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Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #1947


oldsmobile-digest        Saturday, May 8 1999        Volume 01 : Number 1947



Re: car names..
Offlist: '76 Cutlass
SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?
Re: car names..
Re: SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?
How high off the ground WAS a stock '72? (was rim choices)
Re: 700R4 vs 2004R
Re: Wait a sec! was: How much for a tach?
Re: parts wanted
car names
Back again
Re: Offlist: 1968 Canada 442
Turbo 400 long tail in A-body?
Re: Offlist: Diesel stroker
Re: SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?
Re: 700R4 vs 2004R
68 Hurst emblems
Re: 68 Hurst emblems
Re: Offlist: 1968 Canada 442
Re: Turbo 400 long tail in A-body?
Re: car names..
Re: car names..
AIr Pocket
for sale: 1963 F-85
Re: AIr Pocket
Re: How high off the ground WAS a stock '72? (was rim choices)
Re: 700R4 vs 2004R 
Re: Powder Coated Metals - Good Ground?
68 & 72 Interchangability
Re: Back again
Re: Powder Coated Metals - Good Ground?
W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs
Re: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs
Re: cranking pressure and CR..
New Olds Movie
car names
A rare part?
Re: New Olds Movie
Re: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs
W-Machine Registry
Voltage+
Re: Voltage+
Re: Voltage+
Re: Voltage+
Re: W-Machine Registry
Re: 68 Hurst emblems
Re: Voltage+
I've got the '69 now...

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 14:21:13 -0500 
From: Martin Thomas-WLTM07 <Thomas.Martin@motorola.com>
Subject: Re: car names..

My M931 in the Army (Germany) was known as "The Alligator"

As was called by an old First Sgt that said it looked like a big alligator
driving down the highway.

The name stuck.

(M931 is a "5 Ton" semi, 855 CID Cummins, 250 hp @ 2000 rpm, 1100 lb ft
torque @ 1100 rpm, 5 speed auto, dual range transfer, top speed in low trans
22 mph, 62 in high)

Thomas Martin
80 Turbo Trans AM 400 Pontiac Power!
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC
91 Bonneville LE 3800 Buick Power!

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 15:34:05 -0500
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: Offlist: '76 Cutlass

PLEASE REPLY DIRECTLY TO mailto:compucdh@arauco.reuna.cl

===========
> 
> I have an original olds cutlas s 1976 with a , 260 CID, V8
> 
> Where can I buy, the original parts of the inside of the car.
> 
> Carlos Deciv Abuleme

- --
David Brown         Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
              Sneak a peek at 5.X FAQ at:
      www.ameritech.net/users/dlbrown/oldsfaq.htm
          Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.1 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
Conserve bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
           ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 14:02:51 -0600
From: cdemps@lsumc.edu (Dempsey, Charles)
Subject: SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?

I'm *still* looking for a set of 15 X 7 wheels for the '71 VC project
that won't break the piggy (it's fractured already). My choices (in
order of preference) are;

1. SS I. Don't think they made 'em in that size.
2. SS II or III with the bolt on center.
3. SS III snap in center.
4. Keystone (forget the name) five spoke mags.

Actually I wouldn't mind having a good set of Keystones anyway.

The best I've found in the Shreveport area is a set of SS IIIs from a
'76 Cutlass.  They have severe curb rash, trashy trim rings and only one
center cap for $12.00 each (no thanks).

Now the quandry; there are scads of 15X7 Bu*ck chrome rally wheels out
there. Some of them are probably 5" bolt circle, but they look sort of
like SS Is. Unfortunately I don't have a genuine SS I to compare them
to.

How similar are Olds SS Is and Bu*ck Rallys?

Charles (trying not to think about Minilites)

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:01:46 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: car names..

My 83 Hurst Olds I call "Magic" and on the webpage area for pics of my 83 ,
I have it titled  "Black Magic"   
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/MAGSURV/index5.html">Photos of my 83 Hurst 
Olds
</A>  click on the blue...or go to my main page 
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/magsurv/">HOT ROD HARRY'S OLDSMOBILES</A> 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:05:41 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?

The buicks look good on Mr Chambles 73 cutlass on my webpage area for 73-77s  
 
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/MAGSURV1/">1973 to 1977 Cutlass Garage</A> 
click on the blue area and then go to 
"73 Cutlasses"  she looks sweet!!!  Hot Rod Harry

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:09 
From: "John Carri" <jcarri@alesis1.usa.com>
Subject: How high off the ground WAS a stock '72? (was rim choices)

From: joe lewis <lewis@amada.net>

>I have 275/60/15's 15x7 centerline rims on the rear of my 72 the car 
>is about 2'' lower than stock and they never rub.
____________________________________

Geez, a 275/60/15 tire is 28 inches tall, not exactly a small size! If 
your '72 is 2" lower than stock with these, just *how* big was the 
factory original tire?

My '72 Supreme has 225/60/16 tires, 26.6" tall, about an inch and a 
half shorter than your tires, I have the Hotchkiss "1-inch lowering" 
springs all around, and my car still stands way too high off the 
ground for my tastes, it looks absurdly tall next to my RoadRunner 
which is both lower and wider, and the combination of high centre of 
gravity and relatively narrow track width of my Olds isn't helping the 
handling any. I need to get those B-body spindles in there just to 
drop the front end another inch...

Anyone know how high off the ground a factory-stock '72 Supreme was? 
Measured at a suitable point, say the underside of the frame in 
between the wheelwells, or the topmost point of the wheelwell lip?

- -John Carri

'72 Supreme    (getting new balljoints and new poly LCA bushings this
                weekend, if all goes well!)

'73 RoadRunner (badly in need of a total front suspension rebuild) 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:25:40 -0400 (EDT)
From: Bob Valentine <ravalent@liii.com>
Subject: Re: 700R4 vs 2004R

 
> I'm not knowledgeable about the relative torque-handling capacity of 
> the 700R4 and 2004R transmissions, but if built to be adequately 
> strong, the 2004R may be an inherently better choice. 

However, the 2004R is a much lighter duty trans than the 700.  No matter
you'd have to beef the 2004R a lot more than the 700 to handle the same
amount of torque.

> that the 700R4 has an extremly deep 1st gear ratio - I think it's 
> around 3.06:1 - and consequently a huge rpm drop when shifting from 
> 1st to 2nd gear. John Lingenfelter in his book on high-performance 

That's true - but it's also great for moving a heavy pig off the line!
I've got one (a 700) behind my 403, and it's incredible on takeoff.  The
shift to 2nd doesn't really seem to drop me out of the powerband.  The
3.06:1 first lets me get up into the powerband quickly instead of bogging
down with a 2.48 (T400 first gear).

> Plus it's available in the BOP pattern. 

That's true.  I've used an adapter plate behind my motor for over a year,
no problems yet.

> -John Carri
> '72 Supreme
> '73 RoadRunner

                     -->   Bob Valentine  <--  
                    -->   bob@tecmark.com  <--
        "Experience varies directly with equipment ruined"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 16:16:45 -0500
From: Brian Ammons <b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: Wait a sec! was: How much for a tach?

>Hang on!

OK.

>
>Is this an Analog meter?
>

Yes.

>If it is, then it is the one Karl has, and is quite happy with.

Perfect.

>
>Used on a 1965 88 car (bigger than modern Caddys), the power leads can 
>contact battery positive and alternator case (negative), and reach the coil 
>terminals, with the acutual meter resting atop the cowl in front of the 
>windsheild so that one can view dwell angle whilst turning the key to crank 
>the starting motor!
>
>How's that for one-person troubleshooting!

I think it sounds like GREAT one-person troubleshooting.  I also think that
I'm going to go buy it today (probably later today though, so if anybody
wants to try and stop me, you have time).
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian Ammons             ICQ - 3585737
MIS Major - UT Austin  b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu
2903 Breeze Terrace    http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~ammons/
Austin, TX 78722          Home:	 (512) 236-8088 (Austin)
                                              (713) 776-2110 (Houston)
1984 Oldsmobile          Pager:	 (512) 483-8056
	Delta 88                         (713) 318-5938
		4-door
"The Party Barge"
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:16:11 -0400
From: "steve harris" <meso@pamlico.net>
Subject: Re: parts wanted

I think I can help with some of this.
1)  Do you mean the filler piece that follows down the back seat?  If so I
do have extra pieces.
2)Sorry on this one.  All I can say is hit the rust farms.  I had a hell of
a time finding a good set.  They help guide the window into place,  and are
worth the search.
3)Give me some time on this one.  I think I have an extra set,  but I have
to search the piles for them.
4)Sorry on this one as well.  The Stainless screws are available at hardware
stores or Year One.
meso@pamlico.net
Steve
North Carolina
ICQ#26466860
http://members.xoom.com/DR_OLDS/442index.html
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Stefan Gadecki <sgadecki@yahoo.com>
To: oldsmobile mailinglist <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 1999 3:04 PM
Subject: parts wanted


>
>   I'm looking for a few parts for my 1970 Cutlass 'S' Holiday Coupe.
> Here's the list:
>
>     1.  Driver's side end piece to the package tray trim piece.  It's a
> metal piece that goes on the end of an approx 2-3" wide metal strip
> that is the same color as the interior of the car in the rear drivers
> side corner of the car at the bottom of the rear window (interior).
>
>     2.  Driver's side door window upper front corner chrome? stainless?
> metal trim piece.  All I need is the little corner 'elbow' piece with
> the plastic triangular thing on it (exterior).
>
>     3.  Trink lid tin? Stainless? edge moulding.  Not the 3 pieces on
> the actual trunk lid, but the 2 aprox 2" curved pieces that screw into
> the quarters.  I have my rear bumper off, so If I could get these
> really soon, that would be great, so that I don't have to pull my
> bumper back off again to put those little pieces on.
>
>     4.  Rear Driver's side stainless wheel opening trim w/screws if
> possible.
>
> Anyway, these are the parts that I need.  I have had some difficulty
> locating these parts, as they are not reproduced.  I met a few people
> at Carlisle that either had these parts or parts cars that these parts
> could be gotten from.  Unfortunately I don't remember any of their
> names.
>
>    If anyone has any of these parts, Please e-mail me privately at
> 70Cutlass@Beer.com
>
> TIA,
>  Stefan
>  1970 Cutlass 'S' Holiday Coupe
>  70Cutlass@Beer.com
> _________________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 14:41:53 -0700 (PDT)
From: Scott Geiger <geiger_scott@yahoo.com>
Subject: car names

OK, since you asked:

I am currently running a '70 Oldsmo-buick Cut-lark (ya know, half
Cutlass, half Skylark!) as a asphalt short-track Enduro stock car.

Now, you may ask which half is the Olds, and which half is the Buick?
Well the front and rear bumpers, front fenders and hood are Olds, the
rest of the body, engine and drivetrain are Buick.

Her name is "Bossie" because my kids helped with the paint job, and
decided that the hood, trunklid and numbers would be painted in white
with black cow spots!

I am currently working on an '84 Cutlass to replace her, who will be
known as "Bessie" (same basic paint scheme because the kids who come to
the track love it!)







===
Scott Geiger
Beaverdam, VA
'Racing for fun, not money!'
'70 OldsmoBuick Cutlark Stock Car
_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 16:53:22 -0500
From: "Lou Biggs" <lbiggs@intertek.net>
Subject: Back again

How you all doing, still down with back. Will try to keep up, missed
everyone. Trying again, have better pills now!

Lou (Master) Biggs
lbiggs@intertek.net
oca#31353

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:52:33 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Offlist: 1968 Canada 442

>    I own a 1968 442 hardtop that was built in Canada. The car has a automatic
> trans
>    and shifter on the column and bench seat. At the national meet in Lansing
> Mich.
>    I asked 442 owners about this and none new that any had been built in
> Canada....
>  Thank you! WatkinsII@AOL.COM
_______

Oldsmobile absolutely built 442s in Canada.  They can be identified by the
number "1" as the seventh character of the VIN.  US-built cars will have a
letter in this position to signify the build plant location.  The letter "M",
for example, signifies a Lansing-built car.  My first 442 (which I bought back
in 1974) was a 1968 which had been built in Canada.  The Canadian cars all came
with the Chevy "Type C" 12-bolt rear axle as opposed to the "Type O" used on 
the
US-built cars.

While bucket seats were standard on the 442, the bench seat was optionally
available for a price credit that year.  Additionally, the column shifter was
standard when you got the TH400 trans; the floor shifter and console were an
extra cost option.

The people you were talking to at Lansing may have confused the 442 with the
W-30.  All W-30 cars were built in Lansing (due to the hand-assembled "select
fit" engines), so obviously there were no Canadian-built W-30s.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 18:03:17 -0400
From: retrorockets <retrorockets@snet.net>
Subject: Turbo 400 long tail in A-body?

Anybody have experience running a Turbo 400 long tail in an A-body?  Is
there more to it than just a driveshaft length change?  Is there a
problem with pinion angle?  Does it mount in the same place?

GM must have had a good reason to come up with the different length
tails on those trannies.

Dude

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:59:04 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: Offlist: Diesel stroker

> Would love to email and talk with some one about this.
_________

While you can certainly build a diesel block stroker (and may have), I think 
the
real problem is that when all is said and done, a stock 455 Olds will still
weigh less unless you spend a lot of time lightening the diesel block.
Meanwhile, you will have spent the money on a cut-down crank, custom pistons,
and custom balancing.  Your 451 small block really wants big-block heads (due 
to
the larger ports), which will in turn require an Edelbrock Performer with the
ports machined out to match.

Unless you have a real size constraint, or just have to have a small block Olds
(say, for example, you were going to put this in a 64 442 and wanted it to look
stock), I think you'll be dollars ahead by just building a 455 big block.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:05:39 -0400
From: Padavano.Joe@Orbital.COM
Subject: Re: SS I vs Bu*ck Rally wheels. How similar?

How similar are Olds SS Is and Bu*ck Rallys?
________

Not at all.  The SSI is basically the Magnum 500 wheel used by all the major
auto manufacturers at one time or another.  The Olds version came in a couple 
of
flavors:

1966-69 All chrome - won't clear disc brakes
1970 painted with trim ring - will clear discs
1971 (?) all chrome - will clear discs

All of these are either 14x6 or 14x7.  You can get custom-made 15x7s and use
Chevy trim rings, but you'll spend big bucks.

Joe Padavano
padavano.joe@orbital.com

66 442
68 W-30
69 H/O
69 442
70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 06 May 1999 18:12:21 -0400
From: Brian Shankle <cshankle@home.com>
Subject: Re: 700R4 vs 2004R

My Caddy has a 700R4 (right behind the 307 Olds :).)  I can't say enough
good things about its takeoff, and it certainly feels a hell of a lot
stronger than that recently rebuilt non-overdrive 200 in the Cutlass.  I
still have to put that TCC solenoid in it tomorrow though. (Ugh).
Brian.

Bob Valentine wrote:
> 
> 
> > I'm not knowledgeable about the relative torque-handling capacity of
> > the 700R4 and 2004R transmissions, but if built to be adequately
> > strong, the 2004R may be an inherently better choice.
> 
> However, the 2004R is a much lighter duty trans than the 700.  No matter
> you'd have to beef the 2004R a lot more than the 700 to handle the same
> amount of torque.
> 
> > that the 700R4 has an extremly deep 1st gear ratio - I think it's
> > around 3.06:1 - and consequently a huge rpm drop when shifting from
> > 1st to 2nd gear. John Lingenfelter in his book on high-performance
> 
> That's true - but it's also great for moving a heavy pig off the line!
> I've got one (a 700) behind my 403, and it's incredible on takeoff.  The
> shift to 2nd doesn't really seem to drop me out of the powerband.  The
> 3.06:1 first lets me get up into the powerband quickly instead of bogging
> down with a 2.48 (T400 first gear).
> 
> > Plus it's available in the BOP pattern.
> 
> That's true.  I've used an adapter plate behind my motor for over a year,
> no problems yet.
> 
> > -John Carri
> > '72 Supreme
> > '73 RoadRunner
> 
>                      -->   Bob Valentine  <--
>                     -->   bob@tecmark.com  <--
>         "Experience varies directly with equipment ruined"

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 17:55:46 -0500
From: "James L. Brownfield" <olzracer@peaknet.net>
Subject: 68 Hurst emblems

Hi all,

My first posting..... I am looking for a good reproduction of the fender
and deck lid emblems for a 68 Hurst/Olds. I just got a set from The
Parts Place, and they are not a duplicate of the original, as they
claimed.

If no reproductions are available, my old emblems just need to be
replated, anybody know of a place to get this done????

These emblems are plastic, btw.

Thanx,

Jim

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:15:10 EDT
From: HURSTOLDZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: 68 Hurst emblems

In a message dated 5/7/99 4:00:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time, 
olzracer@peaknet.net writes:

<< olzracer@peaknet.net >>
Hey Jim

Also an Idea     since they made casts of mine  and yours are right,  maybe 
they can make a cast from your emblems?????

Please let me know  thanks

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:24:27 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Offlist: 1968 Canada 442

>Oldsmobile absolutely built 442s in Canada.  They can be identified by the
>number "1" as the seventh character of the VIN.  US-built cars will have a
>letter in this position to signify the build plant location.  

As a footnote, something I noticed on a 69 442 that I worked on once was
that on the cowl plate it had "Made in Canada" or something to that effect
plain as day.  Pretty hard to miss.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:34:15 -0600
From: "Travis Adams" <olds442@mcn.net>
Subject: Re: Turbo 400 long tail in A-body?

I have a long tail in my 65.  You have to drill new crossmember mount holes
in the frame further aft.  Whoever did mine was a quarter inch off side to
side and I get a vibration around 3200 rpm as a result(soon to be remedied).
Shorten the drive line, pinion angle should be OK.  Just make sure that
crossmember is right.

- -----Original Message-----
From: retrorockets <retrorockets@snet.net>
To: Olds Email List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Friday, May 07, 1999 3:55 PM
Subject: Turbo 400 long tail in A-body?


>Anybody have experience running a Turbo 400 long tail in an A-body?  Is
>there more to it than just a driveshaft length change?  Is there a
>problem with pinion angle?  Does it mount in the same place?
>
>GM must have had a good reason to come up with the different length
>tails on those trannies.
>
>Dude
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:56:20 -0700
From: "Peter Berusch" <berusch@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: car names..

  1970 98 LS Holiday sedan - blue in color - Big Blue
  1969 98 LS Holiday sedan - green in color - The Hornet
  1966 98 convertible - red in color - Redzilla
  1967 Delta Custom coupe - Once suspected as being involved in a fatal hit
and run accident - Jerry Lee
  The others have not presented their personalities.  Consequently, they
have not been named.
   Peter.

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 20:42:56 -0500
From: Brian Ammons <b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu>
Subject: Re: car names..

My first car, a 1984 Oldsmobile Delta 88 RB 2-door, white with blue
interior, did not have a name until it got stolen and I was forced to
repair it (sans paint job) with a light blue front end and a dark blue
fender.  My girlfriend and I thought it looked like something Kevin Arnold
(from "The Wonder Years") would deliver Chinese food in, thus:  The General
Joe.

My second car, a 1994 Firebird, was always trying to kill me, and I didn't
really want to give it a name.  Based on my installation of a Flowmaster,
my best friend came up with: The General Flow.

My third (and current) car - well, it's The Party Barge.  It's not a
yahcht, it's not a speedboat (for SURE) - it's a BARGE, and it's always a
party.
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brian Ammons             ICQ - 3585737
MIS Major - UT Austin  b_ammons@mail.utexas.edu
2903 Breeze Terrace    http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~ammons/
Austin, TX 78722          Home:	 (512) 236-8088 (Austin)
                                              (713) 776-2110 (Houston)
1984 Oldsmobile          Pager:	 (512) 483-8056
	Delta 88                         (713) 318-5938
		4-door
"The Party Barge"
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 20:46:31 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: AIr Pocket

I may have an air pocket in my cooling system because when the thermostat
opens I sometimes get a real quick jump in my temperature gauge. Ususally a
quick 40 degree jump up and then it comes down real quick. Is this bad to
have? SHould I try and get it out?

Pettrix@prodigy.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 20:59:21 -0500
From: Mike Nigus <liquor@midusa.net>
Subject: for sale: 1963 F-85

63 F-85 wagon online photos avail. for more details liquor@midusa.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 22:22:19 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: AIr Pocket

>I may have an air pocket in my cooling system because when the thermostat
>opens I sometimes get a real quick jump in my temperature gauge. Ususally a
>quick 40 degree jump up and then it comes down real quick. Is this bad to
>have? SHould I try and get it out?
>
>Pettrix@prodigy.net


Peter,
I think I may know what is happening.  When the thermostat is
closed you have higher coolant pressure in the block.  When the
thermostat opens the flow shifts to the radiator.  This pressure
combined with sudden venting allows more coolant out of the
engine than the water pump is bringing in.  This lets the coolant
level in the engine drop enough that your sensor is reading nothing
but air as opposed to being submerged in coolant.  After the sudden
gush of coolant going to the radiator the pump catches up and fills
the block back up.  There is nothing harmful in this but there are a
couple things to look for.

1)  Sensor location:  Some aftermarket sending units give you
    adapters to fit various intakes that will make the sender sit
    very high on the intake.  A shorter adapter would be the first
    thing to try to get.
2)  Thermostat:  A high flow thermostat will allow more of the
    coolant to exit the engine when it opens.  Do you have one
    in there now?  If so, a stock type could cure the whole thing.
3)  Water pump:  A higher flow pump will flow more for the same
    amount of rpm, thus filling the block back up faster when the
    thermostat opens.
4)  Idle speed:  If your engine idles very low this can compound
    #3.  Try raising your idle 300 rpm and see if it does it the same.
    If it goes away, the problem is verified.

Now a word on air pockets.  I see air pockets blamed for everything
from bad water pumps to loose belts.  Air pockets are a serious
problem on certain cars but only if certain conditions exist.  1)  The
radiator fill cap is lower than the thermostat.  2)  The rear of the engine
sits higher than the front of the engine.  The air pocket is kept in the
engine only if it has no way to escape.  The air will collect at the
thermostat since it is the highest part of the cooling system in the engine.
Then the air will go up the radiator hose to the radiator and out the cap.
You can raise the front of the car to make the cap even higher than the
thermostat if your having problems, but the only real cure for a car that
fits with #1 and/or #2 is to convert to an expansion type cooling system
and install a bleeder screw on top of the highest part of the cooling
system.
Both are fairly simple to do.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 07 May 1999 23:24:32 -0400
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: How high off the ground WAS a stock '72? (was rim choices)

John Carri wrote:

> Anyone know how high off the ground a factory-stock '72 Supreme was?
> Measured at a suitable point, say the underside of the frame in
> between the wheelwells, or the topmost point of the wheelwell lip?

According to the assembly manual:

Front measurement taken 1.00 from the front edge of the front door. 
Rear measurement taken 64.10 from the front measurement.  Measurement is
taken from the outer bottom edge of the rocker panel, not the inner
pinchweld.  Tire pressures at 24psi, full fuel tank, no passengers or
added weight, front seat in the rear-most position, trunk empty except
for spare and jack.

Front measurement of an A body coupe with standard suspension and A/C is
10.25.  Front measurement with F42 suspension is 10.75.  Front
measurement with FE2 suspension is 9.81.

Rear measurements in the same order are 10.05, 10.55 and 9.68.

Service specifications are .20 less to allow for spring settling.

Tolerances in productions are +/- .40, tolerances in service are +
.50/-.80.

Differences side-to-side are a max of .50 is production and a max of .75
in service.

Service tolerances reflect normal tire wear and weight build-up with
miles.

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
mailto:plh@nbn.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:25:51 EDT
From: Tbone6944@aol.com
Subject: Re: 700R4 vs 2004R 

As far as torque abilities I prefer the 700 over the 2004R!  The reason is 
because the 700 is built on the principal of the 350 and the 200R is build on 
the principal of the 200.  There is no support in the tailhousing!!!!!!! It 
is one solid case. The 700 has a case bushing to support the output shaft. 
68Fan

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:20:16 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Powder Coated Metals - Good Ground?

>I was wondering if powder coated metals make a good ground. Or is it better
>to scrape off the area where the ground bolt is bolted to. My core support
>is powder coated and the lights are grounded to the core support. They work
>but the area where the bolt attaches to is not scraped off. Could this be
>causing my lights to act funny sometimes.
>
>Pettrix@prodigy.net
>
Instead of scraping off the powdercoating you could use the bolt to
ground it.  Clean both the bolt and the threads.  If the bolt doesn't
have a big enough head, use a washer but get everything nice and
clean.  This will let it ground through the bolt and into the threaded
area which is a solid contact itself.  May need to run a tap to get
the threads nice and clean though.

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 23:50:13 -0500
From: "Mike Bloomer" <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
Subject: 68 & 72 Interchangability

OK, I've saw someone parting out a 72 on the list and this got me to 
wondering about the rocker panel I need on my 68.  These cars are
awfully similar but are the rocker panels the same?  I know that a lot
of the body parts like fenders will interchange (forgetting panel 
alignment) physically, but it seems to me that the rockers may be
identical.  Anybody know if I can pull the rockers off of a 70-72 to go
on my 68?  What about floor pan sections like the toe board?  I know
of a couple in yards around here that would be good donors but don't
want to spend the money if they won't align.

TIA

Mike Bloomer
mbloomer@mindspring.com
ICQ# 19113713
http://members.tripod.com/CutlassFreak/

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 00:10:14 -0500
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@cwix.com>
Subject: Re: Back again

what kind can I have some:)
- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: Lou Biggs <lbiggs@intertek.net>
To: Olds List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 1999 4:53 PM
Subject: Back again


> How you all doing, still down with back. Will try to keep up, missed
> everyone. Trying again, have better pills now!
> 
> Lou (Master) Biggs
> lbiggs@intertek.net
> oca#31353
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 01:40:04 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Powder Coated Metals - Good Ground?

On a72 442 there is 1 ground on the right side and 1 ground on the left
side of the core support that grounds out the front driving, turn signal
and parking lights. Correct? 
What other grounds should I look for in that area?

Pettrix@prodigy.net

- ----------
> From: Mike Bloomer <mbloomer@mindspring.com>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: Powder Coated Metals - Good Ground?
> Date: Friday, May 07, 1999 11:20 PM
> 
> >I was wondering if powder coated metals make a good ground. Or is it
better
> >to scrape off the area where the ground bolt is bolted to. My core
support
> >is powder coated and the lights are grounded to the core support. They
work
> >but the area where the bolt attaches to is not scraped off. Could this
be
> >causing my lights to act funny sometimes.
>> Mike Bloomer

------------------------------

Date: 8 May 99 00:38:10 PDT
From: Randy Hermsen <76Cutlass@netscape.net>
Subject: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs

Hi list 
 W-z ex. man.s installation is on hold due to purchase of 72 cutlass supreme
conv....she needs lots of care up on blocks havnt even turned her over
yet....put the whole dash together last night...also have a serious bone
yardin spree went last weekend goin again this weekend lots of fun ...need a
couple pieces trim head light rims  14 inch beaty rims pass. mirror,trunk lid
I hope ..is the conv. trunk lid the same size as a hardtop model???
will post specs on fuel pump Mick gotta run
seea 


                           Randy
                             76 cutlass supreme
                               72 cutlass supreme conv.
                                 86 dodge van(with new 500.00 trany ouch   







____________________________________________________________________
Get your own FREE, personal Netscape WebMail account today at 
http://webmail.netscape.com.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:01:21 EDT
From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Subject: Re: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs

In a message dated 99-05-08 03:39:04 EDT, you write:

<< put the whole dash together last night...also have a serious bone
 yardin spree went last weekend goin again this weekend lots of fun ...need a
 couple pieces trim head light rims  14 inch beaty rims pass. mirror,trunk lid
 I hope ..is the conv. trunk lid the same size as a hardtop model??? >>

Umm...

For same year, 2dr trunk (decklid ?) same as 2dr decklid.

If you got ~lots~ of 72 peices, post about those you saw, but did not need.
Likly to be others that do need.

Good luck!

SOM

&KA

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 05:33:00 EDT
From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Subject: Re: cranking pressure and CR..

In a message dated 99-05-07 14:50:09 EDT, you write:

<< PV = nRT tells you what any one of P, V, or T does, IF you know what the 
other two do.  In this case, we don't!  >>

Well, actually, we do!

Or we can, mebbe.

The best scenario is to assume an engine at operating temperature!

In that case, the cylinder walls and cylinder head are at a nearly constant 
temperature (as far as we are concerned).

So although not a closed system, we can make good assumptions about the 
non-closed system.

So, n is a constant when the intake valve closes, R is a constant 0.08124 or 
some such for MKS metric systems, and T we can assume to be affected by the 
cylinder walls.

So, we end up with P= nRT/V where t is actually increasing due to engine 
operating temperatures, and we can imply values for V depending on piston 
position in our model.

In short, it is very possible to fabricate a function for T such that it 
increases in temprature relative to the engine block during the brief period 
it is in the cylinder.

What??

<< Also, I was trying to calculate cranking pressure, with no ignition, and 
as a result, no stew of different chemicals. >>

No ignition??

Oh, you're no fun anymore!

SOM

&KA

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 19:11:22 +0900
From: Nick Dean <freewolf@msa.attmil.ne.jp>
Subject: New Olds Movie

Hey listers,

We had a thread going on movies with Olds a couple weeks ago, but I
never heard of this one before today.  I rented it cause it had a shot
of a beautiful black '70 442 with the Hurst hood scoop (what option was
that available as, besides getting a Hurst/Olds?) and nitrous, being
chased by four Texas smokeys.  It almost made my favorite movie of all
time, except the ending didn't meet my taste.  Those of you who've seen
it know what I'm talking about.  I'm still gonna buy it if I find it for
sale.  Oh, yeah, it's called Black Cat Run.

Nick Dean
'72 Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 08:29:47 -0400
From: "B. Vosburgh" <bob442@svic.net>
Subject: car names

My 68 is hugger orange ,the kind of color that you like or hate. Well at
the track a couple of years ago everyone in the group where asking who
had the better time slip. It happend to be me and one of the guys said
whare going to have to slow down ole vitamin c . Now the car has its
name on the back glass   Vitamin C               Butch  68  442

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 08:04:30 -0600
From: "rollin domire" <jackandmc@networld.com>
Subject: A rare part?

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_007A_01BE9929.66F391A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


I am writing to ask for help in what seems to be a rare auto part.I just =
bought a 1968 (cherry) OLDS Delta 88. The rare part is the "nut" that =
holds the ignition switch to the dash. Can anyone help me find this rare =
jewel? You're help is most appreciated. JACK

- ------=_NextPart_000_007A_01BE9929.66F391A0
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2014.210" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I am writing to ask for help in what seems to be a =
rare auto=20
part.I just bought a 1968 (cherry) OLDS Delta 88.&nbsp;The rare part is =
the=20
"nut" that holds the ignition switch to the dash. Can anyone help me =
find this=20
rare jewel? You're help is most appreciated. =
JACK</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

- ------=_NextPart_000_007A_01BE9929.66F391A0--

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 09:07:39 -0500
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@cwix.com>
Subject: Re: New Olds Movie

that ones been up before it was on hbo last year, but does anyone remember
the 70 vista in Vacation?
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Nick Dean <freewolf@msa.attmil.ne.jp>
To: Olds Mailing List <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Saturday, May 08, 1999 5:11 AM
Subject: New Olds Movie


> Hey listers,
>
> We had a thread going on movies with Olds a couple weeks ago, but I
> never heard of this one before today.  I rented it cause it had a shot
> of a beautiful black '70 442 with the Hurst hood scoop (what option was
> that available as, besides getting a Hurst/Olds?) and nitrous, being
> chased by four Texas smokeys.  It almost made my favorite movie of all
> time, except the ending didn't meet my taste.  Those of you who've seen
> it know what I'm talking about.  I'm still gonna buy it if I find it for
> sale.  Oh, yeah, it's called Black Cat Run.
>
> Nick Dean
> '72 Supreme
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 08 May 1999 09:10:06 -0500
From: Kerry Kroger <kerryk@cwix.com>
Subject: Re: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs

the deck lid should be the same as a hardtop supreme, or a four door but not
a cutlass S 2 dr HT
- ----- Original Message -----
From: Randy Hermsen <76Cutlass@netscape.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Saturday, May 08, 1999 2:38 AM
Subject: W-Zex.man.fuel pmp specs


> Hi list
>  W-z ex. man.s installation is on hold due to purchase of 72 cutlass
supreme
> conv....she needs lots of care up on blocks havnt even turned her over
> yet....put the whole dash together last night...also have a serious bone
> yardin spree went last weekend goin again this weekend lots of fun ...need
a
> couple pieces trim head light rims  14 inch beaty rims pass. mirror,trunk
lid
> I hope ..is the conv. trunk lid the same size as a hardtop model???
> will post specs on fuel pump Mick gotta run
> seea
>
>
>                            Randy
>                              76 cutlass supreme
>                                72 cutlass supreme conv.
>                                  86 dodge van(with new 500.00 trany ouch
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________
> Get your own FREE, personal Netscape WebMail account today at
http://webmail.netscape.com.
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 10:45:44 EDT
From: DROLDS350@aol.com
Subject: W-Machine Registry

Hello,
	If anyone remembers, I tried getting a registry for W-Machines about 
a year ago. I sent something to the list asking for anyone with a 66-72 
W-Machine to e-mail me with info. I am going to try this again with a new 
computer and database. 
	I had about 20 cars before my computer broke and I lost all the 
information. If you own a 66-72 Olds W-Machine please e-mail me with the 
following info:
Car	Year	Color	Transmission	Owner	Interior 
Color	Stripe Color	
Rear Axle	Vin		Engine			
Please e-mail me this info to: <A 
HREF="mailto:drolds350@aol.com">drolds350@aol.com
</A> with the subject, W-Machines.
	Anyone who had e-mailed me before with info, if you could please 
resend it to me I would greatly appreciate it!
Thanks!
Jim McKeague
1970 Rally 350
1970 Cutlass W-31

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 11:25:36 -0500
From: "Peter Landowski" <PETTRIX@prodigy.net>
Subject: Voltage+

I was wondering if it isOK to have between 14.0 - 15 .10 volts being put
out when the car is first started. After about 10 minutes it will go down
to 14.5 volts. This is on a 72 442 with an external voltage regulator...


Pettrix@prodigy.net

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 12:30:41 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: Voltage+

thats high compared to my 83 Hurst Olds...the volts read at 9 when I start 
her and then around 10 when she is running...sounds like your car is charging 
on the high side...the alternator on the 83 is a 78 amp....

Maybe your battery has a low charge. or the regulater is being stuck open 
when the car is off and drains the battery...or maybe my gage is off or yours 
is off   ....Hot Rod Harry 

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 12:37:30 EDT
From: LOUS69W30@aol.com
Subject: Re: Voltage+

In a message dated 5/8/99 12:34:29 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
Four42much@aol.com writes:

<< thats high compared to my 83 Hurst Olds...the volts read at 9 when I start 
 her and then around 10 when she is running...sounds like your car is 
charging 
 on the high side...the alternator on the 83 is a 78 amp....
  >>
I always thought normal charging voltage when a car was running at idle 
should be around 14.5, if it's only 10 the battery would die.

Lou Principe
69 442 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 12:49:50 -0400 (EDT)
From: Bob Valentine <ravalent@liii.com>
Subject: Re: Voltage+

> I was wondering if it isOK to have between 14.0 - 15 .10 volts being put
> out when the car is first started. After about 10 minutes it will go down
> to 14.5 volts. This is on a 72 442 with an external voltage regulator...

Sounds about right for startup, since it's recharging the battery.  The
14.5 is just on the high side of normal.  As long as you're not boiling
the water out of the battery I wouldn't worry.

> Pettrix@prodigy.net

                     -->   Bob Valentine  <--  
                    -->   bob@tecmark.com  <--
        "Experience varies directly with equipment ruined"

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:16:39 -0400
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: Re: W-Machine Registry

Jim

I think this is a good idea but I have one small note to make.
Wouldn't one think that the person starting this type of page, be able to
spell Rallye 350 Correctly.
Take a look at you signature 

PS - I'll forward the info on My Rallye and My W-31

Robert Schinkel   docbob@caninet.com
Niagara Falls,    Canada   905-357-4454




- ----------
> From: DROLDS350@aol.com
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Cc: DROLDS350@aol.com
> Subject: W-Machine Registry
> Date: Saturday, May 08, 1999 10:45 AM
> 
> Hello,
> 	If anyone remembers, I tried getting a registry for W-Machines about 
> a year ago. I sent something to the list asking for anyone with a 66-72 
> W-Machine to e-mail me with info. I am going to try this again with a new

> computer and database. 
> 	I had about 20 cars before my computer broke and I lost all the 
> information. If you own a 66-72 Olds W-Machine please e-mail me with the 
> following info:
> Car	Year	Color	Transmission	Owner	
Interior Color	Stripe Color	
> Rear Axle	Vin		Engine			
> Please e-mail me this info to: <A 
> HREF="mailto:drolds350@aol.com">drolds350@aol.com
> </A> with the subject, W-Machines.
> 	Anyone who had e-mailed me before with info, if you could please 
> resend it to me I would greatly appreciate it!
> Thanks!
> Jim McKeague
> 1970 Rally 350
> 1970 Cutlass W-31

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:21:29 -0400
From: "steve harris" <meso@pamlico.net>
Subject: Re: 68 Hurst emblems

Clean the emblems real well,  and paint them!  Use Testors paint(you know,
the stuff you use for model cars),  and make l drops in the ares where the
paint was.  Do not brush the paint in.  Slowly add drops and connect them to
form a solid line.  Its easy to do it just takes time.
meso@pamlico.net
Steve
North Carolina
ICQ#26466860
http://members.xoom.com/DR_OLDS/442index.html
- ----- Original Message -----
From: James L. Brownfield <olzracer@peaknet.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 1999 6:55 PM
Subject: 68 Hurst emblems


> Hi all,
>
> My first posting..... I am looking for a good reproduction of the fender
> and deck lid emblems for a 68 Hurst/Olds. I just got a set from The
> Parts Place, and they are not a duplicate of the original, as they
> claimed.
>
> If no reproductions are available, my old emblems just need to be
> replated, anybody know of a place to get this done????
>
> These emblems are plastic, btw.
>
> Thanx,
>
> Jim
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 13:33:40 EDT
From: Four42much@aol.com
Subject: Re: Voltage+

In a message dated 5/8/99 12:39:30 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
LOUS69W30@AOL.COM writes:

<< I always thought normal charging voltage when a car was running at idle 
 should be around 14.5, if it's only 10 the battery would die.
 
 Lou Principe >>
On my brand new chevy venture and tahoe..the gages are both at 10-12
Hot Rod Harry

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 8 May 1999 15:40:07 -0400
From: "gjcouse" <gjcouse@francomm.com>
Subject: I've got the '69 now...

It's a done deal. I've now taken possession of a 1969 Cutlass Holiday Coupe.
Complete with an incorrect rebuilt 455 with Th400 behind it.The engine is so
fresh that the piston tops are still bright aluminum on top as viewed
through the spark plug hole.

This '69 is in far better shape than I originally thought. The frame is
strait and rust free. The front clip is off but complete. The fenders don't
show a bit of rust. The rear quarters have been re-done with new quarter
skins. The rest of the body shows no rust. Even the body to frame mounts are
in good shape. Looks as though this must have been a Southern car. It's just
to clean, even the whole floor is good. Though the VIN shows that the car
was built in Linden, NJ. Only one small rust through spot in the trunk. It's
even got an absolutely crack free dash pad.

While this 455 will find it's way into Quincy, the '69 rolling shell is
truly worthy of being brought back to life. So, starting next Winter, we
will restore the '69. Than I'll have an "A" body in my stable of muscle.

I did find a bag full of 442 pot metal independent numbers. Each with 2
posts. I didn't measure them but would say there apx. 2" in height. There
were a couple smaller versions at apx. 1+ 3/4" in size. There was even 1 "4"
that looked to have a curve to it. I might part with these. That's about it
for now. We'll pull this engine this weekend and prep it to drop into Quincy
in 10 days or so.  Gary....

- -----Regards,

Gary J. Couse
Couse Custom's

ICQ# 5209322
gjcouse@francomm.com
gjcouse@cc-iroc-ss.com

Custom Conversion Prototype:
CC-IROC-SS-#001 =  "Quincy"
http://www.CC-IROC-SS.com

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------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #1947
*********************************

