To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #694


oldsmobile-digest           Tuesday, 27 May 1997        Volume 01 : Number 694

Re: 350 Buildup?
DMR & Mondello - The real story
Re: Rear-end Change?
Re: Chris B. Witt
Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)
Re: DMR & Mondello - The real story
Re: Radio Speaker Info
Re: Piston Bore Data
Dick Miller & Joe Mondello - DMR version
WIRING PROBLEMS
Re: Last attempt HELP!! Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"
Re: Hey
Re: Piston Bore Data
Re: Toronado Wiring Problem
Re: Chris B. Witt
Rear-end ?
Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)
Re: Hey
Re: 350 Buildup?
Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)
Re:  Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"
Re: 400 pistons
72 Cutlass Parts
Re: Rear-end ?
Re: Chrome SSIII's (Was:  New Pic's)
Some Questions
A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!
Re: Last attempt HELP!! Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"
Re: Chris B. Witt
Wild 442 in Butte, MT (Scott???)
'87 442 questions
Re: Rear-end ?
Re: A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!
Re: Today I'm Broken???
Re: Some Questions
Re: Toronado Wiring Problem
Re: '87 442 questions
Re: A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!
Re: Rear-end ?
Re: '87 442 questions
Re: 69 Convertible
Re: Today I'm Broken???
Re: Olds Chat Link URL
Parts for sale
Re: Rear-end ?
About my Oldsmobile..
Re: '87 442 questions
Re: About my Oldsmobile..
Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)
Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)
1969 455 Engine

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Fernando Proietto <proietto@dow.on.doe.ca>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 10:20:27 -0300
Subject: Re: 350 Buildup?

hhzimmerman wrote:

> I built my '71 350 five years and 35,000 miles ago.  I did a .030 over with
TRW forged pistons, moly rings, > and had the assembly balanced.  I also used
ARP rod bolts (recommended by a lot of people).  I bought main > studs and
windage tray from Mondello, but the machine shop already had the short block
put together by the > time I got the parts, so I returned them.  The heads got
stainless valves and a 3 angle valve job.  I used > a Crane 260/272 cam (mild
for the street), crane springs, comp. cams roller rocker kit, Edelbrock
Performer > intake, carb (600), and timing chain.  High volume oil pump.
Mallory Unilite distributor, MSD-6al box, and > a K&N air filter.  Oh- yeah,
blackjack aluminized headers and 2 1/4" dual exaust with a balance tube and >
Walker dynomax mufflers.  I drive it every day and worked great. > > With my
'71 cutlass and 3.08 gears, mild torque converter on a TH-350 tranny, I ran
14.5 in the quarter > mile through the mufflers without any tuning to the
engine.  I'm sure it would go a lot faster with jetting > and timing changes. >
 > On a side note, I blew a hole through the piston while topping out the car
(128mph).  Upon teardown, both > rings on the number 8 piston had the gaps
lined up in a row at the bottom of the piston!  Seems like blowby > erroded
the piston over time and the extra strain melted the piston.  Make sure you
put the rings in right! > > I'm building the motor again, I just had to get a
new piston and slighty hone the bore out to get the > scratches out.  the rest
of the motor looks great. I did get a carbide porting kit from Summit racing
and a > die grinder.  Yesterday I portmatched the intake manifold and heads.
I also grinded out the A.I.r. bump in > the exaust port of the heads.  the FAQ
says that it results in a 30% increase in flow.  I'll post my > results next
week when the motor is back together. > > if you have any questions, email
me, > > greg

Hi Greg,
sounds like a decent rebuild. I need to ask you about the comps. cams
roller rocker kit you installed. First, why did you install them and
second, did you notice your valve train geometry was off with the mild
cam and springs you installed? I need to know becuase my rebuild was
basically what you did, but I'm getting way too much valve noise with
the stock equipment. I want to install the comp. cams rocker kit but I
want to be sure that they will work for me.
I'm also wondering, I re-used the main stud bolts and connecting arm
bolt for the rebuild. I don't intend on reving to past 5000, but you
never know what will happen on the street. Is it too late to re-install
new bolts after a rebuild and some mileage?

Fernando
'72 442

------------------------------

From: "Bradford W. Nicholson" <brad442@erols.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 11:10:10 -0300
Subject: DMR & Mondello - The real story

Gang,
I spoke w/ Dick Miller last week, after a goof up w/ his ad in the
Capitol City Rockets's newletter.  His story, and it's a short one, is
that when he came out with his new catalog that Mondello was pissed off
because he was no longer selling JUST Mondello parts but some others of
his own manufacturing: i.e. suspension parts. FI system, ect.  Since he
was no longer "EXCLUSIVE Mondello", Joe parted ways.  Also if you look
at Mondello's page, there is a picture of a motor he built for Dick, but
dated December 1996 (huh?)  No one ever said that us Olds fans were all
together, being different isn't easy.

BTW - I may be late answering mail for the next 2 weeks, my wife was due
5/20.
Also this is my first attempt at attaching a sig file using Netsacpe 3.0
so my name may appear twice - sorry

Brad Nicholson
1987 442 W-42
brad442@erols.com

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 11:20:43 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end Change?

At 05:56 AM 5/24/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Actually I have few questions. I have a 2.56 rear-end now. I've got a
>friend who just replaced his 3.08. He'll sell me the axle and all for
>$150. 1)Is that a good price? 2)whould this change make a big difference
>in preformance?
>
>Thanks
>Pat McDermott
>69 Cutlass 'S'
>
Pat

        You should notice a decent difference. It will still do real good on
the freeway too.

Jim Chermack
70 Cutlass Supreme SX W-32
72 442 (350)
86 Ninety Eight
94 Cutlass Supreme
96 C-1500

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 11:22:52 -0300
Subject: Re: Chris B. Witt

Jason Labay wrote:
>
> At 02:18 AM 5/26/97 -0300, Richard Staley wrote:
> >Has anybody heard from Chris Brown Witt lately? Last time I heard some
> >guy was trying to sue him.
>
> Yeah, where is Chris? I remember back when he was on the list and I looked
> forward to his "misc" posts everyday ;-) Great guy and I got to meet him
> last year about this time, got my 75 H/O parts car from him.

I just talked to him about 2 weeks ago.  He is still around and messing
with Oldsmobiles.  I don't know anything about a lawsuit.  Hmmm.  I can
give his e-mail address to anyone who is interested.

- -Dan

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 11:30:31 -0300
Subject: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)

Does anybody here have a good "trick" to keep the convertible top pads
attached to the convertible boot.  They are usually glued on and they
don't stay that way for very long.

Also, I'm still looking for a bumperjack base and some other misc items
for the jacking equipment.

- -Dan

------------------------------

From: Lloyd Culp <bculp@hiwaay.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 06:37:53 -0300
Subject: Re: DMR & Mondello - The real story

Bradford W. Nicholson wrote:
>
> BTW - I may be late answering mail for the next 2 weeks, my wife was due
> 5/20.
> Also this is my first attempt at attaching a sig file using Netsacpe 3.0
> so my name may appear twice - sorry
>
> Brad Nicholson
> 1987 442 W-42
> brad442@erols.com

Congratulations on the 5/20.  I hope it's an Olds nut.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama

PS.  The sig file is fine even w/bifocals.

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 12:11:13 -0300
Subject: Re: Radio Speaker Info

Greg,
Maybe I missed part of this conversation about speakers, but it appears you're
 looking for the front speaker. As recent as about three or four months ago I
 bought two from GM. The part number is 1224267. It is the original front
speaker.

Art Fuller
mefco@sprynet.com

------------------------------

From: "jones" <jones@morgan.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 12:20:15 -0300
Subject: Re: Piston Bore Data

Sorry I am so late in replying about the compression height. I have been
out of town. This refers to the placement of the wrist pin. With any stroke
and rod length combination the pin has be in the right place to complete
the picture for a block of any given height.. If the stroke is increased
the engineer has to either shorten the rod,  move the wrist pin location
closer to the piston crown by 1/2 of the increase or make the block taller.
If there is room they usually leave the rod alone and change the piston.
This is probably cheaper and makes a better rod angle which cuts down on
piston and cylinder wall wear. Sometimes there isnt room below the rings
and in other places and its easier to shorten the rod. Either of the other
two opitons are cheaper than making the block taller because this changes
lots of other things, such as intake width, pushrod length, Location of the
brackets ect.    Case in point is the 350/400 chevy.  These engines use the
same height block but the 400 has a 1/4 longer stroke and a 1/8 bigger
bore. They have the same compression height because the rod bolts hit on
the cam and the beams on the pan rails when 350 rod is used in the 400. So
GM shortened the rod .125 when they increased the 350 stroke by .250 and
just made a .125 larger bore 350 piston for the 400. Of course that never
stopped the hot rod crowd from useing the longer rod.  They made a piston
with the pin moved up .125, took a grinder to the block and rod bolts and
used the longer stronger 350 rod anyway.
I hope this cleared this confuseing subject up a little
Walter

------------------------------

From: "Bradford W. Nicholson" <brad442@erols.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 12:36:40 -0300
Subject: Dick Miller & Joe Mondello - DMR version

Gang,
I spoke w/ Dick Miller last week, after a goof up w/ his ad in the
Capitol City Rockets's newletter.  His story, and it's a short one, is
that when he came out with his new catalog that Mondello was pissed off
because he was no longer selling JUST Mondello parts but some others of
his own manufacturing: i.e. suspension parts. FI system, ect.  Since he
was no longer "EXCLUSIVE Mondello", Joe parted ways.  Also if you look
at Mondello's page, there is a picture of a motor he built for Dick, but
dated December 1996 (huh?)  No one ever said that us Olds fans were all
together, being different isn't easy.

BTW - I may be late answering mail for the next 2 weeks, my wife was due
5/20.

 ---
| | | Brad Nicholson
| | | 1987 442 W-42
|/|\| 1994 Eight Eight LSS
| | | Oldsmobile Club of America ª18984
 --- Oldsmobile Centennial Club - MD
eiMail: brad442@erols.com
Personal Web Site - http://www.erols.com/brad442
Official OCA Web Site - http://www.erols.com/brad442/ocahome.html

------------------------------

From: teacher-pf@juno.com (Robert J. Little)
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 13:59:54 -0300
Subject: WIRING PROBLEMS

Dear Sirs,

I recently acquired a 1966 "TORO", and I love it!!  That's
unusual, because I have always been a sports car dude.  But to my point,
I am only working part-time (not by choice) and former Aerospace worker,
so I have not been able to join the CLUB yet, but will as soon as I can
afford it.
I can not seem to find a manual for my TORO, and I am having
electrical problems.  I desperately need a wiring diagram and info on
taking apart the turn signal switch.  I believe part of my problems are
located in that area.
If you can not help me, can you at least point me in the right
direction?   I would prefer to do this by email, but I do have access to
the WWW.

Thanks,

Bob Little
teacher-pf@juno.com

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 14:51:26 -0300
Subject: Re: Last attempt HELP!! Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"

Hi Theresa! Guess who.

Oldsmobile USA Parts Supply carries most lettering and scripts with only a
few model or year omissions. One glaring omission is the lack of "Vista
Cruiser" in their catalogue listing. They do not list 1963 Dynamic 88 fender,
but they do list 1961-1962 Dynamic 88 for fenders as well as some for 1964.
Just your luck, huh?

I would suggest that you call them (703) 335-1935 and ask if they havent
gotten any 1963 scripts in since they published the catalog. Failing that, I
would definitely recommend ordering their (FREE) catalogue. To clarify any
doubts, check out their web site at www.usapartssupply.com (and maybe email
them).

Will send you my pix soon (I know, I keep saying that). I keep getting
involved with my carburetor/manifold project. Talk to you later.

Good Hunting!

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chiao  (add c and g for location),IL

(Drat! I lost the list I made of funny words beginning with E G and R)?

------------------------------

From: "jones" <jones@morgan.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 14:53:59 -0300
Subject: Re: Hey

Tell us more about this show Art. Is it Sat & Sun? What hours? Where in
Grapevine? Maybe we can go.
Walter

- ----------
> From: mefco@sprynet.com
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: Hey
> Date: Sunday, May 25, 1997 10:11 AM
>
> R.S.,
> The Oldsmobile club of North Texas is having a show with the Buick and
Pontiac
> people next weekend in Grapevine. Also, I might have parts for your '70.
>
> Art Fuller
> mefco@sprynet.com
>

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 15:48:07 -0300
Subject: Re: Piston Bore Data

In his message Walter explains:

> If the stroke is increased
>  the engineer has to either shorten the rod,  move the wrist pin location
>  closer to the piston crown by 1/2 of the increase or make the block
taller.
>  If there is room they usually leave the rod alone and change the piston.
>
Much as I had thought. Thanks.

This brings up another thought (oh, no, not again! run!!)....

IF there are no other conflicts such as rod/cylinder wall contact, and if
(that is a total of 2 if's so far), miraculously, the piston head actually
does not come in contact with the cylinder head or valves. Then wouldn't
using the original 425 pistons with 455 crank and rods result in a high
compression 455. Again, this is a multiple "if" theoretical question?

I understand compression height, but is compression height the same for, say
425 pistons of varying compression ratio (i.e. dished, flat, domed)?

If compression height is the same, then could a 425 piston be milled down for
455 applications?

I seem do be doing my utmost to keep this thread going...and it's getting
kinda silly.

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chicago,IL

....starting to feel piston....

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 16:01:44 -0300
Subject: Re: Toronado Wiring Problem

In a message dated 97-05-26 13:12:14 EDT, Bob wrote:

>
>  I recently acquired a 1966 "TORO", and I love it!!  That's
>  unusual, because I have always been a sports car dude.
>

Well, Bob. You may have been a sports car dude. Now you are a muscle car
dude!

You may be able to score the chassis service manual and body manual through
(800) BYA-BOOK.

Internet. Check out www.usapartssupply.com, they offer chassis and body
manuals for 1966 and I recommend ordering their free catalogue.

You should also send an Email to OldsHeidi@aol.com with the subject heading
of "Oldsmobile Enthusiast" and your snail mail address in the body of the
letter. This will net you a free booklet listing a number of sources of
Oldsmobile related parts and services from many buisinesses.

As far as your wiring problem, I will have to refer you to (you guessed
it).....

         '66 Toro
The     /\     /\     and Mike.

(Response time may vary)

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88
Chicago, IL

------------------------------

From: Richard Staley <rstaley@FastLane.NET>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 16:25:55 -0300
Subject: Re: Chris B. Witt

Dan Williams wrote:
>
> Jason Labay wrote:
> >
> > At 02:18 AM 5/26/97 -0300, Richard Staley wrote:
> > >Has anybody heard from Chris Brown Witt lately? Last time I heard some
> > >guy was trying to sue him.
> >
> > Yeah, where is Chris? I remember back when he was on the list and I looked
> > forward to his "misc" posts everyday ;-) Great guy and I got to meet him
> > last year about this time, got my 75 H/O parts car from him.
>
> I just talked to him about 2 weeks ago.  He is still around and messing
> with Oldsmobiles.  I don't know anything about a lawsuit.  Hmmm.  I can
> give his e-mail address to anyone who is interested.
>
> -Dan


  Dan,

      I am interested in Chris' email address.

  RS
'70 442 4-speed

------------------------------

From: "dayc" <dayc@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 10:34:06 -0300
Subject: Rear-end ?

What gears will go in a Type "0" Cutlass rear that has 2.56 gears as
original set?  Is there a system like the Che*y Series III etc.?

I have a 455 and 3.23 gears in a 70 Cutlass, I am doing a rebuild what cams
off performance/reliability.  I would like a good performance cam, but I do
have power brakes and a/c?  Is the 69 H/O grind more radical than the W
series cams?  It (69) seems more close to some Toronado cams.  If anyone
has any thoughts please share them.

Corey D
dayc@ix.netcom.com
70 Cutlass S 455

------------------------------

From: hhzimmerman <hhzimmerman@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 17:41:53 -0300
Subject: Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)

Dan Williams wrote:
>
> Does anybody here have a good "trick" to keep the convertible top pads
> attached to the convertible boot.  They are usually glued on and they
> don't stay that way for very long.
>
> Also, I'm still looking for a bumperjack base and some other misc items
> for the jacking equipment.
>
> -Danby "top pads", I'm assuming you're talking about the yellow foam lining
of the top boot.  I would try using a can of spray-on weatherstrip
adhesive, I beleive 3M makes some- I got a can at the hardware store to
use for my headliner, worked fine.

- -greg

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 17:42:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Hey

Walter,
I knew somebody would ask about the show, so I had to find my newsletter. The
show is May 31st. at The Sheraton Grand Hotel, located at Hwy. 114 and Esters
Road. Times are from 8 A.M. until late afternoon. Awards will be presented at
5 P.M. If you want to show your car, its $15. It is the first annual Buick,
Pontiac, Oldsmobile car show. Then, on June 7th. we will make a lap on the
new Texas Speedway, in recognition of Oldsmobile's 100th anniversary. We will
follow the Aurora pace car. See you next Saturday.

Art Fuller
mefco@sprynet.com

------------------------------

From: hhzimmerman <hhzimmerman@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 17:53:58 -0300
Subject: Re: 350 Buildup?

Fernando Proietto wrote:

> Hi Greg,
>         sounds like a decent rebuild. I need to ask you about the comps.
cams > roller rocker kit you installed. First, why did you install them and >
second, did you notice your valve train geometry was off with the mild > cam
and springs you installed? I need to know becuase my rebuild was > basically
what you did, but I'm getting way too much valve noise with > the stock
equipment. I want to install the comp. cams rocker kit but I > want to be sure
that they will work for me. >         I'm also wondering, I re-used the main
stud bolts and connecting arm > bolt for the rebuild. I don't intend on reving
to past 5000, but you > never know what will happen on the street. Is it too
late to re-install > new bolts after a rebuild and some mileage? > > Fernando >
'72 442


>From the research I did, after a valve job, the valve stems won't be at the
same height they were originially.  Since the stock rocker arms aren't
adjustable, the geometry is off.  I got the Comp. cams roller rocker kit
($200-250? complete with rockers, studs, guide plates, and pushrods).  They
don't require any machining and bolt right on.  Also, they are cheaper than
Mondello's kits.  Supposedly, they should be worth more H.P. too.  I highly
recommend them.

It's too late to change your bolts, unless you feel like re-checking all your
clearences again with plastigauge, then if their off, that means re-machining
parts and extra $$.  I tried to persuade my machine shop to take out the
stock main bolts and change them with studs AFTER he had already put the
bottom end together.  He said he'd have to charge me another $300 to
dissasemble the engine and recheck clearances afterwards.  I would just leave
your engine alone if it's already put together.

- -greg

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 18:10:19 -0300
Subject: Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)

On Mon, 26 May 1997, hhzimmerman wrote:
> Dan Williams wrote:
> > Does anybody here have a good "trick" to keep the convertible top pads
> > attached to the convertible boot.  They are usually glued on and they
> > don't stay that way for very long.
> by "top pads", I'm assuming you're talking about the yellow foam lining
> of the top boot.  I would try using a can of spray-on weatherstrip
> adhesive, I beleive 3M makes some- I got a can at the hardware store to
> use for my headliner, worked fine.

I tried this with the boot on my Skylark. The 3M spray would only hold
the foam on for a few months -- something to do with "open-cell foam"
that the pads are made of meant the spray wouldn't work very well. The
last time I tried it I used liberal amounts of weatherstrip adhesive, but
I don't know if that worked long-term either and the car is now gone, so
we'll never know! :)

> > Also, I'm still looking for a bumperjack base and some other misc items
> > for the jacking equipment.

That can't be too hard to find -- where are those junkyard guys when you
need them? ;-)

Actually on the '68 there is some sort of bracket that holds the jack
post down, I think it goes along with a wingnut/stud assembly on the
floor of the trunk (not the long one that holds the tire down). If you
find 2, I could use one of those too, since the bracket is missing on mine.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 18:27:52 -0300
Subject: Re:  Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"

Try Originality Plus in Rancho Cucamonga California - 909/555-1212
(information).  They supposedly have practically everything from 62 up.


Lisa Madsen

Heavy Metal Forever - '66 Toronado, '67 Delta 88 Custom , '72 Vista Cruiser
, '72 Vista Cruiser project

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com

My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 18:30:01 -0300
Subject: Re: 400 pistons

I'm the one who inquired about the seeming rarity of thoe 400 pistons -
nice to know I'll (maybe) have a variety to select from.

Thank you.  And yes, Ch*vy lists are not the best things in the world - my
other half has a '66 pickup and had to hunt & search to try and find his info.

Definitely not the CALIBER of us Olds folks.


Lisa Madsen

Heavy Metal Forever - '66 Toronado, '67 Delta 88 Custom , '72 Vista Cruiser
, '72 Vista Cruiser project

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com

My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/

------------------------------

From: James Thingwold <jht@exo.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 18:33:04 -0300
Subject: 72 Cutlass Parts

Available:  front spindle & rotors off '72 Cutlass.  Also, front bumper -
straight needs rechrome (quote from M. Aldana in Calif. is $150-175).

Also available, rear bumper for '72 Vista Cruiser - straight needs rechrome.

330 Edelbrock Performer Intake - $85 (you pay shipping).




Lisa Madsen

Heavy Metal Forever - '66 Toronado, '67 Delta 88 Custom , '72 Vista Cruiser
, '72 Vista Cruiser project

Please E-Mail me at-----:  Lisa@hotglass.com

My Web-Page-----:  http://exo.com/~jht/olds/

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 19:10:10 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end ?

At 10:34 AM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>What gears will go in a Type "0" Cutlass rear that has 2.56 gears as
>original set?  Is there a system like the Che*y Series III etc.?
>
>I have a 455 and 3.23 gears in a 70 Cutlass, I am doing a rebuild what cams
>off performance/reliability.  I would like a good performance cam, but I do
>have power brakes and a/c?  Is the 69 H/O grind more radical than the W
>series cams?  It (69) seems more close to some Toronado cams.  If anyone
>has any thoughts please share them.
>
>Corey D
>dayc@ix.netcom.com
>70 Cutlass S 455
>
>
Corey

        I have basically the same setup and I'm running The 68 Hurst/Olds,
W-31 cam. It pulls extremely hard to over 6200 RPM and does support the
power brakes. It has an awsome sounding idle too.

Jim Chermack

------------------------------

From: "DAVID  BETZ" <dbetz@netwalk.com>
Date: Sat, 24 May 1997 09:13:35 -0300
Subject: Re: Chrome SSIII's (Was:  New Pic's)

Charley, you wrote.
- ----------
> From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Chrome SSIII's (Was:  New Pic's)
> Date: Thursday, May 22, 1997 1:03 AM
>
>
>
> So, would these be SSIV's??? :)
>
>
The SSIV wheels were the polycast wheels on 71-72 Delta 88 ONLY.  I have a
couple sets, one on my 72 Delta 88 convt. and two spare sets.  I am looking
for more info. on them if anyone can help me. (color for re-painting, type
of trim ring, NOS center caps)  These do have trim rings, but I have seen
both chrome and stainless rings like on the Ch*vy Z wheels of that era.

------------------------------

From: Richard Staley <rstaley@FastLane.NET>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 19:38:28 -0300
Subject: Some Questions

I've been saving these questions for quite a while now and I'm ready
to let them loose. First of all what's the difference between cast
Pistons and forged Pistons? What is the option Y-60? What are the times
for a W-25 '70 442 4-speed 455ci.(Example:1/4 mile 13.4sec @ 101mph.
0-60 in 5.5sec.) How does one go about removing the dash in a '70 442
4-speed? How does one go about removing the Rally Pack? How much is the
Rally Pack worth? My fuel gauge says full all the time and my clock
doesn't work, how can you fix them? Sorry about all the questions.
  Thanks in advance,
  RS
'70 442 4-speed W-25

P.S. Please Correct me if I'm wrong about this.  In 1970 the 442 engine
size was 455ci.

------------------------------

From: Dennis Sytsma <dsytsma@dc.seflin.org>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:04:00 -0300
Subject: A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!

Hello fellow Oldsmobile enthusiast's !

My mailbox is too small to stay on the list. So if you respond to this
message, please cc or forward a copy to sytsma@gzinc.com so I can read it.


The A/C on my 1977 Vista Cruiser Station Wagon failed last year.  The
hose leaked.  I replaced the hose and accumulator and put a hard vacume
on the system to confirm it was tight.  The new hoses and accumulator
were rated for either R-12 or R134a refrigeant, but I hear that R-12
works better, so I took the system to several certified repair station
for refill.

O boy, O boy !!!!  the stories I heard!  a $99.00 job they want to bump
up to $1000.00  One said $180.00 to check my system and refill with 4
pounds of R-12 if it is tight and in good working order.

I saw 30 pounds of R-12 going for $400.00 last winter, so I expected to
pay around $16.00 per pound plus labor.  Some said "it went up" ,how
high?  $38.00 per pound, some said $24.00 per pound.  They all offered to
"convert" my system to R134a.

They all had different methods to covert my system.  I finally found a
major chain who said they would recharge my system for $150.00 if it was
in good working order and did not leak.  I agreed.

They pulled my car into the service bay and could not get the compresser
to engadge.  They said I had a electrical failure and the system would
reqwuire repairs.  I reached over and wiggled the connector on the
compresser and it engadged.  They led me to the waiting area.  A few
minutes later the manager took me back telling me that the system had a
obstruction or a compresser problem, and it needed $359.00 worth of
parts.  They had gadges hooked up, and said they had compressed air in
the system to test it, they had me put my hand on the accumalator to show
me it was "hot", they said it should be cold if the compressor was
working.  They said that the expansion valve had a obstruction and needed
to be replaced along with the compressor.

I told them I was "too poor" to fix it, and I would have to "ride hot"
this summer.

Later I added a do it yourself "R-134a convert kit" and 4 pounds of
R-134a and the car is Ice Cold!  The convert kit goes for $39.00 retail
and R-134a does not require a linsence to use it.  The kit adds some
special oil into the system with a pattented fill kit.  Some say the
higher pressure of the R-134a system can cause weak parts in old R-12
systems to fail when you try to convert.

Most certified repair stations will be glad to remove your old R-12 since
it is worth so much money.  Some will convert your R-12 system to R-134a
for $70.00 total, but if it breaks, it is your problem.  $70.00 beats
$600.00 or $1000.00 for a result that the con-artisits will not stand
behind anyway.

What I want to know is, How did they fool me?  Who tests A/C systems with
compressed air?  How did they make the accumulator get hot?  I went back
to the shop, and they said they did not use air, but recycled R-12 to
test it.  If they did that, why did the system not get cold?

I alerted the local media and elected officals of this scam.  I suggested
they do a consumer alert or a hidden camera investigation;


let me know
dennis


Dennis Jon Sytsma

dsytsma@dc.seflin.org

or you can cc a copy to my full internet account at

sytsma@gzinc.com

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:14:49 -0300
Subject: Re: Last attempt HELP!! Fender Scripts for 1963 "88"

At 02:51 PM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Hi Theresa! Guess who.
>
>Oldsmobile USA Parts Supply carries most lettering and scripts with only a
>few model or year omissions. One glaring omission is the lack of "Vista
>Cruiser" in their catalogue listing. They do not list 1963 Dynamic 88 fender,
>but they do list 1961-1962 Dynamic 88 for fenders as well as some for 1964.
>Just your luck, huh?

Does anyone know if these scripts changed over those years???  Perhaps a '62
or '64 model would be the same???


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:14:58 -0300
Subject: Re: Chris B. Witt

At 04:25 PM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Dan Williams wrote:
>>
>> Jason Labay wrote:
>> >
>> > At 02:18 AM 5/26/97 -0300, Richard Staley wrote:
>> > >Has anybody heard from Chris Brown Witt lately? Last time I heard some
>> > >guy was trying to sue him.
>> >
>> > Yeah, where is Chris? I remember back when he was on the list and I
looked >> > forward to his "misc" posts everyday ;-) Great guy and I got to
meet him >> > last year about this time, got my 75 H/O parts car from him. >>
>> I just talked to him about 2 weeks ago.  He is still around and messing >>
with Oldsmobiles.  I don't know anything about a lawsuit.  Hmmm.  I can >>
give his e-mail address to anyone who is interested. >>

Well, I just wrote Chris, so we'll see what he has to say (I asked him if
his ears were burning...)  Here's his address for those that are interested...

"Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:20:35 -0300
Subject: Wild 442 in Butte, MT (Scott???)

     A friend here went to a track meet last week in Butte MT, and reported
seeing an "awesome" 442, he guessed '67-ish...  There was another 70-ish 442
there as well (it had a car alarm...)  I think he said one of 'em was blue
with a red stripe somewhere? can't recall that much of the descriptions.
He'd seen the 67? from the track bus, and  said the big blower sticking out
of the hood ~really~ caught his attention.  (Who'd blame him...)  Scott,
you're from Butte, right?  Any info to report on this thing?  Ever seen it?
(Tell me he doesn't have a ch*vy in there, ~please~!!!!)  Is it owned by
Long-Legged Hannah?  Just curious;)  If you ever get a chance, snag some
pictures of it for us.  Sounds like something that should be captured on
film (providing, of course, that it ~is~ Rocket powerred...)


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 19:29:29 -0300
Subject: '87 442 questions

A friend of mine is seriously considering the purchase of an '87 442:
VIN 1G3GR1192HP316316, black, no G80, no T-tops, but with a power driver's
seat.  Is there anything in particular to check for?  What would be the
best way to make sure the car isn't stolen with a transplanted VIN
tag under the windshield?  The car has supposedly traveled (1)25,000 kms
(78,000 miles), the current (3rd) owner is asking $7000 Cdn. (just over
$5000 U.S.), the undercarriage is very rust-free and the door bottoms are
perfect, which supports the 'never seen winter' claim.  The paint is 1
year old, the engine/transmission pans are dry, the A/C is 1-1.5 lbs
low, and the A.I.R. pump is noisy.  My friend would appreciate any
advice/suggestions/comments!   I'll forward all relevant posts to him.
Thanks!

Kevin Wong
Toronto, Ontario

------------------------------

From: "dayc" <dayc@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 13:27:32 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end ?

Jim is the original pnª for that cam 400165?
Overlap        57
Dur int/exh  285/287
Lift int/exh   .472/.472

If so, where did you get that grind cam?

thanks,
Corey D
dayc@ix.netcom.com
70 Cutlass S -455
 ----
From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: Monday, May 26, 1997 10:22 PM
Subject: Re: Rear-end ?

At 10:34 AM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>What gears will go in a Type "0" Cutlass rear that has 2.56 gears as
>original set?  Is there a system like the Che*y Series III etc.?
>
>I have a 455 and 3.23 gears in a 70 Cutlass, I am doing a rebuild what
cams
>off performance/reliability.  I would like a good performance cam, but I
do
>have power brakes and a/c?  Is the 69 H/O grind more radical than the W
>series cams?  It (69) seems more close to some Toronado cams.  If anyone
>has any thoughts please share them.
>
>Corey D
>dayc@ix.netcom.com
>70 Cutlass S 455
>
>
Corey

        I have basically the same setup and I'm running The 68 Hurst/Olds,
W-31 cam. It pulls extremely hard to over 6200 RPM and does support the
power brakes. It has an awsome sounding idle too.

Jim Chermack

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:39:21 -0300
Subject: Re: A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!

>Later I added a do it yourself "R-134a convert kit" and 4 pounds of
>R-134a and the car is Ice Cold!  The convert kit goes for $39.00 retail
>and R-134a does not require a linsence to use it.  The kit adds some
>special oil into the system with a pattented fill kit.  Some say the
>higher pressure of the R-134a system can cause weak parts in old R-12
>systems to fail when you try to convert.
>
>Most certified repair stations will be glad to remove your old R-12 since
>it is worth so much money.  Some will convert your R-12 system to R-134a
>for $70.00 total, but if it breaks, it is your problem.  $70.00 beats
>$600.00 or $1000.00 for a result that the con-artisits will not stand
>behind anyway.
>
>What I want to know is, How did they fool me?  Who tests A/C systems with
>compressed air?  How did they make the accumulator get hot?  I went back
>to the shop, and they said they did not use air, but recycled R-12 to
>test it.  If they did that, why did the system not get cold?
>
>I alerted the local media and elected officals of this scam.  I suggested
>they do a consumer alert or a hidden camera investigation;

Dennis, I think you did the right thing.  I've ~never~ heard of using
compressed air to test a system.  I'd think that would be plain stupidity.
I doubt ~any~ station's air compressor can provide dry enough air for a
refrigeration system.  It's hard to say what they did to heat up the
evaporator.  For all we know, they could have cranked up the heater, filled
the A/C system up with air, jumperred the low pressure cutout switch, and
let the compressor pump hot air around for a while.  In the R-12
environment, the pressure is almost directly related to the temperature.  If
the reefrigerant's pressure at a given point is 112psi, it's safe to say
it'll be about 112'F.  At 35psi, you'd expect a temperature of about 35'F.
Maybe they did some tricks with pressurization.  Maybe their compressed air
got enough moisture in the system to freeze up the expansion valve.  It's
hard to say.  I'd definately recommend replacing the filter/drier if you
haven't already (unless the a/c system is working fine now)  If this gives
out (fills up) you'll get moisture floating around in the system, and
collect on the expansion valve, where it freezes and plugs up the system
(this causes it to blow nice and cold for five to ten minutes, then suddenly
start blowing warm air)  It's strongly advised to replace the filter/drier
~anytime~ the system is openned up at all.  Ambient air usually has
sufficient moisture to fill up the thing.  One thing's for certain, this
place doesn't sound very trustworthy.  I'd ask to see their certifications,
because technicians have to be specially certified to handle refrigeration
systems now.  I can't remember if the ASE certification is sufficient.  It
seems to me they have to pass a seperate test for A/C work.  I can't
remember what it's called.

Good luck!


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@cis.nmclites.edu
             500 4th Ave.          | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Box 1255              | Montana State University-Northern
             Havre, Montana 59501  | http://cis.nmclites.edu/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass ~Dead 425~
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
     "FAST FWD" (Soon)   | '67 Toronado 425
                    Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

From: Eric Aksomitis <aksomi@cs.uregina.ca>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:50:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Today I'm Broken???

On Mon, 26 May 1997, Robert J. Barry wrote:

> >wire?  It coughed twice, but never very much.  There's fuel in the
> >filter, yet the accelerator pump will not pump fuel!!
>
> OK, first, which carb gasket are you talking about having replaced? IF you
> took apart the carb, it's possible that you inlet valve is stuck shut, or
> perhaps the float is jamming it shut. Does it run on starting fluid or if
> you prime the throttles with a squirt of gasoline? If so, then your carb is
> the culprit.
No, just the bottom gasket was replaced, and it ran home!
It's an inline filter, new fuel pump, which pumps fuels no problem
through the filter.,
Priming it by filling the float through that little vent-hole on top and
putting some gas in the carb directly has no effect, so I doubt it's a
fuel problem.

> If it doesn't fire up with the above, then it's possibly the ignition. Has
> your timing slipped? Those would be the likely problems.
I don't know enough about cars to say if it's good or not, but it has
spark on ª1 and ª3 (didn't check every one).  But they put a new
distributor cap and plugs on it, so tonight the timing light comes out!

Anything specific to look for (ie slipped timing chain!)???

Thanx for the insights so far....

.....Shameless but short self-promo sig file Version 2.1.....
Eric Aksomitis:
Virtual Junkyard: Current count -> 5 vehicles
Oldsmobile Index: Current Count -> 8 vehicles
http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~aksomi/       mailto:aksomi@cs.uregina.ca
Last update: 970504
.....End of self-promo                                  .....

------------------------------

From: Eric Aksomitis <aksomi@cs.uregina.ca>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 20:57:00 -0300
Subject: Re: Some Questions

On Mon, 26 May 1997, Richard Staley wrote:
> I've been saving these questions for quite a while now and I'm ready
> to let them loose. First of all what's the difference between cast
> Pistons and forged Pistons?
Basically, as the name suggests, how they're built, specifics are lost on
me, but I know
from ski-doo's forged are supposed to be denser and stronger, with fewer
metal flaws on the microscopic level??

> My fuel gauge says full all the time
Assuming the float works, the ground wire going from your gage to the gas
tank is not connected (E all the time results from it grounding to the frame)
Of course, this is from my day's of a '75 chev 1/2 ton, but Most gages
should work the same??
Find the wire and ground it to the frame and see if it goes to E.  This
means the gage works, leaving only the float and the wire..

.....Shameless but short self-promo sig file Version 2.1.....
Eric Aksomitis:
Virtual Junkyard: Current count -> 5 vehicles
Oldsmobile Index: Current Count -> 8 vehicles
http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~aksomi/       mailto:aksomi@cs.uregina.ca
Last update: 970504
.....End of self-promo                                  .....

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:59:32 -0300
Subject: Re: Toronado Wiring Problem

KarlAunan@aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 97-05-26 13:12:14 EDT, Bob wrote:
>
> >  I recently acquired a 1966 "TORO", and I love it!!  That's
> >  unusual, because I have always been a sports car dude.
>
> As far as your wiring problem, I will have to refer you to (you guessed
> it).....
>
>     66 Toro
> The /\   /\ and Mike.
>
> (Response time may vary)

Huh?  [The Toro and Mike put down their Menorial Day beers]

Good info.  You can visit http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/torolist.html and
access our FAQ to see if Sparky's got anything there for you.  Also
consider joining the Toro mail list for help with specific problems.

You have to remove the horn button and steering wheel to access the turn
signal and cam assembly.  What's not working, anyway?

And congratulations on owning a really fine car!

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike

- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 21:02:22 -0300
Subject: Re: '87 442 questions

At 07:29 PM 5/26/97 -0300, Kevin Wong wrote:
>A friend of mine is seriously considering the purchase of an '87 442:
>VIN 1G3GR1192HP316316, black, no G80, no T-tops, but with a power driver's
>seat.  Is there anything in particular to check for?

Check the rear of the frame behind the rear wheels very carefully. I have
had G-bodies as old as 87 with that section of the frame completely rotted
off. Got an 85 Calais now that is a beautiful car, but the rear frame is
rotted away ;-(  Make sure it isn't patched up and painted to look good.

>What would be the
>best way to make sure the car isn't stolen with a transplanted VIN
>tag under the windshield?

Run a title history search at the local DMV, find a build sheet, check
engine block ID's against the VIN, etc.
See if it has a 3.73 rear by the axle code, check the tranny ID.

>The car has supposedly traveled (1)25,000 kms
>(78,000 miles), the current (3rd) owner is asking $7000 Cdn. (just over
>$5000 U.S.),

Wow an 85-87 442 for sale under $10,000....has to be something wrong with it
;-) (just kidding)

> the undercarriage is very rust-free and the door bottoms are
>perfect, which supports the 'never seen winter' claim.

Again, check closely. These areas can be patched very well and if done
professionally it takes a good eye to tell.

>The paint is 1 year old, the engine/transmission pans are dry, the A/C is
1-1.5 lbs
>low, and the A.I.R. pump is noisy.  My friend would appreciate any
>advice/suggestions/comments!   I'll forward all relevant posts to him.

With a new paint job, definitely check for patched body damage and/or frame
patch

------------------------------

From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 21:05:02 -0300
Subject: Re: A/C repair Scam's buyer beware!

Hi Dennis,

> parts.  They had gadges hooked up, and said they had compressed air in
> the system to test it, they had me put my hand on the accumalator to show
> me it was "hot", they said it should be cold if the compressor was
> working.  They said that the expansion valve had a obstruction and needed
> to be replaced along with the compressor.

When an A/C system is disassembled for repairs, it should stay 'open'
to the atmosphere for as short a time as possible.  Leak testing a system
with compressed air is an act of sheer negligence/thrift.  Also, air
does not offer the same pressure/temperature characteristics as R-12, so
even if the system were _fully_ charged with air, I would not expect the
accumulator to be cold when the compressor was engaged.  Normally, when a
system is leak tested, only a small amount of refrigerant is used to
pressurize the system; this is not sufficient for an A/C system to
provide any cooling.  They probably used a gas torch to heat up the
accumulator prior to calling you over, or possibly it was just warm from
exposure to engine heat.  If there was an obstruction near the
orifice tube, the high side would see excessively high pressures, but the
accumulator would still be relatively cool.  Since the system was only
being leak tested (i.e. not fully charged), their statement is completely
meaningless and fraudulent in nature.

> Later I added a do it yourself "R-134a convert kit" and 4 pounds of
> R-134a and the car is Ice Cold!  The convert kit goes for $39.00 retail
> and R-134a does not require a linsence to use it.  The kit adds some
> special oil into the system with a pattented fill kit.  Some say the
> higher pressure of the R-134a system can cause weak parts in old R-12
> systems to fail when you try to convert.

The higher operating pressures are probably the least of your concerns!
When you did the conversion, did you flush out all of the existing mineral
oil?  Changing the accumulator only removes a couple ounces, so there
would be several more in the compressor, evaporator, and condenser.
R-134a is not compatible with mineral oil, which was used in your R-12
system.  R-134a can irritate the eyes, nose and throat, and exposure to
R-134a has been shown to cause testicular cancer in lab animals.  If the
special oil in your conversion kit was PAG (poly-alkene glycol), note that
this lubricant is 100 times more sensitive to moisture as mineral oil, and
decomposes when exposed to trace amount of chlorine containing things,
like the aluminum chloride coatings inside an ex-R-12 system like yours.
To ensure the longevity of your A/C, I'd completely flush everything
out and use R-12 or R-406a.  Check out http://worldserver.com/R-406A

Kevin Wong

------------------------------

From: MROTHE <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 22:00:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end ?

dayc wrote:
>
Is the 69 H/O grind more radical than the W
> series cams?  It (69) seems more close to some Toronado cams.  If anyone
> has any thoughts please share them.
>
> Corey D
> dayc@ix.netcom.com
> 70 Cutlass S 455


The 69 H/O cam was basically the same cam as the Toro.  No radical
monster here.  I'm not sure of the part number but it was something like
.472 lift with 285/287 (I think) duration, int/exh timing at 24-81/74-33
respectively.  The 68 H/O non-air cam was the ª402194 cam with
advertised .474 lift, 308 duration.  Really cool idle sound too.  This
cam was used in the 69 and 70 W-31, and W-30 auto cars too.

I am running 3.08 gears in the back of my 71 442, with a (should I dare
say) Mondello JM-20-22 cam.  It really barks, and runs like a striped
monkey.  I originally tried the JM-18-20, but that thing was a real
DOG!! BOW WOW!

My suggestion is to try the 308 cam, and see what you think.  I have
used one before in a 455, and it does come on strong on the upper end.

My 2 cents

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

From: MROTHE <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 22:19:05 -0300
Subject: Re: '87 442 questions

Kevin Wong wrote:
>
> A friend of mine is seriously considering the purchase of an '87 442:
> VIN 1G3GR1192HP316316, black, no G80, no T-tops, but with a power driver's
> seat.  Is there anything in particular to check for?  What would be the
> best way to make sure the car isn't stolen with a transplanted VIN
> tag under the windshield?

Kevin,

The VIN "9" engine code shows it as a 442.  Check the block ª to be sure
(on a little pad on the block under the "7" on the driver's head) If it
has the build sheet or the service sticker (in trunk lid) look for W-42
option code.  And it better have the dual snorkel intake with a chrome
lid.  Also, check the Tranny code on the passenger side of the tranny.
"OZ" should be the code I think.  At least it is on the 85.  Sometimes
(and I say this because they DIDN'T always put them on) there is a
little cowl tag on under the hood.  This will also have the W-42 option
listed on it.  I talked with Arlington assembly plant back in 85 because
mine didn't come with one, but another guy's had one.  They said that if
they had them when the car was built, they put them on, but if not, oh
well......that's because they was wanting to go strictly with the trunk
lid mounted service sticker. (My '87 came with one, go figure)

Here's something a lot of mid 80's 442/Hurst owners don't even know
about.  This item is indigenous ONLY to the 83-87 Hurst/442.  Look for a
"kickdown" switch above the gas pedal.  This looks like the old Turbo
400 passing gear detent switch with a little slide switch activated at
full throttle.  This is actually the full throttle A/C compressor clutch
cutout switch.  It cuts out the A/C clutch when it's mashed to the
floor.  If everything checks out, you can pretty much figure it to be a
gennie.  Also, check to see if the tire pressure sticker is still on the
driver's door, it will list 215/65/15 as the tire size, again, ONLY on
the Hurst/442 in those years.

As to check for the legality of the car, look at the title, and run a
title search or VIN search on it.  Hopefully it won't turn up as stolen.

$7000 is still quite a lot, but if it's clean......  There's a 87 442
with T-Tops around my area for $5,300.00 in a local trader paper.
Anyone interested?  I can check the number tomorrow at work if so.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

From: DJV442@aol.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 22:39:01 -0300
Subject: Re: 69 Convertible

i just bought a 71 cutlass convertible and have owned many in the past.the
problem areas i look for is in the rear sections of the frame(under the trunk
and over the rearend/horseshoe area for rot/cracks in the frame)i would
inspect the remainder of the frame(forward)and check the floors/especially
around/over the frame area.also,check the trunk area carefully,especially
where the quarters meet the inner fenderwells and the very rear outer
corners.hope this helps....good luck....DJV442@
AOL.COM

DAN
71 cutlass conv.
75 cutlass "s"

------------------------------

From: DJV442@aol.com
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 22:45:36 -0300
Subject: Re: Today I'm Broken???

this would not explain why the accelerator pump won't pump fuel but otherwise
i would pull the ignition module from the HEI and have it tested.this
happened to me once out of the clear blue.car was fine,stopped at a
store,came out,car wouldn't start and this was the problem.it is possible to
have spark and this be defective...hope this helps...DJV442@AOL.COM

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:06:25 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds Chat Link URL

> This reminds me of the IRC effort a while back . . . . there is an
> ªoldsmobile channel on IRC which, in my opinion, has less lag most times
> than Web chats.  I've dropped by the olds channel, though, and nobody goes
> there, either.  Is it time to gauge the interest again for a weekly
> ªoldsmobile chat??

I agree that the IRC has less delays than the web based chat, and more
options also.  The Olds IRC channel used to be Tue and Wen from 7pm -
?.  However, with the advent of spring, most people were to busy to show
up at 7pm.  The channel still exists and is still available for use.
I'd be intersted in picking a later time to hold a weekly chat.  How
about Thur at 8:30 Central?

- -Dan

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:13:08 -0300
Subject: Parts for sale

68/69 Working power antenna               $125
69    442 Taillight assemblies and lenses  $50
      Opti-clean bottle, cap and brackets  $25
68    442 Glove box door (black or blue)   $20
69    442 Glove box door (red)             $20
      14x7 SSI, caps and trim rings (set) $175

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:15:55 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear-end ?

At 01:27 PM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>Jim is the original pnª for that cam 400165?
>Overlap        57
>Dur int/exh  285/287
>Lift int/exh   .472/.472
>
>If so, where did you get that grind cam?
>
>thanks,
>Corey D
>dayc@ix.netcom.com
>70 Cutlass S -455
>
Corey

        The specs on my cam are:
PNª 402194
Overlap         84
Dur int/exh    308
Lift int/exh    .474/.474

        I got this cam though a place called Engine Service Group out of
Lansing, MI.
Cost was $111.21 for the cam and lifters. The grind your talking about is
the std. 442 and Auto W-30 cam. We put that cam in my buddies W-30 Auto
convertible and now he wishes he would have put the cam I did in. You can
get that one through Supercars Unlimited in Oregon.

Jim Chermack

------------------------------

From: "Richard Rodriguez" <Inkdick@msn.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:24:40 -0300
Subject: About my Oldsmobile..

I have a 1971Delta88custom..I have been having a problem with it over
heating..I have changed out the thermostat,Radiator,water pump and various
hoses..I really love this car and NEED it..Please send help...What should I
try next...Seems as though it isn't circulating very good...HELP!

------------------------------

From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 22:42:44 -0300
Subject: Re: '87 442 questions

Jason, Mike: thanks for your responses!  From the relatively brief look we
had, the underbody appears to have been undercoated some time ago, the
driveshaft was blister free unlike another '87 we inspected, and there
were no signs of a recent coverup in the rear frame area.  We'll
get to inspect it up on a hoist tomorrow.  Unfortunately, the title search
suggestion won't work in Ontario, Canada, since cars up here don't carry
a title; each owner is issued an ownership at the time of purchase.  Any
private sale here requires that the seller obtains an information
package, which lists outstanding liens and all the previous owners for
that particular VIN.  This one had a very nice dual snorkel air cleaner
w/chrome lid; we looked at one on Saturday that was missing this as well
as the leather wrapped steering wheel.  We'll have to check the engine and
transmission ID's and have a closer look at the various stickers. Thanks
again!

Kevin Wong

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:41:54 -0300
Subject: Re: About my Oldsmobile..

At 11:24 PM 5/26/97 -0300, you wrote:
>I have a 1971Delta88custom..I have been having a problem with it over
>heating..I have changed out the thermostat,Radiator,water pump and various
>hoses..I really love this car and NEED it..Please send help...What should I
>try next...Seems as though it isn't circulating very good...HELP!
>

Have the system power flushed. It sounds like there's something blocking a
passage or something.

Jim Chermack

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Mon, 26 May 1997 23:45:47 -0300
Subject: Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)

> > of the top boot.  I would try using a can of spray-on weatherstrip
> > adhesive, I beleive 3M makes some-

I'll try that.

> > > Also, I'm still looking for a bumperjack base and some other misc items
> > > for the jacking equipment.
>
> That can't be too hard to find -- where are those junkyard guys when you
> need them? ;-)

Hello, junkyard guys.  Where are you?

>
> Actually on the '68 there is some sort of bracket that holds the jack
> post down, I think it goes along with a wingnut/stud assembly on the
> floor of the trunk (not the long one that holds the tire down). If you
> find 2, I could use one of those too, since the bracket is missing on mine.

You are correct, the part is sort of j shaped.  That is the part that I
am after. It should be on any 66-70 car that has a floor mounted spare
(regardless of wheel option).

- -Dan

------------------------------

From: Dan Williams <dr_olds@pitnet.net>
Date: Tue, 27 May 1997 00:02:50 -0300
Subject: Re: Convertible top pads (and still looking for jacking equip)

>
> > > > Also, I'm still looking for a bumperjack base and some other misc
items > > > > for the jacking equipment.

The base is GM part number 3997317 and can be found on 65-72 cars that
have a square shaped mast (jack post).

>
> >
> > Actually on the '68 there is some sort of bracket that holds the jack
> > post down, I think it goes along with a wingnut/stud assembly on the
> > floor of the trunk (not the long one that holds the tire down). If you
> > find 2, I could use one of those too, since the bracket is missing on
mine. > > You are correct, the part is sort of j shaped.  That is the part
that I > am after. It should be on any 66-70 car that has a floor mounted
spare > (regardless of wheel option). >

The clamp is GM part number 587989 and nbe found on 65-70 cars.

------------------------------

From: "Easton,Jeffrey" <Jeff.Easton@abbott.com>
Date: Tue, 27 May 1997 00:09:51 -0300
Subject: 1969 455 Engine

I decided to pass on the 1969 455 engine I mentioned last week.
However, I did go and look at it and if anyone else in the Chicago
area would like it, the info is below;

  Basically, the donor car is a 1969 Delta 88.  The engine is
a 2bbl 455, hooked to a 3 speed auto (presumably a TH400
but I didnt wallow in the mud to verify :-)

  The selling party is the son of the original owner, who
recently passed away.  The car has 60,000 miles on it.
The car is worthless, with rust having taken its toll on
every piece of sheetmetal on the car.  The car looks
driveable, but I wouldnt plan any long distance trips
in it.  It may get you and the engine to your place - then
again maybe not :-).  The seller realizes the car is not
in a restorable (or safe) condition and so far has refused to sell
it to the local kids because of its condition.  The car
has sat in the garage for the most part since around 1976.
It had plates on it that expired in 1995 and the emissions
sticker on the window listed 1994 as the next test time.

The car was a basic holiday sedan with A/C and and AM radio
as the only noticable options.  Rust holes in the fenders,
roof, quarters, trunklid and firewall are pretty bad.  The
owner said they had to weld up the tranny cross member a
few years ago when it broke.

He realizes its only value is for its engine.  He's asking
$500 for the car.  Contact Jerry Barz at (815) 723-6080
if your interested.  The car is located in Joliet, Ill.

Hope this helps someone.

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970 442  4-Speed

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª694
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