To:	oldsmobile-digest @ ccn.cs.dal.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
From:	oldsmobile-digest-owner @ ccn.cs.dal.ca @ INTERNET @ ABTLAB
Date:	09/07/96 06:18:12 PM
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #292


oldsmobile-digest        Saturday, 7 September 1996     Volume 01 : Number 292


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 16:12:00 -0300
Subject: Another Olds in a movie sighting

Years ago I saw a movie called "Rebel of the Road."   It was a late '70's 
B-movie that was about a bunch of kids in their late teens who spent all 
their time racing cars .  One of the main characters (the bad guy), was 
wealthy, and had a '69 442 that was really beefed up.  I am surprised that I 
remember the name of the movie, because I haven't seen it in at least 15 
years, but fortunately, that movies name was branded in my memory banks. 
 The movie was pretty cool, because the 442 was in it A LOT!  I have checked 
with many of the local movie stores here in St. Louis, and no one has ever 
heard of it.  Has anyone else heard of it, and/or know where to obtain it? 
 Please let me know.

Jeff Zeilmann
SMTP:jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
'68 Cutlass Supreme, '69 Cutlass S Convertible

ps.  Thanks Dave for the Year One info!

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 16:12:15 -0300
Subject: Re: Another Olds in a movie sighting 

>I have checked 
>with many of the local movie stores here in St. Louis, and no one has ever 
>heard of it.  Has anyone else heard of it, and/or know where to obtain it? 

Video stores (e.g. Blockbuster) usually have a monster book called a
VideoLog, a massive thing that looks like a car parts catalog. Look
up the movie by title, star name, director or whatever. If it exists,
you should be able to find it in there.

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: Kevin Wong <yu135008@yorku.ca>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 17:24:35 -0300
Subject: Re[3]: Aurora (RWD Oldsmobiles)

On Fri, 6 Sep 1996 brett@actel.com wrote:

>      As to number 2 below, the 98 has been FWD since around '85.  The 
>      Custom Cruiser is the only RWD they have had for a few years.  1996 is 
>      the end of the production for these and it's other full size GM RWD 
>      siblings.

You're right about the Olds 98 being front-drive since '85.  The 1985 Olds
Delta 88 is the last full-size RWD Olds car.  The last mid-size RWD Olds
is the 1988 Cutlass Supreme Classic, only in 2-door form.  The Custom
Cruiser, after being restyled for the '91 model year, was discontinued
partway through '92 due to poor sales.  This is surprising, since IMHO, of
the 3 GM wagons (Caprice, Custom Cruiser, Roadmaster) the CC had the best
instrument cluster and distinctive front end styling.  Interestingly, the
CC was never sold in Canada, and on a recent 5000 mile trip through the
States, I counted about 11 on the Interstates.  Oldsmobile does not
currently sell any rear drive cars.  If you count trucks, there's still
the Bravada.

Kevin Wong

------------------------------

From: Blaine Sanders 5483 <BLAINES@strata3d.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 18:05:09 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply -Reply 

>>> Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com> 09/06/96 04:18pm >>>
>Andrew C. Green wrote:
>>  > Probably you meant to say "_no_ more than any comparable
>car"...?
>
>Prolly did.

I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...
=)
- -Blaine

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 09:36:26 -0300
Subject: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds

I need to change the tranny fluid in my Olds (TH350).  I'm going to switch
to synthetic ATF.  Is there a way to drain the torque convertor without
removing it?  Could I remove one of the steel cooler lines where it attaches
to the radiator tank, start the engine, and let it pump out there?  (The
pump pumps with the tranny in Park, right?)  Or will that hurt the tranny?  

My uncle said I could remove the convertor cover, and drill & tap a hole in
the side, and then plug it with a threaded plug.  Kinda like a drain plug
for the convertor.  A neat idea, but has anybody ever done it?  Does it
work?  Where would you drill the hole?  

I hope the removing-the-line-and-let-it-pump method will work.  I need to do
the same thing to our other car (1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse), and I can't get
to the convertor without dropping the transmission (a much more involved
procedure than the Olds is), as the tranny case covers the convertor (no
convertor cover plate).
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 17:23:02 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply -Reply 

>I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...

*ahem*  Dare I suggest: Riviera or Eldorado? Did they share a
lot of platform parts?

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 17:25:06 -0300
Subject: Re: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds 

>My uncle said I could remove the convertor cover, and drill & tap a hole in
>the side, and then plug it with a threaded plug.  Kinda like a drain plug
>for the convertor.  A neat idea, but has anybody ever done it?  Does it
>work?

I'm not a transmission expert, but I thought the convertor spun with
the crankshaft...? If so, wouldn't a plug in the side throw it off
balance? Flame gently, please...

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 09:57:49 -0300
Subject: Re: Used SS wheels

At 10:10 AM 9/6/96 -0300, you wrote:

>Me, no, but with the Hollander number 
>Andrew C. Green 

Hey, can you tell me what that number was again??  Thanks!
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Sun, 8 Sep 1996 10:03:34 -0300
Subject: Re: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds

At 05:25 PM 9/6/96 -0300, you wrote:

>I'm not a transmission expert, but I thought the convertor spun with
>the crankshaft...? If so, wouldn't a plug in the side throw it off
>balance? Flame gently, please...

That did cross my mind.  I wouldn't use a plug bigger than 1/4" npt.  You
are removing a certain amount of material from the convertor to begin with
to make the hole for the plug.  The plug couldn't weigh much more than the
amount of steel you drill & tap out of the convertor (1/2 ounce??)  Will
that much weight make a great difference in balance?
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 21:50:48 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply -Reply

Andrew C. Green wrote:
> 
> >I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...
> 
> *ahem*  Dare I suggest: Riviera or Eldorado? Did they share a
> lot of platform parts?

OK, that does it.  Torches and pitchforks at Andy's place at midnight!

The 66 Toro and MIke


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 21:48:39 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply -Reply

Blaine Sanders 5483 wrote:
> 
> I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...

Hmmm...  Good point.  OK, everybody send that post back.  
Should read: 

  "Obviously lesser vehicles that used somewhat similar components"

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 17:54:38 -0300
Subject: Re: Used SS wheels 

>Hey, can you tell me what that number was again??  Thanks!

Hollander #4015.

There's also a spiffy wire wheel option for that year, which is
listed as #4016...

Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
Datalogics, Inc.
441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:27:29 -0300
Subject: Re: CHROME NEEDED

$20 plus $5 shipping

------------------------------

From: Blaine Sanders 5483 <BLAINES@strata3d.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:40:00 -0300
Subject: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds -Reply 

Dave,
Hold the drill!  I seem to recall something like that.  Give me the weekend
to dig out my "Turbo Hydramatic 350 Handbook" and I'll let you know. 
Now that I think about it, I believe that "pumping the cooler line" was the
preferred method.  I'd think twice before taking your Uncles advice (no
offense).  I'll try and find the book so I can find out for sure.  Geez, I
should prolly even do that on mine...

- -Blaine

>>> Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net> 09/08/96 06:36am >>>
>  Is there a way to drain the torque convertor without removing it? 
>Could I remove one of the steel cooler lines where it attaches to the
>radiator tank, start the engine, and let it pump out there?  (The pump
>pumps with the tranny in Park, right?)  Or will that hurt the tranny?  
>
<snip>

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 12:26:11 -0300
Subject: Re[2]: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds 

     Nope, the guts inside spin, but the casing itself doesn't spin.  I 
     have heard of people putting in converter drain plugs, but I'd be 
     reaaaaaly careful if I were you.  You could drill too deep or have a 
     plug too deep and it would hit the moving parts in there.  Or you 
     could strip the hole and have a converter with a hole in it.
     
     I know that a lot of oil change places will do a total fluid change on 
     the tranny.  I think they do it similar to how is suggested, except 
     that you don't pump it all out of the coolant line and then add new 
     stuff.  It works more like bleeding the brakes where you add new stuff 
     and watch the old stuff come out.  When you see fresh stuff start 
     coming out, it's changed.  Then hook things up and check the fluid 
     level.  This of course would be done after you change the transmission 
     filter.
     
     Tom L.


______________________________ Reply Separator 
_________________________________
Subject: Re: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds
Author:  oldsmobile@ccn.cs.dal.ca at INTERNET
Date:    9/6/96 2:48 PM


>My uncle said I could remove the convertor cover, and drill & tap a hole in 
>the side, and then plug it with a threaded plug.  Kinda like a drain plug 
>for the convertor.  A neat idea, but has anybody ever done it?  Does it 
>work?
     
I'm not a transmission expert, but I thought the convertor spun with 
the crankshaft...? If so, wouldn't a plug in the side throw it off 
balance? Flame gently, please...

------------------------------

From: Blaine Sanders 5483 <BLAINES@strata3d.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:30:38 -0300
Subject: Re: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds -Reply 

>>> Andrew C. Green <acg@dlogics.com> 09/06/96 02:25pm >>>
>I'm not a transmission expert, but I thought the convertor spun with the
>crankshaft...? If so, wouldn't a plug in the side throw it off balance?

 There is a method described in "Turbo Hydramatic 350 Handbook" that
deals with draining the converter while in the car.  I don't remember any
specifics, but I do remember that the way they recommended
draining/corking was by drilling a tiny hole (1/8" maybe?) then corking it
off with a pop rivit of some sort.  Of course, they didn't recommend this
method at all, because the chances of retaining a seal were very slim. 
According to the author, the best thing to do is remove the converter and
drain it that way.  Uh, again as Andrew said, "Flame gently".  It's been
nearly a year since I read that and I may be completely out in left field.

- -Blaine

------------------------------

From: Katana72@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:30:09 -0300
Subject: Re: No 1971 W-31 (was re: 67 Toro Deluxe for sale) 

according to my olds guru in Va Beach, he said that the ram rod 350 was made
in 68 and was changed into the w-31 in 69. He said it was the same engine,
etc. what do I know? You know, garbage in = garbage out.....   :)


Katana72             It's NOT your father's Oldsmobile
                 Hastings, MN 

------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:10:25 -0300
Subject: [none]



------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:04:40 -0300
Subject: Portosonic  

David Brown,
Got your note, but haven't had a chance to respond. Sorry for the delay.
I see you're in Chicago, maybe drop me a note offline on when we could
talk this weekend about the manifold. Here's what I remember:

Good low end torque, good midrange power, not great breathing above 
4000 rpm, but then how much time do you spend in that part of the 
RPM range? I didn't do much of that sort of thing in my 98 as you can imagine,
especially not with 2.73 gears. Small cap HEI hybrid might be a great
solution, any interest in my old points distributor? It worked great until
HEI too.

It is setup for squarebore (holley) carb, it is the 360 degree design and
each runner has a primary/secondary split in the port. I think that's
the key feature of the design, though what it achieves I don't know.

Mine is unpainted and unabused, yanked it when I put in HEI and it's been
on the shelf for years. No leaks vacuum, water or otherwise when I used it. 

Let me know what would be a good time to talk about this manifold. Otherwise
it's trashbound. I used it with both 3.08 and 2.73 gears and I chirped the
3.08 in first once or twice with the stock 14" wheels.         

------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:57:35 -0300
Subject: Mallory Distrib 

Sorry, but I blitzed the address of the person who wante the Mallory
distributor that's complete, but I think fried. Your price was o.k
by plus shipping, but I don't have your address or phone. Good idea
to send me an email directly with it so I can send over this weekend
and get it out of my garage. Hope it's going to a good home and
will include some spare parts (don't know what I've got) in the price.
look forward to hearing from you.   
thanks
cf

------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:15:13 -0300
Subject: Cable Housing 

Think I have a good one here:

My 66 cruise control wheel to cruise unit cable housing is bent. This 
is the thing the cable rotates inside of. Can any of you think of a
good way to get the kinks out of it or othewise straighten it? 

Maybe I could thread it with something just the right diameter and
roll it back + forth on flat surface?  What could I thread it with?

Hmmm.
cf

------------------------------

From: Rocketeer <bparker@nmsu.edu>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:17:49 -0300
Subject: RE: Spotted: 66-67 (?) wagon

> 
> Vista - Cr(Br)uiser?  Probably a 330 engine if a '67.  3 Flavors, 250, 310 
or 
> 320 hp so no 400.  350 or 400 if a '68.  250/310 hp on 350, 290/360.
> 

Not true... The 400 (2bbl) was available in '67 as the Turnpike Cruiser
option. For a VC this would make a great towing vehicle.

Boyd Parker (aka Rocketeer)            __|__
                                      |  |  |  Why drive just a car...
1966 4-speed Cutlass Convertible      |  |  |  when you can ride a rocket !
1970 4-4-2 Convertible                |  |  |
                                      | /|\ |
                                      |/ | \|
                                      |__|__|
                                         |

------------------------------

From: Katana72@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:30:57 -0300
Subject: Re: Spotted: 66-67 (?) wagon 

Sounds like a Vista Cruiser???

------------------------------

From: Blaine Sanders 5483 <BLAINES@strata3d.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:18:13 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply  

>>> Andrew C. Green <acg@dlogics.com> 09/06/96 02:23pm >>>
>>I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...
>
>*ahem*  Dare I suggest: Riviera or Eldorado? Did they share a lot of
>platform parts?

OK, ya got me there...  But nothing compares to the outer looks. 
An-an-an' what I meant was, n-n-nothing else that Olds made,
anyway.  Yeah.

- -Blaine

------------------------------

From: "Timothy A. Churchill" <tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:04:57 -0300
Subject: Re: ASCII Graphics (Was Re: Decoding VIN's)

> >            ________
> >           /________\
> >          {0-0}=={0-0}  '67 CS Convt
> >
> >...then again, maybe not.  I guess I'll just stick to attempts
> >at witty reparte (emphasis on attempt) :)

> Ok, when are you going to start???
> 
>        ________  
>       /________\
> Brad (0-0||||0-0)
> 
> 

"Reparte" means I'd respond to something witty.... when I see something witty
from you, Brad, I'll respond! :)


Tim (Punchy But Headin' Out for the Weekend) Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, nickname yet to be determined
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 19:57:10 -0300
Subject: [none]



------------------------------

From: John & Robin Whitcore <retrotek@phoenixat.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 17:39:37 -0300
Subject: URGENT HELP!!!!TH-350 Torque Conv./W-31!!!!

Hi all!

We need to get our TH-350 back in our '70 W-31 this weekend in order 
to meet our "gettin' it ready" schedule for a BIG show coming up. The 
torque converter that was in it was a 10''. Our transmission guy 
recommended a 12'' since we don't race it. What originally came with 
it? We'd hate to go through all the work of putting it back in with 
the wrong converter.

Thanks in advance......j&r

------------------------------

From: "Roger M. Borlase" <BORLASE@gordonc.edu>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 21:39:55 -0300
Subject: RE: Spotted: 66-67 (?) wagon 

>> Vista - Cr(Br)uiser?  Probably a 330 engine if a '67.  3 Flavors, 250, 310 
or 
>> 320 hp so no 400.  350 or 400 if a '68.  250/310 hp on 350, 290/360.
>> 
>
>Not true... The 400 (2bbl) was available in '67 as the Turnpike Cruiser
>option. For a VC this would make a great towing vehicle.

No Boyd.  On page 46 of Olds 442 and w-machine resto guide lists the engines 
for a VC as 320 hp Jetfire rocket HC (L 74), 310 hp Jetfire rocket (L 73), 
250 hp Jetfire rocket (std).  On page 45, all the Jetfire rockets were listed 
as a 330 cid engine. 

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 21:52:11 -0300
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds 

At 11:26 AM 9/6/96 -0400, you wrote:
>
>     Nope, the guts inside spin, but the casing itself doesn't spin.  I 

Um, since the casing of the torque converter is bolted to the flywheel, I'd
_hope_ it spins...

>     have heard of people putting in converter drain plugs, but I'd be 
>     reaaaaaly careful if I were you.  You could drill too deep or have a 
>     plug too deep and it would hit the moving parts in there.  Or you 
>     could strip the hole and have a converter with a hole in it.

I've heard that the plug is close enough to balance out the metal removed.
But I'd still pump it out the cooler line.

- -----------
- - Bob Barry
- - 1969 Toronado & 1970 Cutlass Supreme SX (the 455 big-block boys)
- - 1978 Electra Limited Landau Coupe (409 Olds SMALL-block powered!)

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 15:11:36 -0300
Subject: Tranny stuff. 

     Okay, I was wrong, the torque converter does spin.
     
     Open mouth, remove foot, insert other foot. . .  At least it's friday.
     
     On another transmission related note, I'm installing a small tranny 
     cooler this weekend and I want to put in in series with the existing 
     radiator.  Which tranny line going to the radiator is usually in and 
     which is out?  I would guess that the top is in and bottom would be 
     out, since 1) you don't want to suck in air and 2) heat rises so you 
     want the cooler stuff from the bottom to go back from the tranny.  Is 
     my reasoning right?
     
     Or should I just bag it and hook a hose to one of the lines and turn 
     the engine over to find out?
     
     I think I found a really slick cooler and mounting place for it on the 
     G-body cutlass's, I'll post a report once I'm done!
     
     Thanks!
     
     Tom L.

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 22:41:49 -0300
Subject: Re: Used SS wheels 

In a message dated 96-09-05 23:01:53 EDT, you write:

<< Uhh, what's the difference between a wheel cover and a hubcap?  I never
knew
 there was a distinction.  Just called everything a hubcap.  >>

A wheel cover of wheel disc, covers the entire wheel, attaching to the rim of
the wheel.  A hubcap covers the hub & lug nuts only, attaching to the 3 of 4
little "nubs" (some call these t*ts) located on the small ring that is
pressed on the inside area of the wheel.  Hubcaps seem to be called "dog
dishes" up north here, and "poverty hubcaps" down south.  Hubcaps sometimes
have optional trim rings (beauty rings) that is just a chrome band that
attaches to the rim of the wheel in the same way a wheel cover would.
 Understand????

And the wheel covers you're talking about are '69 only, Abody only, deluxe
wheel discs.  They are similar to the '67 full line deluxe wheel discs.

Paul

------------------------------

From: JK McCall <jkmccall@clic.net>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 01:32:56 -0300
Subject: Barrie Car Show: (Ontario)

Greetings:

Made an 8 hour trip from Quebec City to Toronto today in the hopes to 
attend the final show of the summer at the Barrie show and swap.  Got 
here only to find out that the weather may not going to co-operate.  
Well post if I see anything interesting.

On a  side note:  Anyone on the list live in the Toronto Area?  I`m 
staying at my sisters place and have commandered her computer to be able 
to retrieve my mail.  Will check back from time to time.

LTR

JK MCCall

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 23:48:18 -0300
Subject: OCA Blue/Gray Chapter Fall Show 

Just a reminder folks, 11th annual fall show for the Blue/Gray Chapter of OCA
will be held NEXT Sunday, Sept. 15 in Hershey, PA.  Blue/Gray covers the
areas of Pennsylvania and Northern MD.  If you're within driving distance of
Hershey, you're invited to attend.  For further information email -
PHartlieb@aol.com.  Hope to see you there.

Paul

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 23:48:16 -0300
Subject: Re: Decoding VIN's 

In a message dated 96-09-06 01:50:50 EDT, you write:

<< Mystery Digit in 81-88's. >>

Regarding the "Mystery Digit", referred to by the factory as a "check digit".
 Every number and letter in a VIN is assigned a numeric value.  When all
these numeric values are added, they should all add up to the same total.  No
VIN matches the pre-set total number until a check digit is added to make the
VIN come to the right total.  When entering a VIN into a computer system (GM
for example) this is how the computer terminal knows whether or not you are
putting in a good VIN.  The check digit has no meaning except to balance the
equation.  As far as I know, check digits have always been numbers.  I do not
know what the value is for letters, nor do I know what the total to be
matched is.

Paul
Former Dealer Communications System operator for an Oldsmobile dealership.

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 23:48:18 -0300
Subject: Re: Spotted: 66-67 (?) wagon 

In a message dated 96-09-06 19:48:27 EDT, you write:

<< Not true... The 400 (2bbl) was available in '67 as the Turnpike Cruiser
 option. For a VC this would make a great towing vehicle. >>

But this option was not available for the Vista-C.  Only on Cutlass Supreme
coupes and convertible...

L66 Turnpike Cruising Option - Includes 300hp Rocket 400 V-8 Engine with
2-bbl. carburetor and Climatic Combustion Control Engine Air-Induction System
(K50), 7.75 x 14" White-Line nylon-cord tires and heavy-duty chassis items.
 Turbo Hydra-Matic Transmission (M40) required.  Cutlass Supreme Coupes and
Convertibles....$142.18.

Paul

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 18:39:37 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442...should I buy it?

Andrew C. Green wrote:
> 
> >>>cars: 1972 Cotner-Bevington Oldsmobile 98 Endloader, 1966 Pontiac GTO, 
1973
> >>>Imperial LeBaron, 1987 Chevrolet Camaro IROC-X, 1955 Cadillac Seville, 
1969
> >>>Cadillac DeVille Convertibles (2), 1976 Cadillac Series 75 Fleetwood 
Brougham
> >>>1961 Imperial Custom, 1973 Buick Riviera
> >>
> >>Then again, Dan, where are you going to *fit* that thing? ;)
> >
> >that's what my mom wants to know  :)
> >
> >Dan Dale
> >looking for a huge field
>  ^^^^^^^^^^^
> I'd have thought you'd already found one. What are you doing,
> stacking them on end?  :-)
> 
> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
> Datalogics, Inc.
> 441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
> Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473


Andy,

He's putting them in his barn like all of us do.  Don't they have barns 
in Chicago?  Where did Mrs. Murphy keep her cow?

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 23:48:06 -0300
Subject: Re: Another Olds Movie Car Sighting -Reply 

In a message dated 96-09-06 00:28:33 EDT, you write:

<< So which cutlass models of the 72 model year have the checkboard and which

 have the horizontal strips? >>

All Cutlass Supreme models have the checkerboard grille, as do Vista
Cruisers.  Hurst/Olds models also have the checkerboard, but they're painted
black.

Cutlass S, Cutlass & F-85 models, as well as Cutlass Cruisers have grilles
with 8 or nine horizontal bars.

442 grilles are deep set and have a gazillion little rectangles in them.

Clear things up?

Paul

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 18:54:41 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply

Andrew C. Green wrote:
> 
> >I would say more than any comparable car.
> 
> Probably you meant to say "_no_ more than any comparable car"...?
> 
> >I'd buy it but then Andy Green says I don't know what I'm thinking about
> >let alone talking about.   ;)
> 
> Yeah, I'd agree with that.  :-)
> 
> Andrew C. Green            


Andy,

Well I'll definitly agree because I said it.  It sounds true, too.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 23:48:19 -0300
Subject: Re: Aurora 

In a message dated 96-09-06 11:57:17 EDT, you write:

<<  2.  This was the last year for _any_ rear wheel drive Oldsmobiles.  
      There was _one_ 98 left on the lot, and once that's sold there ain't 
      no mo.  The 97 models are all FWD.
      
      3.  Also no plans to put the Aurora V8 in any other Oldsmobiles. >>


#2  Beg to differ here.  '92 was the last rear drive Olds (Custom Cruiser).
 Everything since then has been FWD.  This is of course in exception of the
Bravada w/Smart-Trak.  '96 is the last year for the 98, but it's been FWD
since 1985.

#3  Work for a Chevy/Olds dealer.  We get a [Chevy] magazine called PRO.
 They have comparisons in this month for other '97 makes and claim that the
'97 Taurus will have an optional V8 (mid-year?).  Think Olds is making a
mistake.

Paul

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 18:59:08 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 & 69 455 -Reply 

Blaine Sanders 5483 wrote:
> 
> >>> Andrew C. Green <acg@dlogics.com> 09/06/96 02:23pm >>>
> >>I didn't know there _was_ a comparable car...
> >
> >*ahem*  Dare I suggest: Riviera or Eldorado? Did they share a lot of
> >platform parts?
> 
> OK, ya got me there...  But nothing compares to the outer looks.
> An-an-an' what I meant was, n-n-nothing else that Olds made,
> anyway.  Yeah.
> 
> -Blaine


Blaine,

Having owned the Eldorado & driven the Riviera, there is still no really 
comparable car.  The Eldorado is the ipotime of the luxury barge & 
unless one buys the GS version, the Riviera is just a jr. Eldo.  The 
Toronado is more a Grand Touring car than most with the name.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 02:07:27 -0300
Subject: Qjet vs. Holley: _again_! (need advice/experience) 

Sorry to bring this up again, but I need help fine tuning my 403.

The carb needs to be matched to this modified motor (ported heads, .445/.472
cam, Performer intake); it runs well, but falls flat in the upper rpms, and
part-throttle response is not so good. Here's the options I've got:

1) Work with the stock M4M Qjet, tuning in power valve, main jets and rods,
secondary rods and hangers, and possibly modifying the idle circuit.
- -Pros: Qjet can be an excellent street carb, retains stock linkage/fittings,
can plausibly be considered emissions legal
- -Cons: Parts are not cheap (though with Edelbrock in the picture repopping
the Qjet, more are readily available; still, a basic tuning kit costs nearly
$100), and I don't have a mountain of parts carbs on hand. Not the simplest
carb to open up and modify. One slip of the drill and I can modify the carb
into a greasy paperweight.

2) Use my 750cfm Holley 3310 vac. secondary carb with a "trick kit",
electric choke and a handful of jets and power valves
- -Pros: Parts are cheaper and more available. More people have experience
modifying the carb. Conceivably easier to fine-tune.
- -Cons: Forget about passing a future stricter emissions standard (visual).
Lack of smaller primaries can hurt fuel economy. I'll need to screw around
to get the fittings right.

I know we've been through this before, but I'm looking for the easy way out
in this situation; I don't want to spend my next year of spare time
fine-tuning this thing.

TIA

- -----------
- - Bob Barry
- - 1969 Toronado & 1970 Cutlass Supreme SX (the 455 big-block boys)
- - 1978 Electra Limited Landau Coupe (409 Olds SMALL-block powered!)

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 02:28:46 -0300
Subject: Re: Tranny stuff. 

At 02:11 PM 9/6/96 -0400, you wrote:
>     On another transmission related note, I'm installing a small tranny 
>     cooler this weekend and I want to put in in series with the existing 
>     radiator.  Which tranny line going to the radiator is usually in and 
>     which is out?  I would guess that the top is in and bottom would be 
>     out, since 1) you don't want to suck in air and 2) heat rises so you 
>     want the cooler stuff from the bottom to go back from the tranny.  Is 
>     my reasoning right?

You'd think, but actually it's the reverse; The fluid goes in the bottom
radiator inlet and out the top. This is of interest to me since I too am
going to add another cooler on my Electra (and hopefully keep the 409's
temps down a bit; keep the radiator from doing so much), since the 2400
stall converter is bound to make things run a bit hotter.
     
>     Or should I just bag it and hook a hose to one of the lines and turn 
>     the engine over to find out?

You could, but that's very messy. Easier to get yourself a shop manual and
just look at the figures there (you should get one anyway...).
     
>     I think I found a really slick cooler and mounting place for it on the 
>     G-body cutlass's, I'll post a report once I'm done!

I'm looking for a cooler that has a female flare fitting, so that I can bend
some hard line to run to it. I don't really like the looks of the
rubber-hose ones (though I'm sure they work fine), or the idea of running
rubber hoses through a hole in my front support. I'd rather have hard lines
going through a grommet.

Any recommendations? A friend had to replace a cooler on his work van, and
it had the flare fittings, but no name. :(

- -----------
- - Bob Barry
- - 1969 Toronado & 1970 Cutlass Supreme SX (the 455 big-block boys)
- - 1978 Electra Limited Landau Coupe (409 Olds SMALL-block powered!)

------------------------------

From: Brad Baker <bradbaker@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Fri, 6 Sep 1996 20:04:40 -0300
Subject: Parts please

Good evening.I am looking for some parts for my '68 CS convertible. Mostly
interior parts like a drivers door handle pad -black-,a parking brake pedal
pad and the knob for the release, a glovebox lock mech, two front window
handles, a passengers door panel -black/no carpet-, driver side sun visor,
rear quarter windows rubber strips -2-, and a dashboard clock that works.
Also I am looking for a front right side running light(markerlight) and some
metal connecting bar pieces for the convertible top that have broken. I
don't have a very big budget for this car right now because Honey has other
things she wants to spend money on -curtians or some stupid thing like that-
but I would like to here from any '68 owners that have extra parts taking up
space. Thanks....

Brad  (0-0||||0-0) CS Convt

------------------------------

From: CMatt95460@aol.com
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 03:44:06 -0300
Subject: 69 442 options and colors 

Does anyone out there have a list of available interior/exterior color
combinations for a 69 442?  Also, was the ram air hood available on the 442,
or just the H/O?  Was a vinyl top available on the 442?

------------------------------

From: JPADA@hqgate.orbital.com
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 04:47:59 -0300
Subject: Re: Qjet vs. Holley: _again_! (need advice/experience) 

Bob,

          If you were looking for the easy way out, you'd own Chevies!
          Keep the Q-Jet.  My experience with Hollies is that you
          can very easily and inexpensively tune the RPM at which
          the flat spot comes in, but you can't get rid of it.
          Your comments on emissions testing are good ones.  Get the
          latest issue of Muscle Car Review, as it has an excellent
          article on building a Q-Jet.

          Joe Padavano
          jpada@hqgate.orbital.com

          66 442
          68 W-30
          69 H/O
          70 W-30

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 09:28:27 -0300
Subject: Re: 69 442 options and colors

On Sat, 7 Sep 1996 CMatt95460@aol.com wrote:
> Does anyone out there have a list of available interior/exterior color
> combinations for a 69 442?  Also, was the ram air hood available on the 442,
> or just the H/O?  Was a vinyl top available on the 442?

Here are the color codes for '69:

A - Ebony black
B - Sable
C - Cameo white
D - Nassau blue
E - Trophy blue
G - Topaz
H - Meadow green
J - Aztec gold
K - Tahitian turquoise
M - Glade green
N - Burgundy mist
P - Platinum
R - Crimson
S - Palomino gold
Y - Saffron

Vinyl roofs were available in codes:
2 - black
3 - blue
5 - parchment
8 - sable
9 - green

Interior colors depended on exterior colors, model, and type of seat 
chosen. The colors were black, green, blue, gold, red and antique parchment.

As near as I can tell, the ram-air hood wasn't available except on the H/O.


Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Katana72@aol.com
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 10:05:27 -0300
Subject: Re: Qjet vs. Holley: _again_! (need advice/experience) 

I"m running a 482/492 cam in my 72 cutlass, which has in it a 65 330 motor.
I Use a Q-JET and was perfectly happy with it when I lived in VA Beach. I was
running a 0-60 time of 7 secs with three people in ht e car and a bunch of
junk in the trunk. Parts for the q-jet came from the local junkyards and the
rebuild kit only cost 
$20.00. Since I've moved to MN, I've had to convert to Oxygenated gas and
have had no time to tinker with the carb to re-adjust it for the difference
in atmosphere, gas, etc. In My opinion, Q-jets are the best for the grand ol
olds. I didn't have to do anything with the idle circuits, either. I've also
seen nothing but problems with the Holleys I've been around. They leak, the
floats stick, etc. Another option is the Edelbrock Q-jet clone. It's
supposedly way better than the Rochester, but then you still have the smog
stuff to deal with. BTW< I get 18 mpg if I stay out of the secondaries.

Katana72       

------------------------------

From: Katana72@aol.com
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 10:07:24 -0300
Subject: Re: Qjet vs. Holley: _again_! (need advice/experience) 

Also, there's a book on rebuilding q-jets out there. it shows ALL the tricks.
I got mine at Pep Boys.


Katana72

------------------------------

From: John & Robin Whitcore <retrotek@phoenixat.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 08:16:56 -0300
Subject: Re: No 1971 W-31 (was re: 67 Toro Deluxe for sale)

Katana72@aol.com wrote:

> etc. what do I know? You know, garbage in = garbage out.....   :)

Hey!!!! No insulting our car....   It's a rare piece of "garbage"


Thpbphpt

....R

------------------------------

From: Brad Nicholson <76062.3042@CompuServe.COM>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 12:41:55 -0300
Subject: Web chat w/ AC/Delco & Earnhart

I got this from AC Delco over the 'Net.  Thought someone might be interested
==============================================================
Dear Edgers:

Don't forget to mark your calendars for Wednesday, Sept. 11, 8 to 9 p.m., 
EDT, when Dale Earnhardt will chat live on Talk Time.

The seven-time Winston Cup champion will stop by ACDelco's On The Edge to 
discuss everything from his winning ways to how the 45-year-old North 
Carolina native picked up the nickname, "The Intimidator."

Visit http://www.acdelco.com/chat for software download instructions. Note: 
if you've previously downloaded Global Chat, please revisit our chat page 
in the next few days for new chat instructions, and to download the newest 
version of Global Chat.

Join us next Wednesday for a Talk Time that promises to deliver lots of 
horsepower.
==================================================
 ---
| | |  Brad Nicholson
| | |  1987 442
|/|\|  1994 88 LSS (soon!!!)
| | |  President - CCR (thru 12/97)
 ---  76062.3042@compuserve.com

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 16:17:46 -0300
Subject: Re: Decoding VIN's

PHartlieb@aol.com wrote:
> 
> When entering a VIN into a computer system this is how the computer 
> terminal knows whether or not you are putting in a good VIN.  

Yup.  It's to catch typos.

I've written software in the past to handle check digits so if somebody 
want to send me a couple of examples, I'll try to figure it out.  Usually 
some module-10 or 11 deal.

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: oldsnut@westworld.com (Chuck Noppe)
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 13:53:18 -0300
Subject: Re: a color for Tiny 

>
>> << Suggestions received so far on a color for Tiny 
>>  (Tiny is a '69 Olds 98 Convertible with a black interior and top) >>
>
>In keeping with observations from some that larger cars  perhaps aren't
>as suited for primary colors (like red, f'r instance), and also in keeping
>with this auto's, err, mass :) :
>
>
>Battleship Grey? :)
>
>
>
>Tim (Whose New Fleetwood is a Compact Compared to the Brougham) Churchill
>-------------
>'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
>'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, nickname yet to be determined
>'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'
>

These wonderful cars look great in metallics or white, stay with a factory
color though!
Chuck Noppe 

Oldsnut @ westworld.com

71 Oldsmobile Ninety Eight LS
71 Cadillac Coupe Deville
72 Oldsmobile Ninety Eight Regency

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 05:59:31 -0300
Subject: Re: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds -Reply

At 07:40 PM 9/6/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Dave,
>Hold the drill!  I seem to recall something like that.  Give me the weekend
>to dig out my "Turbo Hydramatic 350 Handbook" and I'll let you know. 

OK!  I'll be waiting...

>Now that I think about it, I believe that "pumping the cooler line" was the
>preferred method.  I'd think twice before taking your Uncles advice (no
>offense)

None taken :)

>I'll try and find the book so I can find out for sure.  

Thanks, man!

>-Blaine
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: Dave Paulison <dpauliso@metrolink.net>
Date: Mon, 9 Sep 1996 06:08:05 -0300
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Transmissions, Olds & non-Olds

At 09:52 PM 9/6/96 -0300, you wrote:
>I've heard that the plug is close enough to balance out the metal removed.
>But I'd still pump it out the cooler line.

OK, from what I've been reading here, drilling a drain hole is risky.
Therefore, I shall pump it out the cooler line.  Which line do I disconnect
(top one or bottom one)?  I'm assuming that I have to be adding new fluid
down the dipstick tube while the old crap is pumping out of the line.  So do
I do it with the engine running (how else would I pump it)?  Does the pump
pump with the transmission in Park, or does it have to be in a drive gear?

TIA!
- --
Dave Paulison          Melbourne, Florida        69 Cutlass Supreme
dpauliso@metrolink.net

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 08:26:58 -0300
Subject: Tranny cooler 

     Several places make coolers with threaded female pipe fittings on them 
     instead of the male type.  B&M makes two of them, #70265 the Street 
     Rod Cooler and #70266 the Extreme Duty.  The Street Rod one is 
     4.5x11x1.5" polished aluminum and the Extreme Duty is 10.25x11x1.5" 
     black powder coated.  The street rod one is rated 13-16,000 gross so I 
     think it'd be fine if you're using it in addition to the in-radiator 
     cooler.
     
     I chose the B&M #70255 cooler for my '84 H/O since it's the exact size 
     to fit behind the two right headlights, in front of the charcoal 
     vacuum canister, where the second battery would go on a diesel 
     Cutlass.  I didn't want to block the radiator at all, and besides the 
     two diagonal braces up there make it near impossible to put a cooler 
     there.  This area might not get as much air flow as in front of the 
     radiator, but if it's a problem I can rig up a small airdam type thing 
     to funnel air up there.  No fan either, but I figure if the car isn't 
     moving fast enough to get airflow then the tranny isn't making enough 
     heat to worry about anyways.
     
     I got this particular cooler because I've had many recommendations to 
     add an additional cooler since the 200-4R isn't the strongest tranny 
     to start with, and combined with the 3.73 gears and 2400rpm stall 
     converter it makes a lot of heat.  I chose the B&M because two tranny 
     builders I've talked to (one local, one on the net) and one shift-kit 
     maker (level 10) recommend them because the design causes a lot less 
     of a pressure drop than the old tube-and-fin style coolers.
     
     This is the hose-and-clamp style.  I would have loved hard line or 
     even braided hose with pipe fittings, but the budget don't allow for 
     that.

------------------------------

From: "Paul R. K. Kuromoto" <suntzu@ohana.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 16:13:01 -0300
Subject: Re: Portosonic 

IF this is the "Port-O-Sonic" Offenhauser you posted about earlier, it's 
not a port o sonic, it's a Dual Port...economy manifold, seems like the 
quick way to limit your 455's rev to 4500rpm tops.  The Port-O-Sonic is a 
gigantic single plane racing manifold with a holley squarebore flange.  
The Super Sonic is the Dominator flange version.

------------------------------

From: "Paul R. K. Kuromoto" <suntzu@ohana.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 16:24:17 -0300
Subject: Re: Tranny cooler

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't low speed (i.e. starting from a stop) 
when the converter makes ALL of its excess heat as it "slips" on its way 
to the stall?  After stall it's working just like any other converter.  
Most G-body installations I've seen use the "X" braces and zip ties.  Not 
pretty but I'd have to say that's about the easiest way to install a 
cooler and there aren't any durability problems with this kind of mounting.

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 19:47:33 -0300
Subject: Re: Web chat w/ AC/Delco & Earnhart

Brad Nicholson wrote:
> 
> 
> ...when Dale Earnhardt will chat live on Talk Time.  The seven-time 
> Winston Cup champion will stop by ACDelco's On The Edge to discuss 
> everything... to how... (he) picked up the nickname, "The Intimidator."

Gee, let me guess...  Cause Ironhead is real good at bonking the 
guy in front of him when he can't get past him any other way?

The 66 Toro and Mike


- -- 
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: "Jason P. Labay" <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Sat, 7 Sep 1996 18:17:38 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442...should I buy it?

Actually I have that huge field. I just cleared me a space at the rear of
our salvage yard and have 12 cars now. Most are parts cars but some are
potential fix-er-ups. I would include them in my sig but that would be
overkill...:) 
>> >Dan Dale
>> >looking for a huge field
>>  ^^^^^^^^^^^
>> I'd have thought you'd already found one. What are you doing,
>> stacking them on end?  :-)
>> 
>> Andrew C. Green            (312) 266-4431
>> Datalogics, Inc.
>> 441 W. Huron               Internet: acg@dlogics.com
>> Chicago, IL  60610-3498    FAX: (312) 266-4473
>
>
>Andy,
>
>He's putting them in his barn like all of us do.  Don't they have barns 
>in Chicago? 

________________________________________________________
Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com) or (jlabay@kent.edu)
Grad Student in Sports Administration at Kent State University
1988 Iroc Z/28	1974 Buick Riveria Stage I 455
1980 4-4-2 W-30	1975 Hurst/Olds W-25
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
- ----------------------

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #292
********************************
 
