To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #613


oldsmobile-digest          Tuesday, 15 April 1997       Volume 01 : Number 613

Re: 1990 Vintage
Re: 70 olds 's
Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
PARTS WANTED
Re: 81 cutlass
Re: 1990 Vintage
Late model 442
Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
Re: How to remove window handle regulator?
Re: Handling Problem
Re: 70 olds 's
Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine
Re: Handling Problem
Re: Tranny Went Kablooie!
Decal Catalog
Re: Handling Problem
Uphostery out of country
Re: Late model 442
Re: Need Favor - '68/'69 Owner
Re: Cutlass 442 ???
Re: Dick Miller Racing!
Ramrod 350
Re: Handling Problem
Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)
Torque Converter for Swap
Re: 442/Cutlass Parts For Sale
Re: 1990 Vintage
3.something rearend
Re: 81 cutlass rt
Re: Cutlass 442 ???
Re: Torque Converter for Swap
Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)
Re: 81 cutlass rt
Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine
Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
Value of Oldsmobiles
Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)
66 -442
RE: Re[2]: rearend ratio
Re: Value of Oldsmobiles
address
Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)
Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: "Easton,Jeffrey" <Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 09:59:45 -0300
Subject: Re: 1990 Vintage

From: David Lincoln <lincoln@ebicom.net>

>The car also has an oil leak.  Dealer said it was leaking (they think)
>where the the distributor would be ( if this car had a distributor), and
>there is a plate with an "O" ring there.  Said that they would have to
>tear it down, and remove the rear head to get to it!
>Seems like drastic measures to fix an oil leak!  But he said it's about
>time to replace the timing belt anyway.  Does anyone know much of the
>anatomy of these engines?  Is this the likely spot to develop an oil
>leak on this engine?

I thought the 3.4L used a timing chain not a belt.  If so a chain
should last a lot longer than 50k miles.

Also, the basic block design has been distributorless for so long
I doubt it has a block off plate.

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970 442  4-Speed

------------------------------

From: "Easton,Jeffrey" <Jeffrey.Easton@add.ssw.abbott.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:12:03 -0300
Subject: Re: 70 olds 's

From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@leba.net>

>On Mon, 14 Apr 1997, Easton,Jeffrey wrote:

>> From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@leba.net>
>>
>> Does the '69/'70 Grad Prix and the '70 Monte Carlo have any relation
>> to the Cutlass Supreme notchback style?

>Duh!  Yes, both the Grand Prix and the Monte Carlo are 57 notchback
>styles.  Two of my favorites and I forgot all about them.  I believe I
>read somewhere where the Monte is considered an A body, but the Grand Prix
>is not?

In '69 the GP switched from a different platform to A body.  I think it
was called the modified A platform.  In '70 chevy came out with the Monte
to compete with the successful GP.  I've seen a lot written about the
GP and Monte but never was it mentioned that the Cutlass Supreme was on
the same platform, although I always suspected it was.

Make mine a '69 GP 428 w/ 4-speed please... :-)

- -Jeff
jeffrey.easton@add.ssw.abbott.com

1970  442 4-speed

------------------------------

From: Lloyd <equitygroup@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:15:48 -0300
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel

Robert J. Barry wrote:
>
> At 09:27 PM 4/14/97 -0400, you wrote:
> >I have a 1982 Oldsmobile Custom Crusier with nearly 400,000 miles on it.
> >The original engine was very bad and required constant repair, but
> >Oldsmobile replaced in 1990 with a new engine and that engine has
> >performed very well with nearly 300,000 miles and running vell today.
> >
> >My question is where can I get another new Diesel V8 engine?  My local
> >dealer says that they are not available anymore.
>
> I believe that both AC-Delco and GM Goodwrench *rebuilt* 350 diesel engines
> are available. You can check their web-page to confirm this.
>
> If all else fails, have yours rebuilt by a competent diesel mechanic (they
> were used in Ch*vy trucks, so a truck place should be able to handle it).
>
> BTW, congratulations on that mileage! What kind of MPG did you get for that
> distance?
> _______________________________________________________
> Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
> Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918
Over the life of the car it has been above 20 MPG the highest average
was 27MPG for about three years on this engine.  It is now about 23MGP.

The only complaint I have is not enough power on the hills.

------------------------------

From: GARY RUBRICH <RUBRICH@bwaafs.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:21:28 -0300
Subject: PARTS WANTED

Hey everybody,
 I'm looking for some parts for a 76-79 GM "X" body (omega,nova,
skylark ect.). What I need is the 3 piece rear bumper filler panels
(they go in-between the body and bumper) in very good used condition
or nos. Please e-mail me back if you have these parts.
                                                   Gary
                                                   72 442 (350)

------------------------------

From: katana72@juno.com (Rob T)
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:21:06 -0300
Subject: Re: 81 cutlass

On Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:45:18 -0300 "Douglas J Harkema"
<harkema2@pilot.msu.edu> writes:
>I just bought a 81 cutlass with a pretty nice body.  The motor is
>shot.  I have
>a 1970 gold 350 and am planning on putting it in this car.  The car
>currently
>has a v-6.  I know that the swap is possible.  I am wondering if I
>will need to
>replace the drive shaft, I know I will need a new tranny also but will
>the
>drive shaft be the right length.  also I would like to know what the
>easiest
>way is to line up where the new motor mounts need to be placed.
>
>Can anyone help me
>
>just getting ready!!!!!
>thanks
>Doug
>
I've done this!!~ The 350 motor will work well, but you'll need to change
the springs in the front. A stock 350 motor mount kit will work just fine
and... the th200 will bolt up. The th350 tranny will also work, without
changing the driveshaft. I can go out and look at the car and tell you
which bolt holes to use to mount the engine to as the motor is out of the
car. One problem I ran across is emissions. Several states have emissions
tests or inspections and will not accept an older motor with a newer
vehicle. Hopefully, yours is not one of them. Also, DON'T  forget the
grounds. That caused a little problem for me after installation. You'll
also experience some minor problems with the speedo and dash indicators.
They'll work, but sometimes lights will come on very dimly. Something to
do with the computer. Good Luck, e-mail me back if you need any other
assistance.

Katana72

------------------------------

From: cowancom@pipeline.com
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:36:04 -0300
Subject: Re: 1990 Vintage

I too just purchased a cutluss convertable. I took time to find a 92 with a
3.1. I have seen many of the problems you stated with the 3.4. There are
also other gremlins associated with that engine. That is why GM stopped
using that engine in Cameros and Firebirds and started using the good old
buick 3.8.
Also, Oldmobile was being pushed by GM to use the remaing 3.4s in stock in
the upcoming Intrega, but because of all the problems will use the 3.8 for
1998 and go to the "Olds only" 3.5 "short north v-6" based on the Cadillac
Northstar V-8 in 1999. Now GM is using these engines up in their new mini
vans they cant give away. It is the only engine you can have.
I was able to purchase a bumper to bumper 7-100,000 warranty on my 92 with
48,000 miles on it through AFI Managment in Arlington Texas for $814.00. I
thought this was a bargan as far as warrantys go. AFI,s ª,s if you want them
are 1.800.654.8455 or 1.800.231.9094.
We love our car any are planning to go to the Olds Club of Florida Drive-In
at the end of the month in Orlando. I also have left Olds a request of data
on their web site looking for a copy of my original window sticker and
production ª breakdown. I'll let you know how that went when Olds gets back
in touch with me.

        Tim and Donna Cowan
        1992 Cutlass convertable

------------------------------

From: Thomas Martin <marttj@pcmail1.csg.mot.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:35:26 -0300
Subject: Late model 442

What makes the engine code "9" special compared to the Engine code "Y"?

I have heard carb, cam, and chrome aircleaner lid.

Not bad for a 40 hp increase.  Can I just swap my cam for a 442 cam and
get some power increase?  What is the carb changes?

I am considering going 3.73 and 200 4R to make a "sleeper" Cutlass.

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme 307

------------------------------

From: pteubel@safety1st.com (Peter Teubel)
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 10:48:22 -0300
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel

        Which engine do you have?  The 5.9L or the 6.2L?  I've heard
     nothing but horror stories about the 5.9L.  The 6.2L wasn't that much
     better from what I've heard.  You seem to be the exception.

        Anyone else out there had any experiences (good/bad/indifferent)
     with GM diesels?


     Peter G. Teubel

     pteubel@safety1st.com
     '51 98 (50% complete....currently a driveway ornament) 48K
     '52 Plymouth (Project-in-waiting....driveway ornament ª2) ??K
     '73 Imperial (a.k.a. USS Enterprise)  28K
     '82 98 (a.k.a USS Nimitz) 80K
     '84 C10 P-up (junkyard hauler) 273K
     '86 Ciera (Wife's car) 70K
     '88 Subaru Turbo (Distainful communter vehicle that actually gets out
                       of its own way) 59K



______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
 Author:  Lloyd <equitygroup@earthlink.net> at imail Date:    4/14/97 10:27
PM


I have a 1982 Oldsmobile Custom Crusier with nearly 400,000 miles on it.
The original engine was very bad and required constant repair, but
Oldsmobile replaced in 1990 with a new engine and that engine has
performed very well with nearly 300,000 miles and running vell today.

My question is where can I get another new Diesel V8 engine?  My local
dealer says that they are not available anymore.

Sincerely,

Lloyd


------------------------------

From: Timothy Carl Hietpas <thietpas@csd.uwm.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:17:19 -0300
Subject: Re: How to remove window handle regulator?

On Mon, 14 Apr 1997, Glenn Connors wrote:

> At 14:10 4/13/97 -0300, you wrote:
> >I'm getting my VC ready for a good paintjob. I want to remove the
doorpanels > >but can't figure out how to remove the retaining clip that holds
the window > >handle regulator. > >Any suggestions? > > >   In a pinch you can
use a piece of solid wire such as a piece of coat > hanger and form a small
hook at the end of it.  By sliding the hook behind > the handle and then
turning it 90 degrees you should be able to snag the > clip and pull it off
the crank stem. >   The clip looks like this and slips into two slots cut into
the handle stem > and clasps the slot in the regulator shaft. > >
\    / >                     )  ( >                    /    \ >
(______) > >  In order to replace it, slide the clip back onto the handle
stem but only > as far as the flat area right before it would snap into the
slots.  Put the > handle back on the regulator and then with a small screw
driver or other > such tool that would fit behind the window crank push the
clip into place. > > >  Glenn >  '69 4-4-2 > To remove these
little clips "sometimes called Jesus clips cause thats what you yell when the
things shoots off and you can't find it again" requires the most sophisicated
tool you will even own.  Take a shoe-string and wrap it around the window
crank once. Pull the string back and forth and the crank will come right out
and the clip will fall into your hand and not the neighbors yard!!!  Sorry
about the little pun....

Tim

thietpas@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu
1987 Olds 442Plates [1987 W42]

------------------------------

From: kozhill@titanlink.com (Jo-Anne Hillier)
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:24:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Handling Problem

Just take it to a front end shop and get all the components checked.My
guess the ball joints.
Scott
kozhill@titanlink.com

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:46:54 -0300
Subject: Re: 70 olds 's

At 09:12 AM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>In '69 the GP switched from a different platform to A body.  I think it
>was called the modified A platform.  In '70 chevy came out with the Monte
>to compete with the successful GP.  I've seen a lot written about the
>GP and Monte but never was it mentioned that the Cutlass Supreme was on
>the same platform, although I always suspected it was.

As I understand it, the CS used the same G-body body shell (though the
external panels are different, I suppose the engineering between them is
shared), but on the A-body chassis. So it is called an A-body

>Make mine a '69 GP 428 w/ 4-speed please... :-)

There was a black one of those cars on the street where I lived in Yonkers
last year, in semi-rough but daily-driveable condition; probably one of
around 160 so equipped, and not driven much. I considered making an offer,
but already had too many cars.

Though the extra wheelbase did show up on the front fenders, I also believe
that the body was longer between the rear of the door and the front of the
rear wheel-well opening. On this car, with no vinyl top, the extra length
was obvious, and in fact looked kind of awkward. The 60-series tires on the
stock 14" Rally II rims also looked lost in those wheelwells.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:46:52 -0300
Subject: Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine

At 03:39 AM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Is there anyone out there that can tell me what the performance
>characteristics would be by installing a 350R cam in a 330 ?
>Considering the 45deg lifter angle of the 330 compared to 39deg
>lifter angle of 350, how much would this affect lift, duration
>timing, etc.  I installed one (some years ago) before knowing

Hmm, that'd be interesting, as one cylinder bank would have its camshaft
timing advanced by 6', while the other would be retarded by 6' (assuming the
timing-chain set would install the camshaft straight-up in relation to a 39'
engine; if you degreed the cam according to the ª1 lobe, however, the odd
bank would be installed straight up, but the even bank would be 12'
retarded!). The reason it's not 3' advanced and retarded (totaling the 6'
difference in the cam bank angles) is because the camshaft degrees are
measured at the crank, which is double the actual camshaft degrees (hence,
the 328' W-30 cam did not have a lifter lobe that was above the base circle
for almost the entire lobe, but rather only for 164' of the cam's circumfrence

>about the different cam bank angle.  The engine runs strong but
>seems sluggish, is the anyway to compensate through timing, etc
>to get proper performance. Or should I just "bite the bullet"
>pull the cam and put in a new Mondello special ?!?!?! HELP

It's not going to run right with your current cam, no matter what you do.
Indexing it to one bank would only make the other bank worse. Spring the
$120 for a new cam, and the $40 for the new lifters; you'll be glad you did.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 05:49:53 -0300
Subject: Re: Handling Problem

     I get the same problem with the 235/60R15's on my '84 H/O.  There's
     probably nothing wrong with your car, although an alignment (esp.
     check for sufficient toe-in and negative caster) couldn't hurt.  Wider
     tires tend to do that, the fatter rubber likes to follow the grooves
     in the road.  Especially bad around here since all the studded tires
     in the winter have made grooves in the road.  Now I know exactly how
     my old Tyco slot cars that I had when I was little felt.

     About your 307 HP question, it should have 140HP and I think 225
     ft-lbs of torque stock.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Handling Problem Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    4/14/97 7:37 PM


     I recently aquired BFGoodrich 255/60/15 Radials and new shocks on all
     four wheels for my 1981 Delta 88.  Although this definitly improved
     handling especialy at high speeds (i.e. ' welcome to ticket-land '),
     the car is all over the  road especialy at slower speeds

------------------------------

From: Andy Geeting <geetinag@miavx1.acs.muohio.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:00:11 -0300
Subject: Re: Tranny Went Kablooie!

At 06:06 PM 4/14/97 -0300, you wrote:
>At 12:52 PM 4/14/97 -0300, you wrote:
>>Hey everyone,
>>
>>     Well, this past Sunday my transmission (in my '87 Cutlass,200-4R)
>>decided it had enough. I pulled off my road and gave it some gas and it felt
>>like I was pushing a brick wall. Gave it a little more gas and it started to
>>jerk and finally as I began to go up a hill, it went. I had no drive in any
>>gear. It was like I had neutral in every gear including reverse. I checked
>>the fluid and it seemed fine except that it looked a little yellow. Could I
>>have antifreeze leaking into my tranny fluid?
>>     The funny thing was that it just seemed to happen. Friday it was fine.
>>Saturday it started acting up. I pulled out of my driveway and it didn't
>>want to shift out of first gear. when it finally did, it jerked real hard
>>and went into 2nd. All day I kept hearing these clunk kind of noises when I
>>was driving around town. It would happen after I would stop coasting and
>>give it a little gas. It was so bad at one point that my girlfriend actually
>>looked out the back to see of something fell off. A couple more symptoms
>>were: it didn't want to shift to overdrive right away. It felt like I was
>>pushing a brick wall when I'd accelerate from a dead stop (meaning I'd have
>>to have it almost to the floor to get it to move) but didn't seem too bad
>>after it shifted into 2nd.
>>     Well, that's all I can think of right now. Sorry this got so long but I
>>wanted to try and be as detailed as possible. Can someone tell me what the
>>problem might be? I know that's pretty tough considering it could almost be
>>anything. Sounds to me like I'm looking at that rebuild I've been wanting
>to do.
>>Thanks in advance!
>>
>>Andy Geeting
>>'87 Cutlass Supreme
>>'88 Cutlass Supreme
>>'74 Delta 88 convertible
>>'78 Caprice wagon
>>'36 Plymouth coupe
>>
>>
>>
>When your TH200 will only go into reverse, you have had in the not too
>distant past very low oil! (Or possibly burned out oil, TH's require an oil
>change at about 25,000 miles).  You've burned out the clutches.  I had this
>happen once, the oil cooler fiting at the bottom of the radiator cracked
>while I was out.  I noticed the oil on the ground, (it was too late already)
>and got out a wrench, and some teflon tape.  Tefloned the joint, added some
>Dexron, and started to drive home.  Got about 2 miles away, and it stopped
>going forwards.  I drove home in reverse.
>
>Anyway, throw away the TH200, get a TH350 and go.  It is a direct replacment
>as long as you get all the TH350 stuff, ie, dipstick tube and dipstick,
>flywheel cover.  If you buy a rebuilt, make sure it has a factory kick down
>cable.  The adjustable cables at the top, do not secure as well as the
>factory.  Also, there are two different atachment clips at the carb., make
>sure you have the one that matches.  It is a bolt out, bolt in proposition.
>
>The Wiz
>
>P.S.  When the TH200 went in my '84 Delta, a rebuilder traded me even; my
>core TH200 for a TH350.  Why I don't know, but that tranny now has 90,000
>miles on it, 1/2 of which behind a mild 455 and it still is operating fine.
>
>
> How badly will this affect my gas mileage? What about the computer and the
lock-up torque converter? Can I use a lock-up torque converter with TH-350?
If not will this affect my computer? The reason I ask this is because I have
to drive to college everyday and I need a good, reliable car. This is my
problem, I want performance and reliability too. Is that possible? Thanks.

Andy Geeting
'87 Cutlass Supreme
'88 Cutlass Supreme Classic Brougham
'74 Delta 88 convertible
'78 Caprice wagon
'36 Plymouth coupe

------------------------------

From: "Mark Cornea (R)" <mcornea@ford.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:09:06 -0300
Subject: Decal Catalog

Olds guys and gals -

My new 20th Anniversary Decal catalog (1935-1992) has finally
arrived. There are many new items, including production figures from '64-'84.
For my new catalog, please send $3.00 to:

Mark Cornea Reproductions
P.O.Box 531445
Livonia,  MI  48153-1445

If you have any questions, please E-Mail direct at the below address,
Thank you.

                                                       ___  ___
                                              /     /    / /  /
                                             / __  /  --/ /  /
       Mark Cornea (Dr Decal) `70 442 stick /_/ /_/ ___/ /__/ Red

             (MCORNEA@pt8244.pto.ford.com)  OCAª 4903

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:26:10 -0300
Subject: Re: Handling Problem

>I recently aquired BFGoodrich 255/60/15 Radials and new shocks on all four
>wheels for my 1981 Delta 88.  Although this definitly improved handling
>especialy at high speeds (i.e. ' welcome to ticket-land '), the car is all
>over the  road especialy at slower speeds (below 60mph).  It wanders all
>over the road and I find myself spending most of the time trying to keep it
>in the lane.  What might be the problem.  Could it be worn coils, or
>over-assisted steering?

I would definitely get the alignment checked. (What sort of wear pattern
did you see on the old tires? Bald down one side, by any chance?) Your
description sounds exactly like what my father-in-law's Regal was doing.
The front end mechanicals were fine; the alignment was way off. Basically
you'd have one front tire fighting the other for traction, and whichever
won would steer the car. Then a bit further down the road, the steering
one would slip, the other one would get a grip, and the car would lurch
off in a new direction. Scary.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: "Mike Aldana" <maldana@quix.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:18:56 -0300
Subject: Uphostery out of country

>Maybe i shouldn't write this, since my business interests are in Mexico,
as most you are probably aware of by now, but i think it is only fair to
warn people about upholstery work in Mexico. I have been restoring cars for
23 years now, frame off correct restorations being my main interest. For a
number of years i tried to have decent work done to my specs, and never got
satisfaction. If it was tuck and roll, the stitching was crude, and
crooked. Diamond work was't even. Padding was done with rags in some cases,
instead of foam as specified. Other times the same foam was reused. Now i
rather spend extra, but i will be happy. Don't get me wrong now. Our chrome
work, foundry, and metalforming is very,very nice. But i simply cannot
recommend upholstery work done across the border.  sincerely  mike
maldana@quix.net

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 06:20:11 -0300
Subject: Re: Late model 442

     You're pretty much correct.  Carb isn't all that different, you could
     probably retune a VIN Y carb to match.  There's also stiffer valve
     springs, a different harmonic balancer (for higher RPM's), dual
     exhaust, and it's the whole dual-snorkel air cleaner, not just the
     chrome lid.  There's also the 2400rpm stall converter that helps get
     it into the power band quicker.

     I wouldn't call that much of a sleeper.  Swap in a 403 with the 3.73's
     and 200-4R and *then* it's a sleeper!

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Late model 442 Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    4/15/97 7:05 AM

What makes the engine code "9" special compared to the Engine code "Y"?

I have heard carb, cam, and chrome aircleaner lid.


------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 13:40:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Need Favor - '68/'69 Owner

>I always thought that the rear defogger was those lines that traverse
>the back of the window.  I didn't realize that it was a fan.

It isn't. The fan-in-the-rear-shelf design is what they used before the
grid-lines-printed-on-the-glass design came along. The changeover was
around 1970 (I think the grid option was available maybe as far back as
1968 or 1969 if not earlier; someone here will know.) although the rear
fan defogger option was available for some years afterward. I had a '78
Camaro with one.

The grid design is way superior and if I was doing a ground-up restoration
(or otherwise removing the rear window anyhow), I'd go to the trouble of
putting in a grid type, with its associated wiring, timer, etc. There are
aftermarket stick-on grids (Interdynamics makes a decent one), but the
installation can be tricky and usually requires extensive arguing with
Mike Frederick. The fan type is probably easiest to install overall and
looks more correct on 1960s era and earlier models.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Stillsurfn@aol.com
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:14:36 -0300
Subject: Re: Cutlass 442 ???

  Two weeks ago I purchased a 72 Cutlass convertible.  It has a 455, a
Quadrajet, and an auto transmission with a hurst dual gate shifter.  Black
exterior with white interior and top.  All numbers match.  It's a head
turner, I get the "nice car" feedback all the time.  Ok so much for braggin'
.... now my ignorant questions...

1) Is this a 442 also?  Was 442  an option package in '72?  How can I tell?
 The serial number identifies the engine as a 250hp (net) 455.

2) Does anyone have any idea how may 72 Convertibles were made with the 455
and hurst dual gate?

3) How does the dual gate work (I don't mean how do you move the shifter,
even an over-the-hill California surfer like myself can figure that out)  I
mean what is happening when I use the right side versus the left?

4) Even though it is a lower compression 455 (8.5 I believe)  is it still
considered a "muscle car"?

5)  I have already broken commandment numbers 1, 4 and 5 of the "Ten
Commandments for the Car Collector" (posted on 4/12/97).  Will I go to hell
for this?  Do they force you to drive Fords while there?

  By the way I have been reading all of this email for two weeks already.  I
am very impressed with all of the knowledge that is distributed here..... you
people are awesome!!!!  Thank you in advance for answers.

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:22:40 -0300
Subject: Re: Dick Miller Racing!

Speaking of which, there seems to have been a big falling out between Joe
Mondello and Dick Miller. The Mondello web page
(http://webs.tcsn.net/mondello) states something like "as of Sept. 1996,
Dick Miller is no longer an authorized seller of Mondello performance parts
. . .". Hmmm.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com, http://www.en.com/users/thall, or
http://www.cybercity.hko.net/ulan_bator/gee/oldsfaq/oldsfaq3.htm

Get the .zip file for local viewing from:
ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

From: hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 14:33:36 -0300
Subject: Ramrod 350

please send any pictures or information on RamRod Olds.  I believe they
were  limited to production in 68 or 69 only 5 hundred something were
built.

------------------------------

From: Scott R Clark <mickeyd@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:13:26 -0300
Subject: Re: Handling Problem

> >I recently aquired BFGoodrich 255/60/15 Radials and new shocks on all four
> >wheels for my 1981 Delta 88.  Although this definitly improved handling
> >especialy at high speeds (i.e. ' welcome to ticket-land '), the car is all
> >over the  road especialy at slower speeds (below 60mph).  It wonders all
> >over the road and I find myself spending most of the time trying to keep it
> >in the lane.  What might be the problem.  Could it be worn coils, or
> >over-assisted steering?
>
> It could be both of those, but the wider tires would also contribute to this
> "tracking" problem. The wider tires are more likely to follow the ruts or
> "tracks" in the road, especially on the highway. Changing over to a
> low-ratio/higher-effort steering box and pump (from a 442/HO, or barring
> finding one of those in the junkyard, from a Monte SS) would likely help.
> Also check the condition of your front suspension components and the rag
> joint on the steering shaft. Any weaknesses in these parts would be
> exaggerated by the wider tires. Oh, worn or even soft stock bushings would
> also contribute to this sensation.

I've been fighting a similar problem in my daily driver (I won't
even mention it's name here, guys!) ever since I put the 245/50 ZR16s on
16x8" IROC wheels on it.  The problem used to be down right dangerous the
first time I put the wheels on it.  It would pull violently to one side
and then the
other, just sort of randomly.  One drive like that was enough.  I rebuilt
the front end, replacing the ball joints, tie-rods (inner and outer)
struts, even the steering box (got one from an '85 IROC).  Now, I'm also
running Goodyear Eagle ZR50 "Gatorbacks" all the way around.  Even now it
has some funny steering pull (and I had an alignment two weeks ago) but
like others have said, I think a lot of that can be contributed to the
wider footprint/stiffer sidewalls following the road and transmitting it's
imperfections to the wheel. When I have a few extra dollars I'm going to get a
set of polygraphite control arm bushings and see if they don't help (I
should have replaced the stock ones when I had the front end apart, but $$
were running short).

Anyway, the suggestions above seem like an excellent place to
start.  Let us know when you track the problem down!

Scott
1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98

------------------------------

From: tgstoner@umich.edu
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:03:36 -0300
Subject: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

From: Thomas Stoner@U OF MICHIGAN on 04/15/97 03:03 PM

Dustin Cross <dcross@selway.umt.edu> wrote:
. . .  I spotted a burgandy 442 . . .   it shows 36000mi which they say is
original   they are
asking $12,900 for it    this seems high to me,  is it?

*********************************************
Seems high to me, but then so does the $13,900 that the local Olds store is
 asking for the
bright red '92 Cutlass convertible with 114,000 miles on it.  I don't know
why I haven't been
able to find a buyer for my 36,000 mile '79 Hurst/Olds yet.  I'm asking
less than half of that.

Tom Stoner
Ann Arbor, MI
tgstoner@umich.edu

------------------------------

From: Brett Chaveriat <brett@mcs.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 18:35:26 -0300
Subject: Torque Converter for Swap

Hi all,
My mechanic just informed me that I have a high RPM stall speed
torque converter in my 72 Cutlass with a 455.  It is too high for
this engine.  It is probably around 3000 rpm (exact rpm can be
verified).
I would like to put a stock converter in the car.  I understand that
smaller engines could take advantage of my converter.  If you are in
the Chicago area, have a stock converter in your car, and are interested
in swapping, e-mail me directly to discuss.  I will only consider a
converter that I can see running in a vehicle.  I obviously can offer
the same to you.  We will then each be responsible for the labor
charges or effort of the transplant on our own cars.


- --
Brett Chaveriat                                    Arlington Hts, IL
mailto:brett@mcs.com

72 Cutlass Supreme Convt.

------------------------------

From: James & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:35:42 -0300
Subject: Re: 442/Cutlass Parts For Sale

At 09:32 AM 4/15/97 -0300, you wrote:
>James Thingwold wrote:
>>
>> Jim - Sign me up for the new wood grain kit around the radio off the '72
>> (you wouldn't happen to have 2 would you?)
>>
>> I'll forward $ as soon as you reply.
>>
>> Thanks -
>>
>> Lisa Madsen

>Do you still have the bumper guards off of that 72 cutlass? I need both
>front and rear but I need the front worse.
>

Lisa

        I have the woodgrain for the dash still. No bumper guards. Let me
know what you want to do. I will take a check or money order.  Send it to

Jim Chermack
1132 Chatmoss Drive
Virginia Beach, VA 23464
(757) 474-0869

Thanks,

Jim

------------------------------

From: Dustin Cross <dcross@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:37:24 -0300
Subject: Re: 1990 Vintage

> The car also has an oil leak.  Dealer said it was leaking (they think)
> where the the distributor would be ( if this car had a distributor), and
> there is a plate with an "O" ring there.  Said that they would have to
> tear it down, and remove the rear head to get to it!
> Seems like drastic measures to fix an oil leak!  But he said it's about
> time to replace the timing belt anyway.  Does anyone know much of the
> anatomy of these engines?  Is this the likely spot to develop an oil
> leak on this engine?


I had a severe leak on my '89 cutlass supreme with the 3.1  it was the o
ring on the distributer plug I had it fixed at a local shop for about $50
the mechanic said he also puts an additional gasket in besides the o ring
and has never had one come back  he also said this is a very common
problem with the GMs

------------------------------

From: Eric Aksomitis <aksomi@cs.uregina.ca>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:46:30 -0300
Subject: 3.something rearend

I'm scheduled to be done exams and on to cars soon, and I've got a
consistent response from everybody about lower-geared rearends.  So, in my
_75 Cutlass Supreme_, which curently has a low-2's rearend, I'm looking
for a 3.something rearend.

1)  What will/won't work?
2)  Is this the 'magic power booster' I've been told?
3)  Can anyone get me one? (Shipping should be easy for that small a part(s))

.....Shameless but short self-promo sig file.....
Virtual Junkyard of olds's: Current count : 4 vehicles
http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~aksomi/mailto:aksomi@cs.uregina.ca
.....End of self-promo                      .....

------------------------------

From: "Douglas J Harkema" <harkema2@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:47:59 -0300
Subject: Re: 81 cutlass rt

>
>
> On Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:45:18 -0300 "Douglas J Harkema"
> <harkema2@pilot.msu.edu> writes:
> >I just bought a 81 cutlass with a pretty nice body.  The motor is
> >shot.  I have
> >a 1970 gold 350 and am planning on putting it in this car.  The car
> >currently
> >has a v-6.  I know that the swap is possible.  I am wondering if I
> >will need to
> >replace the drive shaft, I know I will need a new tranny also but will
> >the
> >drive shaft be the right length.  also I would like to know what the
> >easiest
> >way is to line up where the new motor mounts need to be placed.
> >
> >Can anyone help me
> >
> >just getting ready!!!!!
> >thanks
> >Doug
> >
> I've done this!!~ The 350 motor will work well, but you'll need to change
> the springs in the front. A stock 350 motor mount kit will work just fine
> and... the th200 will bolt up. The th350 tranny will also work, without
> changing the driveshaft. I can go out and look at the car and tell you
> which bolt holes to use to mount the engine to as the motor is out of the
> car. One problem I ran across is emissions. Several states have emissions
> tests or inspections and will not accept an older motor with a newer
> vehicle. Hopefully, yours is not one of them. Also, DON'T  forget the
> grounds. That caused a little problem for me after installation. You'll
> also experience some minor problems with the speedo and dash indicators.
> They'll work, but sometimes lights will come on very dimly. Something to
> do with the computer. Good Luck, e-mail me back if you need any other
> assistance.
>
> Katana72
>
>

I really would appreciate knowing what holes to mount the motor mounts on that
would save a lot of time.  what kind of springs are needed.  Just ones of a
cutlass with a 307 in it or something even a bit more heavy?

Thanks for the info

Doug
70
81
70

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:48:49 -0300
Subject: Re: Cutlass 442 ???

At 01:14 PM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>  Two weeks ago I purchased a 72 Cutlass convertible.  It has a 455, a
>Quadrajet, and an auto transmission with a hurst dual gate shifter.  Black
>exterior with white interior and top.  All numbers match.  It's a head
>turner, I get the "nice car" feedback all the time.  Ok so much for braggin'
>.... now my ignorant questions...
>
>1) Is this a 442 also?  Was 442  an option package in '72?  How can I tell?
> The serial number identifies the engine as a 250hp (net) 455.

The 4-bbl 455 and the 442 were both options, available on the Cutlass
series. So though you have a factory 455, you don't necessarily have a 442.

[snip of things I can't help with]
>4) Even though it is a lower compression 455 (8.5 I believe)  is it still
>considered a "muscle car"?

If you floor the gas when the traffic light turns green, would you be
ticketed with an "unsafe start"? If so, then you may be driving a musclecar.

If your exhaust tone sets off car alarms just by idling through a parking
garage, then you may be driving a musclecar.

If your passenger-side dash and armrest have the finger-impressions of your
passengers from when you take them "just for a trip around the block," then
you may be driving a musclecar.

If your car has *four* _round_ headlights and 400 or more cubic inches under
the hood, you ARE driving a musclecar!
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:53:48 -0300
Subject: Re: Torque Converter for Swap

At 05:35 PM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Hi all,
>My mechanic just informed me that I have a high RPM stall speed
>torque converter in my 72 Cutlass with a 455.  It is too high for
>this engine.  It is probably around 3000 rpm (exact rpm can be
>verified).

Does your engine rev a bit before it begins to move? Is it a stock engine?
What exactly led him to this conclusion, and what makes him think it's too
high for this engine? (I'm a natural skeptic, auto-wise)

>I would like to put a stock converter in the car.  I understand that

There are aftermarket converters available for very reasonable prices
(~$90-$110) that have near-stock or slightly over stock stall speeds. I'd
recommend against a used one, as the metal shavings from the clutches tend
to exist in the converter, and then flow though your tranny once it is
installed.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Mike Coccagna" <mikec@oz.kis.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:59:19 -0300
Subject: Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

 Dustin Cross <dcross@selway.umt.edu> wrote:

> . . .  I spotted a burgandy 442 . . .   it shows 36000mi which they
> say is original   they are asking $12,900 for it    this seems high
> to me,  is it?

It seems a lot high to me.  I went to a car price web page -
http://www.carprices.com and looked up a '87 Cutalss Salon, excellent
condition, and a lot of options.  I found a price of 6900, but it had
a disclaimer of "substancially less than 120,000 miles".

I've been contemplating selling my '93 SCX (24,000 miles) and found
book values about $11k.  Gee, for $2k more, I could get a car that's
6 years older, uses twice the gas and gives fewer horsepower?
Sign me up! :-)

Mike
'91 W-40 442
'93 W-41 SCX

------------------------------

From: "Douglas J Harkema" <harkema2@pilot.msu.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 16:47:59 -0300
Subject: Re: 81 cutlass rt

>
>
> On Sat, 12 Apr 1997 20:45:18 -0300 "Douglas J Harkema"
> <harkema2@pilot.msu.edu> writes:
> >I just bought a 81 cutlass with a pretty nice body.  The motor is
> >shot.  I have
> >a 1970 gold 350 and am planning on putting it in this car.  The car
> >currently
> >has a v-6.  I know that the swap is possible.  I am wondering if I
> >will need to
> >replace the drive shaft, I know I will need a new tranny also but will
> >the
> >drive shaft be the right length.  also I would like to know what the
> >easiest
> >way is to line up where the new motor mounts need to be placed.
> >
> >Can anyone help me
> >
> >just getting ready!!!!!
> >thanks
> >Doug
> >
> I've done this!!~ The 350 motor will work well, but you'll need to change
> the springs in the front. A stock 350 motor mount kit will work just fine
> and... the th200 will bolt up. The th350 tranny will also work, without
> changing the driveshaft. I can go out and look at the car and tell you
> which bolt holes to use to mount the engine to as the motor is out of the
> car. One problem I ran across is emissions. Several states have emissions
> tests or inspections and will not accept an older motor with a newer
> vehicle. Hopefully, yours is not one of them. Also, DON'T  forget the
> grounds. That caused a little problem for me after installation. You'll
> also experience some minor problems with the speedo and dash indicators.
> They'll work, but sometimes lights will come on very dimly. Something to
> do with the computer. Good Luck, e-mail me back if you need any other
> assistance.
>
> Katana72
>
>

I really would appreciate knowing what holes to mount the motor mounts on that
would save a lot of time.  what kind of springs are needed.  Just ones of a
cutlass with a 307 in it or something even a bit more heavy?

Thanks for the info

Doug
70
81
70

------------------------------

From: Paul Brillhart <u17058@uicvm.uic.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 17:10:50 -0300
Subject: Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine

At 12:46 PM 4/15/97 -0300, you wrote:
>At 03:39 AM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Is there anyone out there that can tell me what the performance
>characteristics would be by installing a 350R cam in a 330 ?
>Considering the 45deg lifter angle of the 330 compared to 39deg
>lifter angle of 350, how much would this affect lift, duration
>timing, etc.  I installed one (some years ago) before knowing
>about the different cam bank angle.  The engine runs strong but
>seems sluggish, is the anyway to compensate through timing, etc
>to get proper performance. Or should I just "bite the bullet"
>pull the cam and put in a new Mondello special ?!?!?! HELP

  I got a '65 442 with a 400 and a 4-speed from a friend of mine who
could'nt understand why it ran so poorly after he put a new cam in it.  It
idled o.k. and it didn't make bad power, but it always felt restrained.
Once it heated up, the idle went to hell and it began overheating during
highway driving in the summer.  Sound familiar? I recently bought a JM 16-18
for it and a set of Crane lifters.  I haven't gone through the bottom end
yet, so going wilder would be foolish right now.  By the way, don't buy
Wolverine lifters.  A guy at the local speed shop tried to talk me into
them.  They were nicked on the surfaces, had Chevy oil hole placement, and
the bevel was not concentric at the edge of the face. These were the "best"
in his box of 64.  Needless to say, the Cranes are perfect.  I'll be putting
the cam in in the next 2-3 weeks and let you know the difference.

  Paul Brillhart

BTW: He put on a new timing set without a hitch when he installed it.

------------------------------

From: Lloyd <equitygroup@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 17:47:33 -0300
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel

Peter Teubel wrote:
>
>         Which engine do you have?  The 5.9L or the 6.2L?  I've heard
>      nothing but horror stories about the 5.9L.  The 6.2L wasn't that much
>      better from what I've heard.  You seem to be the exception.
>
>         Anyone else out there had any experiences (good/bad/indifferent)
>      with GM diesels?
>
>
>      Peter G. Teubel
>
>      pteubel@safety1st.com
>      '51 98 (50% complete....currently a driveway ornament) 48K
>      '52 Plymouth (Project-in-waiting....driveway ornament ª2) ??K
>      '73 Imperial (a.k.a. USS Enterprise)  28K
>      '82 98 (a.k.a USS Nimitz) 80K
>      '84 C10 P-up (junkyard hauler) 273K
>      '86 Ciera (Wife's car) 70K
>      '88 Subaru Turbo (Distainful communter vehicle that actually gets out
>                        of its own way) 59K
>
>
> ______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ > Subject: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8
Diesel > Author:  Lloyd <equitygroup@earthlink.net> at imail > Date:
4/14/97 10:27 PM > > I have a 1982 Oldsmobile Custom Crusier with nearly
400,000 miles on it. > The original engine was very bad and required constant
repair, but > Oldsmobile replaced in 1990 with a new engine and that engine
has > performed very well with nearly 300,000 miles and running vell today. > >
My question is where can I get another new Diesel V8 engine?  My local >
dealer says that they are not available anymore. > > Sincerely, > > Lloyd >
It is listed as a 350 or 5.7L Diesel V8.  They were very bad engines as they
were delivered.  There was a class action that I was inlisted to join that
recovered millions to divide between many for engine replacements.  I got one
of the new engines and it was like night and day when compared to the original
one.  The first one had everything from Alternator mounts breaking every 20k
miles, injector pumps blowing seals every 30k miles to top end problems with
push rods bending to rockers breaking.  I had it in the shop five times a year
for the first four eight years.  Couldn't sell it because it was worthless to
everybody but me.

After the new engine it has been very good.  Over 300,000 miles and
still going strong.  Only the alternator bracket remains a problem.
Still replacing them so often that I buy them by the box.

I want a new engine like this last one.  Maybe I can get it to 1,000,000
miles.

Lloyd

------------------------------

From: Lloyd <equitygroup@earthlink.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 18:08:31 -0300
Subject: Value of Oldsmobiles

I have two Oldsmobiles and a Cadillac that I have owned since new.  They
have been stored for twenty years in a heated carage in Cailfornia.
1. 1964 Startfire two door, tan in excellant shape, two tone brown
interior, bucket seats and console,  42,067 miles.
2. 1966 Toronado, Jade Green, green interior 29,000 miles.
3. 1966 Deville Convertable, Blue, white top and leather, 113,087 miles.
The cars look like new and would show well in any new car showroom.

------------------------------

From: Robert Yasczak <VJTD@grove.iup.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 19:13:23 -0300
Subject: Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

In early January, I picked up my 1987 Cutlass Salon with T-tops for
$3800.  The car needs nothing other than an engine detail and new top seals.
You really can't compare prices between 442's and Salon's, since the 442 was a
limited run and they are now becoming more collectible.  I have seen many of
them for sale in this range but they were perfect, garaged and under 10k
miles.  There seem to be alot of dreamers out there who think that their car
is worth much more than they actually are.  For example I looked at a 1986 442
in November of 1996, that was a low mile under 30k miles, but the rims were
begining to rust and it needed painted, this was just from looking at it and
never checking anything else.  The Olds dealer wanted about $10,000 for this
car, which was way to high for its condition and what it needed.  I guess what
it all comes down to is if you really think that the car is worth it to you
then go for it, if not keep looking for another at a lower price, they're out
there. Robb Yasczakvjtd@grove.iup.edu 1969 Cutlass 1969 442 1976 442 1987
Cutlass Salon

------------------------------

From: hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 18:20:05 -0300
Subject: 66 -442

I am looking for a 65, 66, 68-70 olds cutlass 2dr or 442 preferably a
66. around $1200-1500 one in need of care , w/ or w/o engine, plaese
send info.

                 http://www.hanthorn@inwave.com

------------------------------

From: "Aaron R. Weimer" <aweimer@ameritech.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 18:29:50 -0300
Subject: RE: Re[2]: rearend ratio

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC49C2.A0049830
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- -----Original Message-----
From:JPADA@Orbital.COM [SMTP:JPADA@Orbital.COM]
Sent:Tuesday, April 15, 1997 1:39 AM
To:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:Re[2]: rearend ratio


A more accurate method is to count the number of turns of the driveshaft =
it takes to turn the tire _ten_ times, then divide by ten.  The reason =
for this is that differentiating 37 turns from 35 is a lot easier than =
differentiating 3.7 turns from 3.5.
Also keep in mind that if you have a non-posi rear end, you will need to =
multiply the result by two (if you have both rear wheels off the =
ground), as the counterrotation of the two wheels will halve the =
apparent ratio.
Joe Padavano

I would not have thought of that.. My self it's just as easy to pull =
the cover.. Better to change the rear end oil anyways

Aaron

1972442 W30



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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BC49C2.A0049830--

------------------------------

From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 18:53:59 -0300
Subject: Re: Value of Oldsmobiles

At 06:08 PM 4/15/97 -0300, you wrote:

>I have two Oldsmobiles and a Cadillac that I have owned since new.  They
>have been stored for twenty years in a heated carage in Cailfornia.
>1. 1964 Startfire two door, tan in excellant shape, two tone brown
>interior, bucket seats and console,  42,067 miles.
>2. 1966 Toronado, Jade Green, green interior 29,000 miles.
>3. 1966 Deville Convertable, Blue, white top and leather, 113,087 miles.
>The cars look like new and would show well in any new car showroom.

Why are you telling us this?  Do you wish to sell any or all of these?  Or
are you just interested in their possible values, as suggested by your
choice of message subject.

Out of curiosity, what's the VIN of the Toro?  Ralph Braun, who writes the
"Frontwheeling" column in Journey with Old,s is always trying to find the
earliest production VIN (and thus Toro) still in existence.


Dan





************************************************
Dan Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
************************************************

------------------------------

From: marc bodin <bodinkmk@island.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 19:08:53 -0300
Subject: address

olds

------------------------------

From: "Mike Coccagna" <mikec@oz.kis.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 15:21:13 -0300
Subject: Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

On 15 Apr 97 at 19:13, Robert Yasczak wrote:

> top seals. You really can't compare prices between 442's and
> Salon's, since the 442 was a limited run and they are now becoming
> more collectible.  I have seen many of them for sale in this range

Actually, I forgot to mention the price I found INCLUDED the 442
option....

Sorry for the confusion-

Mike
'91 W-40 442
'93 W-41 SCX

------------------------------

From: "jones" <jones@morgan.net>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 19:57:10 -0300
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel

>         The 6.2L wasn't that much
>      better from what I've heard.  You seem to be the exception.
>
>         Anyone else out there had any experiences (good/bad/indifferent)
>      with GM diesels?
You heard wrong about the 6.2. I have one in a 82 Blazer. It ran 247,000
and broke a wrist pin. I sleeved that cylinder  replaced the crank,the two
rods it damaged, bored it .020 and put it back in. It now has 318.000
(total) and runs great. There are a lot of these running around here and
since I have a automotive machine shop I get to work on what ever breaks
down. I do a lot more repairs on the 6.9 & 7.3 Ford (international) than I
do the chevys. The 7.3 has problems with pin holes in the rear cylinders
and is the worst engine on valve guides ever made. I love em.They make me a
lot of money. If I had to make a living on 6.2 & 6.5 GM engines I would
starve to death. Oh I don't make much on Olds V8's either those things
sometimes seem to run forever.
Walter

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 20:17:48 -0300
Subject: Re: Used Olds Prices (was '86 442)

At 07:13 PM 4/15/97 -0300, Robert Yasczak wrote:
>In early January, I picked up my 1987 Cutlass Salon with T-tops for
>$3800.  The car needs nothing other than an engine detail and new top seals.
>You really can't compare prices between 442's and Salon's, since the 442 was
a >limited run and they are now becoming more collectible.  I have seen many
of >them for sale in this range but they were perfect, garaged and under 10k
>miles.  There seem to be alot of dreamers out there who think that their car
is >worth much more than they actually are.  For example I looked at a 1986
442 in >November of 1996, that was a low mile under 30k miles, but the rims
were >begining to rust and it needed painted, this was just from looking at it
and >never checking anything else.  The Olds dealer wanted about $10,000 for
this >car, which was way to high for its condition and what it needed.

For some odd reason it seems that every 85-87 4-4-2 that I see for sale
around here is at least over $10,000. There is someone here trying to sell a
1986 4-4-2 with 98,500 miles for $11,000. Ok now if this car is worth
$11,000, I should ask $20,000 for my 1980 4-4-2, about 3,000 less were made
and it is the same G-body style, and it has the 350 as compared to the 307.
Better yet why pay that much for an underpowered car when you can get a 1986
Buick Grand National which that year only ~2,000 were made making it 1500
cars more rare than the 442. I don't understand the thinking of some of
these people trying to sell the 85-87 4-4-2's. These ads run in the paper
for ever here so there is obviously hardly anyone paying those prices.

- - - - - - - - - - - -
Jason Labay (z28cfi@gwis.com)  Akron, Ohio  F-body list since 5/95
93 Camaro Z/28: Patriot Red, A4, GU5 (3.23), PEG2
89 Mustang GT: Blue, 5.0, M5, many mods...12.78@111mph
80 Oldsmobile 4-4-2 W-30:White/Gold, 5.7L, A3, showcar, 1 of 346
75 Hurst/Olds W-25: White, 5.7L, A3,project car, 1 of 1293

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª613
********************************
