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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1653


oldsmobile-digest     Wednesday, December 9 1998     Volume 01 : Number 1653



66 Delta
Re: 455 update
Holley 650 on a 330
Re: 455 update
Re: Paint Schemes
Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake
Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake
Olds publications
Non-Olds: Scary Sight!
Re: Holley 650 on a 330
493 Stroker Olds
Re: Paint Schemes
Re: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me
Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!
Re: Tire Recommendation
Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake
RE: Pearl White/White
5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Ummmm.....was: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me
Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: Ummmm.....was: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me
Non Olds but may save money!
Jetfire ad
C.B.W. was: J-2 intakes and Midaeval Attitudes...
Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!
Re: model info
Alternator still high
Re: More Edelbrock Stuff
Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me
Re: More Edelbrock Stuff
Goin' to digest for a spell...
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: Joining!
Re: 455 update, Hey Karl!
Re: Alternator still high
Re: Tire Recommendation
Re: model info
anyone have 17'' on a 72 olds yet??
Re: 493 Stroker Olds
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455
Re: brakes H*LP on 70 Cutlass
Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 10:57:42 -0500
From: Mike.Blankenship@medaphis.com (Blankenship, Mike)
Subject: 66 Delta

There is a junkyard that I visit regularly(Georgia) that just dragged in   the 
straightest 66 Delta 2 door I have seen in awhile. Straight rust free   doors, 
fenders, decklid.  Black on black car.  They are very reasonable.    I just 
bought a running 71 455 for $200 so their prices are OK. Just   e-mail me 
privately if interested.

Mike Blankenship
70 442 W-30
70 GTO Judge RAIV
(2) 71 442 Convt's
71 Cutlass S
87 Cutlass Salon
95 Corvette

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:05:17 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: 455 update

In a message dated 98-08-06 16:15:36 EDT, you write:

<< Subj:	 455 update
 The journal with the spun bearing
 was 0.035 undersize :-0  Crank(y) guy in the shop claims he can weld it and
 turn the whole thing to 0.020-0.020 for about $100.  I say "Why not" (it
 is, after all, an MT nodular crank), so we'll see how it turns out.  At
 worst, I can use this one as a core to be offset ground for my stroker
 motor (a, uh, shall we say, slightly longer term project).  I _was_
 impressed when the guy immediately recognized the crank as an Olds crank
 without any other information from me. >>

I am curious as to how Joe "buy a cracked 455" Padavano's crank turned out.

The future Karl "buy a cracked 425" Aune!
And his Variable Vane singers!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 10:14:08 -0600
From: "Dave Rench" <renchd@krause.com>
Subject: Holley 650 on a 330

My brother runs a Holley 650 spreadbore double pumper on a 1966 330 with
stock internals a Performer RPM intake, headers and HEI.  He is very happy
with it.  The car (1972 Cutlass) does have a looser converter (approx.
2400rpm stall speed) and 3.91 gears which is probably one reason the double
pumper doesn't overcarburate when floored at low speed.  He rarely exceeds
5000 rpm with the motor due to stock internals and unknown mileage.  If you
were to run up to 6200-6500 a 750 might be a better choice, particularly
one with vacuum secondaries.

Dave Rench
Krause Publications
http://www.krause.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:24:21 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 455 update

I am curious as to how Joe "buy a cracked 455" Padavano's crank turned out.
____________

Well, funny you should ask, as mine was also a MT nodular crank.  Cost me
$115 for the weld/turn operation, but unfortunately when I went to pick it
up, the machinist informed me that instead of turning it 0.020-0.020 as he
had said he would, he turned it 0.020-0.030!  Needless to say, I was
somewhat upset, plus I had to return the rod bearings I'd already bought
and get new ones.  Also, there is apparently no shop anywhere near the DC
area that can re-nitride the crank (anyone on the list know of one?).

As for the block, my friend and I machined it ourselves (he's a part time
auto mechanics instructor at the local community college and thus has
access to their machines).  This is the '71 455 F2 block with the sleeve.
We took it 0.040 over (had previously been bored 0.030), making it a 464 if
my math is right.  Also resized the rods (had to get two new ones courtesy
CB Witt) and polished the beams myself based on a article in Car Craft.  Am
now balancing the rods using my friend's fixtures, after which I'll have
the crank balanced based on my measurements.  Pretty cool being able to do
the work myself.  I bought Federal Mogul forged pistons, and they were all
within 0.8 grams of each other!  No additional work needed there.

I also managed to score a pair of C heads which already had stainless
exhaust valves installed, along with a triple angle valve job, teflon
seals, and double springs for a good price (yeah, yeah, I know what I wrote
earlier.  In this case, the owner had upgraded to Edelbrocks and these
heads only had about 10K miles on them).  I'll be adding the stainless
intakes and trying my hand at some mild porting (mainly A.I.R. bump removal
and some light cleanup and polishing the exhausts - it's amazing how bad
the ports are as far as roughness and casting flash).

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 00:27:50 +0800 (SGT)
From: Rock Man <rockman20@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Paint Schemes

The women like it? Well, how could I pass up that? ;-) Actually, do
you have some pics of the car? I just don't think that original
greenish color would look really great. 

Del




- ---Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net> wrote:
>
> Rock Man wrote:
> 
> > Okay all you paint experts out there, I need some help. I have my 69
> > Cutlass S sitting at home with hardly any parts left on it or in
it. A
> >
> > friend and I were talking one night and he asked me if I am going to
> > keep the Teal Mist Metallic color that I have on there. I wasn't
> > really sure. I wanted to keep the color due to originality, but then
> > we got to talking about racing stripes. Would my car look "mean"
with
> > racing stripes? What colors for the body/stripes? Would the hood
look
> > odd since it has the chrome vents on it? Should I just stripe the
hood
> >
> > or go across the top and then the trunk? What do you guys think
would
> > make this car look mean? I am open to any suggestions.
> >
> > Del
> >
> >
> > ==
> > Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
> > rockman20@yahoo.com
> > 1986 Honda Accord DX
> > 1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
> > 1981 John Deer Snowmobile
> > 197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
> > 1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
> > _________________________________________________________
> > DO YOU YAHOO!?
> > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
> 
>    Rockman,
>    Alhough I practically grew up in a body shop, I would`nt consider
> myself a "paint expert" by any stretch of the imagination.
>   That tech changes constantly. For what it`s worth, the 69 S I bought
> was previously owned by a bodyshop proprietor. When he did the car he
> painted it the original light green metalic, but added the hood and
deck
> stripes in gloss black.. Car has black vinyl roof. When I bought the
> car, I was sure I would paint it one of the new GM dark greens and
srcap
> the stripes, but in the month or so that I had it o the road prior to
> storage I got so many compliments on the color and the stripes, (
> especially from the women- they seem to really go for the light
> metallics) that I may redo the car pretty much as it is, sans the deck
> stripes. I`ve kinda gotten to like the scheme as it is. It will get 2
> step urathene.
> 
> Bob-69 Cutlass S 455/400
> 
> 

==
Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
rockman20@yahoo.com
1986 Honda Accord DX
1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
1981 John Deer Snowmobile
197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:42:11 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake

In a message dated 98-12-08 20:04:39 EST, you write:

<< Karl,
     I had to go look at mine again, the studs for the vac. are there
(untouched!)
 and the ones for the carbs are screw in type - in fact it looks as though the
ones
 for the vac. linkage may be screw in also!  Did the originals come with press
in
 studs or?
 Todd Daenzer >>

Interesting.

This 'un has (original??) red paint so cannot really tell.
I was under the impression that the bolts (studs) were part of the original
casting.
Part of the reason for that impression was hearing of "dog eared" examples..

Mr. 57?
Do you know if these bolts were part of the casting or are screw-in or pressed
in?

Anyone?

Unfortunately, can imagine that the vacc linkage setup (esp. when
disconnected) gets pitched frequently after queries like...

"Hey! what [in] the [use you imagination] is this thing? Is it mine? Do you
remember what this came from?? Hell, it's taking up valuable space....."

But then, forged cranks have been scrapped for less....

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:53:13 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake

Do you know if these bolts were part of the casting or are screw-in or
pressed
in?

Anyone?
__________

Well, considering the production problems that would be associated with
first casting these studs integrally with the manifold then threading them
following casting, I vote for separate thread-in studs (sort of like on
every other manifold known to mankind).

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 12:11:32 -0500
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: Olds publications

Doe's anyone know of any Oldsmobile only publications? You know like Mopar,
Mustang, Pontiac, All Chevy etc..etc....

Ed
The Omega Man

2-74's

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 13:18:16 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!

I was recently informed that I am for sale - or at least, the image of my
face is. It's a long story as to how it all happened but if anyone would
like to see what list administration does to a formerly handsome guy, go
to this URL: 

http://corel.digitalriver.com/cgi-bin/ImageSearch1.exe?Preview=842073

Don't blame me if it breaks your monitor... ;-)

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 12:28:48 -0500
From: Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net>
Subject: Re: Holley 650 on a 330

Dave Rench wrote:

> My brother runs a Holley 650 spreadbore double pumper on a 1966 330
> with
> stock internals a Performer RPM intake, headers and HEI.  He is very
> happy
> with it.  The car (1972 Cutlass) does have a looser converter (approx.
>
> 2400rpm stall speed) and 3.91 gears which is probably one reason the
> double
> pumper doesn't overcarburate when floored at low speed.  He rarely
> exceeds
> 5000 rpm with the motor due to stock internals and unknown mileage.
> If you
> were to run up to 6200-6500 a 750 might be a better choice,
> particularly
> one with vacuum secondaries.
>
> Dave Rench
> Krause Publications
> http://www.krause.com

   Why vacuum secondaries?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 10:36:26 -0700
From: "Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: 493 Stroker Olds

Okay.  From what I have gathered, all I need is a 455 olds and 455 Buick
rods.  Then, mount the olds pistons on the Buick rods, grind the olds crank
to take the Buick rods and finally notch the block so that the rods can go
down all the way.  Is that all.  Does not sound that bad.  What about top
RPM.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 12:39:00 -0500
From: Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net>
Subject: Re: Paint Schemes

Rock Man wrote:

> The women like it? Well, how could I pass up that? ;-) Actually, do
> you have some pics of the car? I just don't think that original
> greenish color would look really great.
>
> Del
>
> ---Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net> wrote:
> >
> > Rock Man wrote:
> >
> > > Okay all you paint experts out there, I need some help. I have my
> 69
> > > Cutlass S sitting at home with hardly any parts left on it or in
> it. A
> > >
> > > friend and I were talking one night and he asked me if I am going
> to
> > > keep the Teal Mist Metallic color that I have on there. I wasn't
> > > really sure. I wanted to keep the color due to originality, but
> then
> > > we got to talking about racing stripes. Would my car look "mean"
> with
> > > racing stripes? What colors for the body/stripes? Would the hood
> look
> > > odd since it has the chrome vents on it? Should I just stripe the
> hood
> > >
> > > or go across the top and then the trunk? What do you guys think
> would
> > > make this car look mean? I am open to any suggestions.
> > >
> > > Del
> > >
> > >
> > > ==
> > > Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
> > > rockman20@yahoo.com
> > > 1986 Honda Accord DX
> > > 1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
> > > 1981 John Deer Snowmobile
> > > 197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
> > > 1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
> > > _________________________________________________________
> > > DO YOU YAHOO!?
> > > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >    Rockman,
> >    Alhough I practically grew up in a body shop, I would`nt consider
>
> > myself a "paint expert" by any stretch of the imagination.
> >   That tech changes constantly. For what it`s worth, the 69 S I
> bought
> > was previously owned by a bodyshop proprietor. When he did the car
> he
> > painted it the original light green metalic, but added the hood and
> deck
> > stripes in gloss black.. Car has black vinyl roof. When I bought the
>
> > car, I was sure I would paint it one of the new GM dark greens and
> srcap
> > the stripes, but in the month or so that I had it o the road prior
> to
> > storage I got so many compliments on the color and the stripes, (
> > especially from the women- they seem to really go for the light
> > metallics) that I may redo the car pretty much as it is, sans the
> deck
> > stripes. I`ve kinda gotten to like the scheme as it is. It will get
> 2
> > step urathene.
> >
> > Bob-69 Cutlass S 455/400
> >
> >
>
> ==
> Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
> rockman20@yahoo.com
> 1986 Honda Accord DX
> 1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
> 1981 John Deer Snowmobile
> 197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
> 1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
> _________________________________________________________
> DO YOU YAHOO!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

   Yep, But I don`t have a scanner yet so you`ll have to give me an
address. Won`t have scanner till Feb. 99.

Bob-69 Cutlass S 455/400

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 11:44:23 -0600
From: Brian Ammons <b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me

I save all of the mail from the list, see, so when I see something
interesting being discussed I can go back, and try to catch up, so when I
ask question I don't feel like a complete dork.  But this time, I am unable
to find the posts where this thread started, so I am unable to form
guesstimates.

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU GUYS TALKING ABOUT?  I ask you this, because I sure
would like to know.  "MT nodular crank"?  "Weld/Turn" on a "journal with a
spun bearing" that was ".035 undersize" instead of....WHAT?  The ".020 -
.020" you mentioned?  ".000 - .000 of stock"?

"Re-nitride"?

I understand why a '71 455 block is an "F2", but what is "with the sleeve"?
 Where there F2s without a "sleeve"?  Rods are what connect the pistons to
the crank, what are "beams"?  Balancing the rods involves making sure that
each of the reciprocating parts is the same weight (right?), what are
"fixtures"?

I hope that this post doesn't sound too demented (like, "Explain Fermat's
Last Theorem, with the math, RIGHT NOW!), but I like Karl and Joe, and they
seem to know a lot of intersting stuff that I would like to know...

At 10:24 AM 12/9/98 , you wrote:
>I am curious as to how Joe "buy a cracked 455" Padavano's crank turned out.
>____________
>
>Well, funny you should ask, as mine was also a MT nodular crank.  Cost me
>$115 for the weld/turn operation, but unfortunately when I went to pick it
>up, the machinist informed me that instead of turning it 0.020-0.020 as he
>had said he would, he turned it 0.020-0.030!  Needless to say, I was
>somewhat upset, plus I had to return the rod bearings I'd already bought
>and get new ones.  Also, there is apparently no shop anywhere near the DC
>area that can re-nitride the crank (anyone on the list know of one?).
>
>As for the block, my friend and I machined it ourselves (he's a part time
>auto mechanics instructor at the local community college and thus has
>access to their machines).  This is the '71 455 F2 block with the sleeve.
>We took it 0.040 over (had previously been bored 0.030), making it a 464 if
>my math is right.  Also resized the rods (had to get two new ones courtesy
>CB Witt) and polished the beams myself based on a article in Car Craft.  Am
>now balancing the rods using my friend's fixtures, after which I'll have
>the crank balanced based on my measurements.  Pretty cool being able to do
>the work myself.  I bought Federal Mogul forged pistons, and they were all
>within 0.8 grams of each other!  No additional work needed there.
>
>I also managed to score a pair of C heads which already had stainless
>exhaust valves installed, along with a triple angle valve job, teflon
>seals, and double springs for a good price (yeah, yeah, I know what I wrote
>earlier.  In this case, the owner had upgraded to Edelbrocks and these
>heads only had about 10K miles on them).  I'll be adding the stainless
>intakes and trying my hand at some mild porting (mainly A.I.R. bump removal
>and some light cleanup and polishing the exhausts - it's amazing how bad
>the ports are as far as roughness and casting flash).
>
>Joe Padavano
>padavano.joe@orbital.com
>
>66 442
>68 W-30
>69 H/O
>69 442
>70 W-30
> 
- -------------------------------------------------------------
 Brian Ammons		 Universal Internet # (ICQ) - 3585737
 MIS Major - UT Austin	 b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu
 2903 Breeze Terrace	 http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~ammons/
 Austin, TX 78722	Home :	(512) 236-8088 (Austin)
 1984 Oldsmobile		(713) 776-2110 (Houston)
	Delta 88	Pager:	(512) 483-8056
 	  4-door		(713) 318-5938	
- -------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 11:47:52 -0600
From: Brian Ammons <b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!

That manual you're reading didn't tell you a damn thing you didn't already
know, did it?

At 11:18 AM 12/9/98 , you wrote:
>
>I was recently informed that I am for sale - or at least, the image of my
>face is. It's a long story as to how it all happened but if anyone would
>like to see what list administration does to a formerly handsome guy, go
>to this URL: 
>
>http://corel.digitalriver.com/cgi-bin/ImageSearch1.exe?Preview=842073
>
>Don't blame me if it breaks your monitor... ;-)
>
>Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada
> 
- -------------------------------------------------------------
 Brian Ammons		 Universal Internet # (ICQ) - 3585737
 MIS Major - UT Austin	 b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu
 2903 Breeze Terrace	 http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~ammons/
 Austin, TX 78722	Home :	(512) 236-8088 (Austin)
 1984 Oldsmobile		(713) 776-2110 (Houston)
	Delta 88	Pager:	(512) 483-8056
 	  4-door		(713) 318-5938	
- -------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 10:51:39 -0700
From: "Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: Re: Tire Recommendation

I like my BFGoodrich  Radial T/As.  They have been great, held air
beautifully, and hold up pretty good to mileage and WOT.  They don't provide
much traction with my 3.23 posi and a 455 in my Delta.  However, I once put
on regular 225/75/15 stock tires on and they had 1/2 the traction.  The BFGs
are 255/60/15s all around.  Igor.

Igor Todorovic
1981 Delta 88 4dr (455/th400/3.23s)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 12:56:45 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake

In a message dated 98-12-09 12:00:12 EST, you write:

<< Well, considering the production problems that would be associated with
 first casting these studs integrally with the manifold then threading them
 following casting, I vote for separate thread-in studs (sort of like on
 every other manifold known to mankind). >>

Why does Karl read this as "Slap!-Slap!-Slap!..."?

Every other intake manifold known to Karl has threaded bolt-holes. A BB
factory intake manifold (with carb) weighs 70 lbs (give or take a handfull of
ounces).

Studs rising out from selected places on the J-2 is a new concept.

As the J-2 intake studs turn out to be screw-in, "rebel1" (or whomever, cannot
retrieve that Email) has the option of screwing in high quality studs in the
places of those that are missing.

And, there are 15 studs on a J-2 intake. Twelve hold three carbs. Two support
the main unit of the vacc linkage, the last one is for linkage and is to the
left of rear carb. All other fastening points are bolt holes (most are
threaded...).

After that beating, the digest looks relaxing....

           :-)}


Karl Aune
and Soylent Ocean Mist
1965 Dynamic 88 Celebrity Sedan
Members; OCA, IVOC
KarlAune@aol.com
http://meltingpot.fortunecity.com/thurlow/858/index.html
http://members.aol.com/KarlAune/rage.html

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 10:13:06 -0800 
From: Chris Fair <cfair@FairIsaac.com>
Subject: RE: Pearl White/White

I'm just going through this on my 66 Starfire. I'm switching to a
contemporary parchment color instead of the factory correct parchment pearl.

Reason being the pearl adds a real gold tint to it which my girlfriend
described as "prostitute's nailpolish". 

I agree with her and opted for the better looking (my view) and more subdued
parchment. 

You have to look at the colors in various light settings and side by side to
determine which you like better though. 

Choose carefully,
cf

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Peter Landowski [mailto:PETTRIX@prodigy.net]
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 1998 12:57 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Pearl White/White
> 
> 
> This is applied for interior colors:
> 
> To the best of my knowledge in 70 & 71 the only white 
> available on 442's
> was a pearl white. In 72 the white was called just white.
> My queston is which white is the more brighter white (pearl 
> or white)? Also
> which do you think is the nicer looking white?
> 
> Pettrix@prodigy.net
> 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:11:21 -0700
From: "Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

I have a question for those of you who have driven/raced late '80s and early
90's 5.0 Mustangs.  How fast are they.  I get stuff from people like: not
that fast, or: super fast even stock.  I would like to know how my 455 '81
Delta would stand against a 5.0 at a stop light.  Yes I know, I should race
one, but:  Number one, the car is in the bodyshop still, and number two, for
the one week that I drove it I never had the opportunity to stop beside a
5.0 Mustang and pick on him/her.  Once picked on a few 16yr. guys in a 5.0
but we were moving (I won but I also hit the gas first).  My car goes pretty
good for the amount of money I spent into the motor ($1600 CAN or so, ~$1000
US).  It has a TH400 with a 12-inch converter & Hurst Stage 2 kit.  It also
has 3.23 posi and 255/60/15 BFGoodrich T/As.  Stock exhaust manifolds with
dual 2.5" pipes (no cats) & balancer tube.  Mufflers are Dynomax Super Turbo
and 2.25" tail pipes.  These are the motor specks:

'76 Delta 88 block & heads
.030 10:1CR pistons (9.6 about)
Lunatic grind cam, .448/.472 lift, 204/214 @.050 duration
ported&polished(exhaust side)&shaved J-heads
DBL. Roller chain
new rings, bearings, etc..
HEI ignition w ACCEL coil
Stock Intake (soon to put a '70 442 intake on)
New Q-jet (same model as '70 442)
Stock Fuel Pump, K&N air filter (14x3)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 12:19:28 -0600 (CST)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!

This just shows again that beautiful faces need a lot of room... (i am 
getting more room for my face too though I am in the beginners-stage...)

So long, George

- --------------------------------------------------------------
'68 Cuttlass S Conv. 
http://estimator.camd.lsu.edu/georg/sparetime/olds.html
- --------------------------------------------------------------

On Wed, 9 Dec 1998, Greg Beaulieu wrote:

> 
> I was recently informed that I am for sale - or at least, the image of my
> face is. It's a long story as to how it all happened but if anyone would
> like to see what list administration does to a formerly handsome guy, go
> to this URL: 
> 
> http://corel.digitalriver.com/cgi-bin/ImageSearch1.exe?Preview=842073
> 
> Don't blame me if it breaks your monitor... ;-)
> 
> Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada
> 
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 13:36:49 -0500
From: Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net>
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

Igor T. '81 DRB 455 wrote:

> I have a question for those of you who have driven/raced late '80s and
> early
> 90's 5.0 Mustangs.  How fast are they.  I get stuff from people like:
> not
> that fast, or: super fast even stock.  I would like to know how my 455
> '81
> Delta would stand against a 5.0 at a stop light.  Yes I know, I should
> race
> one, but:  Number one, the car is in the bodyshop still, and number
> two, for
> the one week that I drove it I never had the opportunity to stop
> beside a
> 5.0 Mustang and pick on him/her.  Once picked on a few 16yr. guys in a
> 5.0
> but we were moving (I won but I also hit the gas first).  My car goes
> pretty
> good for the amount of money I spent into the motor ($1600 CAN or so,
> ~$1000
> US).  It has a TH400 with a 12-inch converter & Hurst Stage 2 kit.  It
> also
> has 3.23 posi and 255/60/15 BFGoodrich T/As.  Stock exhaust manifolds
> with
> dual 2.5" pipes (no cats) & balancer tube.  Mufflers are Dynomax Super
> Turbo
> and 2.25" tail pipes.  These are the motor specks:
>
> '76 Delta 88 block & heads
> .030 10:1CR pistons (9.6 about)
> Lunatic grind cam, .448/.472 lift, 204/214 @.050 duration
> ported&polished(exhaust side)&shaved J-heads
> DBL. Roller chain
> new rings, bearings, etc..
> HEI ignition w ACCEL coil
> Stock Intake (soon to put a '70 442 intake on)
> New Q-jet (same model as '70 442)
> Stock Fuel Pump, K&N air filter (14x3)

   Igor,
   Prolly depends on what mods might be in any given 5.0. There`s one
in my area with a Paxton blower and 5spd that`s reportly blown quite a
few BBs away. Says he has low 12sec time slips. I just don`t think he`s
run into a BB that`s set up correctly yet. The first 60ft is crucial I
think. Unlike some states it`s hard to get away with very radical mods
in Pa. 9-10sec street cars are few and far between around here anyway.
 Go across the line into OH. and it`s a whole new ballgame.

Bob-69 Cutlass S 455/400

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 13:41:16 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Ummmm.....was: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me

In a message dated 98-12-09 12:43:29 EST, you write:

<< "MT nodular crank"?  "Weld/Turn" on a "journal with a
 spun bearing" that was ".035 undersize" instead of....WHAT?  The ".020 -
 .020" you mentioned?  ".000 - .000 of stock"? "Re-nitride"? I understand why
a '71 455 block is an "F2", but what is "with the sleeve"?  Where there F2s
without a "sleeve"?  Rods are what connect the pistons to the crank, what are
"beams"?  Balancing the rods involves making sure that each of the
reciprocating parts is the same weight (right?), what are "fixtures"? >>

"Do nothing!
 Be silent!
 Be still!
 Rest in the arms of the Dragon!
 Dream! [of Oldsmobiles]!"
    -Merlin (John Boorman's "Excalibur")

First, Karl re-posted (without warning) a quite old missive from Joe P. after
a hard-drive cleaning session. 

(Jonathan Parke had the right idea, I DO have most previous posts up to June,
just not in any order aside from date........)

Joe P. has had "engine" troubles regarding his project 1966 Cutlass (which,
by-the-by, could turn into a real head turner!). The block he intended to use
turned out to.... well.... suck. Beleive the crank was marred with rod-bolt-
marks on the throws, a sleeve in one cylinder, and so on. Karl will look up
the exact post later. Thereafter he as Karl would do purchased a different 455
block that turned out to have a nifty 2" crack in it. Back to the first block.

With us?

O.K. The sleeving implies excessive wear to the internals. Karl is not certain
of all of Joe's references but here goes.....

"MT nodular crank"? - Manual Transmission nodular steel crankshaft - nodular
steel is a notch above cast iron and a notch below forged steel for sheer
strength. Saw the actual heirarchy for strength lately in a perf prof
lecture.... post that later.

"Weld/Turn" on a "journal with a spun bearing" that was ".035 undersize"
instead of....WHAT? - Not sure, BUT willing to guess! Spun bearing on crank
journal caused excessive wear. (right?) To a point that actual surface was
0.035" below specs. (right?) So. Weld/turn is a manner of adding material to
the journal, then turning it back down to specs. (right?)

"Re-nitride" - kinda reaching, but Karl thinks this is a heat-treat type
coating to prolong the life of the crank.

 The ".020 - .020" you mentioned?  ".000 - .000 of stock"? - Think you
understood that one. Recall Joe returned crank bearings when he found the
journals were turned 0.035 instead of 0.020!

but what is "with the sleeve"? Where there F2s without a "sleeve"? - the
"sleeve" is an extreme measure after overboring. Essentially, there is not
enough material in most blocks to add overbore to previous overbore. Therfore
the only real solution is to add material to the cylinder by "sleeving".
Essentially placing a metal cylinder TIGHTLY against the wall of the cylinder.
This provides a smooth, flat cylinder for piston travel in blocks that
otherwise might have to be discarded for lack of further cyl wall material
(cant bore more w/o going into a water jacket). Joe's motor was discovered to
have a "sleeve" as well as other flaws.

Where there F2s without a "sleeve"? - "Sleeves" are all post-wear conditions.
All new-from-the-factory blocks had no sleeves.

Rods are what connect the pistons to the crank, what are "beams"? - (Reaching
again!) Believe Joe meant the "beam" of the connecting rods, i.e. the "I beam"
of rod connecting the two ends of piston rod . [really running for Email-bomb-
shelter over this one!]

Balancing the rods involves making sure that each of the reciprocating parts
is the same weight (right?) - Er.. uh.... Karl not know. But think so. Recall
Joe was impressed that forged pistons were VERY close together weight-wise.

 what are "fixtures"? - the Shattered Fixtures are a local band referenced in
an episode of MTV's Aeon Flux..... Oh. "...using my friends fixtures." (( this
brings to mind the short pushrods thread [that Karl still gots]))
J.P. is likely referring to "capital equipment" out of financial reach to most
do-it-yerselfers.

Joe? How'd I do?

K

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 13:46:54 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Mr. 57 Olds? J-2 bolts? was: The J-2 intake

Why does Karl read this as "Slap!-Slap!-Slap!..."?
_________

Hey, at least I didn't use a rubber hose!   ;-)

Actually, _many_ manifolds use carb studs (just not many Olds
manifolds...).  Fortunately, as you correctly point out, it is easy to
replace them with high-strength studs if necessary.

Joe Padavano (graduate of the C.B. Witt Charm School)
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:53:23 -0700
From: "Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

>   Prolly depends on what mods might be in any given 5.0. There`s one
>in my area with a Paxton blower and 5spd that`s reportly blown quite a
>few BBs away. Says he has low 12sec time slips.

Oh, I know.  I am interested in a stock 5.0, maybe with headers and a couple
of other mods like that.  Paxton blowers and 12 sec. cars are WAY out of my
league.  I understand what you are saying.  I know a guy who owned one once
(now has a Acura Integra, hates it).  He said that it was a "fun" car and
that it had lots of balls.  He said that the only thing he did was headers
and exhaust (no cats, I think it was a '90 5.0, no emissions here).  I wish
I could find a set of headers that fit as I think that they would really
help the car.  Even though my exhaust is not bad, the manifolds have a 2 or
2.25" outlet, which is way too small.  If anyone knows what headers would
fit, please let me know.  Thanks.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 13:50:32 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Ummmm.....was: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me

Joe? How'd I do?

K
_______

Just about nail'd 'em all.  Guess I can put that rubber hose away...

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 04:27:13 +1100 (EST)
From: Rock Man <rockman20@yahoo.com>
Subject: Non Olds but may save money!

Sorry about this list, but since this is a slow day so far, I wanted
to give you all a site that I got today. So far the information that I
know of is true. This site may some day save your hide when you are
racing your Olds on the open highway. (Olds related! ;-)

http://www.speedtrap.com

Del




==
Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
rockman20@yahoo.com
1986 Honda Accord DX
1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
1981 John Deer Snowmobile
197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:04:49 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Jetfire ad

To Ray and anyone else interested in the Jetfire, check out the .mov file
of the 62 Jetfire ad on 442.com, under the multimedia heading.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:07:13 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: C.B.W. was: J-2 intakes and Midaeval Attitudes...

In a message dated 98-12-09 13:54:52 EST, you write:

<<  (graduate of the C.B. Witt Charm School) >>

OTOH one can see why the "Rocket Scientist" left of his own voliton....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:04:19 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!

In a message dated 98-12-09 12:19:34 EST, you write:

<< I was recently informed that I am for sale - or at least, the image of my
 face is. It's a long story as to how it all happened but if anyone would
 like to see what list administration does to a formerly handsome guy, go
 to this URL:  >>

1) We met at Centennial (sort of..) guess Karl's memory is worse than
previously remembered.....
(somehow may be confusing with Jim Chermac....)
[no slight intended to either party!]

2) At least you are not pictured reading about Win98 (curse Bill Gates!)...

3) Being a Corel icon is better than being a Microsoft icon in Karl's book.

[Who had that Email-bomb-shelter again????]

SOM
&KA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 11:16:43 PST
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: model info

> It's an HO scale model of a 1968 442.  I got this from an HO train
> catalog.  It's made by Magnuson Models, and the package says
> Manufactured by Wm. K. Walthers, Inc, 5601 W. Florist Ave,
> Milwaukee, WI  53218.  Note that I got it about 10 years ago,
> don't know if they are still available.

That specific one I don't know, but you'll be interested in
what I _did_ find. First of all, they're on the web at 
http://www.walthers.com (of course), and have a spiffy interface that 
allows you to search for specific items. In a hunt for "Olds" I came 
up with a sizeable list of matches, including a 1904 Olds and Olds 
Inspection Car (HO scale) at 

http://www.walthers.com/htbin/waltprodinfo?part_no=360-228

...and an extremely purple 1970 Olds 442 in "G" scale (1/25?) at

http://www.walthers.com/htbin/waltprodinfo?part_no=704-7401

Happy hunting.

- -- Andy

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 11:19:30 -0800 
From: Chris Fair <cfair@FairIsaac.com>
Subject: Alternator still high

So, I get in the Starfire after not running it for a few days and now the
volt gauge shows what I read as 15+ volts. At idle

I'm getting nervous and about the change out the Alt. The battery is new and
I don't want to cook it. 

Is this conservative or am I worrying unneccessarily?

TIA  (Thanks In Advance)

cf

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:16:28 EST
From: GT5726@aol.com
Subject: Re: More Edelbrock Stuff

In a message dated 12/9/98 9:11:47 AM Central Standard Time,
Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM writes:

<<  First, expect
 to pay close to $500 just to get a stock valve job.  Add the cost of
 hardened seats, stainless valves, good springs, etc.  >>


....HELL! In Dallas the going rate for a assembled longblock 455 is $700.
Where are you finding prices like these($500)?

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:19:50 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Non-Olds: Scary Sight!

3) Being a Corel icon is better than being a Microsoft icon in Karl's book.
__________

Thank you!  Thank you!  Thank you!

I'll give up my copy of WordPerfect when they pry my cold, dead hands from
the keyboard.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:23:39 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

In a message dated 98-12-09 13:56:57 EST, you write:

<<  He said that the only thing he did was headers
 and exhaust (no cats, I think it was a '90 5.0, no emissions here).  I wish
 I could find a set of headers that fit as I think that they would really
 help the car.  Even though my exhaust is not bad, the manifolds have a 2 or
 2.25" outlet, which is way too small.  If anyone knows what headers would
 fit, please let me know.  Thanks. >>

Wanted to stay out of this, but self restraint failed Karl.

1) the 5.0 is simply a 305 with a relatively high final drive ratio.

2) SOM's 425 (single exh, when stock) was sufficient to beat most everyone
that thought they were fast, including a new Mercury (of all things) and
others (no Eclipse's) when carb did'nt bog. {rebuid very good except for minor
choke adjustment}

3) Headers can help HP, but!

There are two crucial factors! First is size of primaries. This is a
significant restriction and can play a large role in the ultimate hp/torque
curve.

Again, check the appropriate lecture (headers) of the Perf. Prof. at
Racermall.com for more info, including calculations. [As Karl keeps mentioning
this, cannot justify looking up his printouts and copying calculations....]

Secondly, the ultimate width of the headders/exh pipe can also have affects on
the harmonics of the exhaust pulse......but this category is more vague and
plays less of a role in the torque peak.

Thirdly (and you DID know there was a #3 ?) the exact model of Header can be
important. Just as it is can be bad to have adjacent intake valves open in an
open plenum intake (first robs second of some f/a signal) can also be bad to
have interfering "cross-talk" between adjacently-firing cylinder exh-header-
tubes...

In short, there is more involved in headers than just bolting them on for a
horsepower gain. More like a HP gain at certain RPMs and HP loss at
others.....

But then you knew what you were getting into.

Right?

SOM

&KA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 13:43:15 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 455 update, Karl/Joe know more than me

WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU GUYS TALKING ABOUT?
________

OK, here goes:

"MT nodular crank"?

MT=manual trans, in that, unlike those in most Olds motors, this crank was
factory drilled for the pilot bearing required to run a manual trans.
Nodular crank indicates that the crank is cast in the stronger nodular iron
as opposed to the run-of-the-mill cast iron.  Not as strong as forged, but
better that simple cast.

"Weld/Turn" on a "journal with a spun bearing"

When you spin a rod bearing, the babbit bearing physically turns inside the
rod's big end, usually with disastrous results for both the crank journal
and the rod (hence the reason why I needed a couple of new rods).  This
damages the surface of the crank, requiring, at a minimum, the crank
journals to be ground undersize (more in a minute).  If the crank is worn
too far to safely turn, the machine shop can attempt to save it by building
up the worn journal with an arc welder, then remachining the journal back
to the correct size.

".035 undersize" instead of....WHAT?  The ".020 - .020" you mentioned?
".000 - .000 of stock"?

Yep.  The 0.020-0.020 refers to the main and rod journals being ground
0.020" under the nominal factory diameter.  The first 0.020 is the mains,
the second the rods.  These don't need to be the same; you could, for
example, have the mains turned 0.010" undersize and the rod journals 0.020"
undersize if the crank wasn't worn as much on the mains.  In that case,
you'd refer to the crank as being 0.010-0.020.

"Re-nitride"?

Olds cranks are nitrided for increased hardness on the bearing surfaces.
This is a surface treatment of the metal that goes a few thousandths deep.
If you turn the crank 0.020 or 0.030 undersize, like mine was, you remove
the nitriding.  It's desirable (but not mandatory) that the crank be
renitrided.

what is "with the sleeve"?  Where there F2s without a "sleeve"?

When I first disassembled this motor back in the summer, I posted a long
and sordid story of the internal carnage I found, not the least of which
was that in a previous life, this motor had somehow suffered a cracked wall
in the no 1 cylinder (hence Karl's "buy a cracked 455" tagline).  The
repair for such a crack is to bore the cylinder oversize and press a steel
sleeve into the cylinder.  That had been done to this particular block in a
prior rebuild.  No, it is not a factory item.

Rods are what connect the pistons to the crank, what are "beams"?

The center portion of a connecting rod is an I-beam cross section, hence
the term "beams".  The outsides of these beams are typically rough cast
with many microscopic cracks and machine marks which can lead to stress
cracks and ultimately rod failure in high RPM usage.  It is common practice
to sand the outer edges of the rod beams to remove these incipient cracks.
Did I need to do it on this particular street-driven motor?  Probably not,
but I figured it was a good place to practice for when I build the motors
for my 66 and 70 (which _will_ see extended high-RPM use).

Balancing the rods involves making sure that each of the reciprocating
parts is the same weight (right?), what are "fixtures"?

Correct, the overall weight and the reciprocating weights need to be
matched for the set.  The fixtures allow you to hold each end of the rod in
succession, while the other end rests on a scale.  The fixturing
incorporates roller bearings and other features to ensure that friction is
minimized to increase the accuracy of the measurements.

Hope this helps

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:38:51 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: More Edelbrock Stuff

....HELL! In Dallas the going rate for a assembled longblock 455 is $700.
Where are you finding prices like these($500)?
_______

Well, I believe you get what you pay for.  You can get an Earl Schieb paint
job for under $200, but I wouldn't take my car there.  Let's put that $700
number in perspective.  The best price I can get on a 455 rebuild kit alone
(with pistons) is something like $470.  Yes, bulk rebuilders get a better
price on the parts, but I'll wager you're not getting FelPro and Federal
Mogul parts, either.  Assuming jobber cost on the parts is $350, that still
only leaves another $350 for all the machine work on the block, the valve
job, and assembly labor.  Now I'll assume that these large rebuilders have
automated equipment that will do a bunch of the same blocks fairly quickly
and with little human intervention to minimize labor costs, but is that
what you want in your motor?

$500 for a valve job includes disassembly, hot tanking, surface the heads,
grind and lap the valves, new seals, set the valve stem height, shim the
springs, reassembly, and new freeze plugs in the heads.  That also includes
the price of the gasket set.  Yes, I'm rounding off high, but it isn't the
$150 it used to be either.  And yes, prices in the DC area are likely
higher than those in Dallas.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

Joe Padavano

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:45:14 EST
From: KarlAune@aol.com
Subject: Goin' to digest for a spell...

Karl's AOL Emailbox has had projectile vomiting the past few days.

Problem might be that the Maelstrom has Email on its hard drive (C:) that
dates from June.

Either that or certain messages are causing problems...

Any road, Karl has missed much mail because he had to delete what was in the
mailbox to eliminate whatever was the offender!

(Anyon got the last 4-5 digests? Especially the one with all the intake
traffic?)
((Karl wanted to read about that...))

Karl will still irritate y'all with his missives, but may be hindered as far
as traffic with individuals!

Read Dorian's (private) and Joe P.'s crank tale....and Barb's tires.... and
have replied to J2.... but thats about all of the mail Karl could read...

Especially those who replied privately the past few days w/o recieving a
reply!

If the subject heading did not catch my eye, the message is probably gone!

Please re-send!

Thanks much

SOM

&KA

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:47:34 EST
From: GT5726@aol.com
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

In a message dated 12/9/98 12:14:21 PM Central Standard Time, igor455@home.com
writes:

<< I have a question for those of you who have driven/raced late '80s and
early
 90's 5.0 Mustangs.  How fast are they.  >>

As a recent owner of a Ford Lightning(351w) and having several chances to race
Mustangs(Moosetangs). I can say that the stock Five-0's run (w/5-speed and
good driver)in the high to mid-high 14's...14.70's+. The stock 5.0 Cobra's run
low 14's, and the 32valve cobra's run 13.90's

I currently thrash about the local track(Texas Motor Speedway...haha) with a
65 Cutlass that I have slips as low as 13.87. I have less than $1400 hundred
in this car...paint, motor, tires, used 442 badges and scoops, and purchase
price. I love to rub that fact in when I just barely eeeek past a $30,000+
car!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:51:44 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

1) the 5.0 is simply a 305..
_________

Actually, the 5.0 Ford is simply the old 302 (4" bore, 3" stroke, which
really yields a 301.6 if you  do the math).  Not to be confused with the
5.0 liter Chevy, which _is_ a 305.  And the 305 should not be confused with
the original Z/28 motor (67-69) _was_ a 301, er, 302, of 4" bore and 3"
stroke, but that was pre-metric displacements.  Interestingly enough, the
301 Pontiac motor of the late 70s/early 80s was also a 4" bore, 3" stroke,
but was called a 301 and a 4.9 liter motor (which would be more accurate).
Nor should any of these be confused with the 5.0 liter Olds, which is a 307
(which is the closest of any to being a true 5.0 liters).

We all clear on that?

(Gimmie a break, it's been a slow day at work)

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:08:06 -0600
From: "Lou Biggs" <lbiggs@intertek.net>
Subject: Re: Joining!

Ray, 
Right!
Lou

- ----------
> From: Ray Costanzo <costanzo@netcarrier.com>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: RE: Joining!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 14:01:04 -0600
From: Paul Brillhart <pbrill1@uic.edu>
Subject: Re: 455 update, Hey Karl!

KarlAune@aol.com wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 98-08-06 16:15:36 EDT, you write:
> 
> << Subj:         455 update
>  The journal with the spun bearing
>  was 0.035 undersize :-0  Crank(y) guy in the shop claims he can weld it and
>  turn the whole thing to 0.020-0.020 for about $100.  I say "Why not" (it
>  is, after all, an MT nodular crank), so we'll see how it turns out.  At
>  worst, I can use this one as a core to be offset ground for my stroker
>  motor (a, uh, shall we say, slightly longer term project).  I _was_
>  impressed when the guy immediately recognized the crank as an Olds crank
>  without any other information from me. >>
> 
> I am curious as to how Joe "buy a cracked 455" Padavano's crank turned out.
> 
> The future Karl "buy a cracked 425" Aune!
> And his Variable Vane singers!

Hey Karl,


  I believe you're in the midwest.  Who is this crank(y) guy that
recognizes an Olds crank?  The reason I'm asking is I've got a '66 Toro
425 I took apart(no cracks, journals are perfect) and was going to use
the press-in bearing and shorten my input spline.  However, if ther is a
good crank guy around, I'd love to have him bore the proper pilot
bearing hole in the crank.  I just don't want to end up with a slightly
off-center bearing ala Mr. Wyatt.

Paul Brillhart

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:29:54 -0600 (CST)
From: hitson@i1.net (roger hitson)
Subject: Re: Alternator still high

Chris,

I have a truck I've had for about ten years, and I bought it used. Its 
alternator has put out nearly seventeen (17) volts all the time I've owned 
it. I used to worry about it, no, obsess with it. After ten years with it 
now and having had to replace only one battery in that time, I no longer 
concern myself with it at all. I have had no particular problems with 
electric or electronic components in the truck, including aftermarket stereo 
stuff.

My non-Olds point is,  try to stop thinkin' about it.

roger hitson

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 14:21:55 -0600
From: "Lou Biggs" <lbiggs@intertek.net>
Subject: Re: Tire Recommendation

Barb, 
Started using T/A 's in 1978, never had a problem with them, the raised
letter ones, street versions, dry and wet tread compound, got 70,000 on a
Vega and 45,000 on a Trans Am as w/400 engine/Ram Air that I drove like an
idiot. Got 250,000 miles out of four sets on the T/A. Have them on
everything now, all I know.
Lou Biggs
lbiggs@intertek.net
- -------
> From: barbw@uswest.net
> To: Oldsmobile <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> Subject: Tire Recommendation

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 15:16:11 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: model info

...and an extremely purple 1970 Olds 442 in "G" scale (1/25?)
________

That's the Testor's HSO (Hobby Shop Only) series model, which looks a lot
like the old JoHan 1970 442 model kit, right down to the customizing bits
included in the kit.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 15:21:54 EST
From: AGUY4RUMLI@aol.com
Subject: anyone have 17'' on a 72 olds yet??

im looking to do this upgrade on mine. I want the widest tires i can fit front
and back. I am currently running 275/60/15 on the rear which is a big tire w/
no problems. And i have alot of space from the inside wall to the frame, so i
was thinking of changing the offset of the rim and go w/ 10'' wide rear rims.
Thanks for any input by the way the car is lowered and everything must fit
under wheel wells.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 9 Dec 1998 15:47:07 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 493 Stroker Olds

Okay.  From what I have gathered, all I need is a 455 olds and 455 Buick
rods.  Then, mount the olds pistons on the Buick rods, grind the olds crank
to take the Buick rods and finally notch the block so that the rods can go
down all the way.  Is that all.  Does not sound that bad.  What about top
RPM.
________

"All" is probably an oversimplification.  You'll need to verify things like
the resulting deck height of the pistons, which may require custom pistons
with a different pin location. You'll clearly need to rebalance the
reciprocating assembly, and in addition to notching the block, you'll want
to check internal clearances everywhere (rod big end to cam lobes, crank
counterweights to underside of pistons, etc.).  The line in Mondello's
catalog should be a tipoff:  "there's no way to build this crank
inexpensively..."  Oh, and with the longer stroke and shorter rods, the rod
angle will positively suck, limiting RPMs and increasing piston and
cylinder wear.  Yes, you can build this motor (several on the list have
strokers), but it won't be cheap.  The latest issue of Car Craft has a
pretty decent article about building stroker motors.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 09 Dec 1998 15:57:07 -0500
From: Bob Dale <bctad5@toolcity.net>
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

GT5726@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 12/9/98 12:14:21 PM Central Standard Time,
> igor455@home.com
> writes:
>
> << I have a question for those of you who have driven/raced late '80s
> and
> early
>  90's 5.0 Mustangs.  How fast are they.  >>
>
> As a recent owner of a Ford Lightning(351w) and having several chances
> to race
> Mustangs(Moosetangs). I can say that the stock Five-0's run (w/5-speed
> and
> good driver)in the high to mid-high 14's...14.70's+. The stock 5.0
> Cobra's run
> low 14's, and the 32valve cobra's run 13.90's
>
> I currently thrash about the local track(Texas Motor Speedway...haha)
> with a
> 65 Cutlass that I have slips as low as 13.87. I have less than $1400
> hundred
> in this car...paint, motor, tires, used 442 badges and scoops, and
> purchase
> price. I love to rub that fact in when I just barely eeeek past a
> $30,000+
> car!

   Kudos pal. I love it.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 06:19:27 +1100 (EST)
From: Stefan Gadecki <sgadecki@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: brakes H*LP on 70 Cutlass

  Try driving around in reverse for a bit.  Go to a side street/back
road and drive in reverse, hitting the brakes a bunch of times (brake
pretty hard)  this should adjust the brakes.  Then check the brake
fluid again.  The fliud should be lower, so add to the appropriate
level.  If doing this doesn't help, take one of your wheels off and
look at the pads.  new pads are about 1/4" thick, and if yours are
less that 1/8", they're gonna have to be replaced.  Other than that,
you might have some air bubbles in the brake lines, so you have to
push down farther because the air compresses before it pushes the
fluid.  If that's the case, you have to bleed the brake lines, which I
personally hate doing.

Hope this helps,
Stefan
1970 Cutlass 'S' Holiday Coupe
sgadecki@yahoo.com



- ---Matt Cremean <creme1ma@cmich.edu> wrote:
>
> Does someone have an explanation as to why I have to put the brake
pedal
> on The Unit almost to the floor before I get any braking power? 
<snip>
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 10 Dec 1998 07:06:56 +1100 (EST)
From: Rock Man <rockman20@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: 5.0 Mustang Vs. 455

Igor,

It all depends on how modified the 5.0 is. I have won against stock
5.0's with my 69 Cutlass. 350 with performer cam. Everything else was
still stock. A TH350 underneath that went into highway gear rear-end.
(Been told it's 2.73....2.78....sound right?) If you find a modified
one, watch out! There is a early 90's 5.0 running around Fargo here.
He is running 9's in the quarter. (That is with help of the juice can
though!) But, I did see him just about win a race against a crotch
rocket (W/O the juice). He lost only by a bike length.




- ---"Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com> wrote:
>
> I have a question for those of you who have driven/raced late '80s
and early
> 90's 5.0 Mustangs.  How fast are they.  I get stuff from people
like: not
> that fast, or: super fast even stock.  I would like to know how my
455 '81
> Delta would stand against a 5.0 at a stop light.  Yes I know, I
should race
> one, but:  Number one, the car is in the bodyshop still, and number
two, for
> the one week that I drove it I never had the opportunity to stop
beside a
> 5.0 Mustang and pick on him/her.  Once picked on a few 16yr. guys in
a 5.0
> but we were moving (I won but I also hit the gas first).  My car
goes pretty
> good for the amount of money I spent into the motor ($1600 CAN or
so, ~$1000
> US).  It has a TH400 with a 12-inch converter & Hurst Stage 2 kit. 
It also
> has 3.23 posi and 255/60/15 BFGoodrich T/As.  Stock exhaust
manifolds with
> dual 2.5" pipes (no cats) & balancer tube.  Mufflers are Dynomax
Super Turbo
> and 2.25" tail pipes.  These are the motor specks:
> 
> '76 Delta 88 block & heads
> .030 10:1CR pistons (9.6 about)
> Lunatic grind cam, .448/.472 lift, 204/214 @.050 duration
> ported&polished(exhaust side)&shaved J-heads
> DBL. Roller chain
> new rings, bearings, etc..
> HEI ignition w ACCEL coil
> Stock Intake (soon to put a '70 442 intake on)
> New Q-jet (same model as '70 442)
> Stock Fuel Pump, K&N air filter (14x3)
> 
> 

==
Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
rockman20@yahoo.com
1986 Honda Accord DX
1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
1981 John Deer Snowmobile
197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1653
*********************************

