oldsmobile-digest-owner @ chebucto.ns.ca 
02/07/97 02:56 PM
To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #505


oldsmobile-digest         Friday, 7 February 1997      Volume 01 : Number 505

Re: A Few Q's
Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead
Re: Kathy Mattea swaps a Rocket 455 into a  Ford Thunderturd
RE: Quad 4 W-41s
Re: A Few Q's
Re: Mid Engines
Re: Larger wheels,Larger tires
Blower Response
Re: Mid Engines
Re: 1991 Olds W-41
Re: 69 H/O Mirrors
Re: My Story...
Re: So Cal Olds
Mid Engines (was: "Ugly 442s (was 1991 Olds W-41))
Re: So Cal Olds Parts
Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead
Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead
Re: Cornball Humor (Non Olds)
Auto Tranny question
Re: Flames
Re: Street Machine Nats (was Mid engines)
Re: Street Machine Nats (was Mid engines)
Re: Auto Tranny question
Re: '87 442 VIN
Re: Flames
Spark plugs
Painted Pinstripes Clarification
Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead
Re: Auto Tranny question
Re: AvGas...again..
Re: Auto Tranny question
Axle mania
RE: Quad 4 W-41s
Re: Axle mania
Re: Auto Tranny question
Maryland Olds Club Mtg - 2/11/97
Re: Axle mania
Re: Auto Tranny question
Re: So Cal Olds
Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead
Re: Auto Tranny question
Re: Auto tranny question
Newsgroup???
list
Re: auto tranny  clarification
Re: 455 Rocket Video
Re: Newsgroup???
RE: Kathy Mattea swaps a Rocket 455 into a  Ford Thunderturd
Re: A Few Q's
Re: Axle mania
Re: Newsgroup???
Upcoming OCA Events
What does "S" stand for? (Auto Tranny question)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Timothy A. Churchill" <tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:16:16 -0400
Subject: Re: A Few Q's

mike fisher:

> Craig, I use "Simple Green" to do most of my automotive and used parts
> cleaning.  this stuff works great and is environmental friendly.  Also I
> use Valvoline 10w 40.


That's my cleanser of choice these days, too.  It's also good on wheels and
tires, I spray it on full strength about 20 mins before I wash the car.
Brake dust comes right off, and it does a nice job on the white
walls/lettering. The interior smells like wintergreen after it's done, too! :)



Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, a.k.a. 'Der KinderWagen'
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: Shang <Shang@dfwmm.net>
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 23:45:40 -0400
Subject: Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead

Jonathan M. Smith wrote:
>
> I own a 1967 Cutlass Supreme. Back last spring, my driver's side lower
> control arm snapped (talk about an interesting drive!).  I went to a
> junkyard in Cabool MO (anyone out there from Southern MO?) and got the
> control arm from a Buick Special.  Now, mind you, this was my first ever
> front end work.  When I got the lower A-arm ready to install, I approached
> things like my dad did.  I put the coil spring between the upper and lower
> control arms, put a floor jack under the lower ball joint and jacked the
> control arm up till the ball joint stud fit into the back of the wheel
> thingamajigie (those of you who've done it know what I'm talking about).
> But, of course, it didn't go nearly that smoothly for me.  In the first
> place I had trouble getting the spring posisioned correctly...there were
> times that instead of the car's weight causing the spring to compress, the
> spring would just lift the car...and wer'e talking about a 67 here...not
> any of those featherweight second generation cutlasses.
>
> I guess what I'm wanting to know here is this:  Is there another way?  This
> is the way that my dad did it when I was growing up, but geez...it was sure
> a pain in the gludious maximus, and boy did it seem...well...dangerous.
> there were times that the spring would pop and I could just see something
> giving and the spring go flying through my skull (too many Stephen King
> novels I guess).  Does anyone have a better way for the home mechanic?
> e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
> www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms

How about a spring compressor? If not, I always bolted to lower control
arm in place at the bushings first, then I crammed the spring in as
close as possible, the jacked the ball joint end up. By the time it go
to the spindle, the spring was in place.

Stephen Hoover
Dallas, Texas
'70 Cutlass "S"

------------------------------

From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:27:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Kathy Mattea swaps a Rocket 455 into a  Ford Thunderturd

R Mullen wrote:
>
> I checked out http://www.mattea.com/rocket.html for details on the
> much-talked about Kathy Mattea song.    This page shows what looks like
> stills from the video.  Displayed above (sacrilege) the 455 Rocket air
> cleaner decal is a picture of a Ford Thunderbird.  Using a Ford
> Thunderbird for a video about a 455 Rocket soured me on the whole thing.

I don't know what the car was in the video (I'm not up on the late 50's
or early 60's), but it _was_not_ a T-Bird.  My guess is the webmaster is
responsible.  Go to that page and look closely at the pictures toward
the bottom and you'll see this.  Of course the 455 wasn't available when
the car in the video was built.  They did show some shots of 455 badges
on the car which looked like the badges from a Buick GS.

Kurt
71 442

------------------------------

From: evans1@serv01.net-link.net
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:39:24 -0400
Subject: RE: Quad 4 W-41s

>Mike Evans,
>
>When I went home for lunch today, I dug out my copy of Motor Trend's road
>test of the W-41 Calais.  They said it ran a 14.7 1/4 mile.  The article
>states "that's faster than a 5-liter Z-28 Camaro".  In the back of the
>magazine, they list all the cars they have tested in the last year or so and
>the respective results.  The 1990 Mustang LX 5.0 went 14.9 in the quarter.  I
>imagine the people that do these tests are more skilled at driving than I am
>as well as most people on the street.  Plus, those published numbers
>represent the best they were able to get out of each car.  Of course, there
>are a million different variables that could alter these results on any given
>day.  I can only speak to my personal experience.  I driven a 5.0 and hopped
>right in to a W-41 and there is no contest.
>
>Cecil Smalley
>1991 Olds Calais Quad 442 W-41
>PidgLanger@aol.com
>NotDads442@aol.com
>
Cecil--

Magazine timeslips are notoriously erratic, but if we must use them, Mustang
5.0LX/5 speed cars have been timed as quick as 14.18, and someone here on
the list noted seeing a W-41 listed in print somewhere in the low 16's.  My
personal pure stock best was a 14.23/94 from one of the 5speed '89 5.0 LX's
that I owned, so it's a least a possible time that they printed.  Did you
have an automatic 5.0?  Those cars are, at best.....pigs. Awful,
performancewise.

Didn't mean to rag on your car.  Aside from pure acceleration/quarter mile
times, I'll grant you it does everything better than the 5.0.

But, enough Mustang chat...I ditched all of my Ford stuff when they ditched
me with the wimpy 4.6, the hideous new body, and the outrageous price tag
they put on a very mediocre car.  Seeya!
Mike Evans
Richland, MI
evans1@net-link.net

------------------------------

From: "Timothy A. Churchill" <tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:38:37 -0400
Subject: Re: A Few Q's

> I make it a rule to never use anything that is "Environmentally Fri=
endly".
>  WAKE UP!, this is the same bunch of panty-waists that want to crus=
h your
> "Clunker"  Ed   Escape442@aol.com  ( trashing the planet as fast as=
 I can! )

Yow, this guy's definitely a poster child for retro-active vasectomie=
s :)

I've read everything I can about these the clunker laws, as =CDm sure=
 all of us
into classic Oldsmobiles would; I've been especially concerned about =
the bill
put forward in NJ, as my stepfather there has a beautiful '52 Ch*vy P=
/U,
so naturally we were interested.  After talking to some state reps, w=
hat we
found  -- for NJ anyway -- was that cars only had to meet emission st=
andards
for their year of origin, not any 199* standards.

Plus, it's my understanding that the constitutionality -- Believe it =
or not,
Ed, there *is* still a Constitution in full force in the US, just ask=
 the
Supreme Court :) -- and this means both US and State constitutionalit=
y --
of some of the more Draconian bills being put forth in other states (=
CA?) are
being challenged, and are not expected to pass; at least not as writt=
en.

FWIW, here in Mass, any vehicle over 15 years old is exempt from emis=
sion
tests, and AFAIK there are no bills in the State House pushing for an=
ything
more restrictive.


Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, a.k.a. 'Der KinderWagen'
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:53:29 -0400
Subject: Re: Mid Engines

I saw that mid engined Olds in 1977 or 78 at the Street Machine
Nationals in Indy.  It was an interesting ride to say the least.  The
humback roof of that body gave him plenty of room for the engine with
the blower.  He did have a firewall with a window in it to keep his arms
out of the blower belt.  Other than having a rear engine the car looked
pretty much stock from a distance.  This was a time before the tubbed
out cars took over.  As I remember he claimed to have driven the car
down from Michigan, but I bet there might have been a trailer stashed
away somewhere.  The car was cammed pretty heavy and it idled with that
surging you get with cammed up blower engines.  It did not do well in
the gymkhana event.  He had the sports car there either before or after
the 4-4-2, but it was not a big hit like the 4-4-2.

Dave
(who used to be closely involved in hosting the Street Machine Nats.)
      Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 12:38:23 -0400
Subject: Re: Larger wheels,Larger tires

At 11:14 AM 2/6/97 -0500, you wrote:
>> rubbing the back for the tire or rim against the frame.  Lastly, I hope you
 >> don't plan on driving the car in the winter.  A tire that big will not
get >> decent traction behind a 4 cylinder.  I too wanted the wider tire on
the > >The original poster has an '87 Cutlass Supreme and this is the RWD G
body >right?  These didn't come with a 4 cyl.  Just the V6 or 307 V8.  And
even >if it did, what's that got to do with how much traction it gets in the
>snow?  Just because it's (presumably) lighter than the V6 or V8?

I had to look at this twice, but I think the meaning is "a tire that big
will not get decent traction behind a 4 cylinder (car, like a F*rd Fairmont,
never mind a 6- or 8-cylinder car like your Cutlass)."

I suspect he means that even a 4-cylinder car would overpower the little
traction that a wide-tire has, since it doesn't dig down into the snow but
rather rides on top of it. Using such a tire in the snow with an 8-cyl car
would result in a futile attempt at movement (you know, like the 5.0 guys in
the snow... ;)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: joshstrub@csgnyc1.attmail.com (joshstrub)
Date: Thu, 6 Feb 1997 10:16:58 -0400
Subject: Blower Response

Blower Drive Service (BDS) has a setup for Oldsmobiles.  There is also an
other well known guy that builds blowers that quoted me a price for the 671
blower polished to show quality with two worked Holley 750 Double Pumpers on
top for $2,500.  I will look up his name and number.

Try BDS
BDS
12140 E. Washington Blvd.
Whittier, CA 90606
310.693.4302
310.698.7214
(Fax) 310.696.7091

Josh

1965 Jetstar 88 Convertible

------------------------------

From: evans1@serv01.net-link.net
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:18:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Mid Engines

>I saw that mid engined Olds in 1977 or 78 at the Street Machine
>Nationals in Indy.  It was an interesting ride to say the least.  The
>humback roof of that body gave him plenty of room for the engine with
>the blower.  He did have a firewall with a window in it to keep his arms
>out of the blower belt.  Other than having a rear engine the car looked
>pretty much stock from a distance.  This was a time before the tubbed
>out cars took over.  As I remember he claimed to have driven the car
>down from Michigan, but I bet there might have been a trailer stashed
>away somewhere.  The car was cammed pretty heavy and it idled with that
>surging you get with cammed up blower engines.  It did not do well in
>the gymkhana event.  He had the sports car there either before or after
>the 4-4-2, but it was not a big hit like the 4-4-2.
>
>Dave
>(who used to be closely involved in hosting the Street Machine Nats.)
>      Wyatt
>70  4-4-2
>

Dave--

I attended a few of the Street Nats in the 80's (Springfield, Fairmont City,
DuQuoin), but it seemed to be heading away from street cars and getting a
heavy of dose of ProStreet highbuck/nonstreetable stuff, so I haven't been
for awhile.  Are they worth the trip now?
Mike Evans
Richland, MI
evans1@net-link.net

------------------------------

From: "Mike Coccagna" <mikec@oz.kis.net>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 05:29:00 -0400
Subject: Re: 1991 Olds W-41

On  6 Feb 97 at 14:55, Pajak_John%PAX1@mr.nawcad.nav wrote:

> HOLD ON !!!!!!  That 14.7 time was from a prototype. I read another
> road test of an actual production W-41 and it was a LOT slower,
> something like low 16s. I'll see if I can dig up the article.

With a few mods (a little roudier W-41 cams, freeer exhaust (incl.
Manifold), and a bigger throtthe body- about $800), a plain-jane Quad4 Calais
will easily turn high 13s, so a W-41 bone stock without the freeer
flow manifold and throttle body turning 14.7 is very real.  A W-40
Quad442 formerly on the list turned a 15.2 @90.19 without mods, and
the type of driver you may see on the street.

Olds shows in one of their catalogs a '93 Achieva SCX with headers,
limited slip diff, and racing cams, that ran a 13.85/100 1/4 mile.

The H.O. Quads and Mike:  '91 442, '93 SCX

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:35:07 -0400
Subject: Re: 69 H/O Mirrors

Mike,
Both of you are correct about 69 mirrors. If the look a likes were all I could
 get, I'd probably use them. If you're the only one in town with a 69 H/O,
who would know the difference? In '69, Hurst hooked up with Rambler, to
produce a low production car called "SC/Rambler". (Commonly called the
"Rambler Scrambler") The mirrors on that car were identical to the ones Hurst
put on the 69 H/O.

Art Fuller

------------------------------

From: Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:34:41 -0400
Subject: Re: My Story...

From: "Mike Coccagna" <mikec@oz.kis.net>

>> >After much discussion with Olds on-line recently, my next car to
>> >find will be a 1991 I-Series Calais Sedan(4-door) with a 5-speed.
>> >According the the sheet Olds sent me there were 58 made!
>>
>> Wow.  Never even heard of one of these.  I asssume that would be the
>> Getrag trans.  I thought this came on the 3.4L cars, but didnt the
>> 3.4L come out in '92?

>The 3.4L went into the Cutlass Supreme.  The H.O. Quads only had the
>Getrag from the factory.  And I believe you're right the 3.4 came out
>in either late '91 or '92.

Yup.  Your right.  I saw the I-series part and confused it with the
Cutlass Supreme International.

Although it would be interesting to see if a 3.4L could be stuffed
into a Calais or Achevia.  :-)

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.con

1970  442  4-Speed
see the archives at http://www.calcon.net/~easton

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:51:45 -0400
Subject: Re: So Cal Olds

Dan, your in my neck of the woods (I'm in Anaheim).  Do you belong to the
So Cal Olds Club?  Just curious.....if not  you should!


Lisa Madsen

Heavy Metal Forever - '67 Delta 88 & '72 Vista Cruiser

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com

My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/

------------------------------

From: "Thomas Stoner" <tgstoner@mailgw2.pmr.med.umich.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:48:28 -0400
Subject: Mid Engines (was: "Ugly 442s (was 1991 Olds W-41))

>  ...Does anyone else remember the one with the supercharged 403
>  mounted mid-engine, where the back seat should have been?...
>
>     Wasn't that car built by Bill Porterfield, former Olds engineer?
>     His other claim to fame was the development of the mid-engined,
>     Toro 455 powered Kelmark kit car.  In fact, I think he had a
>     company called Mid Engineering (how original) which sold plans
>     and chassis which would replace a VW floor pan and accept a Toro
>     drive package for building mid-engined VW-based kit cars.

Joe,

As I recall, the mid engined 442 WAS built by Bill Porterfield.  I
don't recall that he had any connection with Kelmark Engineering, but
he probably did.  I did visit Kelmark once, to look at their mid-
engined kit car.  I believe that it used a tube chassis with the
whole Toronado drive train and front suspension mounted in the rear.
I don't recall any VW heritage to the car at all, but perhaps it did
use the front suspension from a Beetle.  I might still have their
sales information in my files.  I'll have to see if I can find that,
this weekend.

Does anyone know what has become of this 442?  I've seen it offered
for sale at least once in Hemmings, but that was several years ago.
While were on the subject of these "skunk works" type engineering
marvels, does anyone know what's become of the mid-engined 4-wheel
drive Toronado race car which was built for Pikes Peak?  Either of
these would be a real ride.

          ---
 ------- | | | - Tom Stoner -----------------------
|        | | |   OCA #3943                         |
|        |/|\|   Ann Arbor, MI                     |
|        | | |   1979 Hurst/Olds (It's for sale!)  |
|         ---    tgstoner@umich.edu                |
 --------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:51:43 -0400
Subject: Re: So Cal Olds Parts

I have a set of heads of a 455 (haven't checked the code) and an Edelbrock
intake for that same 455 - but as for parts sources that aren t exorbitant
in So Cal - I don't think there's such a creature!  Originality Plus is
higher then my Canadian contact for parts so far.  If your poss. interested
in the heads, let me know, they were redone & have approx. 42 miles on them
before they were yanked back off cause there were other problems with the
motor.


Lisa Madsen

Heavy Metal Forever - '67 Delta 88 & '72 Vista Cruiser

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com

My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:40:06 -0400
Subject: Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead

>I guess what I'm wanting to know here is this:  Is there another way?  This
>is the way that my dad did it when I was growing up, but geez...it was sure
>a pain in the gludious maximus, and boy did it seem...well...dangerous.
>there were times that the spring would pop and I could just see something
>giving and the spring go flying through my skull (too many Stephen King
>novels I guess).  Does anyone have a better way for the home mechanic?

Yup: a spring compressor. There are some things on a car that will
cheerfully kill you, and getting in the way of a spring that suddenly
lets go is one way to make that happen. You can rent a compressor; you
don't have to buy it outright. (And without getting too preachy: it
sounds like you did not have a manual handy, which would have had not
only all sorts of screaming warnings about using a spring compressor
but also additional pointers on things like how the spring is supposed
to be oriented within the control arm, where the end of the last coil
is positioned, etc.)

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: "Jonathan M. Smith" <jmskms@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:49:54 -0400
Subject: Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead

I guess I forgot to mention that I used a pair of hook/bolt compressors
that the parts store called "strut compressors".  The only thing is once I
got the spring compressed I couldn't fit the spring compressor into the
indention in the upper control arm.  I guess I should invent a spring
compressor that will fit up or down through one of the shock absorber
holes...hmmm...maybe it's an idea....

Anyway, I guess you just have to work it.  Thanks for the responses.

Jonathan.





e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms


Hey, this IS my fathers Oldsmobile...Ya got a problem with that sis??

------------------------------

From: "Thomas Stoner" <tgstoner@mailgw2.pmr.med.umich.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:05:38 -0400
Subject: Re: Cornball Humor (Non Olds)

Ed - Escape442@aol.com said:

>> Tom, If you enjoy those two clowns, then more power to ya! I don't
>> think those guys could find their ass with both hands.

To which, Timothy A. Churchill - tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com said:

>This from a guy who personally chastised me for making less than
>complimentary comments about DeLorean... sheesh!  What a hypocrite!

Tim,

Don't be too quick to blame Ed for his harsh words.  I've noticed
that all the AOL people have been more than a little testy lately,
for some reason.  Maybe if they find a new Internet access provider,
their disposition and outlook on life will improve . . .

          ---
 ------- | | | - Tom Stoner -----------------------
|        | | |   OCA #3943                         |
|        |/|\|   Ann Arbor, MI                     |
|        | | |   1979 Hurst/Olds (It's for sale!)  |
|         ---    tgstoner@umich.edu                |
 --------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:10:05 -0400
Subject: Auto Tranny question

Hi all,

I know we discussed "n"-speed trannys before, however, I got confused
last night looking over a book on GM muscle cars.  When I flipped to
the page on 68 442's it indicated that a 2 speed column shifter was
an available option.  Now please correct me if I am wrong but doesn't
2 speed mean Drive and Low.  I looked at my gear indicator on the dash
and it have Park-R-N-D-S-L.  Is this not a 3-speed???  Please clear
my cloudy mind!!

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 04:57:21 -0400
Subject: Re: Flames

Timothy A. Churchill wrote:
>
> I said:
>
> > > Adams was a brewer!  No, wait, that was his brother, Samuel... :)
>
> Bama Bill corrected me:  -- Sorry, forgot my history.  I remember now!
>
> > Cousin.
>
> Bill, ain't everyone in 'Bama everyone else's cousin?  Wives included?
 :)

There are a couple of cousins here.  We do our best not to dilute the
blood line any more than necessary.
>
> > PS. We haven't lost.  Isn't this half time?
>
> Game over, Man!!

My grandmother told me that you would cheat somehow, but I told her,
"Naw, you can trust our Northern cousins."  Was I ever wrong.  Wait till
she finds out.
>
> But you got the consolation prize; I mean, don't they build Bimmers
> and/or Mercedes in Bama?  :) :)

We got that Mercedes plant just as a revenue source.  All of them are
sold 'you know where'.
>
> Tim ("Lived in Bama for 3 Years and Lived to Tell About it") Churchill
> -------------

I have a brother at Harvard.  We have to send him care packages of brain
food as he seems to be losing cranial mass rapidly since moving there
last fall.  No one understands what is happening.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:10:25 -0400
Subject: Re: Street Machine Nats (was Mid engines)

Mike,
I was directly involved with the SM nats for the first 4 years.  At that
time I said I'd never go back.  A friend and former fellow club member
is one of the Special Events people.  He called me and talked me into
attending the 1988 SM Nats in DuQuoin. I thought it would be interesting
to go back after all these years.  I did, it was, and I'm done!  What
had started as a 600 entrant event in 1977 had grown to a 5000 entrant
event by 1980.  Luckily they had limited attendance to 5000 after that.
It was the same old story of too many people and cars in too small of an
area.  By 88 if you did not have a pro built tubbed car you would not
win anything.  There were some outstanding cars that were passed over
for the non-driven trailer queens.  One of the winningest trailer queens
(Matt and Debbie Hays...gag and barf)could not hardly run well enough to
get on and off the trailer, let alone be driven.  The semi-original
musclecars, like most of us on the list have, were looked down upon by
most in attendance.  I would guess that 50% of the people there were not
there for the cars, but to party only.  I was driving my lo-dollar
Fairlane.  Lo dollar, but neat and tidy with a lot of attention to
detail and wild looking paint.  I had folks taking pictures of it, a
first for me.  But my wife overheard some a**hole coment that these
lo-buck cars should not be allowed in the event.  If I had heard him I
would have probably spent a night or two in jail after I offered him a
chance to invest in my next project.  I felt that the whole event was
nothing more than a money maker for Special Events and no longer a get
together for fellow enthusiasts.

On the plus side, some other club members went to the South Bend SM Nats
the next year and enjoyed it.  Less people (under 2000), their ISCA
winning Challenger won a trophy (a non tubbed car no less), and just a
better atmosphere overall.

Personally I will stick to antique type shows and musclecar shows with
drag racing and stay away from the tubbed trailer queen crowd.  That is
why the OCA appeals to me.

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: evans1@serv01.net-link.net
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:40:54 -0400
Subject: Re: Street Machine Nats (was Mid engines)

>Mike,
>I was directly involved with the SM nats for the first 4 years.  At that
>time I said I'd never go back.  A friend and former fellow club member
>is one of the Special Events people.  He called me and talked me into
>attending the 1988 SM Nats in DuQuoin. I thought it would be interesting
>to go back after all these years.  I did, it was, and I'm done!  What
>had started as a 600 entrant event in 1977 had grown to a 5000 entrant
>event by 1980.  Luckily they had limited attendance to 5000 after that.
>It was the same old story of too many people and cars in too small of an
>area.  By 88 if you did not have a pro built tubbed car you would not
>win anything.  There were some outstanding cars that were passed over
>for the non-driven trailer queens.  One of the winningest trailer queens
>(Matt and Debbie Hays...gag and barf)could not hardly run well enough to
>get on and off the trailer, let alone be driven.  The semi-original
>musclecars, like most of us on the list have, were looked down upon by
>most in attendance.  I would guess that 50% of the people there were not
>there for the cars, but to party only.  I was driving my lo-dollar
>Fairlane.  Lo dollar, but neat and tidy with a lot of attention to
>detail and wild looking paint.  I had folks taking pictures of it, a
>first for me.  But my wife overheard some a**hole coment that these
>lo-buck cars should not be allowed in the event.  If I had heard him I
>would have probably spent a night or two in jail after I offered him a
>chance to invest in my next project.  I felt that the whole event was
>nothing more than a money maker for Special Events and no longer a get
>together for fellow enthusiasts.
>
>On the plus side, some other club members went to the South Bend SM Nats
>the next year and enjoyed it.  Less people (under 2000), their ISCA
>winning Challenger won a trophy (a non tubbed car no less), and just a
>better atmosphere overall.
>
>Personally I will stick to antique type shows and musclecar shows with
>drag racing and stay away from the tubbed trailer queen crowd.  That is
>why the OCA appeals to me.
>
>Dave Wyatt
>70  4-4-2
>
>
Dave--

DuQuoin was the last for me, as well.  I remember the Hays car somewhat (Pro
Street Ciera, perhaps?) that did not light my fire, either, but also Rick
Dobbertin's Pro Street destruction of a gorgeous old Corvette.  It was also
about 106 degrees in the shade. To each his own, I guess, but it wasn't my
cup of tea.

I've attended many of the NMCA events since then (Union Grove, Norwalk,
Milan, etc.) that I much prefer, also.  Especially since at these events,
the show cars often venture on to the dragstrip.  Most of the high $ Pro
Street cars that I have seen wouldn't even pass tech to get on the strip (or
street, for that matter!)....no thanks.
Mike Evans
Richland, MI
evans1@net-link.net

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:30:54 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

>I know we discussed "n"-speed trannys before, however, I got confused
>last night looking over a book on GM muscle cars.  When I flipped to
>the page on 68 442's it indicated that a 2 speed column shifter was
>an available option.  Now please correct me if I am wrong but doesn't
>2 speed mean Drive and Low.  I looked at my gear indicator on the dash
>and it have Park-R-N-D-S-L.  Is this not a 3-speed???

Um, I _think_ so. Our old 2-speed Pontiac form 1969 had P-R-N-D-L on the
column shifter.

Useless trivia: Doesn't the "S" in Park-R-N-D-S-L actually stand for
"Super" in some cases, and not simply "Second"? Maybe the Wiz can answer
that one 'cause I think I'm going back a ways here...

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: chuck kapigian <chuck@mhbc.hbocvan.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:48:29 -0400
Subject: Re: '87 442 VIN

- ------------5D7F3BBF59C0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Tim,

    I was wondering if you could decode this oldsmobile VIN # for me.
Thanks in advance for your help.
                   1G3AK4798DM451072



- -Chuck@mhbc.hbocvan.com



- ------------5D7F3BBF59C0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

<HTML><BODY>

<DT>Tim,&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I was wondering if you could decode this oldsmobile
VIN # for me. Thanks in advance for your help.</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 1G3AK4798DM451072</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>-Chuck@mhbc.hbocvan.com</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;</DT>

<DT>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n
bsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;</DT>

</BODY>
</HTML>
- ------------5D7F3BBF59C0--

------------------------------

From: "Timothy A. Churchill" <tac3550@egbsun1.draper.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:49:20 -0400
Subject: Re: Flames

> I have a brother at Harvard.  We have to send him care packages of brain
> food as he seems to be losing cranial mass rapidly since moving there
> last fall.  No one understands what is happening.

Harvard has that effect on folks, particularly the Business school.
Cranial Drain 101 is a pre-requisite to selling one's soul...

BTW, what kind of brain food?  Grits, or hush puppies?  It's true there's
no breakfast place around here that has grits, so I look forward to ordering
them out when I'm south of the Mason-Dixon.  Of course, my Yankee upbringing
always gives me away; since I was a kid I always put butter & sugar on 'em,
never liked mixing in salt, pepper and my eggs like some of my Suthun
relations...

"Fish is good brain food!" -- Larry

"You should eat a whale!" -- Moe



Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, a.k.a. 'Der KinderWagen'
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: Chris Urban <urbanch@magi.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:55:34 -0400
Subject: Spark plugs

Does anyone know of a spark plug cross referencing chart somewhere on the Web?

------------------------------

From: "Thomas Stoner" <tgstoner@mailgw2.pmr.med.umich.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 11:57:11 -0400
Subject: Painted Pinstripes Clarification

In a previous message, I said:

>>  . . . Those were painted on, as I believe all factory pinstripes
>>  were in those days.

To which, Bill Culp replied:

>  . . . I believe that all GM cars were painted though.  . . .

Bill,

Although I didn't specifically say so, I was speaking strictly of
1968 Oldsmobiles at that point.  I don't have any recollection or
knowledge of what other manufacturers, or even other General Motors
divisions, were doing for pinstripes at that point.  Sorry about the
confusion.

          ---
 ------- | | | - Tom Stoner -----------------------
|        | | |   OCA #3943                         |
|        |/|\|   Ann Arbor, MI                     |
|        | | |   1979 Hurst/Olds (It's for sale!)  |
|         ---    tgstoner@umich.edu                |
 --------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:08:18 -0400
Subject: Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead

At 09:49 AM 2/7/97 -0500, you wrote:
>I guess I forgot to mention that I used a pair of hook/bolt compressors
>that the parts store called "strut compressors".  The only thing is once I
>got the spring compressed I couldn't fit the spring compressor into the
>indention in the upper control arm.  I guess I should invent a spring
>compressor that will fit up or down through one of the shock absorber
>holes...hmmm...maybe it's an idea....

Yeah, they did; it's got two pairs of claws, one hooks over some coils near
the top and the other pair hooks over the coils near the bottom of the
spring. They both have threaded holes in them, so you use a large (3/4" or
so) threaded rod to draw them together.

It is specifically designed to do this job. BTW, it is designed to *just*
fit in there; every time I do it, I always get the impression that the
spring compressor will _NEVER_ fit through the shock-absorber hole in the
lower control arm (it inevitably does, but not without a lot of wrangling),
and when you tighten the threaded portion (the hex must face down), the
threaded rod will gradually extend up through the upper shock-mount hole,
but just _barely_ (it's pretty tight). It helps to have a jack to raise and
lower the A-arm to position the tool inside the spring (i.e. to lower or
raise the bottom of the spring, and thus change the relation of the tool to
the upper and lower shock mount).

I went ahead and bought one of these tools (not cheap; ~$55 or so) since I'm
going to be using it so much, but there is *only* one way that it will fit
in there and work, and every time I use it I have to reinvent the *exact*
position for installing and using it. Tedious, real tedious.

BTW, the "other" type of spring compressors (that hook on the outside of the
spring) will not work AT ALL. First off, I challenge anybody to install
these on the outside of the front spring on a RWD A-body (the coils are not
that accessible). As noted above, they won't work on the inside either. I
ruined a pair of my neighbor's trying this when I didn't know any better.
(yeah, don't believe the advertisement that they "work on all coil springs";
sure, you can compress any coil spring with them, but don't expect to be
able to install that compressed spring on anything but a Macpherson Strut!).
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Shang <Shang@dfwmm.net>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:16:48 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

Andrew C. Green wrote:
>
> >I know we discussed "n"-speed trannys before, however, I got confused
> >last night looking over a book on GM muscle cars.  When I flipped to
> >the page on 68 442's it indicated that a 2 speed column shifter was
> >an available option.  Now please correct me if I am wrong but doesn't
> >2 speed mean Drive and Low.  I looked at my gear indicator on the dash
> >and it have Park-R-N-D-S-L.  Is this not a 3-speed???
>
> Um, I _think_ so. Our old 2-speed Pontiac form 1969 had P-R-N-D-L on the
> column shifter.
>
> Useless trivia: Doesn't the "S" in Park-R-N-D-S-L actually stand for
> "Super" in some cases, and not simply "Second"? Maybe the Wiz can answer
> that one 'cause I think I'm going back a ways here...
>
> Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
> Datalogics, Inc.
> 101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
> Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282


The "S" in referred to as "Super" Range in my 1970 Olds Cutlass Owners
manual, and if I remember right, it was referred to "Super" in the 1978
Owners manual also.

Stephen Hoover
Dallas, Texas
'70 Cutlass "S"

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:15:50 -0400
Subject: Re: AvGas...again..

Does the Bowling auto math site have something like this?  Anyone care to
put together a little writeup and conversion table/formula for this for the
FAQ?  Yeah, yeah, I'm lazy!

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
  FAQ 3.0 hopefully available Monday (2/10) !!!

- ------------
[ avgas snip ]
Also, along the tire size/speedometer error thread... does anyone know
how to adjust a speedometer?  The one in my '61 Super 88 is 15 mph off
at 70mph real speed!  Granted, I love crusing along while indicating
85mph, but I'd rather have it be correct.  BTW, I'm running P215-75R14
tires on it now.  I think the original size is 8.00 x 14 or 8.50 x 14.
How about running a list of comparisons between the old, bias sized
tires and the new metric sized ones?

Jeff King ('61 Super 88)

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:16:04 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

Shang wrote:

> The "S" in referred to as "Super" Range in my 1970 Olds Cutlass Owners
> manual, and if I remember right, it was referred to "Super" in the 1978
> Owners manual also.

What does this mean?  Super? Do I have a two-speed or three-speed?  I
know
that I detect two shift points when I drive, hence, that is why I think
I
have a three speed.  Am I right?

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:27:57 -0400
Subject: Axle mania

Hi all,

Well I was able to wriggle myself under my car looking for the elusive
axle code.  No code to be found anywhere.  In front of the axle, in
back, on the bottom (not top).  Where in God's green earth is it.  I
am frustrated since I am dying to know.  (I know too much caffiene sp?)
You would think that GM/Olds whatever would have stamped this number
of the differential assembly.  Egads!  Any advise out there.

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:42:05 -0400
Subject: RE: Quad 4 W-41s

At 07:25 AM 2/7/97 -0400, PidgLanger@aol.com wrote:
>Mike Evans,
>
>When I went home for lunch today, I dug out my copy of Motor Trend's road
>test of the W-41 Calais.  They said it ran a 14.7 1/4 mile.  The article
>states "that's faster than a 5-liter Z-28 Camaro".

My bicycle is faster than half of the 3rd generation 5.0 Camaro's

>I imagine the people that do these tests are more skilled at driving than I
am >as well as most people on the street.

I have to disagree there.  Most can't drive worth a ......  Your specialty
magazine drivers seem to be better (Muscle Car Review, etc.) while the mass
produced ones (Motor Trend, Hot Rod ) tend to do a poor job getting
everyting out of a car.
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com) f-list since: 5/95
93 Camaro Z/28......patriot red, A4, G92, PEG2, GSC,  currently bone stock
      planned spring mods: !Cat, !TB, 160stat, SLP cat back, GM Cold Air Kit
80 Olds 4-4-2  W-30...white/gold...........3rd place '97 Cleveland Auto Rama

------------------------------

From: Timothy Carl Hietpas <thietpas@csd.uwm.edu>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:45:27 -0400
Subject: Re: Axle mania

	Chris,

	If my memory serves, the axle code for you rear-end should be
stamped on the passengers side of the axle and the side closest to your
engine.  I believe the number is closer to the gearbox and almost
certainly has been covered by dirt and rust.  You should clean the axle
housing and 'poof' the numbers should magically appear.

	Tim

> Well I was able to wriggle myself under my car looking for the elusive
  axle code.  No code to be found anywhere.  In front of the axle, in
  back, on the bottom (not top).  Where in God's green earth is it.  I
  am frustrated since I am dying to know.  (I know too much caffiene sp?)
  You would think that GM/Olds whatever would have stamped this number
  of the differential assembly.  Egads!  Any advise out there.

  Chris Sparks
  68 442

thietpas@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu
1987 Olds 442

------------------------------

From: JPADA@hqgate.orbital.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:29:34 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

Hi all,

I know we discussed "n"-speed trannys before, however, I got confused
last night looking over a book on GM muscle cars.  When I flipped to
the page on 68 442's it indicated that a 2 speed column shifter was
an available option.  Now please correct me if I am wrong but doesn't
2 speed mean Drive and Low.  I looked at my gear indicator on the dash
and it have Park-R-N-D-S-L.  Is this not a 3-speed???  Please clear
my cloudy mind!!

Chris Sparks

     Chris,

     The 2-speed Jetaway automatic was the base automatic on the 68 Cutlass
     and F-85.  It was only used behind the straight six and the 350.  All
     400 cu in engines (ie, all 442s) got the TH400 three-speed (the TH350
     didn't come out until 1969).  The book is in error if it indicates
     that the 2-spd was a 442 option.

     Joe Padavano
     jpada@hqgate.orbital.com

     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

From: BRAD.NICHOLSON@ssa.gov
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:43:19 -0400
Subject: Maryland Olds Club Mtg - 2/11/97

I promise, this is the last posting of this message.  Just trying to get
the word out.

The FIRST OFFICIAL meeting of the Oldsmobile Centennial Club will be on
Tuesday, February 11, 1997 starting at 7PM.  The meeting will be held at :

     ERNIE SWANSON OLDSMOBILE
     410 N. CRAIN HIGHWAY, GLEN BURNIE, MD 21061-3009
     Phone: (410) 768-8800
     Fax: (410) 768-1948

All we ask is that you NOT park in front of the dealership as they will be
open, please park on the side.  We have a meeting room somewhere in the
showroom building.  I'll be in there gathering the flock in the showroom as
they come in. We shouldn't run past 9PM.

If you know of anyone else who might be interested, and not on the
newsgroup, please pass the word along and or bring them with ya.  There are
around 40 people currently interested in the club and 1 event has been
scheduled, the cruise @ the Big M Drive-In in September.  We will be
discussing bylaws and maybe the club's first event in the spring/summer.
Also, Ernie Swanson, owner of Glen Burnie Oldsmobile should be attending.

If you want to be a founding father in a car club, here is your opportunity
!!!

Anyone interested in joining, or know of someone who might be interested,
drop me some e-mail.  I'll have directions to the meeting Wed.  If you plan
on coming, please e-mail me so we have a head count for refreshments.

Thanks for the bandwidth.

 ---   Brad Nicholson   OCA#18984
| | |  1987 442 W-42
| | |  1994 Eighty Eight LSS
|/|\|  (H) 76062.3042@compuserve.com
| | |  (W) brad.nicholson@ssa.gov
 ---   Oldsmobile Centennial Club

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:55:56 -0400
Subject: Re: Axle mania

At 12:27 PM 2/7/97 -0400, Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada) wrote:
>Hi all,
>
>Well I was able to wriggle myself under my car looking for the elusive
>axle code.  No code to be found anywhere.  In front of the axle, in
>back, on the bottom (not top).  Where in God's green earth is it.  I
>am frustrated since I am dying to know.  (I know too much caffiene sp?)
>You would think that GM/Olds whatever would have stamped this number
>of the differential assembly.  Egads!  Any advise out there.

Keep looking it may be well hidden under rust. If you are dying to know just
jack the rear of your car up and turn your tires one full revolution and
count the number of revolutions of the driveshaft. ( I don't know the
formula to figure out the exact ratio after this...anybody help me here?)
Also if you rotate one wheel foward and the other goes the same direction,
it is probably positraction.
>
>Chris Sparks
>68 442
>
>
>
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com) f-list since: 5/95
93 Camaro Z/28......patriot red, A4, G92, PEG2, GSC,  currently bone stock
      planned spring mods: !Cat, !TB, 160stat, SLP cat back, GM Cold Air Kit
80 Olds 4-4-2  W-30...white/gold...........3rd place '97 Cleveland Auto Rama

------------------------------

From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:54:42 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

Andrew C. Green wrote:
>
> Useless trivia: Doesn't the "S" in Park-R-N-D-S-L actually stand for
> "Super" in some cases, and not simply "Second"? Maybe the Wiz can answer
> that one 'cause I think I'm going back a ways here..

My '71 owners manual calls it "Super".  I don't have the manual with me,
but I recall it states something like this:
"S stands for super, use when super performance is required".
The only reason I recall any of this is because it made me laugh when I
read it the first time.
BTW, does this mean I can only have super performance when I use the
left side of my dual gate?  The left side is labeled "L S D" and the
right side (the performance side) is labeled "1 2 3".

Kurt
71 442

------------------------------

From: Chris & Robin Miller <cya442@INETWORLD.NET>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 09:58:47 -0400
Subject: Re: So Cal Olds

James Thingwold wrote:
>
> Dan, your in my neck of the woods (I'm in Anaheim).  Do you belong to the
> So Cal Olds Club?  Just curious.....if not  you should!
>
Hey there,

I'm also in So Cal, El Toro/Tustin to be exact (just got here), and was
wondering if you know of any junk yards (salvage yards, oops!) in the
area.  Also tell me about this So Cal Olds Club, fees, events, etc...

Thanks,
Chris Miller
'68 442
cya442@inetworld.net

------------------------------

From: "Jonathan M. Smith" <jmskms@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 12:56:44 -0400
Subject: Re: DANGER..Coils Ahead


>sounds like you did not have a manual handy, which would have had not
>only all sorts of screaming warnings about using a spring compressor
>but also additional pointers on things like how the spring is supposed
>to be oriented within the control arm, where the end of the last coil
>is positioned, etc.)
>
I did have a manual (albeit a Chiltons), the coil end was aligned with the
guide hole in the upper control arm, and I couldn't get the coil compressor
that the parts store loaned to me to fit in the upper control arm.  Someone
out there said that they had a 1967 442...on the upper control arm, is
there a 6 inch deep or so well that the coil spring slides up into?  That's
the way my Cutlass Sup is, and as I placed the spring with the compressors
on it, I had no way to DEcompress the coil without jamming the compressor
in that said well.  Unless I just totally blew the instructions that the
guy at the part store gave me.  Believe me, I've got a healthy respect for
compressed things.  Maybe the compressors that the fellow gave me were too
large, or the wrong type or something.



e-mail:  jmskms@ix.netcom.com
www:     www.netcom.com/~jmskms


Hey, this IS my fathers Oldsmobile...Ya got a problem with that sis??

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:04:23 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto Tranny question

Kurt Heinrich wrote:

> My '71 owners manual calls it "Super".  I don't have the manual with me,
> but I recall it states something like this:
> "S stands for super, use when super performance is required".
> The only reason I recall any of this is because it made me laugh when I
> read it the first time.

Does this mean that the tranny doesn't go into third gear?

> BTW, does this mean I can only have super performance when I use the
> left side of my dual gate?  The left side is labeled "L S D" and the
> right side (the performance side) is labeled "1 2 3".

I have no clue as to what you are talking about here.  :-(

Chris Sparks
68 442

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:16:20 -0400
Subject: Re: Auto tranny question

The letter S was used by some manufactuers to designate super, aka 2nd.
Some used 1-2-3, some 1-2-D, some L-S-D, and many variations.  They were
used on 3 speed automatic transmissions and there were variations used
on the old 4 speed hydra-matics as well.  I had a F**d that had a 3
speed auto with L-2-D1-D2.  D2 was the range that started out in second
and shifted to third instead of starting in first, great in the snow.
Thre were some Oldsmobiles of your vintage available with 2 speed, but
they are somewhat rare.  Those trannies are sought after by racers
running B-O-P engines in light cars.  I had read somewhere that quite a
few were used in Canadian taxi cabs.  I do know that my wifes uncle had
a 70 or 71 Cutlass with a 350 engine and 2 speed tranny that he bought
new.  I drove it once in the mid 70s and it is the only combo like this
I have ever seen in an Olds.

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: PaulP34167@aol.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:21:38 -0400
Subject: Newsgroup???

Has anyone thought about making this a newsgroup?  I know Oldsmobiles are THE
most important things in the world, but my messages of lesser importance seem
to get drowned in a sea of subjects such as: "Mice in my intake."

Just thought I'd ask.

Paul Pate
70 Cutlass S

------------------------------

From: BILL <1939olds@ati-intl.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 15:40:59 -0400
Subject: list

please remove me from the list. I left town for 5 days and receive
755 messages from Oldsmobile lovers of which I am one but this is
my business e-mail.
thanks

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:32:28 -0400
Subject: Re: auto tranny  clarification

The 2 speed trannies I was referring to in my previous post are
Powerglides with the B-O-P bolt pattern.  Not the Jet-Away transmission.

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@Lilly.COM>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 10:06:44 -0400
Subject: Re: 455 Rocket Video

I watched it with tears in my eyes.  I am an old softy when it comes to
cars.  The long shots were of a 59 Olds with Pontiac style 455 emblems
attached.  The ones like they used in the grilles of mid 70s
Bonnevilles.  The close up shots did not look Oldsmobile at all, and
they were not!  At the end of the video they showed a shell of a 66 or
so Buick that was in front of a screen used to project the landscape on.
That explains the funny looking bucket seats and the goofy headliner and
the ect. ect. ect.
Hey, it is the spirit of the song that counts, right?

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

P.S.
Did you ever wonder why Joe Mannix put the car in park right after the
soundtrack went through all the gears of a four speed in the opening of
the show?

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:41:22 -0400
Subject: Re: Newsgroup???

>Has anyone thought about making this a newsgroup?  I know Oldsmobiles are THE
>most important things in the world, but my messages of lesser importance seem
>to get drowned in a sea of subjects such as: "Mice in my intake."

Part of the problem is that a lot more people can get email than Usenet
newsfeeds, and of those who get newsfeeds, there's still a lag in
propagation time (not to mention spamming and other noise even worse
than what you see here). Though I could see possibly creating a subgroup
under rec.autos.manufacturers.oldsmobile, or whatever the hierarchy
would be, having discussions there would be like trying to scream at
each other in the middle of an expressway. You can avoid the newgroup
creation protocols by just setting up an alt.* group and hoping it
propagates, but unless everyone's ISP honors your newgroup request it
would be a long time in circulating, if it ever did.

And realistically, one of the small blessings we have with this list,
which may go unnoticed most of the time, is that our email addresses
are not being skimmed from newsgroups and targeted for junk email. I'm
not saying we don't get hit anyway (I try to minimize the public use
of this email address but I still get hit occasionally), but if we were
to post in Usenet every day, we would be absolutely inundated in crap.
And I can't do wholesale email deletions from this business account
since I do customer support; I have to read everything, even it's from
Mike Frederick.  :-)

>Just thought I'd ask.

I've wondered whether we could lessen the shock experienced by new
members (not necessarily yourself, just in general...) by automatically
subscribing them to the digest version of this list. That way you get
all the same content but 1/20th or so of the message headers, making it
a little easier to wade through the incoming mail looking for urgent
items first, especially after a weekend. Then if you're in a position
where you want to get individual mailings, even if there's a lot of
them, you can contact Greg and he'll manually add you to the real-time
distribution list instead. Comments?

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: "Etzel Bobby" <Etzel.Bobby@mail.ndhm.gtegsc.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 13:09:49 -0400
Subject: RE: Kathy Mattea swaps a Rocket 455 into a  Ford Thunderturd

Yes they could have used a good "455 Technical Advisor". To bad they didn't
know about this list. They could have the use of real 455 cars and been
provided the best advice since Dr. Olds retired. Maybe they will make a sequel
with all the 455 list members in it. :-)

Bobby ( I do like the song and video.)

70 442 (Escape Back to the .....Past)
______________________________________________________________________________
_ From: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca on Fri, Feb 7, 1997 8:43 AM Subject: Re:
Kathy Mattea swaps a Rocket 455 into a  Ford Thunderturd To:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

R Mullen wrote:
>
> I checked out http://www.mattea.com/rocket.html for details on the
> much-talked about Kathy Mattea song.    This page shows what looks like
> stills from the video.  Displayed above (sacrilege) the 455 Rocket air
> cleaner decal is a picture of a Ford Thunderbird.  Using a Ford
> Thunderbird for a video about a 455 Rocket soured me on the whole thing.

I don't know what the car was in the video (I'm not up on the late 50's
or early 60's), but it _was_not_ a T-Bird.  My guess is the webmaster is
responsible.  Go to that page and look closely at the pictures toward
the bottom and you'll see this.  Of course the 455 wasn't available when
the car in the video was built.  They did show some shots of 455 badges
on the car which looked like the badges from a Buick GS.

Kurt
71 442



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------------------------------

From: Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 14:05:15 -0400
Subject: Re: A Few Q's

From: "jones" <jones@morgan.net>

>   In my machine shop some of the cleanest engines I
>have seen have had Castrol GTX and Quaker State in them and the nastiest
>seem to always have Pennzoil in them. Maybe the Pennz users here just don't
>change their oil.

Just curious, but by the time an engine gets to the machine shop, how
do you know what mfg oil is in it?

There is an Oil FAQ floating around on the net.  It has a pretty indepth
listing of different oils and a breakdown of their ash content, zinc
additives, etc.  I'm not sure how up to date it is, but it does make
for interesting reading.

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970  442  4-Speed  w/ 10w30 Castrol GTX
see the archives at http://www.calcon.net/~easton

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 14:03:12 -0400
Subject: Re: Axle mania

Chris,
As other have said, you might have to get sandpaper to get down to the code.
However, you didn't check the top of the tube. Believe it or not, I have found
 them there. I guess the person stamping the tube just didn't want to bend
over far enough to put it in the correct place, or the tube was stamped
before it was installed and it was put in 90 degrees off.

Art Fuller
mefco@sprynet.com

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 17:12:09 -0400
Subject: Re: Newsgroup???

Andrew "Mega Mail" Green wrote:
>
> ...but if we were to post in Usenet every day, we would be absolutely
> inundated in crap.

Something we CAN agree on.

> ...I have to read everything, even it's from Mike Frederick.  :-)

...and answer everthing.

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike

- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: BRAD.NICHOLSON@ssa.gov
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 14:23:27 -0400
Subject: Upcoming OCA Events

     If anyone hasn't been to 442.com lately, check out Bryceman's latest
     enhancements, the boy is goooood!!!
     Don't know what is going on in your area, then check out the
     Oldsmobile Club of America's Event page @
     "http://www.442.com/ocaevents.html"

     I'll try to send Bryce an update each month of OCA events from JWO and
     OCA chapter listing.  Both are current as of the Feb issue of JWO.

      ---   Brad Nicholson   OCA#18984
     | | |  1987 442 W-42
     | | |  1994 Eighty Eight LSS
     |/|\|  (H) 76062.3042@compuserve.com
     | | |  (W) brad.nicholson@ssa.gov
      ---   Oldsmobile Centennial Club

------------------------------

From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Date: Fri, 7 Feb 1997 14:27:15 -0400
Subject: What does "S" stand for? (Auto Tranny question)

I got out my '71 Owners manual when I went home for lunch.  Here's the
quote:

"S" Super Range - Used when super performance is needed for increased
acceleration in traffic, hill climbing or "engine braking" downhill.
The selector lever may be moved from "D" to "S" and vice versa, under
most operating conditions.  "Super" should not be used at speeds above
75 mph.

Kurt
71 442

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #505
********************************
