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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1534


oldsmobile-digest      Tuesday, October 6 1998      Volume 01 : Number 1534



Looking for 81-88 Cutlass
RE: Re: CCC Error Codes (or lack of)
Re: WTB G-BODY DOORS.
Re: WTB G-BODY DOORS.
Re: thinking caps, please.
Re: thinking caps, please, LONG!
Re: Rally Pack -- definition wanted
RE:  A4 intake was: '84 & earlier heads, will they fit? (87 olds)
Re: 83 Cutlass Delay Wipers
Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?
Re: G-Body Cruise Control (long)
Re: H*LP NEEDED, WANTED (and BADLY)
Re: Synthetic Oil and improved mpg
Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!
RE: Aluminum Hoods
Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?
Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!
Re: Synthetic Oil and improved mpg
Cruise campaign
Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?
Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!
72 Cutlass door handle removal
Re: Trunk molding
Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive Diagnosis
Re: Cliff's Classics
Re: STOLEN
Power Seat Saga (Loooong) & Question
Need 1976 carb info!
Re: 72 Cutlass door handle removal
Re: Cliff's Classics
Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive 
Diagnosis
Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive 
Diagnosis
disk brake spindles
RE: Towing
For Sale: 79 Olds Delta 88 (long)
Re: disk brake spindles
Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive 
Diagnosis
Re: Anyone have a console FS?
Olds consoles 70-72
For Sale/Trade - Parts
Re: Power Seat Saga (Loooong) & Question
Re:trunk molding
off
Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!
Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive 
Diagnosis
Re: A4 intake was: '84 & earlier heads, will they fit? (87 olds)
Re: 72 Cutlass door handle removal
Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non -Intrusive
Diagnosis The ICQ # stuff (as Olds as RT) Parts sellers who try to rip you off
Re: disk brake spindles Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)! Re: disk
brake spindles 455 vs. 425 Re: G-Body Cruise Control (long) Re: Edelbrock Heads
- Anyone try them ? Re: Rally Pack -- definition wanted Re: H*LP NEEDED, WANTED
(and BADLY) Re: Cruise control Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?
Buying privately through the mail

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 05:59:50 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Looking for 81-88 Cutlass

Got a guy I met at the local NAPA that is looking for a 81-88 Cutlass,
anyone in the Chicago/Rockford/SE WI area have anything in the market?
(Usual disclaimers, I get nothing, but he has good plans for a nice Road
Rocket!)

He has a 350 ready, and is working on a 8.5 3.42 rear now.  He has
several other Rockets, but he want's a G- Body back.  He had one and
sold it (79K miles!)

Please email me directly and I will pass it on.

Thanks!
Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 06:10:57 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE: Re: CCC Error Codes (or lack of)

Anyone who tells you to put HOTTER plugs in over the too hot R46SX needs
to be jackslapped.  Whatever they say needs to be regarded as nonsense,
because they just don't have a clue.  That is old garbage and you should
NEVER run hotter plugs that what the factory engineers recommended.
They have done lots of testing to determine what plug is best for all
driving conditions.  I would recommend at a max, 2 heat ranges colder,
but never go below R44's if you have a carbureted engine.  (The
2.8L/3.1L Ch@vy V6 with the aluminum heads and MPFI calls for R42's!!).

Pinging is NOT caused by cold plugs, but CAN be CAUSED by hot ones!  And
actually, hot plugs won't cause pinging, they will cause detonation.
There IS a difference.

I missed the original post, but it if refers to pinging, and is related
to the Olds 307, please email me DIRECTLY (I don't get to browse the
list much anymore) and I will go through the procedure.  Olds does not
list it as a maintenance item, but Cadillac does.

It has worked 100% for me, from pinging and running 93 oct, to running
87 oct and no pinging for 1 hours work is WELL worth it to me!!

Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 07:32:16 EDT
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com
Subject: Re: WTB G-BODY DOORS.

Forgot my location FAYETTEVILLE, NC

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 07:31:43 EDT
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com
Subject: Re: WTB G-BODY DOORS.

John this guy has a lot of 81-87 G bodies I think that he is high on his
prices(135-150 a complete door , depending on options) but if you want on will
act as the middle man, let me know. Chris

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 07:37:27 -0400
From: "Peter Berusch" <pber710840@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: thinking caps, please.

The most likely candidate for a tow vehicle I have is my '70 98, but I don't
want to disfigure any of my cars with welding or drilling, so that idea is
out.  Keep thinking.  Peter.
- -----Original Message-----
From: Eric <big_olds@hotmail.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Monday, October 05, 1998 3:01 PM
Subject: Re: thinking caps, please.


>Tow-bar's can be built / bought for real cheap, what do you have
>available for a pulling car??
>
>With driveshaft removed, 1000 miles for a car being towed should be OK,
>and it doesn't take a really big car to tow another car, but it is a LOT
>nicer..
>
>.02 given
>
>Eric
>http://www.dlcwest.com/~jed/eric.shtml
>
>Peter Berusch wrote:
>>
>> So if a guy wanted to move an Oldsmobile from San Antonio, and the car
>> wasn't up to a thousand mile trip, how would he move such a treasure?  I
>> called U-Haul.  They want $700 to rent a small truck and a car carrier
one
>> way and I have to pay gas and insurance.  Seems like an awful lot of
money.
>> The car comes with a ton of good spares, so I need a way to move these as
>> well, hence the truck/trailer combo.  Any thoughts on doing this any (a
lot)
>> cheaper?  I probably should mention the ultimate destination is Atlanta,
>> Jawja.  Peter.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 07:42:18 -0400
From: "Peter Berusch" <pber710840@email.msn.com>
Subject: Re: thinking caps, please, LONG!

Ray, I am cowed and humbled.  An epic tale of intestinal fortitude unequaled
in the annals of auto transport!  So, I guess I'll just get off my a** and
drag that tire burner back here.  Like they say on Paris Island, "No
Sniveling".  Peter.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 02:40:04 -0700
From: Mr Ada <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Re: Rally Pack -- definition wanted

Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM wrote:

> and a set of fuel/oil/temp gauges in the left gauge pod.  The speedo was
> the same as on other cars.  Over the years these sets have been broken up,

The speedo were not the same in 68 for cars that had floor shifter
versuscolumn shifters.  Saffron has a floor shift and the speedo has no PRND21
and
has triangular turn signal lamp masks.  Frost/Scarlet have a column shift and
the speedo has the PRND21 and block turn signal lamp masks.

Just my observation....

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 07:03:33 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE:  A4 intake was: '84 & earlier heads, will they fit? (87 olds)

I have a 1977 350 with a 1982 307 alum intake.  Ports match perfectly.

All 84 and older 307, 350 and 403's use the same port size for the
intake.

85 and up used a size more like the 260 did.  (READ: TINY!).

To get a comparison, measure the Width of a standard Olds intake port.
Then take that size and measure that distance down from the TOP of the
port.  This is where the floor of the intake is on a 85-up 307's.  This
is for 5A, 6A and 7A heads.  NOT the older 7a head.

Yes, the Performer intake will bolt on the newer heads, but the bottom
half of the port will be a mismatch.  And that way it is bad.  On the
other hand, with big port heads and the small port intake may not be so
bad, the small ports dumping into a larger opening just before the valve
may provide some "aftercooling" effect and will reduce any effects of
port reversion.  This probably won't see ANY power improvement with such
small ports in the intake.  But, if you are in a crunch, may work
acceptably well.

As for using the older heads on the newer 307, I would not.  Why?
Simple.  Look at the piston.  It is a high swirl piston that is designed
for the heads, you will most likely get a poorer match with the older
heads without the swirl and likely reduce the amount of A/F coming into
the engine.  So you may actually LOSE power doing this.
But, yes, they will bolt on.  So the small HP gain, is it worth the
work?  I would rather swap a 350...Hey, I did!  It works!

I would just concentrate on improving airflow to what you have if you
want some more power.  Especially the exhaust.  I needs help!  Get the
Hooker GN system.  WELL with it!


Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 06:39:47 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: 83 Cutlass Delay Wipers

> I'm sure it's part of the delay's electronics acting up,

Er, I'm not. IIRC, going to Low or High would bypass the
delay circuitry altogether. I think more likely your motor
just pooped out. I think in the course of replacing the
assembly you can try the old motor with the new delay board
and vice-versa to see which is really dead.

(BTW, be careful to get the motor drive pin in the right place
under the washer pump assembly or your intermittent setting will
stop the wipers about 1/3 of the way up the windshield instead
of at the bottom between sweeps. Been there, done that.  :-)

- -- Andy

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:42:39 -0400
From: "Thomas Q. Bartee" <tbartee@mitre.org>
Subject: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?

Hi everyone - have a question on my '85 Cutlass Salon.  In cold weather, I
am getting a reasonable loud 'ticking' noise (sometimes more of a grinding
noise) coming out of the dashboard, sounds like somewhere near the
speedometer.  The noise is only when the car is moving and is generally
proportionate to the car's speed.  I seem to recall hearing, maybe from
this list, that this noise is likely to be coming from the speedometer
cable, and that you have to do something to the cable (like, grease or oil)
to get the noise to stop.  Anybody had this noise?  What do I likely need
to do to stop the noise?  I used to only get this on very cold days, but I
had some of it recently in only moderate cold, so it's probably time to fix
it.

TIA, Tom.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 06:46:30 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: G-Body Cruise Control (long)

> 9 times out of 10 it's the column switch itself (turn signal
> stalk) that goes bad.  Also, you might want to check for
> loose/broken vacuum hose connections to the servo.

Hear, hear. See if wiggling the column lever slightly will make
the cruise work again; that would indicate broken wires at the
base of the lever where those tiny wires turn to go down the
column, a common problem.

If it's a vacuum problem, you might also find that your heater
controls don't work properly. Specifically, see if you can get
air to come out the dashboard vents on the VENT setting. If
it's stuck coming out the defogger outlets on top or the heater
outlet on the floor no matter what setting you select, you're
losing vacuum somewhere, and the cruise is not going to work
for you either.

If anyone's been screwing around with vacuum lines under the
hood or disconnecting any under there, that would be my first
area to check out.

- -- Andy

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 06:53:47 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: H*LP NEEDED, WANTED (and BADLY)

> A whole bunch of oil, all over the place, on the pan, filter,
> starter, EVERYWHERE.  So, we're leaking somewhere.
>
> I go to take the oil pan off.

Ermm... this is not the followup you want to see, but did you
find the source of the leak? It's the oil pan? More commonly
it's something overhead like the rocker covers; after all, if
anything _above_ the oil pan is wet, the oil most likely came
from above it, not below it...

- -- Andy

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 06:56:09 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Synthetic Oil and improved mpg

> Though I do know that pure synthetic actaully lasts roughly 5000
> -7500 miles in my saturn...  but then again, thats a lil tiny 4
> banger, nothing compared to the mighty 425...

Its additives might last that long but I wouldn't want to drive
a 4-banger, or any engine for that matter, with 7500 miles worth
of dirt suspended in it. Keeping doing those 2500-mile changes!

- -- Andy

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Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 09:01:15 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!

If GM will void your warranty for using it, I would not use it.  If
something clearly WORKED, then it would be factory installed to reduce
warranty claims and give you that FREE HP they claim.   Because HP from
less friction will also result in better mileage.  They need that bad!
CAFE requirements are getting stiff.

IF they would do some REAL testing (not like that bearing and the
torquebar.....THAT IS A HOAX if I ever saw it!!), like a sample of 100
cars, 5 of each type, same options, etc.  And do some controlled
testing, over TIME, like say 100,000 miles, use Engine Design Engineers,
not some crackpot like a welding company or some Joe Indy car driver.
What do they know?  What are their qualifications?  WHO gives them the
blessing to tell me what REALLY works?

Encasing an engine in ice, oohhh aaahhh, spraying liquid nitrogen GAS
(note that it is a gas at room temp, and WARMS VERY quickly!!!) on an
engine, and in 5 min they say it is as cold as liquid Nitrogen.  I work
in an engineering lab, and it takes at least 1 hour, prefer 1.5 hours
just to stabilize to a temp.  So if they would make that engine sit at
- -100 C for say, 2 hours, MAYBE I would give them SOME validity.  But for
that?  HA!  DuraLube, Prolong, Slick 50, and all the rest are just
QUACKS that are getting paid millions to give you something that does
not work, at all!!  They cannot prove it.  So why waste a dime on them?
 (oh, and when does a cold intake and valve cover prove anything??)
Duh!  Anyone from MN?

Save your engine, save your money, just keep REAL oil (Synthetic or a
Good quality petroleum) and your engine will give you years of faithful
service, like all Olds do.

Sorry to blow off steam, but these rip off companies really tick me off,
they are getting rich at the ignorance of others, they are deliberately
misleading the public by advertising they stuff is doing something.
D@mn, I should be a lawyer!
People see what they mislead you to see if you do not pay attention to
what they are REALLY saying.

You want to run an engine without oil?  Anyone got a junker to play with
(a 260 is fine!), 1, unless you have solid lifters you will collapse the
hydraulic lifter that is in there, and it will proceed to bend your
pushrods, running very poorly after that, then 2. tell me what sort of
load a V8 places on bearings with no load on the engine?  What?  Next to
nothing?  hmm, anyone care to take a stab at what sort of road hp an
average car has at 60 mph?  Look in Motortrend or Car and Driver, they
usually tell you.  What?  5 hp to maintain 60 mph?  Heck, swap it out
for a Briggs and Stratton!  Lets save the environment!!

Ok, so, your engine modified with solid lifters, and no crankshaft load
will run for about 4 hours, even more with no oil.  And they are saying
"Suckers!" under their breath.  Oh, wait!  Lets add some big rocks and
dirt to get in the "oil", what?  Too big to fit down the oil drainback
holes?  Oops, no one will notice.  Pour more in!  with no oil it won't
hurt anything, and with no load, who cares!?!?  Wait!  Lets cut the
radiator hose too!  No load, less heat, hmm, lets see, false
advertising???  Would make an interesting class action suit.....

What they do not do is run it for 100K, and say 5 control engines,
identical, 5 test engines, and then tear them down and see what they
REALLY look like.  Remember, you must have control over your
experiments, a subject of 1 is no data to even consider.  Would you go
to a brain surgeon and have him do open brain surgery when he has only
tried it once?  Or not at all?

Hmm, I wonder if they help promote acid rain too?  Ever fail an
emissions test and change the oil and it passes?
Just a thought, call the state of CA and have them test it.

>Was watching MotorTrend TV yesterday and saw some purple stuff that added a
claimed 8 horsepower in
>an LT-1 Corvette.  8 horse?????  That's a sizeable jump...but so is the price
of this purple stuff
>over regular oil--almost 5 bucks a quart!
>
>Anyone heard of this stuff?

Sorry to babble on, but I hate how many people get drawn in and think
they NEED these miracle snake oils.

Enjoy!
Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 09:06:22 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE: Aluminum Hoods

A friend of mine's father said they came on Diesel cars, He had one on a
1979 98.  I have seen one on a 1982 Malibu wagon with a V8 305.

They are out there, just find them for a Cutlass or 88/98/Wagon!

Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 10:21:20 -0400
From: Jim Olson <jolson@edzone.net>
Subject: Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?

It's the speedometer cable. Take your cable down to a local parts store
that makes them, and get a new one. If you grease it, the noise may go
away for a while but it's time for a new one.

Jim...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 10:17:51 EDT
From: SOMMERVLLE@aol.com
Subject: Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!

Good info Thomas but you need to get out more often, I detect a little stress
in your life. just kidding good info any one who buys that stuff is getting
snuchored. just my .02 Chris

Chris Sommerville
69 442 SC
70 442 HC
70 W31
AND LOTS OF PARTS FOR SALE!!!!!!!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 09:36:23 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Synthetic Oil and improved mpg

I change my motor oil every 1000 miles in my 455.
Pettrix@prodigy.net

- ----------
> From: Johnny Gage <bladernr@roava.net>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: Synthetic Oil and improved mpg
> Date: Monday, October 05, 1998 11:47 PM
>
> hehehe... seems I spend maybe just a lil too much time witht eh
secondaries
> open  <innocent grin>  But thanks for teh info...  I guess I'll just
stick
> to the ol faithful right now...  besides which, I usually change the oil
> every 2500 - 3000 anyway...
>
> Though I do know that pure synthetic actaully lasts roughly 5000 -7500
miles
> in my saturn...  but then again, thats a lil tiny 4 banger, notihing
> compared to the mighty 425...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 08:50:15 -0600
From: Garnet.Randolph@ei.educ.ab.ca (Garnet Randolph)
Subject: Cruise campaign

Jason,
I recently had this campaign performed on my 85 Buick Lesabre Collector's
Edition (B-body,307 Olds) by a local dealer.  Actually, the service
manager is a friend of mine, and noticed the flaw while replacing the
water pump recently.  He took the serial number, returned with the parts,
and installed it in my driveway in 5 min.  His words were that the
campaign is good for the life of the car.  Something about liability on
GM's part.  Try a local dealer there and see what they say.
Regards,
- -Garnet

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 08:16:48 PDT
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?

> I seem to recall hearing, maybe from this list, that this noise is
> likely to be coming from the speedometer cable,

Sounds about right...

> and that you have to do something to the cable (like, grease or oil)
> to get the noise to stop.

A really light grease, yes. But if you're hearing scraping noises,
you may already have some broken strands in the cable core and it's
going to break eventually. Sometimes the core gets so dry and hard
to turn that the end shears off down at the transmission (or output
from the cruise module, if you have one).

I _think_ you'll need to remove the speedo in order to get the core
out of the cable. It just pulls out from the upper end, straight out.
Once you do, see if it will lie flat and roll flat on the workbench.
If so, lube it lightly. (I think white lithium was the stuff to use;
ask NAPA. Replacement cores come with a little tube of the proper
grease. Too thick a grease and the core won't turn.) If it's kinked
or frayed, it's toast.

Having gone to all the trouble of opening the dash up to get at the
thing, I'd replace the entire cable and core assembly. You can get
an exact replacement; don't buy the flexy core alone that you're then
expected to cut to length. If you've got cruise, it's pretty simple
to replace the upper cable; if you don't have cruise, you'll have to
go under the car to get at the other end where it screws into the side
of the trans, but this job isn't real tricky to do. Look for a couple
of retainer ears or clips on the lower firewall that hold the cable
to keep it away from the exhaust, steering, etc.

- -- Andy


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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 10:04:34 -0500
From: David L Wyatt <WYATT_DAVID_L@lilly.com>
Subject: Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!

From what I have read, some of the products like Dura-Lube do work.  The main
ingredient is chlorine which is a wonderfull lubricant.  The downside is,
chlorine is very corrosive.  I believe we covered all of this about a year ago
on this list.  Someone with all of the digests could look this up.

My $.02
Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:22:04 -0400
From: "Jason P. Labay" <jlabay@neo.lrun.com>
Subject: 72 Cutlass door handle removal

Ok, thanks to all who told me how to get the mirror off my 72 Cutlass Supreme's
door. Now I need to figure out how to remove the door handle.  What is the best
way? Thanks

Jason Labay  Akron, OH jlabay@neo.lrun.com
http://home.neo.lrun.com/jlabay

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:21:40 EDT
From: W30442CS@aol.com
Subject: Re: Trunk molding

todd, i may have some, will check it out.   steven,  w30442cs@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:55:53 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis

The esteemed Padavano writes:

<< The theory has merit, but there's an easier way. Rather than pulling the
valve cover, just pull the distributor cap and observe the rotor. Turn the
motor one way until the rotor turns. Now reverse direction. If there is
appreciable "slop" in the motion of the rotor, it's time for a chain. >>

Now hang on a sec!

Mebbe Karl misunderstands!

Karl thought that the dist was driven directly by the crankshaft!

How is there "slop" in a gear drive?

Or how is it that the emgine is to be turned?

The dist will not indicate "slop" in the timing chain unless you turn the
motor by motivating the camshaft!  (shudder)

Did Karl miss something?

Does the camshaft drive the dist?

Gonna go pull mine and see.....

SOM

&KA

ICQ #20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:55:52 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Cliff's Classics

In a message dated 98-10-05 10:10:36 EDT, you write:

<<   I just received some parts from Cliff's Classics for my 67'. He runs a
class operation. Everything I received was as advertised - no disappointments
- - care was taken in the packaging as well as in removal from the donor
vehicle.  >>

Do not stop there!

Give the contact info!

Please?

Where is Cliff located?

SOM

&KA
ICQ#20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:55:13 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: STOLEN

In a message dated 98-10-05 17:50:44 EDT, you write:

<< Will whoever stole it actuallly ever be able to firgure out that it's a 2x4
intake for an OLDS?! >>

As Karl is a ways west of you, his extreme deviousness is almost useless.

But thought the orig. post said summat about parts suspected to be heading for
the Virginias.

So does the poster have a suspect in mind?

Bet it was the same schmuck that vamoosed with Heavy Metal I, but with more
sophisticated tastes now.

Karl saw a dual quad intake in a modified F-85 2dr coupe this year.
Sweeeeeet.

Very sorry for your loss.

SOM

&KA
ICQ # 20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 09:01:19 -0700
From: Chris Fair <cfair@FairIsaac.com>
Subject: Power Seat Saga (Loooong) & Question

So I'm trying to adapt late 80's power buckets into the 66 Starfire.
Thought it would be cool to have power buckets for driver & passenger.
Still seems doable, but I had a setback tonight and thought I'd b*tch a bit,
teach a bit, and ask your help.

If you continue this note, you'll learn what I've learned so far. Sorry it's
so long, but I try to write for the 18 year old I was long ago with little
experience.

Thought it smart to get a bunch of power seat tracks, motors, drive cable
systems. I started on the passenger side for which I have a spare original
(1966 S/f) seat pedestal. Figured if I goofed it up real bad, I could still
bolt the original non-power parts back in. This was a good precaution.

In 1966, they only made 4 way seats, I want to be able to adjust the
front/back, seat height _and_ angle, not just front/back and angle. Hence
the swap.

Stop here if you don't have a dremel, SAE & metric sockets, soldering iron,
bench grinder and lots of patience time. If applicable, a patient wife or
significant other. I'm blessed to have these.

What I've learned:
1) late 80's power seat systems require a 13mm socket to remove from cars
(near a 1/2", but not quite, though it sometimes works.)
2) donor seats are usually in the lowest position and in disgusting cars
with cr*p all over the carpet, making them extra pleasant to remove. If you
can shove a #1 phillips sometimes you can raise the seats up and gain
working room.
3) with buckets the easiest way to get the tracks and power system out is to
cut the seat cushion and go in from the top, esp. if you just want the
motor, drive cables and clutch system. 4)The motor/cable system is distinct,
and easily removed,  from the seat tracks. The tracks take a bunch of
correct size (13mm new cars or 1/2" in old) so take lots.
5) 1966 bucket seats are around 2" narrower than late 80's bucket seats --
at least the Cutlass Ciera I pulled the systems from. This means that the
drive cables which transmit the motion from the clutch system/motor to the
seat tracks must be narrowed.
6) you'll need to cut new holes for mounting the motor bracket and cut down
that bracket to clear the front cable and grind the end which abuts the seat
track down to allow it to clear so the cables are located in the proper
(i.e. as straight as possible) position.
7) To narrow the drive cables:
	a) remove motor and clutch system from seat tracks by unclipping the
speed connectors which hold the cables to the track. Here again you'll need
that 13mm socket to
	     remove the motor and relay from the seat tracks. Then all but
the mechanicals will come free and you can work on 'em as a unit. Good time
to test the motor
	b) use a 9/32" socket to remove the long side (you'll see what I
mean -- 1 red, 1 blue, 1 yellow cable). This is the side to be shortened.
You can't really work on the other
	     side, it's already at minimum length. Principle: modify as
little as possible (i.e. shorten 1 side a lot, not both sides a little...)
	c) on the seat track end of each cable, note that it's squared off
to transmit the spinning motion of the clutch/motor to the jackscrews and
forward/back gear. You'll need
	     to make this from a round cable. But, before I get into drive
cable cutting, you'll need to grind the motor mount some to fit it between
the seat tracks.
	d) bolt your seat tracks to the bottom of your seat to see how far
apart they should be. Leave 'em on there, you'll be doing a lot of
check-fitting from here
	e) figure out how much to grind by successively cutting down the
motor mounting bracket until it looks like it fits right with the seat
tracks bolted to the seat. Essentially you're 	     moving it 2" closer 
to
the seat track so it needs to clear as much as possible without affecting
(i.e. grinding...) the motor. Trial and error time.
	f)  now that you can see where the motor and clutch system should
be,  try to reattach the cables removed with that 9/32" socket. G'head.
Betcha can't find the d*mn thing...
	g) so you see that the cables are just a bit too long. How do you
shorten these things? Oh -- I know, I'll just go buy some. No dice. These
are special width cables 	    made for just this purpose and no other.
Speedo cable is too narrow and probably too weak given these cables need to
transmit enough torque to move you & the seat.
	h) I tried several times to cut down the ends so as to retain the
factory pressed square shape. You can't get them short enough to work
correctly and retain the factory pressed
	    square shape that's the key to their function
	i) Conclusion: gotta cut the cable in the middle and square it off
somehow. But first you have to get the cable out of it's colored plastic
housing.
	j) On the seat track end, see the white nylon retainer, with the
cable in a vice, you can pound the cable out of it using a 1/4" deep socket.
Careful here, don't bend the cable.
	k) Back to cutting. Since it's a spiral bound cable, after it's cut,
it'll unwind the minute you put torque on it, as the motor will. Unless you
(ta da!)
	l) Solder the outside to hold the strands together before you cut it
to length. The solder acts like glue and keeps the cable from unwinding on
ya.  Solder, then cut.
	m) then file to a square shape, carefully. (I screwed this up at
least twice. Like I said, get lots of spares)
	n) by now you're so familiar with connecting and unconnecting these
d*mn cables you'll see you just need to cut the front and rear ones
correctly, solder and file 'em down
	   and you're in business.
	o) reattach the shortened cables to the seat tracks, then fit the
motor to them. Finish by fitting the other track to the motor. Use needle
nose pliers to spin the cable by hand 	     when it doesn't fit the 
square
it's meant to go into

But, of course there's more.

In my case, my first move was to mount the seat tracks to the Starfire
pedestals by dremeling out the rivets and bolting. Guess what? They're about
4 inches too high. I get all this way with a creative solution and they're
too d*mn high. What a disappointment.

Back to square 1. Tomorrow.

Good side is you just learned in 15 minutes what's cost me about 15-25
hours. The narrowing trick is key, now I just have to find the right height
pedastels.

Question of the evening: which GM cars from say 1986 forward made power
passenger buckets? Not split full size seat like C*ddies, buckets. F-bodies
maybe? G-bodies. I'm looking for cars with buckets, a console and power seat
on _both_ sides.

Many thanks for any suggestions you might have and I hope you found this
helpful.

cf

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:55:55 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Need 1976 carb info!

This is for someone who posted her troubles two weeks ago!

She has a 1976 Cutlass Salon, and needs to find the correct carb for it.

Dont know if it was Q-Jet or what.
Karl believes that carb code should be: 17046250 or 17046251
Based on 1976 model year and Karl assumes a 350cid motor.

Now!

Can anyone verify this?
It would help if anyone knows if a V6 was a Cutlass option in 1976!

Further, Karl would like to hear from anyone selling a carb of either code!

Or a lead to a source for said carb, NIB, used, disused, rebuilt or anything.

Anyone??

Thanks!

SOM

&KA
ICQ #20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 08:40:25 -0700
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@MCI2000.com>
Subject: Re: 72 Cutlass door handle removal

inner or outer the inner just take off the armrest and use a trim clip
removal tool available at your local ROM auto parts conglommerate
the outer take off the inner stuf just mentioned plus the interior trim
panel, water shield roll the window back up reach inside the door
with a 3/8 socket on a ratchet and find the two bolts that hold the door
handles on take those out and VOILA you just removed the door handle have
fun...kk
- -----Original Message-----
From: Jason P. Labay <jlabay@neo.lrun.com>
To: Oldsmobile Mailing List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 8:24 AM
Subject: 72 Cutlass door handle removal


>Ok, thanks to all who told me how to get the mirror off my 72 Cutlass
Supreme's door. Now I need to figure out how to
>remove the door handle.  What is the best way? Thanks
>
>Jason Labay  Akron, OH jlabay@neo.lrun.com
>http://home.neo.lrun.com/jlabay
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:05:13 EDT
From: COUPEKING@aol.com
Subject: Re: Cliff's Classics

Saw his ads on Bryceman's page about 3 weeks ago. Look there. Private guy.
Peter

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:06:19 -0500
From: "Mick Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis

- -----Original Message-----
From: KarlAune@aol.com <KarlAune@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 10:58 AM
Subject: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis



>Karl thought that the dist was driven directly by the crankshaft!

The gear on the end of the distributor shaft is driven by the gear on the
end of the cam shaft.
===================================================
Mick Gillespie
1969 Cutlass S Conv.
1980 Toronado Brougham
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm
mgillespie@sprynet.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:14:06 -0500
From: "Mick Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis

- -----Original Message-----
From: KarlAune@aol.com <KarlAune@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Tuesday, October 06, 1998 10:58 AM
Subject: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis



>Karl thought that the dist was driven directly by the crankshaft!
Not quite.
The gear on the end of the distributor shaft is driven by the gear on the
end of the cam shaft.
The gear mounted on the end of the crankshaft drives the gear on the end of
the camshaft (by means of the timing chain.
Hope this helps.
===================================================
Mick Gillespie
1969 Cutlass S Conv.
1980 Toronado Brougham
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm
mgillespie@sprynet.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:13:40 -0400
From: "Patton" <patton@ComCAT.COM>
Subject: disk brake spindles

Fellow Rocketeers,

                        I am in the process of doing a disk brake conversion
and a question has come up. What
is the difference between disk and drum spindles on the 67-72 cars - at a
glance they do not look much different .........   yes I am positive the
donor spindles are from a disk ......


Tanks
The General

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 11:12:04 -0500
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas_Martin-WLTM07@css.mot.com>
Subject: RE: Towing

A lot of states require that the towing car be heaving than the
towed/trailered weight.  At least for without trailer brakes.  Hate to
have a 1976 98 push my 1985 Cutlass when I want to stop fast.  I guess
use the 98 for towing??  Olds says 7000 lbs "with available towing
package".

>Tow-bar's can be built / bought for real cheap, what do you have
>available for a pulling car??

Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:19:58 -0400
From: "John Duncan" <JohnDuncan@msn.com>
Subject: For Sale: 79 Olds Delta 88 (long)

Hello, I'm new to the list, and hope that For Sale postings are ok. I
just bought an 85 Olds Toronado Caliente, and I'm selling the 79 Delta
88. I'm located in Marlboro, MA. The car is no prize, but it's got a
strong 350 4bbl. & auto trans. (sorry, don't know the code numbers), and
lots of new primary parts. Here's the low-down:

Brown 4-door, lots of surface rust spots, some rust through
Interior mostly intact, headliner fabric loose from backer board, no
seat rips
130K miles
AM/FM radio
No A/C, heater works great
Extra trans cooler
recent exhaust from catalytic back, new cross-over pipe,
   needs new donut at manifold-to-downpipe
   (which goes to catalytic), needs exhaust manifold-engine
   block gasket on the driver's side
strong engine & trans, both sound good and work just as they should
New items: four 40K 205R75 tires, 4 shocks, starter, alternator,
radiator,
    Water pump, front brake pads, hoses, belts, thermostat, filters,
battery,
    positive battery cable

That's most of the important info, email me directly for anything
further. I'm asking $400, will make a consideration for list members or
referrals. Basically, I see this as a parts car that can be driven away,
as long as you don't mind a loud exhaust and low cosmetic appeal.

John Duncan
JohnDuncan@msn.com
508-480-9414
ICQ # 8228159

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 11:19:22 -0500
From: Stephen Hoover <shang@wans.net>
Subject: Re: disk brake spindles

Patton wrote:
>
> Fellow Rocketeers,
>
>                         I am in the process of doing a disk brake conversion
> and a question has come up. What
> is the difference between disk and drum spindles on the 67-72 cars - at a
> glance they do not look much different .........   yes I am positive the
> donor spindles are from a disk ......
>
> Tanks
> The General


The top attaching nut boss is shallower on the disk brake spindle. The
drum brake spindle could possibly be machined down to the same thickness
of the disk brake spindle, but I have never attemtped it.


Stephen Hoover
Dallas, Texas
'70 Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:25:04 -0000
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis

>valve cover, just pull the distributor cap and observe the rotor. Turn the
motor one way until the rotor turns. Now reverse direction. If there is
appreciable "slop" in the motion of the rotor, it's time for a chain. >>


>Karl thought that the dist was driven directly by the crankshaft!


The distributor is driven by the camshaft.....what you are  actually
"measuring" is how far the crank turns before the cam moves.

The more the timing chain is stretched the greater the farther the crank
will turn before the cam moves.

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:39:29 EDT
From: CRuper1@aol.com
Subject: Re: Anyone have a console FS?

In a message dated 10/5/98 5:37:28 PM EST, hurstolds@xtalwind.net writes:

<< One small crack at the
 side bottom he says, otherwise perfect.  Has console cover too.
 WRONG.  No lid and was busted in about 3 pieces.  Fuming?  No.  Lied to?
 Wasted my money?  Ya.  Don't EVER do business with this guy. Ryan
 McKennna.  He wouldn't know a gray console if it fell on him.  I'd sure
 hate to see what HE considers junk.  I just need the console upper
 plastic section where the shift plate/ashtray and glovebox are.  Anyone
 got one in decent shape?  i.e. no cracks?

 Mike Rothe >>

The name McKenna sounds familiar.  Is he/was he a list member at one time?
I'm just thinking it sounds real familiar...

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 12:43:02 -0400
From: Kyle Roe <karoe@us.ibm.com>
Subject: Olds consoles 70-72

I can put the locate on a Black one that is mostly complete. I know that part
of it is trashed by some fool(s) that were there before me. The compartment and
door are there, and part of the front is usuable.

As well, whoever asked about the bracket for the shifter,  this is in a '70, so
I could get that too.
The stuff is still likely to be there as it was in April and again I was by
there in July.

Lemme know directly if you want me to go get it.
karoe@us.ibm.com

Kyle
'70 442 Ragtop

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 10:09:19 -0700
From: "David Seiver - Account Executive" <DavidS@AnaServe.com>
Subject: For Sale/Trade - Parts

Hey Folks,
I have a original 2 speed tranny out of my 67 f85
intake manifold and 2brl carb off my 425bb
any takers....
I am in Newport Beach, CA
David Seiver
Account Representative
AnaServe, Inc. - A Concentric Network Company
Voice: 1-800-711-6030 ext. 283 (949) 250-7262 Ext. 283
Fax: 714.250.7265
e-mail: dseiver@cncx.com
Web: http://www.anaservehosting.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 13:28:51 -0400
From: "Jason P. Labay" <jlabay@neo.lrun.com>
Subject: Re: Power Seat Saga (Loooong) & Question

I just got done installing power leather buckets from an 87 Chrylser LeBaron in
my 72 Cutlass Supreme. Surprisingly the stock LeBaron brackets almost fit
perfect.  I had to do some bending and drilling but they are in now and look
like the belong in there. Have got many compliments on how nice they look. The
nice leather back seat fit in the 72 Cutlass good also.

Jason Labay  Akron, OH jlabay@neo.lrun.com
http://home.neo.lrun.com/jlabay




>Question of the evening: which GM cars from say 1986 forward made power
>passenger buckets? Not split full size seat like C*ddies, buckets. F-bodies
>maybe? G-bodies. I'm looking for cars with buckets, a console and power seat
>on _both_ sides.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 13:33:57 -0400
From: Kyle Roe <karoe@us.ibm.com>
Subject: Re:trunk molding

I have a couple sets - cheap. Contact me offline.
karoe@us.ibm.com

Kyle

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:01:37 EDT
From: Dons5043@aol.com
Subject: off

unsubscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:06:47 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!

In a message dated 98-10-06 11:23:58 EDT, you write:

<< From what I have read, some of the products like Dura-Lube do work.  The
main ingredient is chlorine which is a wonderfull lubricant.  The downside is,
chlorine is very corrosive. >>

Chlorine??

Well, certainly. Acids are very slippery! (technically a lone chlorine ion is
a STRONG base, but you cannot have just one)

And corrosive?
It is great at corroding stainless steel!
And some copper alloys!

Not to mention that clorine is not to be taken internally.
Ever.
You may start to suffer symptoms of death.

K

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:05:48 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non-Intrusive
Diagnosis

In a message dated 98-10-06 12:15:15 EDT, you write:

<< The gear on the end of the distributor shaft is driven by the gear on the
 end of the cam shaft. >>

DOH!

Karl thought dist shaft was longer!

This explains poor setting of dwell by feeler guage before chain swap.
Car would not start at carwash - thought wet dist, but fired right up later.

Do recall seeing gear on bumpsticks.

Also, thought after posting that a camshaft drive made more sense as would be
directly related to intake/exhaust lobe positions.

Which brings me back to...

Well.
Plenty of time for Fully adjustable mechanical ignition later.....

Thanks Mick!

SOM

&KA
ICQ #20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:06:48 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: A4 intake was: '84 & earlier heads, will they fit? (87 olds)

In a message dated 98-10-06 08:07:01 EDT, you write:

<< Yes, the Performer intake will bolt on the newer heads, but the bottom
 half of the port will be a mismatch.  And that way it is bad.  On the
 other hand, with big port heads and the small port intake may not be so
 bad, the small ports dumping into a larger opening just before the valve
 may provide some "aftercooling" effect and will reduce any effects of
 port reversion.  This probably won't see ANY power improvement with such
 small ports in the intake.  But, if you are in a crunch, may work
 acceptably well. >>

Actually, the "aftercooling" should cause more A/F to condense into liquid
gasoline in any temperatures!

And this would cause harder starting and worse performance until engine is at
normal operating temp.

This could cause a spectacular backfire!

Can I watch?

SOM

&KA
ICQ #20414415

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:10:00 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 72 Cutlass door handle removal

need to figure out how to
remove the door handle.  What is the best way? Thanks

Jason Labay
__________

Well, other than using a torch, there really is only one way.  You must
remove the inner door panel.  There are two bolts which hold the handle on
to the outer door skin, accessible once the inner panel is off.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:14:42 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Woah There! How's that? was: Valve-Piston Impact and Non 
-Intrusive
Diagnosis

Did Karl miss something?

Does the camshaft drive the dist?
__________

Yep.

Go look at any cam, you'll see distributor drive gear at the back end.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 14:41:38 EDT
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: The ICQ # stuff (as Olds as RT)

Of late poeple who are not computer neophytes have complained tha mIRC is
better than Rocket Talk because Rocket Talk has a firewall that prevents mIRC
people from joining #RocketTalk without actually being at a site like the one
hosted by C. Buehner. Too many commercials for negligible 'net stuffs
supported by the Xoom (?) engine???

mIRC has in the past been suggested by more than one person.
No fire-wall, but each person wishing to join Rocket talk would need the mIRC
softtware (SHAREWARE) instead of those with JAVA-able browsers visiting
lyrea.com/~Buehner.html

For thoe who ar interested in ICQ (I Seek You), this is SHAREWARE available,
among other places from sites referenced by cNet.com, a site I recommend.

Visit:

http://www.cnet.com/Resources/Topdownloads/PC/Result/TitleDetail/0,160,0-44655
,00.html

and select 16 or 32 bit versions of ICQ.
16 bit is for 386 & 486 people.

32 bit is for people with Win95 or Win98 (curse Bill Gates!)

An eye will be kept to the RT chat room, really!
(we hope...)

This was just an update on current trends.

BTW a freind is looking for a 1971 Monte Carlo with straight body...engine any
condition. Any leads? Post directly to: KarlAune@aol.com


thanksThanks and good chatting!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 14:25:17 -0500
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: Parts sellers who try to rip you off

I followed up with this info to the person who originally posted it, but
thought it would be good to post the mail list as well.

I ran into this sort of situation with one of the 30 or 40 deals I made
throught the eBay auction site. First, remain calm. Sometimes the seller
has had computer problems, bad health, or some other legitimate excuse.
Keep that frame of mind initially. Try calling and e-mailing. Use
switchboard.com or others to find the phone number. Keep a record of
tries at contacting the seller. But if you are still getting the run
around,

Try to find others who might be in your same situation. An internet
auction is pretty easy, while newspaper or a want ad on an internet site
is more difficult. E-mail them, ask about their situations. If they are
getting ripped off as well, a natural team will form to go after the
person. It's really neat hearing about someone getting more information,
and another taking that and getting results!

Get the person's e-mail address, if you don't already have it. If the
e-mail account was used in the transaction, complain to the site about
the abuse of e-mail privilidges. They will usually yank the person's
access.

Sometimes sites have searchable account indexes. If you can get any more
information like street address and phone number, this is more
information you can give to the seller's local law enforcement agency.
Most of the time you have this information. Use it to find the seller's
phone number so you can call them.

Contact the seller's local sheriff's department or law enforcement
agency. Chances are they already know the character all too well. Give a
BRIEF account of what transpired. Offer to send the e-mails and other
records you have as proof. The person put on the case will contact you
about specifics. Sometimes you will stay in contact through e-mail! If
so, make sure you CC any other people you have been in contact with.
It's amazing how a couple people in different parts of the hemisphere
can get results from a dead beat!

If you see this same person try to set up shop again, you might just
want to let the seller's new internet site (guaranteed) know what this
person has been up to in the past. Provide the dead beat's address and
phone so they can verify the account. It's pretty funny seeing the plug
get pulled again!

I hope helps somebody. I'll put this in the FAQ along with additional
suggestions.
- --
David Brown          Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
          Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.1 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
Conserve bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
           ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 12:41:40 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Re: disk brake spindles

At 12:13 PM 10/6/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Fellow Rocketeers,
>
>                        I am in the process of doing a disk brake conversion
>and a question has come up. What
>is the difference between disk and drum spindles on the 67-72 cars - at a
>glance they do not look much different .........   yes I am positive the
>donor spindles are from a disk ......
>
Well after spending huge amounts of money on spindles :(
I found out that the  HD/Police front drum brake spindles
(9 1/2" X 3" nearly impossible to find station wagon drum) are the
same spindles as a disk brake car

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 12:45:36 +0000
From: Bob Blanchard <bob149@efortress.com>
Subject: Re: Snake oils, just plain stay away (long)!

At 12:13 PM 10/6/98 -0400, you wrote:
>Fellow Rocketeers,
>
> I am in the process of doing a disk brake
conversion
>and a question has come up. What
>is the difference between disk and drum spindles on the 67-72 cars - at a
>glance they do not look much different ......... yes I am positive the
>donor spindles are from a disk ......
>
Well after spending huge amounts of money on spindles :(
I found out that the HD/Police front drum brake spindles
(9 1/2" X 3" nearly impossible to find station wagon drum) are the
same spindles as a disk brake car

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 13:15:24 -0700
From: Chris Sparks <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Subject: Re: disk brake spindles

Bob Blanchard wrote:

> Well after spending huge amounts of money on spindles :(
> I found out that the  HD/Police front drum brake spindles

HD?

> (9 1/2" X 3" nearly impossible to find station wagon drum) are the
> same spindles as a disk brake car

So you are saying the Vista Cruiser Drum Spindles and the same as
Cutlass/442 Disc Spindles for that time frame?  Enquiring minds like
me needs to know! :-)

- --
Chris Sparks
68 442 SC - Frosty
68 442 HT - Scarlet
68 442 HT - Saffron
82 DRB    - Dr. "B"
http://www.catalina-inter.net/mrada

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 14:22:32 -0600
From: william goodnight <idaholc@primenet.com>
Subject: 455 vs. 425

I know that I have seen strings in the past discussing the relative merits
of the 455 vs. the 425.  They didn't mean much to me at the time, but now I
have the opportunity to purchase a 425 for a street machine I am building
which I previously planned to rebuild a 455 for.   Can anyone help me out?

Also, what is the practical limit on compression ratio on a 425 for
servicable steet use?


Bill Goodnight
Goodnight & Associates, Inc.
idaholc@primenet.com
1014 E. Franklin
Boise, Idaho
(208)345-0158

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 04:15:18 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: G-Body Cruise Control (long)

Ditch the cruise and have that switch in the stalk operate your line
locks!

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 03:47:04 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: Edelbrock Heads - Anyone try them ?

On Tue, 6 Oct 1998 01:49:13 -0400 "Jason P. Labay" <jlabay@neo.lrun.com>
writes:
>Summit has them on display in their store. Price is $1599 /pair.
>
>Jason Labay  Akron, OH jlabay@neo.lrun.com
>http://home.neo.lrun.com/jlabay
>
Oh, you get to go to the Summit store!  I am jealous!  Is it very cool?

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 03:45:53 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: Rally Pack -- definition wanted

On Tue, 6 Oct 1998 00:43:06 -0400 Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM writes:
>Scott,
>
>The Rally Pac (no "K") was Oldspeak<-----ha ha ha!
198442.

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 04:16:55 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: H*LP NEEDED, WANTED (and BADLY)

On Tue, 06 Oct 1998 06:53:47 PDT "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
writes:
>> A whole bunch of oil, all over the place, on the pan, filter,
>> starter, EVERYWHERE.  So, we're leaking somewhere.
>>
>> I go to take the oil pan off.
>
>Ermm... this is not the followup you want to see, but did you
>find the source of the leak? It's the oil pan? More commonly
>it's something overhead like the rocker covers; after all, if
>anything _above_ the oil pan is wet, the oil most likely came
>from above it, not below it...
>
>-- Andy
>
Yes, plus it's hard for the oil to get onto the oil pan if it's leaking
from it.  Unless the leak is at the front, in which case, you probably
wouldn't notice much of a leak unless you drive around backwards all the
time.

>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com
>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 04:09:26 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: Cruise control

I just got one the other weekend.  I pulled it out of a car at a
junkyard, and didn't even have to pay for it.  It took a while til I
found one with that chromy tape still on it completely, but it was there.
 Not that that's NOS...

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

On Tue, 06 Oct 1998 05:16:44 -0400 "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
writes:
>Speaking of cruise, anyone know where I can get an NOS cruise control
>switch/turn signal lever with delay wipers for an 85 G-body?  I need
>one
>with the chrome stem on it.  The dealer only has all black, and it's
>shaped slightly different.
>
>Mike Rothe
>

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 04:14:33 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Re: Question - Dash Noise - Speedometer Cable?

On Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:42:39 -0400 "Thomas Q. Bartee" <tbartee@mitre.org>
writes:
>Hi everyone - have a question on my '85 Cutlass Salon.  In cold

If it is the speedo cable, don't bother squirting oil down in it.  That
will solve the problm for about thirty minutes.  Just go ahead and
replace it.  It will be fun anyway.

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

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------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 04:28:56 -0400
From: rocket409@juno.com (Ray Costanzo)
Subject: Buying privately through the mail

There's always that problem of knowing that someone is going to send you
what you paid for when you buy something from someone in a different
state whom you have never met.  An interesting way  to help deal with
this is to use what is called "the conditional endorsement" on the check
you send to the person.  What you do is write out the check and then flip
it over.  Where the payee of the check will eventually endorse it, you
would write something like:"payable upon proof of delivery via fed ex of
a 14.6 pound package" or something of the sort.  When the person takes
the bank to the check, he would actually have to take with him a receipt
from fed ex to prove that he has sent a package before the check is
legally negotiable.  Of course, this is only if the teller notices, which
she should.  If you don't get the part, the bank can then be held
responsible for returning your money.  Easier than a phantom figure on a
computer!  Just something to consider.

Ray Costanzo                                        87 409 Cutlass
                        Bucks County, PA

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------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1534
*********************************
