To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #605


oldsmobile-digest         Thursday, 10 April 1997      Volume 01 : Number 605

Re: lets get technical
Re: Worst Loss?
Re: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: Engine IDs - What do I have?
Re: For sale: 87 woodgrain console plate
Re: Engine IDs - What do I have?
Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: Darwin Award/JATO idiot (Funny, somewhat long)
Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: Worst Loss?, best buy?
Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage  Was: no subject wh
RE: junkyards (fwd)
Re: lets get technical
Some dumb questions (Non Olds)
82 Olds cutlass (T-tops)
Re: lets get technical
Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
85-87 442 cam specs?
Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage  Was: no subject wh
Worst loss?
Re[2]: Darwin Award/JATO idiot
More technical
MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: Darwin Award/JATO idiot (Funny, somewhat long)
Re: 1967 442
Re: junkyards (fwd)
Re: junkyards (fwd)
Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)
Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)
Re: Olds 307
Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)
WANTED 394 ENGINE PARTS
Re: headers, gaskets and such...
Re: 85-87 442 cam specs?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:22:53 -0300
Subject: Re: lets get technical

At 12:44 AM 4/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
>OK boys, I been reading this mail to learn. How about some high tech info
>in how to get more ponies out of these olds blocks. Which cam works best on
>small blocks, big block.

People here seem to be really happy with the JM16-18 or JM18-20 for
performance small-blocks, and JM20-22 or JM22-24 for performance big-blocks.
(these are Mondello cam numbers)

>Carb mods.

Depends on what carb you're working with, and what you're putting it on.
Though you'll find some people here who don't like "quadrajunks", others
here wouldn't put anything else on their engine (because they've tried other
things on their engines and didn't get better performance). Start with a
carb that goes with a factory engine more or less similar to the engine
you've built, and modify from there.

>Intakes,which work best?

The standard cast-iron non-EGR intakes all flow pretty well, and pretty much
the same. It is best to work with the '70-'72 intakes with the choke
integral with the carb; the earlier divorced choke versions are hard to find
parts for, and don't work as well. Of course, there's always the aftermarket
Performers, in big and small block versions, which are tons lighter, and
flow marginally better. There are also single-plane manifolds that work well
with more radical camshafts and higher rpm motors. It really depends on what
your engine is going into, and what you want it to do in that car.

>How can you
>modify stock manifolds?

Intake manifolds can be ported to match the intake runners in the cylinder
heads. Exhaust manifolds can be smoothed at their transition points. You
would use a die-grinder with a carbide burr or a cartridge roll to make
these modifications (air-powered are preferred- they run cooler; there are
also electric versions).

>Exhaust manifolds?

All small-block manifolds are the same, so it makes no difference. For
big-blocks, the X/Y/Z manifolds with the divided centers work best (if you
can find someone willing to sell you their pair). On an earlier car, headers
are always an option. Don't be cheap here, though; you want to pay for
quality, as the cheap ones require a *lot* of modifications to fit well.

>Blue printing tips?

Splurge for the Mondello Tech manual; he details all the clearancing
procedures.

>Oil pumps, what kind of pressure,volume?

High-volume only if you restrict flow to the top of the engine (pushrod
restrictors preferred), and modify the engine for oil return, and are going
to be spinning rather high rpm's. Otherwise, stock volume will be fine. Just
make sure the oil galleys are *spotless*, and you've installed all the
proper oil plugs in the block in the right places. Again, get the Mondello
tech manual.

>Carb cfm? How about jets mettering rods for
>the old Q-jet?

This depends on the engine and what modifications you make to it. Again,
start with the factory setup for the engine closest to your configuration,
and go from there.

>Which heads work on a small block, big block the best using
>90-92 octain fuel?

'69 "5" heads or '70 "6" heads are supposed to flow best with the small
combustion chambers, but the '72 "7a" heads have the small chamber, flow
nearly as well, and have a hardened exhaust seat.

>Ever try K&N air filters?

Yes. Worth it. For driveability, use a dual-snorkel air cleaner with a hot
air pipe. If it's not a daily driver or you live where it's warm (i.e. not
here, where it was 20' this morning, though the sun was shining), you can
use an open-element air cleaner.

>Opinions on synthetic oils?

Nice. Not necessary. Don't put it in an old engine; it will *find* new leaks
for you.

>Timming specs. Distributor curves?

You've got to test this for yourself. Get an adjustable timing kit from
Crane, and follow the instructions.

>Ever try the new hot spark plugs from
>Split fire, Delco, Bosch?

$5 a plug? I don't think so...

>How about fuel mileage?

Forget about it if you want to have fun. With a light foot, however, you can
get in the 14-18mpg range in a modified engine.

>Electric fans?

Bad idea, unless absolutely necessary. A stock-type thermostatic clutch fan,
with a 7-blade Toro fan, a fan shroud and a new 4-row radiator should be
able to cool whatever you throw at it. Just make sure the impeller on your
water pump is actually *attached* before you install it...

>Lets get some opinions going!

Hmmm, it's kinda hard to get opinions from this list... ;)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:22:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Worst Loss?

At 10:11 PM 4/9/97 -0400, you wrote:
>> Come to find out, the intake and heads were typical 1976.  The block,
>> was a 68, forged crank, forged rods, forged pistons, 4 Bolt Mains.  Was
>> this a W30 that I GAVE away?!?  I could just kill myself when he told
[snip]
>It was a large car (98/88/Toro) 455 and NOT a W-30 engine. The forged
>crank was actually almost typical for '68. The 4 bolt mains were a

Oh, I only wish... The rumor that ALL '68 455's, or that all '68 Toronado
455's came with a forged crank, is unfortunately not true. There have been
many '68 Toro engines pulled apart for this very reason, only to discover
the Nodular Iron crank found in other 455's through the early '70's. In
fact, the place that there *has* been a confirmed sighting of a
factory-installed forged crank was in a *low-compression* 2-bbl 455 from a
1968 88 with a _towing_package_. So, all you '68 owners out there with
towing-package equipped 88's and 98's, you may have gold buried in your
engines! _______________________________________________________ Dr. Robert
Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu Theology Dept, Providence
College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:22:55 -0300
Subject: Re: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

At 05:49 AM 4/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Dear Mike and Wiz,
>
>You have managed to create a long thread out of a simple subject. Cool :)
>
>I think that many of us are wondering, why does the wire burn ?
[ S N I P ! ]
>dropped to tenth of the original speed. Not so much power -> no burning.
>
>Hope this helped.

Esko,

Thanks once again for an enlightening (and of course humorous) explanation.
This gets saved in the folder of truly excellent explanations.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:22:52 -0300
Subject: Re: Engine IDs - What do I have?

At 11:27 AM 4/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
>I have recently purchased a 1972 Cutlass Supreme Convertible to restore and I
>need help determining what engine I have.  The numbers on the block are
395558 >(I can't tell from the Olds FAQ what this is - it looks like a 68-70
350, 330 >or 76-81 260).  The numbers on the heads are 8 411 929 (73-76 350
smog heads?). >The numbers on the intake manifold are 411990 and D4BC.  I
can't find any >reference to this intake manifold. The manifold also has an
EGR valve on it. >What exactly do I have?  Could this be a factory combination
for 1972?

(assuming all those parts came together that way from the factory) That's
not a factory '72 engine; EGR didn't come out till '73 (ok, ok, I suppose it
*could* be the last '72 CS ever produced, and since they had just run out of
'72 spec motors they installed a 350 from the new batch waiting to go in the
redesigned Cutlass).

>I also need a source for a vacuum hose routing diagram.

If you're going to be keeping this car and working on it yourself, the BEST
thing you can do is buy a factory manual (original or reprint from Year
One). It will more than pay for itself in the aggravation you save yourself
in doing repairs. And it has the vacuum hose routing diagrams for your car.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Timothy Carl Hietpas <thietpas@csd.uwm.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 11:37:45 -0300
Subject: Re: For sale: 87 woodgrain console plate

On Thu, 10 Apr 1997, MROTHE wrote:
>
> A 1987 NOS light woodgrain (not silver) console shifter plate for a
> Cutlass/442 (G-body).  It does not have the indicator lens (Pop out your
> old one, and glue it in this one.), but includes the clips.  It is
> mint.  I will sell it for $25.
>
Does anyone have the silver console shifter or know where I can get one
in good shape for a 1987 442?  Mine has burns in it from the previous owner
smoking in the car! Da*mit!!....

Tim

thietpas@alpha2.csd.uwm.edu
1987 Olds 442Plates [1987 W42]

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:07:22 -0300
Subject: Re: Engine IDs - What do I have?

>> I also need a source for a vacuum hose routing diagram.
>
>Yeah.  Me too for my 68 442

Chilton (and probably others) have a dedicated book showing nothing
but emissions system diagrams. A well-stocked library or auto parts
store (here in Chicago, the Trak Auto Warehouse Stores have them)
should have a copy that would list it. Yes, you can read the books
_at_ Trak; you can look at their "library" copy instead of having
to buy one. Look for the titles on "Engine Controls" or "Emissions
System Maintenance" and wording like that.

- -- Andy, who was pleased to see that the Arlington Heights, IL library
   even has a Hollander Interchange manual...

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Karl Davlin <kdavlin@bigfoot.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:08:26 -0300
Subject: Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

This whole sting is full of partially correct information!!!  I'm an
electrical engineer doing new product development in a company located
in silicon valley.  If I used these concepts to design our products, I
would be looking for a new career.

I hate to say it but my Cutlass was a wiring nightmare.  I totally
disagree with the way automobile manufactures wire their products.  I
guess they will do anything to save a dime.


Karl

Moore, Spencer T. wrote:

> Sorry to disagree Mike, but it is a little hard to believe that a
> electron has no mass.  THAT'S BECAUSE IT DOES.  Not very much,
> 9.1093897x10^(-31)kg, but it does have mass nonetheless.
>
> Spencer Moore
> 1969 442 (Olds Content)
>
> >----------
> >From:  MROTHE[SMTP:MROTHE@prodigy.net]
> >Sent:  Thursday, April 10, 1997 8:43AM
> >To:    oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> >Subject:       Re: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
> >
> >Esko Ilola wrote:
> >>
> >> Dear Mike and Wiz,
> >>
> >> You have managed to create a long thread out of a simple subject.
> Cool :)
> >>
> >> I think that many of us are wondering, why does the wire burn ?
> >> And why doesn't a ten times as thick wire just burn ten times
> faster ?
> >>
> >> That would be logical, wouldn't it.
> >>
> >> I will try to explain some of the terms they used here to make
> sense in
> >>this thread
> >> if You are not so good in electronics. The thread has been VERY
> informative
> >>yet
> >> hard to understand if You are not familiar with the subject.
> >>
> >> This is by NO means a professional document. It's only purpose is
> to tell
> >>everbody
> >> how good I'm at this subject...oops...to simplify things to put
> some sense
> >>in them
> >> for those of us that are not familiar with this subject.
> >>
> >> Resistance is used to describe how well a conductor can resist
> current. The
> >>more
> >> resistance the better the conductor can resist current. When You
> increase
> >>resistance
> >> You get weaker and weaker current until You finally arrive to
> situation
> >>when there is
> >> virtually no current at all. At this point we usually talk about
>
> >>insulators.
> >> Insulator is just a conductor that has a very high resistance.
> >>
> >> Conductivity is the opposite of resistance. It is used to
> describe
> >>conductors
> >> ability to conduct (:p). It can be said that a good conductor
> contains a
> >>lot of
> >> electrons that do nothing.
> >>
> >> Voltage is used to describe how well the electricity can creep
> over
> >>resistors.
> >> The bigger the voltage the bigger resistance is needed to keep
> the current
> >>at
> >> same level. In some sense the Voltage is analogous with the speed
> of the
> >>electrons.
> >>
> >> Amperage is the hardest part. In simply terms it is the volume
> of
> >>electricity.
> >> The more amperes the more electricity. It is also the mass
> (weight) of the
> >>electrons
> >> thus the number of electrons flowing.
> >>
> >> Power is a product between Amperage and Voltage. High power means
> that
> >>thare are
> >> lots of electrons flowing at a high speed. If the electrons stay
> still (No
> >>voltage)
> >> there is no power no matter how many electrons are staying still
> (High
> >>current).
> >> If there is high electron speed (High voltage) but only a few
> electrons are
> >>involved
> >> (Low current) there is not much power either.
> >>
> >> Work is a product between Power and Time. This is the thing that
> You pay
> >>for.
> >> If You have a huge amount of electrons going very fast (High
> power) but You
> >>give
> >> them no time, then nothing happens. As You gradually increase the
> available
> >>time,
> >> more and more happens (more work is done).
> >>
> >> Why do we need a thick wire to those gizmos that consume a lot of
> current ?
> >> Lot of current means many electrons. If we have a good conductor,
> the speed
> >> of electrons stays low in the conductor thus causing virtually no
> power at
> >>all
> >> in the conductor itself. All the power is there where it should
> be. Usually
> >>a
> >> thick conductor has more electrons (lower resistance) than a thin
> one.
> >>
> >> If we replace the good conductor with a more resistive one, we
> get faster
> >>electrons
> >> (because there are not so many available in the conductor) thus
> causing
> >>some
> >> power in the conductor itself. Because we usually have limited
> supply of
> >>either
> >> Voltage or Current (speed / amount) the gizmo does no more
> receive full
> >>power.
> >> At here we talk about power loss which is a little bit misleading
> as we
> >>didn't
> >> loose the power, it just isn't where it should be.
> >>
> >> The wire burns because there is power in it. If You give it time
> and if
> >>there
> >> is enough power to increase it's temperature, it will burn for
> sure.
> >>
> >> If You put ten wires in parallel that means that You have made
> ten ways for
> >>the
> >> electrons to go. That means in turn that the electron speed
> inside the
> >>wires has
> >> dropped to tenth of the original speed. Not so much power -> no
> burning.
> >>
> >> Hope this helped.
> >>
> >> --
> >> **********************************************
> >> * Esko Ilola                                 *
> >> * Email esko.ilola@tele.fi                   *
> >> * X400  G=esko S=ilola O=tele A=mailnet C=fi *
> >> * Tel.  +358 2040 3439                       *
> >> *       +358 4055 75977                      *
> >> *       +358 9537 430                        *
> >> * Mail  Ukonkivenpolku 7B5                   *
> >> *       01610 VANTAA                         *
> >> *       FINLAND                              *
> >> **********************************************
> >> * Oldsmobile Ninety Eight 1964               *
> >> *            Holiday Sports Sedan (4D HT)    *
> >> **********************************************
> >
> >
> >This one I have to get in on.
> >
> >Power = Amps X Volts
> >Volts = Amps X Resistance
> >Substituting the second equation for the volts in the first
> equation we
> >get:
> >
> >Power = Amps X Amps X Resistance, or more commonly referred to as
> >
> >I(squared)R, where I is amps, and R is resistance.
> >
> >All conductors give off heat as a result of resistance againt
> current.
> >Especially in transformers, where a LOT of conductors are wound
> >together, each wire giving off its own heat.  This is commonly
> referred
> >to as I(squared) R losses, also known as wasted Power.  The lower
> the
> >resistance, the less heat.  Since you can't change a wire's
> inherent
> >resistance characteristics, if you increase Voltage, you increase
> >current.  If that happens, your I(squared)R losses increase, so you
> have
> >more heat loss.  If the heat generated is very great, such as in
> using a
> >too small wire for the load, then it can burn the insulation, and
> then
> >possibly get hot enough to melt the metal.  This is exactly what
> happens
> >to your fuses under the dash.  Or especially the fusable link.
> That's
> >why a 3A fuse element is thread-like compared to a 25A fuse.  Based
> on
> >a  car's voltage system, that is the approximate maximum current
> that
> >can be passed through it.
> >
> >So as for conductor size, in general, when in doubt, max it out.
> Just
> >like fuel line size.  That's why small wire jumper cables (6 GA)
> get
> >hotter when you jump start a car with them than a 2 GA size.
> >
> >Hopefully that is a down and dirty lesson on conductors.
> >
> >I have to disagree about electrons having mass though.  There is no
> mass
> >to an electron.  Hard to believe, but it's true.
> >
> >My 2 cents
> >Mike Rothe
> >
> >

 Moore, Spencer T. wrote:

> Sorry to disagree Mike, but it is a little hard to believe that a
> electron has no mass.  THAT'S BECAUSE IT DOES.  Not very much,
> 9.1093897x10^(-31)kg, but it does have mass nonetheless.
>
> Spencer Moore
> 1969 442 (Olds Content)
>
> >----------
> >From:  MROTHE[SMTP:MROTHE@prodigy.net]
> >Sent:  Thursday, April 10, 1997 8:43AM
> >To:    oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> >Subject:       Re: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage
> >
> >Esko Ilola wrote:
> >>
> >> Dear Mike and Wiz,
> >>
> >> You have managed to create a long thread out of a simple subject.
> Cool :)
> >>
> >> I think that many of us are wondering, why does the wire burn ?
> >> And why doesn't a ten times as thick wire just burn ten times
> faster ?
> >>
> >> That would be logical, wouldn't it.
> >>
> >> I will try to explain some of the terms they used here to make
> sense in
> >>this thread
> >> if You are not so good in electronics. The thread has been VERY
> informative
> >>yet
> >> hard to understand if You are not familiar with the subject.
> >>
> >> This is by NO means a professional document. It's only purpose is
> to tell
> >>everbody
> >> how good I'm at this subject...oops...to simplify things to put
> some sense
> >>in them
> >> for those of us that are not familiar with this subject.
> >>
> >> Resistance is used to describe how well a conductor can resist
> current. The
> >>more
> >> resistance the better the conductor can resist current. When You
> increase
> >>resistance
> >> You get weaker and weaker current until You finally arrive to
> situation
> >>when there is
> >> virtually no current at all. At this point we usually talk about
> >>insulators.
> >> Insulator is just a conductor that has a very high resistance.
> >>
> >> Conductivity is the opposite of resistance. It is used to
> describe
> >>conductors
> >> ability to conduct (:p). It can be said that a good conductor
> contains a
> >>lot of
> >> electrons that do nothing.
> >>
> >> Voltage is used to describe how well the electricity can creep
> over
> >>resistors.
> >> The bigger the voltage the bigger resistance is needed to keep
> the current
> >>at
> >> same level. In some sense the Voltage is analogous with the speed
> of the
> >>electrons.
> >>
> >> Amperage is the hardest part. In simply terms it is the volume of
>
> >>electricity.
> >> The more amperes the more electricity. It is also the mass
> (weight) of the
> >>electrons
> >> thus the number of electrons flowing.
> >>
> >> Power is a product between Amperage and Voltage. High power means
> that
> >>thare are
> >> lots of electrons flowing at a high speed. If the electrons stay
> still (No
> >>voltage)
> >> there is no power no matter how many electrons are staying still
> (High
> >>current).
> >> If there is high electron speed (High voltage) but only a few
> electrons are
> >>involved
> >> (Low current) there is not much power either.
> >>
> >> Work is a product between Power and Time. This is the thing that
> You pay
> >>for.
> >> If You have a huge amount of electrons going very fast (High
> power) but You
> >>give
> >> them no time, then nothing happens. As You gradually increase the
> available
> >>time,
> >> more and more happens (more work is done).
> >>
> >> Why do we need a thick wire to those gizmos that consume a lot of
> current ?
> >> Lot of current means many electrons. If we have a good conductor,
> the speed
> >> of electrons stays low in the conductor thus causing virtually no
> power at
> >>all
> >> in the conductor itself. All the power is there where it should
> be. Usually
> >>a
> >> thick conductor has more electrons (lower resistance) than a thin
> one.
> >>
> >> If we replace the good conductor with a more resistive one, we
> get faster
> >>electrons
> >> (because there are not so many available in the conductor) thus
> causing
> >>some
> >> power in the conductor itself. Because we usually have limited
> supply of
> >>either
> >> Voltage or Current (speed / amount) the gizmo does no more
> receive full
> >>power.
> >> At here we talk about power loss which is a little bit misleading
> as we
> >>didn't
> >> loose the power, it just isn't where it should be.
> >>
> >> The wire burns because there is power in it. If You give it time
> and if
> >>there
> >> is enough power to increase it's temperature, it will burn for
> sure.
> >>
> >> If You put ten wires in parallel that means that You have made
> ten ways for
> >>the
> >> electrons to go. That means in turn that the electron speed
> inside the
> >>wires has
> >> dropped to tenth of the original speed. Not so much power -> no
> burning.
> >>
> >> Hope this helped.
> >>
> >> --
> >> **********************************************
> >> * Esko Ilola                                 *
> >> * Email esko.ilola@tele.fi                   *
> >> * X400  G=esko S=ilola O=tele A=mailnet C=fi *
> >> * Tel.  +358 2040 3439                       *
> >> *       +358 4055 75977                      *
> >> *       +358 9537 430                        *
> >> * Mail  Ukonkivenpolku 7B5                   *
> >> *       01610 VANTAA                         *
> >> *       FINLAND                              *
> >> **********************************************
> >> * Oldsmobile Ninety Eight 1964               *
> >> *            Holiday Sports Sedan (4D HT)    *
> >> **********************************************
> >
> >
> >This one I have to get in on.
> >
> >Power = Amps X Volts
> >Volts = Amps X Resistance
> >Substituting the second equation for the volts in the first
> equation we
> >get:
> >
> >Power = Amps X Amps X Resistance, or more commonly referred to as
> >
> >I(squared)R, where I is amps, and R is resistance.
> >
> >All conductors give off heat as a result of resistance againt
> current.
> >Especially in transformers, where a LOT of conductors are wound
> >together, each wire giving off its own heat.  This is commonly
> referred
> >to as I(squared) R losses, also known as wasted Power.  The lower
> the
> >resistance, the less heat.  Since you can't change a wire's
> inherent
> >resistance characteristics, if you increase Voltage, you increase
> >current.  If that happens, your I(squared)R losses increase, so you
> have
> >more heat loss.  If the heat generated is very great, such as in
> using a
> >too small wire for the load, then it can burn the insulation, and
> then
> >possibly get hot enough to melt the metal.  This is exactly what
> happens
> >to your fuses under the dash.  Or especially the fusable link.
> That's
> >why a 3A fuse element is thread-like compared to a 25A fuse.  Based
> on
> >a  car's voltage system, that is the approximate maximum current
> that
> >can be passed through it.
> >
> >So as for conductor size, in general, when in doubt, max it out.
> Just
> >like fuel line size.  That's why small wire jumper cables (6 GA)
> get
> >hotter when you jump start a car with them than a 2 GA size.
> >
> >Hopefully that is a down and dirty lesson on conductors.
> >
> >I have to disagree about electrons having mass though.  There is no
> mass
> >to an electron.  Hard to believe, but it's true.
> >
> >My 2 cents
> >Mike Rothe
> >
> >

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:16:14 -0300
Subject: Re: Darwin Award/JATO idiot (Funny, somewhat long)

Hate to be a wet blanket here, but...

>You'll recall a Darwin Award winner not long ago where a  former Air
>Force sergeant decided to strap a cargo plane
> rocket booster to his car to see how fast it would go and ended up
>killing himself

The Urban Legends website at http://www.urbanlegends.com (currently
under revision but you can search the files manually) lists this old
story as "unanswered and may be unanswerable" as far as whether or
not it really happened.

>   Here's the 1997 winner:  Larry Waters of Los Angeles.
> Larry is one of the few to win the award and still be alive.
[...]
>He decided to fly.  He went to the
>local Army-Navy surplus store and purchased 45
> weather balloons and several tanks of helium.  The weather  balloons,
>when fully inflated, measured more than four feet
> across.  Back home, Larry securely strapped the balloons to his sturdy
>lawn chair.

This matches a listing which _is_ described as True, but listed as
happening on July 2, 1982, when he made it to 16,000 feet. No name
given. Copycat, perhaps?

>   Here's a salute to Larry Walters, the 1997 Darwin Award Winner.
                                          ^^^^
Little premature, aren't we?  ;-)

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 15:33:18 -0300
Subject: Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

Karl Davlin wrote:
>
> This whole sting is full of partially correct information!!!

Which is which?

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike

BTW, trimming replies is appriciated.


- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Pajak_John%PAX1@mr.nawcad.navy.mil
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:54:00 -0300
Subject: Re: Worst Loss?, best buy?

     The best $1000 I ever spent was in 1981. I bought a 72 W30 convertible
project car that I still have to this day!! (At the time the going price for
an OAI hood was $500)
     The garage project (30 x 40) has finally started so this car will get
the cosmetic restoration it has been patiently waiting for. It is Saturn
Gold with white stripes and top, PS, PDB, AT with dual gate, 3.73 anti-spin
(currently 3.42), SS II wheels, and saddle interior. I never liked the
interior color: I am changing it to white.

************************************************************
John Pajak     "DR. OLDS"
Lexington Park, MD
Pajak_John%PAX1@MR.NAWCAD.NAVY.MIL

65 Delta 88
66 Toronado
69 Cutlass S
70 Cutlass S W31
70 442 W30 convert
72 442 W30 convert
72 Delta 88 convert
+ others

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:40:33 -0300
Subject: Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

At 11:08 AM 4/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
>This whole sting is full of partially correct information!!!  I'm an

Aw, NOW you tell us! I just rewired my Toro based on these posts; is that
why it only partially works? ;)

>I hate to say it but my Cutlass was a wiring nightmare.  I totally
>disagree with the way automobile manufactures wire their products.  I
>guess they will do anything to save a dime.

[BIG snip of quoted posts that I've *already* seen a half-dozen times; note
that you CAN delete the unnecessary portions of the posts you are replying
to!!! This is not directed at Karl, but at *everybody* here! Please,
bandwidth is a *terrible* thing to waste...]

Hmmm, I thought that making the entire body of the car the ground, and only
using one hot wire, was a pretty good idea. What would the other option be,
running a "+" and "-" wire to each component? Multiplexing the switch wires?
(yeah, they do that now and save weight, but could you imagine the weight of
the controller for such a system on a '60's or '70's car?). I like having to
check only for clean grounds and broken hot wires when I've got an
electrical problem.

Since I started fixing electrical things on my car, I've been having a tough
time transferring these skills to repair jobs on my house's electrical
system ("Let's see, we've got the hot wire here, and the ground wire here...
What the h*ll is this 'neutral' wire for???"). Don't worry; I've got an
electrician on retainer until I can figure it out for myself.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:18:58 -0300
Subject: Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage  Was: no subject wh

Just to summarize my comments:

1) The post which stated increasing voltage requires an increase in wire
size was incorrect.  An increase in CURRENT, regardless of cause, may
require an increase in wire size.

2) Wiz questioned the use of the term "Load".  This is more of a street
term than a precise electrical term.  You could say "Bob, we have a 20
amp load" or "Jean, is that an 8 ohm load?"  Since it could refer to
either resistance/impedance or current flow, those terms would be more
proper to use.

3) I'm suprised that on one jumped on Esko's remarks concerning the speed
of electrons.

Now before we get into ELI the ICEman or coulombs per fortnight,
I'm outta here...

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike

- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: "Guillermo Santucci" <San2cci@msn.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:07:43 -0300
Subject: RE: junkyards (fwd)

Hi,

The seats are in rough shape.  The bottoms are practically gone but the
springs look very good.  No rust. The backs are in good shape also. The tray
cover and glove box are there and in good shape.  I'm in Southern Cal.
Pasadena area.

------------------------------

From: kozhill@titanlink.com (Jo-Anne Hillier)
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:34:44 -0300
Subject: Re: lets get technical

Robert Barry responded, thank you.

Cams: do you have any specs on JM16-18, JM18-20, JM20-22, JM22-24, I don't
have easy access to Mondello products.
Oil pumps: do you have more info on oil restrictors. never heard of oil
resrictors in push rods.

Carb tech: Q-jet; On the later design, there is a plug in the top cover
directly above the APT vave ( part throttle valve). This plug can be
removed and taped for a 1/8 " pipe plug. Thus allowing access  to this
valve. You can now adjust this richer or leaner, ( buy raising or lowering
the primary metering rods).
These rods are factory set, and have no specs to readjust even in rebuild
kits.Lots of mechanics remove them during rebuilds and install them at the
wrong setting. With this mod you can adjust your car for better fuel
mileage at part throttle and retain your secondary set-up for performance.
Or you can adjust it for performance. You will have to find a tool that
will work to adjust this valve, for it is shaped like the air screws on the
front of the carb. I have even used needle nose pliers.I put a 3/8" allen
head set screw on my last one and only taped the hole 3/4s of the way down
so the screw would not end up in the fuel bowl.My advice is to lean the
mixture untill you feel the lean hesitation then richen it slightly until
drivability returns. For performance, the old stop watch is the best.This
mod also allows you to be able to free the valve up if it ever sticks,
which it does, because it is controlled and open to your intake manifold.

Scott
kozhill@titanlink.com

------------------------------

From: tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Date: Fri, 11 Apr 1997 00:37:02 -0300
Subject: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)

>bandwidth is a *terrible* thing to waste...]
>

Hey everyone --

I am as about computer stupid as anyone can get.  What is bandwitdh?  Also
some posts get put on my desktop after I download my mail.  How come?

I have built tons of motors and cars and am quite vested in Olds knowledge.
As for these computers.....I need help!

Tony

70 442 W-30
70 Toro GT W-34
65 Jetstar 88 w/4-spd
85 Cutlass Salon 455 Drag Racer
92 Seville STS

------------------------------

From: Matt Bober <mattb442@siu.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 12:34:22 -0300
Subject: 82 Olds cutlass (T-tops)

Does anyone own an 82 Olds cutlass preferably with T-tops in the
Atlanta, Georgia area?    Rumor has it there's a gray one in mint
condition sitting in a Marietta garage collecting dust.  Wanna sell?

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 06:37:14 -0300
Subject: Re: lets get technical

     Cams:  Mondello's cams seem to be the preferred choice.  Which one
     depends on your engine, intended use, power band, etc.

     Intakes:  The stock non-egr intakes work okay.  I like my SB Edelbrock
     performer.  I'd go to a Performer RPM if I didn't have to worry about
     emissions.

     Intake modifications:  More a mod to the heads, but it's purpose is to
     affect the intake.  Block off the exhaust crossover passage.  Keeps
     the intake cooler.  You'll need to switch to an electric or manual
     choke.

     Oil pumps:  Stock unless you go install Mondello's oil restrictors and
     possibly Mondello's other recommended oil system mods, then you can
     use the high volume pump.  Unless it spends more time on the track
     than the street, I'd go with the stock oil pump.

     Carb CFM and Mods:  I've always stuck with the stock Q-jet.  I think
     they're about 650cfm.  The Q-jet works great, but if you like you can
     adjust the mixture (especially the secondary metering rods, they
     usually need richening up a size or two), and adjust the spring
     tension on the secondaries to adjust when they open (open as soon as
     you can without the car bogging down).

     Heads:  I've heard that 7A's are the ideal head for a SB.  Good
     flowing, hardened valve seats, good compression.  C heads are probably
     the best bet for a Big Block unless you can find rare F,H,K, or D
     heads.  Compression ratio and what fuel to use would depend on the
     piston you're using and what your displacement is.

     K&N: Yup, installed one on my '79.  Instantly pepped it up a small but
     just-enough-to-be-noticeable amount.  Transferred it to my '84 H/O
     when I bought it.  Still in use.  Over the 3 years I've had it, it's
     probably almost paid for itself if nothing else.  I'd have used 4-6
     paper filters by now, at $5 each. . .

     Synthetic:  I use Mobil-1, 10w30 spring/fall, 5w30 winter, 15w50
     summer (I change it every 3 months or 3k miles).  The synthetic
     definitely builds oil pressure sooner and cranks easier in the dead of
     winter.  With normal oil when on the highway for a few hours my oil
     pressure would steadily drop from 50psi to about 30psi over time.
     With the synthetic that doesn't happen since it's more stable at
     higher temperatures.  The synthetic also stays cleaner longer and
     after the first few changes I noticed that the oil looks much better
     come oil-change time.  On the down side, if you have any valve cover
     leaks expect the synthetic to make them slightly worse.

     Timing and distributor:  More initial timing and less mechanical
     advance are the general recommendation.  Your speed shop should sell
     distributor recurve kits that contain bushings to limit the total
     mechanical advance, and different springs to bring it on sooner or
     later.

     Plugs:  Splitfire is currently being prosecuted by the Federal Trade
     Commision due to deceptive advertising and insuffient proof that their
     product performs as advertised.  Stay _far_ away.  The stock AC plugs
     have always worked best for me.  The AC rapidfire plugs don't come in
     many different flavors, they one they list for the Olds has threads
     that are at least 1/4" longer than the normal AC plugs.  This would
     cause the threads to stick out into the combustion chamber and I
     haven't tried them for that reason, I bet the threads would heat up
     and create a hot spot causing detonation.  Maybe when they come out
     with a correct plug I'll try it.  I tried the Bosch platinums once,
     they ran very smooth and good for a short time, they they kept fouling
     and generally ran bad after the first 2000 miles.  The NGK U-groove
     plugs do seem to work okay though, about like the AC's.  I'd stay away
     from Autolite plugs, when they work they work okay, but I've had
     several physically break on me, usually a catastrophical failure.

     Gas mileage:  Bad.  Can't say much else :-)  My feeling is you gotta
     pay to play.  Neither the K&N filter, the synthetic oil, or any other
     mod has change gas mileage a measureable amount.  Gearing probably
     would make a difference, but I won't give up my 3.73's with OD!

     Electric fans:  Everyone I know who's used them can't get sufficient
     cooling.  I do think that if you choose your fan carefully (a good,
     big, high CFM fan) and mount it correctly with a shroud that I can be
     done.  On the Monte Carlo page they said you could pick up 20hp by
     dumping the stock engine driven fan.  I dunno about that, these are
     probably the same guys that swear by the splitfire plugs and slick-50.
      I think a clutch equipped engine driven fan is a good compromise.  Be
     sure to use a high flow thermostat (available at speed shops), I like
     180 degrees as a good compromise between performance and having a
     heater :-)  There was an article in a JWO a while ago advising to use
     the high flow thermostat.  The original type of thermostat available
     in Rocket engines through the early 70's is no longer available and
     the type you typically find at parts stores doesn't flow enough.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: lets get technical Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    4/9/97 10:05 PM


OK boys, I been reading this mail to learn. How about some high tech info
in how to get more ponies out of these olds blocks. Which cam works best on
small blocks, big block. Carb mods. Intakes,which work best? How can you
modify stock manifolds? Exhaust manifolds? Blue printing tips? Oil pumps,
what kind of pressure,volume? Carb cfm? How about jets mettering rods for
the old Q-jet?Which heads work on a small block, big block the best using
90-92 octain fuel? Ever try K&N air filters? Opinions on synthetic oils?
Timming specs. Distributor curves? Ever try the new hot spark plugs from
Split fire, Delco, Bosch?
How about fuel mileage? Electric fans?Lets get some opinions going!
Scott
kozhill@titanlink.com




------------------------------

From: Karl Davlin <kdavlin@bigfoot.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 13:43:42 -0300
Subject: Re: FW: Re[?]: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

Robert Barry wrote:

> At 11:08 AM 4/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
> >This whole sting is full of partially correct information!!!  I'm
> an
>
> Aw, NOW you tell us! I just rewired my Toro based on these posts; is
> that
> why it only partially works? ;)
>
> >I hate to say it but my Cutlass was a wiring nightmare.  I totally
> >disagree with the way automobile manufactures wire their products.
> I
> >guess they will do anything to save a dime.

> Hmmm, I thought that making the entire body of the car the ground,
> and only
> using one hot wire, was a pretty good idea. What would the other
> option be,
> running a "+" and "-" wire to each component? Multiplexing the
> switch wires?
> (yeah, they do that now and save weight, but could you imagine the
> weight of
> the controller for such a system on a '60's or '70's car?). I like
> having to
> check only for clean grounds and broken hot wires when I've got an
> electrical problem.

I didn't say I had a problem using the frame as a ground.  I surely
didn't say running a "+" and "-" was another option.  There is a lot
more to wiring than you mentioned.  Some of the problems I see are:
    1.  Fusible links
    2.  Type of wire being used, (cheap, can not handle much current.
The gauge of the wire by all means
         NOT the way to judge how much current it can handle.  The type
of conductor and the insulation play
         a major part as well!)
    3.  The routing of wire without fuses closer to the battery or
source
    4.  Using male connectors on the "hot" side of the connector,
(sensor side should be male)
    5. ect...

>
>
> Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
> Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Thomas Martin <marttj@pcmail1.csg.mot.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:07:18 -0300
Subject: 85-87 442 cam specs?

Is there anyone out there who has the cam specs for the 307 "Y" and the
442's 307 "9"?  I would like to compare.  Or at least where I can get
them?

Also, did all 307 "Y"'s use the same cam for all gear ratio's, or did
the 2.14/2.29 geared cars get a cam that had a lower power band?

A friend of mine's mom and dad have a beautiful white 87 Cutlass
Supreme, fairly loaded, 307 "Y" and 200 4R.  They averaged 27 mpg on an
emergency trip from STL to AZ.  In the wide open areas they were going
80-85, and the rest of the trip they were traveling about 75.  They
praised the car to high heaven.  My 307 "Y" has seen 27.3 with 2.14's,
and averages 24 hwy, and 17 city.  EPA said 17 city, 22 hwy.

I have a copy of the original window sticker, as the dealer could not
find it when my dad bought the car new.  If anyone needs any info from
it, feel free to email me.

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme 307

------------------------------

From: Karl Davlin <kdavlin@bigfoot.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:22:48 -0300
Subject: Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage  Was: no subject wh

Mike Frederick wrote:

> Just to summarize my comments:
>
> 1) The post which stated increasing voltage requires an increase in
> wire
> size was incorrect.  An increase in CURRENT, regardless of cause,
> may
> require an increase in wire size.
>
> 2) Wiz questioned the use of the term "Load".  This is more of a
> street
> term than a precise electrical term.  You could say "Bob, we have a
> 20
> amp load" or "Jean, is that an 8 ohm load?"  Since it could refer to
>
> either resistance/impedance or current flow, those terms would be
> more
> proper to use.
>
> 3) I'm suprised that on one jumped on Esko's remarks concerning the
> speed
> of electrons.
>
> Now before we get into ELI the ICEman or coulombs per fortnight,
> I'm outta here...
>
>     66 Toro
> The /\   /\ and Mike
>
> --
> Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
>      Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
>      (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

 This I can agree to!
                              Karl

------------------------------

From: jkpkobin@discover-net.net (Jeff & Patti Kobinsky)
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:38:09 -0300
Subject: Worst loss?

Back in my high school days (77 - 79) I bought a 65 F85 coupe and thought it
to be a pretty cool car.

One of my high school buddys older brother had a 70 W30 442, red with white
stripes.

This car was all original, aluminum rear end, the works.

He drove it very little, and I remembered him cruising past us "kids" at the
local McDonalds and the tires would squeak and the car would jump a little
to the one side every time it shifted - the car itself was very quiet, so
about all your could hear was the tires chirp when it left the area.

One day I finially was able to get a ride, and I was supprised to find an
automatic transmission (dual gate shifter) that was making the tires chirp
like that.

My first thought was he really must have to wind it up to make it do that,
but a tour of the town proved that was not the case - it did that quite easy.

That first impression has lasted a lifetime, I begged him to sell it to me
for about  8 years - it was driven about ten times per summer - never taken
to car shows (??).

In 1986 on the day I bought my new house we came home from the bank and
there was that Damn car sitting in a parking lot chained to a lamp post with
a 4 - sale sign on it - $4000.00.

I had to stop at the shell station to use the bathroom because I did not
have enough money left in my bank account to by toilet paper 'till payday.

Without a dime to my name until payday, I called the guy the next morning to
see if there was any way I could work out a payment deal - he said the car
was sold less than one hour after he parked it there.

It must have been someone from out of town, because that car has not been
seen around town since.

I'm 36 now, and still have the 65, along with a 74 442 I bought a few years
later.

With the help & inspiration of you guy's I hope to once again drive what I
own.

But the "one that got away" will always be my greatest loss...........

------------------------------

From: JPADA@Orbital.COM
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 15:18:45 -0300
Subject: Re[2]: Darwin Award/JATO idiot


>   Here's the 1997 winner:  Larry Waters of Los Angeles.
> Larry is one of the few to win the award and still be alive.
[...]
>He decided to fly.  He went to the
>local Army-Navy surplus store and purchased 45
> weather balloons and several tanks of helium.  The weather  balloons,
>when fully inflated, measured more than four feet
> across.  Back home, Larry securely strapped the balloons to his sturdy
>lawn chair.

This matches a listing which _is_ described as True, but listed as
happening on July 2, 1982, when he made it to 16,000 feet. No name
given. Copycat, perhaps?

          I don't know if Larry Waters is the same guy, but this did
          actually happen in 1982.  I was living in LA at the time and
          the story made the front page of the LA Times (complete with
          photo).  The guy lived in Long Beach and apparently got into
          the approach path of LB Airport (which is right next to
          Veterans Stadium, which is where the LB Swap Meet is held,
          where one can often find enough Olds parts to warrant this
          gratuitous Olds content in an otherwise non-Olds posting)

          Joe Padavano
          jpada@orbital.com

          66 442
          68 W-30
          69 H/O
          70 W-30


------------------------------

From: Pajak_John%PAX1@mr.nawcad.navy.mil
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:35:00 -0300
Subject: More technical

You Wrote:

People here seem to be really happy with the JM16-18 or JM18-20 for
performance small-blocks, and JM20-22 or JM22-24 for performance big-blocks.
(these are Mondello cam numbers)

>The JM22-25 is a little wild in my 455. It still has enough vacuum to run
power discs.  I'm building a 1970 10.2:1 350 with ª6 heads and would like to
try a JM18-20 grind. It's going in a 4-speed, 3.08 geared, PDB, PS, AC 1970
Cutlass S. Has anyone used the JM18-20 in a 350?????

<SNIP>Though you'll find some people here who don't like "quadrajunks",
others
here wouldn't put anything else on their engine (because they've tried other
things on their engines and didn't get better performance). Start with a
carb that goes with a factory engine more or less similar to the engine
you've built, and modify from there.

>At the track, (72 W30 conv, 455, 22-25 cam, 11" conv, 3.42 gears, 4050 lbs
with driver) the rejetted Qjet ran within a 1/10 second of a scienced out
Holley 750 Vacuum Secondary (13.41 vs 13.31). An 800 Holley double pumper
performed about the same (13.45). The Holley carbs do seem to idle a bit
better on an engine with a hot cam, though. I've never drilled the Qjet
passages like some articles recommend; all I did was change primary jets and
secondary metering rods. The Qjet is on the car now.

<SNIP>A stock-type thermostatic clutch fan, with a 7-blade Toro fan, a fan
shroud and a new 4-row radiator should be able to cool whatever you throw at
it. Just make sure the impeller on your water pump is actually *attached*
before you install it...

>Watch out for clearance problems with the Toro fan. It hit the PS pump on
my 72 W30 (non AC) but cleared just fine on my 69 Cutlass S 350 (AC- longer
water pump!) Use it if you can!!! An auxiliary trans cooler is a good idea
too.

*************************************************************
John Pajak     "DR. OLDS"
Lexington Park, MD
Pajak_John%PAX1@MR.NAWCAD.NAVY.MIL

65 Delta 88
66 Toronado
69 Cutlass S
70 Cutlass S W31
70 442 W30 convert
72 442 W30 convert
72 Delta 88 convert
+ others

------------------------------

From: lawrencr@kostabi.gdls.com (Robert Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:50:53 -0300
Subject: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

>> And the original post said that the wire size must be increased because
>> of increased voltage,

I hate to through more wood on the fire (or current through the wire),
but I think the reason you do this is to increase the voltage going
to the distributor.  The original wire that went to the points type
ignition system had a built in resistance.  I think it was to lower
the voltage in order to increase the life expectancy of the points
and condensor.

So to rephrase, the wire size must be increased to increase the voltage.
Or, really, you need to replace that special high resistance wire with a
regular wire.

I forget what the original post said, so if I just went off on a tangent,
I apologize.

-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Robert Lawrence   | 1970 Oldsmobile 98 Convertible               .^.
lawrencr@gdls.com |  _________,~--,___________\____________     /9|8\ (810)
825-5129    |  |                |~    |        ___   |    \}|{/ Sterling Hts.,
MI |  =------(-o-)-------------------( o )--=      v

------------------------------

From: tchurchill@draper.com (Timothy A. Churchill)
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:44:35 -0300
Subject: Re: Darwin Award/JATO idiot (Funny, somewhat long)

> >   Here's the 1997 winner:  Larry Waters of Los Angeles.
> > Larry is one of the few to win the award and still be alive.
> [...]

> This matches a listing which _is_ described as True, but listed as
> happening on July 2, 1982, when he made it to 16,000 feet. No name
> given. Copycat, perhaps?
>
> >   Here's a salute to Larry Walters, the 1997 Darwin Award Winner.
>                                           ^^^^
> Little premature, aren't we?  ;-)
>

Well, maybe, maybe not.  When I read the story a few months ago, it was
alleged that Larry had already gone to that Big Chaise Lounge Chair In The
Sky; but due to cancer as I recall... maybe caused by UV raditaion suffered
when he was in the upper stratoshpere?



Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, a.k.a. 'Der KinderWagen'
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: turley@symplex.com (Mike Turley)
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 14:46:00 -0300
Subject: Re: 1967 442

>
> First off, I'd just like to say that the 1967 442 is one of the greatest
cars > produced in the history of automobiles. :)           ^^^

Yes, it is.  But, I prefer the '66.  It's got cleaner headlight/parking
lights, and tail lights.  They are both way cool, Brendan.


>
> Brendan
> (looking for a 67)
>
>

John Berenyi, of this list, was advertising a blue '67 that sounded beautiful.
John, you there??


Mike Turley        '66 442
turley@symplex.com

------------------------------

From: Yorcoy@aol.com
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 15:04:52 -0300
Subject: Re: junkyards (fwd)

Do you have any idea what the cost will be? What kind of arrangements need to
be made?
Rick
E-Mail yorcoy@aol.com

------------------------------

From: Yorcoy@aol.com
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 15:09:38 -0300
Subject: Re: junkyards (fwd)

Gill, I think I'm just interested in the glovebox and ashtray cover, let me
know how much.
Thanks

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 18:10:11 -0300
Subject: Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)

Tony Waldner wrote:
>
> What is bandwitdh?

The classic definition is the renge of frequencies that can pass through
a circuit.  My Encyclolodedia of Compuer Science and Engineering defines
the bandwidth of a communications network as "a measure of frequencies it
can transmit or receive at or near maximum power levels".  In our common,
everyday internet usage, it is usually used to refer to the waste of
communications resources.

> Also some posts get put on my desktop after I download my mail.  How
> come?

You got a leak in the bottom of your monitor?   ;)

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike


- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 18:27:01 -0300
Subject: Re: MSDs, Current, and Voltage

Robert Lawrence wrote:
>
> The original wire that went to the points type ignition system had a
> built in resistance.

And therfore not a "wire" in it's true sense but a resistor.

> So to rephrase, the wire size must be increased to increase the
> voltage.

Nope.  The "resistor" is removed.

> Or, really, you need to replace that special high resistance wire with
> a regular wire.

Better.

> I forget what the original post said, so if I just went off on a
> tangent, I apologize.

No need.  We all do.

    66 Toro
The /\   /\ and Mike


- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

From: jev114@email.psu.edu
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 15:39:06 -0300
Subject: Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)

Mike Frederick wrote:
>
> Tony Waldner wrote:
> >
> > What is bandwitdh?
>
> The classic definition is the renge of frequencies that can pass through
> a circuit.  My Encyclolodedia of Compuer Science and Engineering defines
> the bandwidth of a communications network as "a measure of frequencies it
> can transmit or receive at or near maximum power levels".  In our common,
> everyday internet usage, it is usually used to refer to the waste of
> communications resources.
>
> > Also some posts get put on my desktop after I download my mail.  How
> > come?
>
BEcause you have your mail program installed to the desktop...ie
c:\windows\desktop

if you using eudora you probably getting new files like in.toc and
others right?

Jeff

------------------------------

From: "IT" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:09:45 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds 307

I have a 1981 Delta 88 with the 307 motor.  I bought it for $800 Canadian
in '91 and had absolutley no motor problems.  The car has almost 400,000 km
and still runs like a charm.  The biggest repair I had to do was the
power-steering pump (i.e. the old owner left it without oil), and only a
couple of other minor things.  With the new tires (BFGoodrich Performance)
and consequently new shocks to prevent weird tire ware, I have spent only
aprox. $1000 dollars (850 on tires and shocks) for the 110,000 km that I
had it.  By the looks of it, this car is good for many more trouble-free
miles.  You are riqht, no rice burner or any other car for that matter can
top that.  (have spent more on maintanace on my 95 Intrepid than on this
Olds for 1/5 less mileage.)

------------------------------

From: Ray Moriarty <rmoriarty@blairinc.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:18:02 -0300
Subject: Re: Some dumb questions (Non Olds)

>some posts get put on my desktop after I download my mail.  How
>come?

Are the files on your desktop e-mail or attachments? If they are attachments
and you are running Windows 95, your e-mail program is set to automatically
decode attachments to the desktop folder (usually c:\windows\desktop).

Ray
34467x

------------------------------

From: STLPENS@aol.com
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:33:58 -0300
Subject: WANTED 394 ENGINE PARTS

I AM REBUIDING A 61 394 AND NEED FOLLOWING:

PISTONS, RINGS, MAIN-ROD-CAM BEARINGS, TIMING SET, PISTON PIN BUSHINGS,
LIFTERS, CAM SHAFT AND OIL PUMP.

PERFER TO GET FROM ALL ONE SOURE

BUT I WONT BE PICKY

THANKS

------------------------------

From: John Schumacher <jd.schumacher@baylordallas.edu>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:50:38 -0300
Subject: Re: headers, gaskets and such...

Clayton Pierce wrote:
>
> Okay all, I'm going to be installing my headers soon, probably within the
> next week or two, and I need to buy parts.  First off, what gaskets etc.
> do I need exactly?  Anybody have any brand preferences that they would

I recommend stock replacement fel-pro gaskets.  Ordinary header gaskets
fail often and are no contest to even a back-fire.  I've been running
fel-pro metal combination gaskets for over three years on Cyclone
headers with no leaks/burn or replacement yet.

Collectors are also an issue.  I recommend Hooker collectors for any
brand of header.  I found that these collectors retain a seal years
longer than others even with ordinary collector gaskets.  The last thing
you want to do is weld the exhaust pipe/colletor/header all together to
avoid leaks.

- --
John "Shoe-Man" Schumacher
North Texas Olds Club ª25464 Dynamic 88
Dallas, Texas69 442
OCA ª02115174 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

From: MROTHE <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 16:56:40 -0300
Subject: Re: 85-87 442 cam specs?

Thomas Martin wrote:
>
> Is there anyone out there who has the cam specs for the 307 "Y" and the
> 442's 307 "9"?  I would like to compare.  Or at least where I can get
> them?

I have them in front of me.  However, it is only for the lift.  That's
in the 85 chassis manual.  The book states Y-intake=.247" and
exhaust=.251"  and the 9- both at .275"  which, if you take into the
account of 1.6 ratio rockers, it is y-.395"intake/.402" exhaust total
lift.  9-.440" total lift.  Spring pressures (average) for Y- about 80ª
closed, 188ª open.  for 9- 90ª closed, 210ª open.
>
> Also, did all 307 "Y"'s use the same cam for all gear ratio's, or did
> the 2.14/2.29 geared cars get a cam that had a lower power band?
>
It only lists one cam for Y and 9.  I don't know if there are others.

Hope this helps.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª605
********************************
