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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1473


oldsmobile-digest    Wednesday, September 9 1998    Volume 01 : Number 1473



Re: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)
Hotchkis Suspension
Re: how to determine your gear ratio...
W31 specs  was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)
Re: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)
Re: Big Mac's New Car
More on counting turns
Re: W31 specs was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)
Re: how to determine your gear ratio...
Re: Ideas on 455 Aircraft Engine.
Intake question
Re: need vin decipherd?
'72 to '67 rear end swap
Setting up a OLDS website
(Event): All-Oldsmobile Funshow
RE: W31 specs was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)
Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon
Re: W31 specs
Re: Intake question
UNBOUNCE: 425 Toro into a '65 442 4-spd.
UNBOUNCE: Goofy required options...(sorta like Hurst/Olds A/C)
Re: Cutlass trunk floor...
UNBOUNCE: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon
UNBOUNCE: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon
UNBOUNCE: RE: Best Quadrajet carb's?
UNBOUNCE: '72 to '67 rear end swap
'83-4 H/O SS-III Rims
Re: who is running a holley or edelbrock?
Re: Hotchkis Suspension
Re: UNBOUNCE: '72 to '67 rear end swap
Mondello
names
Re: paging stan
Re: Need Decals
Re: Mondello
Re: need vin decipherd?
SS1's-#810
Re: How to determine rear gears
rear gear codes
Re: names
Smoke from the carb
Olds Centennial video "Review" wanted
Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle
Re: 30,000 original mile '69 455? (Very long)
Re: who is running a holley or edelbrock?
Re: names
rocker arm adjustment
Re: Mondello
Hershey, PA Olds Show
Re: Hotchkis Suspension
Re: assembly manual
Pertronix Ignition
Re: Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle
Re: Smoke from the carb
Re: Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle
Re: names
Re: More on counting turns

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 11:57:06 -0700
From: "Chris Sparks (aka Mr. Ada)" <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Re: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)

Shang wrote:

> The W-31 had a VERY hot cam for a small block 233deg@.050 lift and .470
> lift. It was the only Olds motor to use a true flattop piston, which

I guess I'll show my ignorance.  The 233deg is not a temperature indicator is
it?

Or is it a relative rotation about the cam shaft axis 233 degrees from 
whereever
0
is defined to be?

- --
Chris Sparks
68 442 SC - Frosty
68 442 HT - Scarlet
68 442 HT - Saffron
82 DRB    - Dr. "B"
http://www.catalina-inter.net/mrada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 12:54:21 -0600
From: "Travis Adams" <cashmore@imt.net>
Subject: Hotchkis Suspension

Anyone using Hotchkis suspension components?  I just ordered springs,
a-arms, trailing arms, sway bars, and some misc. stuff.  I am hoping to see
dramatic improvement in handling.  They claim I will but I wanted some real
world input.  Thanks in advance.

Travis Adams
65 442 Sports Coupe

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:07:23 -0400 (EDT)
From: dsenko@UU.NET (Drew Senko)
Subject: Re: how to determine your gear ratio...

Nathyn wrote:

> if it isn't posi...put the car in neutral and turn your tire two
> revolutions and count the revolutions of the drive shaft...that will be
> approximately the gear ratio...so if you have a 3.73 gear ratio...the
> drive shaft will rotate about 3.73 revolutions........IF IT IS POSI, just
> the rotate the tire once........this is a  hell of a lot easier than
> taking the cover off....Nathyn

Igor responded:

> My girlfriends dad uses this method, and he tries it seven or eight times,
> gets a number that resembles a factory available gear ratio, and assumes that
> is what it is.  Okay.  I tried it before and could never get it quite right.
> First I get 1.5, then, 1.2, then 2, then (changing my approach) 5.5, and so
> on.  What are we doing wrong.  Anyways, the way I always did it was to pop


Let's suppose that you are trying to determine your gear ratio, and let's
also assume that it is 2.73.  According to Nathyn, if you turn your wheel
once, your drive shaft will turn 2.73 times.  But, how do you know it
turned 2.73 times, and not 2.56 times, or 3.08 times?  Ok, 3.08 would be
more noticeable, but I have another suggestion.

I think that turning the wheel once is not sufficient to get an accurate
reading on the situation.  So, if you turn the wheel ten times, and count
the revolutions of the driveshaft, you get a number like 25 for 2.56 gears,
27 for 2.73 gears, 30 for 3.08, 34 for 3.42 and so on.  It's a little more
work but it yields much more accurate results.  I doubt that one turn of
the wheel will tell you the difference between 3.23 and 3.42 gears.

 --                           ______________                     _
Drew Senko                   / Convertibles \                    |\
dsenko@uu.net                \_____Rule!____/     .__====-_._____|_\______
Vienna, VA, USA                            O      [   ___  |-     |  ___  \
http://members.aol.com/drewinva              o o  =\_//.\\_|______|_//.\\__)
______________________________________________________\_/____________\_/_____

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 14:10:51 -0500
From: "Smetana, Christopher" <csmetana@dowagro.com>
Subject: W31 specs  was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)

Greg, very interesting, but ....
>
>Engines were "select-fit" assembled.  Cylinder bores are honed to the "D"
>spec.
>and use "A" pistons resulting in a larger skirt clearance of .003" - .0035".
What does 'to the "D" spec and use "A" pistons' mean or what does it
entail?  Actually, I have a guess on the pistons but not positive.

>A 6 blade fan with a fan clutch was used.
Incidently, the fan clutch code stamped on my 69 is OU, which I believe
is still the original clutch, but not sure

>Oddly enough, there is no special W-31 coded distributor.
Hmm, I thought they did have special distributors, oh well

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
work: csmetana@dowagro.com    may only be good for about another week
home: chris@abcs.com

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:08:40 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)

Or is it a relative rotation about the cam shaft axis 233 degrees from
whereever
0 is defined to be?

- --
Chris Sparks
_____________

Close.  The 233 degrees refers to the angular travel of the _crankshaft_
during which the cam lobe exhibits greater than 0.050" of lift.  The 0.050"
number is chosen because of the difficulty in measuring the lobe's tangent
point which results in the actual first motion of the lifter.  Olds, which
was quite optimistic in it's cam duration numbers, defined this cam to have
308 degrees of duration at "zero" lift (more realistically at 0.002"-0.005"
of lift).  These make great advertising numbers but are pretty worthless in
determining the actual cam performance.  0.050" of lift is a pretty
universal number among cam grinders for measuring duration.  If you're
wondering why these numbers would be greater than 180 degrees (the duration
of the intake stroke), keep in mind that to account for air column inertia
and the near-zero piston speed at TDC, the intake is actually opened during
the exhaust stroke and doesn't close until after BDC on the compression
stroke.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 4442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:12:27 EDT
From: Mikeytvb@aol.com
Subject: Re: Big Mac's New Car

cardinal red 62 vette, convertable.    wow, i have got to learn how to hit
home-runs.

mikeytvb@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 14:55:28 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: More on counting turns

I suspect that a little additional info is required in the great
count-the-turns mystery when determining rear end ratio.  The problem with
an open diff, as I noted, is that if you get the spider gears turning,
you'll get the factor of two problem in your ratio.  The real problem
occurs in the case where on wheel doesn't turn, either because only one
wheel was jacked up or because there is excessive friction (_really_
excessive friction) in one wheel bearing.  If this is the case, then this
one wheel (and it's associated axle shaft and spider gear) will not turn at
all.  The center spider gears are turning 1:1 with the differential
carrier, with the result that the other spider gear and axle shaft will be
turning at 2:1 over the carrier revs.  (This is why you should have paid
attention in science class when they discussed simple machines)  If an open
rear is turned with both wheels off the ground and the wheels turn in
opposite directions, the spider gears will not enter into the final drive
ratio and you'll get the correct count.  The problem becomes one where one
side will hang up for part of a rev, say due to an out-of-round brake drum,
for example.  In this case you'd get 1:1 part of the time and 2:1 the rest
of the time, resulting in a count which is not correct (and which could
explain widely varying counts when the counting is perfomed several times).
The bottom line with a non-posi rear is to keep one side on the ground and
multiply by 2.  Note that a posi rear doesn't have this problem (unless the
posi is worn), as both wheels will always turn together, so the spider
gears never enter the picture.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:17:33 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: W31 specs was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)

What does 'to the "D" spec and use "A" pistons' mean or what does it
entail?  Actually, I have a guess on the pistons but not positive.
______________

Chris,

On the engine assebly line, Olds would measure the finished bore of the
engine and grade them A through D for final size (due to production
tolerances).  The matching A through D piston would be put in the hole to
yield the correct piston-to-wall clearance.  On the W-motors the blocks
would be honed to the largest size and the smallest pistons used to provide
additional pistion-to-wall clearance.  This hand-fitting was the "factory
blueprinting" touted on the W-cars and also was the reason why all W-30s
and W-31s were only built in Lansing.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 10:13:29 -0700
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@MCI2000.com>
Subject: Re: how to determine your gear ratio...

well your half right do it this way for non-posi jack it up put it in
neutral hold one tire and rotate the other one this will give you the
approximate ratio again only rotate the tire once the twice thing is off by
a wide margin this is how every high school kid decides he or she has a 4.10
when it is really a 2.41 then wonders why his "full or 3/4 race cam and
double pumper carb"wont perform worth diddly just an observation from years
past....kk no slamming intended no worries..
- -----Original Message-----
From: Nathyn M. Knipe <nmknipe@mailbox.syr.edu>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wednesday, September 09, 1998 9:19 AM
Subject: how to determine your gear ratio...


>if it isn't posi...put the car in neutral and turn your tire two
>revolutions and count the revolutions of the drive shaft...that will be
>approximately the gear ratio...so if you have a 3.73 gear ratio...the
>drive shaft will rotate about 3.73 revolutions........IF IT IS POSI, just
>the rotate the tire once........this is a  hell of a lot easier than
>taking the cover off....Nathyn
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 10:04:37 -0700
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@MCI2000.com>
Subject: Re: Ideas on 455 Aircraft Engine.

>Please explain to someone who will not see a 'strip anytime soon (no rad
catch
>can, driveshaft loop, or brain bucket and too much neoprene fuel hose) why
>magneto is superior to HEI in an aeronautical sense.
the magneto doesn't require an external power source to create a spark this
makes it possible to run the engine without the battery in the circuit not
necessary but could be nice in a pinch not strictly reliable but does have
its points better than relying on a wafer circuit ..kk
>
<< .. screw on plug wires eyelet held with a nut .. >>
>
>Eyelet?
>If you are advocating max contact between electrical leads then of course I
>concur. But still plead ignorance to what you said in the first place.
>I have not seen eyelets on spark plugs.
>Eyelet is not on the spark plug it is on the spark plug cable and is held
on by a nut to the plug if you know bosch platinum plugs then you have seen
the threaded nipple on the plug...kk
>Please explain?
>
>Thanks!
>
>BTW:
>It occurs to Karl that this swap would be easier with an olds 350 as these
>were avalable with FI in the later 70's and early 80's. or at the very
least,the only problem with the factory systems is that they dont have a
very broad learning curve the are too narrow minded so to speak to operate
in the aero environs from sealevel to 11000 feet if you have driven a late
model  through the mountains you have experienced the adjustment problems of
these systems the aircraft goes through thes altitudes with a greater speed
causing the computer controls to have to think at a greater rate than they
really can so they give up and go into limp mode so your climb rate goes to
he** in a handcart....kk
if I dont make my self clear on some of the things I post just let me know
and I will try to clarify I get pretty busy at times and rush through...kk
>307 intakes and cyl heads should fit old 350 blocks!
>
>That is a premise Karl fuly intends to build on...
>
>SOM
>&KA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:36:45 EDT
From: SHELTERMEN@aol.com
Subject: Intake question

Can an electric choke carb be used with a divorced choke manifold?  Doesn't
seem unreasonable to me, but what do I know?   Also does anyone have an
opinion on aftermarket intakes?  I've been told that the only gains to be made
by replacing a stock intake is that aftermarket is lighter. I seem to be
getting conflicting info on this subject.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:46:32 -0400
From: "Jason Adcock" <rocketolds@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: need vin decipherd?

>Rich,
>
>2 = Built in Canada
>G = General Motors
>3 = Oldsmobile
>AR = this represents the model (I think) but I don't know what AR stands
>for??

The A is for manual belts (VIN 4 is for automatic belts...in the Cutlass
Ciera or Firenza?).
The R is for Cutlass Supreme. (K is for Cutlass Calais, M is for Cutlass
Supreme Brougham).

>47 = 2-door
>A = engine (Buick 231)
>0 = Don't know??

It's a zero, for the check digit.

>C = year (1982)
>2 = Assembly plant (Therese, Quebec, Canada)
>317,828 = Production sequence number

Sequence number starts with 300001, so yours was built early in the
production run.

>Stan

Jason Adcock
mailto:rocketolds@vt.edu
http://www.cslab.vt.edu/~jadcock

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 12:51:12 -0700
From: "Chuck Cole" <coleboys@netbridge.net>
Subject: '72 to '67 rear end swap

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have a 67 442 which does not have posi.  I can buy a 72 Vista Cruiser =
cheap for the rear end.  Does anyone know if they will swap cleanly?

- ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDDBF0.85F06480
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	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
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<META content=3D'"MSHTML 4.72.3110.7"' name=3DGENERATOR>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 size=3D2>I have a 67 442 which does not have =
posi.&nbsp;=20
I can buy a 72 Vista Cruiser cheap for the rear end.&nbsp; Does anyone =
know if=20
they will swap cleanly?</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_0004_01BDDBF0.85F06480--

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 15:14:00 EDT
From: jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
Subject: Setting up a OLDS website

Hi,

I'm looking for some advice.

My name is Jeff Zeilmann (OCA# 029185) and you may have seen me on and off
the Olds list site now for a couple years.  I have been asked by my local
Olds club (the St. Louis Archway Olds club) to look into setting up a web
site for our local chapter.  I have just begun looking into it, so I am wide
open for suggestions.  I have never created a web site before, so I am a
novice in this field.  I am working at getting a current copy of MS
Frontpage, and that should be good start, but I sure could use any advice
you may have on getting a relatively inexpensive web site started and
maintaining it going forward.  I have a great deal of technical experience,
so I'm sure that I will have no problem catching on to what it will take (I
have been  a Network administrator for AT&T, Lucent Technologies, IBM, and
currently I work as a consultant for a company called Datanomics supporting
Philips Consumer Communications).

Please let me know what steps to take in order to get our club into the 90's
(before the 90's are over :-)

Thanks a bunch,


Jeff Zeilmann
  ^
/ | \
| | |
|/|\|
\ | /
  |
SMTP:jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
'68 Cutlass Supreme
'69 Cutlass S Convertible
'69 4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 15:05:00 EDT
From: jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
Subject: (Event): All-Oldsmobile Funshow

For anyone in the St. Louis or Mid-West area:

BRING YOUR OLDSMOBILE....

The next REAL big show that you don't want to miss is the 15th Annual
All-Oldsmobile Funshow.  My wife and I again are organizing Archway
Oldsmobile's Annual Funshow this year.  It is a car show/swap meet that is
open to the public and will be held on Sunday, Sept 13, 1998.   This is a
successful and growing event, and we anticipate the largest one ever for
this year.  It is held at "The Heart of St. Charles Banquet center" parking
lot, which is right next to Highway 70 (30 feet from the highway) and fully
visible to thousands of people driving by on HWY 70.  It is also
conveniently located next to Historic downtown St. Charles Riverfront
Landing, and right next door to the Station Casino-St. Charles (Also one of
our proud sponsors).  We had a good showing last year of old to new Olds.  A
total of well over 100 cars were on display.  This year we anticipate the
largest turnout ever.


I will be providing the Oldies music (I used to work for Jukebox 96 FM here
in St. Louis doing an oldies show, and have been doing mobile DJing since
1982).  If you go to the show, make sure you come by and say hi.  I will be
at either of two places, the DJ table, or near my car (Blue 1969 4-4-2 with
factory white racing stripes on the hood)  Also, food and beverages will be
available.

Here is the information:
SUNDAY, Sept. 13, 1998, 8am-4pm - St. Charles MO - Archway Oldmobile
Funshow.  Car Show/swap meet that is open to the public, and held by The
Archway Oldsmobile Club of St. Louis from 8am to 5pm.  Have a unique or
classic Olds?  Come show it!  It is held at "The Heart of St. Charles
Banquet center" parking lot right at HWY 70 and 5th street.  Prizes, and
trophies given away in 16 categories.  Cruise by and check out the show
while the DJ plays the golden Oldies.  For more information call John
Palmberger (314)-355-4864 or Jeff Zeilmann (314) 939-4613.

We are welcoming any and all Oldsmobiles to participate.  Your car does not
have to be show quality to show it.  By doing this, we should have a great
representation of all of Oldsmobiles different models, makes and years.  You
don't have to enter your Olds in the competition to show it.  but, if you
wish to compete in one of the 16 categories, the entry fee is only $10.00.

Please let me know if you need more specific directions, and I will be glad
to provide them.  If you would like information about lodgings, I will be
more than happy to provide it.  It actually is being held in a huge parking
lot that is shared by the St. Charles Inn, and across the street is a Best
Western (the Hotel that has a huge Noahs Ark in front of it ).  There are 3
hotels within one block of the show, and nearly a dozen within a one mile
radius of the show.

ps. The '69 4-4-2 will definitely be there (just got the carb rebuilt!)
  .
/ | \
| | |
|/|\|
\ | /
Jeff Zeilmann
1605 Elizabeth Ellen Ct.
St. Peters, MO 63376-6542

Home Phone #: (314) 939-4613
Daytime #: (314) 891-7915
SMTP:jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
'69 4-4-2, '69 Cutlass S Convertible, '68 Cutlass Supreme,

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:03:20 -0500
From: "Smetana, Christopher" <csmetana@dowagro.com>
Subject: RE: W31 specs was RE: 70 350 motors (was Re: MAYBE W-32?)

>
>On the engine assebly line, Olds would measure the finished bore of the
>engine and grade them A through D for final size (due to production

>additional pistion-to-wall clearance.  This hand-fitting was the "factory
>blueprinting" touted on the W-cars and also was the reason why all W-30s
>and W-31s were only built in Lansing.
>
A-ha, Thanks Joe

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
work: csmetana@dowagro.com   may only be good for another week
home: chris@abcs.com

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 12:53:43 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon

Check out the specifications page linked off my web page at
http://www.ior.com/~tlentz/hurst.html

At least for '84, there is listed the "power teams" you could get with
the Cutlass, which are specific rear end, tranny, and engine
combinations.

There WAS a towing package available, and the 3.73:1 rear was only
available on the H/O in '84.

I've heard rumors that G-body wagons with the towing package also got
the 3.73:1 8.5" rear, but they remain as elusive as SMW 403's.

Tom.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 12:55:17 -0700
From: Greg Rollin <supercars@transport.com>
Subject: Re: W31 specs

Smetana, Christopher wrote:

> Greg, very interesting, but ....
>
> What does 'to the "D" spec and use "A" pistons' mean or what does it
> entail?  Actually, I have a guess on the pistons but not positive.

Before I had a chance to clarify, Joe P. provided the correct explanation.

> Incidently, the fan clutch code stamped on my 69 is OU, which I believe
> is still the original clutch, but not sure

OU have the correct one. (Sorry, couldn't resist).

> Hmm, I thought they did have special distributors, oh well

All W-31's used their respective years standard 350 4 barrel distributor.

Greg Rollin
Supercars Unlimited (Where Cutlass/4-4-2 is ALL we do!) 503-244-8249
http://www.supercarsunlimited.com
E-mail: supercars@transport.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 16:14:04 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Intake question

Can an electric choke carb be used with a divorced choke manifold?
_________

Yes, provided you're not attempting to adapt an electric choke kit to a
carb designed to use a divorced choke.  The manifold doesn't matter, but
the carb does.  If you're simply adding a new carb which already has an
electric choke, no problem.

=============

...Also does anyone have an opinion on aftermarket intakes?
_________

An opinion?  From this crew?  ;-)

The answer is, of course, it depends.  An aluminum intake will certainly
save many pounds over the cast iron original, however other performance
improvements depend on the intake and the intended application of the car.
In addition, the intake must be matched with the rest of the engine (carb,
cam, exhaust) to fully realize gains.  For example, a large runner single
plane intake will definitely improve top end HP when properly matched with
a carb, cam, and exhaust.  This setup will not, however, show much of an
improvement around town (in fact, it will likely reduce low-end torque).
OTOH, a smaller-runner two plane intake like the Performer will show some
improvements at the low end but will likely not have any benefit at the
track.  The bottom line is that the car operates as a system (weight,
gearing, transmission, and tires all have an effect, in addition to the
various possible engine mods) and any one change must be optimized with an
eye towards the total setup to realize maximum improvements.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:58:03 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 425 Toro into a '65 442 4-spd.

No longer on the list, respond directly to u17058@uic.edu if you have info.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Paul Brillhart <u17058@uic.edu>
Subject: 425 Toro into a '65 442 4-spd.

I pulled the 425 from the '66 Toro I picked up a week ago last
Saturday.  I couldn't find anyone who wanted the entire car and could
pick it up over Labor Day (ran out of time to part it and cut up the
frame too) so off it went to Victory Auto Wreckers.  Too bad, the car
had 25,000 miles on it, but was hit in the rear by a semi.  Still had
plenty of good sheetmetal, however the vinyl top adsorbed rain, rusted
out the hard top which then introduced rain to the carpet and rusted out
the floors.

Now to my questions.  I have a '65 442, 4-spd.  Other than changing the
oil filter mount, are there any other mods or problms I will encounter
in putting this engine in my car?  I haven't check for the z-bar mount
yet and I noticed tat the starter on the Toro was on the passanger
side.  I assume that I can ount my starter on the driver's side.

Also, does anyone know the specs for the cam in the 425?  I know it has
0.921 in diameter lifters, 0.472 lift and 55 degrees overlap, but I was
wondering what the lift at 0.05 was.


Thanks in advance.


Paul Brillhart

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:59:10 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: Goofy required options...(sorta like Hurst/Olds A/C)

Problems with Tom's address; forwarding the first of several.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Goofy required options...(sorta like Hurst/Olds A/C)

If it is like my 80 Turbo Trans AM, if you wanted the Turbo engine, AC
was required as was the special THM350, not C.  No manual trans was
offered with the Turbo 301.  Bummer!  Probably break the wimpy 4 or 5
sp.  The Turbo 301 had only 210 hp, but a very healthy 345 ft lbs
torque.  I was able to 99% of the time lay a hard scratch from 1-2
shift, and about 50% lay it from 2-3 shift.  I also did a 1/4mi of
14.21@97.3, with 4030 lbs.  3.08 gears 28 in tall tires.  Anyone
computer HP and Torque from that?  I figured 283 hp (rear wheel) and
about 400 lbs/ft torque.

If you have ever driven a Turbo car, you will not want to go back, they
are FUN!!

I do not understand why GM insists on strange option packages like
mandatory AC, Auto I can see, if the manual trans cannot handle it, then
don't offer it.  Like the Z34 Lumina, 1991 the Z34 got a 215hp 215
lbs/ft torque 3.4L, with a manual, but it had a lot of warranty
problems, hence, kill off the manual trans option.  Whereas the SHO gets
a manual for years and no auto!

I just want to turbo my 350 Rocket!!

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:58:01 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Cutlass trunk floor...

Peter,

I will go for the new one from year one. They have sent a postcard for
first order discount of 20%. I could not withstand and they assured me it
will not be long until the thing comes in. I understand that you will not
sell it cheap since you got to cut it out and wrap it and so forth but
with the 20% discount I am around 80 bucks for a new one piece trunk floor...

Just keep in mind guys, when you get your first year one catalog, wait
with ordering (if you can) till they send you the discount postcard to get
you started!

Thanks for your help.
George


- --------------------------------------------------------------
'68 Cuttlass S Conv.
http://estimator.camd.lsu.edu/georg/sparetime/olds.html
- --------------------------------------------------------------

On Fri, 4 Sep 1998, Todd Williams wrote:

> At 04:51 PM 9/4/98 EDT, you wrote:
> >George-
> >The trunk floor I have is pretty nice and will work well for you. I am in
> >SoCal and will have to cut it out if interested.
> >$75+ UPS
> >
> >Peter
> >
> hey will it fit a 72 cutlass supreme ? if so im very interested
> Todd (todd@wvadventures.net)
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:59:57 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon

According to what I have read, with the V8 option in 1985, 3 spd trans
THM200C got ONLY 2.14's, and OD got 2.56.  I will have to scan some of
the literature I have.  I think OD and 3.23 would be an ultimate daily
driver gear ratio.

But if you have a high altitude V6, you got 3.23.  The highest ratio
that is not a 442.  The 3.73 REQUIRES the 442 option.  The V6 got 2.73
standard.

2.14, 2.29, 2.41, 2.56, 2.73, 2.93, 3.08 and 3.23 were the only listed
ratio's, and 3.73 was in the 8.5 in for the 442.  No 3.73 in 7.5/7.625
in form for the Cutlass, although the Monte Carlo SS had 3.73 with the
7.5/7.625 ring gear.

As for special order, I guess you could get the other.  But from what I
have found, there were no high alt gears for a 307 car, just the V6.
For 1985 I have never seen nor heard of other than 2.14/THM200C or
2.56/THM200 4R with the "Y" 307 V8...Factory installed.  442 not
included....<g>

Anyone out there have an 85 that came with other than that?  I would
like to find out if there where other special options your car had,
please email directly.

I don't know if there was a trailer package available, does anyone know
for 81-88?

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:00:28 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Re: Rear gear on '86 Salon

To ID the rear you have, take a visit to
http://ni.umd.edu/gnttype/www/axle_codes.html.

The code is stamped on the right hand (pass side) axle tube, forward
facing, usually covered by years of gunk.

Sometimes it is easier to pull the diff cover!!

Good luck!!

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:01:13 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: RE: Best Quadrajet carb's?

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE: Best Quadrajet carb's?

I shouldn't tell my secret, but...

The 80 Turbo Trans AM is probably the last production car from Detroit
with a 800 CFM carb, and it is a special Q-Jet.  It will work well on
any other GM product that can use the fuel inlet "normal", ie, not like
a Ch#vy.  It goes straight in.  The only significant difference is the
vacuum under the APT metering rods is EXTERNAL, not internal.  No
problem!  Add a vacuum line to it!!    (Else you will KILL mileage!!)
This was controlled by the PEVR, Power Enrichment Vacuum Valve.

This is not a computer controlled carb!!  81 was 80 was not, but the 81
carb should be a great hi performance carb for any computer controlled
car.

This Q-Jet also came with the richest secondary metering rods ever, DX,
near needle sized at the tips, and a very rapid rate to get there.  It
has the absolute richest 70% to 100% secondary operation.  No other is
richer from 70%+ secondary operation.  This is needed for the Turbo
boost at 10 PSI and no computer to control it.  ESC is part of the
distributor, but is stand alone.  (hint, make that 11:1 compression live
on pump gas???  Works for me!!)

AND, they also have pull over enrichment for the primaries, something to
deliver even more fuel when under high load/high rpm situations.  This
is a special feature found only on large engine carbs.

Ok, the drawback?  It has 51 primary metering rods, sorta lean, so, you
change it to be richer based on whatever car you have.  I was designed
for a single plane intake on a 301.

No mine is not for sale!!  But I can dig up the carb numbers if anyone
needs them, just email me directly.

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:02:38 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: '72 to '67 rear end swap

Not on the list; respond directly to coleboys@netbridge.net if you can
assist.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	"Chuck Cole" <coleboys@netbridge.net>
Subject: '72 to '67 rear end swap

I have a 67 442 which does not have posi.  I can buy a 72 Vista Cruiser =
cheap for the rear end.  Does anyone know if they will swap cleanly?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 17:18:22 -0400
From: Miguel Morales <Miguel.Morales@mci.com>
Subject: '83-4 H/O SS-III Rims

I've got 3 rims I'd like to sell for an '84 Hurst/Olds. One is newer
than the rest and still has the clear coat. The other two have been
stripped of clear coat and one is straight and the other is straight
enough to use as a spare unless it is repaired. It is currently 3+ on
the balance machine for weights. Reply privately to
Miguel.Morales@mci.com if you want these. I am asking $125, $75, and
$50. If you want all three make me an offer so I can get them out of
much needed storage.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:27:55 EDT
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: who is running a holley or edelbrock?

In a message dated 9/9/98 1:05:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time, KarlAune@aol.com
writes:

<< Hmmm.

 "Smoke" should not be caused by the carburetor.

 My information on jetting is that the only thing that should affect jetting
is
 displacement. If your car has been overbored, then changing one jet to the
 next higher # is probably feasible. Maybe.

 What is your displacement, what are your jet #'s and what is the model # of
 your current Q-jet?

 Other info on your Oldsmobile might also help.

 (Sorry, I joined this thread late)
  >>

ok, lets see here.  the qjet is a '80 model out of a delta 88.  jet #s?  oh
boy..  i cant remember now.  i didnt drill the jets very much at all, but the
exact amount i also cant remember.  the car is a '78 cutlass with a 355 olds,
9:1 compression, #7 heads, edelbrock performer camshaft and intake, hei
distributor out of a '79 toro w/350, 3.73 gears in the rear.  you say smoke
cant be caused by the carb?  are you sure?  the engine has 20,000 miles on the
rebuild, and i did that.  it was my 4th enginei have done.  i had the heads
done, ($400 invested in them) so i know they are good, too.  everything was
checked (plastigage on the crank, checked all tolerances....)  if its oil,
where could it be coming from?  why only when its wot?  runningwise, the
engine runs really strong.  just kinda sucks looking back when i beat sombody
and see smoke!  makes your car look like a piece of crap.
jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:31:44 -0400 (EDT)
From: The Viking <avar@infinet.com>
Subject: Re: Hotchkis Suspension

On Wed, 9 Sep 1998, Travis Adams wrote:

> Anyone using Hotchkis suspension components?  I just ordered springs,
> a-arms, trailing arms, sway bars, and some misc. stuff.  I am hoping to see
> dramatic improvement in handling.  They claim I will but I wanted some real
> world input.  Thanks in advance.
>
> Travis Adams
> 65 442 Sports Coupe
>
You will LOVE the way she handles.. Their ads are right on.. like on tracks


Al Varhus
Columbus, Ohio
http://www.infinet.com/~avar
http://www.infinet.com/~avar/olds.html
Oldsmobile Club of America # 29111
  Mid Ohio Chapter #136
  Gem City Rockets


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:34:42 EDT
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: UNBOUNCE: '72 to '67 rear end swap

In a message dated 9/9/98 5:08:25 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
ab348@chebucto.ns.ca writes:

<< I have a 67 442 which does not have posi.  I can buy a 72 Vista Cruiser =
 cheap for the rear end.  Does anyone know if they will swap cleanly?
  >>

i think the only difference is the vista cruiser's rear is about 1" wider.
1/2" on each side isnt much.  seems like thats the only difference.
jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 15:22:13 -0700
From: "Greg" <gjackso1@san.rr.com>
Subject: Mondello

Does anyone know of Bob Mondello Oldsmobile engine shop. If so could you
give me his number.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:29:58 EDT
From: MFATZII@aol.com
Subject: names

     Saw a car today called a "Maserati" with the #'s 228.....can anybody shed
some light on this?  Is Maserati the make or model?  Didn't really like the
car but I do like to keep up on the knowledge so when I see something I know
what the hell I'm looking at.  You know, kinda like the Moonbeam Tiger, not
too many people know what that is.....By the way the Maserati is not even
close to the similary spelled Lamborghini MaZerati......
     Now that the subject is started...why is there an Dodge Neon   AND   a
Plymouth Neon??  More? ok. um lets see, How about Suburban?  one by Chevrolet
and another by GMC??  Or the fact that Honda makes and Odyssey when the
origional Odyssey was a 2wd off road buggy type thingy......Sure hope Mazda
dosen't decide to make a Cutlass.........


Ryan (MFatzII@aol.com)
Lincoln,   Nebraska  (Home of the Cornhuskers, too bad they suck !)
<<Turn it on, Wind it up, Blow it out, OLDS-MO-BILE>>

56 88 4dr Sedan  (Project Rocket)
<A HREF="http://www.mergetel.com/~lee/cutlass/rides/wieders2/">Click here</A>
85 Cutlass Supreme Brougham
89 Chevy Beretta CL


    888            888
  8      8       8       8
  8      8       8       8
    8  8           8   8         LIVES
  8      8       8       8
  8     8        8       8
    888            888

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:45:41 EDT
From: OldsGuyGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: paging stan

did you sned it,,thanks    jeff....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 17:55:25 -0600
From: Matthew Mayer <mmayer@interaccess.com>
Subject: Re: Need Decals

Ulysses Melen wrote:
>
> To whom,
>
> I have a friend that is looking for the decal package off an 85 Cutlass 442.
> I believe what he's specifically looking for is the 442 gold door decals.
> Since I really don't know that much about that year can I get some help.  Is
> this a question for Dr. Decal??
>
Since this has come up twice in the last few days...here courtesy of
Brad Nicholson are the 85-87 442 decal part numbers.  You should be able
to get the "442"'s from your dealer.  Otherwise, try a search on the
part number at www.partsvoice.com.

Here ya go:

Part Numbers for 1985-87 442 Exterior Stripes

                                Black    Gray     Dk Blue  Dk Red
White
Part Description                1985-87  1985-87  1986-87  1986-87  1985
==========================================================================
Stripe: F/Bpr Rub Strip - RH    22528704 same     same     same     same
Stripe: F/Bpr Rub Strip - LH    22528705 same     same     same     same
Decal: F/Bpr Fascia "442"       25528697 same     same     same     same
Decal: F/Fascia "442" (1987)    25530186 same     same     same     same
Stripe: F/FDR-RH                22528698 22528736 25529168 25529174
22528722
Stripe: F/FDR-LH                22528699 22528737 25529169 25529175
22528723
Decal: Door Letters "442"       22528708 same     same     same     same
Door: Stripe                    22528700 22528738 25529172 25529173
22528724
Stripe: R/QTR-RH                22528702 22528740 25529170 25529176
22528726
Stripe: R/QTR-LH                22528703 22528741 25529171 25529177
22528727
Stripe: R/BPR Rub Strip-RH      22528706 same      same    same     same
Stripe: R/BPR Rub Strip-LH      22528707 same      same    same     same
Trunk "442" (Gold)              22528697 same      same    same     same
Emblem: Trunk "Oldsmobile"      20000969 same      same    same     same

The parts that are color specific are listed.  If "same" is listed, that
means it is just gold stripes w/o a color backing as a seperator for the
top
and bottom colors.
- --
- ---Matt
Chicago, IL

- --------------------------------------------------------
mailto:mmayer@interaccess.com    |  VM: 800-481-1323
- --------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 19:11:11 +0100
From: Matt Cremean <creme1ma@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: Mondello

Greg wrote:
>
> Does anyone know of Bob Mondello Oldsmobile engine shop. If so could you
> give me his number.

Uh, do you mean JOE Mondello, or is this some other yet undiscovered
Mondello that we haven't heard of yet?

Joe Mondello

Mondello Performance Products, Inc.
1103 Paso Robles Street
Paso Robles, CA  93446
(805) 237-8808

- --
*************
Matt Cremean
mailto:creme1ma@cmuvm.csv.cmich.edu
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+
1975 Cutlass S Hardtop Coupe (250 L-6 1bbl) "parts car"
1973 Cutlass Supreme Hardtop Coupe (350 V-8 4bbl) "The Oldsmoslow"
1970 Cutlass S Holiday Coupe (350 V-8 2bbl) "The Unit"
1983 Ch*vrolet C*price (305 V-8 4bbl) "The Blue Taxi"
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/
**************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 16:09:21 -0700 (PDT)
From: S-MAN <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: need vin decipherd?

- ---RICH6986@aol.com wrote:
>
> 2g3ar47a0c2317828    i dont know if the 0 is the letter or #  but i
have seen
> many other vins on the list and just want to see what mine is   TIA
Rich
>
Ok....
2=Canada
G= GM
3=Oldsmobile
AR=not sure...see below.*
47=2-door
A=231 v-6
0=check digit <what ever that means>
C=1982
2=St. Therese,Quebec....plant of manufacture

*the discriptions I have are....GK = Salon, GM = Brougham, GR=
Supreme,A= Non passive/manual belts?
and Y= Delta 88 Royale Brougham


SMAN
==
John McJunkin  mailto:super442@yahoo.com    ICQ # 16956740
TOPLESS--1985 Cutlass--frog442's 84---my 69 442
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be V-8 !
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
Check out my Burnout page-send me pics of your's and I'll add it
- -http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/Burnouts

_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 17:22:21 -0500
From: "Tony Eichholz" <eichholz@liljasper.com>
Subject: SS1's-#810

Hey Guys;
       Where can I find two 810 SS1's that I can put on my 67? Any info will
be appreciated.Thanks Tony

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 16:51:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: S-MAN <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: How to determine rear gears

Hi all,
        Just another way...although NOT totally reliable....like if
rear has been changed....or wrong code....but anyway,check the RPO
label under the trunk lid....verify VIN# ....if all is right you can
at least determine what was originally in the car.
Rear axle codes have a "G" prefix:
GH2=2.29
GM8=2.56
GT4=3.73
GU1=2.41
GU2=2.73
GU4=3.08
GU5=3.23
G72=2.14
G87=8.5 RING GEAR
G89=7.5 RING GEAR
G80= Anti-Spin

SMAN
==
John McJunkin  mailto:super442@yahoo.com    ICQ # 16956740
TOPLESS--1985 Cutlass--frog442's 84---my 69 442
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be V-8 !
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
Check out my Burnout page-send me pics of your's and I'll add it
- -http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/Burnouts

_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 16:51:43 -0700 (PDT)
From: S-MAN <super442@yahoo.com>
Subject: rear gear codes

 Hi all,
>         Just another way...although NOT totally reliable....like if
> rear has been changed....or wrong code....but anyway,check the RPO
> label under the trunk lid....verify VIN# ....if all is right you can
> at least determine what was originally in the car.
> Rear axle codes have a "G" prefix:
> GH2=2.29
> GM8=2.56
> GT4=3.73
> GU1=2.41
> GU2=2.73
> GU4=3.08
> GU5=3.23
> G72=2.14
> G87=8.5 RING GEAR
> G89=7.5 RING GEAR
> G80= Anti-Spin
>
> SMAN

==
John McJunkin  mailto:super442@yahoo.com    ICQ # 16956740
TOPLESS--1985 Cutlass--frog442's 84---my 69 442
1982 Cutlass Cruiser Wagon(g-body)--soon to be V-8 !
http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/
Check out my Burnout page-send me pics of your's and I'll add it
- -http://members.tripod.com/~SuperOlds/Burnouts

_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 17:13:33 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Re: names

At 06:29 PM 9/9/98 -0400, you wrote:
>     Saw a car today called a "Maserati" with the #'s 228.....can anybody
shed
>some light on this?  Is Maserati the make or model?

Maserati is a car maker. I'm not quite sure which
european contry they are from though.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 17:11:36 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Smoke from the carb

>   you say smoke
>cant be caused by the carb?  are you sure?  the engine has 20,000 miles on
the
>rebuild, and i did that.  it was my 4th enginei have done.  i had the heads
>done, ($400 invested in them) so i know they are good, too.  everything was
>checked (plastigage on the crank, checked all tolerances....)  if its oil,
>where could it be coming from?  why only when its wot?  runningwise, the
>engine runs really strong.  just kinda sucks looking back when i beat sombody
>and see smoke!  makes your car look like a piece of crap.

what color smoke are you getting? If it is black it is almost certainly a
really rich carb

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 20:22:54 EDT
From: SpeedCom@aol.com
Subject: Olds Centennial video "Review" wanted

Hello list,

By now, you have all heard my whinging about not finding visuals on the
torpedo-bodied 2 dr. "sedanettes" form 1940 through 1947. Well, I'm still
beating that drum, as I am trying to learn enough to make an informed
purchase.

I have seen reference on the Web Ring to the Centennial video published by
Doug Newman. Would someone who has that video tell me whether there is a good
deal of coverage of these cars? I am not looking for coverage of the 48 and
later "pointy" torpedos, just the ones up to 47. I don't know exactly how to
ask for an evaluation, whether minutes of play, or number of cars of this
type.

I realize that many might say about the tape "If it's Olds, buy it" but I am
looking specifically for those years. I don't want too much temptation :-)

Thanks and Cheers/Carron

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 20:31:58 EDT
From: DROLDS350@aol.com
Subject: Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle

Will anybody on the list be attending the Carlisle at the new Bloomington
Center? I will be there next Saturday. Anybody els going?
Jim McKeague
htttp://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 20:36:25 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 30,000 original mile '69 455? (Very long)

B. Sanders wrote:

> OK, here's the story.  I found the car in a Junkyard in Las Vegas.
> According to the yard men, the car had just been pulled in a couple days
> before, and they got it from a middle-aged man who called them to come and
> get it.

> Then he dropped the car and hooked a chain to
> the engine and literally tore it the rest of the way out of the car.

A moment of silence, please.  One of our brethren has fallen...

What a shame...

:(

Paul
- --
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 20:37:56 EDT
From: Z28442@aol.com
Subject: Re: who is running a holley or edelbrock?

Can you tell me how to stop all this E-Mail.I'm going on
Vacation for two week and don't need all this mail
thanks

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 21:00:54 -0400
From: Mark Hahn <mahahn@fuse.net>
Subject: Re: names

Italy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 18:07:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: ef01@sprynet.com
Subject: rocker arm adjustment

Plan to pull the heads off the delta 88 this weekend and lap the valves and
replace the lifters. How do I adjust the rocker arms on a 1966 425? I have a
factory manual, but I think the instructions are wrong. The manual says,
"1) torque bolts to 35 ft-lbs
 2) position rocker arms in proper location
 3) coat wear points with...
 4) install the hardened flange bolts. Torque to 20 ft-lbs.
Note: make sure both lifters are in the closed valve position when installing
nuts."
What? How can I install bolts twice. Also no where on head are there any nuts,
both my rockers are bolted to the head. My rockers are held down bt a c shaped
thing that is called in the picture a rocker arm pivot. Am I missing something
here? Is to possible that the chassis service manual is not perfect?
Last question can you use new lifters on an old cam I am of the opinion that 
the
 cam won't no there are new lifters there, but I have had a few arguements at
work about this.

Thanks,

Erik

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:10:01 EDT
From: GChris1511@aol.com
Subject: Re: Mondello

Was just looking through AOL ads.  Guy is selling a 57 olds funeral car.
Built by the Comet Coach Co. has 27,000 miles.  Blue wt new interior. Reply to
Ddan950597@AOL.com.  he says needs TLC.  Anyone interested?  He states that it
is a one of a kind car.  That's all I know.
Jerry

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 21:18:19 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Hershey, PA Olds Show

Just a friendly reminder and shameless plug...

The Blue/Gray Chapter of the Oldsmobile Club of America will be hosting
their 13th Annual Fall Meet on Sunday, Sept. 20th at E.O. Miller
Chevrolet/Oldsmobile, 515 E Chocolate Ave (Route 422), Hershey PA.
Pre-registration is $8 if received by 9/13 and $10 day of show.  3
awards in 8 classes awarded by participant voting, plus Best of Show and
Long Distance.  Dash plaque and goody bag to the first 50 registrants,
door prize ticket to all registrants.  50/50 tickets available for
purchase.  Food vendor on site.  Registration 9am to Noon.  Awards and
door prizes presented at 3pm.  All list members welcome.

Paul
- --
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:28:40 EDT
From: KASOLDS@aol.com
Subject: Re: Hotchkis Suspension

I knew someone who had Hotchkis suspension on a 85 Monte, and he said it was a
big improvement.

Keith

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 20:34:09 -0500
From: Dan Williams <442much@plutonium.net>
Subject: Re: assembly manual

Yes, most of the assembly manuals are *VERY* poor.  I'm assuming the one
you got from Fusicks is the one printed by T/S.  There are other copies out
there that are better.  I got a much better version from a friend of Mark
Cornea's.  I have also seen other ones that the two that I own ('68) and
they all seem to be missing different pages.

- -Dan

George wrote:

> Hi Guys,
>
> finally got a shop and assembly manual from fusicks. I like the shop
> manual and I am sure it is worth the money but the assembly manual is
> really poor quality! I think this must come from the problem of copying
> blueprints. Do you guys have real bad quality assembly manuals too or is
> this something I should not take as a fact and send the thing back?
>
> On some pages I can't read the stuff and can't even make out bolts and
> other importhant details!
>
> Regards,
> George
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> '68 Cuttlass S Conv.
> http://estimator.camd.lsu.edu/georg/sparetime/olds.html
> --------------------------------------------------------------


- --
Dan Williams                            442Much@plutonium.net
Marion, IA                                     68 442 Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Sep 1998 20:40:42 -0500
From: Dan Williams <442much@plutonium.net>
Subject: Pertronix Ignition

Is anbody using the Pertronix electronic ignition that replaces points?
Any comments on any others?  The Pertronix is only two wires, looks
stock and cost around $65.  That seems like a good deal to me.

- --
Dan Williams                            442Much@plutonium.net
Marion, IA                                     68 442 Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:35:55 EDT
From: SpeedCom@aol.com
Subject: Re: Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle

In a message dated 9/9/98
 7:<BR34:<BR48 PM Central Daylight Time, DROLDS350@aol.com writes:

> htttp://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html

im,

That URL won't parse (on AOL !!!). anything wrong with it??

And, uh,.....what's a Carlisle?

Cheers/Carron

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:38:21 EDT
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: Smoke from the carb

In a message dated 9/9/98 8:19:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
bob149@efortress.com writes:

<< what color smoke are you getting? If it is black it is almost certainly a
 really rich carb
  >>

the smoke is black.  when i crank the car while its kinda warm, it takes about
3 seconds for it to fire.  i know this isnt WAY too long, but i like it to
fire within 1 second of turning the key.  when it fires after the 3 seconds of
cranking, i get a puff or two of black smoke.  im also starting to wonder if
this might be an ignition problem.  maybe i need to do a little work on it.
jeremy

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:42:19 -0400
From: "Jason Adcock" <rocketolds@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: Bloomington, ILL ` Carlisle

>> htttp://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html
>
>That URL won't parse (on AOL !!!). anything wrong with it??

Yeah, there are 3 t's in the "http".

Try: http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html

Jason Adcock
mailto:rocketolds@vt.edu
http://www.cslab.vt.edu/~jadcock

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 21:47:16 -0400
From: "Peter Berusch" <pber710840@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: names

Maserati was a very high line manufacturer of Italian vehicles. Known for
speed and handling and exquisite style.  Not for endurance, reliability, or
ease of maintainence.  I owned one called Mistrael.  This, in Italian, means
Wind, which this car broke regularly.  When they were bought out by Chrysler
Corp., they finished their plummet into the maw of hell, and disappeared
from the Earth.  Peter.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Mark Hahn <mahahn@fuse.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wednesday, September 09, 1998 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: names


>Italy
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Sep 1998 22:08:27 -0400
From: "Andersons" <robertan@cfw.com>
Subject: Re: More on counting turns

I agree with Joe's explanation- it's a pretty good explanation of the
"simple machine" model of the gearset.  Except, that is, for this part
(snip):

If an open
rear is turned with both wheels off the ground and the wheels turn in
opposite directions, the spider gears will not enter into the final drive
ratio and you'll get the correct count.  (unsnip)

The real deal with this situation, is that the driveshaft would not turn at
all- you would not get any count at all.  Remember, with both rear wheels
up, you can turn one forward and the other one back, with the trans in PARK.
That's why, with one held still, you get a X2 ratio increase with the other.
Keep 1 wheel on ground, turn the other twice, and count your mark on the
driveshaft carefully.  The X10 suggestion is also exellent for increasing
resolution of the measurement.

Just love this physics talk, don't you?
- -----Original Message-----
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM <Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wednesday, September 09, 1998 3:11 PM
Subject: More on counting turns


>I suspect that a little additional info is required in the great
>count-the-turns mystery when determining rear end ratio.  The problem with
>an open diff, as I noted, is that if you get the spider gears turning,
>you'll get the factor of two problem in your ratio.  The real problem
>occurs in the case where on wheel doesn't turn, either because only one
>wheel was jacked up or because there is excessive friction (_really_
>excessive friction) in one wheel bearing.  If this is the case, then this
>one wheel (and it's associated axle shaft and spider gear) will not turn at
>all.  The center spider gears are turning 1:1 with the differential
>carrier, with the result that the other spider gear and axle shaft will be
>turning at 2:1 over the carrier revs.  (This is why you should have paid
>attention in science class when they discussed simple machines)  If an open
>rear is turned with both wheels off the ground and the wheels turn in
>opposite directions, the spider gears will not enter into the final drive
>ratio and you'll get the correct count.  The problem becomes one where one
>side will hang up for part of a rev, say due to an out-of-round brake drum,
>for example.  In this case you'd get 1:1 part of the time and 2:1 the rest
>of the time, resulting in a count which is not correct (and which could
>explain widely varying counts when the counting is perfomed several times).
>The bottom line with a non-posi rear is to keep one side on the ground and
>multiply by 2.  Note that a posi rear doesn't have this problem (unless the
>posi is worn), as both wheels will always turn together, so the spider
>gears never enter the picture.
>
>Joe Padavano
>padavano.joe@orbital.com
>
>66 442
>68 W-30
>69 H/O
>70 W-30
>
>
>

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1473
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