
oldsmobile-digest       Saturday, May 22 2004       Volume 01 : Number 4898



Re: sale??
Re: sale??
Re: sale??
Total Number of Olds produced
Re: sale??
Re: Total Number of Olds produced
Re: Total Number of Olds produced/ switching to Hyundai
Re: Total Number of Olds produced
sale??
Power windows 1970
Re: Total Number of Olds produced
Re: Total Number of Olds produced
1954 Olds Starfire FS (fwd)
Re: UNBOUNCE: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems
Re: UNBOUNCE: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems
Head bolt torque?
RE: Head bolt torque?
Re: Milton J. Schick
Re: Head bolt torque?
Re: Oldsmobile DELTA88 ROYAL 1984
Re: Head bolt torque?
Re: Head bolt torque?
Bigger Brakes
Re: Bigger Brakes
Anyone with a 70-72 w/Rally wheels
RE: Bigger Brakes
Re: Head bolt torque?
Re: block storage 101
Re: Head bolt torque?
'70 Toro Tire Valve Stems
70 Toro valve stems at NAPA
Re: 70 Toro valve stems at NAPA

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:11:02 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: sale??

On Fri, 21 May 2004, JOHN ORR wrote:
>     I don't know if this is allowed, but I have a complete set up for sale
> of
> JetAway and console with shifter, cable clip, cable. Console is in great
> shape,
> its black. The tranny was rebuilt about 20K miles ago, with new torque
> converter

I assume this is for a '67?

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada
          Olds List Admin Info: http://oldslist.oldsgmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 14:38:40 -0400
From: "JOHN ORR" <jorr@paylessequipment.com>
Subject: Re: sale??

   Greg,
   As far as I know, this will work on 67, 68, 69,  console,  as for the
tranny, it will work on any of the olds blocks.....
john

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:54:58 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: sale??

On Fri, 21 May 2004, JOHN ORR wrote:

>    Greg,
>    As far as I know, this will work on 67, 68, 69,  console,  as for the
> tranny, it will work on any of the olds blocks.....

I was curious if it was a '67 trans and converter because that was the
last year for the switch-pitch. Does it have that (and the hardware to
activate it)? 

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada
          Olds List Admin Info: http://oldslist.oldsgmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:07:11 -0400
From: "Paul Tumolo" <ptumolo@comcast.net>
Subject: Total Number of Olds produced

Blew my mind: Over 35,000,000 units from 1897 to 2004.

That's' a lot of cars!!!

BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buyers are switching to
Hyundai.

Paul Tumolo
1970 442 - one of 35,229,218
OCA # 31967 

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:07:48 -0400
From: "JOHN ORR" <jorr@paylessequipment.com>
Subject: Re: sale??

    Greg,
   It did indeed come out of my 67, and I do have the hardware for it. What
did not come with the car was the shifter and console. It is out of a 68, I
think, but the only difference was the plate where the shifter come out of.
john

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:00:18 -0400
From: "RobV" <rv@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Total Number of Olds produced

> BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buyers are switching to
> Hyundai.

Tell me that is a joke, please!

Rob
Free Olds classifieds and Olds car registry at www.allolds.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:17:03 EDT
From: HURSTOLDZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: Total Number of Olds produced/ switching to Hyundai

- -------------------------------1085167022
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/21/2004 3:11:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, 
ptumolo@comcast.net writes:
BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buyers are switching to
Hyundai
I would sooner kill myself before making that choice!!!

Vinny
68 H/O   (NO  NOT Hyundai/Olds)

- -------------------------------1085167022
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><HEAD>
<META charset=3DUS-ASCII http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; cha=
rset=3DUS-ASCII">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff=
f">
<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 5/21/2004 3:11:11 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ptumolo@=
comcast.net writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue=20=
2px solid"><FONT face=3DArial>BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buye=
rs are switching to<BR>Hyundai</FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV>I would sooner kill myself before making that choice!!!</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Vinny</DIV>
<DIV>68 H/O&nbsp;&nbsp; (NO&nbsp; NOT Hyundai/Olds)</DIV></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1085167022--

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 19:26:25 +0000
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Total Number of Olds produced

>BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buyers are switching to
>Hyundai.

...so apparently GM will be shutting down Hyundai next. That's odd; I didn't 
know they owned them...

- -- Andy

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself with the new version of MSN Messenger! Download today - 
it's FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 15:06:34 -0500
From: bcroe@juno.com
Subject: sale??

You can also use an electronic switch pitch controller to solve 
the linkage problems/ improve driveability.  I use these on all 
my cars.  Bruce Roe

21 May 2004  Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca> writes:

> I was curious if it was a '67 trans and converter because that 
> was the last year for the switch-pitch. Does it have that (and 
> the hardware to activate it)? 
> 
> Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, 
> Canada
>           Olds List Admin Info: http://oldslist.oldsgmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 16:26:50 EDT
From: Roncutlass@aol.com
Subject: Power windows 1970

- --part1_104.4701f321.2ddfc00a_boundary
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Does anyone have a picture of the drivers inside door with and without the 
interior piece?
I'd like to see the power window switch controls installed and the wires 
behind it.  This is for a 70 Cutlass Supreme.  Seems there is a cutout for the 
switch, but its only for 1 button?  Thanks, any responses to roncutlass@aol.com 
would be appreciated.  Ron

- --part1_104.4701f321.2ddfc00a_boundary
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><FONT FACE=3Darial,helvetica><HTML><FONT  SIZE=3D2 PTSIZE=3D10 FAMILY=
=3D"SANSSERIF" FACE=3D"Arial" LANG=3D"0">Does anyone have a picture of the d=
rivers inside door with and without the interior piece?<BR>
I'd like to see the power window switch controls installed and the wires beh=
ind it.&nbsp; This is for a 70 Cutlass Supreme.&nbsp; Seems there is a cutou=
t for the switch, but its only for 1 button?&nbsp; Thanks, any responses to=20=
roncutlass@aol.com would be appreciated.&nbsp; Ron</FONT></HTML>

- --part1_104.4701f321.2ddfc00a_boundary--

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 16:40:23 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
From: Jay Britt <jbritt67@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: Total Number of Olds produced

I heard it was Saab, not Hyundai.

- -----Original Message-----
>BTW, the data shows that most of the Olds buyers are switching to
>Hyundai.

...so apparently GM will be shutting down Hyundai next. That's odd; I didn't 
know they owned them...

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 18:01:13 EDT
From: HURSTOLDZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: Total Number of Olds produced

- -------------------------------1085176873
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 5/21/2004 4:44:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, 
jbritt67@mindspring.com writes:
I heard it was Saab, not Hyundai.
it is BOTH

- -------------------------------1085176873
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><HEAD>
<META charset=3DUS-ASCII http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; cha=
rset=3DUS-ASCII">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff=
f">
<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 5/21/2004 4:44:58 PM Eastern Standard Time, jbritt67=
@mindspring.com writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue=20=
2px solid"><FONT face=3DArial>I heard it was Saab, not Hyundai.</FONT></BLOC=
KQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV>it is BOTH</DIV></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1085176873--

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 19:47:06 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: 1954 Olds Starfire FS (fwd)

Not on the list, respond to paxtonwhse@cocentral.com if interested. Hope
you have deep pockets!

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada
          Olds List Admin Info: http://oldslist.oldsgmail.com

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Paxton <paxtonwhse@cocentral.com>
Subject: 1954 Olds

For sale:  1954 Red & White Starfire convertible.  Excellent condition. 
All power, leather, always garaged. $38,500.  Located in North Carolina. 
(252)399-9128 Coalter Paxton, Wilson, NC

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 19:24:29 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: UNBOUNCE: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems

> From:   "T. Hackett" <trphackett@comcast.net>
> Subject: 1970 Toronado tire valve stems
>
> I have leaking tire valve stems and can't find replacements. Anyone have
> any ideas?

- -----------------------

If you have a NAPA store around, they can get them easily.  Cadillac dealers
usually stock them as well, as these were used on the Eldorado from '67-'68
as swell as the '66-'78 Toronado.  If you can't come up with any locally,
let me know.  I'll mail you a set at cost.

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 19:26:37 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: UNBOUNCE: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems

> Just out of curiosity, what's so special about tire stems for a 1970 Toro?

- -----------------

'66-'78 Toronado ,'67-'78 Eldorado and the GMC motorhomes with the Toronado
powertrain used unique valve stems due to the design of the heavy duty FWD
wheels.

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 21:50:20 -0500
From: "Allen Schwartz" <mycj@tds.net>
Subject: Head bolt torque?

Here is my long explanation leading to a short question. I got my 455
running a few weeks ago. I had water in the oil but was not burning it. I
took the heads off(edelbrocks) and had them milled to make sure they were
flat plus get the compression where I really wanted it. They were also
pressure tested to make sure they were not leaking. They are fine. I put
them back on tonight and now I am burning antifreeze out of the passenger
side exhaust. ALso I had the intak eangles checked to ensure they were
correct for the heads, they are fine. I used the mr gasket ultra seal intake
gaskets with sealer around the water ports.
  The only thing I can think of is that mabey I didn't torque the head bolts
(ARP) enough. I could swear the shop told me 80 pounds but I thought it
shuold be more. Anyone know what the torque should be on my setup with the
aluminum heads?

Allen Schwartz
A&L Enterprises
mycj@tds.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 23:40:37 -0400
From: Jack Kopf <jkopf@optonline.net>
Subject: RE: Head bolt torque?

The olds head torque is something around 80-85 if I remember. ARP states 65
with their bolt kit. Did you check the block deck to see if it is flat? When
you took the heads off after draining the cooling system did you observe
where the coolant was coming from? Over torqueing can also cause problems.
See any coolant in any of the intake runners?



- -----Original Message-----
From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
[mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Allen Schwartz
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 10:50 PM
To: olds list
Subject: Head bolt torque?


Here is my long explanation leading to a short question. I got my 455
running a few weeks ago. I had water in the oil but was not burning it. I
took the heads off(edelbrocks) and had them milled to make sure they were
flat plus get the compression where I really wanted it. They were also
pressure tested to make sure they were not leaking. They are fine. I put
them back on tonight and now I am burning antifreeze out of the passenger
side exhaust. ALso I had the intak eangles checked to ensure they were
correct for the heads, they are fine. I used the mr gasket ultra seal intake
gaskets with sealer around the water ports.
  The only thing I can think of is that mabey I didn't torque the head bolts
(ARP) enough. I could swear the shop told me 80 pounds but I thought it
shuold be more. Anyone know what the torque should be on my setup with the
aluminum heads?

Allen Schwartz
A&L Enterprises
mycj@tds.net

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 22:54:32 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Milton J. Schick

Steve,

It's spam. It's a new trick spammers have come up with to acquire E-mail
addresses to verify that they are active and to abuse. I wouldn't be
surprised if the spam hackers haven't penetrated the Olds List at Chebucto.
Whatever you do, don't respond to it. You'll just confirm that your address
is active. You wouldn't believe some of the scams and ruses that have come
into my inbox.

I think I'd better warn the List.

Milton
_________


- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Harrison" <k0xp@dandy.net>
To: <imp@theriver.com>
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: Milton J. Schick


> Milton, I received this e-mail today. Have no idea who the lady is,
perhaps
> an old friend of yours but maybe just someone who has an Olds question.
> Thought you'd prefer to reply to her yourself. I haven't sent her your
> e-mail in case she's someone you'd prefer not to have it. I won't bother
to
> reply to her, you can do it if you want.
>
> SteveH
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >X-Originating-IP: [205.236.147.59]
> >X-Originating-Email: [ihavis21@hotmail.com]
> >X-Sender: ihavis21@hotmail.com
> >From: "Isidore Havis" <ihavis21@hotmail.com>
> >To: k0xp@dandy.net
> >Subject: Milton J. Schick
> >Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 19:53:02 -0400
> >X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 May 2004 23:53:02.0527 (UTC)
> FILETIME=[C0C52CF0:01C43F8E]
> >X-pstn-levels:     (S:99.90000/99.90000 R:95.9108 P:95.9108 M:100.0000
> C:62.3188 )
> >X-pstn-settings: 5 (2.0000:8.0000) r p m C
> >X-pstn-addresses: from <ihavis21@hotmail.com> [1240/59]
> >
> >May I please have a contact email to Milton Schick? Or any other Olds
> >enthusiasts? Thank you
> >
> >Isidore
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>From: postmaster@mail.hotmail.com
> >>To: ihavis21@hotmail.com
> >>Subject: Delivery Status Notification (Failure)
> >>Date: Thu, 20 May 2004 17:56:01 -0700
> >>
> >>This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.
> >>
> >>Delivery to the following recipients failed.
> >>
> >>        NOSPAMk0xp@dandy.net
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >><< attach3 >>
> >><< message4.txt >>
> >
> >_________________________________________________________________
> >Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSn Premium. Get
2months
> >FREE*
>
>http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-ca&page=byoa/prem&xAPID=1994&DI=1034&SU=ht
> tp://hotmail.com/enca&HL=Market_MSNIS_Taglines
> >
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 23:35:13 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Head bolt torque?

Allen,

I just went to the Edelbrock website to check on the torque spec for the
**aluminum** heads, which may be different from stock. It wasn't very much
different. Use 85 foot-pounds of torque. Also, make sure you are using the
correct torque sequence/pattern for torquing both the head bolts and the
intake bolts, as per the Olds shop manual.


> I had water in the oil but was not burning it. I
> took the heads off(edelbrocks) and had them milled to make sure they were
> flat plus get the compression where I really wanted it.


Remember, when material is removed from the head surface next to the block
to true the heads or raise the compression, the threaded holes in the heads
for the intake bolts are moved closer to the block, which causes
misalignment of the intake bolts when they are installed. Did you buy the
heads new or used? If used, were they ever milled before? Exactly how much
total material did you have removed from the heads? For every 0.010" cut
from the heads, 0.010" should be removed from each side of the intake
manifold and 0.014125" should be removed from the front and rear lip of the
intake manifold.


> They were also
> pressure tested to make sure they were not leaking. They are fine. I put
> them back on tonight and now I am burning antifreeze out of the passenger
> side exhaust.


Right off hand, I can only think of 2 ways to get antifreeze in the exhaust
that are engine related. Either the head gasket has a major leak and the
engine is sucking coolant out of the head gasket into the engine, or there
is a crack in a head or cylinder wall that's letting the engine suck coolant
in.

There is one other way. Do you have a vacuum controlled heater control valve
sitting on the back on the right head? If the diaphragm breaks, the engine
will suck engine coolant right into the intake manifold and into the engine.
Burning antifreeze will cause the rings to stick and gum up the cylinders.


> ALso I had the intak eangles checked to ensure they were
> correct for the heads, they are fine.


There's no logical way for the 135 degree angle of the intake manifold
interface to the block and head to change. What you have to worry about,
like I've already said, is if too much material was removed from the heads
and the intake bolts are misaligned, which will cause the intake gasket to
not seal properly, maybe even leak like a seive.

> I used the mr gasket ultra seal intake
> gaskets with sealer around the water ports.
>   The only thing I can think of is that mabey I didn't torque the head
bolts
> (ARP) enough. I could swear the shop told me 80 pounds but I thought it
> shuold be more. Anyone know what the torque should be on my setup with the
> aluminum heads?


The next question is what head gaskets are you using? If you are using steel
shim or copper, they will not seal between aluminum heads and a cast iron
block. The only head gaskets that will seal are Victor Victor-Seal Red and
Fel-Pro Perma-Torque.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 08:39:21 -0400
From: "Dave Cullen" <david.cullen@snet.net>
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile DELTA88 ROYAL 1984

> I have seen and talked to the owner of a very nice Delta 88- 1982 - she
> looked just like the Caprice, had the 307 and left me with regret that she
> was on sale :-((
> Was there a change of a model between 82 and 84?
> TIA
> Matt

82-85 Delta's were pretty much the same. The Caprice had different body
lines, grille and rear panel. I wanted to do a 2-tone paint scheme on my 85
Delta like some Caprice's came with, but the body lines aren't appropriate
for it.

drc

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 08:02:13 -0500
From: "Allen Schwartz" <mycj@tds.net>
Subject: Re: Head bolt torque?

the block was fully machined and the deck was milled flat, it didn't take
much.

When I disassembled the first time I only found antifreeze in the lifter
valey but some of that may have been from pullin gthe intake. My father
installed the intake whill I did the tranny and after talking to him he says
he might of tightened one side of the intake then the other instade of
sequencing them. This is all from the first time though.

Last night I pulled the plugs and dont see any that are real wet, one was a
little wet but not much and it didn't smell like antifreeze. I put the
pressure tester on it and will go out this morning to see if there is
antifreeze in any cylenders
Allen Schwartz
A&L Enterprises
mycj@tds.net
- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jack Kopf" <jkopf@optonline.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 10:40 PM
Subject: RE: Head bolt torque?


> The olds head torque is something around 80-85 if I remember. ARP states
65
> with their bolt kit. Did you check the block deck to see if it is flat?
When
> you took the heads off after draining the cooling system did you observe
> where the coolant was coming from? Over torqueing can also cause problems.
> See any coolant in any of the intake runners?
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
> [mailto:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca]On Behalf Of Allen Schwartz
> Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 10:50 PM
> To: olds list
> Subject: Head bolt torque?
>
>
> Here is my long explanation leading to a short question. I got my 455
> running a few weeks ago. I had water in the oil but was not burning it. I
> took the heads off(edelbrocks) and had them milled to make sure they were
> flat plus get the compression where I really wanted it. They were also
> pressure tested to make sure they were not leaking. They are fine. I put
> them back on tonight and now I am burning antifreeze out of the passenger
> side exhaust. ALso I had the intak eangles checked to ensure they were
> correct for the heads, they are fine. I used the mr gasket ultra seal
intake
> gaskets with sealer around the water ports.
>   The only thing I can think of is that mabey I didn't torque the head
bolts
> (ARP) enough. I could swear the shop told me 80 pounds but I thought it
> shuold be more. Anyone know what the torque should be on my setup with the
> aluminum heads?
>
> Allen Schwartz
> A&L Enterprises
> mycj@tds.net
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 08:11:41 -0500
From: "Allen Schwartz" <mycj@tds.net>
Subject: Re: Head bolt torque?

> Remember, when material is removed from the head surface next to the block
> to true the heads or raise the compression, the threaded holes in the
heads
> for the intake bolts are moved closer to the block, which causes
> misalignment of the intake bolts when they are installed. Did you buy the
> heads new or used? If used, were they ever milled before? Exactly how much
> total material did you have removed from the heads? For every 0.010" cut
> from the heads, 0.010" should be removed from each side of the intake
> manifold and 0.014125" should be removed from the front and rear lip of
the
> intake manifold.
>
> MIlton, I bought the heads new. Out of the box they were at 9.9
compresion. I wanted 10.5 so I could still run premium so there was not much
removed. I have the exact number somewhere but can't remember off had. The
heads were done at rocket racing performance and they told me there wasn't
enough taken off to need the intake cut.


> Right off hand, I can only think of 2 ways to get antifreeze in the
exhaust
> that are engine related. Either the head gasket has a major leak and the
> engine is sucking coolant out of the head gasket into the engine, or there
> is a crack in a head or cylinder wall that's letting the engine suck
coolant
> in.


I don't even want to consider this right now Milton,yes I may be in denial
but I like it here



> There is one other way. Do you have a vacuum controlled heater control
valve
> sitting on the back on the right head? If the diaphragm breaks, the engine
> will suck engine coolant right into the intake manifold and into the
engine.
> Burning antifreeze will cause the rings to stick and gum up the cylinders.
>
> no I don't


> There's no logical way for the 135 degree angle of the intake manifold
> interface to the block and head to change. What you have to worry about,
> like I've already said, is if too much material was removed from the heads
> and the intake bolts are misaligned, which will cause the intake gasket to
> not seal properly, maybe even leak like a seive.

I had heard stories of edelbrock torkers being shiped with the angle wrong
so I had it checked just in case


>

> The next question is what head gaskets are you using? If you are using
steel
> shim or copper, they will not seal between aluminum heads and a cast iron
> block. The only head gaskets that will seal are Victor Victor-Seal Red and
> Fel-Pro Perma-Torque.

First time around I used the reds, this time I used the fel pro 1155 that is
recomended for them. This gets expensive at 60 bucks per head gasket
>
> Milton Schick
> 1964 442 Cutlass
> imp@theriver.com
>
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 09:44:24 -0400
From: Jack Kopf <jkopf@optonline.net>
Subject: Bigger Brakes

I know that the Disk brakes from '66-'70 are a 
direct swap for drums of the same vintage on a 
98. I would like to go to larger rotors if 
possible. My understanding is that '84 and up 
used 12" rotors and better calipers. Does 
anyone know if the spindles are interchangeable 
from a '84 or up to a '66-'70 vintage large car?



Jack  

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 14:49:49 +0000
From: Steve Harrison <k0xp@dandy.net>
Subject: Re: Bigger Brakes

At 09:44 AM 5/22/2004 -0400, you wrote:
>Does anyone know if the spindles are interchangeable 
>from a '84 or up to a '66-'70 vintage large car?

Fred will know for sure but my intuition says that if your early car has
the steery box BEHIND the engine crossmember, then the steery knuckles on
the spindles will also be at the rear. All the later big-cars have the
steery knuckles at the front of the spindle.

That doesn't mean one might not be able to swap the rightside spindle onto
the left in order to get the knuckle at the rear, and vice versa: but I
dunno if that'll work, not having an early one here.

SteveH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 12:09:39 EDT
From: Roncutlass@aol.com
Subject: Anyone with a 70-72 w/Rally wheels

- -------------------------------1085242179
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I have Rally II wheels on my 70.  At one time, I want to mount the 2 clips 
that go on the back of the trunk to mount the prybar. 
1) Do you know any dimensions for where to drill the 2 holes to mount them and
2) Were they originally painted with the trunk spatter paint, or left silver, 
which I guess makes more sense. Thanks, Ron

- -------------------------------1085242179
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<HTML><HEAD>
<META charset=3DUS-ASCII http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; cha=
rset=3DUS-ASCII">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1400" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffff=
f">
<DIV>I have Rally II wheels on my 70.&nbsp; At one time, I&nbsp;want to moun=
t the&nbsp;2 clips that go on the back of the trunk to mount the prybar.&nbs=
p;</DIV>
<DIV>1) Do you know any dimensions for where to drill the 2 holes to mount t=
hem and</DIV>
<DIV>2) Were they originally painted with the trunk spatter paint, or left s=
ilver, which I guess makes more sense. Thanks, Ron</DIV></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1085242179--

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 11:57:28 -0400
From: Jack Kopf <jkopf@optonline.net>
Subject: RE: Bigger Brakes

'66-'70 do have the linkage in the rear. Think I'll take one and 
go to a salvage yard today and see what I see. The older spindles 
are interchangeable left and right depending on how you install them. 
Killer is that if I had 5X 4 3/4" bolt pattern any size up to 14" 
brakes are available. With the 5X5 pattern here is nothing other 
than the 11" that was offered at the time. 

There is a guy in Australia that has a upgrade using the brakes 
from the new 2004 GTO. Little costly but the real problem is that 
you have to modify so much more and remove the front sway-bar. 

4 Days after the '70 came back from paint my wife introduced it to the 
rear of an El Camino. Her explanation was that it didn't stop like our 
other cars. The '70 had all new brakes and she was correct it didn't 
stop as well as our other cars. Deceleration is valued more than 
acceleration. 

Jack


(clip)
Fred will know for sure but my intuition says that if your early car has
the steery box BEHIND the engine crossmember, then the steery knuckles on
the spindles will also be at the rear. All the later big-cars have the
steery knuckles at the front of the spindle.

That doesn't mean one might not be able to swap the rightside spindle onto
the left in order to get the knuckle at the rear, and vice versa: but I
dunno if that'll work, not having an early one here.

SteveH

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 10:00:14 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Head bolt torque?

Allen,


> When I disassembled the first time I only found antifreeze in the lifter
> valey but some of that may have been from pullin gthe intake. My father
> installed the intake whill I did the tranny and after talking to him he
says
> he might of tightened one side of the intake then the other instade of
> sequencing them. This is all from the first time though.


That would cause the intake to leak, particularly with aluminum.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 13:02:36 -0400
From: "Christopher Witt" <rocketscience442@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: block storage 101

Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 22:40:00 -0700
From: geo.aigel@sbcglobal.net
Subject: Re: block storage

In a dry place, packed up but not completely sealed. E.g. use plastic foil.
For rust prevention I would squirt the entire block with transmission
fluid. Trans fluid sticks very nicely (better than motor oil or WD40).
========================
NAL sells cans of Cosmolene, works great for warding off oxidation.
$3 a can or so. I just bought another 5 cans
I get a LOT of parts that can rust, and live in a swamp known as Michigan
NAL : 1-800-428-4300 M-F 8-5 or so Central or Eastern Time.

As for block storage, techniques vary.
I know a guy here who stores them outdoors, in the open, to "season" them. 
When I questioned this practice, I got dressed down by the World's Greatest 
Engine Builder [ask him, he'll tell ya] that The process is recommended by 
Smokey Yunick. [Don't reckon maybe Smokey lived in SoCal or AZ maybe, not 
MI???]

I prefer to spray down with cosmolene and then protect from all manner of 
moisture. In a sealed bag is great. Many of my items are not so fortunate. 
Many are just in the barn. Most, alas, are under tarps or portions of tarps, 
outdoors, on a pallet. NOT good, wish I had that engine storage building 
done. If it might be years, go ahead and GREASE the cylinders, so that it 
will never not be oiled. That 20k mile Toro 425 block is on a snomobile 
trailer [$15 Padnos scrap yard find], with the cover secured down with 
straps and lots of weight now. Not quite outdoors, not really indoors 
either.

Oh, don't forget to rotate the items every week or so, sit on a different 
side, to even out the "relaxing" effect of gravity on the parts- you know, 
like some folks worry whether that crank they wanna buy has been stored on 
its side, or on its end. ;-)

[ Reality check: If you think that gravity and storage orientation have an 
effect on a crankshaft, what do you suppose the forces applied by the RODS 
during operation will do to it??? This is cast iron, not play-doh or Silly 
putty.]

Probably the BEST way is to hang them upside down by all 6 motor mount 
holes, using bungee cords. Wave your voodoo stick about the block and the 
storage location, whilst chanting your best anti-oxidation spell. Then, 
spray with Rust-B-Gone [Cosmolene], sprinkle with the ash of burned 
Oldsmobile interior fabric components; allow the last bit of ash to scatter 
to the winds [fan makes for good "winds" if indoors].  Place a ball of 
aluminum foil in each cylinder, and in all the bearing journals; the foil 
will act as a sacrificial anode in the event that corrosion does begin to 
occur, and save the block from being pitted. Then, seal in plastic with 
7&1/2 layers, with extra 1/2 layer on the top side. Use only approved 
plastic. Tape over that with CLEAR duct tape, then USPS Priority Mail 
shipping tape. Add a nice red bow for a pleasing appearance. Maybe a note on 
the outside detailing the date the specimen was collected, the wherabouts of 
the Jimmy Hoffa, and the rectal temperature of the man in the moon that day. 
I usually skimp, and just specify the date of acquisition and the type of 
block/ part it is.
- -----------------------
Chris Witt
1303 W. Miller Rd.
Lansing MI 48911

RocketScience442@hotmail.com

Cell 517-449-0432 weekends or short weekday calls or leave message.
Home 517-882-9747 thru 10-11pm MI time most days

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeŽ 
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 10:08:05 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: Head bolt torque?

Allen,

> > MIlton, I bought the heads new. Out of the box they were at 9.9
> compresion. I wanted 10.5 so I could still run premium so there was not
much
> removed. I have the exact number somewhere but can't remember off had. The
> heads were done at rocket racing performance and they told me there wasn't
> enough taken off to need the intake cut.
>


Okay.


> > Right off hand, I can only think of 2 ways to get antifreeze in the
> exhaust
> > that are engine related. Either the head gasket has a major leak and the
> > engine is sucking coolant out of the head gasket into the engine, or
there
> > is a crack in a head or cylinder wall that's letting the engine suck
> coolant
> > in.
>
>
> I don't even want to consider this right now Milton,yes I may be in denial
> but I like it here


:-)


> I had heard stories of edelbrock torkers being shiped with the angle wrong
> so I had it checked just in case


That I hadn't heard before. That would be real bad quality control.


> First time around I used the reds, this time I used the fel pro 1155 that
is
> recomended for them. This gets expensive at 60 bucks per head gasket


Okay, everything sounds right. ???

If Edelbrock has had quality control problems on intakes, what if the heads
were a little short? What if the heads came with too much material milled
off the bottom, throwing the intake manifold bolts off? No one would
normally notice and only checking it would verify it.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 13:12:54 -0400
From: "Christopher Witt" <rocketscience442@hotmail.com>
Subject: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems

Date: Fri, 21 May 2004 13:39:18 +0000
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg_o@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: UNBOUNCE: '70 Toro Tire Valve Stems

>Subject: 1970 Toronado tire valve stems
>
>I have leaking tire valve stems and can't find replacements. Anyone have
>any ideas?

Just out of curiosity, what's so special about tire stems for a 1970 Toro?

- - -- Andy
================
I was gonna send him to NAL
then I recalled
Toro wheels used LONG, METAL stems with a 90 degree bend.
Nothing at all like the usual type
Maybe a Motorhome place still carries that type?
- -----------------------
Chris Witt
1303 W. Miller Rd.
Lansing MI 48911

RocketScience442@hotmail.com

Cell 517-449-0432 weekends or short weekday calls or leave message.
Home 517-882-9747 thru 10-11pm MI time most days

_________________________________________________________________
Get 200+ ad-free, high-fidelity stations and LIVE Major League Baseball 
Gameday Audio! http://radio.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200491ave/direct/01/

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 13:15:36 -0400
From: "Christopher Witt" <rocketscience442@hotmail.com>
Subject: 70 Toro valve stems at NAPA

Andy,
   That valve stem is a bolt in and sightly bent style used from 66 thru
78. I just got some from my local NAPA store. They are sold in sets of 5
and are about $8.00 each. None of the local tire shops had any.
LOL
John Kelsey
Dayton Ohio
==============
Good tip
How about a part number while we're at it?
- -----------------------
Chris Witt
1303 W. Miller Rd.
Lansing MI 48911

RocketScience442@hotmail.com

Cell 517-449-0432 weekends or short weekday calls or leave message.
Home 517-882-9747 thru 10-11pm MI time most days

_________________________________________________________________
Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win 
$1 million! http://local.msn.com/special/giveaway.asp

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 May 2004 14:28:56 -0400
From: John Kelsey <ribspot@pop4.net>
Subject: Re: 70 Toro valve stems at NAPA

Christopher Witt wrote:
> 
> Andy,
>   That valve stem is a bolt in and sightly bent style used from 66 thru
> 78. I just got some from my local NAPA store. They are sold in sets of 5
> and are about $8.00 each. None of the local tire shops had any.
> LOL
> John Kelsey
> Dayton Ohio
> ==============
> Good tip
> How about a part number while we're at it?
> -----------------------
> Chris Witt
> 1303 W. Miller Rd.
> Lansing MI 48911
> 
> RocketScience442@hotmail.com
> 
> Cell 517-449-0432 weekends or short weekday calls or leave message.
> Home 517-882-9747 thru 10-11pm MI time most days
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to 
> win $1 million! http://local.msn.com/special/giveaway.asp
> 
> 
> 
Hi All
    I don't have a NAPA number, thru the bill away. The valve is made by 
schrader/bridgeport their number is TR417 that should be all your parts 
store needs to know to get you these. Any problems and I will be glad to 
get them for anyone at cost. I do not know if they are available in 
other than sets of 5 But I can find out if needed.
John Kelsey
Dayton Ohio

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #4898
*********************************
