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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1795


oldsmobile-digest      Sunday, February 21 1999      Volume 01 : Number 1795



Re: Weber Side Drafts
email trouble
RE: new 71 owner.
Re: Resto $$
Re: Resto $$
Re: broken dipstick help
Re: carb
Re: [Re: Resto $$]
RE: 83-455 - Headers???, Hood...  etc.
Re: accel air filter
Re: [TH-200R4- price/where to buy/etc...]
RE: Paint Prep (Igor)
Re: [Re: broken dipstick help]
Re: Rechroming bumpers...need suggestions!
Re: Roll Call
Restoration experts, help needed
where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
Re: 307's in 442's
Re: 307's in 442's
Re: CCC Feedback Quadrajet -- fast idle & air cleaner question.
Re: broken dipstick help
Re: Restoration experts, help needed
Re: accel air filter
Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's
455 Break-In
unsubscribe oldsmobile
re gauges 86 salon-list
RE: 455 Break-In
Re: My Cutlass has a problem
RE: My Cutlass has a problem
Re: broken dipstick help
Re: Restoration experts, help needed
Re: Restoration experts, help needed
Re: new 71 owner
Interesting item on eBay web site item#67341790: 1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 HOOD!!!
Re: Restoration experts, help needed
Interesting item on eBay web site item#67388848: Rare Factory Chrome 
Aircleaner for Oldsmobile
Nice 1977 Supreme in Iowa for only $1700
Re: Interesting item on eBay web site item#67341790: 1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 
HOOD!!!

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:29:07 -0500
From: Jonathan Parke <jonparke@together.net>
Subject: Re: Weber Side Drafts

Gary,

Eugene Czackor
Northeast Exotics
207-439-5415
51 Goodwin Rd
Kittery Pt., ME

Exotics@pop3.skidpad.com

Met this guy when I was with a friend picking up a Maserati last fall.  He
was the mechanic for the guy who owned the Maserati.  Anyway got to talking
with him about my Cutlass project and he thought it would be neat if put
Weber Side Drafts on it, said he'd done it to another American BB (can't
remember which) and that the Olds would be easy.

Don't know if the e-mail address is good, but I've talked to him several
times on the phone (though not recently).

Might be worth a call... he's quite a treasure trove of facts.

jp



>Hummm. Has anyone ever seen a BB Olds with Weber Side draft carbs mounted.
>This sort of intrigues me if it's ever been done and if any hardware exists.
>
>-----Regards,
>
>Gary J. Couse
>Couse Custom's
>Route-1, Box-615
>Purling, NY 12470
>
>ICQ# 5209322
>gjcouse@francomm.com
>gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com
>
>Custom Conversion Prototype:
>CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
>http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 17:25:41 -0500
From: dgerow@student.stonehill.edu (Daniel R. Gerow)
Subject: email trouble

If anyone is attempting to contact me regarding the Screen saver, my email is
messed up and I think I took myself off the list.
Personal emails should contact me at:

dgerow@stonehill.edu

Please keep sending pics if you have them.

Thanks,

Dan Gerow

- --
- ---------------------
Daniel R. Gerow
Computer Support
Systems Administrator
Stonehill College
320 Washington Street
Easton, MA 02357
dgerow@stonehill.edu
- ---------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:42:56 -0600
From: "Charles A. Dempsey" <cdemps@lsumc.edu>
Subject: RE: new 71 owner.

chuckmanning@email.msn.com wrote:

>I recently inherited a 71 olds cutlass from my grandmother that passed away.
>She bought the car brand new and I found the original papers in the glove
>box including the protecto plate and all service records.  

Neat!

>The only thing is that grandma was thrifty.
>The car only has power steering and the original am radio.  
>It has the 350 2-barrel with 
>barley 100,000.00 miles on it.
 ^^^^^^
Ahh! A long time beer drinker :-). 

> What I would like to do is
>turn it into a 442 but I am concerned about the cost.

IMHO, the thing to be concerned about is not messing up a piece of
history. It's easy to get long on the plans, and short on the execution.
My best advise is;

1. Don't cut any holes in the car.
2. Keep all of the original equipment and box it up in case you (or a
subsequent owner) want to restore the car to its original condition.
3. Don't change the color.

It may not be feasible to clone a 442 on this chassis. In 1971 the 442
was offered in Holiday Hardtop and convertible versions only. Even if
you go to the time and expense of cloning a 442, the result might be
less valuable (except as parts) than the original.

The car can still be enjoyed. Upgrade the suspension to poly bushings HD
springs and sway bars, overhaul the motor with some good speed gear.
Think of it as a stealth 442. Most important, take good care of it and
it will take good care of you.

Charles

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 21:26:55 EST
From: CPEARLPARK@aol.com
Subject: Re: Resto $$

Thanks Karl, and if anyone else can help in the search for good shots of a 71
455 compartment, I'd sure appreciate it.

Scott
71 442 Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 21:29:33 EST
From: CPEARLPARK@aol.com
Subject: Re: Resto $$

Thanks, Kev, for the good wishes, but I can only hope that, when we're done,
I'll have some cash left over for some gas...

Scott
71 442 Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:04:53 -0500
From: Jeff Mullenix <muxx@exis.net>
Subject: Re: broken dipstick help

At 06:40 PM 2/20/1999 -0600, patrick derkacz wrote:
>Well,  I got my headers from summit, in one day(very cool).  Went to put em
>in.  Realized the dipstick tube had to come out to put the drivers side
>header in and the &^%$%&** thing broke right at the base.
>
Screw in a metal screw big enough to take a bite on the left over tube.
Crawl under the with a hammer and a flat bladed screw driver and tap, tap,
tap, tap it out. Easy.  I have done this more than once.  Takes about 5
Minutes.  Good luck.

Jeff 

85 442
70 4spd conv.






>I can spin the d&^%%** thing in the hole with a bolt extractor but I can't
>lever the **&^&*^%  thing out.   I know this must have happened to someone
>else, so what did you do to get it out?
>Please don't tell me you pulled the oil pan off.
>
>What is holding it in?  Isn't there a small flare at the end that kind of
>press fits into the hole?
>
>*((*&^)*&^)&)^%$%$&%#&$
>
>any suggestions are appreciated
>
>patrickd@wwnet.com
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:26:37 -0500
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: Re: carb

Do you mean a 7040257

Robert Schinkel   docbob@caninet.com
Niagara Falls,    Canada   905-357-4454




- ----------
> From: GHeath4138@aol.com
> To: Oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: carb
> Date: Saturday, February 20, 1999 7:56 PM
> 
> Anyone got oringal # 's carb to a 1970 442 455 V8 365 with AT.
> 
> Grover & Alice
> 1970 442

------------------------------

Date: 20 Feb 99 20:19:03 MST
From: RSTOMN <restoman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [Re: Resto $$]

oldsmobile-mml-owner@chebucto.ns.ca wrote:
Thanks Karl, and if anyone else can help in the search for good shots of a 71
455 compartment, I'd sure appreciate it.

Scott
71 442 Conv.

......................................................
71-only??

RESTOMAN

____________________________________________________________________
More than just email--Get your FREE Netscape WebMail account today at 
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:53:25 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: 83-455 - Headers???, Hood...  etc.

As I stated in my original complete post. The Flow Tech headers I have will
not fit a BB with a starter in place. I tried on the 455 sitting in the shop
before placing them on the 307 in my 86 G. I can't comment on other
brands/models of headers on the market. Just the set I have. I'm glad you
have had good luck, Wish I had with these. But I will take any info on the
Hookers for the g BB swap. Got a model # ? Thanks,  Gary.....

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Sx455@aol.com [mailto:Sx455@aol.com]
> Sent: Saturday, February 20, 1999 10:42 PM
> To: gjcouse@francomm.com
> Cc: olds_gbody@listbot.com
> Subject: Re: 83-455 - Headers???, Hood... etc.
>
>
> Oldsmobile G-Body Mailing List - http://cyberglyphs.com/gbody/
>
> In a message dated 2/20/99 4:46:19 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> gjcouse@francomm.com writes:
>
> << No way SB headers will fit a BB application. >>    come on
> ,man!!  don't
> outright tell me something CANT be done! especially something ive
> done several
> times myself and seen done on MANY other gbodys!!  i dont know about your
> flowtechs ,but for years the 260-403 headers were the only thing
> available for
> this engine swap!! ive used cyclones,hookers,and blackjacks and i
> even used a
> set of diesel headers ,yes diesel headers,that i aquired from
> danny lattimore
> .and the application was 78-87 cutlass 260-403!  i will admit changing
> starters required removing the drivers side header ,but sometimes
> you gotta
> sacrifice!!  hooker now makes a header specifically for the 455 to gbody
> swap,but its only been around for a couple years. so, YES  the
> 260-403 headers
> do fit period . also as always im not trying to offend , i know
> e-mail is an
> expressionless media and sometimes things come across different
> than meant!
> rick
>
>
> ______________________________________________________________________
> To unsubscribe, write to olds_gbody-unsubscribe@listbot.com
> Start Your Own FREE Email List at http://www.listbot.com/
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:12:45 -0600
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: accel air filter

Gary,
Though this was a response to the g body list it somehow ended
up here on the main list so I'll respond.  Your reasoning is sound
but there are a few flaws I see.  There is another dimension to
the comparison of the paper to the K&N and that is medium
thickness.  While the paper filters down to 8 microns in the thickness
of the paper the K&N uses a cotton gauze medium which is
considerably thicker.  This allows the air to be filtered gradually
instead of all at once.  To put it another way, the paper element
has a series of fibers that the air flows past to filter it down to the
8 microns.  This is done in a shorter distance than the K&N which
has a looser fiber makeup which gives less of a restriction to
airflow.  The better filtering comes from the thickness.  This also
has an effect on the HP increase from richening up the mixture.

A richer mix will not give more power unless the mix was lean to
begin with.  The power comes from the ability of the engine to
flow more air.  With FI it is common to see the mix lean out for
up to 50 miles before the computer recognizes the increased
airflow and richens up the mixture to optimal.  Of course I'm not
a physics professor so I could always be "off" in my thinking
too.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

>Ok, Let's do this. Let's see, Hummm, I would say it all boils down to
>physics, Two bodies of mass can't fit in a singular space. This is true
>whether solid, liquid, or gas. Look at it this way. Take a stock paper air
>filter and say a K&N. The stock paper filters particulate matter to say 8
>microns in size and a K&N filters down to say a 5 micron size impurity. The
>sheer fact of a filter is to pass a given gas or liquid through a porous
>filter medium. In this case paper. That means that the two filtering agents
>have varying size pores that allow the produce being filtered, in this case
>air, and catch impurities that are larger that the smallest pore in the
>filter medium. If K&N filters impurities 3 microns smaller that a stock
>filter element, that the given K&N pores are 3 microns smaller than the
>stock filter paper. So you can also say that the stock filter element is
>less restrictive than the K&N unit.
>
>A larger total flow of air will pass the larger pores of the stack filter
>verses the K&N filter. This air flow restriction thus increases intact
tract
>vacuum. As the vacuum rises due to restriction, that restriction caused
>vacuum increase causes the carb to meter slightly more fuel. This slightly
>increases the air/fuel ratio. More flue, more available horse power.
>
>Now, manufactures "tune" their engines fuel delivery to the stock air
filter
>installed. Remove the filter and Horse Power drops as more air can easily
>enter the intake track. This lowers the air/fuel ratio causing less Horse
>Power available. Now place the more restrictive K&N and you increase the
>air/fuel ratio verses the stock filter due to the restriction of the
smaller
>pore size. Horse Power goes up slightly.
>
>:^P whew, Hope you all enjoyed this trip into physics 101.
>
>-----Regards,
>
>Gary J. Couse

------------------------------

Date: 20 Feb 99 20:23:09 PST
From: Jon Hart <hartjon@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [TH-200R4- price/where to buy/etc...]

oldsmobile-mml-owner@chebucto.ns.ca wrote:
I'm looking into replacing my TH-350 with a TH-200R4 into my '71 cutlass
with a 350.  What will a good tranny cost?  Where's a place to get one?
*************************************************************************

Greg,

Check with local remanufacturers like Jasper etc. GM no longer offers a reman
200-4r. I am in the process of looking for one to replace the tired 200-4r in
my 83 98. Jasper has a good warranty as I tow and have 3.73 gears. Retail
price at Jasper is $1269.00. I also thought of replacing the 200-4r with a THM
350 but with the final drive gearing I have installed I would not get any
mileage when under normal cruise.

Jon Hart






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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:26:50 PST
From: "Chris Rivier" <crivier@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: Paint Prep (Igor)

Brian Ammons wrote:
But this is a Texas car...there isn't ANY rust ANYWHERE ...
=======================================================

Hi Brian,

I'll second that motion.  As long as you don't live along the coast rust 
is not a problem.

just my $.02,

Chris Rivier
Austin,TX
'66 Delta 88...The BEAST
Sorry, wreck pics are big
http://www2.bladeti.com/cars/
'88 Festiva...ZIPPY 166K LAWN ORNAMENT!


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------------------------------

Date: 20 Feb 99 21:43:33 MST
From: RSTOMN <restoman@netscape.net>
Subject: Re: [Re: broken dipstick help]

oldsmobile-mml-owner@chebucto.ns.ca wrote:
At 06:40 PM 2/20/1999 -0600, patrick derkacz wrote:
>Well,  I got my headers from summit, in one day(very cool).  Went to put em
>in.  Realized the dipstick tube had to come out to put the drivers side
>header in and the &^%$%&** thing broke right at the base.
>
Screw in a metal screw big enough to take a bite on the left over tube.
Crawl under the with a hammer and a flat bladed screw driver and tap, tap,
tap, tap it out. Easy.  I have done this more than once.  Takes about 5
Minutes.  Good luck.

Jeff 

85 442
70 4spd conv.






>I can spin the d&^%%** thing in the hole with a bolt extractor but I can't
>lever the **&^&*^%  thing out.   I know this must have happened to someone
>else, so what did you do to get it out?
>Please don't tell me you pulled the oil pan off.
>
>What is holding it in?  Isn't there a small flare at the end that kind of
>press fits into the hole?
>
>*((*&^)*&^)&)^%$%$&%#&$
>
>any suggestions are appreciated

>
>patrickd@wwnet.com
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Patrick,
Try this it worked for me.I shoved it down the hole
into the pan and found it stuck to my magnetic drain
plug at the next oil change.(The following day) 




RESTOMAN

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More than just email--Get your FREE Netscape WebMail account today at 
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------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 23:56:32 EST
From: Dshack4@aol.com
Subject: Re: Rechroming bumpers...need suggestions!

Scott,

I would rather pay the big bucks and get the job done right the first time.
If your bumpers are in solid condition, then just get them rechromed.  What
442 catalogs do you have, and how do I go about ordering them???

David

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 21:04:53 -0800 (PST)
From: John Pajak <jspajak@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Roll Call

Well here goes:

John Pajak
37 yrs old
Desktop Analyst, Information Spectrum, Inc
ADP Support for the United States Navy Test Pilot School at the Naval
Air Station, Patuxent River, Maryland

- -Die-Hard Oldsmobile fan ever since 1979 when I bought my first Olds,
a '69 Cutlass S. 
- -Self taught mechanic.
- -Married almost 10 yrs, 2 sons ages 6 and 9.
- -21 vehicles, mostly Olds.

Oldses:
1965 Delta 88 2dr ht  425 2V/TH400 (White)
1966 Toronado  425 4V/TH425   (Brown)
1969 Cutlass S 2dr ht  350 4V/TH350 (primer)
1970 442 W30 Convertible  455 4V/M21 (Matador Red/White)
1970 Cutlass S W31  350 4V/TH350 (Sherwood green/Black)
1970 Cutlass S 2dr ht  350 2V/TH350 (Aspen Green)
1970 Cutlass S 2dr Post  350 2V/TH350 (Burgundy Mist)
1971 Cutlass Supreme 2dr ht  350 4V/TH350 (White)
1972 442 W30 Convertible  455 4V/TH400 (Saturn Gold/White)
1972 Delta 88 Royale Convertible  455 4V/TH400 (Matador Red)
1972 Cutlass Supreme Convertible  350 4V/TH350 (#26 Blue)
1986 Cutlass Supreme 2dr ht  307 4V/TH350 (White)
1987 442 2dr ht  307 4V/2004R (Gray/Silver)
4 Cutlass parts cars







==
"2 + 2 = 5 for sufficiently large values of 2"

John Pajak
Lexington Park, Maryland

Check out our cars, trucks and a whole lot more at
http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak
_________________________________________________________
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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:20:09 EST
From: Dshack4@aol.com
Subject: Restoration experts, help needed

To all you olds experts:

In your opinion, when restoring a vehicle (either a frame up resto, or just a
plain resto) what should be the order of restoration, to avoid damaging new or
restored parts.

I figured this order:

1. interior
2. frame and outer body panels
3. engine (out of car)
4. engine bay, trunk, etc..
5. exterior paint
6. body emblems/chrome
7. engine back in vehicle

Any other recommendations or personal experiences would be greatly
appreciated!!

David

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:22:15 EST
From: Dshack4@aol.com
Subject: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

What are your rec's on good restoration manuals, books, and literature, and
how can I get a hold of them.  The only thing I have now is the Year One parts
catalog.

Thanks for reading, 
David

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:25:02 EST
From: CutlassSX@aol.com
Subject: Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

Have u been to <A HREF="www.442.com">442.com</A>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 23:28:39 -0800
From: T Dzieciatkowski <dziec@megsinet.net>
Subject: Re: 307's in 442's

- -----Original Message-----
From: Dave Cullen <david.cullen@snet.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Thursday, February 18, 1999 7:11 PM
Subject: Re: 307's in 442's


>My question originally related to 1985 - the crossover year - 442's . Mike
>R? You have 2 of them? What heads please?
>
>drc


hello my name is tim dzieciatkowski
I have had two 442 w 307 , an 86 and an 87, and both were 7a heads I have
seen these cars with 5a heads as well in 86's dziec@megsinet.net   later
rocketeer

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 01:01:01 -0500
From: "Mike Rothe." <hurstolds@xtalwind.net>
Subject: Re: 307's in 442's

> >My question originally related to 1985 - the crossover year - 442's . Mike
> >R? You have 2 of them? What heads please?

Both have 5A heads.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 01:27:14 EST
From: DYeager535@aol.com
Subject: Re: CCC Feedback Quadrajet -- fast idle & air cleaner question.

In a message dated 2/20/99 4:18:14 PM Pacific Standard Time,
oldsluvr@bellatlantic.net writes:

<< 1) Should'nt *ALL* QJets(reg flavor and feedback) have the same # of
 screws securing the top section(airhorn ?) of the carb down ?>>

	Negative..according to the Roe book, I believe it's 9 for pre CCC, and 
13 for
CCC carbs. Can verify IF necessary : )
 
 <<Ever look down your carb when the choke is wide open and you can see the
 heads of 2 screws ?
 
 Well..... problem is I *DONT* !
 
 According to the Haynes Rochester Carb Manual, there is no mention of
 any differences in the # of screws between models.
 
 My 84 Calais is no longer slurping thru a feedback QJet(actually it has
 none of the CCC junk), and I can't find the remains of it at the moment
 to look at and see if it has the screws or not.
 
 2) After removing the air filter, there is another sort of filter(very
 similar in design to the air filter) which sits inside/within the
 circumfrence of the regular filter(kind of like an inner layer of a
 cinnamon roll ?....sorry foods on the mind....the delicous aroma of our
 dinner cooking is filling the room up here ;), and is, or has been
 permanently attached by some sort of adhesive to the base of the air
 cleaner assembly.
 
 What is this extra filter for ? >>

       My truck has this also...I think I heard someone say spark
arrester..sounds good to me. My '83 K5 has this, but also the 5.5" tall air
filter, so I'm not concerned with losing airflow from that thing. I didn't
bother removing it. A little engine cleaner on them sure works great to shine
it up though! 
													
Dorian

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 01:50:24 EST
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: broken dipstick help

In a message dated 2/20/99 7:03:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
patrickd@wwnet.com writes:

<< Well,  I got my headers from summit, in one day(very cool).  Went to put em
 in.  Realized the dipstick tube had to come out to put the drivers side
 header in and the &^%$%&** thing broke right at the base.
 
 I can spin the d&^%%** thing in the hole with a bolt extractor but I can't
 lever the **&^&*^%  thing out.   I know this must have happened to someone
 else, so what did you do to get it out?
 Please don't tell me you pulled the oil pan off.
 
 What is holding it in?  Isn't there a small flare at the end that kind of
 press fits into the hole?
  >>
BEEN THERE DONE THAT!!!!!!!!  that is EXACTLY what happened to me!  after
rebuilding my engine, putting a good $1600 into it and getting 20,000 miles on
it, i decided to do the header thing.  mondello suggested RED loctite on the
dipstick tube during the rebuild, so i used it.  boy, is that stuff strong!!!
broke it off at the block.  here is what i did.  i got a long rod of some
sort, (cant remember what it was right now) and hammered the remains of the
dipstick into the oil pan.  what did i do then?  well, i put another dipstick
tube in the engine and left the 3" section of tube in the pan.  after 50,000
miles, everything is a-ok.  try some threaded rod, or something like that to
hammer it down into the oil pan.  i used some different punches, screwdrivers,
old dipstick tubes, and who knows what else to get it done.  its a pain, and
youll think your not going to get done, but just keep hittin'!  good luck, im
with ya all the way on this one!
jeremy
BIGJERMES@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:06:04 -0500
From: J Chermack/C&M Classic Parts <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Restoration experts, help needed

David

        Here's the order I go in.

1.) Photograph the entire car (especially any area that will be a pain to put
back together without reference.
2.) Dis-assemble marking every piece especially nuts and bolts.
3.) Any major body work to be done (with car on frame).
4.) Bull the body
5.) Pull entire drive-train (rebuild all needed pieces while car is apart)
6.) Start blasting and reassemble of the chassis. (get it rolling again)
7.) Restore undercarriage of body
8.) Place body back on frame (exhaust can be on already)
9.) Paint all panels separately (masking car to floor for seal from creep),
then install body panels (carefully, installing any chrome that will be
impossible to get to with them on the car)
10.) Wire entire car (must be done prior to install of interior)
11.) Install interior
12.) Install gas tank and other perpetual
13.) Finish with all rubber seals and final chrome install 

* Remember to take videos or photos to document the restoration along the way.

Jim Chermack
C&M Classic Parts
66 442 W-30
66 442 Race Car

At 12:20 AM 2/21/99 , you wrote:
>To all you olds experts:
>
>In your opinion, when restoring a vehicle (either a frame up resto, or just a
>plain resto) what should be the order of restoration, to avoid damaging new or
>restored parts.
>
>I figured this order:
>
>1. interior
>2. frame and outer body panels
>3. engine (out of car)
>4. engine bay, trunk, etc..
>5. exterior paint
>6. body emblems/chrome
>7. engine back in vehicle
>
>Any other recommendations or personal experiences would be greatly
>appreciated!!
>
>David

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:08:54 EST
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: accel air filter

In a message dated 2/20/99 8:25:37 PM Eastern Standard Time,
gjcouse@francomm.com writes:

<< Now, manufactures "tune" their engines fuel delivery to the stock air
filter
 installed. Remove the filter and Horse Power drops as more air can easily
 enter the intake track. This lowers the air/fuel ratio causing less Horse
 Power available. Now place the more restrictive K&N and you increase the
 air/fuel ratio verses the stock filter due to the restriction of the smaller
 pore size. Horse Power goes up slightly.
 >>
well, that could be a possibility with some filters, but the K&N filter doesnt
filter as good as a paper type filter.  more like the paper filtering
particles 5 microns or bigger and the K&N filtering particles 8 microns or
bigger in size. Proof in point is, the K&N flows more air than a paper
element.  i think what you were reading about the K&N making more power than
no air cleaner at all was their "filtercharger".  this is the complete air
cleaner assembly and the baseplate is contoured to enhance air flow around the
base of the carb as well as going down into the carb. it supposedly
straightens the incoming air before it goes into the carb.  straighter than it
would be if there was no "filtercharger" there at all.  supposedly, getting
rid of the turbulence at the entrance of the carb allows more air to enter.
more air, more power....  blah blah blah...   there's my qwoter, i guess.  :-)
jeremy
BIGJERMES@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:10:21 -0500
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

In my opinion a chassis manual and service manual is a must. Then I'd get an
assembly manual, Olds 4-4-2 & W-Machine Resto guide and/or Catalog of Olds
442, w-machines and H/O Parts id guide. As soon as Greg Rollin (SuperCars
Unlimited) has the new 442 By The Numbers out I'll be ordering that too.

If you want the Olds 442/W-Mach Resto Guide give Roger Utter a buzz
 GraphixRUs@aol.com) the money goes towards the Jason Doby project.

Drop me a line if you or anyone else out there wants a '71 Chassis manual
and '71 new products guide.

As far as what order to do things.........I'd do the mechanicals/frame
first, then body/paint and finally interior.

Randy


>What are your rec's on good restoration manuals, books, and literature, and
>how can I get a hold of them.  The only thing I have now is the Year One
parts
>catalog.
>
>Thanks for reading,
>David

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:24:39 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

RANDY A GEISEL wrote:
> 
> In my opinion a chassis manual and service manual is a must. Then I'd get an
> assembly manual, Olds 4-4-2 & W-Machine Resto guide and/or Catalog of Olds
> 442, w-machines and H/O Parts id guide. As soon as Greg Rollin (SuperCars
> Unlimited) has the new 442 By The Numbers out I'll be ordering that too.
> 
> If you want the Olds 442/W-Mach Resto Guide give Roger Utter a buzz
>  GraphixRUs@aol.com) the money goes towards the Jason Doby project.
> 
> Drop me a line if you or anyone else out there wants a '71 Chassis manual
> and '71 new products guide.
> 
> As far as what order to do things.........I'd do the mechanicals/frame
> first, then body/paint and finally interior.

Looks like I'm not the only one up late tonight.  I just downloaded
Netscape 4.5 AGAIN of the net and had to cancel the install temporarily.
Now I can't figure out how to get back to the install part again.  Guess
that will be a later project now as I have several people coming in
tomorrow for tax interviews.  Have you talked to Ashley Jones? He was
supposed to call me and let me know what is going on but I haven't heard
from him.  That doesn't sound good, but I think I'll call him Sunday
afternoon and be sure the other guy took the roof.  Sure hope not,
because it is a major piece I need to think about working on the 72. 
Later......

Don

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:33:16 -0500
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

Hello fellow nightowl!

I tried Ashley the other night, but he wasn't in. I haven't gotten around to
calling back. I spoke to Jack (jbhl on the list), he just bought a '72 H/O
sunroof for $1,500 (so he said). It was listed at 442.com for $2,500. He
talked to Ashley and he said Ashley mentioned selling a whole roof to a guy
recently. Does look good for you, I'm afraid.

Aren't pc's fun..........I spent most of today trying to install an IDE
PCMCIA card si I can use the digital camera I bought off of ebay. Damn
computer won't recognize it's there. I guess I'll be calling tech support
later today.

I found a guy in Florida with 4 NOS H/O emblems..............I bought 3. He
wants $50.00 apiece. I won't be sending payment until Monday. If you want
the last one let me know and I'll get it for you.  Repros are going for
$40.00 each, but there is supposed to be a flaw in them. Something about the
leg on the "H" is deformed or squished, something like that.

Good luck with netscape (personally, I don't like it.........I went back to
exploder 4.0) and I'll talk to you soon,

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:35:53 -0500
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: where can I find books, guides, manuals for 442's

Sorry guys.........looks like Don and I both screwed up. Should have gone
privately.

Well now that you all know..............anyone need an NOS H/O emblem?

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:47:17 -0600
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: 455 Break-In

Did my engine break in today. Had 10W-30 motor oil in it. Here is my
question and I was wondering if this is normal:

455 motor with 7 quart pan.
Motor started right up. 
Primed the motor before starting with tool. 
Had 10W-30 Castrol in the motor.
At around 1700-1800 RPM the motor had about 75-80 pounds of pressure for at
least 10 minutes.
Temperature was around 180* during the first 10 minutes.
I had no fan shround or lower radiator shroud.
Temperature rose to around 205*-210* during last 10 minutes.
Oil temperture dropped to the area of around 45 pounds at 1700-1800RPM
During last 5 minutes temperature rose to around 215*+
Before the motor was shut off the engine was brought back to idle at around
1000RPM
I noticed the oil pressure at idle to be 15 pounds at that time.

I was told by my friend that this is normal because:  the engine
temperature being hot, the motor running for 20 minutes at 1800RPM while
not moving, the 10W-30 oil breaking down due to the motor breaking in, the
temperture of the motor oil thinning out the oil. That these factors all
contributed to the oil pressure drop over the time period.

Would this be correct??
Anyone had a similar situation??


Pettrix@prodigy.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 12:37:58 +0100
From: "Bert Enjoem" <rocket.455@worldonline.nl>
Subject: unsubscribe oldsmobile

unsubsribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 05:27:20 -0800 (PST)
From: terry moore <tc_moore@yahoo.com>
Subject: re gauges 86 salon-list

I have an 86 salon,the problem is when it's cold,the gas and volt
gauges don't work untill it heats up inside the car or I whack the
dash in the right spot.  
The problem I think may be the printed circut board.    Has anyone had
this problem and solved it.



_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 08:37:29 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: 455 Break-In

So long as the main and rod bearings were setup with correct tolerance, I
would think, yes that sounds about right.   Gary.....

- -----Regards,

Gary J. Couse
Couse Custom's
Route-1, Box-615
Purling, NY 12470

ICQ# 5209322
gjcouse@francomm.com
gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com

Custom Conversion Prototype:
CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Peter Landowski
> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 1999 3:47 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: 455 Break-In
>
>
> Did my engine break in today. Had 10W-30 motor oil in it. Here is my
> question and I was wondering if this is normal:
>
> 455 motor with 7 quart pan.
> Motor started right up.
> Primed the motor before starting with tool.
> Had 10W-30 Castrol in the motor.
> At around 1700-1800 RPM the motor had about 75-80 pounds of
> pressure for at
> least 10 minutes.
> Temperature was around 180* during the first 10 minutes.
> I had no fan shround or lower radiator shroud.
> Temperature rose to around 205*-210* during last 10 minutes.
> Oil temperture dropped to the area of around 45 pounds at 1700-1800RPM
> During last 5 minutes temperature rose to around 215*+
> Before the motor was shut off the engine was brought back to idle
> at around
> 1000RPM
> I noticed the oil pressure at idle to be 15 pounds at that time.
>
> I was told by my friend that this is normal because:  the engine
> temperature being hot, the motor running for 20 minutes at 1800RPM while
> not moving, the 10W-30 oil breaking down due to the motor breaking in, the
> temperture of the motor oil thinning out the oil. That these factors all
> contributed to the oil pressure drop over the time period.
>
> Would this be correct??
> Anyone had a similar situation??
>
>
> Pettrix@prodigy.net
>

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 08:40:13 -0500
From: Rebel1 <rebel1@raex.com>
Subject: Re: My Cutlass has a problem

Hey guys, this may be a long shot but it happened to me.  Did your cars
originally have AC that has eliminated?  If your alternator is on the
driver's side with nothing on the passanger side (where the AC pump used
to be) it can cause problems with there not being a big enough contact
patch on the water pump pulley to keep the belt from slipping.  I had this
problem on a 350 that had the compressor freeze up - I had cut the belt,
and all the sudden I had problems with belt squeal.  It didn't seem to
matter how tight I made them!  Just a thought!
Todd
All the toys put away for the winter...


Rock Man wrote:

> ---Thomas Jacquillard <tjacquillard@InfoAve.Net> wrote:
> > I also have a flex fan and when I step on it I get a squeal also. I
> have
> > done everything I could think of but I never thought of the fan
> causing
> > this. How could it? I am running a 68 455 in a 68 cutlass Supreme.
> > LMK, T.J.
> ===============================
> Not sure why this happens. The only logical explanation I could think
> of is that the fan is trying to suck in too much air which causes a
> lot of load and the belts just can't keep up. I never had a problem
> with this before I had the flex fan and I have never found anyone else
> with the same problem until now. If you find a way to fix it, please
> let me know!!!! I was down to thinking about changing all the pulleys?
> I dunno!
> ==
> Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
> rockman20@yahoo.com
> 1986 Honda Accord DX
> 1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
> 1981 John Deer Snowmobile
> 197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
> 1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
> _________________________________________________________
> DO YOU YAHOO!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 08:51:13 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: My Cutlass has a problem

The pulleys were probably badly glazed with the initial A/C lockup and
squeal. I'd sandpaper the pulleys to rid the glaze and ever so lightly
roughen the pulley to belt surface.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Rebel1
> Sent: Sunday, February 21, 1999 8:40 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: My Cutlass has a problem
>
>
> Hey guys, this may be a long shot but it happened to me.  Did your cars
> originally have AC that has eliminated?  If your alternator is on the
> driver's side with nothing on the passanger side (where the AC pump used
> to be) it can cause problems with there not being a big enough contact
> patch on the water pump pulley to keep the belt from slipping.  I had this
> problem on a 350 that had the compressor freeze up - I had cut the belt,
> and all the sudden I had problems with belt squeal.  It didn't seem to
> matter how tight I made them!  Just a thought!
> Todd
> All the toys put away for the winter...
>
>
> Rock Man wrote:
>
> > ---Thomas Jacquillard <tjacquillard@InfoAve.Net> wrote:
> > > I also have a flex fan and when I step on it I get a squeal also. I
> > have
> > > done everything I could think of but I never thought of the fan
> > causing
> > > this. How could it? I am running a 68 455 in a 68 cutlass Supreme.
> > > LMK, T.J.
> > ===============================
> > Not sure why this happens. The only logical explanation I could think
> > of is that the fan is trying to suck in too much air which causes a
> > lot of load and the belts just can't keep up. I never had a problem
> > with this before I had the flex fan and I have never found anyone else
> > with the same problem until now. If you find a way to fix it, please
> > let me know!!!! I was down to thinking about changing all the pulleys?
> > I dunno!
> > ==
> > Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
> > rockman20@yahoo.com
> > 1986 Honda Accord DX
> > 1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
> > 1981 John Deer Snowmobile
> > 197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
> > 1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
> > _________________________________________________________
> > DO YOU YAHOO!?
> > Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 17:15:32 -0600
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@cwix.com>
Subject: Re: broken dipstick help

slide hammer and a big sheet metal screw screw it in assemble the slide
hammer tap tap tap its out good luck....KK
- -----Original Message-----
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com <BIGJERMES@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Sunday, February 21, 1999 2:51 AM
Subject: Re: broken dipstick help


>In a message dated 2/20/99 7:03:04 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>patrickd@wwnet.com writes:
>
><< Well,  I got my headers from summit, in one day(very cool).  Went to put
em
> in.  Realized the dipstick tube had to come out to put the drivers side
> header in and the &^%$%&** thing broke right at the base.
>
> I can spin the d&^%%** thing in the hole with a bolt extractor but I can't
> lever the **&^&*^%  thing out.   I know this must have happened to someone
> else, so what did you do to get it out?
> Please don't tell me you pulled the oil pan off.
>
> What is holding it in?  Isn't there a small flare at the end that kind of
> press fits into the hole?
>  >>
>BEEN THERE DONE THAT!!!!!!!!  that is EXACTLY what happened to me!  after
>rebuilding my engine, putting a good $1600 into it and getting 20,000 miles
on
>it, i decided to do the header thing.  mondello suggested RED loctite on
the
>dipstick tube during the rebuild, so i used it.  boy, is that stuff
strong!!!
>broke it off at the block.  here is what i did.  i got a long rod of some
>sort, (cant remember what it was right now) and hammered the remains of the
>dipstick into the oil pan.  what did i do then?  well, i put another
dipstick
>tube in the engine and left the 3" section of tube in the pan.  after
50,000
>miles, everything is a-ok.  try some threaded rod, or something like that
to
>hammer it down into the oil pan.  i used some different punches,
screwdrivers,
>old dipstick tubes, and who knows what else to get it done.  its a pain,
and
>youll think your not going to get done, but just keep hittin'!  good luck,
im
>with ya all the way on this one!
>jeremy
>BIGJERMES@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:11:24 EST
From: GT5726@aol.com
Subject: Re: Restoration experts, help needed

In a message dated 2/20/99 11:21:24 PM Central Standard Time, Dshack4@AOL.com
writes:

<< To all you olds experts:
 
 In your opinion, when restoring a vehicle (either a frame up resto, or just a
 plain resto) what should be the order of restoration, to avoid damaging new
or
 restored parts.
 
 I figured this order:
 
 1. interior
 2. frame and outer body panels
 3. engine (out of car)
 4. engine bay, trunk, etc..
 5. exterior paint
 6. body emblems/chrome
 7. engine back in vehicle
 
 Any other recommendations or personal experiences would be greatly
 appreciated!!
 
 David
  >>


I always :

1. strip the car to it's shell
2. complete all body work
3. paint car (color changes are easier with nothing in the way)
4. complete mechanicals (engine, trans, etc.)
5. install trim (chrome, moldings, scoops, etc.)
6. interior ( last so you do not have to remove glass to do the headliner,
door panels to do chrome trim, rear side panels to install 442 side scoops
((65'sonly)) etc.)
7. Glass and weatherstripping

My order makes sense to me as it eliminates a ~wholelotta~ paint overspray
cleanup and unnecassary interior panel R&R, possibly damaging new (exspensive)
door panels. It is also easier to facilitate mechanical and electrical repairs
with the interior removed ...just in case cables or wires need to be run under
carpet.

Collyn Eastham
65 442
65 Cutlass

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:15:07 EST
From: GT5726@aol.com
Subject: Re: Restoration experts, help needed

In a message dated 2/21/99 1:03:56 AM Central Standard Time, chermac@exis.net
writes:

<< 1.) Photograph the entire car (especially any area that will be a pain to
put
 back together without reference.
 2.) Dis-assemble marking every piece especially nuts and bolts.
 3.) Any major body work to be done (with car on frame).
 4.) Bull the body
 5.) Pull entire drive-train (rebuild all needed pieces while car is apart)
 6.) Start blasting and reassemble of the chassis. (get it rolling again)
 7.) Restore undercarriage of body
 8.) Place body back on frame (exhaust can be on already)
 9.) Paint all panels separately (masking car to floor for seal from creep),
 then install body panels (carefully, installing any chrome that will be
 impossible to get to with them on the car)
 10.) Wire entire car (must be done prior to install of interior)
 11.) Install interior
 12.) Install gas tank and other perpetual
 13.) Finish with all rubber seals and final chrome install 
 
 * Remember to take videos or photos to document the restoration along the
way.
  >>
  Jim has an excellent idea..I use a polaroid for doing mechanical work on
newer cars...its hard to remember where all the S**T goes sometimes...haha

Collyn Eastham
65 442
65 Cutlass

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 10:37:53 -0500
From: "RC Hellebuyck" <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: new 71 owner

>I recently inherited a 71 olds cutlass from my grandmother......She bought
the car brand new and I found the original papers in the glove box including
the protecto plate and all service records.  The car is mocha
>brown with a white vinyl top........The car only has power steering and the
original am radio.>

<What I would like to do is turn it into a 442 but I am concerned about the
cost.......  I love the car and would like any info anyone has to offer of
advice.>
============================================================================
====

Well remember you asked....so since I'm an owner of an authentic 442 and a
nostalgia buff to boot, here's "my" opinion:

The first paragraph above is what you wrote about the car.  Just reading
this information alone makes the car special.  The color combination, lack
of options and original documentation make it unique.  Not to even mention
the fact that it has sentimental value to you since it was your Grandma's
car (who was the original owner).  No dought you have fond memories riding
in it as a child.

Having said this, I read the second paragraph and must question; If you
"love the car", why try to change it into something it's not?  If you can't
picture yourself driving this beauty (restored), without the constant
thought of "I wish it was a 442", then perhaps you only have sentimental
feelings and don't really find the car appealing.  As they say, "A rose by
any other name is just a rose".  Putting on emblems, stripes and dropping a
455 into an auto that wasn't outfitted to accommodate a big block, is just a
modified cutlass (or clone), it's still not an Olds 4-4-2.

There are allot of real 442's out there and sadly even more 442 clones.  The
cars that really turn heads are the unique/rare models.  Just go to any car
show and see for yourself how many performance cars their are compared to a
"stock" Cutlass or Cutlass S.

If you think money might be a problem, then it will be.  The cost of parts
are unreal, once you find them that is.  Secondly, TIME is a big factor, at
least for most of us.  However if you enjoy restoring cars you always seem
to find the time.  Although take your "schedule book" and toss it away!  It
will be finished when it's finished.  You take your time and do it right, or
hurry and use the "good enough" phrase it shows either way.

MY OPINION:  #1 restore that "plain Jane" car to what it was 28 years ago.
Believe me it will turn heads!  And as always you have the option of
changing the wheels on occasion just to spice it up once and a while.  Buy a
set of SS I or SS II's.  By switching between stock hub caps and one of the
rallye style wheels, the look of the car will totally change and is easily
converted back in 15 minutes!

It won't be worth the money it will cost to do a conversion.  Plus when you
go to sell it, your selling a "clone" which can be found anywhere.  A stock,
original car no matter how plain, with full documentation is what collectors
look for.  Why?  There's not allot of them around.  Why?  People modify them
and seem to have this mental fix that cars must be fast and red to be worth
anything.  Not true.  Some of the most collectible/rare cars are untouched,
stock autos.

#2 again if you can't picture yourself being happy driving a car without
"4-4-2" on the fender, then I suggest selling the car and buy yourself a
real 4-4-2 (or W-30).  Even if it's not totally restored, you will be money
ahead and have what you really what.  Plus the car will be mechanically
correct and safe.  All you have to worry about is fixing worn parts or
detailing.   Even though you won't own Grandma's car, you will be much
happier in the long run.

3# The bottom line is, do what you want it's your car.  Just consider all
options and what's involved either way you go.  You have some very
over-opinionated people on this list, and I am one of them!  8>)  Some of us
are "purist's" and think cars such as yours should be left stock.  Others
think we're idiots and say modifying doesn't really matter.  So again,
consider all sides and do what will make you the happiest.

#4 This is the ultimate option, have your cake and eat it too!.....Keep
Grandma's car stored,  get yourself a real 442 and then save enough money to
restore Grandma's Cutlass back to it's original beauty!

Good luck with your decision, keep us informed on the outcome!
Congratulations on your inheritance!

RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 convt.
mrhell@sprynet.com

*Olds list disclaimer:  Yes I am an "Olds purist".  Above is "my" opinion
and I stand by it right or wrong.  If any list member disagrees then that's
"your" opinion.  Ain't America wonderful?

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 11:38:36 -0400
From: rebel1@raex.com
Subject: Interesting item on eBay web site item#67341790: 1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 
HOOD!!!

I saw this on eBay - anyone looking?
Last I saw it was at $50 and had 12 hours to go...


Title of item:	1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 HOOD!!!
Seller:	spectromen@aol.com
Starts:	02/14/99 19:53:57 PST 
Ends:	02/21/99 19:53:57 PST 
Price:	Currently $50.00
To bid the item, go to:	
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=67341790


Item Description:		
	I know there's someone out there restoring their '68 4-4-2 and needs a 
hood...well guess what? I've got a spare for you.  Currently blue, but paint 
any color you want, it has no body damage, ready to drop in your car. Remember 
all you car junkies, the '68 4-4-2 hood is UNIQUE and different from that of 
the Cutlass! Now, the important stuff: You MUST be a local buyer, after all, a 
car's hood is BIG!  If you're not, I will take the item to the airport, but 
you are responsible for arranging all shipping and handling. Good luck and 
thanks in advance!
On 02/19/99 at 20:09:22 PDT, seller added the following information:
I wanted to make sure it was understood, but this hood does not include 
hinges; it is the hood ONLY :) Thanks!

	Visit eBay, the world's largest Personal Trading Community at 
http://www.ebay.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:38:50 -0500
From: Jeff Mullenix <muxx@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Restoration experts, help needed

At 12:20 AM 2/21/1999 EST, Dshack4@aol.com wrote:
>To all you olds experts:
>
>In your opinion, when restoring a vehicle (either a frame up resto, or just a
>plain resto) what should be the order of restoration, to avoid damaging
new or
>restored parts.
>
>I figured this order:
>
>1. interior
>2. frame and outer body panels
>3. engine (out of car)
>4. engine bay, trunk, etc..
>5. exterior paint
>6. body emblems/chrome
>7. engine back in vehicle
>
>Any other recommendations or personal experiences would be greatly
>appreciated!!
>
>David
>
>
I am doing the following to my 70 conv.,
Full resto;

1.  disassembled the car completely, leaving only the body and frame.

2.  all body work and primed leaving off doors and fenders

3.  Lift body off chassis

4.  Sent chassis out to sand blast

5.  reassemble chassis

6.  paint bottom of car the color the car will be

7.  add engine and all accesories that are attached to chassis only.

8.  Add body back to chassis and send to paint shop,  (one that has a down
draft system so there will be little to no overspray).

9.  Add all body parts back to car 

10.  then do interior

Done.

I am still not completely finished.  It takes awhile.  Goodluck.
My .02

Jeff

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 11:44:18 -0400
From: rebel1@raex.com
Subject: Interesting item on eBay web site item#67388848: Rare Factory Chrome 
Aircleaner for Oldsmobile

I saw this on eBay - any '66 442 4-speed owners out there?  According to the 
description
this air cleaner was only available on the the '66's...

Title of item:	Rare Factory Chrome Aircleaner for Oldsmobile
Seller:	adegroot@ptdprolog.net
Starts:	02/14/99 21:53:54 PST 
Ends:	02/21/99 21:53:54 PST 
Price:	Currently $20.50
To bid the item, go to:	
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=67388848


Item Description:		
	This is an ORIGINAL Oldsmbile Chrome air cleaner
(actually from a 1966-67 Cutlass 430cid engine)
It has an aluminum decor piece with "Oldsmobile",
"Ultra-High Compression" and "Cutlass"(in script)
Lettering in red on a natural aluminum background
(This piece can probably be probably scanned
E-mail me and I'll try it and send you a .jpg of it
if it works). bottom of aircleaner is profiled to fit
a Holley dual-feed ("double-Pumper") carb, but will also fit on a Q-jet.
(includes an unused 4" tall filter element)
E-mail me for a more detailed description.

Personal checks must clear, Money Orders and other certified funds
shipped next buisness day.
Buyer pays actual shipping charges (E-mail with ZIP for shipping estimate)
will be shipped from 18071 (shipping weight about 6lbs)
Good luck and happy bidding(and help me clean out my garage!)

On 02/19/99 at 14:28:28 PDT, seller added the following information:

I have recieved information that this MAY not be an OEM piece
and that it's an early aftermarket performance air cleaner called a Low
Rider (hence, the low position over the carb.)  It was made for low
profile hood clearence, and also explains why it would fit on a Holly
double pumper.  It does have the OEM Olds aluminum decor ring and
attaching cone. I removed it from a Friends car, who recieved the 
car from his father, who in turn purchased the car (a 1967 442) 
new. He told me at the time that the air cleaner came on the car when he 
bought it.
So if it was not OEM then it was dealer installed(the car was I believe a demo
and also had other chrome in the engine compartment, but I didn't aquire those 
parts.
If this causes a problem to any bidders please contact me via E-mail.




On 02/20/99 at 07:27:29 PDT, seller added the following information:
 Further information indicates that this IS an OEM piece,
and that it was ONLY available on '66 442's with 4sp's.
Whatever the case it is a nice 360degree open aircleaner
and I want it sold...

	Visit eBay, the world's largest Personal Trading Community at 
http://www.ebay.com

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Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:47:02 EST
From: OldsRokkit@aol.com
Subject: Nice 1977 Supreme in Iowa for only $1700

Found this on DealsOnWheels online:

1977 OLDS CUTLASS SUPREME. 350 V8, auto trans., air, PS, PB, new paint, 90,000
actual miles. $1,700. (515)448-3509. EAGLE GROVE, IA. 

There's also a picture at:
http://www.dealsonwheels.com/search/Detail.CFM?Autos__ID=13901

Looks to be in real nice shape.  Would make someone a good ride this summer.
I'd probably buy it myself if I were closer.


- -Drew in Windy Western Kansas-

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Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 10:55:50 -0500
From: "B. Vosburgh" <bob442@svic.net>
Subject: Re: Interesting item on eBay web site item#67341790: 1968 OLDSMOBILE 
442 HOOD!!!

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I have one in nice shape for 75.00 .live in north central florida. I do not 
want to ship, must be picked up.   butch      68  442  post

rebel1@raex.com wrote:

> I saw this on eBay - anyone looking?
> Last I saw it was at $50 and had 12 hours to go...
>
> Title of item:  1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 HOOD!!!
> Seller: spectromen@aol.com
> Starts: 02/14/99 19:53:57 PST
> Ends:   02/21/99 19:53:57 PST
> Price:  Currently $50.00
> To bid the item, go to: 
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=67341790
>
> Item Description:
>         I know there's someone out there restoring their '68 4-4-2 and needs 
a hood...well guess what? I've got a spare for you.  Currently blue, but paint 
any color you want, it has no body damage, ready to drop in your car. Remember 
all you car junkies, the '68 4-4-2 hood is UNIQUE and different from that of 
the Cutlass! Now, the important stuff: You MUST be a local buyer, after all, a 
car's hood is BIG!  If you're not, I will take the item to the airport, but 
you are responsible for arranging all shipping and handling. Good luck and 
thanks in advance!
> On 02/19/99 at 20:09:22 PDT, seller added the following information:
> I wanted to make sure it was understood, but this hood does not include 
hinges; it is the hood ONLY :) Thanks!
>
>         Visit eBay, the world's largest Personal Trading Community at 
http://www.ebay.com



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<HTML>
I have one in nice shape for 75.00 .live in north central florida. I do
not want to ship, must be picked up.&nbsp;&nbsp; 
butch&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
68&nbsp; 442&nbsp; post

<P>rebel1@raex.com wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE>I saw this on eBay - anyone looking?
<BR>Last I saw it was at $50 and had 12 hours to go...

<P>Title of item:&nbsp; 1968 OLDSMOBILE 442 HOOD!!!
<BR>Seller: spectromen@aol.com
<BR>Starts: 02/14/99 19:53:57 PST
<BR>Ends:&nbsp;&nbsp; 02/21/99 19:53:57 PST
<BR>Price:&nbsp; Currently $50.00
<BR>To bid the item, go to: <A HREF="
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=67341790
">http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;item=67341790</A>

<P>Item Description:
<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I know there's someone out
there restoring their '68 4-4-2 and needs a hood...well guess what? I've
got a spare for you.&nbsp; Currently blue, but paint any color you want,
it has no body damage, ready to drop in your car. Remember all you car
junkies, the '68 4-4-2 hood is UNIQUE and different from that of the Cutlass!
Now, the important stuff: You MUST be a local buyer, after all, a car's
hood is BIG!&nbsp; If you're not, I will take the item to the airport,
but you are responsible for arranging all shipping and handling. Good luck
and thanks in advance!
<BR>On 02/19/99 at 20:09:22 PDT, seller added the following information:
<BR>I wanted to make sure it was understood, but this hood does not include
hinges; it is the hood ONLY :) Thanks!

<P>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Visit eBay, the world's largest
Personal Trading Community at <A HREF="http://www.ebay.com
">http://www.ebay.com</A></BLOCKQUOTE>
&nbsp;</HTML>

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End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1795
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