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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1924


oldsmobile-digest       Monday, April 26 1999       Volume 01 : Number 1924



Re: rear end blues
New question on Cutlass Supreme
Re: New question on Cutlass Supreme
Re: yahoo just bought 72 cutlass conv
Re: yahoo just bought 72 cutlass conv
Re: Carlisle purchases
1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Check your Computer TIME!
non olds: Re: Check your Computer TIME!
Rear Axle Question
Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass
73 Quad
Too much jets in Edelbrock carb
Re: Need one or two 1971 PO-1 hubcaps.
For sale Notched Covers
Vin # info Please
Re: 73 Quad
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Re: boneyard score
Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass
Re: boneyard score
Re: Vin # info Please
Re: Vin # info Please
Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb
hydroboost
2dr vs 4 dr interior
Re: UNBOUNCE: Bad Vibrations
Re: Engine #
Re: Engine #
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Jefferson purchases (was Carlisle purchases)
Re: Mopar show in So Cal this Sunday (non Olds, please excuse)
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
Re: SW with a DIESEL engine (fwd)
What are these worth
Re: Mondello Cam Specks
Re: Mondello Cam Specks
84 Delta DIESEL FOR SALE
Fwd: stickers
Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb
cruise control
Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale
SUBCRIBE
Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb
Re: cruise control
cowl taginfo lansing car!!
72 rims trailer pkge??
Re: Check your Computer TIME!
No More Adventures From Inside The Dash
Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass
Re: Rear Axle Question
Re: Carlisle(where was everyone?)
Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass
Re: Cutlass in a flood
I'm back from Carlisle
Re: 1970 W-31 Pace Car, whats it worth??

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 13:32:28 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: rear end blues

>B Vosburgh wrote:
>
>> I am on my 3rd set of gears in my olds in just 6 months , fell victim to
>> it again last night. Car has a 12 bolt chevy in it , what happens is
>> that it will start to howl after about 10 passes and then it just gets
>> so loud  that the track starts to complain. I have a mark williams
>> spool, axles and c -clip elim. . whan rear is set up contact patch is ok
>> pinion depth ok and backlash to gear specs.It acts like the pinion is
>> moving like a bad pinion bearing or crush coller.last gears I instaled
>> all new bearings on last gear install. also the back lash is up 30 thou
>> set it again , it is quiet for about 5 passes and the all hell again
>> sometimes running quick is not so much fun.  help...............  Butch
>> 68  442  post
>
>  What about the driveshaft and yoke angle. When my dad was racing(many
>years ago) he had similar problems with a Chevelle he was running. It was
>driving him crazy. He kept putting in new components and re-setting
>everything to specs. He took it to a shop to have it tested in the car.
They
>found that the rear end was at too much of an angle(that was when everyone
>was jacking up the rear end of cars) and it was putting excess pressure on
>the pinion, causing it to bind. I don't know if this helps, but it
something
>to check.
>T.J.


Butch,
Another thing to consider is flex of the whole rearend.  Are you
running any sort of bolt on girdle or back brace?  Due to the
fact that the 12 bolt has a big open area in the rear, under
extreme loads the ends of the axle will move towards the front
of the car.  For a 12 bolt you can use a full width back brace
with a bolt in center section but for reliability a 9" would be
the way to go.  IF you could find someone to sell your rearend
to this wouldn't be that expensive a proposition.  I don't
recall exactly what chassis setup your running but the wider
your axle the more leverage effect your tubes will have to warp
the center section.  Might be something you want to check into.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 15:43:51 EDT
From: FIFTY7C@aol.com
Subject: New question on Cutlass Supreme

Can anyone tell me if the Supreme ever had a longer wheel base/longer body 
than the 442, etc.?  I read somewhere that my 68 is 4" longer than the rest 
of the Cutlasses that year.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:10:00 -0400
From: retrorockets <retrorockets@snet.net>
Subject: Re: New question on Cutlass Supreme

According to the Standard Catalog of Am. Cars, the wheelbase on the '68 Supreme

2-door and the 442 are both 112", 201.6" overall length.  The 4-door Supremes
had 116" wheelbase, 205.6" overall length.

FIFTY7C@aol.com wrote:

> Can anyone tell me if the Supreme ever had a longer wheel base/longer body
> than the 442, etc.?  I read somewhere that my 68 is 4" longer than the rest
> of the Cutlasses that year.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:46:33 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mike Smith <msmithm@gmu.edu>
Subject: Re: yahoo just bought 72 cutlass conv

On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Paul Hartlieb wrote:

> '72 350 - 180hp @ 4000rpm, 275 lb-ft torque @ 2800, 8.5/1 comp.
> 
> '76 350 - can't find any specs other than 8.5/1 comp. - Olds apparently
> wasn't giving hp/torque specs during this period - not even in the '77
> shop manual.

'76 350 - 170hp @ 3800rpm, 275 lb-ft torque @ 2400, 8.5/1 comp.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:50:02 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: yahoo just bought 72 cutlass conv

Mike Smith wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 23 Apr 1999, Paul Hartlieb wrote:
> 
> > '72 350 - 180hp @ 4000rpm, 275 lb-ft torque @ 2800, 8.5/1 comp.
> >
> > '76 350 - can't find any specs other than 8.5/1 comp. - Olds apparently
> > wasn't giving hp/torque specs during this period - not even in the '77
> > shop manual.
> 
> '76 350 - 170hp @ 3800rpm, 275 lb-ft torque @ 2400, 8.5/1 comp.

Hey, where'd you find that?????

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:02:57 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: Carlisle purchases

Got 3 original magazine road tests of an 83 Hurst Olds(12 bucks) , 67 Olds 
442 NOS front hood molding(150 bucks) , 2 slices of pizza (4bucks) ,
 2 sodas(5 bucks) , popcorn (2bucks)

Hot Rod Harry

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 15:25:44 PDT
From: "flynt myrick" <f_myrick@hotmail.com>
Subject: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching 
number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.  

I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for 
this car?  The owner wants $14,500. 

Flynt Myrick 
f_myrick@hotmail.com 
http://www.hotmail.com 


_______________________________________________________________
Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:34:32 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

Flynt:

That sounds like a cool car!

We will need much more info on this car to give you good advice. E. g. how 
old is the resto, are you sure all colors, all parts and the detailing is 
original? How many miles since the resto, are there receipts for 
everything (especially engine work and paint job), does the seller have 
the build sheet (to proof the options) and maybe the window sticker?

Just type everything you know about this car so far and you will get a 
lot of tips and input from the people on the list. Also give us the vin 
to make the basic test that this is for sure not a clone. 

At this point I think that for 14.5k it better is a perfect (in the #2 
range) car. Would be great if you found a very nice car but you will have 
to make sure that nothing is fishy with it at that you will get what you 
pay for...

TTYL,

George

On Sun, 25 Apr 1999, flynt myrick wrote:

> I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching 
> number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.  
> 
> I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for 
> this car?  The owner wants $14,500. 
> 
> Flynt Myrick 
> f_myrick@hotmail.com 
> http://www.hotmail.com 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________________________
> Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:51:14 -0700
From: Andy Lawrence <lawrencj@coral.indstate.edu>
Subject: Check your Computer TIME!

Is there any chance that i could get everyone to check, and update, there
computer time?  I am kind of sick looking all the way down my messages for the
guys that still have 1998 as their date!!!

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 17:48:34 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: non olds: Re: Check your Computer TIME!

> Is there any chance that i could get everyone to check, and update, there
> computer time?  I am kind of sick looking all the way down my messages for 
the
> guys that still have 1998 as their date!!!

Well, Andy, I think you should also try to solve the problem on your 
side: 
Get your mail program to sort the incoming mail by something else then 
the date they carry. I am sure you will be able (in any mail program) to 
sort the mails in the order they actually come in (which would be your 
pc-time). If your mail program can't do that, it is time to get another 
one... no offense... I don't know what you are using but if it gives you 
a big headache the list will sure be happy to help you if someone uses 
the same program. (I am using PINE, I see you have an .edu address, if I 
can be of any assistance with PINE, please reply privately.)

I am very sure that earlier dates will occur more and more the closer we 
get to 2k since that is the easiest way for many people to get around the 
y2k problems. 

I always sort my mail by incoming date. Otherwise I would go nuts with 
messages from all kinds of time zones around the world...

Just my 0.02 

George

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:00:46 -0400
From: Gene Gatti <jerseydevil@mindspring.com>
Subject: Rear Axle Question

Hi Guys,
   I have a '64 Cutlass with a 10 bolt rear in it and if I spin the
driveshaft one revolution the tire turns 1.5 times. The other tire turns in
the opposite direction unless I try to hold one back in which case they both
turn in the same direction. What do you make of this? After reading an
earlier post on identifying a posi rear I'm guessing that mine is not but
why do both tires turn in the same direction if I attempt to hold one back
while turning the driveshaft? And then do I have a 1.5:1 axle ratio or do I
need to double my result? I know I should just pull the cover off but I'm
too lazy at this time :-) Thanks,
Gene

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:29:07 -0400 (EDT)
From: "C. Casteel" <earthsci@POP.usit.net>
Subject: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass

Worked fine yesterday, don't work today.

Fuses are good.

Suggestions on where to start looking?

TIA.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:43:44 -0400
From: "R. Grant" <kgrant442@home.com>
Subject: 73 Quad

I was looking at the carb that I have on my 73 Olds 350 and I noticed that
the carb does not have a kick down for the Trans. Can I modify this carb to
work on my 80 Cutlass or will I have to use the carb that I have on my 307
and hope that it can be reworked to handle the 73 350. I had a 73 Delta with
a 455 and the 400 turbo and it had the kick down on the gas pedal didn't
think that the 350 had the same setup.
Any information would help.

Kevin Grant
80 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:43:19 -0600
From: "Igor Todorovic" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb

I recently bought a Edelbrock 750 carb model 1407.  I think it has a little
too big of jets for my 455 with 204/214@.050 duration and .448/.472 lift.
What jets come with these things stock and what should I try.  Seems to run
rich no matter what and it runs a little rough, I don't like it.  Thanks.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:48:40 -0400
From: Rebel1 <rebel1@raex.com>
Subject: Re: Need one or two 1971 PO-1 hubcaps.

I may have one of these - but I don't have a '71 manual to check it against
- - could you email me a picture?

Todd Daenzer
'69 rag top - 310hp tied to a Jetaway and 2.73's :-(

Dempsey, Charles wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I need one 1971 Oldsmobile 14" hubcap option code PO-1. This is the
> standard (I think) 14" hubcap that came on Cutli and VCs. It has radial
> vents near the rim, a sort of hat shape to the middle, and the chicken
> track logo in the center. Prefer excellent condition. I guess I could
> actually use a pair of them and I'd have one for a spare.
>
> I can take a picture of one of my three remaining hubcaps and send a
> copy if there's an ID problem. There is also a drawing of it in the '71
> Shop manual on page 15-56.
>
> Please reply to cdemps@lsumc.edu.
>
> Thanks,
> Charles

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:51:07 -0400
From: "R. Grant" <kgrant442@home.com>
Subject: For sale Notched Covers

I have a set of notched valve covers not sure of the engine application
willing to take best offer.
They are in good condition (chrome) not sure if this is the original
condition or been re-plated
but in all my years around Olds this is the first time that I have had a
set, I do not have a need for these covers.
I would like to know what Cutlass would use these covers

Kevin Grant
80 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:59:55 EDT
From: CChand4644@aol.com
Subject: Vin # info Please

Could someone please give me some of the specs from My 70 cutlass,
Original engine, where it was made. Anything else?
Vin #  336870Z101109
Thank you,
Chris

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:00:44 -0400
From: "RANDY A GEISEL" <RANDYGEISEL@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: 73 Quad

>I had a 73 Delta with  a 455 and the 400 turbo and it had the kick down on
>the gas pedal didn't  think that the 350 had the same setup.

The kick down cable went to the carb on 69(68?) and earlier models. I know
all 3 1970 Cutlasses I had with the th350 had the cable on the gas pedal.
Not familiar with your 1980, so I can't offer any suggestions.

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:05:07 -0400
From: "John Pajak" <jspajak@us.hsanet.net>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

Flynt wrote:

I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching
number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.
I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for
this car?  The owner wants $14,500.


**********
OOPS! AC was NOT available on any 72 W30. I'd be real suspicious of this
car!

John Pajak
1972 W30 convertible (without AC!)
+ others
http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:14:53 -0400
From: Rebel1 <rebel1@raex.com>
Subject: Re: boneyard score

Ed Binnix wrote:

> Got a hydroboost unit at a junkyard for $25, and THEY PULLED IT. Time to . .
> . . BUMP UP THE DURATION!  Rumpata-rumpata-rumpata-tada-tada-tada-rumpata
> rumpata . . . .
> "Wow, I got it to idle below 1100 RPM's!" Ugh, Ugh, more powerrrrr.

Dang!  I couldn't get one that cheap when I still owned my diesel!  Cool score!
(nice idle too!)Todd Daenzer
'69 rag top - 310hp tied to a Jetaway and 2.73's :-(

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:15:21 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass

C. Casteel wrote:
> 
> Worked fine yesterday, don't work today.
> 
> Fuses are good.
> 
> Suggestions on where to start looking?
> 
> TIA.

OH MY GOD!  IT'S CONTAGIOUS!

Seriously, I bought a new right backup light housing for the '72 at
Carlisle yesterday.  Plugged it in at the lead and grounded it in the
trunk and it worked.  I looked down at the left one and it was working,
too.  I installed the new one today.  When I checked to see that it was
working, the other one was out!  I couldn't believe it.  Took the lense
off and fooled with the bulb and got it working again.  That socket must
me bad, too...  guess I'll have to find another replacement.  Doubt that
ALL of your sockets went bad at once, though.

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:21:24 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: boneyard score

Rebel1 wrote:
> 
> Ed Binnix wrote:
> 
> > Got a hydroboost unit at a junkyard for $25, and THEY PULLED IT. 
>
> Dang!  I couldn't get one that cheap when I still owned my diesel!  

Don't suppose there's much demand for Diesel hydroboosts anymore...

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:25:37 -0400
From: J Chermack/C&M Classic Parts <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Vin # info Please

Chris

        Here's what the VIN will tell you.
3 = Oldsmobile
36 = Cutlass "S" (even numbers meant it was a V-8 car, no breakdown for 350 or
455)
87 = 2 Door Hardtop
0 = 1970
Z = Fremont, California plant
101109 = Sequential number (this indicates that the car was very early)

Jim Chermack

At 08:59 PM 4/25/1999 , you wrote:
>Could someone please give me some of the specs from My 70 cutlass,
>Original engine, where it was made. Anything else?
>Vin #  336870Z101109
>Thank you,
>Chris

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:24:49 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: Vin # info Please

CChand4644@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Could someone please give me some of the specs from My 70 cutlass,
> Original engine, where it was made. Anything else?
> Vin #  336870Z101109
> Thank you,
> Chris

3 - Oldsmobile
36 - Cutlass S
87 - Holiday Coupe
0 - 1970
Z - Fremont, CA plant
101109 - production sequence (an early one!)

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:12:07 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb

> I recently bought a Edelbrock 750 carb model 1407.  I think it has a little
> too big of jets for my 455 with 204/214@.050 duration and .448/.472 lift.
> What jets come with these things stock and what should I try.  Seems to run
> rich no matter what and it runs a little rough, I don't like it.  Thanks.

Hi Igor, 

You sure like carbs <grin>. You should go to edelbrock homepage: 
www.edelbrock.com. It has all the info you are asking for. The 1407 comes 
with a "Richer calibration for maximum perfomance", This is kind of odd 
because the 1411 (same thing with electric choke) comes with "Lean 
calibration for maximum fuel economy.") 
Here are the specs from the www.edelbrock.com/automotive/carb_square.html 
for the 1407:

Metering jets: 
Primary .113 Secondary .107 Metering Rods: .071 x .047
Step up spring: orange (5" Hg)

If this is what you have you may want to go closer to the calibration of 
the 1411. I have the 1411 on a f*rd 460 stock and it runs stong with good 
fuel economy (if you can really have that with a 5 ton car...)
Regards, George

BTW: They sell carb kits with all the rods and jets you want/need. Go to 
their homepage for more info.

- --------------------------------------------------------------
'68 Cuttlass S Conv. 
- --------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:52:50 -0400
From: "Edward Binnix" <comid@jellico.com>
Subject: hydroboost

I have to change the rod on the hydroboost unit to retrofit it to my '75.
Other than that, it's pretty much a bolt in. One problem, has anyone ever
removed the push rod from a hydroboost unit? I can't seem to get it out. Any
advise?

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:41:00 EDT
From: FIFTY7C@aol.com
Subject: 2dr vs 4 dr interior

I have found a 4 DR donor for interior (out of the area). Can someone assist 
me in determining what parts are interchangeable. I assume the dash and 
everything around the dash is but what about seats, front arm rests, package 
tray, etc.?
Thanks.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:02:42 -0400
From: Rebel1 <rebel1@raex.com>
Subject: Re: UNBOUNCE: Bad Vibrations

Greg - something you may want to check is your drive shaft angles - is it
possible that you have the tail end of your trans set too high in the
chassis - thereby throwing off the relationship of the angle of the trans to
driveshaft verses pinion to driveshaft?  Just a thought...
Todd Daenzer
'69 rag top - 310hp tied to a Jetaway and 2.73's :-(


Greg Beaulieu wrote:

> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From:   Dr-Olds@webtv.net (Dr. Olds - K. Wood)
> Subject: H*lp- Bad Vibrations!
>
> Here is a problem I really need ideas with...
> At 80 Miles per hour- or so, I get a pulsating
> vibration.  I've tried a lot of things, but I just

> can't narrow it down yet.  Here's the deal...
>
> Non-original 455 engine.  Long tail TH400,
> GTO 3.55 10 bolt rear.  15" bolt on center caps
> from a 73 or 74 Cutlass.  235 70R15's in front,
> 275 60R15's out back.
>
> Vibrates only at this speed- maybe higher too,
> haven't tried it.---
> Using same RPM range in 2nd gear- no vibration---
> Have had tires & wheels balanced- that's is not it. (even used an extra
> set of wheels- no difference)---
> Had new driveshaft made last winter- balanced.
> -
> Had rearend re-geared and rebuilt- all new everything - last year---
> The vibration is definitely not in the front end- had an alignment done-
> don't feel any vibration
> in the steering wheel whatsoever.
> ---
> This vibration has travelled from one car to
> another-  the whole drivetrain was used in my
> last Cutlass- every nut and bolt.
>
> ---I'm thinking maybe it's in the transmission now- because that's the
> only thing I haven't
> messed with.  The problem has been with me
> ever since about 7 years ago when I had the
> engine and transmission built- at the same time-  I have pretty good
> faith in the motor- but
> is it possible it could cause this vibration only
> at 80mph, but not at the same rpm under no
> or different load conditions?
>
> Sorry about the long message, but I would like
> the problem figured out.  I really thought I was on to something with
> the driveshaft...  But a brand new one- fresh tube, all new joints, and
> balanced didn't change a dang thing.
>
> Help?!?!?!?!
>
> Kevin- Hartford, WI
> Dr-Olds@webtv.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:52:47 EDT
From: CChand4644@aol.com
Subject: Re: Engine #

In a message dated 4/25/99 8:26:20 PM Central Daylight Time, plh@nbn.net 
writes:

<< 3 - Oldsmobile
 36 - Cutlass S
 87 - Holiday Coupe
 0 - 1970
 Z - Fremont, CA plant
 101109 - production sequence (an early one!)
  >>
Thanks Paul and Jim.
Where would I look on the engine to determine if it matches the vin?
Thanks,
Chris

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:06:47 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Engine #

Hi Chris

you can find the number on the left side of the block directly behind the 
alternator/power steering brackets under the head. It is stamped in a 
flat surface you can see if you bend in from the right fender side. The 
surface is about 1" wide and 1/2 high. 

    ___________
    |__head___|
  | |*        |
  --|         |
  | |_________|

This is a view of the right (drivers) side of the engine. The * indicates 
the position of the number. The nubers are about 16-18 pt. if I may use 
text processing units... It is not easy to see but you will find it if 
you keep looking around that area.

Regards, George
- --------------------------------------------------------------
'68 Cuttlass S Conv. (numbers matching)
- --------------------------------------------------------------

On Sun, 25 Apr 1999 CChand4644@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 4/25/99 8:26:20 PM Central Daylight Time, plh@nbn.net 
> writes:
> 
> << 3 - Oldsmobile
>  36 - Cutlass S
>  87 - Holiday Coupe
>  0 - 1970
>  Z - Fremont, CA plant
>  101109 - production sequence (an early one!)
>   >>
> Thanks Paul and Jim.
> Where would I look on the engine to determine if it matches the vin?
> Thanks,
> Chris
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:40:11 -0400
From: retrorockets <retrorockets@snet.net>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

John,

I'm not so sure about no A/C on all W-30s.  I believe it was available on
W-30 automatic trans cars which used a slightly tamer cam (312 deg
duration).  The 4-speed W-30s with the 328 deg cam were not available with
either A/C or power brakes, not enough vacuum at idle.  This was true for
1970 models and I believe it held true through '72, though I'm not
absolutely positive.  Anyone else know the '72s better out there?

Dude

John Pajak wrote:

> Flynt wrote:
>
> I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching
> number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.
> I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for
> this car?  The owner wants $14,500.
>
> **********
> OOPS! AC was NOT available on any 72 W30. I'd be real suspicious of this
> car!
>
> John Pajak
> 1972 W30 convertible (without AC!)
> + others
> http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:31:36 -0400
From: "M. Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

> I'm not so sure about no A/C on all W-30s.  I believe it was available on
> W-30 automatic trans cars which used a slightly tamer cam (312 deg
> duration).  The 4-speed W-30s with the 328 deg cam were not available with
> either A/C or power brakes, not enough vacuum at idle.  This was true for
> 1970 models and I believe it held true through '72, though I'm not
> absolutely positive.  Anyone else know the '72s better out there?

Doesn't the W30 option have an X in the VIN?
==============================================
Mick Gillespie, Melbourne, FL
69 Cutlass Conv.
80 Toronado Brougham
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/~mgillespie/oldspage.htm
==============================================

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:38:55 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

retrorockets wrote:
> 
> John,
> 
> I'm not so sure about no A/C on all W-30s.  I believe it was available on
> W-30 automatic trans cars which used a slightly tamer cam (312 deg
> duration).  
>
> Anyone else know the '72s better out there?

The SPECS book says the W30 option N.A. with C60 (AC).

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:43:04 -0400
From: Rebel1 <rebel1@raex.com>
Subject: Jefferson purchases (was Carlisle purchases)

Hey I just made it back from the Jefferson swap meet - unfortunately I
couldn't be there for the show today - (sorry I missed out guys - sould have
really liked to have checked out your rides!).  But anyway, after a 13 hour
drive in each direction I score the following....

    1)  A serious sunburn!  But after seeing what a swap the place was Friday
the sun was a VERY welcome thing!
    2) 4 - SSII rims with centers, but no trim rims for $20 total!
    3) 1 - (well actually my buddy ended up buying this off me one the way
back)  3.73 posi (7.5") for $150
    4) 1 - set of hood "hockey" sticks for $15
    5) 1 - driver's side grill (Supreme) for my '69 - $10!!!

In addition to this I looked at I don't know how many 10/12 bolt rear ends
trying to find a friendlier (3.73 or deeper) rear for the rag top with
little/no success.  If I would have wanted to convert to leaf springs or
convert the housing (neither a fun prospect) I could have picked from a couple
dozen different ones - but I found only two rears that fit the bill a 3.55 out
of a '68 GTO that sold just before I got to it, and a 3.91 out of a '70 with
what looked to be a vintage W-27 cover for - get this... $995!!!  Well I guess
everybody can guess that I am still hunting... :-)
Well it's about time for this sunburnt (nearly crisp) body to get some rest -
hope everybody enjoyed the sunshine this weekend!
Todd Daenzer
'69 rag top - 310hp tied to a Jetaway and 2.73's :-(  ---- Still....

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:28:15 EDT
From: Moparrp@aol.com
Subject: Re: Mopar show in So Cal this Sunday (non Olds, please excuse)

John, I don't live in  your area but I like the idea of all olds shows. They 
have had several in the St. Louis area over the years. I seemed to have 
missed the last few, any info that the rest of the olds clubs have on shows 
in different areas would be appreciated.	 
Kevin Gill
66 Cutlass
67 Fury III
68 Camaro

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 22:52:10 -0400
From: retrorockets <retrorockets@snet.net>
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

Flynt,

A couple of other things to check to verify that the car is a real W-30:
According to the Olds Restoration Guide (which does have a few goofs in it
but I hope this stuff is accurate) it should have:
        Black plastic fenderwells.
        Ga casting mark on heads.
        Aluminum intake with "OLDS W-455" raised letters.
        The letter X in the VIN number designating the 455 W-30 engine .
        The letter M in Vin number for assembly plant (I think it's the
seventh symbol in the VIN) which signifies Lansing where all W-30s were
made.

Hope this helps.  Should be a really nice car for that price.

Dude


John Pajak wrote:

> Flynt wrote:
>
> I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching
> number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.
> I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for
> this car?  The owner wants $14,500.
>
> **********
> OOPS! AC was NOT available on any 72 W30. I'd be real suspicious of this
> car!
>
> John Pajak
> 1972 W30 convertible (without AC!)
> + others
> http://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:47:45 -0400
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: SW with a DIESEL engine (fwd)

Dr. Pedro E. Andrieu wrote:
> 
> Dear Greg:
> 
> I am amazed at the number of messages and the amount of info I can get from
> most of them.
> 
> But I keep waiting for an answer for me!
> 
> APPARENTLY NOBODY KNOWS ANYTHING ABOUT A GOOD OLDS DIESEL STATION WAGON  I
> very much like to buy !!!
> 
> KEEP WAITING....
> 
> HAVE A NICE WEEKEND

You too, sir.  I know this is probably something you have already tried,
but have you searched www.traderonline.com  ?  If not, that would be the
place to start.  I looked over the last three weeks of the listings on
Bryceman's site, www.442.com and don't remember anything like that on
there for that time period.  But then I don't generally notice ads for
vehicles that new.  Good luck, because I don't think too many of those
were built.  And of the ones that were, a good many of them were changed
over to a 350 gas engine I would suspect.  Good to have you on the list,
and good luck once again.

Don Sowers
Nicholasville, Ky

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:00:05 -0400
From: J&T <tjf26@gte.net>
Subject: What are these worth

I just got some spare parts and I was wondering what these are worth.
1. 72 455 4bbl 4 speed intake.
2. 350 diesel exhaust manifolds
3. 455 valve covers. Oldsmobile written in raised letters. What are these from?

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:08:35 -0400
From: Gasman24 <stulk@bellsouth.net>
Subject: Re: Mondello Cam Specks

Igor Todorovic wrote:
> 
> Okay for those of you who know, what are Mondellos cams and their specs or
> where can I view this on the internet.  I am looking for a mild cam, but
> would like to know what he has to offer so that I can try different specs on
> the DDDyno.  Thanks.

 Hi Igor,
I've got a Mondello book here, this is a few of the spec's :

Part #  Intake    Exhaust   .050 Intake Dur   .050 Ex. Dur  Lobe Ctr.

JM-14-100  .432    .445       204               212          112

JM-16    .472      .472       210               210          114

JM-16-18  .472     .488       210               216          112

JM-18-20  .488     .496       216               226          112

 Also the book I have says the 14-100 and the JM-16 RPM range is
800-4200, very smooth idle. The JM-16-18 RPM is 800-4500, smooth idle.
And the JM-18-20 RPM range is 1000-5500, idle is Semi-smooth.

 This is quoted out of Mondello's catalog (a few years old) and I
have'nt tried any of these cams, so I'd like to see your test results,
in a 403 that is!

 Hope this h*lps you!
        Scott

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:28:17 -0400
From: "gjcouse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: Mondello Cam Specks

Scott;

Does the catalog mention if the JM-18-20  cam requires special lifters,
pushrods, or  rockers? How about the listed price?   Gary....



- -----Regards,

Gary J. Couse
Couse Custom's

ICQ# 5209322
gjcouse@francomm.com
gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com

Custom Conversion Prototype:
CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Gasman24 <stulk@bellsouth.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Sunday, April 25, 1999 11:08 PM
Subject: Re: Mondello Cam Specks

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:38:41 -0400
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: 84 Delta DIESEL FOR SALE

Sorry I couldn't find the original email from someone looking for an
Olds diesel, so I am sending this to the general list.

The following ad appeared in THE LEXINGTON HERALD LEADER newspaper (KY).
The usual disclaimers apply.  

1984 OLDS DELTA 88 ROYALE 2 DOOR DIESEL $1250
PHONE NUMBER LISTED IS 219-2056.  I WOULD ASSUME THE AREA CODE TO BE
606.  

That's the first Olds diesel of any kind I've seen advertised for a long
time.

Don Sowers
Nicholasville, Ky

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 20:37:42 -0700
From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Subject: Fwd: stickers

Does anyone reproduce these?


>X-From_: dave70ss@ici.net Sun Apr 25 19:09:15 1999
>Date: Sun, 20 Sep 1998 09:57:33 -0400
>From: dave <dave70ss@ici.net>
>Reply-To: dave70ss@ici.net
>X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I)
>To: WebMistress@hotglass.com
>Subject: stickers
>
>
>I was wondering if you could give me some leads.
>I need to replace the blue label on the inside
>of my driver's door, Which has the VIN # on it.
>Do you know of anyone who produces these?
>thanks
>dave

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 21:39:41 -0600
From: "Igor Todorovic" <igor455@home.com>
Subject: Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb

> You sure like carbs

No, they just don't like me.

>I have the 1411 on a f*rd 460 stock and it runs stong with good
> fuel economy (if you can really have that with a 5 ton car...)

You think I should notice a difference in both power and how it runs if I
went with the 1411 set-up.  Looks like a little smaller P and S jets and
M.R.s.  Thanks.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 18:30:30 -0400
From: "Raymond Dowty" <rdowty@CLEMSON.EDU>
Subject: cruise control

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01BE8F49.B26B17A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

my 1970 olds 98 has a factory cruise control but either it does not work =
or i don't know how to use it.  there is an on/off switch on the dash to =
the left of the steering wheel and some sort of a button on the turn =
signal knob on the steering column which i assumed was the set button.
1)  could someone tell me how to use this.  maybe i am just doing =
something wrong. (sorry for my ignorance, but my parents hadn't even met =
when this car was made)

or

2) where would be the best kind of place to get it fixed, that is if it =
can be fixed (i.e. if the parts exist)

thanks in advance, y'all are amazingly helpful.  i learn a lot just =
reading everyone else's questions and answers.
ray

 =20

- ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01BE8F49.B26B17A0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN">
<HTML>
<HEAD>

<META content=3Dtext/html;charset=3Diso-8859-1 =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
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</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3>my 1970 olds 98 has a =
factory cruise=20
control but either it does not work or i don't know how to use it.&nbsp; =
there=20
is an on/off switch on the dash to the left of the steering wheel and =
some sort=20
of a button on the turn signal knob on the steering column which i =
assumed was=20
the set button.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3>1)&nbsp; could someone =
tell me how to=20
use this.&nbsp; maybe i am just doing something wrong. (sorry for my =
ignorance,=20
but my parents hadn't even met when this car was made)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000>or</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3>2) where would be the best =
kind of place=20
to get it fixed, that is if it can be fixed (i.e. if the parts=20
exist)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>thanks in advance, y'all are amazingly helpful.&nbsp; i learn a lot =
just=20
reading everyone else's questions and answers.</DIV>
<DIV>ray</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"" size=3D3>&nbsp; =
</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:18:56 EDT
From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Subject: Re: 1972 442 W 30 For Sale

In a message dated 99-04-25 18:24:22 EDT, you write:

<< I have found a restored 72 442 W 30 for sale.  It is a matching 
 number car with the bench seat and automatic with A/C.  
 
 I would like to have this two owner car.  What is a good price for 
 this car?  The owner wants $14,500. 
 
 Flynt Myrick 
 f_myrick@hotmail.com 
 http://www.hotmail.com 
  >>
Well well Mr. Myrick, I hate to be a bearer of bad news.  In 1972, 442 W-30's 
were not offered with A/C.  All 772 cars were non-air cars.  Also, no W-30's 
were sold in California due to emissions.  One thing you can check to verify 
its a W car is by the vin number.  Look at the fifth digit and check for the 
letter "X".  "X" in the vin is the W-30 option for 72.  If the car does have 
a X, then I would suspect that the vin tag has been changed.

Your 72 W-30 expert
W MACHINES (Mark Prince)
two 72 442 W-30's with "X" in the vin

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:06:38 -0500
From: riksab@postoffice.swbell.net
Subject: SUBCRIBE

SUBSCRIBE

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 23:00:32 -0500 (CDT)
From: George <cutlass@one.camd.lsu.edu>
Subject: Re: Too much jets in Edelbrock carb

> > You sure like carbs
> No, they just don't like me.
LOL! You sure learn a lot about carbs!

> >I have the 1411 on a f*rd 460 stock and it runs stong with good
> > fuel economy (if you can really have that with a 5 ton car...)

> You think I should notice a difference in both power and how it runs if I
> went with the 1411 set-up.  Looks like a little smaller P and S jets and
> M.R.s.  Thanks.

Don't you have the data booklet with the carb? Did you buy the carb new 
or used?

I remember, that booklet has all the info how you can tune it, with the 
fuel/air rates etc. If you don't have that booklet, I will try to recover 
mine. I guess it will be useful even for the 1407. Since I am not a 
carb guy, all I can say is that I put my carb on that BB and it ran 
awesome with factory adjusted/calibrated carb. I am sure if yours runs to 
rich you may be able to adjust some without changing rods. Would be good 
to know if you bought it new or used! I actually can't imagine that it 
comes running such a thick (too rich) mix directly from edelbrock.

Let me know if I should dig for that 1411 data booklet to send you a 
copy. Sorry I can't be of more help. (I can remember that I pushed you in 
the edelbrock-performer direction...) 

Good Luck,

George

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 00:46:12 -0700
From: Greg Pruett <gregp@rbnet.com>
Subject: Re: cruise control

Raymond Dowty wrote:
> 
> my 1970 olds 98 has a factory cruise control but either it does not
> work or i don't know how to use it.  there is an on/off switch on the
> dash to the left of the steering wheel and some sort of a button on
> the turn signal knob on the steering column which i assumed was the
> set button.

Yes, that's the set button.

> 1)  could someone tell me how to use this.  maybe i am just doing
> something wrong. (sorry for my ignorance, but my parents hadn't even
> met when this car was made)

Well it works just like any cruise control I've seen exept there's no
accel or resume settings...It's too old for that. :)  You just drive the
speed you want to cruise at, turn on the cruise, push the button and it
should work...Just like any other cruise control exept it has no
accelerate or resume settings.  When you hit the brake the cruise shuts
off.  When you want to resume you have to accelerate back to the speed
you want and re-set the cruise.

> or
> 
> 2) where would be the best kind of place to get it fixed, that is if
> it can be fixed (i.e. if the parts exist)

It's probably pretty simple, something unhooked.  Check the fuse, the
wiring that runs to the unit and to the brake pedal, and the vacuum
hoses that are associated with it.

The cruise control uses vacuum to activate a vacuum servo that applies
the throttle as it's needed to maintain speed.  There's a regulator
assembly on the driver's side inner fender under the hood.  It's the
"brains" of the whole operation.  It has 3 wires running to it along
with some vacuum hoses and speedometer cables.  First off, make sure the
plug with the 3 wires is connected.

There's 2 vacuum hoses at the controller, one runs to the intake
manifold for vacuum, and the other runs to a "T" fitting.  The two other
ends of the T-fitting are connected to hoses that run to the brake pedal
switch and the servo.  If any of the vacuum hoses are missing or
disconnected, the cruise won't work.  The servo is just a big diaphram
mounted on the front of the engine.  It looks like a big distributor
vacuum advance diaphram.  It should have some linkage attatched that
runs to the throttle at the carbueretor. If the linkage is missing, the
cruise won't work. You can also check the servo is working by sucking
through the hose that leads to it.  It should move in as you suck and
release when you don't.

  Also, make sure the vacuum hose and 2-wire connector running to the
brake switch are attatched.  The brake switch is at the top of the pedal
assembly under the dash.  There should be an inline 5-amp fuse in the
pink wire that runs to the brake switch.  Make sure that's good.

Make sure the speedometer cables are connected at the controller.  If
they are and your speedometer works then they're both good and not
causing any trouble.  If your speedometer works and you're missing a
cable at the controller then someone has bypassed the controller and run
the speedometer cable straight to the speedometer.  

There's more to check but you really need a manual to check everything. 
I don't know who would know how to work on that stuff either.  You can
probably get it going youself if you're at least average at fixing stuff
and have a test light or meter.  You can probably find an old domestic
car manual at a local library that will cover cruise control.  

Good luck.

Greg Pruett
72 Vista Cruiser
67 Cutlass Supreme
80 Cutlass Calais
73 98 LS

------------------------------

Date: 25 Apr 99 21:45:27 PDT
From: Randy Hermsen <76Cutlass@netscape.net>
Subject: cowl taginfo lansing car!!

Wow took A good look under the new 72 convt.  very heavy frame double
thickness compared to my 76 cutlass  probably out last any car with a frame
that thick??....got info on cowl tag  ..Karl- tag is st7234267lan481653bdy
tr97053bpnt
what name is the paint ????I had two people tell me that its not a lansing car
come on are we lookin at the same vin site....vin-3j67k2m227034
the 7th one is m is that not lansing??or were you guys just pullin my leg??by
the way the car had a fire I figured by the underside of hood took out
electric fuel pump  lots of no no rubber fuel line...no starter no gen. no
battery cable no inside dash lots of work the trunk and car were full of parts
two dash boards two steering wheels lots of lights for 200.00 I got a deal
...just for 3 boxs of tools and new cables and tire chains.... ect...got a
deal 7 blade alum. fan didnt come stock did it ???
carb#7054937
3117
7-a heads
blk #395558 2   WAS BEHIND water pump at front of motor???
Got good news at car prt swap meet today in golden ears B.C. can remove whole
dash of to be crushed 72 from tow truck dude for the price of 50.00 bucks
total of car to date =$290.00 dollars 
how do I know the #s match engine and car maybe the old man put a different
motor in.?
I know Im ramblin on but can I hook up a battery too the conv. top motor to
get the top down and dry out the car for the summer while I patch it or buy a
new top??or can I just manually push the hood back the pistons do seem to have
resistance so i didnt want to force it??Also thanks to Mike SMITH for the info
on the comparison of h.p. to my 76 -72 350   close race stock .
                  Randy
                    76 cutlass supreme runnin like a rocket
                      72 cutlass supreme conv.up on blocks but lookin better
for only 3 days at our house....still grinnin from ear too ear

____________________________________________________________________
Get your own FREE, personal Netscape WebMail account today at 
http://webmail.netscape.com.

------------------------------

Date: 25 Apr 99 22:02:19 PDT
From: Randy Hermsen <76Cutlass@netscape.net>
Subject: 72 rims trailer pkge??

Hey brothers and sisters just one more ?? did any 72 cutlass supreme conv.
come with trans cooler added too in frt. of rad?? I connected the lines back
too the rad like I think it should be stock??also did all 72 s come with 14
inch rims with those screw on caps??my 76 caps just clip on  wait Ill run and
get the rim #S  ....E   M ..with a 5and a2 next to the m.anyone know about it?
                      Randy
                         76 cutlass supreme
                          72 cutlass supreme conv.

____________________________________________________________________
Get your own FREE, personal Netscape WebMail account today at 
http://webmail.netscape.com.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 00:53:39 -0500
From: Ben Markert <radu@ciris.net>
Subject: Re: Check your Computer TIME!

At 05:51 PM 4/25/99 -0700, you wrote:
>Is there any chance that i could get everyone to check, and update, there
>computer time?  I am kind of sick looking all the way down my messages for the
>guys that still have 1998 as their date!!!
>
I have heard of a server in the 'Net where you could synchronise your PC
clock with the Atomic Clock in D.C., but I dont know the addy.

Olds related: Lila's drivers side is Bondoed and primered, and she's
waiting on my lazy but to start the other side.


Ben Markert aka Radu(online)
radu@ciris.net

Olds forevah!! '
	Lila: 68 Cutlass "S", 350-4bbl, TH350


THM Homepage: HTTP://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5290/ 	"Soon 
to
be my New and Improved website about all things Me!"


The Xen Page: HTTP://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Hills/2050/

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 02:29:17 -0500
From: Brian Ammons <b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: No More Adventures From Inside The Dash

After a particularly frustrating day, I have come to several realizations.

1.	Although the wiring that I pulled out of the donor car is CLOSE to my
car's wiring, it is not the same.  This is the principle reason why my
attempts to hook up my Ralleye gauges have thus far been spectacularly
unsuccessful.

2.	My car does not have the Y67 reminder package; I say this because 
that
code is not listed on the "build sheet" sticker in the trunk.  If it did, I
feel things would be much more complicated than they now are.  This would
be unacceptable.

3.	In a car that came stock with gauges, there was no "Oil/Choke" idiot
light.  I think there should have been, but I guess some people just didn't
agree.

4.	In a car that came stock with gauges, there was both a "Temp" idiot
light, and a guage.  The idiot light was driven off of the green wire, and
the gauge was driven off the green/yellow stripe wire.

5.	The 1984 ETM states that for cars without a gauge package (my car 
stock)
AND without Y67, there is only one wire (green) coming from the Temp
Switch/Sender.  My car has TWO - one green, one green/white stripe.

6.	The ETM also states that for cars WITH gauges (no distinction made
between Y67 and no Y67), there are two wires coming from the Temp
Switch/Sender, one green and one green/yellow wire.  The ETM states that
the green wire is "To Temp Indicator", and the green/yellow wire goes to
the gauge.  At C100 (the bulkhead connector on the engine side of the
firewall), the green/yellow wire changes to green/white.  Note again that
the wires at my Temp Sender are green and green/white stripe.

7.	For cars WITH Y67, there are TWO wires, one green and one 
green/yellow
stripe.  Green/yellow stripe goes to gauges, and green goes to the temp
indicator.

8.	From 5, 6, & 7, I have determined that the wiring in my car forward 
of
the firewall does not match any wiring diagram in the ETM.  This, too, is
unacceptable.

9.	The wire that was originally installed in my stock IP wiring harness 
is
green/white stripe.  This jives with the ETM's description of my car's
wires BEHIND the firewall, but not FORWARD - remember that I have a
green/white stripe wire on my Temp Sender as well.

10.	There is only one solid green wire coming out BEHIND the firewall, 
and
this is attached to the headlamp switch/dimmer.  I posit that this wire has
nothing to do with Temperature wires at all.  I also posit that the
green/white wire from my temp sender does not go ANYWHERE aft of the
firewall.  Unacceptable.

11.	When you pull the temp wire out of the IP wiring harness, the TEMP
light does NOT go on when you start the car.

12.	With the temp wire plugged INTO the IP harness, the TEMP light goes 
on
at start whether the temp sender is plugged in or not.  This part right
here is truly troubling.

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY:

The ETM does not match my car.  My car is unable to move, because I have
the dashboard in my kitchen.  I am really tired of f*cking around with
this, as I have been very patient with it, learning more every day, and in
the end result I was doomed from the beginning.  I am going to abandon this
project tomorrow, and restore the car to non-gauges, unless somebody can
tell me why I shouldn't.

Very bitter,
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian Ammons             ICQ - 3585737
MIS Major - UT Austin  b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu
2903 Breeze Terrace    http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~ammons/
Austin, TX 78722          Home:	 (512) 236-8088 (Austin)
                                              (713) 776-2110 (Houston)
1984 Oldsmobile          Pager:	 (512) 483-8056
	Delta 88                         (713) 318-5938
		4-door
"The Party Barge"
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 04:22:48 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass

I would check the ground....



- ----------
> From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass
> Date: Sunday, April 25, 1999 8:15 PM
> 
> C. Casteel wrote:
> > 
> > Worked fine yesterday, don't work today.
> > 
> > Fuses are good.
> > 
> > Suggestions on where to start looking?
> > 
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:38:48 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: Rear Axle Question

What you have to do since its not a posi is have another person spin the non 
drive wheel as your spining the drive wheel...then you will have the correct 
rotations...Hot Rod Harry

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 08:03:56 EDT
From: SrDietW30@aol.com
Subject: Re: Carlisle(where was everyone?)

Well,  It was raining since around 8:30 or so.  I got to Carlsie around 
6:30am and started to walk around.  I was good until it started to rain.  
Once it started to rain I started going to just the Olds places just in case 
I decided to leave,  which I did around 1:00.   I did get through the car 
coral.  A lot of 72 C/S convertibles for sale.  

Steve Dietrich
  S/E PA
    71 442 W30 Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 07:56:48 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Brake and tail lights went out - '68 Cutlass

>Worked fine yesterday, don't work today.
>
>Fuses are good.
>
>Suggestions on where to start looking?
>
>TIA.
>

Chris,

Check first to see if you have voltage at the sockets.  If not, trace the 
wiring back to the fuse panel.  It should run from the right tail light
across to the left, then up the side of the trunk opening.  From there
it runs under the back  and front seats up to the under dash wiring.
I wouldn't suspect a ground since it's both sides at the same time
and each bulb has it's own ground.  The backup lights and marker
lights also run through the same harness, but are they working?
There are no connectors in the rear part of the harness that could
have come unhooked, but is there a possibility that some wires 
could have been cut?  Start with the simple stuff like bulbs and 
sockets, then start checking for voltages.  Oh, another thing, do 
the turn signals work in the rear?  In front?

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:02:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Rock Man <rockman20@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: Cutlass in a flood

I can give ya some advice here since Fargo had that
fun flood a while back. (pictures on my site if
anyone's interested.) Anyways, my friend's mom's T/A
was under water for a couple of days. The interior
still stinks from that! Even after ripping all
interior out and cleaning it. The electric
windows/locks still work. The car still works, but has
some big problems now and then. Most of it stems from
the fact that it is a 86 with the computer. Electric
tranny and such. The shops did the best they could but
couldn't guarentee anything. As far as rearend and
motor go though, drained oil, flushed em, new oil, and
they are good as new. (At least no problems as of
yet!)

- --- texas442 <texas442@flash.net> wrote:
> I have the opportunity to purchase an inexpensive 72
> Cutlass Supreme . 
> The car is basically complete except it is missing
> the motor.  Here is
> the shocker:  This car was parked in a garage
> (without a motor) when the
> river flooded about a year ago.  The entire car was
> submerged under
> water for about 12 hours.
> 
> I am asking the opinion of the list to see if this
> would be a
> salvageable car or a parts car.  The car is
> basically straight with
> minor rust in the quarters, but no major body
> damage.  I was not able to
> check the floor pans, but I assume they are rusted
> from the water.  The
> windows are good but they do not roll easily.  I
> know that the bucket
> seats and door panels are mostly damaged but what
> about other mechanical
> parts, like transmission, rear end.  I assume that
> all electrical
> components will have to be replaces (starter, alt,
> harnesses, lights,
> etc.).  What are your thoughts?  Would this be a
> salvageable car, or a
> parts car?
> 
> Ali Zalzala
> email:  texas442@flash.net
> http://www.flash.net/~texas442
> 

===
Rock-Man's Page http://www.angelfire.com/nd/RockMan
rockman20@yahoo.com
1986 Honda Accord DX
1983 Honda Big Red 3-wheeler
1981 John Deer Snowmobile
197? Massey Ferguson Snowmobile
1969 Olds Cutlass "S"
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 06:36:32 -0700 (PDT)
From: Stefan Gadecki <sgadecki@yahoo.com>
Subject: I'm back from Carlisle

  CARLISLE ROCKS!(even though it rained a LOT the second day)  I can't
wait till next year(I probably won't be going to summer or fall).  I
was there for 3 days, and I STILL didn't get to all of it!  I got a lot
of parts, and I met a bunch of people on and off of this list. 
Unfortulately, I forgot most of the names.  It was great to finally
meet you guys.  I can now finally put some faces with the words that I
read on my screen.   Anyway, to those of you who didn't make it, you
missed out on a lot.  There were a lot of really nice cars for sale, as
well as a 67? cutlass convertible for $500!  Anyway, I have to go put
my car together now, so bye.

Really Happy,
         Stefan
         1970 Cutlass 'S' Holiday Coupe
         70Cutlass@Beer.com
_________________________________________________________
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 26 Apr 1999 09:35:42 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: 1970 W-31 Pace Car, whats it worth??

This car is 1 of 1...
________

Uh, more like one of none.

First, all 1970 pace car replicas were convertibles and carry the Y74
designation on the body data plate, so they are very easy to verify.  Second,
all were white with black stripes and red accents.  70 pace car replicas came 
in
two flavors:  Cutlass Supremes with the base Supreme 350 motor and 442s with 
the
base 455 motor.  Neither the W-30 nor the W-31 were available in the pace car
that year.

Note that the car used to have A/C, but it has been removed.  You can make out 
a
patch panel in the firewall above the non-A/C heater box, covering the hole 
from
the A/C box, and of course, the A/C alternator bracket on the driver's side of
the motor.

Of course, I won't even go into the fact that the "numbers matching" 400 wasn't
available that year.

It's a nice looking car (from these internet pictures; I suspect that reality
will show more...), but obviously the car has been completely fabricated.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

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End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1924
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