
oldsmobile-digest       Monday, October 4 2004       Volume 01 : Number 5045



Anticlimax
Shipping parts  UPS and FedEx
Re: The General signing off
backfire with "new" MSD ignition
backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info
Re: Need parts
GM HD box progress
Re: GM Oil Cooler Line Fittings?
Re: Anticlimax
Re: GM HD box progress
Re: 67-70 Olds type O Rearend Facts (Long)
Re: backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info
Re: Shipping parts  UPS and FedEx
Re: digital instrument cluster for 1989 Olds Cutlass Supreme SL
RE: The General signing off
RE: Questions for BC list members
Re: backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info
79 Alternator kits
door edge guard
Re: Questions for BC list members
Lower Radiator Hose
OCA Dispute- Settled out of court- Bob Casey comes thru
Re: door edge guard
Re: 67-70 Olds type O Rearend Facts
RE: OCA Dispute- Settled out of court- Bob Casey comes thru
Re: Oldsmobile-digest V1 #5044

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 12:41:30 -0500
From: bcroe@juno.com
Subject: Anticlimax

The valve covers used under the R4 A/C compressor are lower, 
with a "slant" top (compared to the base).  Also some have a 
slightly narrower base, which limits my use of "iron core" 
valve cover gaskets.  Of course there is the 5 hole variety, 
but I always drill and tap my 403 heads to convert them to 
the less leaky 10 bolt pattern.  Bruce Roe

3 Oct 2004  Steve Harrison <k0xp@dandy.net> writes:
> At 06:52 PM 10/2/2004 -0700, you wrote:

> >> found several sets of "Hi-performance" valve covers,
> >> but alas, they only have them for the 350 and 455.

> >????? You mean the valve covers are marked 350 or 
> > 455? Otherwise, they're all the same.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 12:03:30 -0700
From: Joe & Gloria Varley <carcouple@cox.net>
Subject: Shipping parts  UPS and FedEx

Sold a bunch of Olds and Corvette parts on ebay last week, now shipping 
them.  Found out that the $800.00 teak '65 Corvette wheel that I shipped 
and insured with FedEx ground will only be worth $100.00 if it is 
lost/damaged.  Their fine print says that anything that is antique, 
collectible, or furs, or jewelry, is not covered over $100.00 max.  So, 
they will let you pay for $800.00 in insurance up front, but if they have a 
problem, I only get $100.00.

The lady at the counter said that unless it is something FedEx can easily 
go out and buy "off the shelf", its $100.00.  She also said if you have a 
claim, you need the ORIGINAL receipt from when you bought it.  Right,  I 
saved my non existing receipts from '50 Olds and Corvette parts I bought at 
Carlyle, Hershey, and OCA National meets 25-30 years ago, when they were a 
fraction of their value today.

So, think twice if shipping really rare and valuable parts.

Joe Varley
      AZ

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 13:29:10 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: The General signing off

Mark,

I deeply regret that you must leave the Olds List. I will miss you. Good
luck and clear skies.

Semper Fi

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com


- ----- Original Message -----
From: "The General" <patton442@verizon.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 5:50 AM
Subject: The General signing off


> Hey list,
>
>         All good things must come to an end ........
> It has been an honor and a privilege to chat with
> you wonderful guys over the years. Things have
> changed in my life. Some of you know the details.
> Some know more than others. The end result is
> that cars and parts will be part off my past. If they will
> be in the future, one never knows. But I hope to God
> that they will. I still have some parts left over.
>
> 455s - TH400 and TH300 - conoles and shifters.
> I am in Philadelphia, PA.
>
>         I will be unsubscribing just after this is sent, so
> please reply to me privately.
>
>
> The General       patton442@verizon.net
>

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 16:55:46 -0400
From: John Livingston <johnliving@cox.net>
Subject: backfire with "new" MSD ignition

Folks,

I finally have the GM HD racing (MSD 6 HVC equivalent) ignition box 
hooked up and working, more or less. The car starts and idles nicely, 
but tends to miss a bit and often backfires when you step on the gas. 
This is certainly not an improvement over the way it was running 
before on the straight HEI system.

Are there any obvious culprits I should be looking at (other than the 
installer)? Any other info I can provide that might be helpful? I 
don't think I did anything that would've thrown the timing off, and 
the vacuum lines all seem secure.

thanks.

John
68 442 convt.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 17:47:42 -0400
From: John Livingston <johnliving@cox.net>
Subject: backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info

This is probably one of my "hoisted by my own petard" situations. 
I've probably made it difficult for the vac advance to do its job.

When installing the new ignition box, I pulled the HEI ignition 
module from the distributor. I ran the two pick up jumpers out the 
opening where the vacuum advance assembly enters. My understanding of 
how the vacuum advance works is definitely limited. I bet I should 
find another route for those wires. The jumpers MSD supplied were a 
bit short, so that path seemed the best. Time to spice in some longer 
leads?

John
68 442 convt.

At 4:55 PM -0400 10/3/04, John Livingston wrote:
>Folks,
>
>I finally have the GM HD racing (MSD 6 HVC equivalent) ignition box 
>hooked up and working, more or less. The car starts and idles 
>nicely, but tends to miss a bit and often backfires when you step on 
>the gas. This is certainly not an improvement over the way it was 
>running before on the straight HEI system.
>
>Are there any obvious culprits I should be looking at (other than 
>the installer)? Any other info I can provide that might be helpful? 
>I don't think I did anything that would've thrown the timing off, 
>and the vacuum lines all seem secure.
>
>thanks.
>
>John
>68 442 convt.

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 18:37:41 -0400
From: "Joe" <w30442@zoominternet.net>
Subject: Re: Need parts

I think the Parts Place has repo's of all these parts if you want to go that 
route.
http://www.thepartsplaceinc.com
Joe


- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: <old442@adelphia.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 7:54 AM
Subject: Need parts


> Looking for a few odds and ends for a '71 Cutlass:
> Heater control knob
> Underhood light
> Rearview mirror with light (must have excellent mirror)
>
> ***Also, looking for exhaust trumpets to fit a 2 1/2" exhaust system.***
>
> Please respond directly if you have parts.
>
> Thanks.
> Kurt Heinrich
> OCA# 30442
> 71 Cutlass Supreme SX Convertible
> mailto:old442@adelphia.net
>
>
>
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 19:09:04 -0400
From: John Livingston <johnliving@cox.net>
Subject: GM HD box progress

Ken,

I've finally got the HD ignition box in and working, more or less. 
I'm getting a backfire under acceleration that I suspect is 
self-inflicted. I ran the violet and green pick up leads out through 
the vacuum advance opening and I suspect I'm keeping something from 
moving properly. I hope to reroute that tomorrow.

I'm using the internal coil, which also complicates the wiring a bit. 
What external coil do you use with this unit? The MSD 6 HVC racing 
ignition instructions (it seems identical to the GM unit) recommend 
their HVC 8250 coil, which they say is specific to this box. I found 
it at Jegs or Summit for about $125, which seems a bit much.

Here's the link to the MSD instructions, which show exactly the same 
wiring you had recommended. Putting that weather pack harness 
together myself actually was pretty easy. At least it will seem so if 
I get the car to run right!

Hope you're doing well.

John

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 21:02:32 -0400
From: "ron fama" <77w30442@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: GM Oil Cooler Line Fittings?

cms sucks as far as trying to get part numbers and such. just shows illistrated veiw of the lines 
from engine to  rad cooler, or to engine cooler in front of rad. i have to go to dealer in am to 
pick up 74 and up olds timeing tabs i ordered, so ill get  ill veiw with p/n
ron, you can also go to
www.daytonchevy.com  and send e mail they will e mail you back, good guys there
ron
- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Harrison" <k0xp@dandy.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 12:00 PM
Subject: Re: GM Oil Cooler Line Fittings?


> At 01:10 AM 10/3/2004 -0400, you wrote:
>>go to local dealer they will let you thumb threw the book.
>
> Mine doesn't. They won't even let me come behind the counter to look at the
> computer display  ;o\  I must look real shifty or sumpin, I figger  ;o(((((
>
>>i will check my 94 cms tommorrow and see if anything useful is in
>>it as to thread  size.
>
> Thanks, Ron, that's what I was hoping someone could do. I'll go get pix of
> these now so maybe will jog someone else's memory.
>
> At worst, I'm thinking I'll braze or solder something into cutoff pieces of
> the original lines so can at least connect them with short pieces of hose,
> as I'm doing right now. But really wanted to make it all-steel lines
> connection.
>
> SteveH
> 

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 18:05:31 -0700
From: Mark Mullins <mark@marineaviation.org>
Subject: Re: Anticlimax

At 06:52 PM 10/2/2004 -0700, Milton wrote:
>????? You mean the valve covers are marked 350 or 455? Otherwise, they're
>all the same. I don't understand what you're driving at, or am I being way
>too literal again and missed the joke?

Actually, they were marked 350 and 455.  It was the "Hi-performance" and 
the implication that it could only be used on those engines that I was 
being facetious about.




Mark Mullins
Tucson, Az

------------------------------

Date: Fri, 1 Oct 2004 21:16:51 -0400
From: John Livingston <johnliving@cox.net>
Subject: Re: GM HD box progress

Sorry. Meant to send this to Ken direct.

It's a wonder any of my cars run!

John
68 442 convt., sort of

>Ken,
>
>I've finally got the HD ignition box in and working, more or less. 
>I'm getting a backfire under acceleration that I suspect is 
>self-inflicted. I ran the violet and green pick up leads out through 
>the vacuum advance opening and I suspect I'm keeping something from 
>moving properly. I hope to reroute that tomorrow.
>
>I'm using the internal coil, which also complicates the wiring a 
>bit. What external coil do you use with this unit? The MSD 6 HVC 
>racing ignition instructions (it seems identical to the GM unit) 
>recommend their HVC 8250 coil, which they say is specific to this 
>box. I found it at Jegs or Summit for about $125, which seems a bit 
>much.
>
>Here's the link to the MSD instructions, which show exactly the same 
>wiring you had recommended. Putting that weather pack harness 
>together myself actually was pretty easy. At least it will seem so 
>if I get the car to run right!
>
>Hope you're doing well.
>
>John

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 21:27:38 -0400
From: "Chris Carson" <fastcarson@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: 67-70 Olds type O Rearend Facts (Long)

Beware that Canadian 442, and possibly Cutlass as well came with the
legendary Chevy 12 bolt until 1971. Hence the c-clips....
Chris
- ----- Original Message -----
Thanks for the info Steve D.  Pulled the cover and found a "C" clip with 12
bolt ring marked 3862691 14 43. not a posi.  I'm geussing 3=Olds,8.62 Dia,
69Year, 1=Canada,  43/14= 3.08ratio?????
Kerry

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 19:18:21 -0700
From: "Infinite Space Systems, Inc." <imp@theriver.com>
Subject: Re: backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info

John,

> I've probably made it difficult for the vac advance to do its job.
>
> When installing the new ignition box, I pulled the HEI ignition
> module from the distributor. I ran the two pick up jumpers out the
> opening where the vacuum advance assembly enters.


The 2 wires could get caught by the advance mechanism and interfere. I would
look closely at the wires and see if there's any sign of them being pinched.
Since the HEI ingnition module was removed, why can't you run the wires out
through the rubber grommet for those original HEI wires? That's what I
remember as being normally none.


> Time to spice in some longer
> leads?


That should be easy.


> > The car starts and idles
> >nicely, but tends to miss a bit and often backfires when you step on
> >the gas. This is certainly not an improvement over the way it was
> >running before on the straight HEI system.


I checked the MSD website Trouble-shooting section. There was no mention of
any problem like that.

Be sure your carb hasn't suddenly betrayed you, if you are running a Holley.

Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
imp@theriver.com

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 22:53:36 -0400
From: "Randy Geisel" <rocket455@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Shipping parts  UPS and FedEx

Thanks for posting that info. I've been shipping FedEx and never knew that.
Hope that $1225 NOS 1940's Ford Woody tailgate I shipped to L.A. Friday
makes in it one piece. I've never had any problems with FedEx....UPS, on the
other hand, likes to break things.

Randy

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 21:59:56 -0500
From: Kevin Wright <krwright@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: digital instrument cluster for 1989 Olds Cutlass Supreme SL

Well, I meant to check a PnP in your area... :) or keep an eye on 
eVilBay.
Dunno what it would cost. Varies wildly by region and/or yarde. Call 
and ask. I think I paid $30 or so with shipping (got a steal, really.)
Be aware that if you have the basic digital dash, you can't just plug 
in the full digital dash. You have to re-arrange the pins. See the 
'upgrade' articles on w-body.com ( http://www.w-body.com/ )

krw

On Oct 2, 2004, at 12:29 PM, oldsmobile-digest wrote:

> Date: Fri, 01 Oct 2004 09:47:49 -0500
> From: Bob Edwards <bedwards@uark.edu>
> Subject: Re: digital instrument cluster for 1989 Olds Cutlass Supreme 
> SL
>
> kw,
>
> Thanks for your reply. I live in Fayetteville, Arkansas so Dallas 
> isn't too
> far away, however I am a student and work full time, so taking a day 
> off
> would be tough. Do you have a ball park idea what one of the full 
> digital
> dash wo8uld run at Pick N Pull ?
>
> With Appreciation,
>
> Bob Edwards
>
On digest mode, so I'm a little slow...

Kevin Wright                                         
krwright@sbcglobal.net
Dallas/Ft. Worth, TX                             
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/70Olds.html

'71 Cutlass S for sale, less engine and trans: 
http://www.wankel.net/~krwright/cars/olds/71_cutlass.html

Snoopy: 1970 Oldsmobile Cutlass S Sports Coupe - It wants to be a W-31! 
And have EFI, 4-wheel discs, a 6-speed, a turbo or two... :)
...and a '71 Holiday Coupe less engine/transmission for sale - it'll be 
parts if someone doesn't buy it!

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 23:01:53 -0400
From: Cutlass7276@netscape.net
Subject: RE: The General signing off

"The General" <patton442@verizon.net> wrote:

>Hey list,
>
>        All good things must come to an end ........

>>>>
Randy said
that was alot of years..
I dont know bouts you guys,but this brought tears to my eyes..

>>
Hello
I have enjoyed your posts for many years,thank you.
I hope whatever it is that has happen, for us not to have you on list,you take care of yourself and your loved ones.
Sincere good luck to you sir.
Randy H.
Van.B.C.Can.



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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 23:05:45 -0400
From: Cutlass7276@netscape.net
Subject: RE: Questions for BC list members

Kevin & Casey Olund <kcolund@shaw.ca> wrote:

>I saw a van at the side of the road today that had "Air Care On Road" painted on all sides. Complete with police style
>light bar and all. He had an older cavalier pulled over at the side of the road.
>
>Have they started using portable sniffers in the lower mainland ???
>
>Kevin
>
>
>Hello Kevin
Well i am sure there are lots that hope they dont show up outside the drag strip on a fri night street legal :O.
I saw this car there last fri.
 http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1098281276987_1003_001.jpg 
 http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1095361001361_1003_002.jpg 
Last Bracket race of the season next weekend..hope the weather was like this past,,HOT!
Randy H.
Van.B.C.Can.
 http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1092977657957_89600012.jpg 

__________________________________________________________________
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Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 03 Oct 2004 23:52:23 -0400
From: Cutlass7276@netscape.net
Subject: Re: backfire with "new" MSD ignition - more info

John Livingston <johnliving@cox.net> wrote:

I 
>don't think I did anything that would've thrown the timing off, and 
>the vacuum lines all seem secure.
>
>
Hi John
My first recent experience with a MSD install was the timing was advanced after the install alot and had to be retarded back to where the timing should be(but did not back fire).
Does the back fire happen at the lower rpm scale when msd is multiple spark(approx. up too 2000rpm) for 20 degrees of crank rotation.
Did you check timing after install at all?
Does the engine ping upon acceleration?
Also as Steven H. suggested to me,,dont run any wires like coil and spark plug,power leads parallel too the leads from the box.
As per your last question,,a bigger COIL...dont fergit too upgrade wires is needed.
I am guessin Ken will help you with this more then i.
Good Luck!
Randy H.



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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 23:09:10 -0500
From: bcroe@juno.com
Subject: 79 Alternator kits

I still have 3 repair kits for the internally regulated alternator 
the General used through 1979, to 63 amps.  I don't want 
to move these, and they are no use to me (since all my cars 
are standardized on 70A 81 diesel alt and pulleys).  

There are a couple of brush/diode trio/regulator kits.  Also 
a conversion kit (main windings) intended to convert one 
of these to 80A output.  While I think these tend to run hot, 
others like them to 120A.  

Just get me a couple dollars' postage, and one could be 
yours, inside continental USA.  

Bruce Roe
2375 Parkview
AURORA, IL 60504

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 05:42:25 -0400
From: John Kelsey <ribspot@pop4.net>
Subject: door edge guard

Hi All
     I am back in my 76 toro finally. It is not quite done but it is 
very close.
    I am looking for one small part. I have had no luck anywhere. I need 
the left door edge guard. I apparantly lost it somewhere during the 
resto project. I have everything else. A small item I know but I want it 
to complete the project. Anyone?
    While I have your attention I have two new toronado nameplates for 
the fenders. Keep in mind I didn't take these off so I don't know how 
they were removed. There is room for a hand to reinstall the left side 
with the drivers door wide open. The passenger side has what I guess is 
the heater/AC housing and even with the door wide open I see no space to 
get the nuts on the back of this thing. Any hints or suggestions 
appreciated.
thanks
John Kelsey
Dayton Ohio
an

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 07:58:15 -0400
From: "ron fama" <77w30442@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: Questions for BC list members

nj has been doing that for years
ron
- ----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Cutlass7276@netscape.net>
To: <oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca>
Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 11:05 PM
Subject: RE: Questions for BC list members


> Kevin & Casey Olund <kcolund@shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>>I saw a van at the side of the road today that had "Air Care On Road" painted on all sides. 
>>Complete with police style
>>light bar and all. He had an older cavalier pulled over at the side of the road.
>>
>>Have they started using portable sniffers in the lower mainland ???
>>
>>Kevin
>>
>>
>>Hello Kevin
> Well i am sure there are lots that hope they dont show up outside the drag strip on a fri night 
> street legal :O.
> I saw this car there last fri.
> http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1098281276987_1003_001.jpg
> http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1095361001361_1003_002.jpg
> Last Bracket race of the season next weekend..hope the weather was like this past,,HOT!
> Randy H.
> Van.B.C.Can.
> http://images.andale.com/f2/115/106/3596099/1092977657957_89600012.jpg
>
> __________________________________________________________________
> Switch to Netscape Internet Service.
> As low as $9.95 a month -- Sign up today at http://isp.netscape.com/register
>
> Netscape. Just the Net You Need.
>
> New! Netscape Toolbar for Internet Explorer
> Search from anywhere on the Web and block those annoying pop-ups.
> Download now at http://channels.netscape.com/ns/search/install.jsp
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 10:02:35 EDT
From: JonKrisInc@aol.com
Subject: Lower Radiator Hose

- -------------------------------1096898555
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Just bought a Be Cool aluminum radiator from Summit. The current lower rad  
hose seems to be a bit short at the water pump. Looks like I need another  inch 
or so. Did I buy the wrong hose? Does someone make a longer hose?
Tia,
 
 
Bruce
75  Delta 88 Conv. (duals, of course)
72 Cutlass Conv.
56 190 SL Conv.
92  Eldo

- -------------------------------1096898555
Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3DUS-ASCII">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1458" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY id=3Drole_body style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #000000; FONT-FAMILY:=20=
Arial"=20
bottomMargin=3D7 leftMargin=3D7 topMargin=3D7 rightMargin=3D7><FONT id=3Drol=
e_document=20
face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>
<DIV>Just bought a Be Cool aluminum radiator from Summit. The current lower=20=
rad=20
hose seems to be a bit short&nbsp;at the water pump. Looks like I need anoth=
er=20
inch or so. Did I buy the wrong hose? Does someone make a longer hose?</DIV>
<DIV>Tia,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT lang=3D0 face=3DArial size=3D2 FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" PTSIZE=3D"10"=
>Bruce<BR>75=20
Delta 88 Conv. (duals, of course)<BR>72 Cutlass Conv.<BR>56 190 SL Conv.<BR>=
92=20
Eldo</FONT></DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1096898555--

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 10:10:57 -0400
From: "Christopher Witt" <rocketscience442@hotmail.com>
Subject: OCA Dispute- Settled out of court- Bob Casey comes thru

Bob is THE MAN

here's an excerpt from his reply to the Last Blast:
+++++++++++++++++++
Conclusion:
I would call this a "comedy of errors" if it weren't for the fact that the 
owner sees nothing funny about it.

Resolution:
Your judging sheet is indeed available as this is common practice in the OCA 
judging criteria (they are saved for one year whether they are felt to be 
bogus or not).

Your award is available and will be forwarded to you if you wish it.
=====================


I had to apologize to him of course for sending back [before READING his 
reply] a doubtful comment.

Man, it's good to see them resolve the problems they caused w/o being forced 
to in court.

Also negates the need to resort to the Nuclear Bomb that I had planned.

CBWitt
517-449-0432

_________________________________________________________________
On the road to retirement? Check out MSN Life Events for advice on how to 
get there! http://lifeevents.msn.com/category.aspx?cid=Retirement

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 10:07:51 -0400
From: "Frederick Nissen" <fsnissen@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: door edge guard

>     While I have your attention I have two new toronado nameplates for
> the fenders. Keep in mind I didn't take these off so I don't know how
> they were removed. There is room for a hand to reinstall the left side
> with the drivers door wide open. The passenger side has what I guess is
> the heater/AC housing and even with the door wide open I see no space to
> get the nuts on the back of this thing. Any hints or suggestions
> appreciated.

- -----------------

I don't have any leads on the door edge guard, hopefully someone else has
one for you.

On the Toronado nameplates, the last second series I worked on were '77 and
'78.  Both had the fender scripts held on by barrel clips.  You might give
that a try.

Regards,
Fred

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 10:17:58 EDT
From: NUOLDSMAN@aol.com
Subject: Re: 67-70 Olds type O Rearend Facts

- -------------------------------1096899478
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

 
In a message dated 10/3/04 11:37:39 AM Pacific Daylight  Time, 
roseellen99@sbcglobal.net writes:

Thanks  for the info Steve D.  Pulled the cover and found a "C" clip with 12 
bolt  ring marked 3862691 14 43. not a posi.  I'm geussing 3=Olds,8.62 Dia,  
69Year, 1=Canada,  43/14=  3.08ratio?????
Kerry



Hi Kerry,
       Not wanting to cloud the already  somewhat murky waters surrounding 
the O type rearends, I intentionally omitted  the Canadian Built rearends from 
my previous post.  It has been reported  that Canadian built Cutlasses from the 
late 60's and early 70's had Chevy  rearends in them from the factory.  This 
is what your car has, so it was  either built in Canada, or had a Canadian 
built rearend installed after the  fact.  What is the VIN on your car?  That 
would tell what the country  of manufacture is and clear up the source of the 
rearend at the same time.
        The good news about your  rearend is: parts are somewhat easier to 
find.  The bad news is: they  aren't much cheaper and now you have to contend 
with the stigma of the c clip  axle retainers.  Not knowing too much about them, 
I am unable to offer  any advice on what to buy to convert your single track 
to a posi.  
        I guess the first thing you  should do is to figure out what gear 
ratio you want to run, and then take it  from there.  The 3.08 isn't the best 
ratio in the world, yet lots of people  run it and like it.  You may be happy 
with it and if that is the case, find  a carrier that would work with it, and put 
it in or have it installed, and  you're done.  If you don't care for the 
3.08, you can try a lower gear, get  the right posi carrier for it, and have fun.  
I would recommend that you  also buy the c clip eliminator kit and have that 
installed as well for piece of  mind.  With my limited knowledge of this 
rearend, I'm not sure where the  cutoff is between the gear ratios and the posi 
carriers, so the same carrier may  work with the 3.08 and lower gears.  I know 
that Chevy offered a 3.31, but  not sure what others were offered.  I did see in 
the new Parts Catalog that  I just got that there were several gearsets 
offered for Canadian built rearends  only.  If you want those numbers, contact me 
privately and I will forward  them to you.
Steve D

- -------------------------------1096899478
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<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 10/3/04 11:37:39 AM Pacific Daylight=20
Time,&nbsp;roseellen99@sbcglobal.net writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px solid"><=
FONT=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=
=3D2>Thanks=20
  for the info Steve D.&nbsp; Pulled the cover and found a "C" clip with 12=20=
bolt=20
  ring marked 3862691 14 43. not a posi.&nbsp; I'm geussing 3=3DOlds,8.62 Di=
a,=20
  69Year, 1=3DCanada,&nbsp; 43/14=3D=20
3.08ratio?????<BR>Kerry<BR></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV>Hi Kerry,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Not wanting to cloud the already=20
somewhat murky waters surrounding the O type rearends, I intentionally omitt=
ed=20
the Canadian Built rearends from my previous post.&nbsp; It has been reporte=
d=20
that Canadian built Cutlasses from the late 60's and early 70's had Chevy=20
rearends in them from the factory.&nbsp; This is what your car has, so it wa=
s=20
either built in Canada, or had a Canadian built rearend installed after the=20
fact.&nbsp; What is the VIN on your car?&nbsp; That would tell what the coun=
try=20
of manufacture is and clear up the source of the rearend at the same time.</=
DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;The good news about you=
r=20
rearend is: parts are somewhat easier to find.&nbsp; The bad news is: they=20
aren't much cheaper and now you have to contend with the stigma of the c cli=
p=20
axle retainers.&nbsp; Not knowing too much about them,&nbsp;I am unable to o=
ffer=20
any advice on what to buy to convert your single track to a posi.&nbsp; </DI=
V>
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;I guess the first thing=
 you=20
should do is to figure out what gear ratio you want to run, and then take it=
=20
from there.&nbsp; The 3.08 isn't the best ratio in the world, yet lots of pe=
ople=20
run it and like it.&nbsp; You may be happy with it and if that is the case,=20=
find=20
a carrier that would work with it, and put it in or have it installed, and=20
you're done.&nbsp; If you don't care for the 3.08, you can try a lower gear,=
 get=20
the right posi carrier for it, and have fun.&nbsp; I would recommend that yo=
u=20
also buy the c clip eliminator kit and have that installed as well for piece=
 of=20
mind.&nbsp; With my limited knowledge of this rearend, I'm not sure where th=
e=20
cutoff is between the gear ratios and the posi carriers, so the same carrier=
 may=20
work with the 3.08 and lower gears.&nbsp; I know that Chevy offered a 3.31,=20=
but=20
not sure what others were offered.&nbsp; I did see in the new Parts Catalog=20=
that=20
I just got that there were several gearsets offered for Canadian built reare=
nds=20
only.&nbsp; If you want those numbers, contact me privately and I will forwa=
rd=20
them to you.</DIV>
<DIV>Steve D</DIV></FONT></BODY></HTML>

- -------------------------------1096899478--

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 10:28:18 -0400 
From: Tom Bejma <tomcb@prplastics.com>
Subject: RE: OCA Dispute- Settled out of court- Bob Casey comes thru

I am sure a thorough review of the judging sheet (and all of it's
inaccuracies ;-) when you receive it, can be expected in a future email,
right Chris?

Tom Bejma
Harrison Twp., MI


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christopher Witt [mailto:rocketscience442@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 10:11 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: OCA Dispute- Settled out of court- Bob Casey comes thru
> 
> 
> Bob is THE MAN
> 
> here's an excerpt from his reply to the Last Blast:
> +++++++++++++++++++
> Conclusion:
> I would call this a "comedy of errors" if it weren't for the 
> fact that the 
> owner sees nothing funny about it.
> 
> Resolution:
> Your judging sheet is indeed available as this is common 
> practice in the OCA 
> judging criteria (they are saved for one year whether they 
> are felt to be 
> bogus or not).
> 
> Your award is available and will be forwarded to you if you wish it.
> =====================
> 
> 
> I had to apologize to him of course for sending back [before 
> READING his 
> reply] a doubtful comment.
> 
> Man, it's good to see them resolve the problems they caused 
> w/o being forced 
> to in court.
> 
> Also negates the need to resort to the Nuclear Bomb that I 
> had planned.
> 
> CBWitt
> 517-449-0432
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> On the road to retirement? Check out MSN Life Events for 
> advice on how to 
> get there! http://lifeevents.msn.com/category.aspx?cid=Retirement
> 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 11:14:30 -0400
From: "Frank Siano" <fsiano@mde.state.md.us>
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile-digest V1 #5044

Hello Everyone,

My name is Frank.  I am a very long time reader of this list.  A few of
you I have dealt with
regarding parts that you were looking for.  Though this is my first
reply to the list, there
were other topics that I wanted to chime in on but did not.  First some
background.  I own six
Oldsmobiles, 2 - '68 442s (one 4spd and one auto), 1 - 77 442, 1 '01
Aurora (daily driver),
and two parts cars (a 68 2dr Supreme and a 77 Cutlass 4dr).  The '68
442 4spd was purchased
new by my Father.  I wish it was still new.  With my Dad being in the
military it was our daily
driver and it's condition reflects that.  Dragging it around the world
into different climatic
conditions and me taking it apart and putting it back together time and
time again did it no
favors.  Actually, being butchered by a body shop really did it no
favors.
It will get there one day.

So with that intro I wanted to comment on the posi rear response by
Steve D.  I would
never say that the 672 31 spline carriers came only in OAI cars.  The
68 my Dad ordered
new came with one and it is not an OAI car.  The car's specs are as
follows; 400 4bbl/M-20 4sp/
3.42:1 posi (anti spin), heavy duty cooling, manual drum brakes, power
steering, red exterior,
black interior w/bench seat, non-AC, AM radio w/rear speaker.  I am a
believer that the factory
did whatever they wanted when assembling these cars.  An example of
this is the oil fill tube on
this car.  It is the bent style AC type.  The build date for this car
was very late in model year
which may indicate why this car got this rear if they were for OAI cars
only.  This was the
rear on hand then this is what went into the car.  Same for the oil
fill tube.   This car though
was built in Linden, NJ.  This would rule out that these rears were
only use in W-30/31 cars.
What would this rear be doing in Linden when all W-30/31 cars were
built in Lansing??

My other 68 specs as follows; 400 4bbl/turbo 400/3.08:1 open (though
currently sporting
a 3.73:1 C-type posi from a 69 442), non-AC, power drum brakes, power
steering, saffron
exterior w/black vinyl top, black interior w/buckets and console, rear
window defogger.  When I
purchased this car it came with 69 knobs/switch assemblies for the
lights/wipers/lighter and the
fake wood across the bottom of the dash.  I find it hard to believe
that someone would go through
the trouble of replacing the knob/switch assemblies and adding the wood
grain.....  Maybe or was
it the factory????  So far I have not been able to track down all of
the previous owners to find out.
Sorry, I do not remember the build date off hand.  This car was built
in Lansing.

I just remembered a couple of other topics I was going to chime in on. 
First, the dual painted
stripes on the metal part of the dash.  Both cars have them.  Actually,
all 68 442s that I have
seen have had them.  OAI or not.  Second, four speed shifter handles. 
My 68 has engraved on
it "442 H".  I have a 69 442 shifter assembly that came out of a
bucket/console car.  Also
engraved the same way.  Both handles are bent the same even though one
came in a bench
seat car and the other a bucket/console car.  The 69 shifter does have
the reverse lockout
mechanism for key removal.

A anti rear side story.  A few years ago I picked up a spare 672 31
spline carrier, complete with
side/pinon gears, clutches, everything.  The side gears are hard to
find and what I was looking for.
Price - $75 and A-body rear sway bar from a 68. Not a bad deal!! 
Speaking of parts, anyone
looking for something hit me off list.  I have to get rid of some Olds
and Buick stuff.  Will put a
list together and post.

Anyway, great list, info, and people.  Sorry for the long intro/post
and I will try to participate
more often.

on digest mode

Frank Siano
fsiano@mde.state.md.us  


  

Date: Sun, 3 Oct 2004 11:52:50 EDT
From: NUOLDSMAN@aol.com 
Subject: Re: 67-70 Olds type O Rearend Facts (Long)

Kerry, Rodney, Listers,
        The Olds 12 bolt O type  rearend (12 bolt cover, 10 bolt ring
gear) 
is probably the least understood  and most maligned component on the
cars of 
that era.  Only available from  1967 until 1970, so there isn't a
surplus of 
surviving cars, or rearends, to  salvage parts from.  Also adding to
the 
confusion is the fact that there  are four different posi carriers to
choose from, and 
one of those isn't  used for the most desirable gear ratios, which are
from 
3.23 and up.  To  further complicate things, different splined axles
also come 
into play.   Oldsmobile engineers added heavy duty axles to late model
year 67 
and 68 O  type rearends with the OAI option, and the number of splines
that 
meshed  with the posi carrier was increased to 31, instead of the usual
28.
        The following list was provided  to me by Brian Trick from
Erie, PA 
and from Kenneth Schoepen from our  List.  It shows the various posi
carriers' 
casting numbers as well as the  axle splines used for each:
 
#673 = 2:56 & 2:78 ratios, 28 spline 
#671 = 3:08 & 3:23 ratios,  28 spline 
#588 = 3:42 & anything numerically higher, 28 spline 
 
And the oddball: 
#672 = 3:42 & anything numerically higher, 31  spline 
***The 31 spline axles were offered in late 67-68 OAI cars
only..........

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #5045
*********************************
