To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET1
cc:	 
From:	oldsmobile-digest-owner @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET1 @ ABTLAB
Date:	12/10/96 12:17:18 PM
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #398


oldsmobile-digest        Tuesday, 10 December 1996     Volume 01 : Number 398


----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:47:18 -0400
Subject: Re: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus Story

NON-OLDS BELOW: DELETE NOW IF YOU ARE UNINTERESTED!!

Being a resident of the great white north I must take issue with Esko's claim
that Santa is a resident of Finland. As proof, I offer the following: Canada
Post advertises that they will deliver your letter to him and they claim
the address below is foolproof:

Santa Claus
North Pole
CANADA <--- NOTE!
H0H 0H0

Given the fact that Canada Post has a hard enough time delivering things
to us in more populated areas of the country, I figure this must be legit
since they are promoting it. ;-)

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 11:37:02 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Pearl Harbor Day

Ah, hah, hah, hah, ha!!  Love ya man!

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
                 ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ----------
>
> Please try to use some discretion, Anon., er, I mean C.R.F.

>WHAT!  Anon = CRF = WizKid?  I can't believe it!  What a shocker!

>The 66 Toro and .... (I'm not tellin ya)

See, when I started on this new fangled internet thing, I sent a message to
myself so I could tell just what other people could see 'bout me...

Frank Boerger//Tallahassee

------------------------------

From: "Mark Cornea (R)" <mcornea@ford.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:57:02 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobilia

On Dec 9, 11:14am, JPADA@hqgate.orbital.com wrote:
> Subject: Oldsmobilia
>           OK, I found the neatest toy for Christmas.  Combining the
>           pleasures of 442s and pinball, yesterday I played the
>           Demolition Man pinball game.  In addition to likenesses of
>           Stallone, Sandra Bullock, and Wesly Snipes on the back
>           glass, the triangular bumper above the left flipper has a
>           frontal view of the red 70 W-30 from the movie.  Even
>           better, they have used the 70 W-30 Matchbox car (the one
>           usually sold as a fire chief car - go figure) in a track in
>           the upper left of the playing surface.  Hitting the car with
>           the ball sends it headed after a similar Matchbox version of
>           the futuristic police car stolen by Snipes in the movie.
>           ('Course, I always had a problem with the fact that a W-30
>           couldn't catch an electric car ;))  The game also has
>           several elevated tracks, multi-ball play, a magnetic claw
>           similar to the one in the cryo-prison, and pistol grips
>           (Holy Plymouth, Batman) in addition to the normal flipper
>           buttons.
>
>           Downside of the game is the point inflation which seems
>           common in all new pinball games - 450 MILLION points for a
>           replay!  My best score in three attempts was 136 Million.
>
>           Joe Padavano
>           jpada@hqgate.orbital.com
>
>           66 442
>           68 W-30
>           69 H/O
>           70 W-30 (real _and_ Matchbox versions)
>

	Demolition Man info - One of the 3 cars that was used for the movie was
purchased from a friend of mine, he is also an OCA member. The Car that he had
was the "show car" and is the one they used for all the photo's.

	The guy had 2 442's, 1 was a RED W30 4 speed, and the other was a
RALLYE RED 442 automatic. When the company came to look at the car, found out
it was a 4 speed, they said NO, we need an AUTOMATIC. The other 442 was in for
a paint job anyway, so they ended up buying the car (Rallye Red) in primer and
painting it RED with Black W30 stripes.......I ended up buying the W30.

	Did you know that there are Demolition Man trading cards.

                                                       ___  ___
                                              /     /    / /  /
                                             / __  /  --/ /  /
       Mark Cornea (Dr Decal) `70 442 stick /_/ /_/ ___/ /__/ Red

             (MCORNEA@pt8228.pto.ford.com)

------------------------------

From: "Chris R. Smetana" <Chris_R._Smetana@DADC.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 06:58:02 -0400
Subject: Re: F-body to A-body Disc brake swap

At 03:30 PM 12/4/96 -0500, you wrote:
>>From Tom Lesniak, Reading, Pa
>  Yes you can swap '70-'81 F-body spindles, rotors, and calibers to
>'64-'72 A-body cars.
>  You need special ball joints and outer tie-rod ends and off-set
>upper control arm shafts.
>  'Hot Rod' did an article back in June, 1987 about a company by the
>name of H-O Racing Specialities, 4708 Marine Ave., Lawndale, CA
>90260. Tele. (310) 973-7078 Who made this swap.

Is the article you are talking about Old Goat New Tricks, featuring the '64
GTO of Ken Crocie (sp?) and a new ZR1.  I heard, from this list I think, that
Ken at H-O Racing went out of business in Sept., bummer.  I know of several
people who have tried the F-body disc brakes on GTO's, most notably on a '70.
You have to have about 1 INCH of shims on the control arms to get the
settings right, which is one reason why they yanked them off their Goats and
went to other disc brakes.  They also just didn't like the F-body setup.  I
think several people on the list in the last several weeks posted all the
info and parts needed to do a disc brake conversion using parts from the
following, doing this from memory so bear with me, 67-74 Nova's and clones
68-72 Buick Specials                                                   I would
 personally use only the single piston 68-72 Chevelle
 calipers as I've heard not many good things 69-72 Grand Prix
 about the dual piston calipers on '67s 67-72 Tempest and I think some
others, someone else can probably finish this list.  From the donor car you
will need to take everything from the spindle to the dust cap, along with a
combination valve, which is the valve that distributes the brake fluid via
the brake lines to both front wheels, rear wheels and incorporates the brake
warning light switch,  you will also need a disc brake master cylinder along
with possibly the brake lines that go from the master to the combination
valve, I reused one of my originals when I converted my '71 Skylark to front
discs as the fitting was the correct size on the old line.  Someone on this
list also mentioned a very important part that I forgot when I did this swap,
which is the disc brake hose brackets that bolt to the frame and connect the
flexible brake hoses to the hard steel brake lines.  And of course you should
purchase new disc brake hoses.  There was an article in the Sept? '86 Hot Rod
called Brake Dancing that listed the donor vehicles for this swap, I can
check that article and post the list of donor's if anyone is interested.
Also, I think someone posted that there where only two places that they knew
of where you could buy the special ball joints, upper input shafts and tie
rods to convert to F-body disc brakes, with H-O Racing now out of business,
that only leaves Global West unless someone else found another place.  I
would bet there are probably some others. Incidentally, when I converted my
Skylark to front discs I purchased a kit from an individual in Riverside,CA
for $375.  It included all new GM parts from the spindle to the dust cap, a
new combination valve and brake lines from the master to the combo valve.  I
also bought a '66 GTO from this guy so he knocked off $20 on the brake kit.
I then purchased new disc brake hoses from Year One, about $32 each if I
remember right.  Also purchased the aforementioned disc brake hose mounting
brackets from Chicago Muscle Car Parts for $40, kinda steep if you ask me.
Finally, I had the master cylinder replaced at Midas many months before and
told the guy I would be converting to front discs and he told me there was no
difference between a disc and drum master cylinder.  After talking to some
other people, we believe he is wrong although my cars drives and most
importantly stops fine with the disc brakes and I'm guessing
drum-there-is-no-difference-from-disc brake master cylinder.

Chris Smetana
Terre Haute,IN
1969 Cutlass W-31
2 1966 GTO's - one is a parts car
1971 Skylark convertible - with the disc brakes - for sale
1989 Mustang 5.0 LX hatchback

------------------------------

From: John Young <reospeeder@earthlink.net>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 13:19:35 -0400
Subject: Re: Digitizing the Dash

Check Dakota Digital or Cyberdyne.  The make digital gauges for the
aftermarket.  Dakota advertises on the inside back cover of Rod &
Custom magazine.  If you get a catalog from them both you might
find what you're looking for (except for the command console)

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 06:23:58 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile collectables

     I saw these at the local Toys-R-us just recently.  I bought the '74
     H/O pace car.  They also had a '78 (?) Delta-88 pace car too.  They
     showed the '70 as available on the back, but I couldn't find one.
     $4.95 for the pack (you get an indy car too), Johnny Lightning brand
     name.


______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Oldsmobile collectables Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    12/9/96 10:07 AM


The other night I was in the local racing collectable store. They had a
number of 1/64 sets of Indy car with a pace car. I noticed that one
     of them was a 1970 Olds pace car. It was packaged with a new style
     Indy car. The price was $7.95. The brand was either "Racing
     Collectables" or "Johny Lightning". Sorry but 23 years of Olds exhaust
     has had an effect

------------------------------

From: John and Robin Whitcore <retrotek@phoenixat.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 11:03:34 -0400
Subject: Re: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus / OLDS: carburetor jets

> From: Esko Ilola <esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi>
> Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 04:33:28 -0400
> Subject: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus / OLDS: carburetor jets
>
> As You propably know, S.C. lives in Finland.
>
> The story was very pleasing and quess what, I read them all.
>
> Seems like the magig words "NON-OLDS" is the best ad for
> Your message. I always read ALL the NON-olds messages. Don't you?
>
> But when i come across a lousy W-31-message, I simply delete it.

I'm just curious why you would delete such a message. Maybe you've
gotten smoked off the line one too many times by a W-31?!? Maybe you own
a FORD?

......john

'70 W-31

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 16:50:53 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: 350 Olds parts swap

Is there a big "N" cast onto the side of the front weight?

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
                 ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ----------
Nope, they are cast, though of nodular iron, I believe.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: grpruett@vt.edu (Greg Pruett)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 09:10:23 -0400
Subject: HEI woes

Deja vu!  My HEI distributor , bought used 3 months ago to replace a points
distributor that conked out on me, has conked out on me.  I would appreciate
any advice I can get.  I was driving when the engine cut off then cut back
on, then died a few seconds later.   There was no sputtering, the engine
died as if I had turned it off.  I checked the gas supply by pumping
accelerator and looking down the carb and the accelerator pump was squirting
gas as it should.  I checked spark and it was fine too.  I assumed it
flooded somehow so I just waited 10 mintuits and it started again.  I drove
it about 4 miles and it cut off then backfired.  It re-started, ran smoothly
for a second and died again.  A cop spotted me and had a wrecker come to tow
the car since it was stalled at a busy stoplight.  After the car was dropped
off at my apartment i re-started it with no trouble.  I just got discusted
and turned it off after a few minuits of idileing normally.  An hour or so
later I re-started it and it died after a minuit or so.  There was no spark.

The crimp connectors look good on the wire that runs from the fusebox to the
distributor and it was new when I installed the distributor 3 months ago.
It sparks just a little when I connect it while the key is on,  so it
appears voltage is reaching the distributor.  My multimeter is busted so I
can't test voltage or ohms for sure.  Has anyone had a similar problem with
their HEI?  Would anyone konw if this is consistent with a module or pickup
coil failure?  I'm not fond of removing distributors so I'd like to make
sure before I pull it to replace the electronic goodies inside.  The coil is
new, (3 mos old) by the way but I don't know how to check it without a meter.


Any suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks
Greg Pruett
`72 Vista-Cruiser

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 18:37:55 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Headers or manifolds?

Mark and anyone else
,
I know you said Hookers shouldn't leak based on your experience with them,
but if a header did leak, could it be caused by the flange not being true?
Do you think milling the flange a little bit would fix the problem, or
maybe the flange is too thin to begin with, thus warping.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
                 ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ---------
 Aaron, you should go with the Hooker Comp Headers with the 1 7/8 th tubes
and 3 1/2 inch collectors.  No modifying will be necessary with these
headers.

W MACHINES
(Mark Prince)

------------------------------

From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 18:47:09 -0400
Subject: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish

     On a similar note (to the chemists) I have a question here.  Locally
our town is using a chemical de-icer on the streets, I believe it's
Magnesium Chloride.  It works like hell on the ice (Melts it, get it?:) but
it plays hell on the cars.  Any chrome on a vehicle is vulnerable, and badly
so.  I talked to a girl today who had just discoverred her husband's new
Centerlines were ruined by pitting from this stuff.  Everyone knows C-lines
aren't cheap, so she wasn't very thrilled about the discovery.  The chrome
mirrors were starting to pit, also.  The wheels are three months old, and
they are on a '96 Dodge Ram 4X4, and around here, vehicles just ~don't~
rust,  even Fords!
     Does anyone have any experience with this or similar chemical de-icers?
Is there anything people can do to protect their equipment (aside from
garaging it over winters)?  Perhaps a coating of Vaseline or Grease, etc.
over all chrome and re-applying; say every couple hours:)?  This girl's
husband works at the Dodge dealer here, and he sees many cars coming in that
are getting corroded on the undercarraige and he says it's really causing
problems.  I'm scared to look under mine, but it's not a Dodge, so it should
be a little better....

     Any suggestions or thoughts?  TIA


      Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
      500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
      Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
      Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
      "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
      "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
             (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)

------------------------------

From: Blaine Sanders 5483 <BLAINES@strata3d.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:59:35 -0400
Subject: HEI woes -Reply

Deja-tripple-vu!  I, too would appreciate any advice here.  My used HEI
distributor (also installed about 3 mo. ago), just died on me the exact
same way.  Luckily, I didn't have to have it towed, though ;).

Thanks,

Blaine
'72 Cutlass Supreme

>>> Greg Pruett <grpruett@vt.edu> 12/09/96 06:10am >>>
Deja vu!  My HEI distributor , bought used 3 months ago to replace a
points distributor that conked out on me, has conked out on me.  I would
appreciate any advice I can get.  I was driving when the engine cut off
then cut back on, then died a few seconds later.   There was no
sputtering, the engine died as if I had turned it off.  I checked the gas
supply by pumping accelerator and looking down the carb and the
accelerator pump was squirting gas as it should.  I checked spark and it
was fine too.  I assumed it flooded somehow so I just waited 10 mintuits
and it started again.  I drove it about 4 miles and it cut off then backfired.
 It re-started, ran smoothly for a second and died again.  A cop spotted me
and had a wrecker come to tow the car since it was stalled at a busy
stoplight.  After the car was dropped off at my apartment i re-started it with
no trouble.  I just got discusted and turned it off after a few minuits of
idileing normally.  An hour or so later I re-started it and it died after a
minuit or so.  There was no spark.

The crimp connectors look good on the wire that runs from the fusebox
to the distributor and it was new when I installed the distributor 3 months
ago.
It sparks just a little when I connect it while the key is on,  so it appears
voltage is reaching the distributor.  My multimeter is busted so I can't test
voltage or ohms for sure.  Has anyone had a similar problem with their
HEI?  Would anyone konw if this is consistent with a module or pickup
coil failure?  I'm not fond of removing distributors so I'd like to make sure
before I pull it to replace the electronic goodies inside.  The coil is new,
(3 mos old) by the way but I don't know how to check it without a meter.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks  Greg Pruett
`72 Vista-Cruiser

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 10:59:47 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes

     I'd say get a new multi-meter.  You can get cheap digital ones for
     $20-$30 at Radio Shack.  My $15 one has done a great job for 8 years
     now.  Realistically, at that price you'd probably spend more on
     unnecessary repairs that you would on the meter.

     I can't help you much on the problem, my guess would be the HEI module
     (was cutting out when it got warm, now it finally died for good), but
     I wouldn't bet on it until you can check continuity and voltage at all
     the proper terminals, and ohms on the coil.

     BTW, what's an average price for an HEI module?  I've never had to buy
     one, but for some reason I thought they were around $10-$15.  I got a
     quote on one for my '84 H/O and they wanted $69!

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@FairIsaac.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:13:04 -0400
Subject: HEI Woes

When mine just up & died, I replaced the coil and it was good as new. Suggest
you check out the mechanical components, replace the coil and electro-thingy
beneath the rotor. Could it be a bad wire going into the HEI unit?

Mine's been great for years. Way less hassle than points
cf

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:15:57 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes -Reply

Maybe the pickup coil - carefully check the wires inside the dist.  You really
 need an ohm meter to check it.  FWIW, I carry a module, among other small
easily replaceable parts, in the car.  Might not hurt to get one and try it.
For you and I, there is practically no way to test a module except swap it
into a car that runs.  If there is, I would like to hear the procedure.  Keep
warm.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
                 ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:15:34 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes -Reply

>Deja-tripple-vu!  I, too would appreciate any advice here.  My used HEI
>distributor (also installed about 3 mo. ago), just died on me the exact
>same way.  Luckily, I didn't have to have it towed, though ;).

Pull the cap and rotor off and check the connections and wiring inside.
I've seen modules that weren't plugged in all the way, and I've seen pickup
coils have their wiring cracked and shorted out at different times when the
vac. advance rotates the whole assy.  This may be the case here, or it may
not.  It's mainly a visual test, though, and the hardest part is pulling the
cap and rotor.

Many HEI's had problems with the rotor, where spark would arc through the
rotor to ground, resulting in a no spark condition.  This, however, does not
sound like your problem since the car starts up again.  I'd be led to the
pickup coil's wiring as it moves around during changing vacuum conditions.
Good luck, and I hope I've nailed it for you.


      Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
      500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
      Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
      Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
      "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
      "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
             (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)

------------------------------

From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:28:40 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes

>     BTW, what's an average price for an HEI module?  I've never had to buy
>     one, but for some reason I thought they were around $10-$15.  I got a
>     quote on one for my '84 H/O and they wanted $69!

They vary greatly as I recall.  It goes along the lines of "you get what you
pay for..."  Kmart has cheap ones for $10 or $20 but many of those do not
have the quality circuitry for reliablity, etc.  The 7 pin modules they
carry don't have the right spark curves, etc.  (I'm told)  I've never dealt
with them at all, but from what I've heard, you're usually better off
spending the $$$ and getting the good ones.  Similar to Power Chips, I
imagine.  Would you buy one from Kmart?  Or from Summit?  Who's more likely
to know they're selling you the right one?  That's my thoughts on it,
anyway....

      Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
      500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
      Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
      Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
      "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
      "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
             (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 19:30:45 -0400
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Headers or manifolds?

In a message dated 96-12-09 18:05:03 EST, you write:

<< I know you said Hookers shouldn't leak based on your experience with them,

 but if a header did leak, could it be caused by the flange not being true?
 Do you think milling the flange a little bit would fix the problem, or
 maybe the flange is too thin to begin with, thus warping.   >>

the flange could be off.  You need to take a steel ruler about 18 inches long
and put
it on the flange and check for tolerance.  It should be 0 all the way
through.  if not
a machine shop could probably mill  the flange to make it true.  Depending on
the maker of the headers the flange could be too thin like if it was Black
Jack or Cyclone Headers

W Machines

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 11:29:47 -0400
Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish

     Is that liquid or pellet stuff that they're using?  They just started
     using some liquid stuff here in Spokane and they say it's not
     corrosive like salt, but they didn't say exactly what it was.  I
     wonder if it's the same. . .

     BTW, aren't centerline wheels usually aluminum?  I know they do make
     some chrome models, but when you say "centerline" most people think of
     the aluminum type.

     Tom.

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome
Polish Author:  oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    12/9/96 3:07 PM


     On a similar note (to the chemists) I have a question here.  Locally
     our town is using a chemical de-icer on the streets, I believe it's
     Magnesium Chloride.  It works like hell on the ice (Melts it, get
     it?:) but


------------------------------

From: Frank Gonzalez <PLPAUDIO@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:08:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

NON OLDS RELATED
 To Frank Boerger//Tallahassee/FL

 The Littlest Angel
LOL ROFL!!!

------------------------------

From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:03:01 -0400
Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish

>To: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
>From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
>Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish
>
>>
>>     Is that liquid or pellet stuff that they're using?  They just started
>>     using some liquid stuff here in Spokane and they say it's not
>>     corrosive like salt, but they didn't say exactly what it was.  I
>>     wonder if it's the same. . .
>
>Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's liquid.
>
>
>
>>     BTW, aren't centerline wheels usually aluminum?  I know they do make
>>     some chrome models, but when you say "centerline" most people think of
>>     the aluminum type.
>
>I think they're alum, I'm not sure.  Many use chrome and aluminum as the
same when talking wheels, and I guess I did, too... oops :)  This stuff is
getting aluminum and chrome, tho, from what I've heard.
>

      Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
      500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
      Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
      Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
      "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
      "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
             (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)

------------------------------

From: buehner@cis.nmclites.edu (buehner)
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:07:11 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

>NON OLDS RELATED
> To Frank Boerger//Tallahassee/FL
>
> The Littlest Angel
>LOL ROFL!!!

Well, I may be showing my age a bit, but here goes anyway.  What is this?
(>LOL ROFL!!!<)  I've seen it a few times, and am guessing it stands for
something good, but I havn't figured it out yet :(  Unfortuanately I missed
the Abbrev.101 class last year ;)  Thanks, & Later...

      Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
      500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
      Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
      Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
      "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
      "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
             (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 14:09:31 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

>
> NON OLDS RELATED
>  To Frank Boerger//Tallahassee/FL
>
>

Frank,

Thanks for the information.  I always wondered what "the rest of the
story" happened to be.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 14:16:11 -0400
Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish

Tom Lentz wrote:
>
>      Is that liquid or pellet stuff that they're using?  They just started
>      using some liquid stuff here in Spokane and they say it's not
>      corrosive like salt, but they didn't say exactly what it was.  I
>      wonder if it's the same. . .
>
>      BTW, aren't centerline wheels usually aluminum?  I know they do make
>      some chrome models, but when you say "centerline" most people think of
>      the aluminum type.
>
>      Tom.
>
> _____
>
Tom,

If you haven't noticed, that salt will corode aluminum as well as
iron/steel.  Look at the aluminum step plates on Yankee cars after a few
years.  They can be eaten away.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Greg Kalkhoff <gkalkhof@execpc.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 22:19:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

buehner wrote:

> Well, I may be showing my age a bit, but here goes anyway.  What is this?
> (>LOL ROFL!!!<)  I've seen it a few times, and am guessing it stands for
> something good, but I havn't figured it out yet :(  Unfortuanately I missed
> the Abbrev.101 class last year ;)  Thanks, & Later...

Charlie,

LOL=Laughing Out Loud
ROFL=Rolling On Floor Laughing
ROFLMAO=Rolling On Floor Laughing My A** Off
<G>=Grin
<BG>=Brig Grin
<VBG>=Very Big Grin
(: = Smile
(; = Wink

and so on and so on...

Sparky

- --
Greg Kalkhoff                                        See the Sparkmobile
Toronado FAQ Administrator
http://www.442.com/kalkhoff.html http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/torofaqs.htm
AKA "Sparky"

------------------------------

From: Oldsruns@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:19:15 -0400
Subject: Abbreviations:

I got a little yellow card with a number of abbreviations from AOL when I
sighned up.

If you would like I'll send publish the list, it isn't very long.

And I'm going to be Anon. too,

Red

------------------------------

From: Oldsruns@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:19:13 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

For crying out loud,

Youve got some of the guys rolling around on the floor crying.

laughint out loud
rolling on the floor laughing.

Anon

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 14:13:36 -0400
Subject: Re: Science at work: Santa Claus Story

Esko Ilola wrote:
>

>
> And, if you have nothing to do at your work,
> check a homepage at
>
> http://www.angelfire.com/de/EskoIlola/index.html
>
> --
> **********************************************
> * Esko Ilola                                 *


Esko,

Nice homepage.  I'll get to check more later.  It is bookmarked.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Frank Gonzalez <PLPAUDIO@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:42:01 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

buehner wrote:
>
> >NON OLDS RELATED
> > To Frank Boerger//Tallahassee/FL
> >
> > The Littlest Angel
> >LOL ROFL!!!
>
> Well, I may be showing my age a bit, but here goes anyway.  What is this?
> (>LOL ROFL!!!<)  I've seen it a few times, and am guessing it stands for
> something good, but I havn't figured it out yet :(  Unfortuanately I missed
> the Abbrev.101 class last year ;)  Thanks, & Later...
>
>       Charley Buehner       | "buehner@cis.nmclites.edu"
>       500 4th Ave.          | "charley@rocketship.com"
>       Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
>       Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
>       "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
>       "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
>              (Real Cars Don't Wear Bowties!)Laughing out loud\Really out
F*&%^%#$ loud.

------------------------------

From: Oldsruns@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:29:41 -0400
Subject: Abbreviations Longer list, but still short

:)  = smile

:D  = Laughing

;) = my lips are sealed

:X = my lips are sealed

: .  = kiss

:( = frown

:P = sticking out tougue

() = hug

B) = wearing shades

o:) = angel

<:.) = dunce

LOL = laughing out loud

OTF = on the floor

afk = away from keyboard

bak = back at keyboard

brb = be right back

Red Rock
aka ANON. II
(I figured out how to be anon too)

------------------------------

From: Frank Gonzalez <PLPAUDIO@WORLDNET.ATT.NET>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:49:57 -0400
Subject: Re: Christmas story - (Non-olds related)

Lloyd Culp wrote:
>
> >
> > NON OLDS RELATED
> >  To Frank Boerger//Tallahassee/FL
> >
> >
>
> Frank,
>
> Thanks for the information.  I always wondered what "the rest of the
> story" happened to be.
>
> Bill Culp
> Decatur, Alabama

Click on Reference 1

------------------------------

From: sbento@mecn.mass.edu
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:36:55 -0400
Subject: Re: Re[2]: Headers or manifolds?

On Mon, 9 Dec 1996, David Brown wrote:

> Mark and anyone else
> ,
> I know you said Hookers shouldn't leak based on your experience with them,
> but if a header did leak, could it be caused by the flange not being true?
> Do you think milling the flange a little bit would fix the problem, or
> maybe the flange is too thin to begin with, thus warping.
>
> David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
> Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
>                  ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

David,

Yes, header leaks at the flange can be casued by a warped flange, carefully
check your headers with a flat file to see if there are any raised areas
and then just file them away, also check your headers in a dark room with
a flash light to see if there are any cracks in the tubes or areas that
might have not been completly welded(my cheapy blackjacks had a small
pinhole that dad welded up for me). Then once your headers have checked
out, throw away the cheap gaskets that came with them and buy some Mr.
Gasket Ultra seals, they have a steel core and run about $15. Oh, don't
forget to check the header bolts every now and then..;-)


Steve
71 Cutlass S 455
93 Mustang LX 5.0

------------------------------

From: "C.R.F." <wizkid@inlink.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:51:19 -0400
Subject: Re: Abbreviations Longer list, but still short

At 08:29 PM 12/9/96 -0400, you wrote:
>
>:)  = smile
>
>:D  = Laughing
>
>;) = my lips are sealed
>
>:X = my lips are sealed
>
>: .  = kiss
>
>:( = frown
>
>:P = sticking out tougue
>
>() = hug
>
>B) = wearing shades
>
>o:) = angel
>
><:.) = dunce
>
>LOL = laughing out loud
>
>OTF = on the floor
>
>afk = away from keyboard
>
>bak = back at keyboard
>
>brb = be right back
>
>Red Rock
>aka ANON. II
>(I figured out how to be anon too)
>
>
>
Red,

I left the 1931 Fisher body book, and the Fisher Body Service Bulletins at
the Xerox people this afternoon.  I forgot the Cabriolet top suppliment, and
will take in with me tomorrow when I pick up the other stuff.

It is only a couple of pages, and I should be able to do it while I'm there.
They have Xerox machines all over the place for their customers to use.

Anon. I

------------------------------

From: sbento@mecn.mass.edu
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 21:11:40 -0400
Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was: Chrome Polish

Wow, what a coincidence my girlfriend is from Spokane, she moved East
about 4 years ago, her best friend is still out there and her brother
owns a 69 442!!! It is blue w/ white W-30 stripes and its in perfect
condition.

All the centerline wheelsI have seen are aluminum, some are available
"polished" which look chrome but there not steel. In MA they love to
spread salt all over the place in the winter and I had destroyed a set
of Mustang Cobra II wheels in the winter on my Pinto. The salt just
started to erode the aluminum, the wheels looked terrible after a few
winters.

Steve
71 Cutlass S 455
93 Mustang LX 5.0


 On Mon, 9 Dec 1996, Tom Lentz wrote:

>
>      Is that liquid or pellet stuff that they're using?  They just started
>      using some liquid stuff here in Spokane and they say it's not
>      corrosive like salt, but they didn't say exactly what it was.  I
>      wonder if it's the same. . .
>
>      BTW, aren't centerline wheels usually aluminum?  I know they do make
>      some chrome models, but when you say "centerline" most people think of
>      the aluminum type.
>
>      Tom.
>

------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@Direct.CA>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:23:27 -0400
Subject: RE: Chrome Polish - The Best?

At 11:48 AM 12/9/96 -0400, "The Viking" wrote:
>For you chemists out there is it the ammmonium oleate or the
>oxalic acid which removes the tarnish?  If one could make a stronger
>cleaner it sure would speed up the process.  Cheers!!

The oxalic acid is the iron stain remover as well as citric acid (milder and
less toxic).

Nick DiGiovanni
ndigiova@Direct.CA
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@Direct.CA>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:23:38 -0400
Subject: Re: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus Story

At 01:47 PM 12/9/96 -0400, Greg Beaulieu wrote:

>Being a resident of the great white north I must take issue with Esko's claim
>that Santa is a resident of Finland. As proof, I offer the following: Canada
>Post advertises that they will deliver your letter to him and they claim
>the address below is foolproof:
>
>Santa Claus
>North Pole
>CANADA <--- NOTE!
>H0H 0H0
>
>Given the fact that Canada Post has a hard enough time delivering things
>to us in more populated areas of the country, I figure this must be legit
>since they are promoting it. ;-)

I second the motion.  My 4 yr old daughter and I just sent a letter to Santa
on Friday to this same address.  I'll let you know what the reply is.

Nick DiGiovanni
ndigiova@Direct.CA
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2

P.S. My daughter is asking for a Microwave (light bulb oven) and I asked for
more $money$.

------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@Direct.CA>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 20:23:32 -0400
Subject: Re: Chemistry stuff; was:  Chrome Polish

At 06:47 PM 12/9/96 -0400, Charley Buehner wrote:
>our town is using a chemical de-icer on the streets, I believe it's
>Magnesium Chloride.  It works like hell on the ice (Melts it, get it?:) but
>it plays hell on the cars.  Any chrome on a vehicle is vulnerable, and badly
>so.

Magnesium Chloride is very similar to Sodium Chloride (Ordinary table salt -
NaCl).  In fact it is the second largest component of Sea water.  It is not
the Magnesium that is the problem but the high chlorides that are very
corrosive.

>     Does anyone have any experience with this or similar chemical de-icers?
>Is there anything people can do to protect their equipment (aside from
>garaging it over winters)?  Perhaps a coating of Vaseline or Grease, etc.
>over all chrome and re-applying; say every couple hours:)?

I once owned a set of aluminum wheels that I sprayed with a type of clear
laquer.  I forget the name of the product but they sell it at most places
that sell aftermarket wheels.  It is designed specifically for this purpose
ie corrosion and pitting protection.  It dries within about 15 minutes and
leaves a clear coating on the wheel (or any area that you have sprayed) that
is very difficult to detect afterwards.  These wheels were sold to my
brother and he still has them with no signs of pitting yet.  I sprayed them
about 11 years ago.
Hope this helps.

Nick DiGiovanni
ndigiova@Direct.CA
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Ryan Hehn <RYANH@docker.com>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 21:47:34 -0400
Subject: Re: build sheets

Clayton Pierce wrote:
>
> I found the build sheet (I think) for my '81 Calais parts car.  It was
> behind the top portion of the back seat.  It is supposed to be like a
> large computer printout right?  I have a question.  Evidently
> Oldsmobubble screwed up!  Attached at the bottom of the sheet, was the
> sheet for the NEXT car in the assembly line.  I've got sheets on 2
> different cars!  How rare an occurrence is this?  Has anyone else seen 2
> of these still attached before?  I'll get the VIN # for the car behind it
> on the very off chance that somebody on the list owns the car :-)  It was
> an '81 and was made in the St. Therese, PQ, Canada plant.  It was NOT
> another Calais.
>
> Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
> Clayton Pierce,
> zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu

I have an '81 made in St. Therese, PQ... Who knows, maybe it's mine!

But probably not...

Ryan Hehn
ryanh@docker.com

------------------------------

From: Ryan Thompson <rythom@ICSI.Net>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 14:57:43 -0400
Subject: Question

Dear Oldsmobile owners,

        My name is Ryan Thompson, I'm from Victoria, TX, unfortunatly it has
come the time for me to sell my Classic Oldsmobile. My question is how much
to sell it for.
I have a 1962 Olds Starfire F-85. When I got it I put on new paint along
with new tires and rims. Also the interior is all new. I had the seats
custom made to fit the pattern of the original seats, new carpet and new
celing. Have original books, floormats, hubcaps. It still has the original
Alluminum 215 V-8 engine. We had, of course, to change the rubber hoses and
gaskets, drain the fluids, and replace the water pump.(It was sitting up in
a garage for 16 years) So, If someone out there knows how much this model
which was only made for 2 years is worth, your help would be greatly
appreciated.

My email address is: rythom@icsi.net

                Thanks!

                                                                Ryan

------------------------------

From: Groundz212@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 22:42:21 -0400
Subject: Re: Performance 455 intakes?

enlighten me on this offenhuasser manifold i;ve never heard of one?

------------------------------

From: John Young <reospeeder@earthlink.net>
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 22:55:25 -0400
Subject: 1970 Door Panels

I've got a question, but first a "Sad Story".
While my 1970 Cutlass Supreme SX conv. w/Rally Pacl was at the
top shop the guy called me and asked if I wanted him to make door
panels too.  As the plastic roll at the top was badly sun damaged
and breaking up I told him no, I didn't want to rebuilc those, I
would junkyard some.  So he threw them away.  Badges, walnut burl
insets, and all.

Paddock offers panels for "Supreme" and "S" but not Supreme SX.

My question:
Did the Supreme SX have the wide or narrow inset?  Better yet,
does anybody out there have a set with burl that you wanna sell?
Preferrably medium blue, but if I have to replace fabric, carpet,
etc., alright.  I just don't want to put wood grain where there ought
to be burl.

Old Dog
70 Cutlas Supreme SX Conv.
67 T-Bird Landau

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 17:02:40 -0400
Subject: Re: 1970 Door Panels

John Young wrote:
>
>
> My question:
> Did the Supreme SX have the wide or narrow inset?  Better yet,
> does anybody out there have a set with burl that you wanna sell?
> Preferrably medium blue, but if I have to replace fabric, carpet,
> etc., alright.  I just don't want to put wood grain where there ought
> to be burl.
>
> Old Dog


John,

My does that story sound familiar.  This type of thing has happened to
nearly everyone I know; including myself, at one time or another.  I
certainly sympathise.  If only I knew somehting about panels.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Keith455@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:17:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile collectables

They are made by Johnny lightning, and toys r us has them for 4.99.  I have
one complant about them though. I bought the 74 pack and the H/O is blue.
I've never seen a blue H/O. They where all white to my knowledge, I don't
know what they were thinking but I sucks I wish the car was the right color..

Keith

1975 Hurst Olds

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:21:28 -0400
Subject: Re: build sheets

In a message dated 96-12-09 10:07:04 EST, you write:

> I've got sheets on 2
>  different cars!  How rare an occurrence is this?  Has anyone else seen 2
>  of these still attached before?

Well, Olds hid those build sheets for a lot of years.  I found the build
sheet for my '52 Ninety Eight behind one of the upper rear seat cushions, and
found a sheet for the next car on the line behind the other one.  Also found
half of another sheet under the front seat.

Paul

------------------------------

From: PHartlieb@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:32:51 -0400
Subject: Re: 1970 Door Panels

In a message dated 96-12-09 22:09:49 EST, you write:

> Paddock offers panels for "Supreme" and "S" but not Supreme SX.
>
>  My question:
>  Did the Supreme SX have the wide or narrow inset?  Better yet,
>  does anybody out there have a set with burl that you wanna sell?
>  Preferrably medium blue, but if I have to replace fabric, carpet,
>  etc., alright.  I just don't want to put wood grain where there ought
>  to be burl.
>

There is no difference between Supreme and Supreme SX door panels.  The SX
option was all performance oriented items and had nothing to do with interior
trim.  Your SX is a Supreme with a 455 engine, heavy duty transmission, 442
bumper and dual exhaust trumpets.  Supreme door panels will work for you.
 Sorry, ain't got none.

Paul

------------------------------

From: Beydler@aol.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:55:45 -0400
Subject: Olds brackets

Wish to correspond with any Olds bracket racers. Currently building '81
Cutlass/ 425 Olds.

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 00:24:06 -0400
Subject: Re: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus / OLDS: carburetor jets

At 10:03 AM 12/9/96 -0500, you wrote:
>> From: Esko Ilola <esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi>
>> But when i come across a lousy W-31-message, I simply delete it.
>
>I'm just curious why you would delete such a message. Maybe you've
>gotten smoked off the line one too many times by a W-31?!? Maybe you own
>a FORD?

Well, as a '64 98 sedan-owning computer programmer in Finland, Esko probably
hasn't seen a Ford (like ours, I know of Ford of Europe) in a while, and I
doubt that he'd have much opportunity to work on a W-31...
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 00:39:35 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile collectables

In a message dated 96-12-09 22:28:02 EST, you write:

<< They are made by Johnny lightning, and toys r us has them for 4.99.  I
have
 one complant about them though. I bought the 74 pack and the H/O is blue.
 I've never seen a blue H/O. They where all white to my knowledge, I don't
 know what they were thinking but I sucks I wish the car was the right
color..

 Keith
  >>
The original colors are availible from Spiegel Catalogs for the price of
95.00.  The set includes all 8 correct color Pace cars in a special lexan
case.  The 70 is white, the 74 is white and the 77 is silver and black.

W MACHINES(Mark Prince)

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 00:45:19 -0400
Subject: Re: 1970 Door Panels

In a message dated 96-12-09 22:09:49 EST, you write:

<< My question:
 Did the Supreme SX have the wide or narrow inset?  Better yet,
 does anybody out there have a set with burl that you wanna sell?
 Preferrably medium blue, but if I have to replace fabric, carpet,
 etc., alright.  I just don't want to put wood grain where there ought
 to be burl.
  >>
Hey John, I have a pair of 70 supreme doorpanels front and rear.  They were
given to me yesterday.  They are yours for free, you pay the shipping.  I am
from
Detroit Michigan.  The door panels are gold(sorry), but I am offering them to
you.
W Machines(Mark Prince)     Let me know one way or another if you want them
and
                                           where you are located.

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 00:57:03 -0400
Subject: Re: Performance 455 intakes?

In a message dated 96-12-09 21:55:48 EST, you write:

<< enlighten me on this offenhuasser manifold i;ve never heard of one? >>
Offenhauser offers 3 intakes.  The O4B is a 455 intake made for a point
distributor
and was made in the late 60's early 70's.  The offenhauser 360 intake is for
350 Oldsmobiles and is the same design as the O4B. Both intakes are dual
plain intakes
made for low and mid range.  The offenhauser Port O Sonic intake was a design
that
Joe Mondello uses.  Its a single high rise plain intake for 455's.  Its for
mid to extreme top end.  I am not sure it the 360 and O4B are still availible
new, but I come across them at swap meets time to time.  The port o sonic is
still availible

W MACHINES (Mark Prince)

------------------------------

From: pete <pete@awinc.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 01:15:44 -0400
Subject: Re: 1970 Door Panels

At 12:45 AM 12/10/96 -0400, you wrote:
>In a message dated 96-12-09 22:09:49 EST, you write:
>
><< My question:
> Did the Supreme SX have the wide or narrow inset?  Better yet,
> does anybody out there have a set with burl that you wanna sell?
> Preferrably medium blue, but if I have to replace fabric, carpet,
> etc., alright.  I just don't want to put wood grain where there ought
> to be burl.
>  >>
>Hey John, I have a pair of 70 supreme doorpanels front and rear.  They were
>given to me yesterday.  They are yours for free, you pay the shipping.  I am
>from
>Detroit Michigan.  The door panels are gold(sorry), but I am offering them to
>you.
>W Machines(Mark Prince)     Let me know one way or another if you want them
>and
>                                           where you are located.
>
>
>any chance for arm rests for 70 olds 'Coupe??? could use panels too but
mine are black and white..



               ~\\ ! //~
                +(o o)+
 *--pete--.o00o.--( )--.o00o.--pete--*

 ******     Pete Berisoff      *******
 *      Penticton, B.C. Canada,      *
 (<:)       1(604)492-6349       (>:o)
 *******    pete@awinc.com     *******
 *******     pete@img.net      *******

------------------------------

From: JPADA@hqgate.orbital.com
Date: Mon, 9 Dec 1996 23:24:28 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes

Deja vu!  My HEI distributor , bought used 3 months ago to replace a points
distributor that conked out on me, has conked out on me...

     Greg,

     You didn't mention whether or not the failure of the points
     distributor had the same characteristics as the problem with the HEI.
     If it did, my guess would be that there is an intermittent problem
     with either the voltage source wiring or the ground.  I assume you ran
     a new 12 volt non-resistor wire to the HEI when you installed it; if
     not, this could be the source of the problem.

     Assuming that the failure of the HEI is different than that of the
     original distributor, there could obviously be a number of problems.
     Intermittent electrical problems are the worst, since they never fail
     at a time convienient for troubleshooting.  I assume you replaced the
     cap and rotor when you installed the unit.  I've actually had a very
     unusual failure of a relatively new rotor on an HEI, wherein I got a
     carbon track through the center of the cap from the center contact to
     the distributor shaft.

     Check for internal wiring which rubs or contacts the case when the
     vacuum advance is activated.  Connect the advance hose to manifold
     vacuum at idle - this should apply full advance.  Now disconnect the
     hose.  Repeat.  If there is a bare spot, this may eventually locate
     it.  Check also for bare spots or breaks in the source and ground
     wires to the distributor - run new ones temporarily to test.
     Thoroughly inspect all wiring and contacts in and to the distributor
     for breaks, shorting, looseness, and corrosion.

     Something else to try is to temporarily rig a 12 volt bulb, visible
     while driving, powered off of the BATT terminal of the HEI (the other
     side just goes to ground).  This bulb should be lit whenever the
     ignition is on.  If your engine cuts out and the light goes off,
     clearly the problem is the wiring to the distributor, not the HEI
     itself.  If the light stays on, the problem is either downstream of
     the BATT terminal (either in the HEI or its ground) or it is not
     ignition-related.

     The next step, of course, is to spend large amounts of money replacing
     parts - rotor, cap, ignition module, coil.

     Good Luck.  I hope this helps.

     Joe Padavano
     jpada@hqgate.orbital.com

     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

From: Bob Valentine <ravalent@liii.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 03:47:43 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes

> Deja vu!  My HEI distributor , bought used 3 months ago to replace a points
> distributor that conked out on me, has conked out on me.  I would appreciate

> their HEI?  Would anyone konw if this is consistent with a module or pickup
> coil failure?  I'm not fond of removing distributors so I'd like to make
> sure before I pull it to replace the electronic goodies inside.  The coil is

   The HEI module usually dead or alive - the intermittent problem you're
having is not usual.  The only close call to yours I had was a bad pickup
coil.   Car would run fine sometimes, but under certain conditions it
would sputter and cough.

   First thing I do when the HEI starts acting funny is:

	0.  Check the carbon contactor that lies below the coil - I've burned
	up several of them with just the plain HEI module.  Running a MSD
	without MSD's contactor, I ate them once a month.

	1.  Run jumper wire from the HEI + terminal directly to the battery.

	2.  Replace the coil with a known good spare.

	3.  Replace the module
	
        If the problem is STILL there

	4.  Get another from the salvage yard.  ;^)


    Insert test drive between all steps, preferrablly with a chase car...

> Any suggestions are appreciated.

                     -->   Bob Valentine  <--
                    --> ravalent@liii.com  <--
        "Experience varies directly with equipment ruined"

------------------------------

From: Kevin Wong <yu135008@yorku.ca>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 03:51:53 -0400
Subject: Build sheets/ Locked doors

For almost a year, a friend's '77 Custom Cruiser had a rear door stuck in
the locked position.  Yesterday, we decided to attack the problem by
removing the rear seat and carefully removing the door panel, without
inflicting too much damage - I'd never done one on a closed door!  It
turns out the lock linkage at the door latch mechanism had become detached
due to a broken clip.   An unexpected bonus was that we found the build
sheet.  It was attached to the inside of the driver's side rear door by
some 1.5" wide black tape!  Its condition is very good except for
a puncture mark where one of the armrest screws had penetrated.

Kevin Wong

------------------------------

From: acohoe@silk.net (Al Cohoe)
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 03:55:26 -0400
Subject: Re: off email

>
><< >Hi,
> >  could you guys please take me off your E mail list
> >        thanks
> >
>
>
>
>

------------------------------

From: Bob Valentine <ravalent@liii.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:40:00 -0400
Subject: FREE 70-72 Cutlass Stuff

To make a long story short, I finished taking what I needed off a '71 CS
convertible parts car I bought, and I have some other stuff that I'd rather
not see go off to the junkyard with what's left of it.    All interior
stuff is black unless otherwise noted.

Anything/everything free to the first person who responds (if anyone does).

I'm located in NY (on Long Island), Exit 36 off the LIE.

'72 CS front fenders - bondo on the bottom of both.  Good for patching.
'72 CS Dashboard - black, no cracks, no glovebox door.
'71 CS hardtop trunklid - bondo'd lip
'72 gas tank
'71 S hardtop rear quarter glass
Assorted interior trim parts (no armrests or door panels, sorry)
Parts of a '71-'72 convertible black interior.  Mainly the
	rear armrest/window covers.  Black, not torn but
	they all need cleaning.   Also one piece in white.
	Not good  for a 100 point resto....
'71 S hood (the one with the fake louvers).  No back chrome trim. Blue.
350 non-EGR 4bbl cast iron intake.  Free Q-jet if you take it!
assorted door parts - manual regulators, linkages, lock plates
heater box/heater core (non-AC)
'71 CS cargo coil springs - unused.
Set of 8 unmatched rods for a Olds 350, with junk pistons attached.
'70 (I think) Olds 350 Nodular crank.   Removed from a running motor.
'71-'72 front bumper brackets
'71 Olds 350 A/C alternator brackets
'71 CS manual 4-wheel drum Master and proportioning valve (still in car)
Olds 350 points distributor
'71-'72 front bumper braces
'71 trans crossmember.  Should fit 68-72.  I know it fits 70-72.
'71 AT console woodgrain insert.  Used, ok condition.
'70 442 (I think.  Has buttons) lower seat upholstry.  Unused. 1 piece.

All the above is FREE.  I'd rather see it go to another Olds guy than see
it become part of a new Hyundai, and I've got to get rid of most of it...
to make more space for new Olds stuff! There's unlisted stuff still on
the parts car, so drop a note with needs.

Free, but with a string attached:

'71 Olds 10-bolt rear - 2.56 Posi.  It's under the parts car right now,
but you'd have to take the whole car for it since otherwise I'll have to
pay to have it flatbeded out of my driveway (no front spindles).  ;^)

And the only thing for sale/trade:

4 Centerline rims -  for GM small bolt pattern axles (A/F/B body)

	2 15x10's (might be 10.5) with good BFG 295-50/15 rubber
	2 15x7's with junk rubber.
	Center caps
	1/2 set of lug nuts, 2 wheel locks w/ tool.

	$350 for the set.  They're about 2 years old.  Would consider
	trades, namely a set of 15" Olds SSIII rims with the bolt
	on center caps.  (I don't need the caps tho...)

	
                     -->   Bob Valentine  <--
                    --> ravalent@liii.com  <--
        "Experience varies directly with equipment ruined"

------------------------------

From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 08:41:16 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile collectables

Well, my understanding is there are 6(?) numbered "series". Each series
has different non-original colors.  There is also a "Collectors Series"
which has the correct colors.

Kurt
71 442
>
> They are made by Johnny lightning, and toys r us has them for 4.99.  I have
> one complant about them though. I bought the 74 pack and the H/O is blue.
> I've never seen a blue H/O. They where all white to my knowledge, I don't
> know what they were thinking but I sucks I wish the car was the right
color.. > > Keith > > 1975 Hurst Olds

------------------------------

From: Frank Boerger <103454.317@CompuServe.COM>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 09:37:42 -0400
Subject: RE: HEI woes

Greg Pruett wrote:

  <Snip>
>Has anyone had a similar problem with
>heir HEI?  Would anyone konw if this is consistent with a module or >ickup
coil failure?  I'm not fond of removing distributors so I'd like to >make sure
before I pull it to replace the electronic goodies inside.  The >coil is new,
(3 mos old) by the way but I don't know how to check it >without a meter.

Believe it or not, I have had this experience on  three different occasions.

1) '75 Ch*velle:  Spark stopped with engine hot, good cold.
Solution: Ignition coil.

2)'77 Corv*tte: spark on for a few minutes, spark off for a while, hot or
cold. Solution:  Ign. Module

3) Pont sunbird:  no spark at all.
Solution: Ign. Module.

FWIW,

Frank Boerger//Tallahassee

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 04:29:00 -0400
Subject: Re: 1970 Door Panels

WMACHINES@aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 96-12-09 22:09:49 EST, you write:
>
>
>   >>
> Hey John, I have a pair of 70 supreme doorpanels front and rear.  They were
> given to me yesterday.  They are yours for free, you pay the shipping.  I am
> from
> Detroit Michigan.  The door panels are gold(sorry), but I am offering them
to > you. > W Machines(Mark Prince)

Mark,

I'm not John, but I want to thank you for your help & generosity.  Nice
people are everywhere, but I didn't expect them in cyberspace too.  John
will be the most thankfull & you put a smile on everyone's face at
Christmas time w/a gift like that.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 04:34:31 -0400
Subject: Re: HEI woes

JPADA@hqgate.orbital.com wrote:
>
> Deja vu!  My HEI distributor , bought used 3 months ago to replace a points
> distributor that conked out on me, has conked out on me...
>
>      Greg,
>
>      You didn't mention whether or not the failure of the points
>      distributor had the same characteristics as the problem with the HEI.
>
>
>      The next step, of course, is to spend large amounts of money replacing
>      parts - rotor, cap, ignition module, coil.
>
>      Good Luck.  I hope this helps.
>
>      Joe Padavano
>
Joe,

I hate to write all the time, but these nice posts of help & ideas are
just great.  I'm thanking yo all for the past, present, & please keep it
up in the future.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:25:46 -0400
Subject: '85, '86 block quality

Has anyone heard about Olds' block quality being poor for 1985 or 1986?  I
was told by a friend who was told by a couple of mechanics that there was a
problem with the nickel content during one of those years.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Olds FAQ 2.0 at: http://www.en.com/users/thall/
                 ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

From: Matt Mayer <mmayer@interaccess.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:11:09 -0400
Subject: Distributors

While we are on the subject of distributors, I have been having a cold
weather realted problem with the Dist. in my '86 Cutlass 442.  When it
gets really cold (0 - 10 above for those of us here in chicago..)  For
the first few minutes after start-up I get a rup-rup-rup-rup sound
coming from the distributor.  I had it replaced--the whole thing--in
January of 94.   The problem disappeared for a while, but I am beginning
to hear the tell-tale sounds of it again...only faintly now, but I am
pretty sure it will get worse as it gets colder.  Any ideas on what this
could be??  Is destroying my distributor or just annoying?
Thanks!
- --
- ---M
'86 442
-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
MMayer@InterAccess.Com                 | Matt Mayer VM: (800) 481-1323 
		
| "Well, that was interesting......"

------------------------------

From: "Kenneth G. Holland Jr." <rottin@coil.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:16:20 -0400
Subject: Re: Performance 455 intakes?

WMACHINES@aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 96-12-09 21:55:48 EST, you write:
>
> << enlighten me on this offenhuasser manifold i;ve never heard of one? The
offenhauser 360 intake is for 350 Oldsmobiles and is the same design as the
O4B. Both intakes are dual plain intakes made for low and mid range.

 The 360 has both a small block and big block version for Oldsmobile.
Summit Racing has the BB version hanging on the wall in their showroom.


>The offenhauser Port O Sonic intake was a design
>that Joe Mondello uses.  Its a single high rise plain intake for 455's.
>Its for mid to extreme top end.
> W MACHINES (Mark Prince)

There is also a "Super Sonic" which is the same as the "Port O Sonic"
except that it has a dominator flange.

Offy made alot of really neat induction stuff in the 60's (50's too?)
for the 394.  A friend of mine has an "Offy Dual Quad" setup and an
"Offy Webber 8x1" setup.  Too bad they wont bolt up the modern engines.

     Kenneth G. Holland Jr.
- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   K&D Holland Trucking, Inc.
 Excavation, Demolition, Paving
         216.291.2780

------------------------------

From: "Kenneth G. Holland Jr." <rottin@coil.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:24:01 -0400
Subject: Comp. Cams Magnum Roller Rockers

I visited Summit Racing yesterday and picked up afew things.  Among
them was a Comp. Cams Magnum roller rocker kit.  The kit came with:

Roller Rockers
"Hi Energy" Push Rods
Rocker Studs
Guide Plates
and NO directions.

  Anyone have any experience with this kit?  The salesman seemed to
think that alot of machining would need to be done to the head.
The new studs screw right into the stock holes.  Looks to me like it'll
just bolt rite up.  Am I missing something?
- --
     Kenneth G. Holland Jr.
- -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   K&D Holland Trucking, Inc.
 Excavation, Demolition, Paving
         216.291.2780

------------------------------

From: rjphil00@pop.uky.edu
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:32:38 -0400
Subject: V6 to V8

I have a 1983 oldsmobile cutlass with a 3.8l V6 and a olds factory 350 turbo
transmission.  The car is in good shape but it is too damn slow.  I'm
getting ready to rebuild a pre-1984  350 chevy motor that I have had sitting
around.  I'm looking for information (or somewhere to find information) on
capatibility between the V6/V8 and olds/chevy (transmission,cooling,motor
mounts and brackets).
                                                Randy Phillips
                                                rjphil00@pop.uky.edu

------------------------------

From: Esko Ilola <esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:14:41 -0400
Subject: Apologies

I wrote:

> Seems like the magig words "NON-OLDS" is the best ad for
> Your message. I always read ALL the NON-olds messages. Don't you?
>
> But when i come across a lousy W-31-message, I simply delete it.

Sorry guys. No meaning to hurt or insult anybody.

Get a jolt every time I touch the Del-button. :).

- --
**********************************************
* Esko Ilola                                 *
* Email esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi           *
* X400  G=esko S=ilola O=tele A=mailnet C=fi *
* Tel.  +358 2040 3439                       *
* Mail  Ukonkivenpolku 7B5                   *
*       01610 VANTAA                         *
*       FINLAND                              *
**********************************************
* Oldsmobile Ninety Eight 1964               *
*            Holiday Sports Sedan (4D HT)    *
**********************************************

------------------------------

From: Andy Geeting <geetinag@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:37:25 -0400
Subject: open element air cleaner

Hey everyone,
     I was wondering if it was possible to put an open element air cleaner
on my '87 Cutlass Supreme? I would like to put one on but I don't know
anything about these Thermac air cleaners. Will it affect the way my car
runs at all? I know it will run rough until it warms up but is there
anything else that might go wrong?
     I recently bought a K&N air filter. Will this fit an open element air
cleaner or do you have to get a special one?

Thanks in advance!

Andy Geeting
geetinag@miavx1.muohio.edu
'87 Cutlass Supreme
'88 Cutlass Supreme Classic Brougham
'74 Delta 88 convertible

------------------------------

From: Esko Ilola <esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 10:50:02 -0400
Subject: Re: Oldsmobilia

<total snip>

Yesterday evening (monday evening) they sent
the Demolition Man in our TV.

The 70 W-30 was impressive.

- --
**********************************************
* Esko Ilola                                 *
* Email esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi           *
* X400  G=esko S=ilola O=tele A=mailnet C=fi *
* Tel.  +358 2040 3439                       *
* Mail  Ukonkivenpolku 7B5                   *
*       01610 VANTAA                         *
*       FINLAND                              *
**********************************************
* Oldsmobile Ninety Eight 1964               *
*            Holiday Sports Sedan (4D HT)    *
**********************************************

------------------------------

From: Esko Ilola <esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:10:31 -0400
Subject: NON-OLDS: Santa Claus lives in FINLAND

Well:
- - we have a village for "santa claus" near
  Rovaniemi-town which is located 2 miles south
  of the arctic circle.



Search results using Alta Vista with

"santa near claus near rovaniemi" -> 58 matches
"santa near claus near canada"	  -> 66 matches

The searches show that although the count for
Rovaniemi is noticeably smaller it is HUGE if
compared with the land areas.


And for those who still suspect, here is a web
page address (partially in finnish).
http://www.urova.fi/home/roikaup/santa/index.htm

Once in that page, klick "Joulupukki" (Santa Claus
in finnish).

- --
**********************************************
* Esko Ilola                                 *
* Email esko.ilola@tele.telebox.fi           *
* X400  G=esko S=ilola O=tele A=mailnet C=fi *
* Tel.  +358 2040 3439                       *
* Mail  Ukonkivenpolku 7B5                   *
*       01610 VANTAA                         *
*       FINLAND                              *
**********************************************
* Oldsmobile Ninety Eight 1964               *
*            Holiday Sports Sedan (4D HT)    *
**********************************************

------------------------------

From: Matt Mayer <mmayer@interaccess.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:48:21 -0400
Subject: Re: open element air cleaner

Andy Geeting wrote:
>
> Hey everyone,
>      I was wondering if it was possible to put an open element air cleaner
> on my '87 Cutlass Supreme? I would like to put one on but I don't know
> anything about these Thermac air cleaners. Will it affect the way my car
> runs at all? I know it will run rough until it warms up but is there
> anything else that might go wrong?
>      I recently bought a K&N air filter. Will this fit an open element air
> cleaner or do you have to get a special one?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Andy Geeting
Andy,
  You are correct in that it will run poorly until the engine is warm.
When cold the air cleaner sucks air in through that silver tubing
connected to the "stove" on the drivers side of the block.  The stove
warms the air going into the engine.  As for an open element, I just had
a discussion with  my friend in Indianapolis about taking the air
cleaner cover and flipping it over to increase the volume of air getting
intot the engine.  He said it did seem like he had more power, but I
didn't ask him about cold weather because it was still relatively warm.
I am considering trying the flip, but my 442 has the dual snorkel
cleaner so I am not sure how much improvement I will get.

- ---M
'86 442
-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
MMayer@InterAccess.Com                 | Matt Mayer VM: (800) 481-1323 
		
| "Well, that was interesting......"

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 05:57:42 -0400
Subject: Re: '69 Toronado

Oldsruns@aol.com wrote:
>
> Dear Bill,
>
> Nice words, and I must say appreciated.  I always enjoyed my cars, and I had
> several of them tucked away to "play" with when I retired.  I worked for the
> last 20 odd years in the San Francisco Bay area, and only came back home
last > September.  My father had a stroke, and could no longer manage the
"family > farm" and my brothers and I discussed the possiblities, and I drew
the long > straw.  I would have been gone from California a long time ago, but
there is > just something, a supreme majesty in the Big Trees, and severa
times each > year I would drive thru the Sequoya (it fell over because of snow
load ten or > fifteen years ago) with the tunnel cut thru.  And the Red Woods
are > magnificent too.  Many of these trees are more than 2000 years old, and
I > found wonder and amazement renewed each time  was in their presence. > >
I was able to 'retire' ha ha, and return to the farm.  My mother is greatly >
relived.  She literally cannot tie her own shoes, making a knot is too >
complicated for her.  However, the house is entirely decorated with murals >
she painted over the years.  And her cooking would bring tears to the eyes of >
any 'chef de cuisine,' as well as send him packing for Paris for retraining. >
 > The nice thing about a farm is that there are two periods when it is >
extremely busy, and most of the rest of the time it is slow enough to restore >
a car or build an engine.  Next year I am going to insulate and put heat into >
an old dairly barn.  It is about 40 feet by 80 feet, and with a partition I >
can have a nice shop to work in throughout the winter. > > The main problem
here, as it was in California-there was never enough money > to do everything,
at least not all at once.  Of course beans at $10 or $15 a > bushel , or corn
in the stratosphere would help a lot too. > > I also agree that this group
does seem like a great bunch.  I never though I > could get so many answers to
my questions (even they then bring up new > questions), and almost all in one
day. > > Red


Red,

I have visited California many times, but only love the the area 100
miles souh of San Francisco & then north to the Oregon border.  I had no
idea that the tunneled Sequoya was gone.  Like so many others, I took a
picture of my Mother's van within the tree in 1981.  She'll be sad to
hear that.  That is such magnificant country.

The Army allowed me to live at Fort Lewis, Washington for a couple of
years in the 1967-1969 period.  That is great country, but a little
isolated.  I  like the way it has both Western & Eastern influences.  It
is wonderful cosmopolitan country.

As you have, I came back to Michigan to help my grandmother & invalid
uncle when my grandfather died.  That was 27 years ago; we have been in
Alabama for 25 years; my grandmother is nearly 95, my uncle 75, & I am
helping my 70 year-old mother.  It has been a great 25 years too.

I have a bunch of cars, though not as interesting as yours.  They
include a wide variety of makes.

1928 Model A roadster pickup; bought as a basket case & still not put
together.  i have some parts acquired though.

1949 Studebaker Champion convertibe in shabby original condition.  I
have now most every part to assemble as a very nice car.  It runs ok,
but is worn.  It is fun to drive around in the summer & take to shows to
capture the "Roughest Thing Running" awards.

1955 Ford Victoria; again in shabby condition.  It is pink & white (my
favorite), has every accessory except AC, & needs changed over from a
3-speed to automatic.  I have an identical (pink & white) parts car w/AT
to work this out.  A bumper guard was traded for the parts car.

1955 Studebaker President Starliner in rough shape.  It is nicely
equiped w/leather, PW, & everything else.  The engine will be rebuilt by
Christmas & it is on to the body work.  I like those chromy things w/the
low sleek bodies.

1956 Linoln Premiere hardtop in ok shape.  It needs a paint job as it
sat at an airport in the open for 8 years before I got it.  The body
should be done next year & then on to the interior & chrome.  I have a
parts car w/AC that I will be installing this spring or maybe even this
winter. They drive so nice & appear to be the longest car in the world.
Mine is truquoise & white.

1961 black Continental sedan that I just purchased to augment my 1963
convertible,  I don't know if I will save the car or use it in my
restoration of the convertible.  It looks nice, needs brakes, & rund
good.

1962 Olds Jetfire that was rescued from a cotton field in 1976.  It was
a metallic blue we/a matching interior, but I changed it to silver w/a
black vinyl top & silver/charcoal interior.  These are the turbo-charged
cars that are really neat.  That turbo can really turn on that little
aluminum V8.  Mine has everytning on it including AC, PW, PA, etc.  It
is one of my favorites.  Although it has won many show awards, it is
getting it's cam replaced now.  I hope that it is back early in the next
year.

1962 Dodge Polara 500 convertible in an unusual black & white.  This is
the bucket seat model that everyone had to build.  It came w/few
accessories (AT, radio & heater), but I have added PB & PS w/PW & AC on
the horizon.  It has never been repainted & looks good.  The heater fan
isn't in as yet, I haven't fixed the turnlights, & it looks like the 361
engine w/dual point distributor needs tuning again.


1963 Dodge Polara 500 convertible.  This one is beige & blue (beige body
w/blue top & beige & blue interior).  It has over 300,000 miles on it.
The 383 engine is getting a cylinder resleaved.  I hope to have it back
in circulation again this winter too.

1964 Continental convertible originally gold w/black interior.  This car
needs restoration much as the Grand Prix does.  I will make it all black
if it survives.  It looks like it will give it's convertible parts to
the 1961.  I'll figure this out by spring.  These are beautiful, nice
driving cars.

1963 Pontiac Grand Prix which needs everything.  Luckily it is fully
equipped w/AC, power vents, & even tri-power.  This one will be a while
on the restoration list.

1963 Avanti R2.  Mine will be a 4-speed.  The engine is done & parts
collected but not much else is done.  It is gold w/black & white
interior.  I don't know whether top make it black w/beige & white
interior or keep the gold.  I have never driven the car.  It has 29000
miles on it, but it sat outside in Wisconsin for 15 years w/a holed
piston.  I wonder how that happened?

1967 Toronado in gold & cream interior.  I have had this car many years
& driven it alot.  It is great w/all accessories.  It will get painted
Tahoe Turquoise Metallic in a couple of months & I am adding a Hurst
electric sunroof from a Hurst Grand Prix of that era.

1968 442 convertible 4-speed.  This car is nice, but needs an interior.
I am adding AC to the full list of accessories.  I may even add disc
brakes, although I don't really like those 2-piston types.  Thsi one is
Teal w/white interior & black roof.

1969 AMX bought new after leaving the Army. It started out white w/blue
stripes & charcoal interior, but I painted it red later.  I want it
black now as soon as I can get to its refurbishing.  It is a 390 4-speed
w/AC & leather.  I added the Group 19 parts when it was new 7 now it
just doesn't run on our poor gas.  As a matter of fact it has sat inside
since 1981 w/54000 on it.

1970 Buick GS 455 w/all accessories.  I bought a new GS Stage 1 like
this in 1970.  This Burnished Saddle Metallic w/chocolate vinyl top &
interior standard 455 is its replacement.  I have added many accessories
that I didn't have on my original car including PW & reclining seat.  It
is nearly complete at the body shop.  I just have to replace the vinyl
top & install the interior when it returns in a cooiuple of weeks.

1972 AMX 401 4-speed.  Thsi was bought for my son's 16th birthday 16
years ago.  He didn't like it & so it has sat in the barn for all these
years.  It is dark metallic blue w/white vinyl roof panels & blue vinyl
interior.  I have the engine out for painting & to work under the hood.
Possibly it will get done next winter.

There are a few parts cars too.  I hope to clean all this up by the end
of summer.  My barn & garage is full.

Good luck w/your cars & family this Christmas season.  I hope that you
know how much your family appreciates your help at this time.  You'll
never regret it although you'll wonder sometimes.

Merry Christmas
Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:12:53 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Oldsmobile collectables

     The ones I saw were in different colors.  I chose a whilte '74, but
     they also had blue and a particularly ugly metallic purple one too.
     So be sure to look through the stack in the store. . .

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Re: Oldsmobile collectables Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    12/9/96 9:07 PM

     one complant about them though. I bought the 74 pack and the H/O is
     blue. I've never seen a blue H/O. They where all white to my
     knowledge, I don't

 Keith
  >>
The original colors are availible from Spiegel Catalogs for the price of
95.00.  The set includes all 8 correct color Pace cars in a special lexan
case.  The 70 is white, the 74 is white and the 77 is silver and black.

W MACHINES(Mark Prince)


------------------------------

From: Mark Odell <modell@isc.mds.lmco.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 12:54:11 -0400
Subject: Re: open element air cleaner

This air cleaner conversation is intriguing.  I have an '86 442 and I made
a switch to an open cleaner (Edlebrok) back in '86.  What a difference, but
there are a few other issues.  1- the cold temp operation, and the lack of
warm air intake off of the exhaust manifold through the snorkel, this will
cause a very moody, hesitation on cold days.  I don't run in the winter at
all.   2- the snorkels represent an air restriction.  Yes they increase air
velocity (nozzle effect), but they also inhibit air volume, this is why I
went to the open air cleaner.  By removing the snorkels, you need to
consider the carb now that the restriction is gone and the vacum delay
damper on the second snorkel is gone.  This brings up the third issue.  3-
consider changing the linkage on the carb that activates the secondary
throttle plates.  The more open air intake minus the vacum motor delay will
upset the balance of the system.  The linkage prevents the secondaries from
opening very far, so I modified mine to allow a different delay and maximum
opening.  The delay is critical so that you don't flogg the engine on
acceleration.  I performed all my modifications by carefully bending the
linkage to make changes to the secondary delay and the max opening. This is
a little trial and error.  All this represents a significant change in the
personality of the car.  Much more spunk.  It'll come alive when the
secondaries kick in.  One word of caution,  have mercy on the 200R4.  These
changes I speak of here I am very  suspicious of, they are the changes that
broke the  camels back and probably over worked by 200R4.   Good luck.


At 11:48 AM -0400 12/10/96, Matt Mayer wrote:


>Andy Geeting wrote:
>>
>> Hey everyone,
>>      I was wondering if it was possible to put an open element air cleaner
>> on my '87 Cutlass Supreme? I would like to put one on but I don't know
>> anything about these Thermac air cleaners. Will it affect the way my car
>> runs at all? I know it will run rough until it warms up but is there
>> anything else that might go wrong?
>>      I recently bought a K&N air filter. Will this fit an open element air
>> cleaner or do you have to get a special one?
>>
>> Thanks in advance!
>>
>> Andy Geeting
>Andy,
>  You are correct in that it will run poorly until the engine is warm.
>When cold the air cleaner sucks air in through that silver tubing
>connected to the "stove" on the drivers side of the block.  The stove
>warms the air going into the engine.  As for an open element, I just had
>a discussion with  my friend in Indianapolis about taking the air
>cleaner cover and flipping it over to increase the volume of air getting
>intot the engine.  He said it did seem like he had more power, but I
>didn't ask him about cold weather because it was still relatively warm.
>I am considering trying the flip, but my 442 has the dual snorkel
>cleaner so I am not sure how much improvement I will get.
>
>---M
>'86 442
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
>MMayer@InterAccess.Com                 | Matt Mayer
>VM: (800) 481-1323 		       | "Well, that was interesting......"


-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- - - Mark Odell - Muscle car enthusiast Sr. Technical  Staff, Advanced
Engineering Concepts Team, Lockheed Martin (my real life)

1986 Olds 442
1996 GMC Sierra Z71

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 12:41:55 -0400
Subject: New Olds Review (informal) [REPOST]

I sent this yesterday, but it never showed up; lost in cyberspace or
something? Anyway, here it is again, and ignore it if it has magically
reappeared...
*********************************************************

I had to drop some things at an office across the street from the only local
Oldsmobile dealer today, and thought I'd share my impressions of the latest
from our favorite automaker:

* Looking from the window of the second floor office, I noticed a row of
Auroras lined up, and thought gee, nice car, to bad it costs so many $$$.
Then I noticed it wasn't a row of Auroras at all, but rather a row of the
latest 88's with those Aurora 5-spoke rims! I tell you, those rims make that
car look rather nice, almost nice enough to mask the awkwardness of the
split-grille design (the front end is too square for the angle they want to
give the grille openings).

Making an 88 look upscale by using those Aurora rims may be a smart idea...
as long as it doesn't cannibalize Aurora sales. With a supercharged V-6,
that 88 would be a nice car. With the Aurora V-8, that 88 would be MINE!
Just as long as it had discreet little "W-33" badges near the front turn
signals... :)

* As for the new redesigned Olds minivan... it makes a boxy Windstar, but a
horrible Olds! In fact, they had a Windstar parked next to two of the
minivans, apparently to show just how stodgy their own new design looks.
Kinda like an overinflated Mitsubishi minivan (no, that's not a compliment).
Maybe the long-wheelbase version would be better proportioned (maybe those
_were_ the long-wheelbase versions...Yikes!).

* The row of current Cutlasses with those little mini-headlights reminded me
that an Olds dealer is about the only place that I see the new Cutlasses.
This point was driven home by the fact that I noticed there were *two*
Cutlasses from the '78-'87 era on the street at that very moment, and I had
noticed a few on my way there. I didn't notice any fwd Cutlasses on the road
in that same period of time. Oh, they may be there, but they do a good job
of blending in. If you are a private detective, about the only thing less
noticeable than a newer Cutlass Supreme would be a Ciera; heck, most people
wouldn't notice it if you parked in their driveway!

Of course, there are exceptions, such as the bright red convertible with the
5-spoke rims in the parking lot here at work. Of course, there are also two
'78-'80 Cutlasses in that same lot. I would bet that there are more of the
highly popular '78-'80 Cutlasses and Supremes on the road today than there
are of the less popular '88-'97 Supremes. If you dispute that figure (ok, I
suppose it could be an exaggeration), then how about this one: There are
more '78-'87 Cutlasses still on the road today than there ever were '88-'97
Cutlasses made. I bet Olds would do better business selling reconditioned
'78-'87 Cutlasses (powered by, say, a 250hp Olds 350; they still have the
tooling) for $15,000 than they do now by selling brand new fwd Cutlasses.

* The new Olds Bravada is one slick SUV. Put a V-8 in there, and I might
consider buying that one.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 04:50:38 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: open element air cleaner

     I've always wondered about the effectiveness of those heat risers.  I
     understand what they're trying to do, and I agree they must do
     something since all cars have them.  But it seems to me that trying to
     warm the air by drawing it over the exh. manifold when the engine is
     cold would sort of be self-defeating.  By the time the exh. manifold
     warms up, the engine is warmed up and doesn't need the warm air
     anyways. . .

     The K&N filter might fit, but probably not.  It depends on which
     afterarket filter you choose.

     I've heard of one person who ran a 4" duct from the second snorkel to
     a cold air source (that hole in the fender in front of the overfill
     tank looks handy. . .) and claims a 2-tenth improvement in the quarter
     mile.  I'm not sure I believe this, but just maybe it's true (a 2
     tenths improvement on a high 15s car isn't that big of a deal).  I'm
     planning on running a cold-air duct from my second snorkel and then
     moving the vacuum hose on that side so that the second snorkel opens
     when the heat riser shuts off rather than only at WOT.

     I'm still trying to figure out a way to remove that carbon filter or
     whatever the heck it is just inside of the air filter without damaging
     the air cleaner housing.  It appears to be held in by a bead of blue
     silicone.  It's obviously restricting flow since when I go to clean my
     K&N filter only the top 3/4" or so is really dirty, meaning all the
     air is going through that small section (I usually flip the filter
     over halfway between cleanings so both sides get dirty).

     I remember trying the flip-over-the-lid trick on my '79.  It sure
     sounded cool (although the hood _barely_ shut), and made my 260 go
     from really really really slow to just really really slow.  It could
     have been psychological, hearing the hiss. . .

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Re: open element air cleaner
Author:  oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    12/10/96 8:05 AM


Andy Geeting wrote:
>
> Hey everyone,
>      I was wondering if it was possible to put an open element air cleaner
> on my '87 Cutlass Supreme? I would like to put one on but I don't know
> anything about these Thermac air cleaners. Will it affect the way my car
> runs at all? I know it will run rough until it warms up but is there
> anything else that might go wrong?
>      I recently bought a K&N air filter. Will this fit an open element air
> cleaner or do you have to get a special one?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>

------------------------------

From: tonwald@metro2.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 00:14:28 -0400
Subject: Re: '85, '86 block quality

>Has anyone heard about Olds' block quality being poor for 1985 or 1986?  I
>was told by a friend who was told by a couple of mechanics that there was a
>problem with the nickel content during one of those years

David --

I have'nt heard of any poor quality blocks in '85 or '86,  but I do know
that there was a problem in '87.  I don't know if it is due to poor nickel
quantity, but there was a cracking problem in the deck area.  Engine
rebuilders are aware of this and check the decks of '87 307's very close.

Olds wasn't the only division to suffer in '87.  The small block Chev
cracked in the cam valley that year,  and the 2.5 liter 4 cyl Pontiac
suffered block and head cracking problems that year.

Tony

 _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/+++\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_


                                        Tony Waldner
tonwald@metro2.k12.mn.us                Northeast Metro 916
                                         3300 Century Ave. N.
                                         White Bear Lake, MN
                                                       55110

 \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_+++_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/

------------------------------

From: tonwald@metro2.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Date: Wed, 11 Dec 1996 00:29:52 -0400
Subject: Re: V6 to V8

>I have a 1983 oldsmobile cutlass with a 3.8l V6 and a olds factory 350 turbo
>transmission.  The car is in good shape but it is too damn slow.  I'm
>getting ready to rebuild a pre-1984  350 chevy motor that I have had sitting
>around.  I'm looking for information (or somewhere to find information) on
>capatibility between the V6/V8 and olds/chevy (transmission,cooling,motor
>mounts and brackets).
>                                                Randy Phillips
>                                                rjphil00@pop.uky.edu

Randy --

I have done a few of these swaps and it is going to be tough unless you
have a "donor" car to get motor mounts, p/s pump, starter, pulleys, fan,
shroud, radiator, a/c brackets, and exhaust from.

Some GM TH350's came with both bell housing patterns in them.  If you are
lucky,  you will have the trans with both patterns there.  If not,  you
will need to buy a trans too!

A Buick 350 fits the best because all of the brackets and accesories are
the same.  The fuel line is routed on the left side of the frame for both
v6 and v8 Buicks.

The toughest part of swapping the 455 in place of the V6 in my 85 Cutlass
Salon was getting the frame pads off of my frame!  Hard to reach bolts in
the frame!
It also was a pain to re-route the fuel line across the front of the motor.
looks dumb!  Other than that the Buick to Olds swap was easy.  The Chev is
just as easy provided you have all of the accessories.

Good luck!

Tony

 _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/+++\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_


                                        Tony Waldner
tonwald@metro2.k12.mn.us                Northeast Metro 916
                                         3300 Century Ave. N.
                                         White Bear Lake, MN
                                                       55110

 \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_+++_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 13:25:16 -0400
Subject: Re: Re[2]: open element air cleaner

At 03:50 AM 12/10/96 -0500, you wrote:
>
>     I've always wondered about the effectiveness of those heat risers.  I
>     understand what they're trying to do, and I agree they must do
>     something since all cars have them.  But it seems to me that trying to
>     warm the air by drawing it over the exh. manifold when the engine is
>     cold would sort of be self-defeating.  By the time the exh. manifold
>     warms up, the engine is warmed up and doesn't need the warm air
>     anyways. . .

Well, I'd say that the exhaust manifold warms up pretty quickly; put your
hand on it, and start the car- then you can know for sure... ;)

It is not just for the initial startup, but for driveability in the first
few minutes, as well as for emissions control. The exhaust starts providing
hot air in a few seconds, while it takes the engine a couple minutes to get
up to operating temperature, especially on a cold day.

I know that running an open-element on my 403 hurts the driveability for
about 5 minutes after startup, though I don't know if it takes longer
overall to warm up.

OTOH, I used to run the same open-element on my '70 455, and with a Holley
carb and manual choke, I could drive off after only a few seconds, and it
didn't stumble at all.

I think the key here is what conditions your engine was designed to operate
under. If your carb expects warm air, and is designed to be driveable under
cold conditions with a supply of warm air, then feeding it cold air will
result in driveability problems. Of course you could modify the fuel supply
system to make it driveable with cold air under cold conditions, but then
you'd likely sacrifice some other quality (fuel consumption, exhaust
emissions, etc.) unless you did a whole lot re-engineering.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 13:28:39 -0400
Subject: 10-Bolt confusion, and Apology in Advance...

Well, I don't know how I could have been more wrong, but my plans for
getting a decent rear gear into my Olds 409-powered Electra have been shot
down...

THE PLAN: Since my '78 Electra has a corporate 10-Bolt rear, I planned on
swapping out its open carrier for the posi carrier from my '76 Monte Carlo
parts car, and since I'd still like to be able to move that around the yard,
I planned on putting the open carrier from the corporate 10-bolt out of the
'72 Vista Cruiser I parted last spring in the Monte temporarily.

REALITY: Did you know that GM made at least _three_ different types of
10-bolt rear ends in the '70's? If you want to see them, just come by my
yard, since the three 10-Bolts above that I planned to swap parts around in
are ALL DIFFERENT! :(

The '78 Electra rear is a "B"-type rear, with scallops in the cover where
the axle tubes connect with the gear case. The '76 Monte rear seems to be
the standard corporate type, with a smooth cover. The '72 VC rear has a
contoured cover (like a "C"-type 12-bolt), and a large cast "O" on either
side of the front of the gear casing.

Now for the question: Does anybody know whether the innards of these three
rears are *absolutely* non-interchangeable? I know that GM did some wierd
things with their gears and casings (10-bolt rears with 12-bolt covers, "B",
"P", "O" and "C" type rears, etc.), and would like some direction on this.
The '78 Buick shop manual can tell me what I have, but not what it will
interchange with across years and makes.

I may just end up swapping in an entire 3.23 posi rear axle from a later
"C"-body with a trailer-towing package or such.

Oh, and the apology is for the official looking .sig that I will be using
from now on, since I'm getting more mail from students and colleagues who
really don't care what cars I own. Just don't call me doctor here....
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "JOSEPH_W. BARKER" <BARKERJO@mailserv1.ferris.edu>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 1996 14:12:38 -0400
Subject: Re: open element air cleaner

> Date sent:      Tue, 10 Dec 1996 11:37:25 -0400
> From:           Andy Geeting <geetinag@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu>
> Subject:        open element air cleaner
> To:             oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Send reply to:  oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

> Hey everyone,
>      I was wondering if it was possible to put an open element air cleaner
> on my '87 Cutlass Supreme? I would like to put one on but I don't know
> anything about these Thermac air cleaners. Will it affect the way my car
> runs at all? I know it will run rough until it warms up but is there
> anything else that might go wrong?
>      I recently bought a K&N air filter. Will this fit an open element air
> cleaner or do you have to get a special one?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Andy Geeting
> geetinag@miavx1.muohio.edu
> '87 Cutlass Supreme
> '88 Cutlass Supreme Classic Brougham
> '74 Delta 88 convertible
>
>
> Dear Andy,

The only way putting an open element aircleaner on your car will
affect performance is when you start it up it won't run quite as
efficiently as it would recieving warm air from the choke stove.  It
will help your engine breathe better too.

Joe Barker
84 Cutlass Calais RWD

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #398
********************************
 
