oldsmobile-digest-owner @ chebucto.ns.ca 
02/12/97 01:57 PM
To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #514


oldsmobile-digest       Wednesday, 12 February 1997    Volume 01 : Number 514

Re: The Meaning of 442
Re: Olds in latest Car Craft
Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts
Headers part III, The Return of the Headers
Re: wheels
Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel
Re:Re: Switch to discs
Re: 1968 442 / GM A body, spares & misc parts
Re: My Classic Car
Re: hope the Olds list can help
Re: 67 Delta rear quarter needed..
Re: Headers, the saga continues.
Re: Headers, the saga continues
Re: My Classic Car
DAVID NYE CONTACT ME!
Motor Physical Size
72 Vista Cruiser
Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel
Re: Air Cleaner
Re: My Classic Car
Re: Leaking Lena
Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel
Re: My Classic Car
Re[2]: Olds in latest Car Craft
Re: Air Cleaner
Re: Leaking Lena
Re[2]: Leaking Lena
Re: Motor Physical Size
Re: Air Cleaner
Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts
Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts
YIKES!!
Archive Availability
Re: Olds in latest Car Craft
'65 98 update (LONG)
Seat covers and wheel wells
RE: Archive Availability
Re: Motor Physical Size
Re: Motor Physical Size
Re: Leaking Lena
IRC Right Now!!!
Re: Header Woes
WANTED  455
Re: Leaking Lena Again

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Jon442@aol.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:24:15 -0400
Subject: Re: The Meaning of 442

My dad always told me that it meant if you had the 4-barrel open in 4th gear,
you were going 2 damn fast....

Jon

------------------------------

From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:24:35 -0400
Subject: Re: Olds in latest Car Craft

On Tue, 11 Feb 1997, Frank Gonzalez wrote:

> Jason Labay wrote:
> I saw same article and wondered about hp since the stock 4.3 in the
> Bravada already puts out 200hp,thats a lot of bucks for little
> return.IMHO
I agree 100%.  Maybe toss in a 455, and i'd be interested.  (or even a 350
(Olds)).  Bravada SS maybe?


> Also noticed in engines they put almost all GM(Chevy,Pontiac,Buick)but
> not Olds!!!
> Frank

Ah, yes, but believe it or not, they "ACTUALLY" mentioned Oldsmobile up in
the front section of the magazine.  Evidently, as they were saying, there
is sombebody on their staff who is an olds-person.  Of course whoever this
is is outweighed evidentally, by Marlin what'-his-name who is the one
interested in publishing stuff about Ch*vy's and "ONLY" Ch*vy's.

Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
Clayton (notice how easily words like "Oldsmobile" and "Cutlass" and "88"
roll off of the tongue, much easier than words like "Ch*vy" or "F*rd"
which have all the characteristics of obscenities) Pierce,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu

------------------------------

From: tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 21:35:40 -0400
Subject: Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts

>Is there any one out there that has a set of the big block frame mounts for
>sale? I need a pair for a 442 I'm restoring.
>


What year 442?  69 and up are different than 68 and older.  All Cutlasses
use the same frame mounts regardless if it is a 350 or a 455.  The Delta 88
& 98 frame pads are the same as Cutlasses from '71 to '76.

I have a pair off of a '70.  It is the type that mounts to the frame with 3
bolts each.

Tony

70 442 W-30
70 Toro GT W-34
65 Jetstar 88 w/4-spd
85 Cutlass Salon 455 Drag Racer
92 Seville STS

70 Rayson Craft flat bottom 455 Olds V-drive
79 Sidewinder 455 Olds Jet
86 Wellcreaft Nova 454 Chev

------------------------------

From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:38:52 -0400
Subject: Headers part III, The Return of the Headers

Hello all,

I'm soon going to be putting headers on my '84 Cutlass (350 4bbl. TH400).
Is there anything that I should know or plan for?   The headers I'm using
are fairly good quality ones (don't remember the brand though), that I got
off of a former parts car --they had only been used for less than a month
before the tranny quit in the car!  I only paid $200 for the car, and it
included the headers, and the 350 rocket motor, as well as spare body
parts.  Anyway, as I was saying, is there anything that I should watch out
for in installing these?  They were bent where they were supposed to be
when they were installed into the parts car, so I am expecting an easy
installation.  My motor, however, is mounted in the Cutlass at the right
angle, whereas the parts car's was forward slightly, and therefore, tipped
at a slightly wrong angle.  Will this cause any problems?  Finally, I am
hoping to get the money together for Flowmaster mufflers, if I can't
afford them, I'm just gonna' install glasspax although I've found that on
long trips they can drive a person "batty" while the Flowmasters are a bit
better because the noise is concentrated to the rear of the car.  Does
anybody have any reasons why I shouldn't use F-mstr's or glasspax?  Oh,
and btw, I live in Tenn. in an area where there are no emmissions regs.
so the catylitic conv. (which was removed long ago when the dual exhaust
was added) will not be any problem :-)  I've just heard so many horror
stories about installing headers on an Olds motor, I wanted opinions and
instruction.

Thanks,
Clayton Pierce,
Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu
'84 Cutlass Supreme (350 4bbl. Th400 69k miles)

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:37:59 -0400
Subject: Re: wheels

Craig J. Smith wrote:
>
> I am considering replacing the simulated wire wheel covers on my 68 442
> with Superstock I wheels.  A local yard quoted me $200 for a set with
> all the chrome.  Is this a reasonable price?  Are my simulated wire
> wheel covers (orginal equipment) worth anything?

Do you have disc or drum brakes?  If you never plan to ever upgrade
to disc brakes then go with SSI, else SSII.  If the rims aren't bent
and the chrome is in good condition then $200 seems fine.

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:40:21 -0400
Subject: Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel

Greg Beaulieu wrote:
>
> Does anyone know if the sport steering wheel used in the '68 Cutlass was
> the same (except for the center cap) as the one used in the '68 Corvette?
> They look pretty similar and apparently the Corvette ones can be had for a
> price. I have had zero luck finding a Cutlass sport wheel.

My steering wheel that I currently have, even though it is not a
sport one, has three posts all at 90 degrees from each other.  Their
is some rubber parts affixed to these posts with two having cut
outs for the silver horn accuators.  Is this a standard steering
wheel?

Chris Sparsk
68 442

------------------------------

From: r_mullen@Merck.Com (R Mullen)
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:17:00 -0400
Subject: Re:Re: Switch to discs

>My Cutlass can stop almost as well
>as my Eclipse now (which has four wheel discs).

>I do want to convert the front to discs someday, but right now, I'm happy
>with the performance of the drums.
>Dave Paulison

Dave,
Maybe it will stop as well for the first run.  My former '69 Cutlass (4W
Drums) would stop well for the first 100 mph- zero run.  But if I
immediately reaccelerated to100 and tried it again, I would run out of
brakes by the time I got down to 60 mph.  The cooling of the drums is
inferior, which leads to the fade problem.  If a person's driving style
is not excessive, then drums work fine.

Your advice about rebuilding using good parts is excellent.  I used NAPA
semi-metallic drum brake shoes on the back of my 442 up until this
month, when my rear disc conversion began.  They held up well,
outlasting 2 sets of drums that were used on them and were ruined by
heat checking/cracking.  The shoes come with a lifetime warranty from
NAPA.

Scott Mullen
'70 442 (Stops faster than it accelerates)

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:56:55 -0400
Subject: Re: 1968 442 / GM A body, spares & misc parts

jeff antonucci wrote:
>
> Where do you live?
>
> Jeff.

I live in LA County (Near Santa Fe Springs/Downey/Pico Rivera/Norwalk
area).  I work at McDonnell Douglas in Long Beach.  My work phone,
since this is where I am usually at most of the day, is (562) 593-9265.
I have Voice Mail if you want to leave messages.

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 04:56:59 -0400
Subject: Re: My Classic Car

James Thingwold wrote:
>
> Lloyd - I loved my '70 AMX, it was, of all the musclecars I've owned &
> driven, the most fun (390-4speed) and despite being held together in places
> with unknown materials, it was the most reliable too.    If I'd have known
> they were voting I'd have joined you in your impartiality.
>
> P.S. My buddy who has had just about every muscle car (+ Porsches, etc.)
> still says his '70 W-30 was the smoothest, tightest car he ever had.
>
> Lisa Madsen


Lisa,

Actually, I love each of my cars for different reasons.  I have to agree
w/you on the construction of an AMX.  My 390 4-speed is very fast &
stable feeling.  Everything mechanical has just the right sound from the
engine tight feeling rumble & instant responsiveness, to the just right
feel of the Super T-10 w/the Hurst shifter next to your right leg for
snappy easy shifts, right on down to the stiff short chassis that begs
to be twisted & slid through any curves.  What a drive!

Then there are the doors which rattle, the windows whistle air, the
upholstery (even leather) feeling like it was quite cured before being
pulled out of the mold, & all the plastic pieces all finished by the guy
just hired an hour ago.

Then there is my 442.  It is big & strong everywhere.  Everything is
absolutely in command.  Whatever you want is just another 1/4" farther
down on the gas pedal.  The car is put together so well w/luxury touches
everywhere.  It is just like your personal rocket cocoon.  It isn't a
sports car, but what car is going to keep up w/it so that it can be
taken in the curves?

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:00:04 -0400
Subject: Re: hope the Olds list can help

WMACHINES@aol.com wrote:

> set, please email me. Also, I have a friend looking for  the 3 spoke 69 442
> ralley wheel.

I am curious.  What does this one look like?

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 05:01:30 -0400
Subject: Re: 67 Delta rear quarter needed..

A67delta88@aol.com wrote:
>
> Hi, just wondering.. are the rear quarters from a 68 delta/delmont 88 the
> same as a 67's? I know where I can get a 68 rear quarter, but will this fit
> my 67? thanks.
>
> A67Delta88 Custom 4dr hdtp.

I wouldn't be completely sure about interchangeability.  I do know that
the side marker lights were mandated first in 1968, & so you will have
to contend w/that hole in the quarter.  I also know that 98s are
different from 88s.

Now you know everyting that I know.  Congratulations!

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:56:24 -0400
Subject: Re: Headers, the saga continues.

>Dumb Question Dept.:  Does 'aluminization' increase the lifespan of the
>                      exhaust?  Is this kind of tube stock special order?
>                      Or do most muffler shops carry it?

My '72 LeMans went to Car-X for new full duals. They said they'd have to
custom-bend the left-side tailpipe since it was out of stock, but this
was a Good Thing, they said, because the straight stock used for custom
bending was aluminized and better quality than the pre-bent stuff. They
were right; after a couple of years had gone by the aluminized still
looked new and the pre-bent on the other side was rotting out.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:44:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Headers, the saga continues

Tim,
Around here aluminized exhaust is becoming the norm on quality custom
systems.  As far as I know, it is a coating that is applied when the
tubing is made.  I know a few folks who have this on their cars and it
seems to last much longer than standard exhaust tubing.  The guy at the
shop keeps this on hand for most of his work.  He also keeps some of the
regular tubing around for those $89.95 systems.  I was charged $160.00
for my system including the mufflers from the headers to the back
bumper.  Not a lot more than what it would be with the cheap tubing.  If
I ever return the car to a totally stock form I will consider stainless.
It is just too expensive for me to use on this car which I do NOT baby.
My old system was on the car since 1984 and this new one should last
longer.

You are right, a bad day in the Olds is better than a good day at work!

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:10:45 -0400
Subject: Re: My Classic Car

>Actually, I love each of my cars for different reasons.  I have to agree
>w/you on the construction of an AMX.
[...]
>Then there are the doors which rattle, the windows whistle air, the
>upholstery (even leather) feeling like it was quite cured before being
>pulled out of the mold, & all the plastic pieces all finished by the guy
>just hired an hour ago.
>
>Then there is my 442.
[...]
>The car is put together so well w/luxury touches everywhere.

Okay, do you have T-tops in the 442? Is the inner trim piece around the
release handle made of plastic? Have you ever removed it and looked at
the back side of it? On my '82, the mold maker kept track of which mold
was right-hand side and which was left by carefully carving huge "RH"
and "LH" abbreviations on the backs of the panels. This plan worked
almost perfectly, the only flaw being that by the time he decided to
carve these notes to himself, he'd already mixed them up.

So what you find is a huge "LH" hastily scribbled out with a grinder and
"RH" scrawled next to it, and of course the opposite on the other piece.
I like finding human touches like that on these old machines.  :-)

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Chris Urban <urbanch@magi.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:25:30 -0400
Subject: DAVID NYE CONTACT ME!

Hey David:

	I lost your email address again so reply to this email directly to me.

Chris Urban

------------------------------

From: jmskms@ix.netcom.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:17:38 -0400
Subject: Motor Physical Size

Here's a question that may be an oddball.  Is there a distinction between
Olds Big Block and olds Small Block?

Now, mind you, I do have limited mechanic experience:  The only powerplants
that I've had hand in rebuilding are a 396 from a 61 Vette (I did maybe 10%
of the work on that one), an inline six from a 1941 GMC truck (maybe 40%),
and a 350 from a 1972 GMC Pickup (75%).

I have never had the 330 out of my 67 Cutlass Supreme, but while I suppose
that it would be a small block, it looks much larger than the chevy 350.
Is that an illusion of it being packed into the engine bay?

One of my best friends from high school (the late Brad Risner, rest his
soul) drove a 1968 442.  People, this car ROCKED! But you all already know
that.  The thing is, When we parked our cars side by side, opened the
hoods, the engines did not look that much different.  Someone, and it may
have been Brad, once told me that Oldsmobile just made one block size and
simply bored them out differently.  i.e an olds 330 block is the same as an
olds 455 block.  Is this true?  If not, what are the physical differences
between a Big Block Olds and a Small Block Olds, and what displacements
belong to each category (for example, I assume a 350 would be a small
block, and a 455 would be a big block).

Finally, if you're really in a curiosity satisfying mood, can you tell me
the physical differences between the various General Motors 350 engines?

Thanks, and I await with baited breath for an answer (or two).

Jonathan

e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms


Hey, this IS my fathers Oldsmobile...Ya got a problem with that sis??

------------------------------

From: IRA_H_SIEGELMAN@vnyao.dcmdw.dla.mil (IRA H SIEGELMAN)
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 10:27:56 -0400
Subject: 72 Vista Cruiser

     Would any body in the Southern California area like to buy (cheap,
     cheap) an engineless 72 Vista Cruiser? Many good parts. Come and get
     it! (805) 263-9034

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 05:39:01 -0400
Subject: Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel

Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada) wrote:
>
>
> My steering wheel that I currently have, even though it is not a
> sport one, has three posts all at 90 degrees from each other.  Their
> is some rubber parts affixed to these posts with two having cut
> outs for the silver horn accuators.  Is this a standard steering
> wheel?
>
> Chris Sparsk
> 68 442

Chris,

That sounds like it.  The sport one is 3-spoke (brushed stainless) over
the lower 180 degrees w/a center cap for horn & rocket emblem.  The rim
is imitation wood.  It looks very beautiful.

Many people like the 4-spoke one first used in 1970.  It has an "X"
pattern to the brushed stainless spokes, the same rocket emblem center
cap for the horn, & a thick vinyl rim.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: PaulP34167@aol.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:45:26 -0400
Subject: Re: Air Cleaner

In a message dated 97-02-11 17:43:31 EST, you write:

<< 	I was wondering if anybody knows were to get a Dual Snorkel
 Air Cleaner Assembly for a 1984 Hurst/Olds.  Were would I have to order
 this from?

 Brian Steinbach
  >>

I know this doesn't sound logical, but you might try an Olds dealer.  I doubt
any aftermarket dealer would have this, but I could be wrong.

Paul Pate
70 Cutlass S

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 05:48:33 -0400
Subject: Re: My Classic Car

Andrew C. Green wrote:

> Okay, do you have T-tops in the 442?

	<snip>

> So what you find is a huge "LH" hastily scribbled out with a grinder and
> "RH" scrawled next to it, and of course the opposite on the other piece.
> I like finding human touches like that on these old machines.  :-)
>
> Andrew C. Green

Andy,

My 68 442 is a convertible.  I sometimes feel that the canvas is on
inside out though.  That Olds fellow must have been an ex AMC
professional employee.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:05:18 -0400
Subject: Re: Leaking Lena

Hi all,

Here is a break down:

Had to have two rubber pieces replaced on the gas line.  The pieces
that bend to go up into the engine compartment.

I have noticed some seepage on my gas tank.  My mechanic said that
I can either have the tank relined/fixed or apply soap to wet area.
He says soap seals up any small holes that may be in the tank.  Any
one tried this?

I also was told that I had oil and tranny leaks.  Argh!!!! One leak
is coming from the speedo cable (we all knew about this one).  Another
leak is coming from the tranny at some valve.  My mechanic said he
could do the former, but the later one only if it spring loaded.  I
don't know what valve he is talking about.

For the oil leak, the valve covers are leaking.

My mechanic said to me that no matter what I do, this car will continue
to leak.  I am a firm believer that if I get all the leaks fixed
properly, I shouldn't have any spurious leaks.  Any feedback?

Another question:

Does anyone know of a tach that would fit into my dash that isn't
a tic-toc-tach?  I really don't care about having a clock since my
new radio has one.

Later...

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:12:26 -0400
Subject: Re: 68 Sport Steering Wheel

Sounds quite a bit like the 80's Calais steering wheels (I've got one in
my C. Supreme) except that instead of fake wood trim, they had padding.
Still had a "rocket horn" in the center though.

Clayton Pierce,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu

On Wed, 12 Feb 1997, Lloyd Culp wrote:

> Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada) wrote:
> >
> >
> > My steering wheel that I currently have, even though it is not a
> > sport one, has three posts all at 90 degrees from each other.  Their
> > is some rubber parts affixed to these posts with two having cut
> > outs for the silver horn accuators.  Is this a standard steering
> > wheel?
> >
> > Chris Sparsk
> > 68 442
>
> Chris,
>
> That sounds like it.  The sport one is 3-spoke (brushed stainless) over
> the lower 180 degrees w/a center cap for horn & rocket emblem.  The rim
> is imitation wood.  It looks very beautiful.
>
> Many people like the 4-spoke one first used in 1970.  It has an "X"
> pattern to the brushed stainless spokes, the same rocket emblem center
> cap for the horn, & a thick vinyl rim.
>
> Bill Culp
> Decatur, Alabama
>
>

------------------------------

From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:15:59 -0400
Subject: Re: My Classic Car

On my '72 Mercury, when I removed what was left of the vinyl top, there
was factory markings and a big number underneath it.  In the '81 Cutlass
Calais parts car I had, I found 2 build sheets behind the back seat (still
together).  One of the technicians had obviously been drinking coffee at
the time of the car's assembly :-)

Clayton Pierce,
Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldmsobilling,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu


On Wed, 12 Feb 1997, Lloyd Culp wrote:

> Andrew C. Green wrote:
>
> > Okay, do you have T-tops in the 442?
>
> 	<snip>
>
> > So what you find is a huge "LH" hastily scribbled out with a grinder and
> > "RH" scrawled next to it, and of course the opposite on the other piece.
> > I like finding human touches like that on these old machines.  :-)
> >
> > Andrew C. Green
>
> Andy,
>
> My 68 442 is a convertible.  I sometimes feel that the canvas is on
> inside out though.  That Olds fellow must have been an ex AMC
> professional employee.
>
> Bill Culp
> Decatur, Alabama
>
>

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:09:54 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Olds in latest Car Craft

Ah, but don't despair, an Olds made it in the pile of scrap in the
interchange article! Can't wait for the subscription to run out next year.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
    FAQ 3.0 maybe available Friday (2/14) !!!

- ------------
> On page 16 of the the newest issue is a picture and story of the proposed
> Bravada Pilot, which has more than 20 modifications by SLP (SLP is the same
> company making the Z28 SS and the Trans Am WS6). The engine is a 4.3L vortec
> with an Eaton supercharger. Good for 230hp. It is lowered 2" and has 17"
> wheels. Nice truck, but why the 4.3 Vortec? It would nice to see the LT1
> move into there with a supercharger.
> They did a top 10 list of pre 80 muscle cars...no Olds
> Also did a top 10 engine list......no Olds engine but the LT1 made it :)
> They also list the Tick-Tock-Tach as a wacky factory option
> There are a couple of tech-talk Q&A's in the back on Olds engines
> - - - - - - - - - - -
> Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com) f-list since: 5/95
> 93 Camaro Z/28......patriot red, A4, G92, PEG2, GSC,  currently bone stock
>       planned spring mods: !Cat, !TB, 160stat, SLP cat back, GM Cold Air Kit
> 80 Olds 4-4-2  W-30...white/gold...........3rd place '97 Cleveland Auto Rama

I saw same article and wondered about hp since the stock 4.3 in the
Bravada already puts out 200hp,thats a lot of bucks for little
return.IMHO
Also noticed in engines they put almost all GM(Chevy,Pontiac,Buick)but
not Olds!!!
Frank

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 04:29:41 -0400
Subject: Re: Air Cleaner

     As of last year they were still available new from GM, but I haven't
     checked recently.  Hold on a sec. . .  part number is 25042690
     according to the H/O brochure.  Why not trot down to the dealer and
     ask?  We'd be interested to know what you find out!

     If they don't have it, try Originality Plus.  I think their number is
     on 442.com, if not I can get it for you.  Consider them a last resort
     though, as they usually charge an arm and a leg.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Air Cleaner Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    2/11/97 3:07 PM


 I was wondering if anybody knows were to get a Dual Snorkel
Air Cleaner Assembly for a 1984 Hurst/Olds.  Were would I have to order
this from?

Brian Steinbach










































































































































































------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:17:33 -0400
Subject: Re: Leaking Lena

>For the oil leak, the valve covers are leaking.
>
>My mechanic said to me that no matter what I do, this car will continue
>to leak.  I am a firm believer that if I get all the leaks fixed
>properly, I shouldn't have any spurious leaks.  Any feedback?

Do the rocker (heh-heh :-) covers; that'll stop a lot of sewage from
covering the engine. Even if they're not the only leak points, they're
definitely great as being one source that can coat the entire engine in
goo. Fix 'em up (my preference is new cork gaskets with a light coating
of K&W Copper Coat; others like Form-a-Seal type stuff), clean the
engine and see if there's anything else leaking. Maybe there won't be.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 04:44:26 -0400
Subject: Re[2]: Leaking Lena

     I tend to agree with you, provided that you identify and fix the
     underlying cause of the leak.  It may be as simple as a bad gasket or
     seal, or it may be a warped/bent valve cover or cracked tranny case.
     Use the best gaskets you can find (I like the rubber valve cover
     gaskets that NAPA sells for $20/pair, they work much better than the
     cork ones at $10/pair and are easier to install too since you don't
     use any sealant) and check the valve covers, heads, etc. out good for
     any clues as to why it's leaking.  Spend lots of time on the gasket
     area surface preparation, it should be clean enough to eat off of and
     smooth too, and use the correct torque on the bolts.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Re: Leaking Lena Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    2/12/97 8:22 AM

My mechanic said to me that no matter what I do, this car will continue
to leak.  I am a firm believer that if I get all the leaks fixed
properly, I shouldn't have any spurious leaks.  Any feedback?

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 12:54:17 -0400
Subject: Re: Motor Physical Size

At 10:17 AM 2/12/97 -0500, you wrote:
>Here's a question that may be an oddball.  Is there a distinction between
>Olds Big Block and olds Small Block?

Nah, they're completely identical; we just call them different things to
confuse the "outsiders"...

[wise-a** mode off]

>I have never had the 330 out of my 67 Cutlass Supreme, but while I suppose
>that it would be a small block, it looks much larger than the chevy 350.
>Is that an illusion of it being packed into the engine bay?

No, the Olds is physically bigger.

>soul) drove a 1968 442.  People, this car ROCKED! But you all already know

Of course...

>that.  The thing is, When we parked our cars side by side, opened the
>hoods, the engines did not look that much different.  Someone, and it may
>have been Brad, once told me that Oldsmobile just made one block size and
>simply bored them out differently.  i.e an olds 330 block is the same as an
>olds 455 block.  Is this true?  If not, what are the physical differences
>between a Big Block Olds and a Small Block Olds, and what displacements
>belong to each category (for example, I assume a 350 would be a small
>block, and a 455 would be a big block).

Pontiac is the company that used the same block for all its motors, from the
326 through the 455. The 301 is a lower-deck version of the same block. I
believe that the very early blocks were also of the same design, but I don't
know how they differed, deck-height wise.

Actually, all modern Olds OHV V-8's use the same basic design, but with two
different deck heights. Aside from some difference in fastener and bearing
sizes, everything else is of the same design, and largely interchangeable.
The FAQ will tell you all the minor differences. Just quickly, however, the
lower-deck block (known as the small-block, all with the 3.39" stroke crank)
was used for the 260 (gas and diesel), 307, 330, 350 (gas and diesel) and
403. The higher-deck, big-block Olds was used for both 400's, the 425 and
the 455.

Visually, however, the only difference is that the big-block is two inches
wider, and slightly taller. (yes, I'm ignoring casting marks for now)

>Finally, if you're really in a curiosity satisfying mood, can you tell me
>the physical differences between the various General Motors 350 engines?

Everything is different, except the carb and distributor cap.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:02:17 -0400
Subject: Re: Air Cleaner

The part no. 25042690 is no longer available, and has not been replaced.
According to the dealer, you can try (703) 335-1935 --I have no idea who
this is!  I would like one of these myself for my '84 (not a Hurst) with a
350 rocket swap, might give me a bit more power, and if figure, hey, a
quadrajet's a quadrajet, so it should fit just fine!

Clayton Pierce,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu

On Wed, 12 Feb 1997, Tom Lentz wrote:

>
>      As of last year they were still available new from GM, but I haven't
>      checked recently.  Hold on a sec. . .  part number is 25042690
>      according to the H/O brochure.  Why not trot down to the dealer and
>      ask?  We'd be interested to know what you find out!
>
>      If they don't have it, try Originality Plus.  I think their number is
>      on 442.com, if not I can get it for you.  Consider them a last resort
>      though, as they usually charge an arm and a leg.
>
>      Tom Lentz
>      tlentz@teknon.com
>
> ______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ > Subject: Air Cleaner > Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET > Date:    2/11/97 3:07 PM > > >  I
was wondering if anybody knows were to get a Dual Snorkel > Air Cleaner
Assembly for a 1984 Hurst/Olds.  Were would I have to order > this from? >
 > Brian Steinbach > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > > > > > > > > >
 > > >

------------------------------

From: Pajak_John%PAX1@mr.nawcad.navy.mil
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:40:00 -0400
Subject: Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts

Someone wrote:

"What year 442?  69 and up are different than 68 and older.  All Cutlasses
use the same frame mounts regardless if it is a 350 or a 455.  The Delta 88
& 98 frame pads are the same as Cutlasses from '71 to '76.

I have a pair off of a '70.  It is the type that mounts to the frame with 3
bolts each."



**************************************************************************
>WAIT !!!!!!!!!! All Cutlasses do not use the same frame mounts !!! 70-72
455 frame >pads as well as the rubber motor mounts are different from the
350 pieces !!!!!!


John Pajak     "DR. OLDS"
Lexington Park, MD
Pajak_John%PAX1@MR.NAWCAD.NAVY.MIL

65 Delta 88
66 Toronado
69 Cutlass S
70 Cutlass S W31
70 442 W30 convert
72 442 W30 convert
72 Delta 88 convert
+ others

------------------------------

From: Terrance Bradley <DocOlds@Magmacom.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:05:27 -0400
Subject: Re: 70-72 Big Block Frame Mounts

At 09:35 PM 2/12/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>Is there any one out there that has a set of the big block frame mounts for
>>sale? I need a pair for a 442 I'm restoring.
>>
>
>
>What year 442?  69 and up are different than 68 and older.  All Cutlasses
>use the same frame mounts regardless if it is a 350 or a 455.  The Delta 88
>& 98 frame pads are the same as Cutlasses from '71 to '76.
>
>I have a pair off of a '70.  It is the type that mounts to the frame with 3
>bolts each.
>
> Better look again at those brackets as their are two types for the cutlass.
  The 350 part number is 404752 and fits 69 to 72 cutlass.
  The 455 part number is 402953 and fits 69 to 72 400-455 cutlass.
  A giveaway to the difference is that 2 different motor mounts are used so
  their has to be 2 frame mounting brackets were used. the 455 can be
installed
  where a 350 came from but only if the 350 mounts are used and the 455 will
set
  about an inche lower usually causing interferance with the fan shroud.



  Docolds@Magmacom.com
>
The Doctor Lives

------------------------------

From: tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Date: Thu, 13 Feb 1997 00:32:25 -0400
Subject: YIKES!!

>Someone wrote:
>
>"What year 442?  69 and up are different than 68 and older.  All Cutlasses
>use the same frame mounts regardless if it is a 350 or a 455.  The Delta 88
>& 98 frame pads are the same as Cutlasses from '71 to '76.
>
>I have a pair off of a '70.  It is the type that mounts to the frame with 3
>bolts each."
>
>
>
>**************************************************************************
>>WAIT !!!!!!!!!! All Cutlasses do not use the same frame mounts !!! 70-72
>455 frame >pads as well as the rubber motor mounts are different from the
>350 pieces !!!!!!
>
>
>John Pajak     "DR. OLDS"

I guess I was wrong!!  Thanks for the correction guys!   I am not a
"numbers cruncher" when it comes to these things.  All I do know is that I
have done 10 or 11 350 to 455 swaps in 70 to '75 cutlasses.  All of the 350
mounts on both frame and block fit the 455 perfectly.  I had no trouble
with fan shrouds or anything else lining up.  I do know that the 455 mount
is a heavier duty piece compared to the 350,  but when you go to a local
parts store for a new mount they give you the same mount no matter what
engine you have.  I guess I have a little too much "junkyard dog" in me!!!

Tony

70 442 W-30
70 Toro GT W-34
65 Jetstar 88 w/4-spd
85 Cutlass Salon 455 Drag Racer (With 307 mounts!!)
92 Seville STS

------------------------------

From: Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:49:23 -0400
Subject: Archive Availability

Thanks to Drew Senko, we have now made available, for a limited
time, the entire set of Mailing List Digests.  For those of you
that may have missed some, this is your second chance.

http://www.calcon.net/~easton   original site
http://members.aol.com/drewinva/olds alternate site

Grab 'em while you can. :-)

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970 442  4-Speed
see the archives at http://www.calcon.net/~easton

------------------------------

From: "C.R.F." <wizkid@inlink.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 14:13:42 -0400
Subject: Re: Olds in latest Car Craft

>interested in publishing stuff about Ch*vy's and "ONLY" Ch*vy's.
>
>Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
>Clayton (notice how easily words like "Oldsmobile" and "Cutlass" and "88"
>roll off of the tongue, much easier than words like "Ch*vy" or "F*rd"
>which have all the characteristics of obscenities) Pierce,
>zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu
>
>

I don't know that they both have all the characteristics of an obscenity.
After all, C*evrolet, or even Ch*vy, is not a four letter word.  Nuff said.

The Wiz

------------------------------

From: lacey@dsea.com (Dan Lacey)
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:33:55 -0400
Subject: '65 98 update (LONG)

(LONG)

I finally got the rear suspension upgraded! This took 2 Sunday afternoons.
If I had to do it again, I could do it in one afternoon. Half of my time
was spent finding the proper way to use the jack, jack stands, and various
tools needed for the job.

I chose the rear over the front suspension to upgrade first because of the
simplicity of the job, lower cost of parts, and lower weight of rearend
(this car weighs I believe more than 2 tons).

This round included new springs, air bags, shocks, lower control arms,
lower control arm bushings. I installed the lower control arms and shocks
on one day, then the springs and air-bags on the next Sunday.

To save time, I swapped lower control arms so that I could have the
bushings replaced and still drive the car. The lower control arms are from
a '64 Chevelle Malibu. They are "almost" exactly the same. The 2
differences are that the 98 has anti-sway bar mounting points pre-drilled.
The Chevelle did not. The 98 has a mounting bracket for the emergency brake
cables; the Chevelle does not. I still have to remove the brackets from the
old arms and drill some holes in the new arms for these (they bolt on.
Maybe a quick weld would work too.)

FEP replaced the lower control arms on his Chevelle with some trick stuff,
and had the old arms just "laying around". Close inspection showed that
they are basically the same part. FEP had sway bar mounting points drilled
and then "enhanced" them. First, the sway bar mounting points were
reinforced using steel tubing welded to the inside of the control arm so a
bolt could pass thru. Next, a plate of 3/16" steel was welded down the
length of the arm to "box" them. I ordered the Energy Suspension
poly-graphite bushing set and had them installed at a local shop. The rear
set of bushings runs $100 from Performance Suspension Technologies (Energy
does not sell direct), but the local shop gave me the same price.
Installation cost about $50-$60. I am not sure since I was buying alot of
stuff and we dicker (friendly) about price alot...

The springs were found at Pep Boys (they are starting to amaze me!) for
$115 for the rear set. They are made by TRW. The air bags are Air Lift 1000
made by...(D#@$, I forgot the manufacturer and the literature is at
home...). I purchased these thru Summit Racing for about $65. I should have
purchased new rubber perchs (sp?) for where the springs rest, but these can
be installed rather easily now that I know what I am doing. I chose the
combination of OEM springs and air-bags over progressively wound or heavy
duty springs. Changing to a different kind of spring would either change
the ride height or the travel, or both. With my combo., I can have the
original handling, or adjust for hard driving and large payload easily.

Special tools needed:
- - Breaker bar or a Large rachet wrench.
- - Pry bar of some kind, about 3 foot long, with a good flattened point.
- - Jack stands that will get the car at least 15" off the ground at the
frame. - - a GOOD creeper will save you ALOT of time!!!

Tricks and Traps...

First of all, when FEP tells you to do something, you should probably do
it!!!! Case in point... When installing the lower control arms, put the
jack (your car is on jack-stands, right?) under the center of the
differential as far forward as you can. If you put it under the shock, the
differential will move about 1 to 2 inches to the rear!(VERY scarry when
you pull that bolt out!!!) At this point, I just went inside to calm down
and plan my next move... This is one place where you need the pry bar. The
point should fit in one of the frame holes behind the tire. Insert and push
the tire/axle forward. By raising and lowering the jack slightly (about 1
inch), the axle will now move forward and backword slightly. This is how I
lined up the control arm with the rear mounting point.

I could only get my car up about 15-15 1/2 inches off the ground. I would
consider this a minimum height to get the old springs out without a spring
compressor. This is a 30 year old car, and I doubt that the springs have
ever been replaced. I pryed the springs out with the above mentioned pry
bar. Putting in the new springs is pretty easy at this point. The new
springs, unsprung, are about 4 inches shorter than the old worn out
springs. This is for two reasons. Someone told me that as a spring wears
out, it will lenghten (sounds reasonable). Spring manufactures claim that
OEM springs maintain the ride height of the vehicle with better materials
so the springs can be shorter but perform the same. The air-bags have to be
inserted between the coils since the top and bottom of the spring spiral to
a very small diameter. When you get them in, they will fit VERY loosely.
You will probably be able to fit your finger between the bag and the
spring. They will also appear to be a couple inches short. At this point
you might as well attach the air hose to the bag. It would be harder with
the bag on the car. With the air-bags inside the new springs, I
"bench-pressed" them up and onto the perchs. This was actually pretty easy
(I am 6', 145 lbs :-------).

You need a heat shield on the exhaust system next to the passenger side
spring so you don't melt the air bag. These are supplied with the air bag.
They are just sheet metal and hose clamps.

Test run the air hoses for the bags before you install. On most cars you
can just cut the supplied hose into 2 pieces and worry about it later. On
my car, the axle is about 5 feet from the rear of the car. I JUST had
enough hose to connect it all together underneath the license plate. If I
had figured out a path before hand, I would have cut them different lengths
and been done with it, but now I have to go back and fix it up...

Bottom Line:

I have been driving it since Sunday to work and back. The front suspension
has not been done, so it is hard to determine what the end result of all
this will be... I almost eliminated a nasty pull to the left while braking.
It is almost unnoticable now. Apparently, the slight pull was causing the
rear end to steer the car (probably the worn bushings). I don't scrape
while pulling into driveways anymore!  The springs raised the ride height
 1 and 1/4". This was measured at the rear axle from the ground to the
bottom of the wheel well skirt. I was at about 17 1/4" before and am now at
18 1/2" before you pump up the bags. The air bags will give you MORE than
enough lift if you want. I am currently running about 10 lbs of air in both
sides. When I get the front-end done, I plan to fill the bags
assymetrically to avoid roll on launch.

Even without the front-end work, the car is much safer to drive! Stopping,
accelerating and over-all handling are greatly improved.

Future Stuff:

After I upgrade the brake system, front suspension, and add BEEFY tires, I
will come back to the rear-end. I would like to replace the rear upper
control arm bushings (they came with the set), and add a rear anti-sway
bar.

Thanks for Listening...


*************************************************************************
* THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY  *       Dan Lacey ( lacey@dsea.com )        *
*                           *       Dainippon Screen Eng. of America    *
* LEFT BLANK                *       3700 W. Segerstrom Ave.             *
*                           *       Santa Ana, CA. 92704                *
*************************************************************************

------------------------------

From: "Christine Rooney" <Christine.Rooney@bender.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 14:33:06 -0400
Subject: Seat covers and wheel wells

        Does no one have anything to add?  No advise or nothing?

______________________________ Forward Header
__________________________________ Subject: Seat covers and wheel wells
Author:  Christine Rooney at AO-PO1 Date:    2/6/97 9:28 AM


     Good morning all!

     I was wondering if anyone knows where to order kits to reupholster the
     seats from a 75 H/O?  Apparently, at a show in Hershey PA last summer
     there was someone selling kits for the "wet look" that fit either 74
     or 75's.  My husband is interested in finding out more information
     about this kit.

     Also - we need NOS chrome trim wheel wells.  Any thoughts?

     Regards,

     Christine

------------------------------

From: "Etzel Bobby" <Etzel.Bobby@mail.ndhm.gtegsc.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:32:22 -0400
Subject: RE: Archive Availability

"Thanks" go out to Jeff and Drew for makeing these digests availabile to the
list. A lot of the information in the digests could not be found in any book
or from many sources even using the power of the Internet. I feel lucky to
have this information in a format that I can search at any time to find how to
keep my 442 happy.

Thanks again

Bobby

70 442 (Escape Back to the.....Past)
______________________________________________________________________________
_ From: Oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca on Wed, Feb 12, 1997 12:58 PM Subject:
Archive Availability To: Oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

Thanks to Drew Senko, we have now made available, for a limited
time, the entire set of Mailing List Digests.  For those of you
that may have missed some, this is your second chance.

http://www.calcon.net/~easton   original site
http://members.aol.com/drewinva/olds alternate site

Grab 'em while you can. :-)

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970 442  4-Speed
see the archives at http://www.calcon.net/~easton


- ------------------ RFC822 Header Follows ------------------
Received: by mail.ndhm.gtegsc.com with SMTP;12 Feb 1997 12:58:00 -0400
Received: from chebucto.ns.ca by delphi.ndhm.gtegsc.com with SMTP;
          Wed, 12 Feb 1997 17:57:09 GMT
Received: by chebucto.ns.ca id <57192(1)>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:50:13 -0400
Received: from abtlabs.pprd.abbott.com ([192.103.72.2]) by chebucto.ns.ca with
SMTP id <57583(1)>; Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:48:39 -0400
Received: from APEMX1.CMIS.ABBOTT.COM (apemx1.abbott.com) by
abtlabs.pprd.abbott.com with SMTP id AA08994
  (5.67c/IDA-1.4.4 for <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>); Wed, 12 Feb 1997 11:46:03
- -0600
From:	Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com
X400-Originator: Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com
X400-Recipients: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=ABTLAB/ADMD=IBMX400/C=US/;0017000004138203000002]
X400-Content-Type: P2-1988 (22)
Message-Id: <0017000004138203000002*@MHS>
To:	<Oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Archive Availability
Date:	Wed, 12 Feb 1997 13:49:23 -0400
Sender: oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: Oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

------------------------------

From: "C.R.F." <wizkid@inlink.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 14:31:00 -0400
Subject: Re: Motor Physical Size

Many random <snips> below.

>
>Here's a question that may be an oddball.  Is there a distinction between
>Olds Big Block and olds Small Block?

Yes, it is basically deck is higher on the BB.

>Now, mind you, I do have limited mechanic experience:  The only powerplants
>that I've had hand in rebuilding are a 396 from a 61 Vette (I did maybe 10%
>of the work on that one), an inline six from a 1941 GMC truck (maybe 40%),
>and a 350 from a 1972 GMC Pickup (75%).

I don't think that a 396 was an option in a '61 Corvette.  As a matter of
fact, I don't remember it in them until '66 or so.

>I have never had the 330 out of my 67 Cutlass Supreme, but while I suppose
>that it would be a small block, it looks much larger than the chevy 350.
>Is that an illusion of it being packed into the engine bay?

The Olds is physically larger than the SM Ch*vy.

Someone, and it may
>have been Brad, once told me that Oldsmobile just made one block size and
>simply bored them out differently.

Not true.  There is a small block and a big block, they are different.
Also, the different displacements that have occured in this generation of
engines has run the gambit of displacements between 260 and 455.  There are
also some core and pattern differences between the different 'bores' in what
would otherwise by substantially the same basic block.  As an example in the
BB Olds, two areas of difference are lifter bore and lifter set angle, there
are others.


>Finally, if you're really in a curiosity satisfying mood, can you tell me
>the physical differences between the various General Motors 350 engines?

This one would take a book, right Kevin?  Anyway, if Kevin feels up to it,
he will surely fill in at least some of the blanks.

>Thanks, and I await with baited breath for an answer (or two).
>
>Jonathan
>
>e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
>www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms
>

An answer in part from,

The Wiz

>Hey, this IS my fathers Oldsmobile...Ya got a problem with that sis??
>
>
>

------------------------------

From: Travis Adams <cashmore@imt.net>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:33:17 -0400
Subject: Re: Motor Physical Size

jmskms@ix.netcom.com wrote:
>
> Here's a question that may be an oddball.  Is there a distinction between
> Olds Big Block and olds Small Block?
>
> Now, mind you, I do have limited mechanic experience:  The only powerplants
> that I've had hand in rebuilding are a 396 from a 61 Vette (I did maybe 10%
> of the work on that one), an inline six from a 1941 GMC truck (maybe 40%),
> and a 350 from a 1972 GMC Pickup (75%).
>
> I have never had the 330 out of my 67 Cutlass Supreme, but while I suppose
> that it would be a small block, it looks much larger than the chevy 350.
> Is that an illusion of it being packed into the engine bay?
>
> One of my best friends from high school (the late Brad Risner, rest his
> soul) drove a 1968 442.  People, this car ROCKED! But you all already know
> that.  The thing is, When we parked our cars side by side, opened the
> hoods, the engines did not look that much different.  Someone, and it may
> have been Brad, once told me that Oldsmobile just made one block size and
> simply bored them out differently.  i.e an olds 330 block is the same as an
> olds 455 block.  Is this true?  If not, what are the physical differences
> between a Big Block Olds and a Small Block Olds, and what displacements
> belong to each category (for example, I assume a 350 would be a small
> block, and a 455 would be a big block).
>
> Finally, if you're really in a curiosity satisfying mood, can you tell me
> the physical differences between the various General Motors 350 engines?
>
> Thanks, and I await with baited breath for an answer (or two).
>
> Jonathan
>
> e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
> www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms
>
> Hey, this IS my fathers Oldsmobile...Ya got a problem with that sis??
Big block measures 14 inches across at the manifold base, small block
measures 12 inches.  I think the Olds is a little bigger than the
Ch*vy.  Another easy identifier is the drivers side cylinder head will
have a # cast in it at the front on a small block where a big block will
have a letter cast there.

------------------------------

From: "C.R.F." <wizkid@inlink.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 14:46:14 -0400
Subject: Re: Leaking Lena

At 12:17 PM 2/12/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>For the oil leak, the valve covers are leaking.
>>
>>My mechanic said to me that no matter what I do, this car will continue
>>to leak.

If my mechanic had that attitude I would get another mechanic, as your
problems are obviousl beyound the scope of his ability.

>>I am a firm believer that if I get all the leaks fixed
>>properly, I shouldn't have any spurious leaks.  Any feedback?

Absolutely, fix the leaks, and you will not have any spurious leaks, or any
non-spruious leaks either.  (interesting adj. there)  Until a new one crops
up of course.

>Do the rocker (heh-heh :-) covers; that'll stop a lot of sewage from
>covering the engine. Even if they're not the only leak points, they're
>definitely great as being one source that can coat the entire engine in
>goo. Fix 'em up (my preference is new cork gaskets with a light coating
>of K&W Copper Coat; others like Form-a-Seal type stuff), clean the
>engine and see if there's anything else leaking. Maybe there won't be.

Rocker covers and oil pan gaskets (both engine and tranny) can get
everything wet with oil, which then breeds dirt, which then causes the
entire car to look supremely shabby.  In the case of rocker covers,
sometimes double cork gaskets are the answer, instead of single.  And coat
them with the gasket goo of your preference.

The tranny leaks are all easy to fix save for the front main seal and the
kick down cable (transmission must come out for it front seal, and oil pan
must come off for kd cable.)  GM Hyrda-matics either have a 'O' ring at most
possible leak points, or a little rubber bootiee.  With a gasket of course
on the oil pan.

Why don't they design the kd cable as an interior fitting that juts thru the
hole.  At assembly attach, this small fitting, to the end of the k-d cable,
and then attach the kd cable flange to the tranmission.  That would
certainly save a lot of hair pulling and cussing all those d*mb b*stards at
Hyrda-matic.

>Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
>Datalogics, Inc.
>101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
>Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282
>

The Wiz

------------------------------

From: jmskms@ix.netcom.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:00:02 -0400
Subject: IRC Right Now!!!

Hey, I've opened up a channel on chatnet called #oldsmobile

right now it's 1:00 pm Central time, and I'll probably have this channel
open until at least 4:00 central time.  Everyone who reads this should jump
in!

The particular server, if you don't have a chatnet server in your IRC
bookmarks is:

Louisville.KY.US.ChatNet.Org    and the port is 6667

Everyone, come on in!

P.S. My nick right now is Hogg (I'm a University of Arkansas alum).



Kim & Jonathan Smith
www.netcom.com/~jmskms
IRC: SwineTrek or Comissh

------------------------------

From: qwik@ticipa.Works.ti.com (Jack Wendel MSGID QWIK)
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:24:01 -0400
Subject: Re: Header Woes

I've always just used red Loctite.  You can also use the blue stuff.
Never had a problem.  If you read the spec sheet, the temperatures
experienced are really past the operating range of Loctite, so it loses
SOME of it's holding strength.  That's why I can get away with using the
red stuff (stud and bearing mount) yet still remove the bolts later.

On my latest build, I use those Stage 8 bolts.  Kinda pricey, but they
work well also.

Finally, I use silicone on my header and flange gaskets.  I was skeptical
when a neighbor told me about it, but I tried it just to see.  Again,
it's not SUPPOSED to work because of the temperatures, but it really
works great.  The type of silicone doesn't matter.  I just use whatever
color matches best! :-)

L8R,

Jack (NEVER had a header leak) Wendel

------------------------------

From: OLDS78442@aol.com
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:49:09 -0400
Subject: WANTED  455

 I was wonder ing if anybody out there is selling a  455, that runs. I prefer
the complete motor. I live in Ct so the closer the better. The motor is going
in a 78 cutlass with a 260 in it now. If i get a 455 the 260 will be for sale
, it has 120000 miles on it , but runs well so if anyone is interested let me
know. make a offer.
Also, what does it take to put the 455 in.

                                         thanks, Jason
                                   OLDS78442
78 cutlass

------------------------------

From: Pajak_John%PAX1@mr.nawcad.navy.mil
Date: Wed, 12 Feb 1997 15:42:00 -0400
Subject: Re: Leaking Lena Again

Andrew C. Green   wrote:
<<SNIP>>
Rocker covers and oil pan gaskets (both engine and tranny) can get
everything wet with oil, which then breeds dirt, which then causes the
entire car to look supremely shabby.  In the case of rocker covers,
sometimes double cork gaskets are the answer, instead of single.  And coat
them with the gasket goo of your preference.

>>DON'T use silicone sealer as it has a tendency to break loose and clog up
the oil return holes. If you want thick cork gaskets MR Gasket makes the
thickest ones I've seen. Cheap cork "Trak Auto" type versions are very thin.


The tranny leaks are all easy to fix save for the front main seal and the
kick down cable (transmission must come out for it front seal, and oil pan
must come off for kd cable.)  GM Hyrda-matics either have a 'O' ring at most
possible leak points, or a little rubber bootiee.  With a gasket of course
on the oil pan.

Why don't they design the kd cable as an interior fitting that juts thru the
hole.  At assembly attach, this small fitting, to the end of the k-d cable,
and then attach the kd cable flange to the tranmission.  That would
certainly save a lot of hair pulling and cussing all those d*mb b*stards at
Hyrda-matic.

>>As I recall, isn't Lena a 442 with TH400 ? Remember a TH400 has no
kickdown cable; it's electrically controlled. A TH350 does have a cable,
however; it IS possible to change the O-ring without removing the trans pan
!! There is a stiff wire that connects the internal linkage to the cable.
This wire will stick up through the hole in the trans case allowing the
cable to be removed and replaced with little diffuculty !!!!

John Pajak     "DR. OLDS"
Lexington Park, MD
Pajak_John%PAX1@MR.NAWCAD.NAVY.MIL

65 Delta 88
66 Toronado
69 Cutlass S
70 Cutlass S W31
70 442 W30 convert
72 442 W30 convert
72 Delta 88 convert
+ others

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #514
********************************
