
oldsmobile-digest          Saturday, 22 June 1996       Volume 01 : Number 211


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Scott R Clark <mickeyd@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 22:14:39 -0300
Subject: Good News!...Well, at least sort of.

	Hey everyone!

	This last week I discovered that I was not the lone 1960 Olds owner in 
these parts that I thought I was!  While I was tooling down Hwy 93 South 
doing some stuff for work, I spotted a white '60 four door!  Cool.  I 
have'nt had time to go and check it out, but it looks like it's been 
sitting for a while, kind of neglected :(  Then, two days later, I saw 
another '60.  This one was a blue statio...er, 88 Fiesta Wagon, again 
looking like it has been sitting for a while, and again, off in the 
boonies.  
	
	A couple days ago I made a trip to check out the wagon, thinking 
"hey whats the worse thing that can happen?"  When I arrived at the 
place, I decided to park outside the barbwire fence and make the walk up 
the road to the car, and then to the shack up the road to find the 
owner.  About half way there I was greeted by a huge black 
dog that was barking like mad.  "Hmmm...Whats the worst thing that can 
happen??  Well, lets see...I could get mauled by this huge dog, and wake 
up in some nightmarish scene out of "Deliverence"..."

	Well, fortunatly, things went much better.  The dog turned out to be 
much friendlier after some ear scratching, and I even managed to find the 
owner of the car at the shed (turned out to be his shop...he even had a 
couple tractors in for repairs).  Anyway, I talked to the owner (a salty 
old guy), and he said that I was actually the second guy in the past 
month to ask about buying the thing!  Weird.  Maybe the owner of the four 
door I saw was planning a restoration too...
	
	The guy said that he was actually planning to use a bunch of it to 
restore a convertable he had after he was done working on the tractors.  
So, no sale :(  Thats the bad news.  Good news is, he might sell me some 
of the front sheet metal that I need (ie. grill, hood, etc) for a couple 
hundred bucks!  Cool.  He said he should know in a month what hes doing.  


	If I'm lucky I might be able to get the transmission, and some other 
goodies as well.  I guess I'll see when he calls (he wrote my name and 
number on the wall of his shop...his "file system" as he called it.)  He 
also said that he was a bodyman for many years, and that he still had 
some body solder he could use to fill some dings if I brought them in!  
Doubble bonus!  Anyway, I guess it really does pay to check some of these 
things out, huh Chris!

	I've also spent some time cleaning the various pices of under-hood 
sheet metal on my '60.  What a mess.  That undercoating stuff is really 
tough to strip, and there is some serious rust pits in some metal (really 
bad under the battery tray...imagine that!)  I just have to remind myself 
how much I love grinding rust out.  I'm hot-tanking anything that will 
fit in the tank to strip them, but so much of that stuff is huge, so 
thats just mostly little pices of hardware, leaving me with lots of paint 
stripper, wire brushes, and elbow grease ahead of me.  Hopefully, the 
results will be worth it!  Anyway, wish me luck...I need it!!

			Scott
		1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98

------------------------------

From: Rocketeer <bparker@nmsu.edu>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 22:39:16 -0300
Subject: Re: 455

On Fri, 21 Jun 1996, Charles A Rogers wrote:

> 
> but people who drive fords are dicks
>

You need to get a life, and watch what you write...

I happen to drive two Fords as daily transportation, and
still enjoy both the Rockets in my garage.

Anyone with such a childish and pathetic outlook on other
vehicle brands can only hurt the car hobby rather than 
contribute to it.

If you don't like Fords fine, that is your right. But keep
your unwanted and in poor taste opinions to yourself. 

Boyd Parker

1990 Ford Ranger
1989 Ford Mustang
1966 Olds Cutlass Convetible
1970 442 Convertible

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 17:58:33 -0300
Subject: Re: Starter?

Robert Lawrence wrote:
> 
> When I go to start my car...
> 
> I turn the key.  At first, nothing happens, but I keep it turned.
> Then, it goes... err..err..ERR..ERR..CLACK..Whirrr.  Then, I do it
> again and it starts.
> 
> Anybody have a clue?
> 
> -Robert:

I would go straight to the battery cables and grounds.  Check each 
connection & make it clean.  If no luck - go to the ignition switch & 
check all connections there.  Even the switch should be suspect if this 
is not correcting the problem.  The Starter/solenoid would be last & can 
be checked at most parts places.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 18:23:41 -0300
Subject: Re: fun with 260's?

Chris Brown Witt wrote:
> 
> So, a friend, Pat Lind, has decided to do what some of us can only dream about
> doing...
> 
> Hot-rod a 260 engine...
> 
> Hmmm....
> --
> Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
> wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

Chris:

Wow!  And I thought I saw courage & daring in the Army.  Rangers & 
Special Forces have nothing on him.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 18:32:05 -0300
Subject: Re: 455

> 
> > > is there a way to put a 455 in a 78-88 Cutlass?  i am asking this because
> > > the S-10 has the same front clip as the cutlass and am wanting soem SERIOUS
> > > power...and if it would be a pain in the ass, what is the largest engine
> > > that i can put in there w/o too much trouble...better yet, what was the
> > > largest engine offered in these years
> > >                                 Zack
> > >
> > >
> > Zack:

Weren't there 350 Olds engines in the late 70's H/O cars.  If these were 
fit in the bodies, then doesn't it follow that a 455 is a viable 
possibility.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Jason P. Labay" <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 23:43:38 -0300
Subject: Re: 70 88 duals xman

At 04:52 PM 6/21/96 -0300, Chris Brown Witt wrote:
>Anybody KNOW for sure the casting code and/or number for a LH duals xst
>manifold for a 70 88 such as W33 car? 

The Mitchell Interchange Manual that I have gives the following casting #'s:

1970 455, 390hp Dual Exhaust

LH: 406199 

*this manifold can be found on the following cars:
Olds 65-66, 425, LH, Dual Exh
Olds 67, 425, Dual Exh, LH
Olds 68-69, 455, Dual Exh, LH
Olds 70, 455, 390HP, LH

>Roger Bacon's still looking for one. So far he claims that
>-69 is NOT the same

The interchange manual disagrees...

>-71, etc are NOT the same.

The interchange manual agrees...

>-W will not work

Manual does not say

>-Toro units no workee either

manual agrees

...hope this helps some


Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio					z28cfi@gwis.com
1988 Camaro IROC-Z/28 5.0 bowtie power			jlabay@phoenix.kent.edu
1975 Hurst/Olds W-25 5.7 rocket power
H/OCA member #0278A

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 18:41:27 -0300
Subject: Re: Still no dash pad

WMACHINES@aol.com wrote:
> 
> OK guys I still need a 72 saddle color dash pad.
> I do not want to paint a black dash.
> I would like a original saddle AC dash pad.
> So any of you olds experts willing to help besides
> W30Jim.  please respond ASAP please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> 72 W30 Race Rocket


I was just at a couple of junk yards (we have those yet in Alabama) and 
there were the remains of 15 or 20 Cutlasses from '67 to '77.  A bunch 
of 1971's & 1972's were present with interiors in various conditions (no 
saddle dash pads - sorry), radios, tilt wheels, consoles, etc.  A '67 
station wagon was present W/442 front fenders & factory air was there.  
Generic parts were available from many Chevelles & a couple of Buicks & 
Pontiacs.  

I'll be going back (its 80 miles from here) in a week or so if any one 
needs some definite item & information on cost & condition.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Roger Saladin <rsaladin@bright.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 23:44:29 -0300
Subject: Re: Synthoil trash talk 

At 11:53 AM 6/20/96 -0300, you wrote:
>In a message dated 96-06-20 08:19:13 EDT, you write:
>
><<  Supposedly, bean oil 
> (castor?) was experimented with before and was also found to be an 
> effective racing lubricant.
>  >>
>
>That _OLD_ fairy tale just won't die, will it?  Never mind the ability to
>perform the function of a lubricant, these oils support life.  If you would
>like mold, mildew and bacteria thriving in your engine, go for it.  Sure, if

I don't know how old the "fairy tale" is, but in fact castor oil has been
used as a lubricant. I raced bikes back in the '60s, and at that time Castrol
had a castor based lubricating oil that was quite popular for two stroke
racing engines because it burned much more cleanly than regular petroleum
based oils.

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 21 Jun 1996 18:54:29 -0300
Subject: Re: Good News!...Well, at least sort of.

Scott R Clark wrote:
> 
>         Hey everyone!
> 
>         
> 
>         A couple days ago I made a trip to check out the wagon, thinking
> "hey whats the worse thing that can happen?"   Hopefully, the
> results will be worth it!  Anyway, wish me luck...I need it!!
> 
>                         Scott
>                 1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98

Scott:

This is the way to get an old car together.  It seems that the more 
difficult the part the more difficult the owner of that needed part.  
You need to take the good with the bad though.  I might tell you where I 
got some of my Jetfire parts sometime.  

Congratulations.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Ken <rottin@en.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 00:25:59 -0300
Subject: 1967 442

Welp.. I bought a 1967 "442"(?) for $4600.. I'm kinda concerned that the car may not be 
 a real 442 I dont pick it up for afew days, and dont have access to the car till then.  
 I do know the VIN #338677M246541
 
  Does this number help you to determin the cars authenticity?
 
  The car has : 400cid 4bbl.
                4 speed manual trans
                dual exhaust
                louvered hood
                Posi-traction
                power top
                NO rear sway bar.
 
  The only thing that has me worried is the missing sway bar and a C/S emblem on
 the dash.  If this is just a 'Cutlass Convertible' and not a '442 Convertible' how
 much would this affect the value of the car? 

 
  Ken

------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@direct.ca>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 02:56:06 -0300
Subject: Re: 1967 442 

At 12:25 AM 6/22/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Welp.. I bought a 1967 "442"(?) for $4600.. I'm kinda concerned that the
car >may not be a real 442. I dont pick it up for afew days, and dont have
access to >the car till then.  
> I do know the VIN #338677M246541
> 
>  Does this number help you to determin the cars authenticity?

Not really.  The 4-4-2 was not a separate model until '68-'71 but was an
option only available on the Cutlass Supreme in 1967.  Therefore this VIN #
tells you that it is a '67 Cutlass Supreme Convertible (38677) built at the
Lansing, Michigan Plant.  It may very well be a 4-4-2 optioned car.  In
order for it to be a 4-4-2 it should have:

A 400 cid engine (bronze color).
A single 4bbl carb.
Automatic or Standard Trans.
Dual Exhaust with chrome tips.
Front and Rear sway bars with boxed lower rear control arms.
Letter C cast on front of left cylinder head and rear of reight cylinder head.
Special chrome air cleaner. Automatic has single snorkel (same as '66)
Four-speed has open element (same as '66).
Special 4-4-2 emblems located on front grille and bottom of both front
fenders and on bottom right of deck lid. 
 
>The only thing that has me worried is the missing sway bar and a C/S emblem on
>the dash.  

The C/S emblem on the dash is probably correct for this model year.
However, this car should have a sway bar in the rear.

>If this is just a 'Cutlass Convertible' and not a '442 Convertible' how
much >would this affect the value of the car? 
> 
>  Ken

Looking at my February '96 issue of Old Cars Price Guide, a '67 Cutlass
Supreme Convertible in #3 condition (very good condition - "20-footer") is
worth $5200.
A '67 Cutlass Supreme 4-4-2 in the same condition is worth $6800.
Remember that it is not important what this magazine thinks it's worth or
what someone else tells you what it's worth, but rather what you think it is
worth and how much you are willing to pay.  (Of course, if you try and sell
it then it does matter what the buyer thinks it's worth and how much he/she
is willing to pay :o)
 
Nick DiGiovanni
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2 - "Snarls Softly and Carries a Big Kick"

------------------------------

From: glenn connors <gpc442@buffnet.net>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 03:38:29 -0300
Subject: RE: still overheating

>>I hate to mention this but a goodrealiable acquaintance of mine told me that 
>>when he replaced the head gaskets on his '72 Olds, (Felpro), he had a bad 
>>overheating problem and ended pulling the heads back off to find that there 
>>was water jacket holes that were die cut but not punched out. 
>
>Was his a 350?  I had a valve job done on my '72 350 and seems 
>to be running hot lately, but not overheating.  The thing sounds like a diesel 
>when revving it just a little after a small drive.  Any ideas on this?  The 
>water pump was replaced in March.  The valve job was done in August of '94.
>I'm also using premium gas.
>
>Roger Borlase
>'72 Cutlass Wagon
>http://www.microdata.com/rborlase
>
>
Forgot to mention his was a 350ci. but it was more than just running hot it
would overheat at a mortal rate.

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 10:45:57 -0300
Subject: Trip Notes and While I Was Away...

Hi everyone!

I'm back from my week long trek across the USA. Quite the trip. Last 
Saturday I made it to the Homecoming in Lansing. The only problem was the 
traffic from Detroit to Lansing on the Interstate - how *do* you folks put 
up with that each day? Just crazy, either bumper to bumper at 70 mph or 
stopped due to construction. Anyway, it was a beautiful day and I had no 
problems thanks to the excellent directions some of you gave me. Thanks!

Found the Olds plant and was amazed that you could just drive in and 
park. Put on my Bryceman shirt and wandered around. Was looking for 
others and at first found no one. Spent some time with the vendors and 
wished I had a big empty suitcase with me. Bought a few small things, 
would liked to have bought more. Met Ron Memmer and his stuff is to die 
for. Love to know where he finds it. 

So many beautiful show cars it was kind of overwhelming. An entire row of 
H/Os... 4-4-2 converts... 50's stuff... after a couple of hours I was 
overwhelmed. Met Penny Casteele and Steve DeNovi of OCA, seemed like nice 
people and DeNovi wanted to buy my shirt. I figure if Bryce and Chris 
wanted to go into business together selling these things they'd make a 
fortune because I got lots of nice comments about it. Something to 
consider, guys.

Finally I went back to wandering around the vendor area and as I'm walking
along I hear a voice yell out, "Hey... who are you?". It's our esteemed
Mr. Witt, finally, who ID'ed me from the shirt. Funny how you have mental
pictures of people based on their posts here, and Chris didn't match mine
at all for some reason. I had a great time chatting... we have a similar
sense of humor, I think. Offered me a free iced tea which was much
appreciated due to the sun and heat, and then started hawking his stuff...
"Parts for sale...  get a free soda with every purchase...". Wish I had
had more time to spend with him. And, dammit, I wish I had thought to take
a picture!  Sorry, but thanks again, Chris, I really enjoyed meeting you
and I've got your flier. 

That was the best of Saturday, for after that I delievered myself into 
the clutches of Northwest Airlines and didn't get to Idaho until 3AM 
Sunday due to weather and general incompetence (would you believe sitting 
in a plane in Minneapolis for nearly 2 hours without a crew? The flight 
from hell...). Anyway, Boise and Idaho in general revealed themselves to 
me during the week and I really liked the place. For someone from Nova 
Scotia like myself, the weather was a dream, sunny and dry each day, just 
gorgeous. The city itself is neat and I recommend the place to you.

Wes Fujii called me at the hotel and we set up a meeting. I had lunch on 
Wednesday with Wes at a legit 50's drive-in (one of the things about 
parts of Boise is that time seems to have stopped around 1965) with 
carhops on rollerskates and the best burgers I've ever had. Wes' car is 
lovely, I've never seen one like it ever, and I'm really glad he took the 
time to get it out of mothballs just for me. Thanks, Wes, I really 
appreciate it. Oh, and in case you didn't know, Wes is a great guy too!

I had intended to call Bill Goodnight of the list who's also in Boise and 
meet with him too while I was there. My conference had us pretty well 
booked, though, and since I met a very special person while I was there 
(another story... do we have anyone here in Indianapolis? ;-)   ) I was 
otherwise occupied and didn't get the chance. Sorry, Bill.

All in all it was a great week. One of the lessons I learned was that for
us in the east we really have a lot of challenges compared to our friends
out there when it comes to old cars. I mean, I was astounded to see old
stuff - really old stuff - still being used as daily drivers with only
minimal rust and rot. Old cars are everywhere out there and not at all
uncommon. For example, on Wednesday my friend and I had dinner downtown
and as we were walking around afterwards we ran into a '67 CS convertible
with the yellow/yellow/yellow color combo that was offered that year only
and is so rare. Just being used as a driver, it appeared, and I tried to
explain to my new friend Julie why my jaw was dragging the pavement. You'd
just never see that here. You folks out there are really lucky, and I'm
envious. 

I've been looking at the digests for the last week and just a couple of 
comments as administrator:

1. Folks, please, please, PLEASE: trim your follow-up posts of unnecessary 
quoting. This is close to an epidemic. All of us would be appreciative 
and I don't want to have to send individual warnings.

2. The spam "good luck" post was unfortunate. Not from a list member as 
far as I can determine. 

3. I like one-liners as much as anyone, but try to keep them from getting 
out of hand. This is an OLDS list, remember, not an autos newsgroup. Try 
to keep Olds content in your posts.

4. As for Fords and guys named Dick: we don't do that here. I suspect a
spur-of-the-moment thing that the author wishes now that he never sent. 
I'll cut him a little slack on this, this time. But a retraction would be
appreciated, I think, and we will not tolerate this sort of thing in the
future. No flames to the list, either, remember. If you disagree, take it
to private email. 

That's all. I'm a little jet-lagged and otherwise disoriented right now 
following the events this week. Glad to be back, but wishing I was in 
Indy instead...

;-)

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@ccn.cs.dal.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Dana and Mary Taylor <dmtaylor@top.monad.net>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 13:00:20 -0300
Subject: Still asking 

Me again. In my quest for a good choice engine to rebuilb I collected a 
350 from an 78 Olds Salon. It has a 4brl manifold and is still all Gold 
paint. When I tried to clean the pad on the left front I lifted a large 
flake of rust and I think the number went with it. It does have the ID 3A 
on the heads. Would this or a combo of the other engines make a good 
starting place. The rest of the car was in fair shape so if anyone needs 
parts I could get them.

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 12:15:00 -0300
Subject: Re: 70 88 duals xman 

> From bparker@NMSU.Edu Fri Jun 21 21:25:04 1996
> Chris,
> I sent Roger such a manifold just a couple of months ago when you first
> posted this.
>
> It was marked with an 'X' had a 489XXX number, no provisions for an
> exhaust butterfly valve.
>
> I know this is the right one, because I saw a '70 D-88 last weekend
> with this manifold, and it had true duals on it...
> What is up with this guy???
> Boyd


Well, ya gotta wonder... Here's what his latest 4-page letter says, condensed:

Part#/ casting # still questionable... the parts books lie... Needs a LH xman
for duals for a '65-76 B/C car with bb motor [engine? :) ]

Big problem is the 70 steering box... interferes with LH xst. [maybe duals cars
had different steering box?? that'd explain it.- Chris] A very special xst man
was required... flows UP over the steering box, then points down at the back...
[sounds like the "S" xst man I just got, but he says that does not fit...]
  In 71 the steering box was moved fwd maybe 14 inches, no problem. Makes the
'70 steering link very rare & valuable... with the fwd mounted box, the LH
manifold is a lot like a Cutlass unit, even may have a center divider...
However, '71-76 xmans will NOT fit a '70 due to the steering box location.
  The 70 service manual shows a large open area, straight down, about 8x10",
with xst pipes bending 90 deg. back on a large radius.

Toro units similar, but bend outward, points right at the steering coupler,
about 1/2" away. No way.

The plentiful Cutlass bb LH xmans will not fit [presumably X, W, similar
units]. Several folks have suggested  65-69 starfire/ Delta Cutsom LH xmans...
I have not yet been able to try one, and have a feeling that this is not
necessarily so, due to confusion in the parts books.

Starfires for 65 & 66 were 88's w/ the 425. all duals, used manifold part
#393233... btw, Delta Cutoms *are* Starfires- The name change was to avoid a US
regulation on prices, and charge more by offering the performance motor &
other items as "options" rather than a package as in 1966.

 Delta Customs in '67-69 were 88's with the 425 or 455, all had duals, and
according to another parts book, used xman #393233. The current 3/96 71-older
parts book gives part #393233 for 455 w/ duals for '68-70, all exc. Toro...
[yet, with the '70 steering box diff., how can that be?- Chris] Another person
says that the 71 parts book he has lists the 68-69 LH duals xman as #393233 for
455 w/ duals, exc. Toro. [Same # again...] The 74 parts book lists the partt #
as 406199 and indicates that as TORO ONLY. [obviously not correct for a
non-Toro then- Chris]

According to both parts books, 98's had factory duals available from 65-69 &
72-74, but not 70-71... After '75, cat. conv's. precluded duals.

Originality Plus sent an xman #384895 [That'd be the "S"- Chris] convinced it
would fit. Off a 66 Starfire. It would not fit; I think it was a splayed Toro
model. [His words, not mine- Chris]  Note that the casting # is lower than the
65-66 S'fire number.

One of the club members has a couple '70 W33's which have the correct manifold,
but rust makes the casting number unreadable [Chris: well, what about that
giant LETTER onthe front there, that S or X or W or whatever...] Maybe a W33
owner in the SW US has one they can read yet?...

Bottom line: I need a 406199 LH dual xst manifold. Part #393233 might fit,
worth a try. Will pay dearly.

Day phone 800-429-5371-ext. 4247
home 817-460-8300 [TX]
email rbacon@why.net [read about every 2 weeks]
- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: Mike Hall <mikehal1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 14:26:52 -0300
Subject: My June trip...

I just got back from sunny, HOT, HOT, HOT Mexico (108 degrees).

Spent some time in Laredo, Texas and then on to Nuevo Laredo, Mexico. 
Talk about a different way of life, WOW! It was a business visit for me, 
I was running a Design of Experiments on one of my cable systems, a HVAC 
cable for the 1997 Escort. The Mexican people are so poor, we pay them 
about $4.00/day. Hard working, eager to please, the service in the 
restaurant and hotel was the BEST I have EVER received... BY FAR!

Mexico really looks like a war zone...

Driving REALLY sucks there... I really like the fact that they have STOP 
signs and Traffic Signals at the same intersection, do you stop on green 
or not? I was told to GO by the honks of more than one disturbed 
Mexican... TOURISTS! ALTO does mean STOP for the curious, The sign is the 
same, letters are different.

I, as usual, looking for and found, many rust free Oldsmobiles. Saw a 
"55" (I think) Olds 88, good condition, totally rust free, interior fair, 
2-door hardtop. I saw many, many 80's Oldsmobiles, all rust free, most 
with interiors totally shot. I saw one 1970 Cutlass from the road, baby 
blue (?) with a dark blue interior, needed some front end TLC but other 
than that a good fixer-upper. I was in traffic behind a white 1966 (?) 
Olds 88, needed lots of TLC but would have been a great base for 
restoration or as a parts car. Overall, a great place to find parts cars. 
I didn't see one Toro, I assume to pricey for the times. Anybody on the 
list who lives in that area?

Till next time,
Mike


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Michael R. Hall                                  Ortonville, Michigan
E-Mail: mikehal1@ix.netcom.com
The Oldsmobile Stable:    
     1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass S, 380 horses of pure Mondello fun...
     1991 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight Royale Broughm, the classy one...
         Brought to you by a Apple Power Macintosh 7100/80
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------

From: Mike Hall <mikehal1@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 14:26:54 -0300
Subject: Re: Still no dash pad

>'ll be going back (its 80 miles from here) in a week or so if any one 
>needs some definite item & information on cost & condition.


Bill,

I am in need of a pair of white buckets. 1972 Cutlass S...

Thanks,
Good Hunting!
Mike


<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Michael R. Hall                                  Ortonville, Michigan
E-Mail: mikehal1@ix.netcom.com
The Oldsmobile Stable:    
     1972 Oldsmobile Cutlass S, 380 horses of pure Mondello fun...
     1991 Oldsmobile Eighty-Eight Royale Broughm, the classy one...
         Brought to you by a Apple Power Macintosh 7100/80
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 10:46:15 -0300
Subject: Re: Still no dash pad

Mike Hall wrote:
> 
> >> Bill,
> 
> I am in need of a pair of white buckets. 1972 Cutlass S...
> 
> Thanks,
> Good Hunting!
> Mike
> 
> Mike:

Expect the upholstery to be old & hard.  This is the hot South you know. 
 Price should be $50-$75 for (2) repairable stuff. I'll add that to my 
list and let you know.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: John & Robin Whitcore <retrotek@phoenixat.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 12:56:12 -0300
Subject: `69 442 Dash?

We bought a `69 442 that we are stripping so we can have some minor 
body work done to it and to get it repainted.  Does anyone know how 
the dash comes off?  For the life of us, we can't figure it out.

HELP!!!

Thanks.....j&r

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@kfmw.net>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 12:35:43 -0300
Subject: Re: `69 442 Dash

> We bought a `69 442 that we are stripping so we can have some minor
> body work done to it and to get it repainted.  Does anyone know how
> the dash comes off?  For the life of us, we can't figure it out.

Well, there are a ton of speed nuts that hold the dash on.  This is one 
of those dreaded dashes (68-69) that nobody wants to remove.  I've done 
4 of them and they were all a pain.  A big help would be an assembly 
manual, it will give you a location of all the speed nuts, but you don't 
need it.  Just start feeling your hands around the back of the dash.  
You can start near the vents at either end of the dash.  Also, you'll 
probably have to remove the gauges at some point.  Some tips, are to use 
a deepwell socket for the nuts because the studs in the dash are pretty 
long.  Also, make sure you have plenty of socket extensions and flexible 
driver.  Another must is to remove your seats and drop the steering 
column (optional) if you want to.

------------------------------

From: "Roger M. Borlase" <BORLASE@gordonc.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 19:46:10 -0300
Subject: RE: Re[4]: Changing Differential Fluid 

>It was a really fun time with those screw top, fat Amsoil containers.  Used a 
>funnel with about 5" of 1/2" tubing attached to direct the lube.  Topping it off
>was the most fun.

I used a syringe to do it on my wagon.  Couldn't quite get all of it out the 
syringe.  Same deal with the quart bottles after dumping the remains of one 
into the other.

Roger Borlase
http://www.microdata.com/rborlase

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 19:58:54 -0300
Subject: Re: Synthoil trash talk 

In a message dated 96-06-20 21:33:54 EDT, you write:

>  Experiments were done with an
>oil designed to be an engine lubricant derived from certain beans."

 That is a bit different from what I assumed he was referring to in his first
post.  If it is "refined" for the specific purpose of lubrication, that's
different than using the stuff straight, which is in large part the basis of
my objections.  I understand that at least some synthoil starts life as
petroleum oil. There would seem to be no chemical reason why another source
of oil could be used in the same/similar fashion.

I also agree with everything you said.  Your right, a specific microbe which
needs or can use this type of nutrient would be required for any growth to
take place.  I just feel that the likelihood of such a bug being around is
considerably higher for an oil that is also edible for humans and/or other
vertibrates.  If there bacteria that can break down ethylene glycol, there
is, if not a good chance. at least a credible one that something will also
grow in bean, castor, peanut. etc. oils.  _If_ such a bug exists it could
wreak havoc in an engine lubricating system.  At least in one that could be
expected to be idle for some time.

Also, consider that there are microbes already know which attack crude oil.
At least experimentally; I think some were tested during the Exxon Valdez
disaster.

I checked with a most respected expert on cooking oils (my wife of course)
and she informs me that she has never had anything grow in any cooking oil
she has used while stored in a closed bottle on the shelf.

So I back off on all the items I stated (before starting brain) except that I
still feel an edible oil could, under the right conditions and microbe, allow
something to grow.

That and questionable lubricating qualities would keep me out of the market.

Bob Handren  OCA# 7728
'67 W-30 Modified
'70 SX Convertible
Oviedo, FL but somewhere near Richmond, VA this evening.

------------------------------

From: "Paul R. K. Kuromoto" <suntzu@ohana.com>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 19:53:44 -0300
Subject: RE: Re[4]: Changing Differential Fluid

They do sell "lubricant pumps" for this job, which are very useful for a 
variety of purposes...made to screw onto a standard oil bottle, kind of 
like a hand-soap dispenser.

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
 I used to think that the Information age would spawn a great
 revolution as more people got smarter due to access to more
 information.  To the contrary, now that any idiot can use the
 Net, the integrity of the information contained therein has
 been corrupted.                          --Suntzu@ohana.com
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 20:07:42 -0300
Subject: Re: Heat Soak Defined! 

In a message dated 96-06-21 12:32:13 EDT, you write:

>
>> heat soak (heet sok~) adj. -- A catchall, nebulous term used by people 
>> to describe unknown, or enigmatic dynamics of electricity relative to 
>> load and resistance through a copper wire when turning a key to start 
>> an Oldsmobile.                             ;)
>
>The 66 Toro and Mike
>
>
>
>-- 
>Michael R. Frederick, CEO
>Edison3, Incorporated
>Tampa, Florida
>(813) 210-8649
>
>
>

Hey Mikey - that's it! ;-))

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@aol.com
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 20:12:11 -0300
Subject: Re: Re[4]: Starter problems 

In a message dated 96-06-21 12:45:42 EDT, you write:

>I would like to try this out - would much rather pay $12 for a relay than
$29
>for the same MAD relay and directions.  I get pretty MAD when I have to stop
>to get gas - happens very often, and the car wont start.  Rrrrruu,
>rru,               r!   People come up to you and talk about how great it
was
>back when they had a 442 just like this, but theirs always started.  Does
>anyone have the directions?  
>
>Luke 71 442  

Unless you are very broke, the $17 difference will be rapidy spent in time
and money for the other parts you need. You also need wire (I think three
types of various color and gauge), fusible link, conectors and the
instructions.  Yes, you could probably get by with one spool of wire but
won't it be fun trouble shooting if something gets fried?

------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@direct.ca>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 21:07:18 -0300
Subject: Re: Synthoil trash talk 

At 07:58 PM 6/22/96 -0300, you wrote:
>Also, consider that there are microbes already know which attack crude oil.
>At least experimentally; I think some were tested during the Exxon Valdez
>disaster.

You're right.  In my line of work we actually keep these microbes alive in
oil refineries and process systems to consume waste oil products.  However,
the whole process must be supplimented with glycol, nutrient and caustic
(specific pH) for these microbes to "work".  Too complex to explain in 3 lines.

>So I back off on all the items I stated (before starting brain) except that I
>still feel an edible oil could, under the right conditions and microbe, allow
>something to grow.

I agree 100%!

>That and questionable lubricating qualities would keep me out of the market.

As you stated before, unless there is more proof and proper technical
studies done, I too do not want to try it on my engines.




Nick DiGiovanni
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2 - "Snarls Softly and Carries a Big Kick"

------------------------------

From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 1996 22:05:38 -0300
Subject: Buying another engine...

So, I have the opportunity to buy a rebuilt '69 Police 455-4V engine, with 350
trans, and 4-row radiator... don't think I should pass that up. Anyone
hereabouts {Lansing, MI} need a 455 or trans? Engine was bored 30 over, forged
pistons, W30 spec cam, very healthy.

Going to pick up the 69 442 engine with spun bearing tomorrow. With luck it
just might come with xst manifolds or something.

- --
Chris  B. Witt         *the* Rocket Scientist
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

From: Dana and Mary Taylor <dmtaylor@top.monad.net>
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 1996 01:04:52 -0300
Subject: Re: Buying another engine...

Chris Brown Witt wrote:
 Anyone
> hereabouts {Lansing, MI} need a 455 or trans? Engine was bored 30 over, forged
> pistons, W30 spec cam, very healthy.
> Wish cowhampshire wasn't so far away... I would be interested. I am going 
to do a 350 if i can just got a 78 from a olds salon.

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #211
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