
oldsmobile-digest           Sunday, 28 July 1996        Volume 01 : Number 249


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 13:58:50 -0300
Subject: Re: Ninety Eight 1964 4DHT (Hurst)

Esko,

> I just joined this mailing robot to see if there is some sense in doing
> so.  Another reason is my Olds 98 1964 4DHT (Hurst).

Olds!  Finland!  Cool!  (no pun intended).  Always good to hear from you 
folks on the other side of the Great Pond.  We have been hearing more and 
more from people like yourself who drive Oldmobiles in countries we 
really didn't expect them to be popular in.

> My Olds is in good condition and it is in daily use. Because of the
> weather conditions here in Finland, the car MUST be in perfect 
> condition, specially during the winter.

I'll bet!

Loved the store of the Yllastunturi trip.

> In case You don't know celcius...

In spite of the fact that we stupid Americans still cling to miles and 
gallons, we have the vague notion of Celcius.   :)

> You should have seen the faces of the poor Saab and Mercedes owners 
> when we helped them out of the trouble.

Wished you had a picture of that.    :o

When I lived in Germany, I used to love to pull onto the Autobahn and 
floor my Toronado.  A BMW or Mercedes driver would coming up behind me 
would, of course, put their left blinker on and move to the left lane so 
they wouldn't have to slow down for my big, fat pig of a car.  Naturally, 
they never caught up to me (I made sure of that!).  But is was great fun 
to watch them disappear in my mirrors, still in the passing lane with 
their blinkers on, not willing to give up.  Wiedersehen!

> In my country it is almost impossible to get literature, posters etc. 

I'm sure we can help with that.

> It would be nice to have the ORIGINAL shopping manual in good 
> condition.

Oh, there's probably someone on the list that either has a set to sell or 
can tell you exactly where to get them for your car.  By the way, we 
refer to them as "shop" manuals.

> ...AND is willing to get rid of it, i'm willing to "help" him.

Very kind of you!  ;)

As to the clock and the rear quarter lamps, I'm sure here someone can 
help you.  As I am one of the minority Toronado owners, I don't have much 
information on the other Olds but most of the folks here have 
conventional :) Olds and I'm sure they can be of help.

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 14:08:18 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

Paul R. K. Kuromoto wrote:
> 
> If anyone has parts for Muncie transmissions or broken Muncies, please
> let me know! 

Paul,

Sorry, nope.  But if you get desparate, let me know and I'll check around 
Tampa Bay for you (though it might be hard to get ahold of people on the 
weekend -- they're all at the beach).

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 14:04:15 -0300
Subject: Re: A no show :-(

Mike,

What a huge bummer!  But you're right, at least it died at home and not 
at the show.  The old girl was *trying* to be nice to you.

I guess we know what you'll be doing this weekend.

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 11:32:56 -0300
Subject: Re: Ninety Eight 1964 4DHT (Hurst) 

At 05:48 AM 7/27/96 -0400, you wrote:
>Item Subject: Sanoman teksti
>Hi there :) !
>
>I just joined this mailing robot to see if there is some sense in doing
>so.
>Another reason is my Olds 98 1964 4DHT (Hurst).

Welcome to the robot; hope you have a *big* in-box! Lots of Olds-talk here.
I love four-door hardtops; you don't get those from any manufacturer these
days, though the Japanese luxury cars try to "look" like they have no center
pillar between the windows.

Was this car sold new in Finland, or imported later? How do those cars *get*
there anyhow?

>My Olds is in good condition and it is in daily use. Because of the
>weather
>conditions here in Finland, the car MUST be in perfect condition,
>specially during the
>winter.

Wow. You'd be considered pretty adventurous to do that in the USA; to do it
in Finland you must be a hero! Actually I hear that American cars are pretty
hot in Scandanavian countries, especially Dodge/Plymouth/Chrysler cars from
the 1950's.

>Here is a little story of my Olds:
>Last year (1995) at february we traveled with my wife and five children
>(of which two was our own) to Yllastunturi. The Yllastunturi is a small

You travelled with three children who are not your own? You are either very
brave, or completely insane!

[snip]
>The journey was pleasing with many beautiful wiews. My wife slept in the
>rear seat
>with two of the five children. The rest of us fitted comfortably on the
>front seat.
>Our car is childrens favourite, because they can populate the front seat
>and are able
>to sit thre side-by-side. (Anybody having similar experiences?).

Ah, me and three sorority sisters across the front of a '68 Ch*vy Caprice,
but nothing lately...

>At the evening (8pm) the temperature was about 8 degrees below zero. In
>case You don't
>know celcius, the zero point is the point where the water freezes and
>100 degrees over
>zero is the temperature where the water boils. Anyway, it was not too
>cold when we
>arrived.

Just for the record, *some* of us went through school when President Jimmy
Carter was forcing the Metric system on America, and have a bit of a clue
about it (though not much; base-10 numbering systems suck, we have it just
because that's how many fingers we have and French Rationalists lacked
historical consciousness; base-12 is more useful and convenient for
dividing, but don't get me started on this...)

>At the morning the temperature had gone down to 29 degrees below zero.

Ah, like a good spring morning in Michigan!  ;)

>The Saab
>did not make it. Neither did the (diesel) Mercedes. So they plugged the
>warmer on
>and the fuse on the wall blow up. Near the fuse compartment (on the
>cottage wall)
>there was a sign that said: "If the fuse has been blown, please contact
>the willage
>office.....". The problem was that the office was 5 kilometers away.
>
>At this moment I had my olds going and warm.

Yay! 

>You should have seen the faces of the poor Saab and Mercedes owners when
>we helped
>them out of the trouble.
>
>In my country it is almost impossible to get literature, posters etc. of
>my
>car. Until now I've succeeded with a shopping manual (a good copy of the
>real stuff),
>and an original brochure in good condition.
>
>It would be nice to have the ORIGINAL shopping manual in good condition.
>If there is
>somebody who has that manual (it is a 5 volume set) AND is willing to
>get rid of it,
>i'm willing to "help" him.

If nobody on the list has a set for sale, the Shop Manual is available from
a number of places; Oldsmobile U.S.A. Parts Supply Ltd. has the 5 volume
1964 set for sale for $79.12. You can reach them at phone # (703) 335-1935,
or Fax # (703) 335-0904. Their hours are 9:00AM to 6:30PM Eastern Standard
Time on Monday through Friday, and 9:00AM to 1:00PM Eastern Standard Time on
Saturday. There are also places that deal exclusively with books and shop
manuals who would have what you are looking for. Have you ever seen a copy
of Hemmings Motor News? That is the "bible" of car restoration, with cars
and parts from all over the USA for sale.

>The Olds has a clock in it's dashboard and unlike us humans, this thing
>seems to go
>faster as it becomes older. I have not opened the clock (yet) but i will
>do so in the
>near future. Any information about that clock is welcome. Please, don't

You may not have to open it up. The mechanism slows down a bit if you turn
it backwards; just try turning it backwards by 12 hours and see if there is
any difference in its speed. If it is still too fast, turn it back another
12 hours. This is a pretty ingenious system of compensation; if the clock is
5 minutes fast, and you turn it back, the mechanism is slowed down a bit,
and if it is 5 minutes slow, it speeds up a bit when you turn it ahead.

Again, welcome to the list!

- -----------
- - Bob Barry
- - 1969 Toronado & 1970 Cutlass Supreme SX (the 455 big-block boys)
- - 1978 Electra Coupe (409 Olds SMALL-block powered!)

------------------------------

From: curly@sgi.net
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 11:43:17 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed 

At 10:27 AM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:
>If anyone has parts for Muncie transmissions or broken Muncies, please 
>let me know!  I need to get as many replies to this message as possible 
>as soon as possible, so even if it's to say sorry, nope, I need to know 
>if its likely i'll find the part i need through this route.  In 
>particular I am looking for an undamaged case, excluding tailshaft, with 
>a specific size of countershaft.  I have seen two different sizes so far 
>and I don't know if there are more so I can provide you with the 
>dimension if you have any.
>
>%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
> I used to think that the Information age would spawn a great
> revolution as more people got smarter due to access to more
> information.  To the contrary, now that any idiot can use the
> Net, the integrity of the information contained therein has
> been corrupted.                          --Suntzu@ohana.com
>%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
>
>
>
nope no muncie parts but used to have some until another guy
like you came along and bought them all!!!

------------------------------

From: <borlase@faith.gordonc.edu>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 13:11:43 -0300
Subject: blower motor follow up

Fellow Oldsmobilers,

the fuse for my blower had a small crack near one of the ends.  So I 
replaced it and it worked fine.  Thanks for all the info you guys 
provided.

Roger Borlase
http://www.microdata.com/rborlase
http://www.microdata.com/rborlase/borlase.htm

------------------------------

From: Chris Miller <cya442@erols.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 15:41:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale

DELPROPO@emuvax.emich.edu wrote:
> 
> I have some Cutlass parts for, thay are as follows.
> 1. center consols for 67-69 cutlass, complete(sorry no cable
> 2. Complete side trime for 68-69 F-85 and cutlass S.
> 3. Wheel well moldings 68,69.
> 4. 70 speedomoter
> 5.71-72 front turn lamp.
> Other stuff available leave a list of needs and I will see what I have. The
> prices are VERY reasonable.       Thanks Greg Del 70 Cutlass Supreme Don Del 68
> Cutlass S. Michigan

How much are you asking for the wheel well moldings and in what 
condition are they?
Do they fit on the wheel well lip or about an inch form the lip?

Also looking for the "Oldsmobile" script for the hood of a '68 442, and 
a set of hood hinges for same.

Chris Miller <cya442@erols.com>

------------------------------

From: lawrencr@kostabi.gdls.com (Robert Lawrence)
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:18:07 -0300
Subject: Re: FAQ 

> Dan Lacey writes:
> >I have been wanting to ask what NOS is....but I won't...
> 
> It could mean a couple of different things today, right?
> 
> The standard usage: New Old Stock
> 
> The new usage: Nitrous Oxide...

N2O is Nitrous Oxide.  I think people mistakenly use NOS for
N2O, because a lot of people (like me, before I got involved
with y'all) don't know what NOS means.  And, in a lot of
the contexts, nitrous oxide kind of fit.

I'm not a member of the grammer police, but it's clearer if
we use N2O for nitrous oxide and NOS for new old stock.  A lot
of FAQs (I haven't checked ours, lately), have an acronym section
to define things like NOS, N2O, FAQ, IMHO, LOL, ROTFL, BTW...

I would suggest we add one (if we don't have one, already), but
someone may suggest I do it.

- --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Robert Lawrence   | 1970 Oldsmobile 98 Convertible               .^.
lawrencr@gdls.com |  _________,~--,___________\____________     /9|8\
(810) 825-5450    |  |                |~    |        ___   |    \}|{/
Sterling Hts., MI |  =------(-o-)-------------------( o )--=      v

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:30:37 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale

Chris,
I sell hood hinges for $60 a pair. A no dent set of your wheel opening moldings 
for $200.  If I can help let me know.

Art Fuller
mefco@sprynet.com

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@kfmw.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 09:56:25 -0300
Subject: Easybake car parts

I have painted some of my engine and noticed that the paint scratches 
very easily.  For some of the smaller pieces I would like to throw in 
the oven, but don't know what temp and for how long?  Also, what about 
putting a clearcoat over the paint.  Is that a good idea because of the 
engine heat?

Thanks,

Dan

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:48:44 -0300
Subject: Re: To forge or not to forge...

At 07:29 PM 7/26/96 -0300, you wrote:

>Yes, for any performance engine, bits of cast pieces broken off of the 
>piston skirt                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Michael R. Hall 

When I pulled my engine and took the pan off to rebuild the bottom end last
year, the #1 piston had a small piece of skirt broken off (about the size of
a dime).  I found it in the oil pump pickup.  

Just curious here; what would cause the skirt to break?  It was a nice clean
break, the piece wasn't bent or anything.


- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:54:09 -0300
Subject: Re: To forge or not to forge...

>Also, does anyone know why Olds changed the bolt pattern for the flex
>plate?

>--Dan

Engineers were bored??
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:52:43 -0300
Subject: Re: FAQ

At 09:34 PM 7/26/96 -0300, you wrote:
>
>I have been wanting to ask what NOS is....but I won't...
>Dan Lacey ( lacey@dsea.com )

New Old Stock.
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 17:07:28 -0300
Subject: Re: Ninety Eight 1964 4DHT (Hurst)

At 06:48 AM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:

>During the night there was two more arrivals to our parking place. One
>Saab 900 turbo 
>The Saab
>did not make it. 
>At this moment I had my olds going and warm.
>You should have seen the faces of the poor Saab and Mercedes owners when
>we helped
>them out of the trouble.

NOW I know why I haven't traded my Olds for a Saab.  ;)
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 17:12:23 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

At 10:27 AM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:
>If anyone has parts for Muncie transmissions or broken Muncies, please 
>let me know!  I need to get as many replies to this message as possible 
>as soon as possible, so even if it's to say sorry, nope, I need to know 
>if its likely i'll find the part i need through this route.  In 
>particular I am looking for an undamaged case, excluding tailshaft, with 
>a specific size of countershaft.  I have seen two different sizes so far 
>and I don't know if there are more so I can provide you with the 
>dimension if you have any.

Year One has (expensive) parts for Muncie 4 speeds.  Only internals, seals,
and the extension housing.  No cases.  Their number is 1-800-950-9503.  I
found a page somewhere on the WWW to get a free catalog (if you don't
already have one), but I can't remember where it was.  I'll see if I can
find it and let ya know.
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 17:25:01 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

At 10:27 AM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:
>If anyone has parts for Muncie transmissions or broken Muncies, please 
>let me know! 

Year One has (expensive) parts for Muncie 4 speeds.  Only internals, seals,
and the extension housing.  No cases.  Their number is 1-800-950-9503.  I
found a page somewhere on the WWW to get a free catalog (if you don't
already have one), but I can't remember where it was.  I'll see if I can
find it and let ya know.

OK, I found the page.  It's at http://www/carcollector.com/catlog1.htm#YearOne

It says the catalog is free "for a limited time" when you mention code
PCS6F.  Call 'em and see what they say!
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Ken <rottin@en.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 16:46:47 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

Paul R. K. Kuromoto wrote:
> 
> If anyone has parts for Muncie transmissions or broken Muncies, please
> let me know!  I need to get as many replies to this message as possible
> as soon as possible, so even if it's to say sorry, nope, I need to know
> if its likely i'll find the part i need through this route.  In
> particular I am looking for an undamaged case, excluding tailshaft, with
> a specific size of countershaft.  I have seen two different sizes so far
> and I don't know if there are more so I can provide you with the
> dimension if you have any.

 I have 2 manual 4 speed transmissions sitting in my garage.. How can I 
identify if they are muncie's.. if they are, mebbe we can make a deal..

Ken
Cleveland, Ohio
1967 442 Convertible

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 21:06:05 -0300
Subject: Re: Ninety Eight 1964 4DHT (Hurst)

Dave Paulison wrote:
> 
> NOW I know why I haven't traded my Olds for a Saab.  ;)

We all KNEW there was a reason out there somewhere.   ;)


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 21:04:42 -0300
Subject: Re: To forge or not to forge...

Dave Paulison wrote:
> 
> >does anyone know why Olds changed the bolt pattern for the flex plate?
>
> Engineers were bored??

Really.  They must have gotten tired of seeing who did to the best job of 
mounting stuff over-top of the other stuff that breaks down.  :(

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 18:23:06 -0300
Subject: Re: Easybake car parts

Dan,
I use high temp clear for all those parts around the engine.

Art Fuller

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 18:28:31 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

That will be the last free thing you get from Year One, so enjoy the catalogue.

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 18:26:33 -0300
Subject: Re: FAQ

I might be wrong, but I think NOS, referring to nitros, is a brand name. A guy 
at the races gave me a hat with that on it.  I don't use the stuff, but I took 
the hat and thanked him.

Art Fuller 

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@kfmw.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 11:58:37 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale

> Also looking for the "Oldsmobile" script for the hood of a '68 442

The 68 442 does not have an Oldsmobile script on the hood, but the 
cutlass S does.

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 18:33:32 -0300
Subject: Re: Easybake car parts

Dan,
I met a guy at a car show from Kansas. He had a show 70 w30 with beautiful 
SS1's. The black inserts were perfect.  He said he painted them and put them in 
the oven in his kitchen and baked the paint on.  He was really pleased with the 
results, but when his wife got home the whole house smelled like paint. He was 
in serious trouble.

Art Fuller

------------------------------

From: John Harris <John.Harris@rttc.redstone.army.mil>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 18:43:31 -0300
Subject: Max tire and wheel size 69 442

Folks,

I have a 1969 442.  Right now I have the original wheels and original
size tires.  I am having mucho wheel spin under full acceleration.  What
I would like to do is to find some old SSII wheels and have them
modified to accept a wider tire.  Do any of you know how wide of a tire
I can get UNDER a 1969 442?  I will need to know the backspacing and
overall width or the wheel.

Thanks

John Harris

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 22:04:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Power Servo keeps me un-Comfortron... 

In a message dated 96-07-26 01:19:57 EDT, you write:

<< does anyone have a more detailed schematic for the wiring
 on the '69 Toro Comfortron? The diagrams in the '69 Shop Manual don't label
 the wire colors, or show details on the connectors for the Toro >>

My "Comfortron Information Manual" from '66 has a wiring diagram showing wire
colors.  Wiring for '69 should be similar, but wire colors may not?  I show 5
wire coming from the power servo on a '66:

Black w/green stripe
Black w/white stripe
Black w/yellow stripe
Black w/orange stripe
Brown (thought I was gonna say black, didn't ya?)

All five of these wires go to the heater blower resistor.

Black w/orange stripe goes on to the blower motor

Brown goes on the the range relay.

How does this compare to what you got?

Also has a vacuum hose diagram w/hose colors.

Paul
Learning more about Comfortron all the time.

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 22:10:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Max tire and wheel size 69 442

At 06:43 PM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:

>I have a 1969 442.  Right now I have the original wheels and original
>size tires.  I am having mucho wheel spin under full acceleration.  What
>I would like to do is to find some old SSII wheels and have them
>modified to accept a wider tire.  Do any of you know how wide of a tire
>I can get UNDER a 1969 442?  I will need to know the backspacing and
>overall width or the wheel.
>
>John Harris
>
John,

I have a 69 Cutlass, with SSIII wheels (15x7), and have P245/60R15's on them
with no clearance problems.  
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 22:16:53 -0300
Subject: Re: Muncie parts needed

At 04:46 PM 7/27/96 -0300, you wrote:

> I have 2 manual 4 speed transmissions sitting in my garage.. How can I 
>identify if they are muncie's.. if they are, mebbe we can make a deal..
>
>Ken

Here it is from the Year One catalog #R325:

"The Muncie was used with most performance engines, and is not to be
confused with the Saginaw or Borg-Warner 4-speeds.  The Muncie is
distinguished from the Saginaw in that the reverse lever on the Muncie is
mounted in the extension housing, where the Saginaw reverse lever is mounted
in the side cover.  The main difference between the Muncie and the
Borg-Warner is that the Muncie has a 7 bolt side cover and the Borg-Warner
has a 9 bolt side cover."

Hope that helps ya'll out...
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 22:23:24 -0300
Subject: thermostat

My engine currently has a 195 degree thermostat in it.  It doesn't overheat,
but does get pretty close in the Florida heat (94-97 degree highs).  I am
planning on putting a cooler 'stat in, and have available 160 degree and 180
degree high performance, high flow 'stats.  Does anybody out there use a 160
degree 'stat?  If so, do you know how, if at all, it affects your cars
performance (power, gas mileage, etc)?  Should I put in a 160 or 180 degree
'stat?

Geez, all these life altering decisions are beginning to make me depressed...
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Michael Brady <drolds19@mail.idt.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:17:12 -0300
Subject: Re: Max tire and wheel size 69 442

John Harris wrote:
> 
> Folks,
> 
> I have a 1969 442.  Right now I have the original wheels and original
> size tires.  I am having mucho wheel spin under full acceleration.  What
> I would like to do is to find some old SSII wheels and have them
> modified to accept a wider tire.  Do any of you know how wide of a tire
> I can get UNDER a 1969 442?  I will need to know the backspacing and
> overall width or the wheel.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> John Harris

 Hi john, i also own a 69' 4-4-2 and have two complete set's of wheels
 and tires, for car shows i have a set of 14x6 super stock ones with
 firestone redlines and for around town i have a set of super stock
 two's 14x7 with some very sticky L-60's, there is a company in 
 oregon that makes custom super stock ones and i saw a set last week
 that were 15x8 and looked outstanding!!! As far as putting big wheels
 under your olds i have had 50s series under several 68-69s with 
 no problems what so ever, my 4-speed car also has big time wheel spin
 but should be ok once i install no-hop t-bars, let's hope anyway?

------------------------------

From: DELPROPO@emuvax.emich.edu
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 20:15:30 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale 



------------------------------

From: "Edwin L. Dyer" <Havasued@bbs.lnknet.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 22:48:58 -0300
Subject: Olds Magazine?

Does anyone know of a publication dedicated to Oldsmobile?

------------------------------

From: DELPROPO@emuvax.emich.edu
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 20:27:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale 

Thanks thw whell well molding are in excellent shape they are $125 or best
offer call me at (810) 227 -3086 in Michigan .......Thanks.....

------------------------------

From: DELPROPO@emuvax.emich.edu
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 20:29:28 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale 

If I have a set of hinges they are $35 a pair. The wheel well moldings are
$125. or best offer give me a call if interested ....Thanks....Don.

------------------------------

From: <borlase@faith.gordonc.edu>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 23:59:51 -0300
Subject: Re: thermostat

A colder thermostat will use more gas because it will take longer for the 
engine to heat up.  However in Fla 180 would be a good choice since it 
hot there.

Roger Borlase
http://www.microdata.com/rborlase
http://www.microdata.com/rborlase/borlase.htm

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 23:35:28 -0300
Subject: Parts Needed

Anyone have any of the following?

* T3 headlamps, either high or low beams
* '68 Cutlass right rear taillight lens
* Set of 4 trim rings for 14x6 SSII wheels
* 1970 Cutlass interior hood lock mechanism
* Trunk clips for jack handle mounting with SSII wheels
* '68 Cutlass backup light assembly (don't need lens)

Please respond with prices to me directly. Thanks!

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 23:38:57 -0300
Subject: Re: Parts for Sale

On Sat, 27 Jul 1996, Dan Williams wrote:

> > Also looking for the "Oldsmobile" script for the hood of a '68 442
> 
> The 68 442 does not have an Oldsmobile script on the hood, but the 
> cutlass S does.

Quite true. If you do need the script it is available in repro form from 
most of the Olds parts houses. I have one and it is good quality.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 17:30:52 -0300
Subject: Re: Ninety Eight 1964 4DHT (Hurst)

Esko.Ilola@Tele.telebox.fi wrote:
> 
> Item Subject: Sanoman teksti
> Hi there :) !
> 
> I just joined this mailing robot to see if there is some sense in doing
> so.
> Another reason is my Olds 98 1964 4DHT (Hurst).
> 
> My Olds is in good condition and it is in daily use. 
> 
> 
>                 Sanoman:

WELCOME!  Finland is such a wonderful place.  I am happy to hear that 
you already have an Oldsmobile.  Those 98's are just great cruising 
vehicles.  No wonder they are popular with the kids.  You are a lucky 
man.

That was a nice story of the dependability of those 1960's American 
cars.  They are great tough cars & I it looks as if they are definitely 
in the league with Mercedes & Saab. 

Can you tell me what the Hurst part of your car's name means?  In 
America, we only know the Hurst company for special parts, modifications 
to regular production cars, & high performance vehicles.

The bulb changing can be done on American cars either by taking the 
screws out of the lenses & removing them to get at the bulbs or by 
looking inside the trunk, finding the bulb holders near the bumper, 
twisting them a part turn & removing them for the bulb.  I don't have 
such a car, but these are the usual ways.

I believe that your clock question has been answered.  Another fix, is 
to change it over to a quartz movement that is readily available in the 
US.  These make for very reliable clocks.   

We hope that you can tell us more about Finland & we can tell you 
something about America.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:13:58 -0300
Subject: Th 200-4R Problems.. 

As a few of you know, I have recently put a 200-4R tranny in my 79 Cutlass
(behind a 403)  When I mentioned I was doing this, a few of you had questions
about durability, etc.  I wasn't really concerned about this I figured if
beefed up Grand Nationals run these successfully I shouldn't have a problem.
 I figure my 403 puts out about 350HP and 420 lbs of Torque, according to Mr.
Gaskets Dyno program.

Well now that I have the car on the road, I am having problems with the
tranny.  After I properly adjust the TV cable (which is very straight
forward), the engine picks up about 200 rpms before it shifts from 1st to
2nd.  2nd to 3rd is a little sloppy and 3rd to 4th is fine.  I took it back
to the shop I had it built, and they claimed that it was a problem with the
TV cable (The TV cable regulates line pressure inside the trans).  So they
adjusted the cable so I was shorter, thus increasing the line pressure.  Now
it shifts sloppy from 1st to 2nd, and picks up about 200 rpms before it
shifts from 2nd to 3rd.  3rd to 4th is still fine.  Therefore I assume this
is a pressure problem and not a problem with clutch slippage, etc.  I talked
to an Art Carr tech and he said he couldn't help me because he didn't know
how the tranny was built.  And yes, I am taking it back to the shop I had it
built on Tuesday.  I am just trying to get some input.  

Here is some info on the tranny:
- -Code OG (I think from an 84? Cutlass)
- -Has a BOP bell housiing, and not a universal bell like the later units
- -has a non-lockup convertor, with a 2200-2400 stall from Dynamic

Any input would be appreciated!
Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:12:17 -0300
Subject: Car Craft Street Meet... 

Is anyone planning on attending the Car Craft super street meet duing August
16-18?  I am driving my 79 Cutlass out there from eastern PA and would like
to know if anybody else will be there.

Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:14:59 -0300
Subject: Re: thermostat 

Dave:
Putting in a cooler thermostat does not necessarily make the car run cooler.
 In your case, if the radiator, fan, & water pump are not all working
together, the cooler thermostat will open at 160 or 180 and remain open until
the water reaches that desired temperature.  If the water/antifreeze never
gets cooled, the thermostat will remain open and the water will continue to
flow through the radiatior.  All the cooler thermostat will do is open
earlier.  If you have problems with the car running warm, check the 'entire'
cooling system. including the fan, clutch, radiator, water pump, and the
thermostat (to see if it is partially stuck!)

On a side note, I just finished building my 403 about two weeks ago when I
was getting ready to fire it up for the first time.  The temperature kept
creeping until it hit 240 when I decided that was enough.  I then replaced
the cheap aftermarket flex fan with a stock 6 blade aluminum clutch fan, with
no success.  It turns out the brand new Robert Shaw balanced sleeve
thermostat was stuck closed.  So I replaced it with another 180 unit and then
car rarely creeps above 190.  It usally runs 180 on the highway with no
problems at all. 

Hope this info helped,
Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: OLDSPWR@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:14:09 -0300
Subject: GM Collectors Guide (BOP)?? 

Does anyone out there subsribe to GM Collectors Guide, formerly BOP (Buick
Olds Pontiac)????

The only reason I subsribed to this magazine (at $25 a year) was because they
featured one Olds a month along with new products.  Now for the past few
months the entire magazine has been dedicated to classified ads.  If I wanted
to read classifieds on Olds I would pick up a Hemmings.  I wonder if they
have a lack of feature cars.  If they do maybe we could send them some
pictures of our Olds.  Anybody have any other thought???

Tom Millard OLDSPWR@aol.com

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 19:22:23 -0300
Subject: Re: thermostat

Dave Paulison wrote:
> 
> My engine currently has a 195 degree thermostat in it.  It doesn't overheat,
> but does get pretty close in the Florida heat (94-97 degree highs).  I am
> planning on putting a cooler 'stat in, and have available 160 degree and 180
> degree high performance, high flow 'stats.  Does anybody out there use a 160
> degree 'stat?  If so, do you know how, if at all, it affects your cars
> performance (power, gas mileage, etc)?  Should I put in a 160 or 180 degree
> 'stat?
> 
> 
> Dave Paulison         

Dave:

I wouldn't go to the 160.  Your engine will run too cool, the heater 
won't work well at all, the car performs better at the higher temp, & 
you get better gas mikeage at 180.  The 195's are used in the newer cars 
for the catalitic converters & other emissions equipment.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Albabama

------------------------------

From: ndg@traverse.com (Darren Shroeger)
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 00:59:00 -0300
Subject: sweet Starfire sighted! 

Our local drive-in, Don's Drive In, had a classic car "cruise-in" yesterday.
Went in hopes of seeing primo Oldsmobiles, of course. Arrived and whoa, what
drives in but a '61 Starfire!  Talk about wild, this thing had fang-like
protrusions on the corners of the rear bumper. Hooded, round taillights, chrome
everywhere- wow! Completely original except for a repaint sometime in the 70's,
this thing was like perfect! The guy's mother bought it brand new in '61 and
it has lived in the garage its entire life. When he first arrived he told me he
bought it for $500 from some old guy and was thinking of selling it for like
$800 or so. Then the real story came out. Funny guy.

Also saw a nicely restored '59 Super 88. Really admired the styling, love those
tailfins! I don't think Olds loses anything to Ch*vy on 50's style!


- -Darren Shroeger
  '68 442 / 4 speed
  '80 Grand Prix / 350 Olds

------------------------------

From: ndg@traverse.com (Darren Shroeger)
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 01:10:00 -0300
Subject: '68 W30 faCTOR 

So does anyone have any insights on how to distinguish a '68 W30
from a plain jane 442? Aside from the motor of course, as this car
did not come with the original motor.

The reason I ask is that when I told Chris Witt about the 1/8" pinstripes
along the bottom of my dash, he said his W30 had those. Maybe my '68
is a W30 car, he suggested.

So I ran outside and checked for evidence of OAI scoop mounting. Hmmm...
No holes in the bumper, but some suspiscious-looking holes in the
radiator support.

Chris also told me to check the radiator keeper for 2 curves vs. 1 curve.
Mine is the 2 curve version, which indicates either AC (which the car
doesn't have) or heavy-duty cooling (ie: W30).

Any other things to check?

- -Darren Shroeger
  '68 442 W30 (?) / 4 speed
  '80 Grand Prix / 350 Olds

------------------------------

From: "Paul R. K. Kuromoto" <suntzu@ohana.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 01:09:04 -0300
Subject: Muncie rebuild kit from Year One

I purchased one of these kits from Year One for about $160.  This kit, as 
the catalog says, is very complete.  The individual parts may or may not 
come out to $160 if you were to buy them separately but I hesitate to 
imagine how hard it would be to round up all these small parts.  
Rebuilding a Muncie, I have found, is very simple and I would suggest the 
experience to anyone who has average mechanical experience.  The kit 
contains: front and rear main bearings, all seals, all gaskets, new 
roller bearings and spacers for mainshaft and countershaft, new snap 
rings, case bushings, new synchro rings, and thrust washers.  You only 
need a hydraulic press for one or two operations.  Most any Chiltons "big 
book" manuals (with unit repair sections) contains about the best diagram 
and instructions for overhauling a muncie.  I also found an old Hot Rod 
with an illustrated article on Muncie transmissions, email me for the 
particular issue.  I have not found any shops specializing in manual 
transmissions though the a rticle refers to a shop called "Stick Only".  
Has anyone found other shops offering Muncie parts or rebuild kits?
If anyone is going to work on their Muncie for the first time drop me a 
line, I'd be interested to hear about your progress and results.

- -Paul

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 I used to think that the Information age would spawn a great
 revolution as more people got smarter due to access to more
 information.  To the contrary, now that any idiot can use the
 Net, the integrity of the information contained therein has
 been corrupted.                          --Suntzu@ohana.com
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

------------------------------

From: John & Robin Whitcore <retrotek@phoenixat.com>
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 21:37:03 -0300
Subject: Air to W-31

We recently acquired a fully original #'s matching '70 W-31. The car 
never came with air conditioning. I was thinking about putting it in 
but wasn't sure about 2 things.

1) Would it devalue the car? (Can it be installed in a way that it 
could be yanked without ever knowing it was there ?)
2) Given the setup of the engine/gears (original spec) would the car 
stall at every stop light? Would it affect the cars performance when 
not running?

It's hot in Florida!

....j&r

------------------------------

From: David1756@aol.com
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 01:59:04 -0300
Subject: subscribe 

subscribe David Wilk
I seem to have been disconnected from the list

------------------------------

From: Michael Brady <drolds19@mail.idt.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 04:30:16 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds Magazine?

Edwin L. Dyer wrote:
> 
> Does anyone know of a publication dedicated to Oldsmobile?

Hello, i suppose the best bet is the oca publication journey with olds
 is the best bet, i subcribe to GM collector guide but since they
 added chevy's it's not the same and i think the quality has gone 
 right in the toilet, my last issue was the worst yet and have no 
intension of getting it again.


    Mike Brady 69' 4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Michael Brady <drolds19@mail.idt.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 04:56:43 -0300
Subject: Re: Air to W-31

John & Robin Whitcore wrote:
> 
> We recently acquired a fully original #'s matching '70 W-31. The car
> never came with air conditioning. I was thinking about putting it in
> but wasn't sure about 2 things.
> 
> 1) Would it devalue the car? (Can it be installed in a way that it
> could be yanked without ever knowing it was there ?)
> 2) Given the setup of the engine/gears (original spec) would the car
> stall at every stop light? Would it affect the cars performance when
> not running?
> 
> It's hot in Florida!
> 
> ....j&r

 Hello, nice car!!! If you are making the car a total # matching car
 then yes it might effect the value but not a heck of a lot in my 
opinion. Thecar's performance would not be affected to much but you will
 have an extra pulley and weight,you may want to add a better gear to 
offset the extra weight, is it running with 3.91 currently?? I wound'nt 
go any higher than that, i had 3.91 in my hurst and it was not pleasent
on those highway adventures!! My 67' 4-4-2 had a four speed with air
and in the four years i owned the car i only used my air twice!! But 
having lived in fla. i realize how blaz'in hot it get's, if i lived down 
there i may be thinking the same move. 


            Mike Brady 1969 4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Michael Brady <drolds19@mail.idt.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 05:18:53 -0300
Subject: Re: sweet Starfire sighted!

Darren Shroeger wrote:
> 
> Our local drive-in, Don's Drive In, had a classic car "cruise-in" yesterday.
> Went in hopes of seeing primo Oldsmobiles, of course. Arrived and whoa, what
> drives in but a '61 Starfire!  Talk about wild, this thing had fang-like
> protrusions on the corners of the rear bumper. Hooded, round taillights, chrome
> everywhere- wow! Completely original except for a repaint sometime in the 70's,
> this thing was like perfect! The guy's mother bought it brand new in '61 and
> it has lived in the garage its entire life. When he first arrived he told me he
> bought it for $500 from some old guy and was thinking of selling it for like
> $800 or so. Then the real story came out. Funny guy.
> 
> Also saw a nicely restored '59 Super 88. Really admired the styling, love those
> tailfins! I don't think Olds loses anything to Ch*vy on 50's style!
> 
> -Darren Shroeger
>   '68 442 / 4 speed
>   '80 Grand Prix / 350 Olds


 Derren, i hear ya' on that one, Starfire's are the coolest!!! The 61'
 and 62 are my favorite, i love the duel hood spears. I don't own one 
 but i will!!!! I had a black 62 starfire lined up but the deal fell
 thru!! In fact i called about one today that was in fla. but the car was 
sold. Sure would be nice to have a star to keep my 4-4-2 company in the 
garage.Any other starfire nut's out there??? I belong to the starfire-
jetstar one chapter of oca, they come out with a nice newsletter 
quarterly As far as the 50s go i recently was at a car show were there
was a 57 chevy and 57 olds parked side by side and it was almost
laughable, make mine oldszzzzzzz.

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 07:59:07 -0300
Subject: 66 Tri-Power Parts FS

The following is not from me, so respond please to Craig, not myself!

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Sat, 27 Jul 1996 23:50:46 -0300
From: Craig Dobbins <kissrulz@gnn.com>
To: oldsmobile-owner@ccn.cs.dal.ca

Hello,
  I own a 68 442 convertable and was told to write you and ask to subscribe.  
I also have a 66 tri-power intake and original carbs (nothing else with that 
except the intake and carbs - no air cleaners, etc.), and am looking for some 
infor and possible current market value on that.  I just purchased the 66 
intake for $500 off of my buddy who needed the money.  Thanks and Write Back 
please!
                                                           Thanks,
                                                             Craig
                                                             Kissrulz@gnn.com

------------------------------

From: Mike Hall <mikehal1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 09:39:35 -0300
Subject: Re: To forge or not to forge...

Dave Paulison wrote:
>Just curious here; what would cause the skirt to break?  It was a nice clean
>break, the piece wasn't bent or anything.

Spark knock will do it... there are pretty significant differences in 
tensile strength between forged steel and cast steel.

>I found it in the oil pump pickup.

Nice place for it, that crap ALWAYS seems to end up there...


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Michael R. Hall                                  Ortonville, Michigan
E-Mail: mikehal1@ix.netcom.com                   OCA #17903
The Oldsmobile Stable:    
     1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass S, 380 horses of pure Mondello fun...
     1991 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight Royale Broughm, the classy one...
         Brought to you by a Apple Power Macintosh 7100/80
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------

From: Mike Hall <mikehal1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 10:49:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Th 200-4R Problems..

Tom Millard wrote:
>Well now that I have the car on the road, I am having problems with the
>tranny.  After I properly adjust the TV cable (which is very straight
>forward), the engine picks up about 200 rpms before it shifts from 1st to
>2nd.  2nd to 3rd is a little sloppy and 3rd to 4th is fine.  I took it back
>to the shop I had it built, and they claimed that it was a problem with the
>TV cable (The TV cable regulates line pressure inside the trans).  So they
>adjusted the cable so I was shorter, thus increasing the line pressure.  Now
>it shifts sloppy from 1st to 2nd, and picks up about 200 rpms before it
>shifts from 2nd to 3rd.  3rd to 4th is still fine.  Therefore I assume this
>is a pressure problem and not a problem with clutch slippage, etc.  I talked
>to an Art Carr tech and he said he couldn't help me because he didn't know
>how the tranny was built.  And yes, I am taking it back to the shop I had it
>built on Tuesday.  I am just trying to get some input.

A TV cable doesn't, as you say, "regulate" anything. It is a simple 
mechanical control, actuation on one end to actuate something else on the 
other end. All mechanical controls should be no less than 80% efficient. 
What this means is if you have a 1 pound weight on one end of the cable, 
it should not require any more than 1.2 pounds to move the weight in the 
cables routed position and at the temperature extremes. This is a older 
cable, is it sticking? If you had the TV cable in your hands it should be 
very smooth if you actuate it. A TV cable, often referred to as the 
"kickdown" cable, transmits the energy to the transmission to go to a 
lower gear at or near WOT (Wide Open Throttle). Some TV cables have 
adjusters on them, some do not. If your shop is "hand-modifying" a 
non-adjustable TV cable, odds are the problem is something else. The 
adjusters are usually pre-set at the point of manufacture and do not need 
adjustment at point of assembly. The adjusters are there only if 
something drastically changed with build variation at the point of 
assembly. I think that you may have a TV cable problem but it may be a 
Tranny problem...

Good Luck,
Mike


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Michael R. Hall                                  Ortonville, Michigan
E-Mail: mikehal1@ix.netcom.com                   OCA #17903
The Oldsmobile Stable:    
     1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass S, 380 horses of pure Mondello fun...
     1991 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight Royale Broughm, the classy one...
         Brought to you by a Apple Power Macintosh 7100/80
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------

From: Mike Hall <mikehal1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 10:49:21 -0300
Subject: Re: Air to W-31

J&R wrote:
>1) Would it devalue the car? (Can it be installed in a way that it 
>could be yanked without ever knowing it was there ?)

Yes, it would devalue the car. It would not matter to the locals about 
the change but if you tried to get the big bucks out of the car at one of 
the bigger nationwide auctions, you would be hit pretty hard. Originality 
is an easy thing to say but horribly hard to prove. If you have the 
protect-o-plate, I wouldn't make the change as this would prove to be 
non-original, IF this is important to you and you want the value of the 
car to appreciate. I am of the mind that the classics should stay classic 
(original) and the "grunt cars", like my Cutlass S, can be modified to 
the hearts content since they aren't worth much to begin with. As far as 
installation goes, what you are talking about is a HUGE job. If you do 
make this change yourself, it will be expensive and lots and lots and 
lots of work. If you have it done by a shop, assuming one will do this 
for you, sell your firstborn as a downpayment... As far as knowing it was 
ever there or not, if you throw enough money at something, SOMETIMES you 
can actually achieve what you want to do. So, maybe, maybe not, depends 
on who you want to fool...

>2) Given the setup of the engine/gears (original spec) would the car 
>stall at every stop light? Would it affect the cars performance when 
>not running?

The car should not stall, it WILL require to be tuned than it is 
currently. The performance will be affected. All the junk that you see 
attached to A/C cars, that stuff weighs something, so the car is heavier, 
that affects performance. The compressor pulley is "free wheeling", so to 
speak. That pulley still generates drag, that affects performance. The 
pulley cannot achieve high RPMS without damaging the compressor so you 
will not be able to rev as high as a non-A/C car, this affects 
performance. The compressor system can be fixed to add higher revs, I 
just unhook the belt if I'm going racing...

Regards,
Mike




<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Michael R. Hall                                  Ortonville, Michigan
E-Mail: mikehal1@ix.netcom.com                   OCA #17903
The Oldsmobile Stable:    
     1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass S, 380 horses of pure Mondello fun...
     1991 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight Royale Broughm, the classy one...
         Brought to you by a Apple Power Macintosh 7100/80
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 05:41:56 -0300
Subject: Re: sweet Starfire sighted!

Darren Shroeger wrote:
> 
> Our local drive-in, Don's Drive In, had a classic car "cruise-in" yesterday.
> Went in hopes of seeing primo Oldsmobiles, of course. Arrived and whoa, what
> drives in but a '61 Starfire!  Talk about wild, this thing had fang-like
> protrusions on the corners of the rear bumper. Hooded, round taillights, chrome
> everywhere- wow! Completely original except for a repaint sometime in the 70's,
> this thing was like perfect! The guy's mother bought it brand new in '61 and
> it has lived in the garage its entire life. 
> -Darren Shroeger
>   Darren:

I'd love to hava a 1961 Starfire.  They were all convertibles with 
beautiful leather interiors of a metallic nature ususlly matching the 
exterior color.  The lack of fins on top of the rear fenders & those 
lucious curves make it superior to the '62's in muy opinion.  Even that 
slow shifting old 'slim jim' Hydramatic have a certain class.  The 
engine has a certain deep rumble that is enhanced as it goes through 
it's shifting process at mild throttle.  The whole GM line was superior 
to all the others in style with the possible exception of the Lincoln 
Continental & Thuderbird.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 05:51:50 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 W30 faCTOR

Darren Shroeger wrote:
> 
> So does anyone have any insights on how to distinguish a '68 W30
> from a plain jane 442? Aside from the motor of course, as this car
> did not come with the original motor.
> 
> The reason I ask is that when I told Chris Witt about the 1/8" pinstripes
> along the bottom of my dash, he said his W30 had those. Maybe my '68
> is a W30 car, he suggested.
> 
> So I ran outside and checked for evidence of OAI scoop mounting. Hmmm...
> No holes in the bumper, but some suspiscious-looking holes in the
> radiator support.
> 
> Chris also told me to check the radiator keeper for 2 curves vs. 1 curve.
> Mine is the 2 curve version, which indicates either AC (which the car
> doesn't have) or heavy-duty cooling (ie: W30).
> 
> Any other things to check?
> 
> -Darren Shroeger
>   Darren;

W30's also had red plastic fenderwells w/6 or 7 inch holse for the hoses 
going up to the aircleaner and down to the long scoops mounted behind 
the bumper using the mounting holes for the fender liners.  Of course 
they had all 442 equipment & features, but W30's came w/stiff rear axle 
ratios. no power brakes; but could have been discs, & no door locks as 
they were vacuum & W30's had little of that.  Everyone I have seen had 
the front fender verticle stripes but probably could have been deleated. 
 All 442's had the twin stripes on the lower portion of the dash.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: John Harris <John.Harris@rttc.redstone.army.mil>
Date: Sun, 28 Jul 1996 11:04:35 -0300
Subject: Custom Sized Super Stock Wheels

Folks

Do any of you know the name, address, or phone number of a company that
makes custom sized SS wheels?  I have been told that there is a company
in Oregon.  I need a wider tire under my Olds but I don't want some
aftermark chrome wheel.

John Harris

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #249
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