
oldsmobile-digest      Thursday, April 22 2004      Volume 01 : Number 4865



CALIFORNIA SMOG LAWS
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
RE: CALIFORNIA SMOG LAWS
RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?
Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?
RE: Rear main seal
Re: Fuel gauge/Autometer,works opposite
Transistor Ignitions
Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?
Re: Rear main seal
Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: Rear main seal
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Spring Carlisle 4/23 (Fri)
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 12:42:01 -0700
From: "John Holt sr" <johnlholtsr@hotmail.com>
Subject: CALIFORNIA SMOG LAWS

the website for official state of california smog regs is listed under ca 
dept of consumer affairs, here is the link that spells out the existing up 
to date smog laws for the state of CA. Model year 76 and later need to be 
smog checked, 75 and earlier are exempt.

http://www.smogcheck.ca.gov/StdPage.asp?Body=/Smogcheck/doineed.htm



John

_________________________________________________________________
Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your waist. 
http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=et_pv_030104_lovehandles

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 14:58:02 -0500
From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

I'll double check.... I'm not sure it's fused. I'll double check if
possible.

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "swanny" <swannys78@adelphia.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 2:36 PM
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions


> JBS,
> I have to correct myself on determing which starter you might have. One
> feild (thin cooper wire about 1/4 ") coming from the starter body  to the
> solenoid, is a low torque starter. A high torque starter has two fields,
and
> sometimes has an inch long shaft to the solenoid.
>
>  Was the brown wire a fuseable link?
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
> To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 2:52 PM
> Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
>
>
> > Not sure about the starter being HD or not, I'll check. stock exhaust
> > manifolds are in use. I should mention that after the starter install
> (about
> > 3 months ago) I had to tape the insulation on a "brown" wire to get the
> > starter to work. This insulationt was rubbed, or burnt through and was
> > ARCHING when I tried to start the car. I'm not sure if this is still the
> > issue with slow cranks after the cars been running.
> >
> > Thanks for the suggestions. The PVC valve is a year old, but that means
> > nothing. I'll just go ahead and replace that.
> > Come to think of it, I do believe the tranny pan you mention is rather
> > wet.... rear main seal?
> >
> > I'll check the plugs tonight and report back. I will also get the car on
> the
> > rack this weekend to investigate the starter and the wet tranny pan
> > further... any other suggestions are welcome.
> >
> >
> > JB Schuren.... this list is great... such a wealth of knowledge.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "swanny" <swannys78@adelphia.net>
> > To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 11:48 AM
> > Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
> >
> >
> > > JBS
> > > Some rebuilt starters they give you at the auto parts store are not
what
> > > they seem. If the starter you have replaced has only one field going
to
> > the
> > > solenoid it is a standard duty, if it has two feilds with a long post
to
> > the
> > > solenoid it is a heavy duty. More often than not the difference in the
> > > starter is more cranking ability for engines with either higher
> > compression
> > > or more cid. Are you using headers?
> > >
> > > Check your plugs, if they are tan or grey most likley your not burning
> > oil.
> > > Blow by might another consideration. Check your pcv valve. Any puddles
> on
> > > the garage floor? Is your inspection pan for your tranny (assuming it
is
> > an
> > > auto) wet?
> > > Pat Swanton.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
> > > To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> > > Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 11:43 AM
> > > Subject: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
> > >
> > >
> > > > Oil Usage:
> > > > My 71 rocket with 59 original is burning about 1 qt of oil per
month.
> > This
> > > > car is driven everyday 95% City.
> > > > Last year the thermostat stuck and we reached about 250degrees,
every
> > > since
> > > > then the cars has used a quart or so a month...so I checdked her
> fliuds
> > > this
> > > > evening, like I do every month and she was was two quarts low this
> > month!!
> > > > and I noticed a slight KNOCK when I started her. I added two qt of
> > > straight
> > > > 40 and she stopped knocking. Power is still there...... I don't have
> any
> > > > blue oil smoke... Where is the oil going??? did the heat score the
> > > cylinder
> > > > walls? Is she worn out enough that it might be time for a rebuild???
> > > >
> > > > Starter question:
> > > > I just replaced the starter, it's a remanunfacture and after the
cars
> > been
> > > > driven and stopped, it turns over REAL slow. I've had this occur on
> > > chebbies
> > > > (starter is too hot from exhaust). But the starter that was on the
car
> > > > before never acted this way... what to do?
> > > >
> > > > Sorry for multi questions..... but I'm affraid my Cutlass is dying.
> > > >
> > > > JB Schuren
> > > > 71Cutlass Conv Rocket 350 w/HEI.
> > > > 03 Dodge Ram 1500 Hemi QC
> > > > http://foggy.audioguy.net
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 13:10:15 -0700
From: "67Oldz" <67@oldsmobile.net>
Subject: RE: CALIFORNIA SMOG LAWS

Yes however there is a bill which is supposed to pass and be active within a
couple months... Something about no more 30 year old cars...From what I have
found so far it will change the law so that... Here is a link with real info
on whats about to happen....
http://www.enjoythedrive.com/content/?id=32719

- -----Original Message-----
From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
[mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca] On Behalf Of John Holt sr
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 12:42 PM
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: CALIFORNIA SMOG LAWS

the website for official state of california smog regs is listed under ca
dept of consumer affairs, here is the link that spells out the existing up
to date smog laws for the state of CA. Model year 76 and later need to be
smog checked, 75 and earlier are exempt.

http://www.smogcheck.ca.gov/StdPage.asp?Body=/Smogcheck/doineed.htm



John

_________________________________________________________________
Lose those love handles! MSN Fitness shows you two moves to slim your waist.

http://fitness.msn.com/articles/feeds/article.aspx?dept=exercise&article=et_
pv_030104_lovehandles

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:25:40 -0400
From: james.zito@ps.ge.com
Subject: RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

>From DanGer ow:
Lastly, I know the Olds 12 bolt isn't a "real" 12 bolt and parts are
somewhat difficult to find (esp. gears) thus it seems as if a (gasp, shri=
ek,
horror) Chebby rear may be the way to go, so if I brake it, I won't cry.
And all brand C 12 bolts use C clips, right?  What about others from the
B.O.P. lineup, are they all the same?

Any experience/info is mucho appreciato.

- -----------------------------------------------
Although it is true that the Olds "12 bolt" only refers to the cover, since
the ring is held on with only 10 bolts, parts aren't all that hard to find.
Richmond gears I believe carries the gears.  And I know that Greg Rollin
from www.SupercarsUnlimited.com has all the goodies for them that you could
ever want.  gear sets, limited spin units, bearings, crush sleeves and
limited spin rebuild kits.

I am not sure but I think the B and the P types are remarkably simmilar to
the O type......

Jim
69 442 conv

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:26:25 -0400
From: james.zito@ps.ge.com
Subject: RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

>From DanGer ow:

Lastly, I know the Olds 12 bolt isn't a "real" 12 bolt and parts are
somewhat difficult to find (esp. gears) thus it seems as if a (gasp, shriek,
horror) Chebby rear may be the way to go, so if I brake it, I won't cry.
And all brand C 12 bolts use C clips, right?  What about others from the
B.O.P. lineup, are they all the same?
- ---------------------------------------
While it is true that the O type is 2 bolts short on the ring, parts are out
there.  I am fairly sure that Richmond Gear has the ring and pinions sets,
as well as the bearings and shims required to set them up.  I KNOW that Greg
Rollin of Supercars Unlimited has everything you could ever want for them.
>From gear sets, to complete carriers (all 3 sizes IIRC) the set up kits,
crush sleeves, S springs, rebuild kits for the limited spin so that the rear
end you thought was a dog leg after 6-700 miles of burn outs can again spin
both tires.......

Not entirely sure on this but I think that the Band P rears may be the same
as the O.....after all the trannies match......


Jim
69 442 conv

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:52:34 -0400
From: travis gummels <travis@gummels.com>
Subject: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

Hello Everybody,

I have a 350ci olds that currently has a 2.5inch exhaust with hpipe.  
Its quite rusty and loud I'd like to replace it.  I have found a 
stainless kit from http://www.never-rust.com/custom.html but its the 
stock sized system and no hpipe.  I can get a aluminized kit from 
torquetech thats 2.5inch and has an hpipe or xpipe.

Performance wise what do y'all think is better?  The 2.5 or the 2?  My 
motor is .060 over btw.

Thanks
Travis

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 16:00:53 -0500
From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

IMHO, 2.5 with X or H pipe.


- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "travis gummels" <travis@gummels.com>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 3:52 PM
Subject: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?


> Hello Everybody,
> 
> I have a 350ci olds that currently has a 2.5inch exhaust with hpipe.  
> Its quite rusty and loud I'd like to replace it.  I have found a 
> stainless kit from http://www.never-rust.com/custom.html but its the 
> stock sized system and no hpipe.  I can get a aluminized kit from 
> torquetech thats 2.5inch and has an hpipe or xpipe.
> 
> Performance wise what do y'all think is better?  The 2.5 or the 2?  My 
> motor is .060 over btw.
> 
> Thanks
> Travis
> 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 15:43:03 -0500
From: Kevin Wright <krwright@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: RE: Rear main seal

Try that "Great Stuff" or whatever it is that comes in cheez-whiz cans 
and caulking-gun cartridges. Best RTV gasket-maker I've ever used.

krw
On Apr 20, 2004, at 4:24 PM, oldsmobile-digest wrote:

> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 12:52:24 -0500
> From: "Mike Schlottman" <mschlott@spe.org>
> Subject: RE: Rear main seal
>
>> The RTV that I used at the back of intake in lieu of the
>> rubber seal did
>> leak, however.............(:
>>
>> Paul Tumolo
>> 1970 442 Hardtop
>> OCA # 31967
>
> Arggg.   I hate that.  I will be doing my intake again, this week or 
> next to correct the same problem.  This time I will use the rubber 
> seals.  But I'm going to use a thin layer of RTV under the seal to 
> glue it in place.  I'll let it sit over night before installing the 
> intake.  I also plan on puttng a layer of RTV  on top of the seal.  
> Along with duct tape, JB -weld, super glue and anything else I can 
> find. :)  I will not have a leaking intake!
>
>     mike
>
> Mike Schlottman
On digest mode, so I'm a little slow...

Kevin Wright                                         
krwright@sbcglobal.net
Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX                             
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/70Olds.html

'71 Cutlass S for sale, less engine and trans: 
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/71_cutlass.html

Snoopy: 1970 Oldsmobile Cutlass S Sports Coupe - It wants to be a W-31! 
And have EFI, 4-wheel discs, a 6-speed, a turbo or two... :)
...and a '71 Holiday Coupe less engine/transmission for sale - it'll be 
parts if someone doesn't buy it!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 15:39:46 -0500
From: Kevin Wright <krwright@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel gauge/Autometer,works opposite

You might take another look at Autometer's website. I could have sworn 
that some of their fuel gauges worked with GM senders. Might be the 
newer style, though, which would explain the reverse reading, or it 
could be VDO or Stewart-Warner that I'm thinking of...

krw
On Apr 20, 2004, at 4:24 PM, oldsmobile-digest wrote:

> Date: Tue, 20 Apr 2004 13:23:09 -0400
> From: "swanny" <swannys78@adelphia.net>
> Subject: Re: Fuel gauge/Autometer,works opposite
>
> Milton,
> You are one hundred % correct. It isn't worth the aggravation.
> With normal everyday driving or weekends for that matter, I can go by 
> the
> tripometer. I can toss it up as a lesson learned.
> I think I still have the rallye pack gauges and ill try to incorporate 
> that
> in to the dash. Its a shame I had a custom dash panel made for all the
> gauges.
> Thanks for your imput.
> Pat Swanton.
>
On digest mode, so I'm a little slow...

Kevin Wright                                         
krwright@sbcglobal.net
Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX                             
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/70Olds.html

'71 Cutlass S for sale, less engine and trans: 
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/71_cutlass.html

Snoopy: 1970 Oldsmobile Cutlass S Sports Coupe - It wants to be a W-31! 
And have EFI, 4-wheel discs, a 6-speed, a turbo or two... :)
...and a '71 Holiday Coupe less engine/transmission for sale - it'll be 
parts if someone doesn't buy it!

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 19:02:40 EDT
From: HURSTOLDZ@aol.com
Subject: Transistor Ignitions

- -------------------------------1082588559
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hey List

I was emailed this question from this guy I bought an alternator from,  maybe 
someone here can EMAIL HIM PRIVATELY?   
baskethd@insight.rr.com
Thanks
Vinny
68 H/O

YOU MAYBE ABLE TO HELP ME.  I WAS WONDERING IF OLDSMOBILE 442'S  EVERY USED A 
TRANSITOR IGNITION (TI)  AND IF THEY DID WHAT ALTERNATOR DID THEY USE ON 
THESE CARS AND WHAT YEARS DID THEY USE THEM.  I KNOW PONTIAC AND CHEVROLET DID AND 
THEY ARE ALWAYS A 42 AMP.  IF YOU CAN HELP LET ME KNOW. THANKS, RANDY.

- -------------------------------1082588559
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><HEAD>
<META charset=3DUS-ASCII http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; cha=
rset=3DUS-ASCII">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff=
f">
<DIV>Hey List</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>I was emailed this question from this guy I bought an alternator from,&=
nbsp; maybe someone here can EMAIL HIM PRIVATELY?&nbsp;&nbsp; </DIV>
<DIV><A href=3D"mailto:baskethd@insight.rr.com">baskethd@insight.rr.com</A><=
/DIV>
<DIV>Thanks</DIV>
<DIV>Vinny</DIV>
<DIV>68 H/O</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>YOU MAYBE ABLE TO HELP ME.&nbsp; I WAS WONDERING IF OLDSMOBILE 442'S &n=
bsp;EVERY USED A TRANSITOR IGNITION (TI) &nbsp;AND IF THEY DID WHAT ALTERNAT=
OR DID THEY USE ON THESE CARS AND WHAT YEARS DID THEY USE THEM. &nbsp;I KNOW=
 PONTIAC AND CHEVROLET DID AND THEY ARE ALWAYS A 42 AMP.&nbsp; IF YOU CAN HE=
LP LET ME KNOW. THANKS, RANDY.</DIV></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1082588559--

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 19:11:38 -0400
From: "ron fama" <77w30442@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

  3 inch works best
  ron
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "travis gummels" <travis@gummels.com>
  To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
  Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 4:52 PM
  Subject: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?


  > Hello Everybody,
  > 
  > I have a 350ci olds that currently has a 2.5inch exhaust with hpipe.  
  > Its quite rusty and loud I'd like to replace it.  I have found a 
  > stainless kit from http://www.never-rust.com/custom.html but its the 
  > stock sized system and no hpipe.  I can get a aluminized kit from 
  > torquetech thats 2.5inch and has an hpipe or xpipe.
  > 
  > Performance wise what do y'all think is better?  The 2.5 or the 2?  My 
  > motor is .060 over btw.
  > 
  > Thanks
  > Travis
  > 
  > 

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 19:02:11 -0700
From: Kevin & Casey Olund <kcolund@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Rear main seal

I think you mean "Right Stuff", and I concur, it's the best I've used

Kevin 

> Try that "Great Stuff" or whatever it is that comes in cheez-whiz cans 
> and caulking-gun cartridges. Best RTV gasket-maker I've ever used.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 19:01:09 -0700
From: Kevin & Casey Olund <kcolund@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

>   3 inch works best
>   >
>   > Performance wise what do y'all think is better?  The 2.5 or the 2?  My
>   > motor is .060 over btw.

It all depends on what you desire. A smaller pipe aids low speed velocity and in turn assists with cylinder scavenging
at lower rpm's. With an H pipe, the larger diameter isn't as necessary as it is on a separated duals system, as higher
rpm pressure increases can be dispensed of via two pipes.

The cam and heads, etc play a big part as well. I would dare to guess that if you were running a cam with 10 or so more
degrees duration on the exhaust than the intake, the larger diameter pipe would not make much of a difference. However,
if you are running a cam with similar duration specs, you would want to go with the larger pipes.

Kevin

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 22:24:11 -0400
From: "Randy Geisel" <rocket455@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

> >  Was the brown wire a fuseable link?

Not on a '71.....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 23:58:00 -0400
From: "Daniel R. Gerow" <dgerow@stonehill.edu>
Subject: Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

Thank you to all for the axle education, makes perfect sense now!

My original plan was to purchase a complete/rebuilt Chebby rear and retire
my original into safekeeping.  As Milton pointed out, C clip eliminators
would be mandatory for my concerns.  This would ease the installation of an
aftermarket brake kit as most are built generically for the "GM A Body line"
thus our previous discussion.

More questions specifically related to the aftermarket brake kits:

Milton, when I began my research last summer I was leaning towards a Wilwood
kit.  However after talking to many people at car shows who were using or
had used them on their classic iron, they all said the same thing; great
quality and excellent stopping, but pad replacement was much too frequent.
Any comments on that?

I'm currently debating between Wilwood and Baer...both have the same size
rotors (13" front / 12" rear Wilwood are two-piece, Baer are solid) however
the calipers are much different - 6 piston front /4 rear Wilwood and 2
piston front / single rear Baer.  Of course cost is an issue and the Baer
kit is much more affordable, but then again, one would not want to skimp on
such a critical system as brakes.

Confusion re-establishes itself and takes the lead! :)

 ~ Dan

- -------------------------------------
Daniel R. Gerow
'70 W-31 4spd post
dgerow@stonehill.edu
http://www.oldsrocket.com
- -------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 00:00:59 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

Dan,


> Milton, when I began my research last summer I was leaning towards a
Wilwood
> kit.  However after talking to many people at car shows who were using or
> had used them on their classic iron, they all said the same thing; great
> quality and excellent stopping, but pad replacement was much too frequent.
> Any comments on that?


Wilwood has A, H, J, B, C, E, Q, and T brake pad compounds. For a proper
disc brake system tailored to your car, you need to select the correct brake
pad compound. What we don't know is what those other people used for a pad
compound. Go to http://www.wilwood.org/PolyMatrixCatalog.pdf and read the
characteristics of the different Wilwood brake pad compounds.


> I'm currently debating between Wilwood and Baer...both have the same size
> rotors (13" front / 12" rear Wilwood are two-piece, Baer are solid)
however
> the calipers are much different - 6 piston front /4 rear Wilwood and 2
> piston front / single rear Baer.  Of course cost is an issue and the Baer
> kit is much more affordable, but then again, one would not want to skimp
on
> such a critical system as brakes.


That's because a 4 or 6 piston caliper is always more expensive than a 1 or
2 piston caliper. I prefer the multiple piston calipers because they're
always more streamlined and compact in thickness and the torque application
is more even on the circumference of the rotor.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 00:18:29 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

> Last year the thermostat stuck and we reached about 250degrees, every
since
> then the cars has used a quart or so a month...so I checdked her fliuds
this
> evening, like I do every month and she was was two quarts low this month!!
> and I noticed a slight KNOCK when I started her.


The high heat pulse may have stuck a few rings in their respective ring
lands in the pistons. That could be the oil usage. Also, the excessive heat
could have caused tremendous momentary wear in the valve guides, again
increasing oil consumption. The knock could be a partially collapsed piston
skirt due to the heat sticking a piston in a cylinder bore.


> I added two qt of straight
> 40 and she stopped knocking. Power is still there...... I don't have any
> blue oil smoke... Where is the oil going???


It could be just valve guide damage.


> did the heat score the cylinder
> walls?


Probably.


> Is she worn out enough that it might be time for a rebuild???


Could be. Pull the plugs and see if they're oil fouled.


> Starter question:
> I just replaced the starter, it's a remanunfacture and after the cars been
> driven and stopped, it turns over REAL slow. I've had this occur on
chebbies
> (starter is too hot from exhaust). But the starter that was on the car
> before never acted this way... what to do?


An Olds is supposed to use a high torque starter, but most rebuilt
replacement starters are standard torque. Look at the flat lead(s) coming
out of the starter case that attach to the solenoid. If only one flat lead
is present, you have a standard torque starter that has 4 field coils. If 2
flat leads are present, back-to-back, you have a high torque starter with 3
field coils and one shunt coil. That's how GM makes a high torque starter.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 00:21:40 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

> I should mention that after the starter install (about
> 3 months ago) I had to tape the insulation on a "brown" wire to get the
> starter to work. This insulationt was rubbed, or burnt through and was
> ARCHING when I tried to start the car. I'm not sure if this is still the
> issue with slow cranks after the cars been running.


If that wire was overheated enough, the copper wire itself could have been
heat damaged to the point where it lost part of its conductivity and the
resistance in the wire went up.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 05:14:06 EDT
From: Tremendous442@aol.com
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

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2.5 better than 2 inch performance wise. 3 inch even better. Of course on the 
noise level side, the smaller is not as loud, but who cares about that?

Sean

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<DIV>2.5 better than 2 inch performance wise. 3 inch even better. Of course=20=
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<DIV>Sean</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 05:27:27 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

> Last year the thermostat stuck and we reached about 250degrees, every
since
> then the cars has used a quart or so a month...

250 shouldn't be enough to kill anything.

I'd replace the valve stem seals if they are original.  The valve stem seals
were responsible for a lot fo the oil loss on most of the Olds I have seen
using oil .

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 05:36:45 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Rear main seal

> Try that "Great Stuff" or whatever it is that comes in cheez-whiz cans 
> and caulking-gun cartridges. Best RTV gasket-maker I've ever used.

You are thinking of  "The Right Stuff." It is a great product.

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 07:19:49 -0500
From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I'll check all this out this weekend.... The underside of the car where the
motor and trans meet is very oily....
The valve stem seals are original, motor has never been touched. Is this
something that is fairly easy to do?

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:36:40 -0400
From: "swanny" <swannys78@adelphia.net>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

If you've never done valve stem seals it is a tedious job.
The best way is to take the heads off and send them to your local machine
shop. Do you have an air compressor and air tools?
Pat Swanton


From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 8:19 AM
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions


> Thanks for all the suggestions.
>
> I'll check all this out this weekend.... The underside of the car where
the
> motor and trans meet is very oily....
> The valve stem seals are original, motor has never been touched. Is this
> something that is fairly easy to do?
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:36:22 -0400
From: "ron fama" <77w30442@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

  on a note i had a 1968 442 that lost the left axle due to failed brg, was not fun.even though  it
was the olds rear with bolt in axles they still can leave the car.
  ron
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Daniel R. Gerow" <dgerow@stonehill.edu>
  To: "Olds List" <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
  Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 11:58 PM
  Subject: Re: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?


  > Thank you to all for the axle education, makes perfect sense now!
  >
  > My original plan was to purchase a complete/rebuilt Chebby rear and retire
  > my original into safekeeping.  As Milton pointed out, C clip eliminators
  > would be mandatory for my concerns.  This would ease the installation of an
  > aftermarket brake kit as most are built generically for the "GM A Body line"
  > thus our previous discussion.
  >
  > More questions specifically related to the aftermarket brake kits:
  >
  > Milton, when I began my research last summer I was leaning towards a Wilwood
  > kit.  However after talking to many people at car shows who were using or
  > had used them on their classic iron, they all said the same thing; great
  > quality and excellent stopping, but pad replacement was much too frequent.
  > Any comments on that?
  >
  > I'm currently debating between Wilwood and Baer...both have the same size
  > rotors (13" front / 12" rear Wilwood are two-piece, Baer are solid) however
  > the calipers are much different - 6 piston front /4 rear Wilwood and 2
  > piston front / single rear Baer.  Of course cost is an issue and the Baer
  > kit is much more affordable, but then again, one would not want to skimp on
  > such a critical system as brakes.
  >
  > Confusion re-establishes itself and takes the lead! :)
  >
  >  ~ Dan
  >
  > -------------------------------------
  > Daniel R. Gerow
  > '70 W-31 4spd post
  > dgerow@stonehill.edu
  > http://www.oldsrocket.com
  > -------------------------------------
  >
  >
  >

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 08:44:30 -0500
From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

I got air/tools, so I could remove the heads and such, but now I'm thinking
a complete engine rebuild if i'm going to go to that kinda trouble.

can you bore AND  'stroke' the rocket 350? or would there be clearance
issues with longer rods?

- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "swanny" <swannys78@adelphia.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 7:36 AM
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions


> If you've never done valve stem seals it is a tedious job.
> The best way is to take the heads off and send them to your local machine
> shop. Do you have an air compressor and air tools?
> Pat Swanton
>
>
> From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
> To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 8:19 AM
> Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
>
>
> > Thanks for all the suggestions.
> >
> > I'll check all this out this weekend.... The underside of the car where
> the
> > motor and trans meet is very oily....
> > The valve stem seals are original, motor has never been touched. Is this
> > something that is fairly easy to do?
> >
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 13:55:01 +0000
From: brad442@comcast.net
Subject: Spring Carlisle 4/23 (Fri)

I'll be wandering around lookin at & for stuff Friday.  I should be at Ed & Bonnie Fochi's swap space (Space IE 20) 'round noon to eat lunch in piece.  I'll have info 'bout the GM Nats in June then.  Look for a Baltimore Ravens Super Bowl Champions had overtop of my ugly mug.
- --
 ---
| | |  Brad Nicholson
| | |  1987 442 & 2001 Intrigue GLS
|/|\|  brad442@comcast.net
| | |  mywebpages.comcast.net/brad442
 ---

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 10:33:21 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

> I got air/tools, so I could remove the heads and such, but now I'm
thinking
> a complete engine rebuild if i'm going to go to that kinda trouble.

- -----------------

You do not need to pull the heads.  If you have a compressor, just buy the
adapter that screws in to the spark plug hole.  The air pressure holds the
valves up while you change the stem seals.

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 10:53:00 -0400
From: SteveH <k0xp@dandy.net>
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

At Thursday, 22 April 2004, you wrote:
>You do not need to pull the heads.  If you have a compressor, 
>just buy the adapter that screws in to the spark plug hole. 
>The air pressure holds the valves up while you change the 
>stem seals.

What stem seals would you recommend, Fred? I've heard that the original 
teflon O-ring type that Olds used and that are included in the Felpro 
gasket sets aren't very good, and some have used the rubber umbrella 
types from Frod 289s and say they are much better. What say you?

Along the same lines of valve seals/guides...  I recently found a 
vacuum gage that's apparently not damped at all; it's response is 
very quick. On my '88 307, it wriggles about +/- 1 or 2 inches Hg 
pretty violently at rpms above 600-700 but at idle, it's steady. 
Even at 4000 rpm, it'll show violent wriggling +/- an inch or two.
I would have thought that the undamped vacuum gauge would show more 
wriggling at LOW rpm since it would be able to keep up with the intake 
pulses easier but this is definitely the opposite.

Oil consumption is up to a quart/200-300 miles and about half the 
time, there's a nice blue cloud of oil smoke when the engine's started,
whether warm or hot (but not usually when cold). In addition to 
valve seals, I'm thinking the vacuum gage behavior may be an indication 
that my valve guides are well-worn; what you think? This engine has 
over 235K miles but still runs like a bat outta heck for a 4600 lb 
station wagon with a 307; has no problem spinning my Avid 275/60-
15s for a few feet :o)

Thanks,
SteveH



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------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 09:29:57 -0700
From: "Schopen, Kenneth" <kenneth.schopen@medtronic.com>
Subject: RE: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?

> Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 09:07:41 -0400
> From: "Gerow, Daniel R." <dgerow@stonehill.edu>
> Subject: Rear disc brakes/C clip axles?
  

snip 

> Lastly, I know the Olds 12 bolt isn't a "real" 12 bolt and parts 
> are somewhat difficult to find (esp. gears) 

snip 
 
>   ~ Dan

Ah, once again my favorite rear end, the O-Type 12 bolt, is up for discussion. 

You are correct that new gears choices are somewhat limited. Richmond Gear 
is currently the only manufacturer, and they make only 3.42, 3.90 and 4.10 
gears that are designed for use on the carrier originally used for 3.08-3.23 
gears (limited slip carrier #671 - I don't know the open carrier number). But 
really, do you need something other than 3.42, 3.90 or 4.10 for a performance 
street setup? Oh, I forgot you have a W-31, so you'll probably be wanting some 
4.33s or lower same as Chris Smetana :)

You can get new and used parts from Supercars Unlimited, and there's a fella 
named Brian Trick (bltrick@aol.com) who has lots of used parts for them (as well 
as a LOT of knowledge on O-Type rears). You could also post on realoldspower.com 
and see what those fellas can come up with - sometimes I am quite surprised at what 
surfaces on that For Sale board.

Your '70 O-Type is reportedly the strongest of the O-Types due to better metallurgy 
than the earlier ones, and the use of a tapered roller axle bearing. That bearing 
style is supposed to greatly increase the loading capacity. It also makes the '70 
axles and housing incompatible with the '67-'69 version - ask me how I know this and 
I'll be compelled to relate the story of how I ended up with one of each of the 
O-Type 12 bolts Olds made.

If you want any more info on O-Type 12 bolts, feel free to e-mail me and I'll share 
all I know.

Kenneth
1971 Cutlass Supreme convertible
Phoenix, AZ

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 18:21:27 +0000
From: 77w30442@comcast.net
Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions

did not pay much attention to original post but  from what i have read.
oil in back of engine can be 2 things valve cover gaskets or leaking intake.
valve seals can be a pain in the rear when done in the car. and its hard to check valve guide wear when 120lbs of air psi is holding the valve closed.
if you pull heads and send out they can check valve guids but 2 problems can accur. 1 if they have to do a valve job  first the valve hiegt most likely  wont be correct and leave you with a adjustment problem.2 if they  cut the valve seats ect. ot may be to much for the tired out rings and cause bigger problems. i had a 455 with great compression but the darn oil ring failed due to over heating. 
just my 2 cents
ron
> If you've never done valve stem seals it is a tedious job.
> The best way is to take the heads off and send them to your local machine
> shop. Do you have an air compressor and air tools?
> Pat Swanton
> 
> 
> From: "JBS" <jbschuren@houston.rr.com>
> To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
> Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 8:19 AM
> Subject: Re: 71 cutlass oil use and starting questions
> 
> 
> > Thanks for all the suggestions.
> >
> > I'll check all this out this weekend.... The underside of the car where
> the
> > motor and trans meet is very oily....
> > The valve stem seals are original, motor has never been touched. Is this
> > something that is fairly easy to do?
> >
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 11:44:31 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?

Sorry, but bigger is not always better. The larger the tube, the lower the
exhaust gas velocity. The lower the exhaust gas velocity behind the exhaust
valve, the less cylinder scavenging performed. The less cylinder scavenging,
the lower the power output. Other factors enter into this equation and can
affect it, but the rule is generally true, especially for a street engine.
In an all-out race engine that couldn't survive on the street anyway, other
factors come into play.

Stock engines will work best with 2.25" and modified engines usually work
best with 2.5" all the way through or 3" necking down to 2.5" after the
mufflers.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com


- ----- Original Message -----
From: <Tremendous442@aol.com>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 2:14 AM
Subject: Re: Exhaust: 350ci: 2in or 2.5in, which is better?


> 2.5 better than 2 inch performance wise. 3 inch even better. Of course on
the
> noise level side, the smaller is not as loud, but who cares about that?
>
> Sean
>

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #4865
*********************************
