learn when I finally break down and read the FAQ!

K

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 22:28:11 -0400
From: "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
Subject: Re: Dumb-ass

GT5726@AOL.COM wrote:
>
> 442 originally stood for 400,4barrel, duel exhaust,...but that lasted only 
for
> the first two years...64&65...It was supossedly changed to
> signify...4-speed,4barrel,duel exhausts...:)

Uh, that was the other way around.  The 64 442 came standard with a 330
c.i.d., then the standard was upped to 400 in '65-'69 (two versions),
then 455 for '70/'71, then standard 350 in later years, all the way down
to 260 in '78.  Olds advertised the 442 as 4 barrel, 4 speed and dual
exhausts ONLY for 64 as I recall.  Never again however.  Since the 65's
could be had with an automatic, they THEN changed it to 400 cubes,
4-barrel, and dual exhausts.  At least the 442s ALL had V8s, however
sometimes underpowered.  Comforting thought anyway.  Much to the chagrin
of Quad442 lovers, I do not, and cannot, consider the FWD Quad442 as a
"442" since the designator was changed.  Not that the Quad442 isn't
capable of holding it's own, and they are great performers, but I'm a
purist, and if they hadn't used the "QUAD" in front of the designator,
only then could I consider it.  As far as I'm concerned, the 442 took a
dirt nap after the 87 model year.

I have an ORIGINAL July of 64 Hot Rod magazine with the first 442 ad in
it.  It was a 4-door police cruiser, where they advertised 4-barrel,
4-speed, and 2-exhausts.  "The police needed it, Olds built it, pursuit
proved it..."  Option code B09.  Available on all F-85 body styles
except station wagons in '64.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 23:13:12 -0400
From: Ken <olds442@en.com>
Subject: 78 cutlass race car

I went ahead and bought the car.  Now that it's home it looks like its in even
beytter shape than I thought. Afew problems though.
 1) the rear bumper was ripped off when the car was pushed off the trailer.
Forgot to tell my friend to apply light pressure to the peddle so the car
doesn't take off with the steep ramps.  The bumper shock was already pushed in
on the side that broke off.  I see 2 options here, new bumper shocks if they 
are
still avalible or fiberglass rear bumper.  Anyone know whats out there?
 2) the poor misguided fellow I bought the car from had a little block chevy in
it. There must be a dozen holes drilled in each side of the crossmember where
the frame mounts go.  Would my best bet be to go to a gm dealership for the
correct frame mounts and to find a diagram to figure out which holes to use?  I
hate to open the dread g-body big block question up again...  Any ideas would 
be
apreciated.

Ken

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 3 Jul 1998 23:48:58 EDT
From: <Surmise@aol.com>
Subject: toro list serve ?

Does anyone know of a list serve for toro's

John Stowe
Surmise@aol.com
67 442

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 03 Jul 1998 23:21:45 -0700
From: Greg Kalkhoff <gkalkhof@mail.execpc.com>
Subject: Re: toro list serve ?

Surmise@aol.com wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of a list serve for toro's
>
> John Stowe
> Surmise@aol.com
> 67 442

John,

Go to http://www.toronado.org and click on Toro List FAQ. Then click on 'List'
in the Wonderbar icon row at the bottom right. Follow directions. I think we
have about 75-125, depending, subscr*bed to the majordummy Toro server.

Welcome aboard!

Sparky

- --
Greg "Sparky" Kalkhoff                               See the Sparkmobile
Toronado Chapter Webmaster                     
http://www.442.com/kalkhoff.html
Toronado FAQ Page Administrator
http://www.Toronado.org

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1345
*********************************
