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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1755


oldsmobile-digest      Friday, February 5 1999      Volume 01 : Number 1755



Electric Choke
Re: Subscribing commands
RE: Seats and windows
Re: '71 VC. No ignition key. No Problem.
Re: Smokin' SOM
Re: Inter State Emission testing?
Re: '71 VC. No ignition key. No Problem.
Re: No Number info
Re: What's Purple and Horny.....?
RE: Thanks for the Advice
Mime-Version: 1.0
Re: black oil
Re: Anyone in South Carolina?
RE: A.I.R. Manifold availability?
Re: P.A.W/mailorder
Re: SX question
403 2" valves (was Re: More 455 Head IDs)
Unsubscribe commands
Re: parts for sale
Re: Inter State Emission testing?
Fwd: Interesting item on eBay web site item#62841221: OLD 
TACH...OLDSMOBILE...HOOD OR DASH MOUNT
Re: New Hot Rod
Re: List Language (was Re: Black Oil)
75th anniversary olds decanter on e-bay.
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES
Re: Intake Manifold Install
Re: Restore or not (preferences)
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES
Re: Inter State Emission testing?
Re: this day in history
RE: for SX information (was Re: SX question)
Re: Intake Manifold Install
Re: A.I.R. Manifold availability?
Re: 442 Stripes
Coupla Olds Sightings to Ponder
RE: HURST/OLDS PRICES
HURST OLDS
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES -Reply
Re: 403 2" valves (was Re: More 455 Head IDs)
RE: A.I.R. Manifold availability?
Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES
RE: Inter State Emission testing?
Re: Intake Manifold Install
Re: Intake Manifold Install
RE: Inter State Emission testing?
Re: Restore or not (preferences)
Re: Intake Manifold Install
Re: Restore or not (preferences)
Re: Restore or not (preferences)
Re: Headers Real Benefit
Re: P.A.W (performance automotive warehouse)
Stripes and weatherstrips.
Re: Stripes and weatherstrips.
Good Body Shops in WI
what makes oil black?
Re: HURST OLDS
Re: what makes oil black?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 18:11:11 -0800 (PST)
From: John Pajak <jspajak@yahoo.com>
Subject: Electric Choke

"James E. Brady III" <James.E.Brady.1@gsfc.nasa.gov> wrote:
<SNIP>
I had the hot air choke too and had to go with an electric choke. 
That worked out great since I wanted to do it anyway.  I utilized the
same housing just swapped in the electric choke cover and plug the hot
air hole.

**********
James,
     Which electric choke cover did you use? I assume it was for a
later GM application ...which did one?

Thanks

==
"2 + 2 = 5 for sufficiently large values of 2"

John Pajak
Lexington Park, Maryland

Check out our cars, trucks and a whole lot more at
http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 21:09:55 -0500
From: Brian Kerr <bkerr@golden.net>
Subject: Re: Subscribing commands

Brian Kerr wrote:

> I have misplaced the instructions for unsubscribing. I need to get my
> inbox under control, so I am going to switch to digest mode. Can some
> one please send me the instructions?
> Thanks
>
> Brian Kerr
> 69 Cutlass Conv

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 21:30:02 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: Seats and windows

Where in NY?

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Oldscutaw@aol.com
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 12:03 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Seats and windows
> 
> 
> The windows are not tinted, sorry. I live in NY sorry about that 
> too. I am not
> sure if i want to sell it though. I was looking in to a '72 
> Camaro. I am also
> looking to buy a manual tranny. I most likely wont sell it. It 
> kind'a grew on
> me.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 03:07:29 -0600
From: "Charles A. Dempsey" <cdemps@lsumc.edu>
Subject: Re: '71 VC. No ignition key. No Problem.

Hi Joe and list,

I now have a key to my Vista Cruiser.

It took about 20 minutes to pull the horn button, steering wheel, lock
plate and turn signal mechanism.

There was one vertical slot about 3/32 X 3/8 inch (occluded by flashing)
in the 12 o'clock position. Putting a screw driver in this did nothing.
On a hunch I probed for other openings and found one  at about the 2
o'clock position beneath one of the signal switch mounting posts.
Probing this hole I could feel a sort of lever which seemed to be
attached to the lock. When I pushed it in I was able to partially
withdraw the lock. Gentle prying with a screw driver caused the lock to
pop out. This procedure appears to have caused no damage to the steering
column or the lock.

With my lock cylinder in hand I went to my trusty lock smith who cut a
(genuine GM) key ($7.00) from the codes. The codes were correct and the
key worked.

I took the key and cylinder back to the VC and found that, while the
cylinder can be removed with difficulty in the "locked" position, it
practically falls out when the lever is depressed with it in the "run"
position. The shop manual is sort of correct in this regard. It's lots
easier to remove if you put the ignition in the run position.

Perhaps the previous owner's ignition key did not work on the doors, but
my new one cut from the ignition code does. It's more likely that she
simply assumed that a square key wouldn't work in the door locks. My new
key does not fit the glove box or tail gate. I'll get one of those cut
tomorrow from the codes on the glove box lock.

My 28 year old baby Vista Cruiser is back together and locked up tight
as a drum waiting for daddy to bring his trailer. I hope to get down
there and load her up early tomorrow morning.

Now all I need is a '71 OAI hood, some D heads, a W-30 intake and cam,
some flat top TRW pistons and.................Hey! Anybody got a set of
14" SS IIs you want to get rid of :-).

I'll put some pics up on the web ASAP.

Thanks Joe and everybody,
Charles

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 22:18:21 EST
From: DYeager535@aol.com
Subject: Re: Smokin' SOM

In a message dated 2/4/99 7:09:29 PM Pacific Standard Time,
mbloomer@mindspring.com writes:

<< On another note SOM is smoking.
 >Yes, "she" is a smokin' ride, but periodically white vapor billows out from
 >under the hood.
 >
 >Did not notice this until after it got colder out.
 >
 >Karl knows what it is.
 >It is from the power steering system.
 >
 Had this on my 68.  The "mysterious leak" was caused by  a
 pinhole in the high pressure hose spraying the exhaust manifold
 when the steering was a full lock.  At full lock you can hear the
 pump start to strain because the press spikes, and that was the
 only time it would leak.  Nice little stream shooting straight on the
 motor.  Have someone hold the steering wheel a full lock while
 your looking under the hood.  Suprising what you might see.
  >>

       On a related note...I have recently experienced heater hose (the kind
that comes in the big rolls, cut to length) that has pinholes in it every so
many inches. Obviously done in production. Of course also only leaks when the
radiator gets up to pressure, but surprisingly just oozes out, creating nice
little trails down the inner fender, but never enough to puddle. The holes
aren't big enough obviously to see unless you are looking for them, or they
start to leak, which is of course after you have taken the time to install
them : ) Guess I need to make sure next time I get some to look for that.
Dorian

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 20:47:24 -0600
From: <barbw@uswest.net>
Subject: Re: Inter State Emission testing?

Joe:

Here in Phoenix they have the mobile testing units known as "smog dogs".  They 
are
strategically positioned either at a freeway on ramp or off ramp at a point 
where
you will be accelerating.  An infrared sensor measures the emissions coming 
from
your tailpipe and a camera snaps your license plate number.  The information
gathered from these checkpoints is kept on file at the local air quality 
office.
If you exceed the allowable emissions standard, a notice is mailed to you and 
you
have 30 days to get retested for compliance.  If you fail to make the required
repairs pass emissions, your registration is suspended.  Please note, however,
that the road side emissions standards are significantly more lenient than the
maximum allowable limits at the testing stations.  How do I know this?  I got a
smog dog citation last year.  After making certain repairs I did pass the
emissions test and all is well.

As for out-of-state vehicles, Arizona is the migration headquarters and snow 
bird
capital of the world.  Vehicle testing is not done or required for vehicles
belonging to non-Arizona residents.  Unless the vehicle is registered with the
state, I cant imagine how local air quality officials could possibly know who 
an
out of state vehicle belongs to, where the owners are staying or how long the
vehicle will remain in the state.  Without that information, there is no way 
the
owner of an offending vehicle can receive a citation by mail. I have not heard 
any
screaming on the news or in the paper from newcomers or snow birds about their
receiving road side pollution citations.  So, at least in Arizona, I dont think
you need to be too worried about receiving such citations if you come to visit 
or
are passing through.

Barb


Stakin@aol.com wrote:

> <snip>
> <<  I was under the impression that those states
>  that use the spot testing target the vagrant polluters.  Without huge
>  clouds of smoke coming out the exhaust you would just blend in
>  with everyone else. >>
>
> I wonder what will happen when they see (hear) a 68 442 ( insert your 
favorite
> flavor )  in race tune rolling their way.  " that thing cant possibly pass ,
> check him "  I despise this tactic .  I understand this might be coming to
> western Washington.  Has anyone on the list gotten spot checked and failed?
> What happens next ?
>
> Joe Stackman

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 22:58:49 -0800
From: Greg Pruett <gregp@rbnet.com>
Subject: Re: '71 VC. No ignition key. No Problem.

Charles A. Dempsey wrote:

> Perhaps the previous owner's ignition key did not work on the doors, but
> my new one cut from the ignition code does. It's more likely that she
> simply assumed that a square key wouldn't work in the door locks. My new
> key does not fit the glove box or tail gate. I'll get one of those cut
> tomorrow from the codes on the glove box lock.

Your square key should fit the tailgate too.  The round key only fits
the glovebox in a Vista Cruiser.  My key doesn't always turn easily in
the tailgate but with a little jiggling it'll twist.  I've always
thought it was because the ignition lock is worn more than the
tailgate.  The ignition is the most used lock and the tailgate is the
least used.  The tailgate also catches a lot of dirt, water, salt, etc.
so I imagine it gums up quicker.

Greg Pruett
72 Vista Cruiser
67 Cutlass Supreme
80 Cutlass Calais

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 22:05:18 -0600
From: "James Moore" <panman638@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: No Number info

I did not want to sound bitter. I understand what you said Mike, I would
have liked to heard a reply like the ones I just read after my e-mail, It is
a shame I had to sound like a little piss ant before I got a response. I
have learned a great deal being on this list for the past two years, I had
thought that I could finish my car in a year. Two years have come and gone
and allot of what I did the first year are now being redone because I have
learned and I want my car to be as original and as correct as it possibly
can be. Now that I know I cannot find what I would like I will settle for
what I have and I will do it correct. Thanks list
                               Jim Moore
- -----Original Message-----
From: RARE73OLDS@aol.com <RARE73OLDS@aol.com>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Thursday, February 04, 1999 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: No Number info


>In a message dated 2/4/99 7:29:33 PM Eastern Standard Time,
>panman638@worldnet.att.net writes:
>
><< I Guess Oldsmoble has no way of knowing the production numbers of the
> options that were sold on there cars. Chevy and Pontiac have all the
records
> anybody could ever care to wan, But everytime I try to find anything out
> about my olds all I am told is the numbers of a model with a conv, or h/t
or
> auto, or whatever that is so generic. Oh well I will settle for not a soul
> ever responding to my questions. It feels the same as it does when I come
> into the house to talk to my wife. >>
>
>   I agree with what you say and still do not understand then where all
that
>production info came from for the 60s and early 70s cars if Olds does not
have
>it. What did some Olds God make all those numbers up . You know, how many
4spd
>W30 conv were made? and how many 70 post 442s with 4spds were
made?...etc....
>I mean the 72s and up even have a code in the VIN to tell you what motor
and
>sometimes what motor and trans came in that car...the 60s and early 70s did
>not even have that...hopefully in time that info will come out...
><A
HREF="http://members.aol.com/magsurv/index.html">HotRodHarrys73Olds455/4spe
>ed</A>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 20:17:51 -0800 (PST)
From: Stefan Gadecki <sgadecki@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: What's Purple and Horny.....?

  The first thing that popped into my head when I read this was BARNEY!!
Yea, the one from that "you love me and I love you..." show.  

Olds content:  I once blew up a stuffed Barney doll with fireworks
then used its head as a hood ornament on my Olds until somebody swiped
it...
_________________________________________________________
DO YOU YAHOO!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 23:15:57 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: Thanks for the Advice

Old cars will hold or even increase in value, the same can't be said for
hookers.

Heheheheheheheheheheh lol Hehehehehehehehehehehehe Aheemmm (clearing
throught) You do mean Headers right?  Hehehehe....

- -----Regards,

Gary J. Couse
Couse Custom's

ICQ# 5209322
gjcouse@francomm.com
gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com

Custom Conversion Prototype:
CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com

------------------------------

Date: 4 Feb 99 21:17:51 MST
From: RSTOMN <restoman@netscape.net>
Subject: Mime-Version: 1.0

unsubscribe oldsmobile

RESTOMAN

____________________________________________________________________
More than just email--Get your FREE Netscape WebMail account today at 
http://home.netscape.com/netcenter/mail

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 23:20:48 -0500
From: "Erik Gertsen" <ainode@frontiernet.net>
Subject: Re: black oil

Whens that dallas show you refer to? street racing?
and paint overspray? wait, i think im a little tired here.
but please say more about this show. one of the big attractions about having
my delta (w/455 and 4bbl) was i could walk to these punks with the automatic
LX stangs and be a righteuos snot. LOL>
Erik
- ----- Original Message -----
From: <GT5726@aol.com>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 8:25 PM
Subject: Re: black oil


>In a message dated 2/4/99 12:47:16 PM Central Standard Time,
>jalkara@whidbey.net writes:
>
><<
> sounds like the body shop is the cause of your black oil, extended idling
> causes some greif in many things
> as for bad language
> i thought this forum was kinda like a bunch of guys standing around in the
> garage and that language would be on the bottom end of mild in all
> conversations i have ever heard taking place in a garage full of people,
> including ones with mixed sexes.
> i mean if you got to be so politically correct it is time for you to sell
> your gas powered olds and buy an electric car or better yet just walk
> everywhere so there will be more gas for me to waste while im burning
> rubberr like crazy
>  >>
>
>
>I tend to agree with the relaxed atmosphere idea. While I'm generally
polite
>in "new" company, I like to think of this forum as more of a "garage scene"
>too. Maybe it is due to the useage of a "paint oversprayed" laptop setting
>next to my Craftsman rollaway. When I meet some of you at the Dallas show
this
>summer, I'm sure I'll keep it on a polite level....FOR A WHILE! The beer
and
>the "Rockets" will get the best of me, and I'm sure to start smarting off
to
>the 5.0 and 5.7 geeks that will undoubtedly show up.
>
>Collyn Eastham
>65 442
>65 Cutlass
>
>P.S. I'll even show you nice folks where the street racing scenes are here
in
>"Big D"
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 23:21:42 EST
From: BIGJERMES@aol.com
Subject: Re: Anyone in South Carolina?

In a message dated 2/4/99 9:55:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, old442@erols.com
writes:

<< I may be getting a job offer for a position in Greenville, SC soon.  
 My wife was wondering about the schools, housing, etc., but I want to
 know information on the IMPORTANT things.  Such as: 
 How are the junque yardes?
 What are the policies for historic cars?
 What do nice 442s sell for down there?
 
 If anyone can help with either my questions or my wifes, please respond
 privately. >>
well, i live about 20 miles from greenville sc, and i like it.  nice pretty
scenery as well as a growing city.  (getting somewhat big now)  the junkyards
around there im not sure of but then again there isnt going to be many OLD car
yards anywhere.  
jeremy
BIGJERMES@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 23:33:48 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: A.I.R. Manifold availability?

Yes, I boo booed. I meant going into exhaust port rather than into the
manifold. I also omitted their head entry fact. Speaking of which. What's
the best route to combat the usual associated rust/fusion of the A.I.R.
pipes head entry nuts/collets (for better tern). I'll WD them several times
over a few days before attempt at removal. Not to sure if heating will help
in this case. Just hoping their not so rust fused to cause any head damage
during extraction. I'm sure there going to round off causing knuckle busting
and effecting an immediate "Blue Fog" to surround the car. Oouch.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Martin
> Thomas-WLTM07
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 8:59 AM
> To: 'oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca'
> Subject: RE: A.I.R. Manifold availability?
>
>
> I never have seen an Olds exhaust manifold that the AIR went in the
> manifold, they do on SB Ch$vy, but on Olds they go into the head directly.
> FAR more reliable.
>
> I think all 5A (from 80's 307) and 7A heads are drilled and
> tapped for AIR,
> and others may be, depends on the emissions (CA or Fed).  My 77 3A heads
> have the boss', but they are not drilled and tapped.
>
> Thomas Martin
> 80 Turbo Trans AM
> 85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
> 91 Bonneville LE 3800
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 23:34:46 EST
From: DYeager535@aol.com
Subject: Re: P.A.W/mailorder

In a message dated 2/4/99 8:25:57 PM Pacific Standard Time, Mikeytvb@aol.com
writes:

<<what you have
 to think about when ordering parts is if the shipping is going to add up to
 more than local stores.  i remember ordering a sbc intake from jegs and it
was
 around 120 plus 5 shipping and discount sells them for 125 plus local tax.
 
 mikeytvb@aol.com
 70 442 hc >>

      Most of my experiences have been the same price wise..local speed shops
with tax are the same as the mail order with handling and/or shipping. Except
with the true double roller timing chain. Summit and Jegs both have them for
$41, and the local shops want $73. Other than that, cams, rockers, bearings,
etc., have all been the same or less locally. Thanks, Dorian

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 04:47:21 GMT
From: Robert Barry <RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu>
Subject: Re: SX question

>Can you tell where exactly this letter will be stamped? I think I saw a
>"KA"
>stamped just below the valve cover on the front left hand side.
>_________
>
>That's the one.  Ka heads are 73-76 marine/irrigation/service replacement
>heads.  Big valves, hardened seats.  Not original, but not a bad choice for
>street driving on today's gasoline.

They were also on the highest-hp stick production cars in '73 (and '74?) As
noted, great head for the street, up there with the F's and H's.

But, check the casting on the other head; if it was a service replacement,
the other head may be original. You can check the 6-digit casting # to make
sure it's the same as the driver's side head.
_______________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry   MailTo:RBarry@Providence.Edu
http://studentweb.providence.edu/~rbarry/wheels

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 04:47:24 GMT
From: Robert Barry <RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu>
Subject: 403 2" valves (was Re: More 455 Head IDs)

>W-31 motors were the only 2-inch small block heads, exept for the 200 HP
>403's that were in 77 Toro's and I believe 77-78 Trans Ams?

AFAIK, all 403's came with 2" intakes (I can verify the 2" intakes on a '78
Electra and '79 Trans-am, both rated at 185hp).
_______________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry   MailTo:RBarry@Providence.Edu
http://studentweb.providence.edu/~rbarry/wheels

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 23:56:12 -0500
From: Brian Kerr <bkerr@golden.net>
Subject: Unsubscribe commands

I have misplaced the instructions for unsubscribing and subscribing the 
digest. I
need to get my inbox under control, so I am going to switch to digest mode. 
Can some
one please send me the instructions?

Thanks

Brian Kerr
69 Cutlass Conv

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 00:05:33 EST
From: Bbymks4@aol.com
Subject: Re: parts for sale

           Western Washington, probably too far away....

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 00:10:29 EST
From: Onebil2mny@aol.com
Subject: Re: Inter State Emission testing?

In a message dated 2/4/1999 3:04:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
shang@connect.net writes:

<< I don't see how a road side spot check could be applicable to an out of
state vehicle. The emission requirements are not the same state to state >>

Hmmmmm... well, inspection (road worthiness) laws technically apply to out of
state cars, but here in Md I rarely see an out of state vehicle ticketed for a
violation of Md's inspection laws.  They can be enforced on an out of state
vehicle, but don't seem to be.

Bill K

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 21:19:38 PST
From: "jason shreve" <jasonshreve@hotmail.com>
Subject: Fwd: Interesting item on eBay web site item#62841221: OLD 
TACH...OLDSMOBILE...HOOD OR DASH MOUNT

Cool Item on e-bay!!!  A console tack for 64-65 442/cutlass.  I would 
love to have it but would like to see someone get it that needs it.  
Last time I check it was at $27.




>
>I saw this item for sale at eBay, the world's largest personal trading 
community, and thought that you might be interested.
>
>Title of item:	OLD TACH...OLDSMOBILE...HOOD OR DASH MOUNT
>Seller:	compshack@digiscape.com
>Starts:	02/01/99 19:29:24 PST 
>Ends:	02/06/99 19:29:24 PST 
>Price:	Currently $26.55
>To bid the item, go to:	


http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=62841221




>
>Item Description:		
>	OLD TACH I HAVE BEEN TOLD IT IS A ADD ON FROM OLDSMOBILE...IT IS 
LIGHTED AND TACH AND LIGHT BOTH WORK....BIDDER PAYS $4.25 SHIPPING.....
>FEEL FREE TO EMAIL ANY QUESTIONS...OR COMMENTS....GOOD LUCK and HAPPY 
BIDDING......PLEASE VISIT MY OTHER AUCTIONS
>
>On 02/02/99 at 19:23:07 PDT, seller added the following information:
>AFTER I LISTED THIS I RECEIVED 2 EMAILS WITH THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION
>Your Olds tach, Item # 62841221 is from a 1964 Olds. It mounted on the
>console and was a factory option. ( I have a 64 442 w/ that 
option.).................
>
>Hi,  Your Olds Tach is a standard equipment tach for a 1965 Olds 
Cutlass
>442.  It mounted on the center console ahead of the shifter. Good luck!
>
>	Visit eBay, the world's largest Personal Trading Community at 
http://www.ebay.com
>


______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 00:23:21 EST
From: Onebil2mny@aol.com
Subject: Re: New Hot Rod

In a message dated 2/4/1999 12:34:27 PM Eastern Standard Time,
jasonshreve@hotmail.com writes:

<< I agree with this.  It is my opinion that the BBC is the best GM engine.  
 But there is nothing worse than seeing a 442 with a BBC.  That is why I 
 have a 68 Camaro so I can enjoy my BBC with out ruining my Olds. >>


even if the car was bought as a basket case, with no engine, and the guy
already has a BBC, build and ready to go.  What if, along with all of this,
the car is not stock at all.

Bill (hope I slip by on this technicality) K

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 00:27:50 EST
From: Onebil2mny@aol.com
Subject: Re: List Language (was Re: Black Oil)

In a message dated 2/4/1999 5:18:07 PM Eastern Standard Time,
comid@jellico.com writes:

<< Just in poor taste, that's all. It offends some, me included. It's a public
 forum which makes ignoring it much more difficult. Appropriate language
 offends no one regardless of your TASTE in conversation. >>

Exactly

Bill K

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 21:41:05 PST
From: "jason shreve" <jasonshreve@hotmail.com>
Subject: 75th anniversary olds decanter on e-bay.

There is a cool Jim Beam Decanter on e-bay from 1972!!   It was made to 
celebrate the 75th anniversary of olds.  To find it just search 
oldsmobile.  Would be a nice piece of history to have. It was at 30 last 
I saw.



______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 00:52:47 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES

RANDY A GEISEL wrote:
> 
> I just checked the price watch page of Oct/Nov '98 issue of T&L.
> 
> They show the following: '68 H/O, 9 ads, High price $56,000 (yes 56K), Low
> price $3,950, most common $4,500 - $5,900
> 
> '69 H/O 5 ads, High $27,500, Low $5,500, Most Common $19,500 -$20,000.
> 
> Hope this helps,
> Randy
> 
> >How much are 68 and 69 H/O's going for these days?
> >What about 70 W30's?
> >I'm gettin the itch.

So what about the rusty 72's with a sunroof, Randy?

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 00:55:43 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES

jason shreve wrote:
> 
> I am the same way.  It is all part of the funny to say this is how I
> bought it, look at it now!!!!
> 
> >I, however, have some sort of masochistic problem because I get more
> excited
> >seeing an old beater that has potential then a restored car.  

You have to admit there are probably cheaper ways to get excited.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 01:11:21 -0500
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES

>So what about the rusty 72's with a sunroof, Randy?

Hey Don,

Let's see........there's the one in the NJ junkyard (salvage yard to be pc)
that I sent (you probably lost them) pics of for $3000 and then there's the
one inFL with the roof rusted and caved in.....$2450. Still see his ad in
JWO.

There's my not rusty but paint and upholstery bad hardtop....$6500 ($12,000
come Spring after paint, carpet, top, and buckets redone)
T&L says 7 ads, high $19,998, low $2,450, common range $17,500 - $18,000

$ ads for ragtops, high $28,000, low $8,550........no common range listed
because one ad had no price listed.

Did you get around to talking to Ashley Jones about his roof?

How's that?

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 01:16:33 -0500
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Intake Manifold Install

>I hate to sound like a complete "newbie" here, but does anyone use >any
silicone on their intake?

Just in the corners where the front and rear gaskets meet the heads and
intake.

When I used both the valley pan and composite gaskets under the Performer
RPM, I put a small bead on the front and back gaskets as the intake sat up
higher and you could move these seals back and forth. Worked fine, but ended
removing the valley pan the next time I had the intake off.

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 01:20:36 EST
From: W30442CS@aol.com
Subject: Re: Restore or not (preferences)

In a message dated 2/4/99 6:11:09 PM Eastern Standard Time,
hurstolds@xtalwind.net writes:

<< 
 I'm going into year two of the H/O project, and haven't completed NEARLY
 what I'd hoped to.  And if I had just bought one already done, I could
 be enjoying it's beauty rather than sifting through boxes of various
 pieces of it wondering where I could get this replated, and where am I
 gonna get a replacement for that, etc >>
mike, if i may ask, what kind of cond. was your hurst in when you got it?  i
looked at a 69 hurst last year before starting the resto on my rallye 350. i
had allways wanted one but the price seemed a bit too much $$$.  the one i saw
had been hit in the front end , but the bad pieces had been replaced.  the
motor and trany would need over hauled, a new interior needed,the motor was
dissasembled, and there was rust in the fenders and rear qrt. panels.  all the
H/O parts were there, but it looked to me as if it would be better in the long
run to buy one a little closer to finished.  oh, and it was for sale for
6000$.  i decided to stick with the rallye, its a #numbers matching car with
tons of paper work and nos parts , and i had just rebuilt the motor in it.
look for it at the 99 nats!    i still want a hurst or a 70 w-30 (4spd) some
day, but for now ill settle for what i have.  steven, w30442cs@aol.com    (70
w-31 4spd, rallye 350, 71w-30 conv., 71 442)  ; )  

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 00:25:28 -0600
From: GTH <lkxiii@lords.com>
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES

Don Sowers wrote:
> 
> jason shreve wrote:
> >
> > I am the same way.  It is all part of the funny to say this is how I
> > bought it, look at it now!!!!
> >
> > >I, however, have some sort of masochistic problem <snip and grin>

> You have to admit there are probably cheaper ways to get excited.

My late father's quote (as he loaned me BIG bucks so I could buy a '65
F75)..."it's probably cheaper than cocaine, obviously gives you a
thrill, and might keep you out of the streets and bars, plus you might
get something worthwhile in return" [and sadly saved his kids $475.00
..that Fleetwood served as a family car at his funeral]. But, I'm the
ONLY member of my family that has the vaguest idea what goes on under a
hood.

George Hester

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 00:50:19 -0600
From: <shang@connect.net>
Subject: Re: Inter State Emission testing?

Safety inspections yes, but not emissions, which was what we were
discussing. :)

Stephen Hoover
Dallas, Texas
'70 Supreme

Onebil2mny@aol.com wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 2/4/1999 3:04:19 AM Eastern Standard Time,
> shang@connect.net writes:
> 
> << I don't see how a road side spot check could be applicable to an out of
> state vehicle. The emission requirements are not the same state to state >>
> 
> Hmmmmm... well, inspection (road worthiness) laws technically apply to out of
> state cars, but here in Md I rarely see an out of state vehicle ticketed for 
a
> violation of Md's inspection laws.  They can be enforced on an out of state
> vehicle, but don't seem to be.
> 
> Bill K
.

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 23:02:08 -0800
From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Subject: Re: this day in history

Finally, something *interesting* about this date in history....

Music & Olds fan - 

Lisa Madsen
Anaheim, CA

'66 Toronado, '67 Delta 88 Custom, '72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible,  '72
Vista Cruiser, '80 GMC 1/2 Ton

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com
My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/
Subscribe To : Lisa's Classic Oldsmobile Bulletin Board Mailing List:
Lisa's Oldsmobile FREE Banner Exchange
http://exo.com/~jht/olds/banners/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 01:44:16 -0600
From: Robert Bishop <rbishop@iamerica.net>
Subject: RE: for SX information (was Re: SX question)

At 11:57 AM 2/4/99 -0500, you wrote:
>
>> >You might also see the June, 1993 edition of the now defunct magazine
>> >"Buick, Olds, Pontiac" Collectors Guide. It has an article on W-32 & SX
>> >Cutlasses.
>> 
>> Does anyone have a copy of this magazine that I can pay them to photocopy
>> pages from?

I happen to have a copy of this magazine. If you would like a photocopy of
the SX article let me know at:    rbishop@iamerica.net

p.s. to Robert Barry:  the pics are of 70 SX's, right up your alley!

Thanks

Robert Bishop

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 20:00:14 -0600
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Intake Manifold Install

>In my opinion you should put some silicone in the four corners where the 
>intake mates with the heads and block in the back and front. I am against 
>silicone in most gasket procedures but I put silicone in all the 
>"corners" that appear for ex. also in the corners of the oil pan. I think 
>that is what most people do, but we better wait on the other opinions...
>
I never use the supplied end gaskets as you can have problems with 
leaks there or the end pieces moving.  I clean the surfaces very good
and put a bead of RTV where the seal would go.  Gets sandwiched 
inbetween the intake/block and won't move.  Thats the only time I use
a lot of RTV, and avoid using it on stuff like valve cover gaskets.  If you
want to hold the gasket in place the yellow "gorilla snot" weatherstrip
adhesive is what I use.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 05:54:21 -0600
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: A.I.R. Manifold availability?

> Speaking of which. What's
>the best route to combat the usual associated rust/fusion of the A.I.R.
>pipes head entry nuts/collets (for better tern). I'll WD them several times
>over a few days before attempt at removal. Not to sure if heating will help
>in this case. Just hoping their not so rust fused to cause any head damage
>during extraction. I'm sure there going to round off causing knuckle
busting
>and effecting an immediate "Blue Fog" to surround the car. Oouch.


Best way is to use anti-seize when you put it together.  Always
use a ~line~ wrench to avoid rounding the nuts off.  If you can
tell their going to round off anyway, cut the tubes off just above
the fitting and use a socket.  An impact works best to jar it loose
but if all else fails (or someone rounded them off before) you
can use a punch to drive the tube out of the center and use
an extractor.  The type that has the left hand twists and about
6-8 ridges on them work the best.  The more you try to loosen
the fitting the further the extractor will bite into it.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 07:18:26 EST
From: GraphixRUs@aol.com
Subject: Re: 442 Stripes

David, I e-mailed you direct but  had a fatal error message.
Please e-mail me direct.
Roger  Utter

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 07:30:38 -0500
From: tchurchill@draper.com (Timothy A. Churchill)
Subject: Coupla Olds Sightings to Ponder

Figured I'd post about a couple of Olds sightings I had yesterday (2/4).
Well, to be accurate, one Olds sighting and one Olds reading:

1)  Stopped by my sister's house, and was driving back to the main road
    via a different route through her neighborhood than I normally take.
    Parked in front of a house a couple of blocks from hers, I saw a 
    '73 442.  Burgundy.  Couldn't really stop to take a closer look at it,
    but it seemed in reasonably OK restorable shape.  No dents, minimal rust.
    Rear bumper was *badly* pitted though, almost uniformly over the entire
    bumper.  Was this common for chrome of that vintage?  We see very few
    early-mid 70s vehicles these days up here in the rust belt, but when I
    see 'em, the chrome is usually 75-90% rust colored.

    Sometime, I'll have to drive by & talk to the owner, maybe when Big Red
    is out & about again...

2)  An article in the Boston Globe yesterday had a blurb on a stolen 1995
    Oldsmobile -- model not listed -- that was recovered by the police.
    Hardly a noteworthy occurence, especially in the paper in one of the
    car theft capitals like Boston, except for two unusual aspects of the
    crime:

    1) The car was stolen back in '95 when brand new from a dealership
       in New Hampshire, and;

    2) It was recovered in POLAND.  Not Poland, Maine, neither... :)
      
    No word yet as of yesterday on how/why it got there...


Happy weekend everyone!  The Missus and I are getting away for an early
V-Day weekend (read: sans offspring) down to Cape Cod, where the water
is only slightly colder than in August :)



Tim Churchill  tchurchill@draper.com  OCA #30327  Framingham, MA
- ----------------------------------------------------------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, new a.k.a 'Old Gold'
'98 VW Passat GLS Wagon, a.k.a. 'der Kinderwagen'

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 08:12:24 -0500 
From: "Semantana Chris (ONEX)" <SemantanaC@tce.com>
Subject: RE: HURST/OLDS PRICES

> >So what about the rusty 72's with a sunroof, Randy?
> 
> Hey Don,
> 
> Let's see........there's the one in the NJ junkyard (salvage yard to be
> pc)
> that I sent (you probably lost them) pics of for $3000 and then there's
> the
> one inFL with the roof rusted and caved in.....$2450. Still see his ad in
> JWO.
> 
Ah yes Bob Anderson's sunroof car.  Is this the one that, from the polaroids
he has taken to Lansing and Springfield, looks like it is the remains of a
H/O sunroof car (no front end or drivetrain if I remember right)?  I'm quite
surprised at some of the asking prices for Bob's cars.  Now granted, the
polaroids are not great but $3000 or so for a Rallye 350 that is not numbers
matching and in need of a very aggressive resto in kinda high, IMO.

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute, IN
http://www.abcs.com/chris/

1969 W-31
1969 4-4-2 parts car
plus others

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 08:19:34 -0500
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: HURST OLDS

Hey Guys
I was just searching around on the web and came across www.69ho.com. If you
haven't seen this site check it out. Theres some pretty cool 69 h/o
prototype stuff there. 
btw, thanks to everyone who responded with the current 68/9 H/O prices.
Guess I'll dream a little bit, figure out what I want, look for that and
see if I have anything in my pocket when I find it. I know what you guys
mean about settling for a lesser car for one reason or another. Other than
my Omegas, pretty much every car I've ever owned got old pretty quick and
was then sold. I'm very quickly loosing interest in my '70 Camaro. Got my
eyes open for a '68-'72 442. 

Question: Is it possible to buffalo a 442 owner into taking a '70 Camaro
trade?? 

Omega Man
'74 Omega 455/4spd
'74 Omega S hatchback 455/auto/4spd...I haven't decided yet..

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 08:22:06 -0500
From: Tony Molinaro <AMOLINARO@mbakercorp.com>
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES -Reply

Let's see........there's the one in the NJ junkyard (salvage yard to be pc)
that I sent (you probably lost them) pics of for $3000 and then there's the
one inFL with the roof rusted and caved in.....$2450. Still see his ad in
JWO.

Does any one know if the one with the rusted and caved in roof come
from western PA? 

Tony Molinaro
69 442 4 spd

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 09:00:36 -0500
From: tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Subject: Re: 403 2" valves (was Re: More 455 Head IDs)

>AFAIK, all 403's came with 2" intakes (I can verify the 2" intakes on a '78
>Electra and '79 Trans-am, both rated at 185hp).
>_______________________________________________
>Dr. Robert Barry   MailTo:RBarry@Providence.Edu
>http://studentweb.providence.edu/~rbarry/wheels



Thanks for the info Dr. Bob!  Like I said in my post,  I don't know small
blocks like I know big blocks, But I am always willing to learn!  I just
don't tear into those as often as I do the 455's I have in my cars and
boats!

Tony

70 442 W-30
70 442 W-30 convert
70 Toro GT W-34
65 Jetstar 88 w/4-speed
84 Hurst/Olds
85 Cutlass Salon 455 Drag Racer
92 Seville STS

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 09:33:08 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: RE: A.I.R. Manifold availability?

 What's the best route to combat the usual associated rust/fusion of the
A.I.R.
pipes head entry nuts/collets (for better tern).
_______

Gary,

Are you just writing off this set of A.I.R. pipes - in other words are you
assuming these will be damaged in the removal process to the point of being
unuseable?  If so, I'd suggest the following:  Before attempting to round,
er, remove the flare nuts, cut off the tubes just above the nut.  Then use
a six-point socket and a breaker bar to remove the flare nuts.  If the nuts
are sufficiently worn that even a six-point socket is loose, try the
next-smaller metric socket (to the point of hammering it on if necessary).

If you're determined to try and save the pipes, be sure to use flare nut
wrenches on them.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 09:38:04 EST
From: Lou0118@aol.com
Subject: Re: HURST/OLDS PRICES

I saw a 69 H/O in Old Car Trader about a month or two ago.  It was here in New
Jersey and the guy was asking $20,000.  Maybe I'll give the guy a call to see
if he sold it or got any action on it.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 10:17:42 -0500
From: "Gary Couse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: RE: Inter State Emission testing?

Actually this was about to be my next question. While the "big boys" have
mega bucks to smooze with the EPA for a model line certification. At least
that's how I read it. A few "units" are pulled from the initial model run
than the EPA tests and if passed that the model design is certified for
production as designed. They need to get any/all different engine variations
likewise certified.
There should be an ability to "re-certify" a model line as a modified
original production unit. I doubt any of the big boys did any true dual cat
testing as simply that wouldn't be "cost effective for mass production".
Let's face it. It's cheaper for them to produce a single cat system than a
dual. We could listen to their argument that twice the exhaust (both banks)
will fire the cat quicker. Personally I don't believe it. Dual cats at half
the size of the original large cat, when mounted at a header collector
should fire as quick or quicker. Reasoning, header exhaust is moving
smother, faster, and because of that, hotter. Smaller single bank cats can
easily be produced with comparable flow characteristics as that of a large
single unit. In fact, Quincy is so setup. Including A.I.R. injection and O2
collector installed. While I don't have emission testing equipment
available, and don't live where emission testing is required, I know I'm
running cleaner than original. I should be allowed (as an auto
remanufacture) to have my system retested for certification or my line.

Any thoughts/suggestions?

- -----Regards,

Gary J. Couse
Couse Custom's

ICQ# 5209322
gjcouse@francomm.com
gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com

Custom Conversion Prototype:
CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com

Project Forum Delphi Site:
http://www.delphi.com/cc_iroc_ss

> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Martin
> Thomas-WLTM07
> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 1999 1:45 PM
> To: 'oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca'
> Subject: Re: Inter State Emission testing?
>
>
> What is required to prove that your new design, say (for example) dual
> converters IS compliant with EPA standards??  Like the CARB
> approval?  Or my
> new design on EGR valve operation is better, or my new EFI is better for
> emissions...
>
> If I design a new dual cat system that I have determined through my own
> testing will meet or exceed emissions requirements of CA or FED, how do I
> get CARB or Fed approval to use it on my own car, and further, later for
> sale to the public?
>
> Just a blanket law saying that you can't change is not fair to the people
> who CAN design something that works.  And maybe I can design
> something that
> works better!  Edelbrock and other companies make parts that replace
> emissions devices and they have the big $$ to get the approvals,
> what about
> the little guys?  Just stepped on?
>
> There should be some way to get a waiver from the state or fed saying that
> this device installed as such is compliant with EPA laws and does not
> degrade emissions levels.....yada yada yada.
>
> Anyone have any info?
>
> Thomas Martin
> 80 Turbo Trans AM
> 85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
> 91 Bonneville LE 3800
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 09:47:36 -0600
From: "Roger Hitson" <hitson@i1.net>
Subject: Re: Intake Manifold Install

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 2/4/99, at 4:44 PM, George wrote: 

>Del, 
>
>In my opinion you should put some silicone in the four corners where the 
>intake mates with the heads and block in the back and front. I am against 
>silicone in most gasket procedures but I put silicone in all the 
>"corners" that appear for ex. also in the corners of the oil pan. I think 
>that is what most people do, but we better wait on the other opinions...

George, Del, whomever...

I suggest you also use a bead of silicone around the water ports. Around the 
intake ports, i don't use silicone, but use brush tack or similar

roger hitson

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 08:54:46 -0700
From: "Igor T. '81 DRB 455" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: Re: Intake Manifold Install

>I suggest you also use a bead of silicone around the water ports. Around
the intake ports, i don't use silicone, >but use brush tack or similar

Thanks guys.  I installed it last night.  I uses those seals and the
composite gasket (with hole cut out) and no valley pan.  I have no problem
with RTV so I could have used in on the intake.  You guys might be right, it
might leak this way.  The only reason why I uses it was because when I
assembled the motor, I used them and they did not leak at all.  Now, I had
no clearance or anything like I did on the stand, so it might just leak on
the back.  We will see.  I also uses RTV around the water ports.  Nothing to
lose.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 10:55:43 -0500
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: RE: Inter State Emission testing?

>dual. We could listen to their argument that twice the exhaust (both banks)
>will fire the cat quicker. Personally I don't believe it. Dual cats at half
>the size of the original large cat, when mounted at a header collector
>should fire as quick or quicker. Reasoning, header exhaust is moving
>smother, faster, and because of that, hotter. Smaller single bank cats can
>easily be produced with comparable flow characteristics as that of a large
>single unit. In fact, Quincy is so setup. Including A.I.R. injection and O2
>collector installed. While I don't have emission testing equipment
>available, and don't live where emission testing is required, I know I'm
>running cleaner than original. I should be allowed (as an auto
>remanufacture) to have my system retested for certification or my line.
>
>Any thoughts/suggestions?
>
>-----Regards,
>
>Gary J. Couse
>N========================================



Not to sound like a retard or anything, but how does a cat work? I know
what they do but how do they accomplish it? Is it just like a muffler with
special filtering material or something. My cat experience is limited since
my core interest of cars is pre-'75. 

Omega Man
2 '74 Omega's both 455

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 09:56:43 -0600
From: "Roger Hitson" <hitson@i1.net>
Subject: Re: Restore or not (preferences)

*********** REPLY SEPARATOR ***********

On 2/4/99, at 6:08 PM, Mike Rothe. wrote: 

<snipped>>
>  I guess I've done it for so darn long, I'm almost ready to
>"retire" from the actual gruntwork on a total resto.  Don't get me
>wrong, I love it and always will, it's just that as you get along in
>years, your priorities change, whether you initiate it or someone else
>does.  
>
>I think I've done my fair share for the hobby too, Like getting stuff
>reproduced for the 69 H/Os.  Especially figuring out that darned
>FireFrost gold paint.  Also, I'd like to think that I've given some
>insight to members of this list with knowledge I've gained throughout
>the years.  While I'm not "jedi master" Joe Padavano, Ken Snyder, Jim
>Chermack, Greg Rollins, or Hot Rod Harry, to name just a few of the
>respected talents, <snipped>

You're far too humble, old dude.

roger hitson

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 11:04:24 -0500
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: Re: Intake Manifold Install

A
>>intake mates with the heads and block in the back and front. I am against 
>>silicone in most gasket procedures but I put silicone in all the 
>>"corners" that appear for ex. also in the corners of the oil pan. I think 
>>that is what most people do, but we better wait on the other opinions...
>
>George, Del, whomever...
>
>I suggest you also use a bead of silicone around the water ports. Around
the intake ports, i don't use silicone, but use brush tack or similar
>
>roger hitson
>
>


I second that. I just had to replace the intake gaskets on my sbc. I put
them on dry the first time. Lasted 3 months. Water passage started leaking.
All over the place. 

Omega Man

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 10:58:18 -0500
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Restore or not (preferences)

...While I'm not "jedi master" Joe Padavano...
______

Uh, now, I don't think I look _that_ much like Yoda...   ;-)

Seriously, I can't take all this credit.  I've learned a lot from others on
this list over the past, uh, however may years that it's been.  I prefer to
think of myself as taking over the Chris Witt "designated list smart@$$"
role.  I also find that being first to respond tends to make one look
omniscient, when in fact all it means is that I'm screwing off at work.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 11:16:11 -0500
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: Re: Restore or not (preferences)

At 10:58 AM 2/5/99 -0500, you wrote:
>...While I'm not "jedi master" Joe Padavano...
>______
>
>Uh, now, I don't think I look _that_ much like Yoda...   ;-)
>
>Seriously, I can't take all this credit.  I've learned a lot from others on
>this list over the past, uh, however may years that it's been.  I prefer to
>think of myself as taking over the Chris Witt "designated list smart@$$"
>role.  I also find that being first to respond tends to make one look
>omniscient, when in fact all it means is that I'm screwing off at work.
>
>Joe Padavano
==========================

Use the force Joe. 
When it comes to screwing off at work I'm the "jedi master"!

Omega Man

'74 Omega S
'74 Omega

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 10:21:04 -0600
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: Re: Headers Real Benefit

Thanks. I suppose it would be worth some power to smooth out the casting
roughness inside the log type manifolds. Defintely more on the W/Z
manifolds - I've heard them called "factory headers". Ultra shorties,
but definitely like a header.

==========
Greg Rollin at Supercars recommended hogging out the stock exhaust
manifolds as
much as possible. Also, at the Nats in Springfield during the Mondello
tech seminar, Joe (Mondello) recommended against extrude honing stock
exhaust manifolds.
This would only be worth it for the W/Z type manifolds as the "log"
type manifolds would still have problems with neighboring cyls 
pulsing at the same time.  What I mean is that the pulses coming
from one cyl will try to go through the manifold at the same time 
as another.

- --
David Brown          Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
          Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.1 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
Conserve bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
           ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 11:26:19 EST
From: RmeCbtEngr@aol.com
Subject: Re: P.A.W (performance automotive warehouse)

P.A.W. is a very good parts house, ive had very good service from them in my
dealings with them, also Summit is a good place 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 11:40:24 -0500 (EST)
From: hurst455@webtv.net (Corey Putnam)
Subject: Stripes and weatherstrips.

I have a 75 Hurst/Olds and I need to find somewhere I can find a stripe
kit and weatherstripping for T Tops so I can get it in the body shop.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 12:00:47 EST
From: RARE73OLDS@aol.com
Subject: Re: Stripes and weatherstrips.

For the stripes call Stencils and Stripes at 847-692-6893...there in IL.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 10:52:54 -0600
From: "Dave Rench" <renchd@krause.com>
Subject: Good Body Shops in WI

Just wondering if any list members have a body shop that they would
recommend in Central or Southern WI or Northern ILL.  What I'd be looking
for is 1/4 panel replacement, moderate rust repair and paint.  Not
necessarily looking for Nationals level "show quality" work, just something
suitable for a restored driver that would pass at a local show.

Feel free to e-mail me privately to save bandwidth.... renchd@krause.com

Thanks for your help  


Dave Rench
1970 W-31

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 11:32:09 -0600
From: "Roger Hitson" <hitson@i1.net>
Subject: what makes oil black?

Igor,

Did you ever get an answer to your question, or just scoldings?

I don't know what makes oil black. Always assumed it was accumulated engine 
crud. Obviously you shouldn't hav that with a recent rebuild,so....

Speculating here (always dangerous ) possibly incomplete combustion?

roger 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 11:40:07 -0600 (CST)
From: blue442@webtv.net
Subject: Re: HURST OLDS

- --WebTV-Mail-2034093299-280
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This guy's on the list, I recall his service provider gave was hesitant
to let him use that address.  :-)

Jeff Carter
blue442@webtv.net


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Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 08:19:34 -0500
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
From: Gene Gilpin <ggilpin@wrallp.com>
Subject: HURST OLDS
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Hey Guys
I was just searching around on the web and came across www.69ho.com. If you
haven't seen this site check it out. Theres some pretty cool 69 h/o
prototype stuff there. 
btw, thanks to everyone who responded with the current 68/9 H/O prices.
Guess I'll dream a little bit, figure out what I want, look for that and
see if I have anything in my pocket when I find it. I know what you guys
mean about settling for a lesser car for one reason or another. Other than
my Omegas, pretty much every car I've ever owned got old pretty quick and
was then sold. I'm very quickly loosing interest in my '70 Camaro. Got my
eyes open for a '68-'72 442. 

Question: Is it possible to buffalo a 442 owner into taking a '70 Camaro
trade?? 

Omega Man
'74 Omega 455/4spd
'74 Omega S hatchback 455/auto/4spd...I haven't decided yet..


- --WebTV-Mail-2034093299-280--

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 5 Feb 1999 12:46:31 -0500
From: "Ed Binnix" <comid@jellico.com>
Subject: Re: what makes oil black?

It's the same stuff that makes the inside of your exhaust manifolds black -
soot. Unless you run propane there will always be a certain amount of carbon
(natural by-product of combustion) in your oil as a combination of gravity
and cylinder pressure caused a limited (depending on engine wear) amount of
combustion by-products to go into the crank case. Other factors include
heat, and exposure to various gasses which both discolor oil.

A good example is a diesel engine. When changing oil, the old oil is so
black and thin from soot and raw fuel that it will stain the skin for days
 believe me, I know). Pour in the new oil, crank up the motor and let it
warm up. Check the oil level and you will find it almost as black as the old
oil, though it will be thicker. This is due to the 20+:1 compression ratio
and the resulting high cylinder pressure of diesels.

I would be very interested to see if gapless rings and/or a crankcase
evacuation system would reduce the amount of carbon in the oil. Hmmmmmmm . .
.

- -----Original Message-----

>Igor,
>
>Did you ever get an answer to your question, or just scoldings?
>
>I don't know what makes oil black. Always assumed it was accumulated engine
crud. Obviously you shouldn't hav that with a recent rebuild,so....
>
>Speculating here (always dangerous ) possibly incomplete combustion?
>
>roger
>

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1755
*********************************

