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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1485


oldsmobile-digest     Tuesday, September 15 1998     Volume 01 : Number 1485



Re: alternator or Battery
Olds nut?? was: "Daily Driver"...Early Toro Expert ...
car prob?? was Re: Kane County, IL show & swap & car prob??
Hey JL and other Ch*tty-guys!
1960 Dynamic 88 was: 1961 Dynamic 88
Re: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)
RE:  3800 Performance Mods (long)
RE: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)
Re: 360HP 455
RE: Car/Parts 4 sale
Re: 455 w/a 2.29:1 gear ratio?
Re: 360HP 455
Re: RE: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)
=?iso-8859-1?Q?Aurora_360=B0_interior?=
Re: Car/Parts 4 sale
Re: Toro rust/paint question
=?iso-8859-1?Q?For_more_360=B0_interiors....?=
Re: Fw: ENGINE OFFSET IN 71 SUPREME
Re: looking for Mr Stoner
Preliminary results of consultation; 455 Aeroplane
Re: Old broken and rusted parts
SOS! Save Our Sparky!
RE: looking for Mr Stoner
Re: Fw: ENGINE OFFSET IN 71 SUPREME
G-body 442 hoodscoop
Master Cylinders
71 VISTA CRUISER PARTS
Re: Toro rust/paint question
Re: 71 VISTA CRUISER PARTS
paging Dan Williams
Top Boot 4 Sale
RE: Car/Parts 4 sale
Save My Fathers Oldsmobile
Re: Master Cylinders
Re: Toro rust/paint question
Re: 70-72 Master cylinders
Re: Save My Fathers Oldsmobile
Re: Locks and Questions....
Re: Master Cylinders
Re: paging Dan Williams
GM is SOAKING me.. {75 Cutl Door}
Re: Daily driver
Re: Master Cylinders

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:17 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: alternator or Battery

In a message dated 98-09-14 08:15:49 EDT, you write:

<< My 94 Che!y Cavalier has a problem and I cant figure out what it is. There
is a humming sound coming from the alternator. The car want start after It
runs for a while >>

Like vapor-lock (though usually a normal choke-function) on older cars?

How loud is the hum?

Your alternator is not involved in starting your car.
Just the battery.
However, the alternator maintains charge on the battery!
It is harder for modern batteries to go bad.

Have your battery tested (con be done free of charge [sorry] at some places).

Karl would suspect problem is elsewhere.
Alternator hum is incidental. (mebbe)
Same voltage used to power starting motor for cold and warm starts.

Cold start problem would indicate batt or alt, mebbe.
Not warm start.

Karl not know FI enough to diagnose this.

Sorry.

But offhand, attempt this method which does work for vapor-lock-(when a choke
thing)-ed carburetors;

Tromp the pedal AND HOLD DOWN!
Turn the key.

Reason this works for carburetion; engine hot, but underhood air may cool
choke coil so choke closes! Throttle WOT makes choke butterfly valve open
preventing the flooding that would be caused by normal choke function!

The first time Karl tried this, it worked like a dream!

Hot engine, vrooom!

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:15 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Olds nut?? was: "Daily Driver"...Early Toro Expert ...

In a message dated 98-09-14 13:16:32 EDT, you write:

<< I looked more deeply into the FAQ and found a Toro list. I suppose I'd
better subscribe to that too. Looks like I'm becoming another Olds nut. >>

Yikes!

How much mail is that!

I think you just signed away all of your free time!

Olds nut?
What's that?   :-)}

Karl  <-----Prefers to be called an Olds Bolt.

(Or Dolt, depends on situ!)

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:13 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: car prob?? was Re: Kane County, IL show & swap & car prob??

Joe Padavano, 'nuff said;

<< Sounds like the classic sticking float/needle valve, possibly due to crud
getting between the needle and seat. If you have a lot of crud in the fuel
bowl, this will get caught in the needle and seat, holding it open (and thus
allowing the fuel pump to overgfill the fuel bowl and pump gas right out the
venturies). If high-RPM makes it go away, this is likely due to the increased
fuel flow flushing the contiminants out of the needle and seat, only to have
new particles lodge there later. One of the things I've
 found in the last few years is that some of the new additives in gasoline
have a corrosive effect on the pot metal of carb castings.  I've had two Q-
jets that I've had to discard because the pot metal inside the float bowl area
had corroded and was flaking off, causing just such a flooding situation when
they became lodged in the needle and seat. If bad enough, this flooding
condition will also cause gasoline to flow out of other areas of the carb.  >>

Have had carb apart for rebuild.
Botched choke coil and rod (too much bend and coil may not catch rod properly,
plus foam from open end of choke stove gone).
But think I left bowl pretty clean.
My inline see-thru filter dont look so bad.
BUT had prob in rebuild, needle & seat dint match carb originals!
(What I get from a kit when vendor does not ask carb #s!)
So Karl used old ones!

So, what the modern Q-Jetters need is to coat the fuel bowl with something
inert to gasoline?

I saw cans of "plasti-cote" spray paint at an Ace Hardware.
How about that?

NOTE: Do not just spray paint at your carb without masking the sesitive areas,
especially air horn and the vent for the needle/seat. Jason Labay learned this
the hard way (crummy performance after painting!)

Karl needs to replace the top of his '65 2GC anyway.

Bridge over air horn busted, air cleaner shroud mutilated for new attachment
method (by previous owner), fuel inlet stripped and now with oversize
fitting.....

Thought about picking up some 2-Jet carbs at Kane County Fairgrounds the other
day, but they all said 17045....

Karl was kinda shocked, as this would indicate 1975???

Prolly from Ch*tty cars, but was not aware of use of the 2-jet in mid-1970's
anyway.
Besides, top of the fuel bowl looked too small.

<< If bad enough, this flooding condition will also cause gasoline to flow out
of other areas of the carb. >>

Yup, this happens. Karl figgered because throttle valve closed. But gasoline
should not flow out of venturii when no vacc! Gas was oozing out of the
throttle axle shaft! (or did I mention that previously)

Well, back to the yardes....

Wanted; 1965 or so Roch 2-Jet. Good top required. Will consider a model with
jets of 58, 59 or in 70's. 2GV's also considered favorable.

Thanks Joe, and all!

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:16 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Hey JL and other Ch*tty-guys!

In my search for any repro parts that might be useful, I contacted Classic
Industries for their Ch*tty Big-Car Repro catalogue. To my dismay, I recieved
a Camaroon Catalogue. Karl could care less. No, that is not true. Karl could
not ever possibly care less than he does about having that catalogue. So after
a while he fond that he had actually recieved an Email confirming his
catalogue order and responded to it with Catalogue H#LP in the subject. This
is part of the reply....

<< DEAR KARL,
 	I DO APOLOGIZE FOR THE IN CONVINCE.  HOWEVER OUR BIG SIZE CARS 
CATALOG WILL
BE AVAILABLE EARLY 1999.  >>

There was more, but spelling radically improved.

From now on, Karl will try to refrain from use of Ch*tty parts, as they seem
to corrode the brain......

Still In Convinced...

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:20 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: 1960 Dynamic 88 was: 1961 Dynamic 88

In a message dated 98-09-13 20:34:07 EDT, you write:

<< I am a new owner of a '60 Dynamic. >>

Fortunately (?), 1960 was considered a "holdover" year for Oldsmobile in that
th 1960 offerings were more similar (possibly interchangeable) to the 1959
Oldsmobiles.

This means that yout resources will be older cars, if there are any that
interchange.
Good Luck!

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:04:18 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)

In a message dated 98-09-13 20:25:34 EDT, you write:

<< Take it to a place where the place is clean (that is a sign that the owner
and mechanics are neat and meticulous). Get an estimate on what will be done
to it. Also ask if they warranty the work. >>

Karl's usual mechs do charge 59.95/hour for labor.

BUT they do know what they are doing.
(One has an 80's Hurst Olds!)

And although a recent brake job cost just under $800, I was not charged for
the replacement of the rear axle oil seal that they replaced little over one
year ago.

For Pettrix and other locals; I use Brach's Auto Centre just south of 103rd
and Western Avenue.

They did misidentify my engine as a 330, but you really have to be more than
an Olds neophyte....

Pettrix:
What model years are you familiar with?

(Uh, reply should prolly be private.)

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 08:57:35 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE:  3800 Performance Mods (long)

What I would do, as I have done....

Get a GOOD high flow air filter like Amsoil or K & N (Amsoil traps dirt
better, they both flow about the same amount of air on a flowbench,
Amsoil is cheaper...).

Don't waste money on Bosch Platinums, the DIS will destroy them in short
order, like 10K miles if even that!  Use good quality AC or Autolight,
nothing else will do.  Champions are nothing but trouble.  No
performance was gained using Rapidfires or Splitfires.  Stock gap on the
AC's or Autolight (NOT Motorcraft!) plugs works well.

Get some good plug wires, I use the Taylor Spiral Pro racing wire, it is
a spiral core, magnetic shielded, and works well with the 3800.  That
made a performance improvement.

180 Thermostat, not really sure if it makes anything at all, but it is
an off the shelf item.

Mine lacks umph as it has the pathetic 2.84 gears.  Does ok first and
2nd but 3rd and OD is not very good, too low in rpm.  I have 215 70
15's, I am changing to 225 60 15's soon, that should help a little.
Needs the 3.33, (3.73's are avail in the 4T65E, but offered only on the
Monte Carlo Pace Car for 97) but for 92, they killed off the 3.33, so
you have the standard 3.06  I think in 92 they all got 3.06's.  But that
is an expensive changover as Steve Ochs can tell you.  Not for the
average backyard mechanic.  Got to remove the trans, and that is no easy
task.

There is a guy on the Buick loop that works with ECM chips for the 3800,
but I do not know if you will get much more.

What I want to do with mine is get the stuff to make is a Series II (or
as close as I can get) 3800.  They made 205 hp, your is 170 and mine is
165.  Yours has the same cam as my 91, but new intake.  (Tuned Port).
Maybe a roller timing chain if anyone makes one.

The Series II 3800 has roller tip rockers as well.  All 3800's have
roller cams.

If you look at the exhaust, there is a nice 2.3in pipe from the front to
the rear of the engine, but there is a poor joining of the front to the
rear pipes to join together to go to the O2 sensor and the catalytic.
More like a V8 header there on the back side, the front is a nice
header, but not equal length.  If you can make a better Y join there
instead of all exhaust cramming together at the #6 cyl, it would help a
lot for breathing.

According to my Tach, 5200 is redline, the 3800 Series II has a 6000 rpm
redline.  May have cam changes there as well as bottom end.

Your overall best bet is EFI Performance, they have supposedly been
working on a turbo kit for the "3" and "C" 3800's not sure if they have
one for the "L" 3800.  But that would bring you up to 250 to 300 hp!
(250 hp is considered by EFI as safe on a 4T60 300 pushing it, but unk
on the 4T60E, Steve?)

Good luck!  Let me know how you get it running!


Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:26:22 -0500
From: "Smetana, Christopher" <csmetana@dowagro.com>
Subject: RE: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)

>
>And although a recent brake job cost just under $800, I was not charged for

WOW!!!!!  $800 for brakes (yeah I know just under $800) but still that's
a lot of Peso's.  Curious, what all was done?


Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
work: csmetana@onexinc.com
home: chris@abcs.com

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 07:39:11 -0700
From: Ben <olds442@primenet.com>
Subject: Re: 360HP 455

> Igor, Here's my scoop. I have headers, edelbrock intake, 750 Q-jet from
> edelbrock, stock torque converter and a comp cams 268, .484/.484. Without
> figuring in my aluminum heads I make over 400 according to the desktop dyno.
> nearly 500 torque! I will plug your numbers in and give you an approxiamate
> hp/ft/lbs rating for your engine. You should be well above 350 hp... i'll get
> back with you later today.

Ben

> Anyways, I was looking at Edelbrock homepage and their powerpackage 
(excluding
> their heads of course) and the thing seems to peake at about 327HP.  Seems
> vary low to me.  I would like to get 360HP out of my olds. What should I
> change.  If all this edelbrock stuff makes only 327HPs, then I must be under
> 300.  How did '68 Deltas make 390 HPs.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:36:10 -0400
From: Chris Urban <urbanch@magi.com>
Subject: RE: Car/Parts 4 sale

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDE095.35297420
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Would you have a 69 antenna and drivers side remote mirror with real =
nice chrome? By the way I been on this list for 3 years and this is only =
the 3rd time I've seen someone selling stuff that is actually worth =
selling.

Chris Urban

- -----Original Message-----
From:	SOMMERVLLE@aol.com [SMTP:SOMMERVLLE@aol.com]
Sent:	Tuesday, September 15, 1998 8:14 AM
To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:	Car/Parts 4 sale

Well guys and gals made my rounds to the junkyards this weekend and here =
are a
few of the things that I've found. I'f you are interested please e-mail =
me
privately at=20
SOMMERVLLE@AOL.COM  or call (910) 487-1540 home or (910) 396-5420 work =
ask for
SSG Chris Sommerville (I'm in the Army, located in Fayetteville NC) all =
parts
are priced without shipping
all of this stuff is subject to trade need some 69 442 parts, and always
looking for another 442.
MY STUFF
1970 442 south carolina car, has some rust and dents but is a solid =
start. Is
a bench seat, auto on the column 455 AC car. Has the wrong year 455 in =
it but
know where the original 455 is located at. Car has potentialwas green on =
green
w/ black leather interior. Have pictures and can e-mail on request want =
$1200

68-72 A body rear end 3.73 posi complete (it's out of a ch-vy) good =
shape $350

ladder bars and mounts for GM A body $75

Set of weld wheels front 2 are 15x5 and rear 2 are 15x8 good shape $400

new 4 core radiator for 68-72 442 used one month $200

flowmaster exhaust from the header collectors to exit behind rear wheels =
 good
shape $100

set of "C" heads pulled off of a running motor I would say that they =
need to
be gone through $125

set of "8" heads off of a running motor $75

picking up a 1969 C/S parts car in decent shape has a #5 headed 350 and =
a
turbo 400 e-mail for needs

Junkyards, will act as the middle man and I will have to get a price =
from the
yard for you.
1968 442 some small items no nose has a "C" headed 400 and auto trans =
(Sitting
for some time)

1966 or 67 F85 (2, one is a post car) and cutlass complete

several 1969 and 70-72 cutlass's 2 and 4drs

1971 442 been stipped inside and doors are gone rest of car in decent =
shape

several 455's most with G and J heads. one E motor

2 sets of T-Tops for 1979 and newer cutlass's good shape

several 73-77 cutlass and 442's=20

TONS of G body stuff in great shape
If you are interested let me know Thanks Chris



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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BDE095.35297420--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:34:48 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Re: 455 w/a 2.29:1 gear ratio?

My 350 with 2.14 does ok, but that is because I have the THM200C, and I
believe that the THM200C has the 2.74 first gear.  (nothing for sure on
that, but it acts like it, 55 mph the engine is screaming in first!)
Sure, at WOT at 10 mph she is doggy, but if you give it 2/3rd throttle,
she will lay rubber off the line, and a lot of it if conditions are
right.  I can do 0-60 in 9 flat with 2.14's and 205 75 14's.  Use that
as a benchmark.  I love the part throttle acceleration at 70 and it just
keep going and going and going and going.....  The speedo is buried and
I am only part way thru second gear!!  WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!
Imagine if I could live in Montana!

Try this, if you have to deal with 2.29's, get some 225 50's!  Short
tires will make up for the gear!

So build a THM200C to live behind a 455!!  Or get the gears and install
them in a THM350!

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 07:50:49 -0700
From: "John Young" <realtorjohn@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: 360HP 455

It may be time to note the following equation..  HP=torqueXRPM/5252.
Horsepower is a contrived figure, based on torque at a given RPM. Torque at
a higher RPM makes for all kinds of great HP numbers, but may be in the
dust on the street. Tons of torque below 4000 or even 3000 rev's will
dominate the stoplight grand prix. Just some thoughts from an old street
racer.
realtorjohn@sprynet.com
69 442 W-32

- ----------
> In a message dated 9/15/98
>  1:<BR47:<BR12 AM Central Daylight Tim, igor455@home.com writes:
>
> > Oh no, you are right.  Olds motors are all torque.  BUT still, you look
at
> >  some of the older machines.  375 hp 455s, 390 hp 455s.  Means lots of
> torque
> >  at some RPMs too.  I don't want to rev my 455 past 5000 but I would
like
> HPs
> >  in the 300s and torque well into the 400s.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:02:55 EDT
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com
Subject: Re: RE: new labor rates ( 60 $ per hour)

<<And although a recent brake job cost just under $800, >>

$800 for a brake job WOW!!!!!! would have done it for alot less. The only
thing that I can think of is that the pads/shoes were HIGH Metallic (GOLD).
Just my .02

Chris Sommerville
69 442 SC
70 442 HC
70 W31
and lots of parts

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:11:52 -0500
From: "Brett Wilson" <bwilson@dmotorworks.com>
Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Aurora_360=B0_interior?=

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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This is pretty cool......
http://www.auroracar.com/interior/360.asp?
>Brett Wilson

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Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>This is pretty =
cool......</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><A=20
href=3D"http://www.auroracar.com/interior/360.asp">http://www.auroracar.c=
om/interior/360.asp?</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>&gt;Brett Wilson</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_0037_01BDE091.423E49A0--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 07:59:01 -0700
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@MCI2000.com>
Subject: Re: Car/Parts 4 sale

is that rearend a 10 or 12 bolt?.kk
- -----Original Message-----
From: Chris Urban <urbanch@magi.com>
To: 'oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca' <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Tuesday, September 15, 1998 7:44 AM
Subject: RE: Car/Parts 4 sale


Would you have a 69 antenna and drivers side remote mirror with real nice
chrome? By the way I been on this list for 3 years and this is only the 3rd
time I've seen someone selling stuff that is actually worth selling.

Chris Urban

- -----Original Message-----
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com [SMTP:SOMMERVLLE@aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, September 15, 1998 8:14 AM
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: Car/Parts 4 sale

Well guys and gals made my rounds to the junkyards this weekend and here are
a
few of the things that I've found. I'f you are interested please e-mail me
privately at
SOMMERVLLE@AOL.COM  or call (910) 487-1540 home or (910) 396-5420 work ask
for
SSG Chris Sommerville (I'm in the Army, located in Fayetteville NC) all
parts
are priced without shipping
all of this stuff is subject to trade need some 69 442 parts, and always
looking for another 442.
MY STUFF
1970 442 south carolina car, has some rust and dents but is a solid start.
Is
a bench seat, auto on the column 455 AC car. Has the wrong year 455 in it
but
know where the original 455 is located at. Car has potentialwas green on
green
w/ black leather interior. Have pictures and can e-mail on request want
$1200

68-72 A body rear end 3.73 posi complete (it's out of a ch-vy) good shape
$350

ladder bars and mounts for GM A body $75

Set of weld wheels front 2 are 15x5 and rear 2 are 15x8 good shape $400

new 4 core radiator for 68-72 442 used one month $200

flowmaster exhaust from the header collectors to exit behind rear wheels
good
shape $100

set of "C" heads pulled off of a running motor I would say that they need to
be gone through $125

set of "8" heads off of a running motor $75

picking up a 1969 C/S parts car in decent shape has a #5 headed 350 and a
turbo 400 e-mail for needs

Junkyards, will act as the middle man and I will have to get a price from
the
yard for you.
1968 442 some small items no nose has a "C" headed 400 and auto trans
(Sitting
for some time)

1966 or 67 F85 (2, one is a post car) and cutlass complete

several 1969 and 70-72 cutlass's 2 and 4drs

1971 442 been stipped inside and doors are gone rest of car in decent shape

several 455's most with G and J heads. one E motor

2 sets of T-Tops for 1979 and newer cutlass's good shape

several 73-77 cutlass and 442's

TONS of G body stuff in great shape
If you are interested let me know Thanks Chris

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:24:40 EDT
From: SpeedCom@aol.com
Subject: Re: Toro rust/paint question

I went to look at the 71 Toro (Daily Driver posting). It seems a very good car
mechanically and looks pretty good from 30 ft. price is $1200, 153K miles,
newish batt/alt/tires. Exhaust system pretty good. No real leaks. Engine and
trans never been apart nor troublesome. Interior is really solid, with newish
vinyl on the seat tops and good carpet. All switches, windows, seat motors
work. It needs one CV boot replaced.

Real problem, to make it look good,it needs a paint job. I have relatives in
the business, so if I strip it, the painting can be fairly economical...say
$600-800. BUT.. the car has a bit of cancer. Can anyone tell me of their
experiences with this sort of body repair?? The car lived in chicago for the
first 3-4 years of its life. There is bubbled and flaking rust on the top of
the right rear fender cutout (and I suspect that the left will have some that
hasn't broken through yet.). Worse, under the vinyl roof (yucch) there are 5
places that have obvious rust as seen in lifting of the vinyl from the flaking
underneath. I believe that it may ahve gone through on the right front corner,
as it is a bit soft, but I didn'tn want to push hard enough to break the guy's
car :-) Also, on the left  rear deck, right below the window trim, there is a
8" strip of bubbled rust that has to come out.

I've been told that there is NO WAY to repair this sort of rust so that it
will never come back, but I don't know that this is true. I've also been told
that fibreglass mesh will repair it even if it has rusted the metal completely
through. (by the way, the headliner shows no rust/water spotting in the area
that I suspect may have gone through.)

Anyway, this is mechanically a really good car that could last forever. I'm
only afraid that troubles with the rust could also last forever :-). If that
is the case, I will pass and look for something that hasn't had the advantages
of a Chicago birth.

Could someone let me know of their experience with this sort of thing?

Cheers/Carron

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:26:45 -0500
From: "Brett Wilson" <bwilson@dmotorworks.com>
Subject: =?iso-8859-1?Q?For_more_360=B0_interiors....?=

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BDE093.56D42540
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

go to
http://carpoint.msn.com/gallery
>Brett

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>go to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2><A=20
href=3D"http://carpoint.msn.com/gallery">http://carpoint.msn.com/gallery<=
/A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>&gt;Brett</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_0047_01BDE093.56D42540--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:29:37 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Fw: ENGINE OFFSET IN 71 SUPREME

I also read the Car Craft info about this offset.  First, let me say that
they've got it wrong.  First of all, they claim that "On Cutlass Supreme
and Cutlass S cars, the engine is moved 1 inch off center to the right from
the normal Cutlass or 4-4-2 mounting position..."

Well, the Cutlass S and the Cutlass and the 442 Holiday and Sport Coupes
all use the same frame and frame mounts, so this can't be true.  In
addition, this question refered to a 72 car, where the 442 was an option
package only, available on Cutlass, Cutlass S, and Supreme converts.  I
could believe, though I don't know why it was done, that the Supreme and
Supreme convert have the offset engine (keep in mind that the 70-72 442
convert was based on the Supreme body).  Can someone with a parts book
confirm that the motor mounts are different from side-to-side?  Does
someone have a Supreme bare frame and can verify this offset?  I still find
this hard to believe, as the Supreme (unlike the other GM "notchback" cars
of 70-72, the Gran Prix and Monte Carlo) used the same wheelbase as the
other 2 door cars - 112".  I would assume that this means the same frame as
well (GM isn't in the business of wasting money on two different frames
where one would work).  The Supreme also uses the same fenders, inner
fenders, firewall, A/C housing, steering shaft/box/linkage, exhaust
manifolds, head pipes, etc.  Where is this alleged offset taken up?

Joe (Show Me) Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 08:47:43 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Re: looking for Mr Stoner

At 02:12 AM 9/15/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Has any one heard from Tom Stoner?
>Tried mailing him, his server would not accept it.
>I need to talk to him.
>

I haven't seen him in a while either.
(had mail bounce too)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:58:57 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Preliminary results of consultation; 455 Aeroplane

I mentioned earlier here that I would like to post some ideas to Jim
McFarlane.

In my post to him, I included most ideas that has arisen;
1)dry-sump oiling
2)Fuel injection vs. carburetion
3)Possibility of tuning for low rpm power

And I did mention the intended aircraft and its original engine. And tha same
was MUCH heavier than a 455.

He seems to be replying to my points numerically, but I did not copy myself
and can not recall my solliloquy verbatim.

I hope you browsers can read the Italics. They are his, not mine.

Karl,

On somewhat limited time, following are some quick takes on the questions you
posed.  I'd like to go further into the subject, but I hope you can appreciate
my limited schedule for extended answers.

1. I think a dry-sump is a must.

2. Avoid carburetors {even pressurized versions}.  Too much MPFI technology
exists today to not take advantage of this method.  Fuel delivery will be as
much a benefit as attitude-insensitivity.

3. I agree on your assumptions about engine mounting feasibility.  Keep in
mind that low rpm, high torque applications allow greater peak-to-peak
torsional loading than an engine operating at a higher rpm.  "Hammer blows" to
engine mounts is a fair analogy.

4. You're catching on.  Air flow "tuning" {both intake and exhaust} can have a
significant impact upon where an engine's peak volumetric efficiency occurs.
Given adequate packaging space in the airframe, you should be able to tune
intake/exhaust systems for torque output in the rpm span you indicated.

Overall, my impression of using a 455 Olds for aircraft applications is that
its weight may be a negative factor.  When the "Thunder" engines were being
developed for crop dusters years ago, I did some consulting with the cylinder
head and block designer.  You may recall that these were hemisphere chambers
particularly well suited to low rpm combustion efficiency.  If I recall
correctly, package weight was a prime consideration.

Knowing no more than I do about aircraft weight requirements, I'd think you
would be better off using a basic engine of lighter weight, although opting
for large piston displacement is certainly consistent with low rpm, high
torque output...especially if you are able to utilize any form of "long rod"
combination that narrows the rpm spread between peak power and peak torque.

However, just about regardless of the engine you select, larger displacement,
tuned intake/exhaust systems and tumble/swirl combustion processes should help
optimize the combustion efficiency and torque of your engine of choice.  I
don't think I've helped you very much, but if I only stirred up a couple of
additional thoughts, maybe our "discussion" was worthwhile.

Best of luck,

Jim McFarland

(My head hurts.... mebbe I should put some beer on it.)

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:58:59 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Old broken and rusted parts

In a message dated 98-09-14 17:46:37 EDT, you write:

<<  I long ago ceased to be amazed at how I would suddenly have a need for
some goofball part that I'd stored away years before. >>

A good memory helps here.

I actually went out and bought new an item that I had squirrelled away years
before...

SOM
&KA

Who now gots old M/C, broken vib. dam. (shipping woulda negated the core
deposit anywho), broken grille (potmetal...sigh), 3 intakes and climbing,
factory coil, plugs of various makes, the cap, rotor, and BADLY burnt up plugs
that were on the car when I (er, Karl) bought it.......
Soon to add; hood, rad support, 4 coil springs and 4 original shock absorbers
(read as rusty metal that slides freely, once I have them off, they will
prolly seize for good and all), broken spring compressors...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:58:55 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: SOS! Save Our Sparky!

Well, Karl gotsa say he thinks prob is oil ring.

In SOM's "A" 425, each piston has two oil rings.
At least, that is what we recall from the Chassis manual.

Reasons to suspect oil ring;

<< There was a smell, but none that I ever smelled before! It was not a
burning, acrid, gas, smell. ... I NEVER saw that much smoke! It was not blue,
it was not white, sorta grey and opague, but LOTS of it! It lasted about 10
seconds and went away. >>

This part is interesting, why would it be intermittent?

<< The car seemed to run fine for the next minute or two, but when I backed
off for some slower traffic, there I was writing my name in the fresh morning
air again! >>

<< Now, our initial impression was that the modulator let go and I was sucking
tranny fluid back through the carb. >>

Modulator? Oh, you mean tranny fluid through vacc lines?

And yah, this sucks.

<< The car continued to emit LARGE amounts of smoke, but ONLY intermittantly
with no pattern and I could not MAKE it do it on purpose.

I now have more power loss (but still plenty to get down the road).

We notice the engine has a slight miss.

THEN I notice smoke puffing out the breather and PCV holes on the valve
covers. I take the oil filler cap off and it looks like Puff the Magic Choo
Choo!!! The engine seems to be going more sour as we fiddle around, but never
bad enough to determine just what the hell is going on. >>

Were you getting blow-by before? Sounds more like rings.

<< 1. Temperature NEVER got above normal.
 2. It sucked almost a quart of oil in about 20 miles.
 3. Rad Fluid clear (no evidence of oil or frothing as in cracked head)
 4. NO noise from valve train or engine proper.
 5. Removing plug wires on right side (two closest to firewall seem not to
 make much difference). All others made a BIG difference. >>

TWO plugs (#6 and #8 right?) removed (one at a time I presume) with little
effect?

Why would rings in two adjacent cylinders go bad?


<< 1. Car has been running like a champ for years, only 112 original miles on
it) >>

Wow! After a 600 mile vacation you have a total of 112 miles!

<< If, in fact, I did blow a pistion or something internal/bottom end, what
should I do?  Take a match to it and REALLY flame the thing up? >>

No. Pull the motor and ship it to me!

Karl hopes Sparky gots alternate transportation.

But consider;
If you are truly at 112K, this is as good a time to visit your internals as
any.
Whether you wish to only re-ring, or go completely nuts (or get whacked) with
cylinder honing and the whole recondition thing, 112K is prolly as good a time
as any to replace bearings etc. on your innards.

<< Sparkless >>

Sparkles??

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:01:59 -0500
From: "Smetana, Christopher" <csmetana@dowagro.com>
Subject: RE: looking for Mr Stoner

I got an email from him 3 1/2 weeks ago, 8/28 to be exact.  I bought a
magazine from him.
Haven't tried emailing him lately though.

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
work: csmetana@onexinc.com
home: chris@abcs.com

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others

>----------
>From: 	Bob Blanchard[SMTP:bob149@efortress.com]
>Sent: 	Tuesday, September 15, 1998 3:47 AM
>To: 	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
>Subject: 	Re: looking for Mr Stoner
>
>At 02:12 AM 9/15/98 -0400, you wrote:
>>Has any one heard from Tom Stoner?
>>Tried mailing him, his server would not accept it.
>>I need to talk to him.
>>
>
>I haven't seen him in a while either.
>(had mail bounce too)
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 12:27:41 -0400
From: "Jason P. Labay" <jlabay@ee.net>
Subject: Re: Fw: ENGINE OFFSET IN 71 SUPREME

A few weeks ago we replaced the upper and lower mounts in my 72 Cutlass Supreme
with the original 350.  I wasn't thinking and called the parts store and 
ordered
them for a 72 Cutlass...didn't specify Supreme.  They went into the locations 
on
the frame perfect....who knows.

Jason




>someone have a Supreme bare frame and can verify this offset?  I still find
>this hard to believe, as the Supreme (unlike the other GM "notchback" cars
>of 70-72, the Gran Prix and Monte Carlo) used the same wheelbase as the
>other 2 door cars - 112".  I would assume that this means the same frame as
>well (GM isn't in the business of wasting money on two different frames
>where one would work).  The Supreme also uses the same fenders, inner
>fenders, firewall, A/C housing, steering shaft/box/linkage, exhaust
>manifolds, head pipes, etc.  Where is this alleged offset taken up?
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 12:35:52 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Nathyn M. Knipe" <nmknipe@mailbox.syr.edu>
Subject: G-body 442 hoodscoop

i don't suppose anyone has a hood for a g body with a hood scoop on it???
i am looking for a 442 scoop for my car...so even if you just have the
scoop itself i would be interested in it..thanks..Nathyn
(i know i can replicas from Lauren engineering)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 09:52:49 -0700 (PDT)
From: John Pajak <jspajak@yahoo.com>
Subject: Master Cylinders

     Joe P., Greg R., thanks for clearing up the master cylinder
sizing. Guess I'll rebuild the original one I took off......I'm glad I
don't throw ANYTHING away.
     The car stops OK with the current MC which I assume is a 1.125"
bore. Guess the pedal effort would be lower with a 1" bore
size.....though it's not too bad now.





==
"2 + 2 = 5 for sufficiently large values of 2"

John Pajak
Lexington Park, Maryland

Check out our cars, trucks and a whole lot more at
http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 10:02:51 -0700 (PDT)
From: j a <vistaboy71@yahoo.com>
Subject: 71 VISTA CRUISER PARTS

ANY ONE KNOW WHERE I CAN GET A RUST FREE TAILGATE

FOR A '71 VISTA??



JAMIE
'71 VISTA SOON TO HAVE 455



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:03:38 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Toro rust/paint question

I've been told that there is NO WAY to repair this sort of rust so that it
will never come back, but I don't know that this is true. I've also been
told
that fibreglass mesh will repair it even if it has rusted the metal
completely
through. (by the way, the headliner shows no rust/water spotting in the
area
that I suspect may have gone through.)
_______________

The only permanent way to repair any rustout is by welding in new metal.
Any fiberglass/filler method will eventually come throught again, in fact
most plastic fillers will absorb water and make the problem worse.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:15:34 EDT
From: RGHaun@aol.com
Subject: Re: 71 VISTA CRUISER PARTS

Try Hemmings motor news or go to Carlisle Pa. for the swap meet,
Oct.1-4, only 78 acres of cars & parts for sale.
Ron Haun

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:16:37 -0400
From: "Mark Cornea (R)" <mcornea@ford.com>
Subject: paging Dan Williams

Dan,
		If your out there, please contact me at the address below.

       ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
          Mark Cornea (Dr Decal) `70 W30 stick ~ Red (of course)

                              <mailto:drdecal442@aol.com>
                              <mailto:mcornea@ford.com>

            Visit <http://members.aol.com/drdecal442/mcr.html>


            OCA# 4903
       	    OPC# 14
       ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 00:39:54 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: Top Boot 4 Sale

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_01BDE10A.85B38820
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Top boot for sale from a 72 442. This boot will fit 1968-1972 models. This
boot has no rips or tears and all 4 buttons are there. The color is a
saddle brown color. This boot is not show quality but is a very nice
alternative to buying a new one. The top boot is not faded and has the tuck
strip intact. The reason I am selling it is because I am changing the
interior color to black.

Brand new go for $100.00

I am selling the top boot for $45.00

E-Mail me privately.....
Pettrix@prodigy.net

- ------=_NextPart_000_01BDE10A.85B38820
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head></head><BODY bgcolor=3D"#FFFFFF"><p><font size=3D2 =
color=3D"#000000" face=3D"Arial"><b>Top boot for sale from a 72 442. =
This boot will fit 1968-1972 models. This boot has <i>no rips or =
tears</i> and all 4 buttons are there. The color is<font =
color=3D"#800000"> a saddle brown color.<font color=3D"#000000"> This =
boot is not show quality but is a very nice alternative to buying a new =
one. The top boot is not faded and has the tuck strip intact. <font =
face=3D"Courier New">The reason I am selling it is because I am changing =
the interior color to black.<br><br><font face=3D"Lucida Sans">Brand new =
go for <i>$100.00<br><br></i><font color=3D"#0000FF">I am selling the =
top boot for $45.00</b><font color=3D"#000000" =
face=3D"Arial"><br><br><b><i>E-Mail me privately.....</i></b><br><font =
color=3D"#0000FF"><u>Pettrix@prodigy.net</u><font =
color=3D"#000000"><br><br></p>
</font></font></font></font></font></font></font></font></font></body></h=
tml>
- ------=_NextPart_000_01BDE10A.85B38820--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:05:47 EDT
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com
Subject: RE: Car/Parts 4 sale

The rear end that I put out earlier is a 12 bolt unit. Thanks Chris

Chris Sommerville
69 442 SC
70 442 HC
70 W31
AND A LOT OF PARTS!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 16 Sep 1998 14:03:17 -0400
From: "VBDeveloper" <vbdeveloper@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Save My Fathers Oldsmobile

Sorry for the pun, none intended. It is my fathers Oldsmobile. And...
I am looking for weather-strip for '86 Delta 88. Would that be a dealer's
item or is aftermarket available?
Also, is anything  else available aftermarket? Thanks in advance ....

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:09:51 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Master Cylinders

In a message dated 98-09-15 13:04:47 EDT, you write:

<<     The car stops OK with the current MC which I assume is a 1.125" bore.
Guess the pedal effort would be lower with a 1" bore size.....though it's not
too bad now. >>

Uhhh.

Karl woulda guessed that the larger bore diameter resulted in less pedal
effort, as larger bore = more brake fluid moved through lines.

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:12:42 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Toro rust/paint question

In a message dated 98-09-15 13:16:08 EDT, you write:

<< Any fiberglass/filler method will eventually come throught again, in fact
 most plastic fillers will absorb water and make the problem worse.  >>

Does this include Bondo?

Then only real way is to weld a patch and then use sealant on the metal, as
Karl imagines that welding is also a kind of stress (=rust) for metals.

Thanks

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:21:57 PDT
From: "Brent Pinkstaff" <fear_of_tomorrow@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: 70-72 Master cylinders

I thought that '70 w-31 and stick w-30 cars (manual disc) used the same
master cylinder as the drum brake cars. Most of the parts books as well
as most of the cars I have seen support this. I know that the '71-'72
manual disc cars had their own master, but that the '70 models used the
drum one.

Brent Pinkstaff
'70 Cutlass S (Mr. Hankey, the Cutlass poo)



>There was some discussion earlier regarding the differences between the
>1970-1972 master cylinders.  Hopefully the following info will help:
>
>1970 Power disc. All models (1st design. Dual bail) 1.125" bore.
>1970 Power disc. All models (2nd design. Single bail) 1.125" bore.
>1970 Manual disc (including W-30) dual bail. 1" bore.
>1970-1972 Power or manual drums.  Single bail. 1" bore.
>1971-1972 Power disc. (incl. W-30). 1.125" bore. (Same as '70 2nd
type).
>
>1971-1972 Manual disc (W-30). Dual bail. 1" bore.
>
>Greg Rollin
>Supercars Unlimited (Where Cutlass/4-4-2 is ALL we do!) 503-244-8249
>http://www.supercarsunlimited.com
>E-mail: supercars@transport.com
>
>
>




______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:32:02 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Save My Fathers Oldsmobile

In a message dated 98-09-15 14:12:10 EDT, you write:

<< Sorry for the pun, none intended. It is my fathers Oldsmobile. And... I am
looking for weather-strip for '86 Delta 88. Would that be a dealer's item or
is aftermarket available?
 Also, is anything  else available aftermarket? >>

Uh, well you can try the Olds dealers.

Or Softseal or Metro....

Fusick's could have it, do not know of their catalogues for other years/makes.

IS the 86 your fathers? And what about it needs saving?

Read the FAQ at 442.com anyway.

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:34:55 -0700 (PDT)
From: S-MAN <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Locks and Questions....

- ---Ray Costanzo <rocket409@juno.com> wrote:
A lock question.  I have a pair of keys with little gold Olds emblems
embedded in them.  They're from an 88 Olds something or other.  I've
heard that different year cars had slightly different key patterns.
So if I cut the keys the same as mine, wil I then discover that
they'll slide in but not turn?  They seem to slide in fine now,
uncut...  My car's an 87, the door locks are original, the ignition
switch is from my 86 CSB...

- -----Hey Ray,
     As long as the letter on the keys are the same(ign.
A,C,E,J....door B,D,H,K )which evidently are since it goes in, than
Yes it will work.The letter designates the keyway.just make sure you
get them cut where you're sure the machine is accurate....because it's
always easier to cut the key more, but if the machine is adjusted too
deep...it's a lost cause.hard to put metal back on :)If you go to a
locksmith ,have them "clip " the key out.This is like a punch for keys
and makes the key to factory depths.
          Those "gold " keys are hard to find....I've been looking for
years for the chrome ones that have the "rocket" on them....have even
found the manufacturer but no luck there unless I wanted to order like
10,000 blanks.....don't see that happenning.
          SMAN
==
John McJunkin  mailto:super442@yahoo.com    ICQ # 16956740
TOPLESS--1985 Cutlass--frog442's 84---my 69 442
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be V-8 !
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
Check out my Burnout page-send me pics of your's and I'll add it
- -http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/Burnouts

_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:34:44 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Master Cylinders

Karl woulda guessed that the larger bore diameter resulted in less pedal
effort, as larger bore = more brake fluid moved through lines.
____________

Karl should be careful not to confuse volume with pressure.  Assume that
the brake pedal is pressed on with a constant force, resulting in a force F
exerted on the pushrod into the M/C.  Pressure in the line coming out of
the M/C is simply:

P = F/A

where A = the area of the M/C piston.

Smaller piston diameter = smaller area =  higher pressure for a given force
on the pedal.  Conversely, for a constant pressure in the line (assuming
constant pressure results in constant braking force at the wheels), a
smaller area results in a lower required force.

Karl correctly points out, however, that the smaller piston will result in
less fluid flow for a given linear travel.  Since we are keeping the wheel
cylinders a constant size in this example, and thus require a constant
volume of brake fluid for the same braking action, the smaller M/C piston
must obviously travel farther than the larger one, albeit at a lower
applied force, to move this constant volume of fluid.  In other words, like
any other lever system, you're trading a longer travel for lower force.
(Gee, Mister Peabody, simple machines in automobiles _again_...)

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 14:45:20 EDT
From: RGHaun@aol.com
Subject: Re: paging Dan Williams

Hello Mark, remember me from the Olds show in Canada,
the ole brken down draftsman. Retired now, hope to see you some
day.
Ron Haun
Orchard Park, NY

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 12:45:08 -0600
From: Eric <big_olds@hotmail.com>
Subject: GM is SOAKING me.. {75 Cutl Door}

So, I finally got a door for my new 75 Cutlass Supreme
(basic-transportation machine, not in great or bad shape).  The old one
was gushed real good, so I welded shut and gave the car an informal
test-period.  The car passed and I got a new door (white door on a brown
car, looks Real silly).  My first trip to GM got me door-pins and
bushings, plus a roller kit (The pins were $3 each, the roller kit was
$34, and the last roller kit I will buy!)

So, the door is now on, and I need the bolt + washer + bushing on the
frame near the rear of the door that the lock clamps around.  It is a
LOW GRADE Bolt with a washer and a bushing, and THEY WANT $32 dollars
for it!!

So, my alternatives:
1) Get used one
2) Get one built (I think any machine shop / garage could beat $32)
3) Build one myself (not impossible, but who has time)
4) Look for aftermarket.. (Preferable at a reasonable price)

The questions:
1) Is GM trying to soak me ($32 bolt, sorry, not a fair price, even with
low turnover)
2) Where can I get aftermarket for under $15 (Canadian Tire,
Bumper-Bumper , NAPA) ????
3) IS there an easy way to just build one?

Please answer me soon, as the door doesn't close so good!

Eric Aksomitis
http://www.dlcwest.com/~jed/eric.shtml

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 11:52:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: S-MAN <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Daily driver

- ---SpeedCom@aol.com wrote:
 S,
>
> I was the guy. What do you have?
>
> Don Carron
>
- ----Hey Don,
         I had saved the address....along with all the rest....but
forgot which it was.I just saw a post about the Saab,don't know if
you're still looking or not. One I found is a 77 442...nice car from
talking on the phone  403, new paint.$3500...ouch.also a 74 Cutlass
for $1500,sounds good by
discription.........350/350,buckets/console,Ac, new 15x8 rallys,runs
excell.
              I'll keep my eyes out,just let me know if you're still
interested or going with the "crybaby" (Saab) :)
               SMAN
==
John McJunkin  mailto:super442@yahoo.com    ICQ # 16956740
TOPLESS--1985 Cutlass--frog442's 84---my 69 442
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be V-8 !
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
Check out my Burnout page-send me pics of your's and I'll add it
- -http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/Burnouts

_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 15 Sep 1998 13:52:02 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Master Cylinders

> <<     The car stops OK with the current MC which I assume is a 1.125" bore.
> Guess the pedal effort would be lower with a 1" bore size.....though it's not
> too bad now. >>
>
> Uhhh.
>
> Karl woulda guessed that the larger bore diameter resulted in less pedal
> effort, as larger bore = more brake fluid moved through lines.

Karl, it is not about moving fluid, it is about (hydraulic) pressure when
you are dealing with brakes!
Pressure is measured in force per surface size, for ex. pounds per square
inch. When you brake you want to get the highest pressure in the system
with the lowest force applied to you pedal.

Let me give you an example:

Karl wants to put 2 p/si on his brake system.

1. Karl has 1 square inch brake piston. Then he must appyl 2 pounds force
to the piston to get to 2pounds/1square inch = 2p/si

2. Karl has 2 square inch brake piston. Then he must apply 4 pounds force
to get 4pounds/2square inch = 2p/si!

Got it? The only thing that limits one to go all the way to very small
bore sizes is of course that you have to have a certain volume decrease
to build up the pressure. With a small piston you would have to press
that thing in a looong way to achieve that and that kind of stroke would
be not practicable to put in your car.

Just could not keep back... ;-)
So long,
George

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1485
*********************************
