To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #692


oldsmobile-digest           Sunday, 25 May 1997        Volume 01 : Number 692

Re: speedo cable lube
Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam
Re: block identity?
Re: Olds for sale -- Travis???
Re:Yellow_interior
Re: block identity?
Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam
Re: Piston Bore Data (ATTN: D. Brown)
Rear-end Change?
Re: Rear-end Change?
350 Buildup?
Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?
Re: Vac. hook-ups, ect.
Re: Vac. hook-ups, ect.
Re: Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?
Dallas Car Shows/Aurora Parts
oldsmobile
Re: Cam walking
Re: Hedders/442
Re: Hedders/442
Re: Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?
Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam
66 rear end swappability
Door hinge swapping
Re: block identity?
Re: Olds for sale -- Travis???
Re: Hedders/442
RE: 69 W-32
Re: 350 Buildup?
Mondello sucks
Warhoops Junkyard -  Detroit Area
Re: Rocket (air/cleaner)
RE: 69 W-32
Re: 66 rear end swappability
Re: 350 Buildup?
[none]
DMR and Mondello for Olds parts [was Re: Mondello s*cks]
Re: Warhoops Junkyard -  Detroit Area
Re: Mondello sucks
Re '67 442's
Re: Mondello sucks  (?)
"A" 425ci blocks [was 307 roller cam]
Original Parts Group

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 02:50:35 -0300
Subject: Re: speedo cable lube

At 01:17 AM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Uh, what's the difference between a speedo cable and a cruise control speedo
>cable?

A speedometer cable goes from something (wheel hub, transmission, cruise
control box) to the speedometer.

A cruise control cable goes from something (wheel hub or transmission) to
the cruise control box.

But I'm just guessing on this one...
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 02:50:32 -0300
Subject: Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam

At 12:18 AM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>The 1965 425 (why not call it an..) "A" block  (per stamping on front ledge)
>is configured such that a 45 degree valve angle results. "A" heads were
>designed for this configuration (giving credence to my observations of no
>post-'65 motors with "A" heads).
>
>Now, consider upgrading to "C" heads. There may (according to Mr. Barry) be
>some difficulty with pushrod "interference". I will take interference to mean
>conflict of intended pushrod diameter or misalignment of rod holes/guides.
>Whatever. Will the resultant valve angle of "C" heads (if properly installed)
>result in a different geometry in the pushrod/rocker arm/valve which should
>be accounted for?

As long as you use the pushrods for a 45' motor, there should be no problem
with geometry; the position and dimensions of the rockers will be the same
for 45' and 39' motors (though the rockers on your '65 would be the
one-year-only design.

>If possible conflicts involve pushrod diameter, which years of blocks or
>cylinder head letters saw any new pushrod diameter?

It's not the pushrod diameter, but the angle that the pushrod enters the
head. There should be something in the archives from Chris Witt on this point.

Unless you're rolling in dough, though, your "A" heads would be a good
choice as a basis for a performance motor.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 02:53:39 -0300
Subject: Re: block identity?

At 01:41 AM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Karl Aune
>1965 Dynamic 88
>Chicago IL

Karl,

Is this your street address?

;)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 04:08:45 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds for sale -- Travis???

At 10:26 PM 5/23/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Hey everyone,
>The following ad in this mornings paper.
>
>1)  1972 Olds 442  completely original, excl cond, $5000     obo
>(406) 278-5436
>
  Hey, that's a MT phone number!  Where's it at???!!!???

Dustin would probably be interested (I am too short of $$$$ myself...)


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: "Dal Allan" <dal_allan@mcimail.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 04:04:13 -0300
Subject: Re:Yellow_interior

The yellow interior subject comes up every few months, and it is back with
us again. This may be the only color which is not available in reproduction
from any vendor. About half the saffron cars I've seen used to have saffron
interiors but the owners used black when they couldn't locate replacements.

That is supposed to be a Saffron/Saffron 442 in the 1967 brochure but the
color match is awful. If the saffron finish has a high gloss and depth in
the paint it looks great but if it has oxidized and been let go, it looks
lousy. The 442 came with white or red pin striping along the top of the
front fender; the white is practically invisible, red looks good.

The saffron interior was a 1-year thing. I've read that this was because
Cadillac management became upset and claimed yellow interiors were exclusive
to their division. Yellow was popular in Cadillacs for many years, and may
even still be available.

You could buy a 1967 Olds convertible in all-Saffron, but I haven't seen a
yellow top in over 20 years. The previous owner of our car began searching
in the early 80s to find fabric for the top before he gave up and had it
done in light ochre.

The yellow interior came with one of two dash/steering wheel/carpet colors.
One was black and the other was a khaki brown color. Black is a lot easier
to live with,I've never been able to locate a carpet to match the door kick
panels and the other khaki finished parts.

An all-Saffron car attracts girls of every age, from 15-50. I've owned a lot
of cars in various colors but nothing has been more of a magnet than this
one. I don't think I've ever filled the gas tank without having a pretty
girl come over and strike up a conversation, even when my wife is sitting in
passenger seat. They ignore her, and the prettier they are the madder my
wife is when we drive off.

To the other email on Original interior colors, many companies advertise
this but to be certain you need NOS fabric. If you have an original interior
that needs only a seat bottom or front buckets you will discover coloring
differences which are not age-related. For NOS material, I can recommend:

          SMS AUTO FABRIC          503-234-1175
          2325 SE 10th Ave         503-234-0651Fx
          Portland OR 92714

Saffron fabric is not a plain yellow, it has an opalescent kind of finish to
it which gives the interior a glow. The front buckets were done on my 67
with original material from SMS, and fading by the sun was obvious on the
panels. The rear seat was perfect, no color fade at all so did not need
redoing. Door vinyl is thinner and more susceptible to changing color. Vinyl
dye was used to match the door panels to the original color using light
yellow which was finished off with a light pearl dusting over it.

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 05:17:46 -0300
Subject: Re: block identity?

In a message dated 97-05-24 02:03:24 EDT, you write:

> t 01:41 AM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>  >Karl Aune
>  >1965 Dynamic 88
>  >Chicago IL
>
>  Karl,
>
>  Is this your street address?
>  ;)

well no,

snail mail can reach Me at

Karl Aune
1976 Cutlass S
Chicago, IL

(that is my father's Oldsmobile)

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 05:32:57 -0300
Subject: Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam

In a message dated 97-05-24 01:57:33 EDT, you write:

>
>  It's not the pushrod diameter, but the angle that the pushrod enters the
>  head. There should be something in the archives from Chris Witt on this
> point.
>
>  Unless you're rolling in dough, though, your "A" heads would be a good
>  choice as a basis for a performance motor.
>  _______________________________________________________
>
So, if I am understanding you correctly; the (again, let us call the 1965
parts..) "A" cylinder heads mount to the "A" block at a specific angle (lets
call this angle "theta" just for argument) {note to eveyone else; we are not
talking about a specific angle here} theta. What you are saying is that "B"
through (heaven forfend) "J" cylinder heads might be designed to mount to the
block at some discreet angle "epsilon" and therefore cause problems. Such
problems may manifest themselves as valve seals that cannot completely seal.
Or possibly that the intended pushrod "approach" angle for those cylincer
heads might not in fact result from the installation of them onto the 1965
425 cid block. Am I close?

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Somewhere USA
Magellanic Cloud,  Alpha sector

Everytime I Get away they Reel me back in!?

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 05:46:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Piston Bore Data (ATTN: D. Brown)

In a message dated 97-05-24 01:42:29 EDT, you write:

> Compression height is the distance from the center of the piston pin bore
to
>  the top of the piston. You could physically interchange the 425 and 455
>  pistons, but you'd either wind up with the piston too far down in the bore
>  (hence lousy compression), or sticking out of the cylinder bore (goodbye
"A"
>  heads!) at the top of the stroke.
>
>  Compression height has nothing to do with displacement, but everything to
do
>  with, you guessed it, compression.
>  _______________________________________________________
>

Alright! And thanks! I am sure that the FAQ can only improve from this
information. According to the Mondello catalogue, the "A" heads are in fact
82 ci total. That makes them, as far as I can see, among the others for
largest volume of cylinder head. My point is this;  Since "A"'s are almost if
not as big as they come, then the previous belief is a fallacy. The 425ci
differs from the 455ci by crankshaft, piston rods, and pistons. That is to
say, if I understand Mr. Barry (sorry, I love using the 4th person when
referring to my friends, it's soooo annoying) correctly. I was having a hard
time visualizing a different stroke with only different crank and rods.


Edward G. Robinson  (i just saw him in soylent green)?

------------------------------

From: Pat McDermott <kor@thepoint.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 05:56:16 -0300
Subject: Rear-end Change?

Actually I have few questions. I have a 2.56 rear-end now. I've got a
friend who just replaced his 3.08. He'll sell me the axle and all for
$150. 1)Is that a good price? 2)whould this change make a big difference
in preformance?

Thanks
Pat McDermott
69 Cutlass 'S'

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 06:19:04 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end Change?

Yes. It will make a difference.

ª1 you will have greater acceleration if you can get your tires to adhere to
the road.

ª2 your top speed will be diminished and you will see a slight decline in MPG
rating ( if you keep track of that sort of thing)

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chicago, IL

"The fault, dear Brutus, is in our stars, not in our Oldsmobiles"

------------------------------

From: Thomas Martin <marttj@pcmail1.css.mot.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 07:22:56 -0300
Subject: 350 Buildup?

Did anyone respond to the question about a good street 350 buildup?  I
am interested in doing one so if someone could email me what it was or
someone email me a good combination that works, I would apprecitate it.

I am looking at 3.08 gears, 3500 lbs weight, THM 350 or THM 200 4R, (OD
may get 3.42's-3.73's).  What I want is street power, not something up
at insane RPM that small block Ch@vy's have to run to make power,
something in the Olds territory.

What cam profiles do Olds engines like, what are the best heads to run
that can be actually found, not rare W3X castings.  Something that
anyone can build.

Is there any block/head improvements that Olds engines like?  What RPM
is a safe Redline for an Olds 350?   Is the Diesel block worth the
weight for a street car?

Thanks
Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme 307

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 07:43:02 -0300
Subject: Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?

I'm looking for a car to drive on a regular basis now that I only have one
play car (the '68) and in my searching I encountered the following car: an
'83 Hurst, one owner, 116,000 kms (about 70K miles), original paint (owner
says it needs refreshing though), said to be otherwise mint, no mechanical
problems to speak of, loaded with everything. Owner is asking $5K Cdn
(about $3700 US). I haven't seen the car yet, so I can't say whether the
description is true (it's about an hour away from here).

Assuming the description is accurate, that sounds like not a bad deal. Am
I wrong? Discussion here a while back over the '83 H/O stripes/decals
being made from unobtainium would concern me, though. Just what I need,
another car I don't want to drive in bad weather... ;-)

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: katana72@juno.com (Rob T)
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 09:52:23 -0300
Subject: Re: Vac. hook-ups, ect.

On Fri, 23 May 1997 08:29:22 -0300 "Luke Hogan" <hogan442@c-gate.net>
writes:
>       Hi guys,
I

>have a few problems i need h*lp with, there are
>two small vacuum hoses coming from inside my car thruogh the firewall,
>one
>goes to th vac. canister on the firewall, the other who knows?  The
>other
>prob. is what fac. color is the timing chain & water pump supposed to
>be
>for 1970 Olds 442 455 is it blue like the rest of the motor?  Thanks
>in
>advance to all.  Luke
>
The vacuum lines through the firewall go to the heater/air conditioner
controls. one is for the temperature select and the other controls where
the air blows out . one should be connected to the block somewhere and
the other to the canister and the are routed to the heater controls. The
one connected to the block may be connected to the heater valve on the
block. I can't remember off the top of my head.

Katana72

------------------------------

From: katana72@juno.com (Rob T)
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 09:52:23 -0300
Subject: Re: Vac. hook-ups, ect.

On Fri, 23 May 1997 08:29:22 -0300 "Luke Hogan" <hogan442@c-gate.net>
writes:
>       Hi guys,
I

>have a few problems i need h*lp with, there are
>two small vacuum hoses coming from inside my car thruogh the firewall,
>one
>goes to th vac. canister on the firewall, the other who knows?  The
>other
>prob. is what fac. color is the timing chain & water pump supposed to
>be
>for 1970 Olds 442 455 is it blue like the rest of the motor?  Thanks
>in
>advance to all.  Luke
>
The vacuum lines through the firewall go to the heater/air conditioner
controls. one is for the temperature select and the other controls where
the air blows out . one should be connected to the block somewhere and
the other to the canister and the are routed to the heater controls. The
one connected to the block may be connected to the heater valve on the
block. I can't remember off the top of my head.

Katana72

------------------------------

From: MROTHE <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 13:03:39 -0300
Subject: Re: Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?

Owner is asking $5K Cdn
> (about $3700 US).
> Assuming the description is accurate, that sounds like not a bad deal. Am
> I wrong? Discussion here a while back over the '83 H/O stripes/decals
> being made from unobtainium would concern me, though.

> Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia,
Canada


Greg, there is valid concern about the price of the stripes (You can get
them from A Little Different, Stencils and Stripes, and probably Mark
Cornea).  But, to buy a car that is $3700 U.S. that is considered by
most to be the premium '83 Olds performance example, and somewhat rare
nowadays, the money you save in the purchase could more than make up for
the expense of a few hundred dollars in stripes.   I say go for it, if
the car is otherwise clean and original.  New paint and stripes would be
the least of my concerns, but that is my personal preference.

It all boils down to whether you would want to invest in it as a driver
or not.  You could buy it, and if you wanted to fully restore it, start
building an inventory of parts, and drive it in the meantime.  Then
again, if you didn't want to restore it, then don't.

As far as the stripes, for example, you can still get 85-87 442 stripes
on a limited basis (BLACK is the only full sets I think) from GM.  I
paid a little over $400 with my discount for the complete set stem to
stern.  Everyone else wanted $575 or more.  So, no matter who had the
stripes, you are going to pay $$$$ for them anyway.

Either way, just grab one of those lightning shifters, and hang on......

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

From: ngomez@airmail.net (Nick Gomez)
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 13:00:12 -0300
Subject: Dallas Car Shows/Aurora Parts

There are several car shows in Dallas soon, this weekend (May 23,24,25)
there is a show at Southfork Ranch. I forget the sponsors. There is also a
show tomorrow (May 25) at Texas Stadium, I don't know if it is happening on
Saturday or not.

I went to Keller's Drive-In last Saturday night and saw two cool Cutlass'.
A red convertible, a 1966 or 1967, before the split grill. Also a blue
hardtop, a 1968 or 1969. There was also a mid-1970s Delta 88, sounded
healthy. It was a four door (yeah!), and the owner had painted '455 SS' on
his rear fenders.

At the drive in, I talked to a gentleman who told me about the North Texas
Olds Club. They are having a show on May 31 @ the Sheraton Grand. Some
Buick and Pontiac people are joining in. It's only $15 to show your car,
and it won't be judged. If anyone wants some more info, let me know. I plan
to go.

My summer job has me working at an auto auction house, it's just perfect
for me. I drive to dealerships, and the other day I went to Sewell Olds.
While waiting to be picked up, I was admiring the Aurora. I would very much
like to find a wrecked one, or order some parts off of it. The dual exhaust
tips would be great, I'd like to chrome them and put them on my car. They
have nice chrome wheels, they wouldn't look good on my car though.

I've driven plenty of cars at work, everything from Corvettes to big diesel
Ford F350 dualies. However, I've never driven an Olds! I would love to
drive an Aurora or even a newer Cutlass. One day, I suppose. Well, take
care, keep in touch!
Nick

------------------------------

From: Howard Owen <rocket88@pacbell.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 15:26:04 -0300
Subject: oldsmobile

unsubscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

From: Brad Bowles <wolds@napanet.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 15:53:15 -0300
Subject: Re: Cam walking

Mullen, R. Scott wrote:
>
> Brad wrote:
> >When I had my  '71 455 (.060"= 468) rebuilt, the builder said not to use
> >a cam button.  he said that when using hydraulic lifters, it is not
> >necessary because "it pulls the cam into the correct place, eliminating
> >the use of a cam button."  He also said that using a cam button can
> >prematurely wear out the cam and cause severe damage, some of which I
> >have heard of on this server.
>
> Brad,
> I'm a bit confused as to how the use of hydraulic lifters "pulls" the
> cam anywhere.  Excessive cam end play causes erratic timing and
> causes/is caused by (in a self reinforcing loop)timing chain stretch.
> Using a cam button for 30K miles on my cam has certainly not caused any
> damage and in fact stabilized my timing at high rpm range.  I can't
> think of any reason why a device that eliminates cam end play would
> cause premature wear on the cam.  Even the timing cover on my car shows
> no effect from the cam button, since the bronze button is the
> sacrificial (softer) component.  Anybody out there whose cam was
> damaged/worn out by a properly installed button?
>
> Luke, in answer to your original question, Mondello makes a bronze
> spacer that installs behind the cam gear (between the gear and the
> block) for use in setting up your cam properly.  I've used this spacer
> and his bronze button with good success.
> Scott Mullen

Scott,
This is what I was told by the engine builders.  I don't know exactally
how it works, but it does.  It now sounds like you are safe either way.
Brad

------------------------------

From: Brad Bowles <wolds@napanet.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 16:01:08 -0300
Subject: Re: Hedders/442

Richard wrote:
>
> Hello all:
>
> My dilemma....I gotta '69 442 w/455 it has hedders on it now, their
> rusted and they leak(big suprize).  Clearance is very tight..I need to
> relocate brake distribution valve....and right control arm has maybe 3/8
> of a inch of clearance. (I finally had car aligned after completely
> rebuilding the suspension.)
>
> I've been considering two options:
> 1.  Replace with stock exhaust manifolds (safe way)
> 2.  Replace with Hooker ceramic coated hedders (:) performance!
>
> I am seeking advice here.   I know each has good and bad points, but I
> would appreciate some constructive critisim.
>
> Too be Hedder, or not to be Hedder?  That is the Question!
>
> Thanks all,
> Richard Fuqua
> '69/442

Richard,
I recently installed headers on my 70 442 w/455.  They are Doug
Thorolys.  They squeeze the starter, required brake proportioning valve
movement, and touch the firewall.  Other than that they fit. To fix
these problems...
1. Wrap the starter motor in a heat shield and add a heat shield to the
solonoid.
2. Move the brake proportioning valve
3. take a prybar to the fire wall
No Problem!

Doug Thoroleys come chrome coated to prevent rust too!
Brad
'70 442

------------------------------

From: "Luke Hogan" <hogan442@c-gate.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 06:36:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Hedders/442

- ----------
> Richard wrote:
> >
> > Hello all:
> >
> > My dilemma....I gotta '69 442 w/455 it has hedders on it now, their
> > rusted and they leak(big suprize).  Clearance is very tight..I need to
> > relocate brake distribution valve....and right control arm has maybe 3/8
> > of a inch of clearance. (I finally had car aligned after completely
> > rebuilding the suspension.)
> >
> > I've been considering two options:
> > 1.  Replace with stock exhaust manifolds (safe way)
> > 2.  Replace with Hooker ceramic coated hedders (:) performance!
> >
> > I am seeking advice here.   I know each has good and bad points, but I
> > would appreciate some constructive critisim.
> >
> > Too be Hedder, or not to be Hedder?  That is the Question!
> >
> > Thanks all,
> > Richard Fuqua
> > '69/442
>
> Richard,
> I recently installed headers on my 70 442 w/455.  They are Doug
> Thorolys.  They squeeze the starter, required brake proportioning valve
> movement, and touch the firewall.  Other than that they fit. To fix
> these problems...
> 1. Wrap the starter motor in a heat shield and add a heat shield to the
> solonoid.
> 2. Move the brake proportioning valve
> 3. take a prybar to the fire wall
> No Problem!
>
> Doug Thoroleys come chrome coated to prevent rust too!
> Brad
> '70 442

 Richard i put Hooker super comp. ptª3202 on my 70 442 . The only problem i
had was the  steering  shaft was        rubbing against one pipe that was
notched from hooker for that reason, so all that i did was take a socket
that was a little bigger in dia. & inlarged the notch a bit. I  wonted  the
ceramic coated ones but i'am kind-of glad they didn't have them in stock ,
just for that reason only.  I thought about sending mine of to have them
finished by Jet-Hot , has anybody out there had this done if so what
kind-of luck?  Richard i hope this helped. Luke

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 17:22:07 -0300
Subject: Re: Value of an '83 Hurst/Olds?

At 07:43 AM 5/24/97 -0300, you wrote:
>
>I'm looking for a car to drive on a regular basis now that I only have one
>play car (the '68) and in my searching I encountered the following car: an
>'83 Hurst, one owner, 116,000 kms (about 70K miles), original paint (owner
>says it needs refreshing though), said to be otherwise mint, no mechanical
>problems to speak of, loaded with everything. Owner is asking $5K Cdn
>(about $3700 US). I haven't seen the car yet, so I can't say whether the
>description is true (it's about an hour away from here).
>
>Assuming the description is accurate, that sounds like not a bad deal. Am
>I wrong? Discussion here a while back over the '83 H/O stripes/decals
>being made from unobtainium would concern me, though. Just what I need,
>another car I don't want to drive in bad weather... ;-)

Is it owned by a rock star?  Just curious ;)  To me, that sounds like a
pretty decent price, providing it's the fully loaded one (T-Tops, spoiler,
scoop, lightning rods...)  It seems to me some of those were optional on the
Hursts.  Not sure.  As for the stripes, even if they are no longer
available, you should be able to get a ~good~ bodyshop to match them.  They
can do stencils for the lettering, and mask and shoot for the striping tape.
If you ~really~ want it to look original, you can even have them skip the
clearcoat-colorsand-clearcoat-colorsand-etc-etc-etc procedures, so that you
actually feel the bump from the paint lines...  That will give it the look
~and feel~ of striping tape :)  I'd go for it.  If nothing else, you can
trade it to some rock star for an older 442 Convertible someday :)


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 17:37:34 -0300
Subject: Re: 45 degree 425ci block, was 307's Roller Cam

>So, if I am understanding you correctly; the (again, let us call the 1965
>parts..) "A" cylinder heads mount to the "A" block at a specific angle (lets
>call this angle "theta" just for argument) {note to eveyone else; we are not
>talking about a specific angle here} theta. What you are saying is that "B"
>through (heaven forfend) "J" cylinder heads might be designed to mount to the
>block at some discreet angle "epsilon" and therefore cause problems. Such
>problems may manifest themselves as valve seals that cannot completely seal.
>Or possibly that the intended pushrod "approach" angle for those cylincer
>heads might not in fact result from the installation of them onto the 1965
>425 cid block. Am I close?


Actually, I ~think~ the situation is that all of the heads will interchange,
and the blocks are externally the same, i.e. the angle at which the A head
mounts on the block (which I'll call "angle" for lack of Latin desire:) is
the same angle as the other heads (to which I'll also refer to as "angle")
The difference (as far as I can deduce) is in the camshaft itself.  I guess,
blockwise, the cam sits higher in the lifter valley on the 45' engines.
(i.e. the timing chain is longer, I guess.)  I guess this would lead to
shorter pushrods, too.  (Perhaps the change was brought about by the Toro's
lower hoodline, and sunken intake???)  I think the mods required in the head
swaps would be to make sure the pushrods don't rub on the edges of the holes
in the head  (Since the cam is higher, the pushrods sit in the engine at a
different angle, as well.  The hole they go through is essentially a tube,
so there's an invitation for interference there)  As far as actual valve
operation, it'll be normal.  They should seat normally, etc.  Unless you run
pushrods that are too long, and end up shoving a valve into a piston...  The
other concern would be running quality.  With the wrong cam in there (as was
discussed earlier on with a different thread) you'll have one side of the
engine running normally, and the other side running 6' advanced or retarded.
In other words, there would be ~no~ running quality :)  At least that's my
understanding of the bank-angle situation, which I'll casually refer to as
Delta, now, since that's one word we all can associate with readily :)


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Christian Fair <cfair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 18:36:47 -0300
Subject: 66 rear end swappability

Will the rear end in a 66 Jetstar handle the torque of a big block?

Found a Jetstar in the boneyard today and was wonder what, if any,
of it's rearend parts would work well in my 98 conv.

thanks
cf

------------------------------

From: Christian Fair <cfair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 18:38:33 -0300
Subject: Door hinge swapping

Do any of you know if the door hinges on a 66 4 door 98 or 66 4 door
Jetstar will work well in my 66 98 two door convertible?

I'm going back tomorrow to pick these cars clean and don't know if I should
pull these parts.


TIA

cf

------------------------------

From: Travis Adams <cashmore@imt.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 22:05:04 -0300
Subject: Re: block identity?

KarlAunan@aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 97-05-23 22:06:47 EDT, you write:
>
> >
> >  Hi Buddy! What you have is a 66 425, There will be an O in the VIN
> >  Engine code according to my records.  I have the same type of engine
> >  as you do! :) It works great and it should have a nice crank in it!
> >  Also, no it is not the oddballs lifter and Cam Bank angle! An
> >  edelbrock Part ª2152 Cam works excellent with a "Healthy but not to
> >  radical" Idle! I've done my 425 up nicely and it works great! Happy
> >  motoring!
> >
> >  _
>
> Whoa!
>
> Not to jump on any body, mind you.
>
> 386525A
>
> Here is what the numbers mean:
>
> 38  (honestly, I don't know)
>
> 65        1965
>
> 25         425cid
>
> A       this means you have the "oddball" cam angle (alternately called
valve > angle) of >        45 degrees which was only manifest in the 425's of
1965. As for "A", I > do not know what it meant originally. Nowadays it is
merely a good way to > correlate your block with your cylinder heads. I am
positive that your > cylinder heads are stamped with a capital "A" (which was
only the case in > 1965 so far as I can tell) and have the nearby number
383821 which also was > only present for 1965. The Cylinder head on the
driver's side should have the > "A" obscured by the power steering unit and
bracket (I did not find mine > until I had to nearly remove the bracket to
change the V-belt). However, on > most years of big block cylinder heads, the
letter is located at the leftmost > edge of the cylnder head. This means that
you may be able to see an A near > the firewall on the passenger's side if
there are no substantial obstructions > like A/C unit. > > Also, since you
obviously have a 1965 car, you will have one of several > variations of the
TH400 transmission, depending on engine configuration. The > only way to tell
is to get down there and clear the gunk off the tag on the > passenger's side
of the transmission (only just above the trans pan and at > approx. midway
down the transmission's entire length) > > Again, mechwar dude. I don't mean
to harsh on anyone, but you really have to > be careful distinguishing between
45 degree and 39 degree blocks. > > BTW could you mention the specs of the
Edelbrock part ª 2152 cam so I might > compare it with stock specs? > >
Thanks in advance. > > Karl Aune > 1965 Dynamic 88 > Chicago IL > > Eagles'
Generation Riots? Karl, The car is a 65 442.  This is not the original engine
though.  It also has "D" cast heads off a 68 H/O.  Do the 45 degree blocks
work with heads from the 39 degree block?  I couldn't see how and that is why
I wasn't sure.  What about the lifter size?

Thanks,

Travis

------------------------------

From: Travis Adams <cashmore@imt.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 22:08:31 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds for sale -- Travis???

Charley Buehner wrote:
>
> At 10:26 PM 5/23/97 -0300, you wrote:
> >Hey everyone,
> >       The following ad in this mornings paper.
> >
> >               1)  1972 Olds 442  completely original, excl cond, $5000
obo > >(406) 278-5436 > > >   Hey, that's a MT phone number!  Where's it
at???!!!??? > > Dustin would probably be interested (I am too short of $$$$
myself...) > > >              Charley Buehner       |
mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu >              500 4th Ave.          |
mailto:charley@rocketship.com >              Box 1255              | Montana
State University-Northern >              Havre, Montana 59501  |
http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner >              "Rockit 1"            | '81
Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~ >              "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS
455 >              "FAST FWD" (Soon)     | '67 Toronado 425 >
Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties! Charley,

Not sure where it is but the ad was in the Billings Gazette.

Travis

------------------------------

From: hhzimmerman <hhzimmerman@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 21:25:05 -0300
Subject: Re: Hedders/442

Brad Bowles wrote:

>         I recently installed headers on my 70 442 w/455.  They are Doug
> Thorolys.  They squeeze the starter, required brake proportioning valve
> movement, and touch the firewall.  Other than that they fit. To fix
> these problems...
> 1. Wrap the starter motor in a heat shield and add a heat shield to the
> solonoid.
> 2. Move the brake proportioning valve
> 3. take a prybar to the fire wall
> No Problem!
>
> Doug Thoroleys come chrome coated to prevent rust too!
> Brad
> '70 442


Where did you get them?  How much do they cost?  And do you know if they
have a set to fit a 455 into a '71 cutlass convertable?

thanks,
greg

------------------------------

From: "Karl Morra" <442KARL@msn.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 21:28:25 -0300
Subject: RE: 69 W-32

Do you have any info on the cam shaft in a w-32 such as specs, part numbers,
or is it the same as an automatic 442 or w-31?  Also is there anything else
unique to a w-32?  Does the w-32 have pinstripes or wide stripes on the hood?
 I am also interested in ram air parts or where I can buy them.

Thanks,

Karl Morra

------------------------------

From: hhzimmerman <hhzimmerman@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 21:39:58 -0300
Subject: Re: 350 Buildup?

Thomas Martin wrote:
>
> Did anyone respond to the question about a good street 350 buildup?  I
> am interested in doing one so if someone could email me what it was or
> someone email me a good combination that works, I would apprecitate it.
>
> I am looking at 3.08 gears, 3500 lbs weight, THM 350 or THM 200 4R, (OD
> may get 3.42's-3.73's).  What I want is street power, not something up
> at insane RPM that small block Ch@vy's have to run to make power,
> something in the Olds territory.
>
> What cam profiles do Olds engines like, what are the best heads to run
> that can be actually found, not rare W3X castings.  Something that
> anyone can build.
>
> Is there any block/head improvements that Olds engines like?  What RPM
> is a safe Redline for an Olds 350?   Is the Diesel block worth the
> weight for a street car?
>
> Thanks
> Thomas Martin
> 85 Cutlass Supreme 307


I built my '71 350 five years and 35,000 miles ago.  I did a .030 over with
TRW forged pistons, moly rings, and had the assembly balanced.  I also used
ARP rod bolts (recommended by a lot of people).  I bought main studs and
windage tray from Mondello, but the machine shop already had the short block
put together by the time I got the parts, so I returned them.  The heads got
stainless valves and a 3 angle valve job.  I used a Crane 260/272 cam (mild
for the street), crane springs, comp. cams roller rocker kit, Edelbrock
Performer intake, carb (600), and timing chain.  High volume oil pump.
Mallory Unilite distributor, MSD-6al box, and a K&N air filter.  Oh- yeah,
blackjack aluminized headers and 2 1/4" dual exaust with a balance tube and
Walker dynomax mufflers.  I drive it every day and worked great.

With my '71 cutlass and 3.08 gears, mild torque converter on a TH-350 tranny,
I ran 14.5 in the quarter mile through the mufflers without any tuning to the
engine.  I'm sure it would go a lot faster with jetting and timing changes.

On a side note, I blew a hole through the piston while topping out the car
(128mph).  Upon teardown, both rings on the number 8 piston had the gaps
lined up in a row at the bottom of the piston!  Seems like blowby erroded the
piston over time and the extra strain melted the piston.  Make sure you put
the rings in right!

I'm building the motor again, I just had to get a new piston and slighty hone
the bore out to get the scratches out.  the rest of the motor looks great. I
did get a carbide porting kit from Summit racing and a die grinder.
Yesterday I portmatched the intake manifold and heads.  I also grinded out the
A.I.r. bump in the exaust port of the heads.  the FAQ says that it results in
a 30% increase in flow.  I'll post my results next week when the motor is
back together.

if you have any questions, email me,

greg

------------------------------

From: Hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 22:18:44 -0300
Subject: Mondello sucks

Ever hear of Dicks racing? they're saying is "Mondello sells parts, we
sell horsepower."
We've talked to Joe on the phone and he is a complete prick who thinks
he knows everything, his son is pretty cool though.  We'd like to get
the V/O twister back on the road and blow Joe's Twister II clean off the
track.  That would piss him off, getting beat by his old car.
Marty
68 442

------------------------------

From: lawrencr@kostabi (Robert Lawrence)
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 22:46:09 -0300
Subject: Warhoops Junkyard -  Detroit Area

I spent a couple hours at Warhoops junkyard, at 18 1/2 Mile
between Mound and Van Dyke in Sterling Heights, MI.

They have a number of older Oldsmobiles (60's & 70's), some older
ones, and some newer ones, also.  Next time, I go, hopefully,
next Saturday, I'll take notes on what's there, and post'em  I only saw
one 60-70's Cutlass.  It was a 72 CS, with 7a heads.  It did
have four SSxxx wheels (medium blue).  They don't let you pull
parts yourself.  They wanted $150 for the wheels.  One wheel
looked in pretty good shape, one was peeling, and the other
two had the center hubs pretty fogged up.

Most of the older Old's were in pretty rough shape.

Is this a good deal?  Will they fit my 70 98?  I didn't
think to check the tires to see if they were 14 or 15 inch radius.
If anyone else is interested, and I don't use'em, let me
know, and I'll try to help you out.

I was looking at heads just for grins.  I saw a couple of C's
an E, a G, and a 3.  They want $65 a head.  They pull.  Is this a good
deal?

I spent the rest of the day playing with my car.  Right now the
back seat is out, and the dashboard is all apart.  I fogged my
clock with WD 40.  We'll see if it starts to work.

I'm attempting to put a new stereo in the car.  It has space for a
4 x 10 in the middle of the dash.  A space for a 6 x 9 in the
middle of the back seat.  I don't want to cut anything for the
speakers or the stereo.  Anybody have this same set up and find
a combination that works?  I'm not holding my breath.

Anybody know what Wesley's Bleach-White will do to vinyl seats?

It's the end of May, and my schedule and the weather have finally
cooperated enough to let me spend some quality time with my car!

I need to get back to Florida.

-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Robert Lawrence   | 1970 Oldsmobile 98 Convertible               .^.
lawrencr@gdls.com |  _________,~--,___________\____________     /9|8\ (810)
825-5129    |  |                |~    |        ___   |    \}|{/ Sterling Hts.,
MI |  =------(-o-)-------------------( o )--=      v

------------------------------

From: Richard Staley <rstaley@FastLane.NET>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 22:56:17 -0300
Subject: Re: Rocket (air/cleaner)

Richard Staley wrote:
>
> Mark Cornea (R) wrote:
> >
> > > >Maybe I was born stupid, then, but I thought I'd heard somewhere that
> > > >there really was a Rocket engine, per se, that was different.  If not,
> > > >someone clear me up so I don't go around being ignorant anymore!!!
> > > >
> > >  I thought so too. The air cleaner on my 80 and 75 Olds say "Oldsmobile
350" > > > while the air cleaner emblem on a 72 I have at the yard says
"Oldsmobile > > > Rocket 350"...hmmmm > > > >         The word "Rocket" on the
air/cleaner decals was dropped in 1973, except > > for, (and I'm 99% sure) the
'73, '74 and '75 H/O's were the ONLY ones that said > > "Rocket" on them. > >
___  ___ > >                                               /     /    / /  / >
>                                              / __  /  --/ /  / > >
Mark Cornea (Dr Decal) `70 442 stick /_/ /_/ ___/ /__/ Red > > > >
(MCORNEA@pt8244.pto.ford.com)  OCAª 4903 > >   Hey Mark, >         Does your
442 air cleaner have a 455 ROCKET decal on it? By the way did > you read that
article on how to detail a 442 air cleaner in Car Craft > mag. it was the
April '97 issue. If so, my air cleaner flap door doesn't > have a short screw
it has some weird thing in place of the screw does > yours have the weird
thing that mine has?(no I am not talking about the > hinge its the thing above
the hinge) > >           RS >         '70 442 4-speed

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:13:07 -0300
Subject: RE: 69 W-32

At 09:28 PM 5/24/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Do you have any info on the cam shaft in a w-32 such as specs, part numbers,
>or is it the same as an automatic 442 or w-31?  Also is there anything else
>unique to a w-32?  Does the w-32 have pinstripes or wide stripes on the hood?
 >I am also interested in ram air parts or where I can buy them. > >Thanks, >
>Karl Morra >

Karl

        The 69 W-32 used the same cam as the 66-69 4 spd 442 cars. The cam
part number is ª393859. I'm sorry I don't have the specs for the cam handy.
These engines were identical to the 4 spd cars. They just had the OAI added
to them. The hood was suppose to have the Y-73 Paint Stripes on the hood. I
have seen 1 documented W-32 the was black and did not have the hood stripes.
They did make a few W-32 Convertibles. A total of 297 69 W-32's were built.
25 Sport Coupes, 247 Holiday Coupes and 25 Convertibles. Hope this info helps.

Jim Chermack

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:16:41 -0300
Subject: Re: 66 rear end swappability

At 05:36 PM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Will the rear end in a 66 Jetstar handle the torque of a big block?

Is that a Jetstar 1 or a Jetstar 88? The Jetstar 1 had the Starfire
equipment, so its rear would be plenty strong (it came with the 425 and
TH400, rather than the 330/Jetaway, so check under the hood)

>Found a Jetstar in the boneyard today and was wonder what, if any,
>of it's rearend parts would work well in my 98 conv.

What's wrong with your 98's axle?
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:16:46 -0300
Subject: Re: 350 Buildup?

At 06:22 AM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Did anyone respond to the question about a good street 350 buildup?  I

Um, yeah, spent a bit of time on it too... :(  It's on the work computer, so
I can't resend it to you until Tuesday, but I'll probably forget by then.
Remind me on Tuesday, and I'll send it to you then.

>I am looking at 3.08 gears, 3500 lbs weight, THM 350 or THM 200 4R, (OD
>may get 3.42's-3.73's).

That's a good, sensible street setup.

>What cam profiles do Olds engines like, what are the best heads to run
>that can be actually found, not rare W3X castings.  Something that
>anyone can build.

They like more exhaust lift and duration than on the intake side. 2.00"
intake/1.62" exhaust are the preferred size for performance small-blocks.
Any head from the ª5's to the ª7a's (basically, from 1969-1972) will have
the smaller combustion chambers, and will give you decent compression, and
flow well too. The 7a heads from the 1972 350's have the advantage of
factory hardened exhaust seats, if that is a concern to you.

>Is there any block/head improvements that Olds engines like?  What RPM
>is a safe Redline for an Olds 350?   Is the Diesel block worth the
>weight for a street car?

A well-built, nodular iron crank, solid-main block 350 could live well to
6500rpm, or safely see the high side of 7000rpm with a forged crank; the
camshaft that would allow you to reach those heights, however, would not be
very responsive below 2000-3000rpm, so build it for the 2000-5000rpm range,
where you'd be driving it most of the time. A diesel motor could reach the
same rpms, but would be able to survive the pressures of supercharging or
nitrous as well.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Aaron R. Weimer" <aweimer@ameritech.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:30:02 -0300
Subject: [none]

Unsubscribe

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:36:54 -0300
Subject: DMR and Mondello for Olds parts [was Re: Mondello s*cks]

At 09:18 PM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Ever hear of Dicks racing? they're saying is "Mondello sells parts, we
              ^^^^^
>sell horsepower."

You mean Dick Miller Racing (DMR for short)? I bought all my Mondello
Catalog parts from DMR (closer, geographically); I got his latest catalog,
and one notable omission is the lack of any engine rebuild kits. Mondello's
kits weren't economical for my 403 rebuild, but he's very competetive on the
350 and 455 kits. I'd buy the kit for my 455 from DMR, but he doesn't have
one, and the individual parts would be more than the Mondello kit. Too bad,
DMR gave me great service (I ordered the wrong head bolts, and he exchanged
them for the right ones without any question).

All in all, though, the parts they carry and their prices are nearly
identical. The things unique to DMR or Mondello, such as the EFI setup or
the lower block girdle, are priced so far beyond my reach that it's
irrelevant.

>We've talked to Joe on the phone and he is a complete prick who thinks
>he knows everything, his son is pretty cool though.  We'd like to get

People here on this list have spoken, both positively and negatively, about
conversations they've had with Joe Mondello himself. It might be good if DMR
functions as a true competitor, and not just an Eastern Distributor, for
Mondello. I do know that since joining this list, I haven't had the need to
call CA to see what "Dr. Olds" has to say about this or that.

One other difference I noticed between the DMR and Mondello catalog is the
cams. DMR lists only single-pattern cams; tradition has it that Olds motors
respond better to the dual-pattern cams that Mondello sells (but doesn't
produce himself; who is the actual maker of them, Engle is it?). Anyone have
any actual experience with the difference between a single and dual pattern
cam in an Olds? Is DMR onto something, or is he just selling the cams that
he got the best deal as a distributor for?

>the V/O twister back on the road and blow Joe's Twister II clean off the
>track.  That would piss him off, getting beat by his old car.

Apparently, the Twister II wasn't running too quick in its last national
appearances, so maybe he's used to getting beat...
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:36:58 -0300
Subject: Re: Warhoops Junkyard -  Detroit Area

At 09:46 PM 5/24/97 -0400, you wrote:
>a 72 CS... four SSxxx wheels... wanted $150 for the wheels...
>Is this a good deal?  Will they fit my 70 98?

I think the 98 would have a 5 on 5" bolt pattern, whereas the CS would have
the 5 on 4.75" bolt pattern; not compatible.

[snip]
>I was looking at heads just for grins.  I saw a couple of C's
>an E, a G, and a 3.  They want $65 a head.  They pull.  Is this a good
>deal?

Not spectacular, unless they were ready to run. What would they want for the
whole engine? (they pull)

>Anybody know what Wesley's Bleach-White will do to vinyl seats?

It's a harsh cleaner; I wouldn't want to see what it would do to the carpet.
Keep the Bleach-white on the tires, and get some vinyl upholstery cleaner
for your seats. (I'm still regretting using Bleach-white on my vinyl top... :(
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: hhzimmerman <hhzimmerman@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 23:35:16 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello sucks

I emailed mondello last week with a simple question on head porting last
week.  I just ordered his $9 (ouch!) catalog.  I told him I would buy
the porting materials from him (almost $100) if he responded to my
question- week later, no answer yet!

How's that for customer satisfaction?

luckily, a reader responded to my post with the info I needed on
grinding the A.I.R. bump out of the exaust port- and I got the grinding
materials from Summit Racing- they're AWESOME.


- -greg

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Sun, 25 May 1997 01:22:26 -0300
Subject: Re '67 442's

Got this message from my web page - anyone able to help in this?

Snip:  it brought back memories
of my 1967 442 convertible I also made a foolish mistake getting rid of
that car and would give almost anything to have another one like it.It was
yellow with a black top and interiorif you know of one please let me know
buster@alltel.net

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sun, 25 May 1997 02:08:39 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello sucks  (?)

In a message dated 97-05-24 21:27:13 EDT, you write:


>  We've talked to Joe on the phone and he is a complete prick who thinks
>  he knows everything, his son is pretty cool though.

You mean Joe Mondello does not know everything? Really?

Seriously. Do you think he can't have someone else sit around on Wednesdays
answering questions from anyone who thinks they know what 442 means?

I would think more people would appreciate his making himself so available.

I have recently conferred with some who have had varying opinions about
Mondello products, to wit intake manifold gaskets. I do not see how even this
is different from other suppliers the quality of whose wares may be more or
less good depending on product. I for one will continue to hold for hold for
half an hour in order to get his opinion (and as such is not dogma) on my
technical difficulties.

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chicago, IL

Echoing Guitar Riffs?


------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Sun, 25 May 1997 02:37:50 -0300
Subject: "A" 425ci blocks [was 307 roller cam]

Mr Buehler, er, Buehner wrote;

> Actually, I ~think~ the situation is that all of the heads will
interchange,
>  and the blocks are externally the same, i.e. the angle at which the A head
>  mounts on the block (which I'll call "angle" for lack of Latin desire:) is
>  the same angle as the other heads (to which I'll also refer to as "angle")
>  The difference (as far as I can deduce) is in the camshaft itself.  I
guess,
>  blockwise, the cam sits higher in the lifter valley on the 45' engines.
>  (i.e. the timing chain is longer, I guess.)  I guess this would lead to
>  shorter pushrods, too.  (Perhaps the change was brought about by the
Toro's
>  lower hoodline, and sunken intake???)  I think the mods required in the
head
>  swaps would be to make sure the pushrods don't rub on the edges of the
holes
>  in the head  (Since the cam is higher, the pushrods sit in the engine at a
>  different angle, as well.  The hole they go through is essentially a tube,
>  so there's an invitation for interference there)  As far as actual valve
>  operation, it'll be normal.  They should seat normally, etc.  Unless you
run
>  pushrods that are too long, and end up shoving a valve into a piston...
 The
>  other concern would be running quality.  With the wrong cam in there (as
was
>  discussed earlier on with a different thread) you'll have one side of the
>  engine running normally, and the other side running 6' advanced or
retarded.
>  In other words, there would be ~no~ running quality :)  At least that's my
>  understanding of the bank-angle situation, which I'll casually refer to as
>  Delta, now, since that's one word we all can associate with readily :)
>

Well, (and realize that I am just guessing) my impression is that the
difference between the 39 degree 425/455 blocks (oh man! these threads are
never gonna end)  and 45 degree "A" blocks (I may as well include 330 blocks
as they have the same angle) is that the block itself is different. (Well
duh! Karl) What I had intended to say here was that the angle of the inside
of the V that is the block is different. That would be to say that the angle
of the lifter valley of "A" blocks is larger than in later years. If this
were the case then no parts would be higher or lower than in other years. The
pushrods would still lie in the same relative position to the block, just at
a slightly exaggerated angle. As I was considering this (3-4 sentences ago) I
realized that this concept could infact be flawed. A wider V angle would mean
that either lifter valley tray or intake manifold would not be
interchangeable. Hmm. I seem to have run rings around myself (again). I will
tell you all what. I have an intake swap impending which is still a long way
off because I am currently rebuilding my carburetor and have decided to
replace parts not in the rebuild kit and add an electric choke. At any rate
when I am in mid-intake swap, I will take photos and measurements in an
effort to quantify the differences between "A" and other blocks.

Oh well, another confusing letter.

More info later.

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chicago, IL

Eddys Going 'Round.........? (and around and around)

------------------------------

From: Shang <shoover@flash.net>
Date: Sun, 25 May 1997 03:12:48 -0300
Subject: Original Parts Group

I was looking through an Original Parts Group catalog for Ch*velle, my
friend had and I was wondering if anyone new if they had a Cutlass/442
catalog. I saw an ad for them in Hot Rod, and they list Ch*velle and
L*Mans. They actually had complete consoles new for about $150. I was
shocked and was wondering if they had them for Olds. I'll call them
Tuesday, just wondering if anyone knew off the top of their heads.

Stephen Hoover
Dallas, Texas
'70 Cutlass "S"

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End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª692
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