To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #615


oldsmobile-digest         Wednesday, 16 April 1997      Volume 01 : Number 615

Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)
Re: 66 -442 NOT '67!
'68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
Re: 68 442
Re: Subject: Re: Torque Converter for Swap
Guage, and light problems(was: 81 cutlass)
Re: 307 Smoke
Re: 66 -442 NOT '67!
V/O Twister
Misc. followups
Re: 68 442
Re: [2] Handling Problem
Oldsmobile Centennial
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
SSI Wheels
Re: 442/Cutlass Parts For Sale
Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)
Re: 68 442
Re: 68 442
Re: Handling problem
Re:(2) 442/Cutlass parts for sale
Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)
Re: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?
Re[2]: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?
Re: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?
Re[2]: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?
Re: [2] Handling Problem
Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel
Re: castle nut clip for spinde with speedo drive?
Re: GM 3.4L V-6s
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
[2] Handling Problem
Just What Every Garage Needs
Re: Tranny Went Kablooie!
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
Re: GM 3.4L V-6s
Re: Power Valve Holley 750
Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
Re: [2] Handling Problem
3.something rearend
To:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Re: [2] Handling Problem
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)
ª's
Re: ª's
Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)
Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine
NOS Rear Window Defoggers for Omega/88/98/Toronado
Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine
Re: [2] Handling Problem
Re: Synthetic Motor Oil Again
RE: ZL-1.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: Nick DiGiovanni <ndigiova@Direct.CA>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 12:17:43 -0300
Subject: Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)

At 03:12 AM 4/16/97 -0300, Joe Padavano wrote:
>     Excellent!  I couldn't have said it better myself!  I tried to think
>     up a factory 64-72 musclecar (as opposed to ponycar) that didn't have
>     four headlights, and all I could come up with were some of the early
>     Super Stock Chryslers.

How 'bout '71-'72 Chevelles... they had/have only 2 round headlights ;').


Nick DiGiovanni
ndigiova@Direct.CA
Port Coquitlam, B.C.
1970 4-4-2

------------------------------

From: "Blaines" <blaines@strata3d.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:26:40 -0300
Subject: Re: 66 -442 NOT '67!

- ----------
>         A friend of mine is finishing a nice 66 442 Holiday coupe. Got a
> rebuilt and built short stroke 400 and a automatic. It has been switched
to
> a TH400. Replated bumpers, beautiful grille, super straight body better
yet
> he'll let it go for $1500 right now before he puts everything back
together.
> The front clip is off and the engine is out. Otherwise the interior is
very
> nice. Radio delete car and if I remember right it may have been a heater
> delete also. I can't remember. He had a few of them. If your interested
> please give him a call at (804) 730-3396. His name is Frank. He's located
in
> Richmond, Virginia. Check it out. If I had some more cash right now I'd
pick
> it up. It's super clean.
>
> Jim Chermack

I've seen that car advertised in several places on the Internet (I'm almost
positive it's the same one), and I can not believe he hasn't sold it yet!
Maybe it's because everyone thinks it must be a p.o.s. if he only wants
$1500 for it.  It sounds like a killer deal to me... and if I lived in
Virginia, I'd have already sold my left you-know-what to get it. ;)


------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:35:18 -0300
Subject: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada) wrote:
> > My 1968 442 convertible has the courtesy light above the radio.  It
> > is a black trimmed light w/switch included.  It also comes on when
> > the door is opened or the light switch turned fully counter-clockwise.
> In checking with the 1968 Oldsmobile wholesale car order sheet, the
> option U29 (Courtesy lamps) came standard on convertibles.  On the
> sports/holiday coupes they were included with options M14 (Heavy duty
> 3 speed fully synchonized transmission), M20 (4 speed wide ratio fully
> synchronized transmission), or M21 (4 speed close ration fully
> synchronized transmission) when D55 (Sports console - with floor shift)
> was ordered.  So I guess this light wasn't meant for my car since it
> is a automatic.

Not sure we're talking about the same thing here. Courtesy lights are (I
think) the ones mounted under the dash to light the footwells.
Convertibles almost always come with these because they have no place for
an overhead light.

OTOH, Cutlasses of this era offered a map light option which mounted
above the radio - same general location as the rear defogger switch I was
asking about a couple of days ago. The ones I've seen have a switch on
them, though I didn't know they were also wired into the door jamb switch
circuit. I'm trying to get one of these right now from Chris Witt for my
'68 (he thinks he has one *somewhere*) since I mitaswell put it in while
I'm attacking the dash for the defogger switch too...

This map light is not to be confused with the *other* map light that came
in the rear view mirror... :)

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:38:36 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442

On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, hanthorn wrote:
> I noticed alot of 68 442 talk lately.  I have a 68 442, and so does a
> friend of mine.  If you live in WI or the surounding area and have a 68
> 442s for sale, or any parts..(need drivers Quarter panel) please let me
> know, because you can never have enough 442s. I want more!!
> Anyone know how many 68 442s were built with the automatic shifter on
> the column???

I dunno exactly. I have been told that they made only 69 '68 W-30 sport
(post) coupes with a column shift automatic. OTOH, my buddy Don has a '68
W-30 holiday coupe (hardtop) that is a bench seat/column shift car, so
perhaps they made more of that style.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: grpruett@vt.edu (Greg Pruett )
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 03:46:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Subject: Re: Torque Converter for Swap

>>At 05:35 PM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>>Hi all,
>>>       My mechanic just informed me that I have a high RPM stall speed
>>>torque converter in my 72 Cutlass with a 455.  It is too high for
>>>this engine.  It is probably around 3000 rpm (exact rpm can be
>>>verified).
>>
>>Does your engine rev a bit before it begins to move? Is it a stock engine?
>>What exactly led him to this conclusion, and what makes him think it's too
>>high for this engine? (I'm a natural skeptic, auto-wise)
>
>It is clear that it is a higer than stock torque converter.  While in
>drive,
>standing still, and with the brakes applied, he achieved RPMs of around
>3000 RPM before loading up.  This is measured with the factory
>Tic-Toc-Tac.
>We would need to verify this with a more trustworthy tach to get an
>exact stall
>speed.  From a standing start, the car really winds out before
>engaging.  This
>engine has lots of torque even at pretty low RPMs, which I am missing
>out on.
>It is a stock 455 4 bbl.  Despite this, I cannot spin the tires from a
>standing
>start.  It really feels like there is a rubber band connection between
>the
>engine and tires (there isn't - I checked <g>)

Does this car have a TH-400?  If it's a TH-400, is there a chance that at
some point the tranny was replaced by a switch-pitch tranny?  And the switch
pitch was hooked to the kickdown switch that was for the original tranny.
Just a thought.  You could unplug the kikdown switch and try the stall test
again.  If it's a switch-pitch converter the stall speed would be noticeably
lower.

As I say, just  a thought, and the chances are probably one in a million.
But it would be easy to check out and it might save you trading torque
converters.

Greg Pruett
`72 Vista-Cruiser
`67 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

From: CRuper1@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 13:35:23 -0300
Subject: Guage, and light problems(was: 81 cutlass)

In a message dated 97-04-16 03:11:02 EDT, you write:

<< Also, DON'T  forget the
 >grounds. That caused a little problem for me after installation. You'll
 >also experience some minor problems with the speedo and dash indicators.
 >They'll work, but sometimes lights will come on very dimly. Something to
 >do with the computer. Good Luck, e-mail me back if you need any other
 >assistance.
 >
 >Katana72
 >


 Actually, I'd say the dash problems are isolated, i.e. not related to the
 engine swap.  Perhaps dumping the computer might give CEL problems (but I
 think with the EMC gone, the light stays off) so I think Rob's lighting
 problems are elsewhere.  The V6 and V8's used the same sending units (Or
 ~could~ use, I should say) so electrically there should be little
difference. >>

I would agree with you, and bet that the problem with the dash lights
pertains to a ground problem still occurring, or just nothing more than a
light that, by chance, got burnt out at the same time you did the motor swap.
 I've done a 350 swap into an '81 which had a 260 in it, and didn't have any
problems( didn't have guages, just the idiot lights), but everything worked
fine for me.  I did change over to guages later on, and had problems with the
guages only giving a decent reading "every so often" (they would come on only
when it was warm, or after the car was running for a some time, but it just
seemed like they weren't getting a signal all the time, such as the gas guage
not moving around when you slam the gas from a dead stop, while having no gas
in the tank basically).  I went and looked through thing this last weekend,
and now things work right.  What did I do?  Took the dash all apart, replaced
a few bulbs, and cleaned (nothing more than wiped off with a rag) the
contacts where things connect into the back, etc.  It works fine now.

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 06:35:12 -0300
Subject: Re: 307 Smoke

     Can't help you much with the smoke, it's probably carburetor related,
     although it may be leaking valve guides.  Either way it doesn't sound
     like it's a problem that's worth bothering to fix, just keep an eye on
     it.

     I'm not sure what the stock speed the TCC is supposed to engage at
     (most aftermarket chips delay this), but I thought it was around 35 or
     so.  I would wire up an LED (or simply connect your voltmeter) to the
     TCC lockup pin on the diagnostic connector.  This way you can tell if
     the computer really is telling the TCC to lock up (meaning a computer
     or sensor problem.  Do these cars have speed sensors?), or if it's
     locking up on it's own (a TCC or TCC solenoid problem).  If you go to
     the Turbo Regal home page at http://ni.umd.edu:80/gnttype/www you
     might find instructions on how to wire this up.  Pin F on the ALDL
     connector (the top corner closest to the driver, opposite end from the
     corner you put the diagnostic jumper in) will go low (ground) when the
     TCC is locked up.  BTW, you can also put a switch in here to ground
     pin F and force the TCC to lock up if you want (starting with second
     gear, the TCC cannot physically lock up in first gear or reverse since
     there is no fluid path).  I think it might be neat to wire up an
     indicator LED to notify when the TCC is engaged, I may do this too.
     Take an LED with an appropriate resistor in series, wire cathode to an
     ignition switched 12v, anode to pin F.

     BTW, I got my TCC solenoid changed out yesterday.  Seems to have fixed
     my sticky solenoid when hot problem, the TCC is now unlocking when it
     should.  Also replaced the O2 sensor, it wasn't bad but after 85k
     miles I figure it needed it.  Seems to run a little smoother and cured
     a minor "flat spot" I had at about half throttle.  I'm driving to
     seattle (5 hours) this Sunday, and I'm anxious to see what it's done
     to my gas mileage.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: 307 Smoke Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    4/15/97 5:51 PM

     Also...last one, I promise...going to work today, the torque converter
     just decided to act up and at all speeds greater than about 25, it
     would engage.

------------------------------

From: DKTBAT@webtv.net (doug thompson)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:01:48 -0300
Subject: Re: 66 -442 NOT '67!

Here! Here!

Doug..'67 4-4-2 (Bimini Blue, modified 455), '67 4-4-2 (white, original
un-restored), '67 4-4-2 Convertable, original un-restored

------------------------------

From: hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:18:24 -0300
Subject: V/O Twister

A friend of mine is a big Olds fan he has a 68 442 and so do I. Joe
Mondello was in Vietnam and back then he was racing a car called the V/o
twister (named after his favorite drink Vodka & Orange juice with a
twist) My friend's Uncle was also in Nam with Mondello, I guess
something happend over there and Mondello owed him a favor? or something
like that. Well the moral of the story is that Mondello gave or sold
cheap(not sure) his race car.  The V/O Twister (the Original one ) has
been sitting in his uncles barn for 20 years now with only a couple
hundred miles on it. All complete and as was when Joe raced it.  My
friends been askig his uncle to sell it to him, but he values that car
more than life. Mondello also named the car he has now after it"Twister
II" I just think he should sell it to my friend and not let the damn
thing just sit in his barn all coverd with dust. I'v never really heard
alot about the V/O Twister but its a 69 442 I know it has a roller cam
and 3.90 gears and used to run in the low elevens. if anyone has any
info or pictures on this car please, please send it to me.

thankyou, Marty

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <ACG@dlogics.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:20:02 -0300
Subject: Misc. followups

Three or four for the price of one, 'cause I'm working from home
today over a cheesy dialup line...

> From: JPADA@Orbital.COM
> Subject: Re[2]: Need Favor - '68/'69 Owner
>
> Andy "defroster head" Green wrote:
>
>> ...The fan type is probably easiest to install overall and looks more
>> correct on 1960s era and earlier models.
>
>     But you fail to point out the insulating properties of all the air
>     bubbles in the aftermarket grid-type units...     ;)

Hey! What are _you_ doing in this argument? Has Mike got the flu?

> Subject: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)
>
> The good Dr. Robert Barry wrote:
>
>> ...If your car has *four* _round_ headlights and 400 or more cubic
>> inches under the hood, you ARE driving a musclecar!

I would say you're driving a musclecar if everything in the back seat
was in the front seat before the last stoplight turned green...

> From: "IT" <todorovb@cadvision.com>
> Subject: [2] Handling Problem
>
> When I had the shocks and tires installed, the front end was checked,
> wheels were alligned and they said everything was okay.  This was done
> aproximatley 2500km ago.  Right away, I noticed the problem. They keep
> insisting that everything is fine.

I still would get a second opinion on the alignment. Have the place
you go to actually measure it on the rack, not just eyeball it with
a tape measure.

> From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
> Subject: Re: 81 cutlass
>
>> You'll
>> also experience some minor problems with the speedo and dash indicators.
>> They'll work, but sometimes lights will come on very dimly. Something to
>> do with the computer.
>
> Actually, I'd say the dash problems are isolated, i.e. not related to the
> engine swap.  Perhaps dumping the computer might give CEL problems (but I
> think with the EMC gone, the light stays off) so I think Rob's lighting
> problems are elsewhere.

Agreed; the only light controlled by the computer is the Check Engine
light. No other lighting problems could be blamed on this. Maybe with
a little more detail we can figure this one out. Which lights are coming
on dimly? Dash backlighting? Warning lights? If so, which warnings?

> From: "Thomas G. Stoner" <tgstoner@umich.edu>
> Subject: 1974 Oldsmobile Bulletins For Sale (4/16)
[...]
> 74-I-12A   2   Clock Warranty Repair Supplemental Information

Hey, what does this one say? Anything about squirting WD-40 in
the back?  :-)

> From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
> Subject: Re: 1971 cutlass for parts
>
> I was wondering if the light fixture, I assume above the radio, was
> available on the 68 442?  Or maybe just the Cutlass line.

I've seen something that looked very similar on the '68 LeMans, FWIW.

Andrew C. Green            (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606         Fax: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Denney J Keys <Denney.J.Keys.1@gsfc.nasa.gov>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:19:37 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442

I apologize up front...

Heaven knows I DON'T want to restart the "what's 4-4-2 really stand for?"
thread again, but it occurs to me that the "standard" transmission on the
4-4-2 has ALWAYS been listed as a 3-speed (granted it was a manual
transmission) in all of the factory documentation that I have ever come
across (WITH the exception of 1964 where it was touted specifically as
4-speed, 4-barrel, dual exhausts).

~Maybe~ it should really be ex post facto renamed as the 4-3-2 (1-0-Blastoff!)

Sorry, but it has been bugging me for a very long time. ;-)

Denney
66 Cutlass Conv.
72 Cutlass
73 "4-4-2"
95 Cutlass Supreme SL

<snip>
>> I noticed alot of 68 442 talk lately.  I have a 68 442, and so does a
>> friend of mine.  If you live in WI or the surounding area and have a 68
>> 442s for sale, or any parts..(need drivers Quarter panel) please let me
>> know, because you can never have enough 442s. I want more!!
>> Anyone know how many 68 442s were built with the automatic shifter on
>> the column???
>
>I dunno exactly. I have been told that they made only 69 '68 W-30 sport
>(post) coupes with a column shift automatic. OTOH, my buddy Don has a '68
>W-30 holiday coupe (hardtop) that is a bench seat/column shift car, so
>perhaps they made more of that style.
>
>Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
>
<snip>
 ________
 |  /\  | Denney J. Keys, P.E.
 |  ||  | Code 734 - Space Power Applications Branch
 |  ||  | Goddard Space Flight Center
 |  ||  | Greenbelt, MD  20771
 |  ||  | Phone ª(301)286-6202/Fax ª(301)286-1743
 | //\\ |
 ||/||\||
 |_/||\_|
    /\
   //\\

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 07:20:09 -0300
Subject: Re: [2] Handling Problem

     Have you tried deflating the tires some?  I asked my tire dealer a
     while ago, and they recommended about 32psi front, 28-30psi rear (V8
     G-body, 235/60R15 tires, 35psi max tires).

     Many shops will inspect your front-end for free, so you always have
     the option of going somewhere for a second opinion.  Keep this in mind
     though: do you really expect a shop to say "Everything is great, we
     don't need to do any work for you and we don't want your money"?

------------------------------

From: Dan Muir <danmuir@UDel.Edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 14:38:59 -0300
Subject: Oldsmobile Centennial

The Oldsmobile Centennial will be a special feature of Hagley's Cavalcade
of Cars, a major car show to be held at Hagley Museum, Wilmington,
Delaware, USA on Saturday, September 20, 1997.  This is an outgrowth of
100 Years of Cars held at Hagley Museum in September of 1996.  That car
show, planned by eight car clubs from Delaware, New Jersey, and
Pennsylvania, included motor vehicles from every year since 1896, with
the exception of 1898, in a field of 500 cars, displayed by decade,
representing the diversity of the industry.  It was enjoyed by more than
7,000 visitors in the 6 hours that it was open.

The 1997 Cavalcade of Cars will again be limited to 500 pre-registered
vehicles.  Vehicles through the 1977 model year are invited, with
Oldsmobiles through the current year.  Registration is $10, with no fee
for cars 1916 and earlier.


For a registration form, contact

Dan Muir
Hagley Museum and Library
P. O. Box 3630
Wilmington  DE  19807  USA
(302) 658-2400
FAX   658-0568

danmuir@udel.edu

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:00:20 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

Hi Greg,

Do you know what the option number is for the Map light?  I didn't
see any reference to it in the 442 options order sheet.

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

From: Tom Williams <tjwilli@megavision.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:03:08 -0300
Subject: SSI Wheels

HI All,
     I am looking for a nice set of SSI wheels for a 70 W-31.
Would prefer the trim rings and center caps to be in good shape.
Also I am looking for an 8 track player for the same car. I need
it to be black in color.

Thanks,
Tom Williams
70 W-31

------------------------------

From: Steven LaCrosse <lacrosse@frontiernet.net>
Date: Thu, 17 Apr 1997 02:58:34 -0300
Subject: Re: 442/Cutlass Parts For Sale

James & Joanne Chermack wrote:
>
> At 10:37 PM 4/13/97 -0300, you wrote:
> > Dear J&J,
> >  I am trying to find some one to trade to buy from, a 3:31 rearend for
> >my 69 442. I have a 3:73 now. Please advise. Thank you.
> >
>
> You must have a C rear end in the car. I don't know of anyone around here
> that wants a Ch*vy rear. I can't give the 3.73:1 posi I have away. I'm
> trying to trade it with a buddy of mine for a TO code 3.91 Olds right now.
> You can buy 3.31:1 gears for that rear brand new. That might be an
alternative. > > Jim Chermack


Jim, are you trying to find a 3:91? I may have one. Now that I think I
found out how to tell a Olds from the C word.   Can I say that on the
internet??  haha. Please advise. Steve

------------------------------

From: Dustin Cross <dcross@selway.umt.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:19:01 -0300
Subject: Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)

On Wed, 16 Apr 1997 JPADA@Orbital.COM wrote:

> The good Dr. Robert Barry wrote:
>
> ...If your car has *four* _round_ headlights and 400 or more cubic inches
> under the hood, you ARE driving a musclecar!
>

what is it considered if your only at 350 cubic inches?

------------------------------

From: "Blaines" <blaines@strata3d.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:24:00 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442

> From: Denney J Keys <Denney.J.Keys.1@gsfc.nasa.gov>
> I apologize up front...

Uh, me too ;)

> Heaven knows I DON'T want to restart the "what's 4-4-2 really stand for?"
> thread again, but it occurs to me that the "standard" transmission on the
> 4-4-2 has ALWAYS been listed as a 3-speed (granted it was a manual
> transmission) in all of the factory documentation that I have ever come
> across (WITH the exception of 1964 where it was touted specifically as
> 4-speed, 4-barrel, dual exhausts).

In the beginning, "442" must have meant something.  They had to derive the
name from something... some attribute of the car - or just out of thin air.
 Isn't that how most things are named?  It doesn't matter really, so long
as it catches the buyers attention.  But IMHO, after 1964, "442" was just a
badge.  It didn't have to *designate* any certain setup.  It did however
have a meaning.  And after the first introduction of the 442, everyone knew
what it was.  It meant, "hey look, pussy!  I demand respect!  I am
something to behold... something to be feared!"  It didn't nescessarily
mean "I have a 4-speed, a four barrel, and dual exhaust"... because we all
know that the buyer had the option to change those things if he so chose.
It's like the difference between a plain-jane Monte Carlo and a Monte Carlo
SS.  "SS" doesn't mean that it always had an exact set of options.  It does
however mean that it spat out more performance than the granny-mobile.
It's the same thing with "442".  It just means "I'm more impressive than a
plain Cutlass".  I mean, really, for all we know, "442" could have been
named after three guys:  two that wore glasses, and one who didn't.

Just my 2 cents...

- -Blaine
'72 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:25:07 -0300
Subject: Re: 68 442

At 02:19 PM 4/16/97 -0300, you wrote:
>I apologize up front...
>
>Heaven knows I DON'T want to restart the "what's 4-4-2 really stand for?"
>thread again, but it occurs to me that the "standard" transmission on the
>4-4-2 has ALWAYS been listed as a 3-speed (granted it was a manual
>transmission) in all of the factory documentation that I have ever come
>across (WITH the exception of 1964 where it was touted specifically as
>4-speed, 4-barrel, dual exhausts).
>
>~Maybe~ it should really be ex post facto renamed as the 4-3-2
(1-0-Blastoff!)
>
>Sorry, but it has been bugging me for a very long time. ;-)
>
>Denney

Denney, Denney, Denney,

Rest easy.  Yes, in 1964, when the 4-4-2 first appeared, the numbers
referred to four barrel carb, four-speed transmission, and dual exhaust.
But later it came to mean four barrel carb, 400-cubic inch engine, and dual
exhaust.  So yes, one could have a 4-4-2 with a three-speed or, I guess, an
automatic.

Of course, in vehicles of the 1980s, it came to mean four cylinders, four
wheels, two doors!



Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

From: r_mullen@Merck.Com (R Mullen)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:26:00 -0300
Subject: Re: Handling problem

Igor wrote:
> but the problem is at lower speeds (25-40 mph).  I just don't know what else
to look >at.

Igor,
Positive caster is usually the key to stopping wander, since the
positive caster makes the wheels self-centering.  It does make the
steering feel heavier at lower speeds though.  You do have a puzzler of
a problem though, since the wandering problem is usually more pronounced
at high speeds, which you say is not the case.  Do you know what the
caster setting is?  Also, your tire pressure is too high at 36 psi
(cold, I assume).  Try 28-30 (cold) and check your idler arm for wear.
Replacing this and my center link tightened up my car's handling
dramatically.  Also, did the repair job after the accident include a new
coil spring?  I should think that one new and one old coil would cause
some problems.  Are your front sway bar mounts in good shape?  I once
broke a bolt in one of the frame mounts for the front sway bar on my '69
Cutlass and the handling went to heck.

Scott Mullen

------------------------------

From: r_mullen@Merck.Com (R Mullen)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 15:32:00 -0300
Subject: Re:(2) 442/Cutlass parts for sale

Jim Chermack wrote:

>You must have a C rear end in the car. I don't know of anyone around here
>that wants a Ch*vy rear. I can't give the 3.73:1 posi I have away. I'm
>trying to trade it with a buddy of mine for a TO code 3.91 Olds right now.

Later, Jim Chermack also wrote:

>The following is a list of 64-72 Olds Cutlass/442 parts for sale.

>**** New stuff to list****
>70  12 Bolt Posi Ch*vy Rear 3.73:1 (Posi rebuilt)  $500.00

That explains why you can't "give" that axle away......
Scott Mullen

------------------------------

From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:01:13 -0300
Subject: Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)

Nick DiGiovanni wrote:
>
> At 03:12 AM 4/16/97 -0300, Joe Padavano wrote:
> >     Excellent!  I couldn't have said it better myself!  I tried to think
> >     up a factory 64-72 musclecar (as opposed to ponycar) that didn't have
> >     four headlights, and all I could come up with were some of the early
> >     Super Stock Chryslers.
>
> How 'bout '71-'72 Chevelles... they had/have only 2 round headlights ;').

POINT PROVEN!!!

- --
Kurt Heinrich  (mailto:old442@erols.com)
71 442         (see it at http://www.442.com/heinrich.html)

------------------------------

From: Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:08:13 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?

Just out of curiosity, is this Olds V6 or Buick V6 that we're talking
about here?  The Buick V6's were more common in the Olds bodies, and I
don't recall seeing many Olds V6's anywhere.

------------------------------

From: pteubel@safety1st.com (Peter Teubel)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:25:33 -0300
Subject: Re[2]: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?

     That I don't know.  Just said "Olds V6", but considering the source,
     they might just want to group it under GM.




______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Re: Olds V6 Oil
Delivery.....Comments? Author:  Charley Buehner <buehner@cis.nmclites.edu> at
imail Date:    4/16/97 4:08 PM




Just out of curiosity, is this Olds V6 or Buick V6 that we're talking
about here?  The Buick V6's were more common in the Olds bodies, and I
don't recall seeing many Olds V6's anywhere.






------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:50:07 -0300
Subject: Re: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?

Yep, that's the Buick V-6. Actually, the Chevy V-6's (2.8, 3.1, 3.4, 4.3),
and Ford V-6's (2.8; not sure about the 4.0) oil their cranks in pretty
much the same way. A minute or two warmup and granny driving for the first
5-10 minutes is a good idea.

The external line on the Buick is a Smokey Yunick trick. He also welds the
rear portion of the rear cylinders to the block - they sort of float at
that point.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu

Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com, http://www.en.com/users/thall, or
http://www.cybercity.hko.net/ulan_bator/gee/oldsfaq/oldsfaq3.htm

Get a copy for local viewing from:
ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ------------
>From the pump, the oil goes up to the rockers from one back of cylinders,
down to the lifters for that bank, then to the cam bearings, then to
the other bank's lifters, then up to the rockers for the other bank,
and then and only then down to the crank, through the crank to the
rods.  You can imagine how long it takes oil to get to the crank
and rods on start up or after a cornering interruption.  But wait!
There's more...

Chris's solution is to run an external line from the pump directly to this
gallery.  He hasn't tossed a motor since he started doing this.

------------------------------

From: pteubel@safety1st.com (Peter Teubel)
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:21:38 -0300
Subject: Re[2]: Olds V6 Oil Delivery.....Comments?

     Excellent!  Thanks for the "confirmation".


______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: Re: Olds V6 Oil
Delivery.....Comments? Author:  "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
at imail Date:    4/16/97 5:50 PM


Yep, that's the Buick V-6. Actually, the Chevy V-6's (2.8, 3.1, 3.4, 4.3),
and Ford V-6's (2.8; not sure about the 4.0) oil their cranks in pretty
much the same way. A minute or two warmup and granny driving for the first
5-10 minutes is a good idea.

The external line on the Buick is a Smokey Yunick trick. He also welds the
rear portion of the rear cylinders to the block - they sort of float at
that point.

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu

Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com, http://www.en.com/users/thall, or
http://www.cybercity.hko.net/ulan_bator/gee/oldsfaq/oldsfaq3.htm

Get a copy for local viewing from:
ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ------------
>From the pump, the oil goes up to the rockers from one back of cylinders,
down to the lifters for that bank, then to the cam bearings, then to
the other bank's lifters, then up to the rockers for the other bank,
and then and only then down to the crank, through the crank to the
rods.  You can imagine how long it takes oil to get to the crank
and rods on start up or after a cornering interruption.  But wait!
There's more...

Chris's solution is to run an external line from the pump directly to this
gallery.  He hasn't tossed a motor since he started doing this.



------------------------------

From: J2RKT@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:26:35 -0300
Subject: Re: [2] Handling Problem

       I haven't read the whole thread on this one, so excuse me if this has
already been offered.
       Check the front bearings and see if they are loose -- ive had two cars
come back from brake shops with the same wandering and rutting problem and it
was because the nit wits didn't tighten the bearings tight enough.

 hope that helps some

                                 J2RKT@aol.com

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:34:22 -0300
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Custon Cruiser V8 Diesel

OL>The 7.3 has problems with pin holes in the rear cylinders
OL>and is the worst engine on valve guides ever made. I love em.They make me a
OL>lot of money. If I had to make a living on 6.2 & 6.5 GM engines I would
OL>starve to death. Oh I don't make much on Olds V8's either those things
OL>sometimes seem to run forever.
OL>Walter

You mean theres actually something worse than a s.b. chevy on valve
guides. WOW!

Daren

O.C.A ª 023571

------------------------------

From: KarlAunan@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:43:49 -0300
Subject: Re: castle nut clip for spinde with speedo drive?

In a message dated way back on 97-04-12 08:55:14 EDT, Josh wrote:

>     Hi all, I am inneed of some help. on my '70 88 I just replaced the
>  spindle and rotor, and can't find out what kind of clip holds the castle
>  nut on, parts stores around here are no help, they still can't get over
the
>  fact that ppl drive cars that old, everyonr keeps telling me to find the
>  hole and put a cotter pin in it but there isn't one because of where the
>  spedometer drive goes in, any help would be much appreciated,
>
>  --
>  __/////////\  Budgreen, ea154@cleveland.freenet.edu  /\\\\\\\\\__

>
>    \\\\\\\\\/      Josh......                         \/////////
>  =============================================================

Wiz, according to my service manual, all 1965 models ran the speedometer
cable to the front wheel. So that makes years 1965-68.

Josh,
I can't answer your question immediately, but as my speedo just went dead (in
the middle of Lake Shore Drive!) I should have an answer for you this weekend
if the temperature does not drop again....

Karl Aune
1965 Dynamic 88    87K miles and holding.....
Chicago, IL

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:51:56 -0300
Subject: Re: GM 3.4L V-6s

I'm not saying their junk, just I heard differently about those differences
from GM literature. Correct me if I am wrong.

Isn't this just the original 3.1 with sequential port fuel injection and
roller rockers, instead of multi-port injection and stamped steel rockers?

The power output of the "old" 3.4 in the Cutlass was around 210hp. I guess it
was detuned for applications like minivans (like 160hp). Did the "new" 3.4
also get SFI and roller rockers?

I seem to recall that a couple of years ago all the GM V-6's were upped in
horsepower through SFI and roller rockers. What were the other upgrades that
went into these engines used in new Olds'?

David Brown   Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu

Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com, http://www.en.com/users/thall, or
http://www.cybercity.hko.net/ulan_bator/gee/oldsfaq/oldsfaq3.htm

Get a copy for local viewing from:
ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

- ------------
Chevrolet
introduced a new 3.1L V-6 in 1994 (called the 3100 V-6) which is completely
different than the old 3.1L. It is vastly improved and has more horsepower
(160). Production on the old 3.1L V-6 ended at the end of 1994 model year
(except in Mexico).  The new 3100 V-6 is used on a variety of GM vehicles
including N-car & W-car.

     The third version of the 3.4L is the one used only in the new GM
minivans (Venture, Trans Sport, Sillouhette).  This engine is not at all
related to the old 3.4L V-6.  This engine is a larger displacement of the
new Chevy 3100 V-6.  It has many technological improvements over the old
3.1/3.4L V-6.  Also increased is the power output (185 HP).

Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
Transmission Division (4T60/65-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

'97 Chevy Blazer LT 4x4 4.3L V6    '96 DCM Impala SS 5.7L V8
'87 Olds Cutlass 442 307 V8        '61 GMC 1500 Fleetside 305 V6

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:57:33 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

On Wed, 16 Apr 1997, Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada) wrote:
> Do you know what the option number is for the Map light?  I didn't
> see any reference to it in the 442 options order sheet.

Now, ummmm, lessee... I'm not sure. My literature doesn't show that light
as a separate option. In fact, it doesn't talk about it specifically at
all, though I know they exist because I've seen them. It must have been
included in one of two groups:

Lamps, Instrument Panel Courtesy (U29) -- the one you mentioned ;-)
or
Convenience Lamps and Mirror (Y60)

I can't find any explanation of exactly what either of these included.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 16:56:44 -0300
Subject: [2] Handling Problem

OL>When I had the shocks and tires installed, the front end was checked,
OL>wheels were alligned and they said everything was okay.  This was done
OL>aproximatley 2500km ago.  Right away, I noticed the problem. They keep
OL>insisting that everything is fine.  Yes I am using stock rims that had
OL>215/75/15s on them befoure.  Yes, I belive the car was in a front-end
OL>accident with the previous owner, judging from paint residual in the right
OL>part of the engine compartment.  I told them this at the shop, they
OL>inspected the car and said it was repaired properly and it is not causing
OL>any problems.  The left-upper ball-joint is new, while others are still
OL>fine (so they said).  My next try was the brakes.  It pulled to the right
OL>along with this handling problem, so I replaced the right caliper and
OL>rotor.   I had the other rotor machined and put new pads on.  This hepled,
OL>but the car still wonders.  My tires are inflated to the max. pressure
OL>stated on the tires (36 psi).  It is really not that bad at speeds of 55mph
OL>and above.  If the road is slanted a lot, then it pulls to that side (heavy
OL>car combined with wide tires, this is to be expected), but the problem is
OL>at lower speeds (25-40 mph).  I just don't know what else to look at.

OL>Igor Todorovic
OL>'81 Delta 88 307 4-dr
OL>'95 Chrysler Intrepid 3.3

Rear control arm bushings?

Daren

O.C.A. ª023571

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:08:38 -0300
Subject: Just What Every Garage Needs

Last night I made the mistake of visiting my buddy and ace mechanic Don
Hirtle at his palatial garage. I always hate going to his place because
he always has some new toy. Last night was no exception.

He somehow found and acquired a 1959 model Sun distributor machine, mint,
with all the manuals and in perfect working order. It looks brand-new in
fact. He had to demonstrate it for me, and it was quite impressive. All
sorts of dials, knobs and gizmos on it. Looks something like a small
jukebox. I suppose it's only really useful for points distributors, but
you can analyze the dwell at various rpms, check wear on the cam, test the
vac advance with the built-in vacuum pump, and play with the mechanical
advance and see what the results are. When the thing is spinning at
1000+rpm it makes quite an impressive noise! Though you better hope those
mechanical advance weights are well-attached... :)

Of course, he has also got all of the shims, special Delco-Remy
distributor grease, etc., that one needs to become an expert repairer of
the beasts, so I've made an appointment with Dr. Distributor for the near
future to check out my Olds ASAP...

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:05:52 -0300
Subject: Re: Tranny Went Kablooie!

OL>At 01:00 PM 4/15/97 -0300, you wrote:
OL>>At 06:06 PM 4/14/97 -0300, you wrote:
OL>>>At 12:52 PM 4/14/97 -0300, you wrote:
OL>>>>Hey everyone,
OL>>>>
OL>>>>     Well, this past Sunday my transmission (in my '87 Cutlass,200-4R)
OL>>>>decided it had enough.

OL>>>
OL>>>P.S.  When the TH200 went in my '84 Delta, a rebuilder traded me even; my
OL>>>core TH200 for a TH350.  Why I don't know, but that tranny now has 90,000
OL>>>miles on it, 1/2 of which behind a mild 455 and it still is operating
fine OL>>> The Wiz OL>>> OL>>> How badly will this affect my gas mileage? What
about the computer and th OL>>lock-up torque converter? Can I use a lock-up
torque converter with TH-350? OL>>If not will this affect my computer? The
reason I ask this is because I hav OL>>to drive to college everyday and I need
a good, reliable car. This is my OL>>problem, I want performance and
reliability too. Is that possible? Thanks. OL>> OL>>Andy Geeting OL>>'87
Cutlass Supreme OL>>'88 Cutlass Supreme Classic Brougham OL>>'74 Delta 88
convertible OL>>'78 Caprice wagon OL>>'36 Plymouth coupe OL>> OL>> OL>> OL>Gas
milage should not change.  Don't know about the lock up torque OL>converter.
I would think that it would not be noticed by the computer.  The OL>beauty of
installing a TH350 in the place of a TH200 is that it is a bolt OL>and go
proposition, and TH350s are very common.

OL>The Wiz


TH 200-4r is an overdrive tranny the TH350 is not. There WILL be a 3-5
decrease in gas mileage.

Your slipping Wiz.

Daren

O.C.A. ª023571

------------------------------

From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@aisf.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:30:16 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

Greg Beaulieu wrote:
>
> Now, ummmm, lessee... I'm not sure. My literature doesn't show that light
> as a separate option. In fact, it doesn't talk about it specifically at
> all, though I know they exist because I've seen them. It must have been
> included in one of two groups:
>
> Lamps, Instrument Panel Courtesy (U29) -- the one you mentioned ;-)
> or
> Convenience Lamps and Mirror (Y60)
>
> I can't find any explanation of exactly what either of these included.

If anyone can help here with what came with the above two options, let
me
know.

Thanks in advance.

P.S.  Joe Padavano can you tackle this one?

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:38:52 -0300
Subject: Re: GM 3.4L V-6s

OL>Chevrolet
OL>introduced a new 3.1L V-6 in 1994 (called the 3100 V-6) which is completely
OL>different than the old 3.1L. It is vastly improved and has more horsepower
OL>(160). Production on the old 3.1L V-6 ended at the end of 1994 model year
OL>(except in Mexico).  The new 3100 V-6 is used on a variety of GM vehicles
OL>including N-car & W-car.


OL>Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
OL>Transmission Division (4T60/65-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
OL>The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
OL>statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

OL>'97 Chevy Blazer LT 4x4 4.3L V6    '96 DCM Impala SS 5.7L V8
OL>'87 Olds Cutlass 442 307 V8        '61 GMC 1500 Fleetside 305 V6

My wife has a '93 Grand am the throttle body has 3100 on it. She baught
it late in the year ('94s were out). Could this be the new vesion? I
thought it was a buick motor because it's got the oil filter in the same
place as a buick. A REAL pain to change!

Daren

O.C.A. ª023571
daren@qconline.com

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 17:43:12 -0300
Subject: Re: Power Valve Holley 750

OL>part-throttle conditions (where most street driving *should* be done.. ;).

OL>_______________________________________________________
OL>Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
OL>Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

Part throttle whats that?

Daren

O.C.A ª023571
daren@qconline.com

------------------------------

From: Christian Fair <cfair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:50:03 -0300
Subject: Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine

Been here, done this. What happen in my case is the motor ran very badly
and loudly at idle, but it did run. Once you got it above maybe 2000 revs
it was fine, but you can hide just about any mistake at that engine speed.

After about 2 weeks, I took it back to the builder who looked into it and
put in the right cam. I have a 66 425 block. Which was it the 39 degree
or 45 degree? I can't remember.

cf


>At 03:39 AM 4/15/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>Is there anyone out there that can tell me what the performance
>>characteristics would be by installing a 350R cam in a 330 ?
>>Considering the 45deg lifter angle of the 330 compared to 39deg
>>lifter angle of 350, how much would this affect lift, duration
>>timing, etc.  I installed one (some years ago) before knowing
>
>Hmm, that'd be interesting, as one cylinder bank would have its camshaft
>timing advanced by 6', while the other would be retarded by 6' (assuming the
>timing-chain set would install the camshaft straight-up in relation to a 39'
>engine; if you degreed the cam according to the ª1 lobe, however, the odd
>bank would be installed straight up, but the even bank would be 12'
>retarded!). The reason it's not 3' advanced and retarded (totaling the 6'
>difference in the cam bank angles) is because the camshaft degrees are
>measured at the crank, which is double the actual camshaft degrees (hence,
>the 328' W-30 cam did not have a lifter lobe that was above the base circle
>for almost the entire lobe, but rather only for 164' of the cam's
circumfrence > >>about the different cam bank angle.  The engine runs strong
but >>seems sluggish, is the anyway to compensate through timing, etc >>to get
proper performance. Or should I just "bite the bullet" >>pull the cam and put
in a new Mondello special ?!?!?! HELP > >It's not going to run right with your
current cam, no matter what you do. >Indexing it to one bank would only make
the other bank worse. Spring the >$120 for a new cam, and the $40 for the new
lifters; you'll be glad you did.

------------------------------

From: Kabootski@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:58:29 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

I have such a map light on my '68 ragtop.  It is wired into the door jams,
but it does not go on when the interior light swich is activated; only the
rear courtesey lamps do.  With the doors closed, the map light only goes on
by the map light switch, which also activates the front courtesey lamps.  My
''70 Cutlass convertible is the same way.  I am parting the '68 out, if
anyone wants the lamp.  It does has a burn mark on the lens, however.

Duane Ambroz
1970 Cutlass Supreme convertible
1989 Century T-type

------------------------------

From: "Tom Lentz" <tlentz@teknon.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 11:38:01 -0300
Subject: Re: [2] Handling Problem

     Could be.  I think the loose bearing theory is a good candidate too.
     Do you have a lot of slop in the steering box?  That is exceptionaly
     easy to fix, just loosen the nut on top (the one with the allen screw
     in the middle of it), tighten the allen screw _a_little_bit_ and then
     tighten the nut back down.  Be careful, this is very easy to
     over-tighten.  Fortunately, it's easy to re-adjust if you get it too
     tight.  Also, if it's too tight you can damage the gears in the
     steering box.  Too loose and you have slop in the steering.

     Tom Lentz
     tlentz@teknon.com

______________________________ Reply Separator
_________________________________ Subject: [2] Handling Problem Author:
oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca at INTERNET Date:    4/16/97 2:22 PM

OL>at lower speeds (25-40 mph).  I just don't know what else to look at.

Rear control arm bushings?


------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:09:28 -0300
Subject: 3.something rearend

OL>I'm scheduled to be done exams and on to cars soon, and I've got a
OL>consistent response from everybody about lower-geared rearends.  So, in my
OL>_75 Cutlass Supreme_, which curently has a low-2's rearend, I'm looking
OL>for a 3.something rearend.

OL>1)  What will/won't work?
OL>2)  Is this the 'magic power booster' I've been told?
OL>3)  Can anyone get me one? (Shipping should be easy for that small a
part(s)

OL>.....Shameless but short self-promo sig file.....
OL>Virtual Junkyard of olds's: Current count : 4 vehicles
OL>http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~aksomi/            mailto:aksomi@cs.uregina.ca
OL>.....End of self-promo                      .....

What do you want? Good street performance or 1/8 or1/4 mile performance?
If you want good street performance gear it so you keep the rpm's in the
optimum power range of your motor at your typical cruise mph. If you
want straight line performance gear it so that the motor is at the top
of the power band at the end of the track. You also want to make sure
that your tires can handle the extra torque that a steeper gear will
create at the tires.

Here's a couple formulas

To figure rpm-        168 * gear ratio * mph / tire radius
To figure mph-        tire radius / 168 * rpm / gear ratio
To figure gear ratio-        tire radius * rpm / 168 / mph
To figure tire radius-       168 * mph * gear ratio / rpm

These are out of an Edelbrock catalog. It's got more use full formulas
besides these and best of all it's FREE!

Daren

O.C.A. ª023571
daren@qconline.com

------------------------------

From: <Sherry_Soball@Douglas.BC.CA>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:15:23 -0300
Subject: To:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

subscribe oldsmobile
- --

------------------------------

From: Daren@qconline.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 18:33:14 -0300
Subject: Re: [2] Handling Problem

OL>     Do you have a lot of slop in the steering box?  That is exceptionaly
OL>     easy to fix, just loosen the nut on top (the one with the allen screw
OL>     in the middle of it), tighten the allen screw _a_little_bit_ and then
OL>     tighten the nut back down.  Be careful, this is very easy to
OL>     over-tighten.  Fortunately, it's easy to re-adjust if you get it too
OL>     tight.  Also, if it's too tight you can damage the gears in the
OL>     steering box.  Too loose and you have slop in the steering.
OL>
OL>     Tom Lentz
OL>     tlentz@teknon.com

What's the correct way to adjust the box? When I painted the box on my
'65 Dynamic 88 I turned this not knowing what it did. Now I need to get
it back to the correct position. Before I start driving it again.

Daren

O.C.A. ª023571
daren@qconline.com

------------------------------

From: Kabootski@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:35:43 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

Y60 was the trunk, mirror, hood lamp.

Duane Ambroz
1970 Cutlass Supreme convertible
1989 Century T-type

------------------------------

From: Kabootski@aol.com
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 19:37:38 -0300
Subject: Re: '68 Courtesy/Map Lights (was:Re: 1971 cutlass for parts)

Y60 was the trunk, mirror, hood lamp.

Duane Ambroz
1970 Cutlass Supreme convertible
1989 Century T-type

------------------------------

From: JFOWLER@capecod.net
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 21:49:55 -0300
Subject: ª's

I was wondering if anybody could decipher these codes for me?  They are
located on the firewall/cowl area.  THANKS!

ST69  33667LAN416187
TR  934        75B
    06B

------------------------------

From: hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:13:37 -0300
Subject: Re: ª's

JFOWLER@capecod.net wrote:
>
> I was wondering if anybody could decipher these codes for me?  They are
> located on the firewall/cowl area.  THANKS!
>
> ST69  33667LAN416187
> TR  934        75B
>     06B
My guess from looking at it, its a 69  made in Lansing MI The 416187 car
made that year. TR is the trim code, 06B is paint code the first five
are body style, engine and something else, I'll write later I can't find
my book.

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:31:38 -0300
Subject: Re: "Real" Musclecars (was: Cutlass 442 ???)

At 03:12 AM 4/16/97 -0300, JPADA@Orbital.COM wrote:
>The good Dr. Robert Barry wrote:
>
>...If your car has *four* _round_ headlights and 400 or more cubic inches
>under the hood, you ARE driving a musclecar!
>
>     Excellent!  I couldn't have said it better myself!  I tried to think
>     up a factory 64-72 musclecar (as opposed to ponycar) that didn't have
>     four headlights, and all I could come up with were some of the early
>     Super Stock Chryslers.

1969 ZL1 Camaro, wouldn't this classify as a muscle car as opposed to the
rest of the Camaro's (Z/28's, RS/SS) being ponycars. All aluminum 427 was a
beast.  I am glad this topic was brought up as I never thought of all those
cars having 4 headlights. Hmmmm, learn something new everyday:-)
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Jason Labay (z28cfi@gwis.com)  Akron, Ohio  F-body list since 5/95
93 Camaro Z/28: Patriot Red, A4, GU5 (3.23), PEG2
89 Mustang GT: Blue, 5.0, M5, many mods...12.78@111mph
80 Oldsmobile 4-4-2 W-30:White/Gold, 5.7L, A3, showcar, 1 of 346
75 Hurst/Olds W-25: White, 5.7L, A3,project car, 1 of 1293

------------------------------

From: "Robert J. Barry" <rbarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:33:03 -0300
Subject: Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine

At 05:50 PM 4/16/97 -0400, you wrote:
>I have a 66 425 block. Which was it the 39 degree
>or 45 degree? I can't remember.

Well, it depends:

The Toro block was 39', but with the large lifters.
All other blocks (except perhaps the Starfire) were 45', but with the small
lifters.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <ACG@dlogics.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:39:18 -0300
Subject: NOS Rear Window Defoggers for Omega/88/98/Toronado

Okay, I finally rummaged through my crawlspace downstairs and got
the boxes out. NOTE: All are fan-forced defoggers, little blower
motors and duct kits; they are _not_ the grid-lines-on-a-back-window
design. Here's what I found:

Five dealer-install defogger kits to fit mid-'70's Delta 88, 98
and Toronado series. Actual model year applicability is a bit
unclear. Instruction sheet says "Initial run approved 1/20/75"
so it could be either '75 or '76 at minimum. Boxes labeled Group
9.778, Part No. 982024.

Each kit is for complete installation, with motor assembly,
ducting, vents (black color), complete wiring harness, switch,
control panel appliques, etc. Since apparently the Toro shared
a little control panel with the Power Antenna switch, you get
a replacement Power Antenna control applique as well, plus a
blank filler if your car did _not_ have a Power Antenna. Neat!

Instruction sheet is cute, too: the boilerplate text around the
outside edge was so out of date that the company address reads
"Lansing 21, Michigan" even though ZIP codes had been around for
about twelve years at that point. Instructions are excruciatingly
detailed so you have no excuse for not installing it right.

Finally, I have one example of the same thing for an Olds Omega
(or Nova/Apollo/Ventura) hatchback. Group 9.778, Part No. 994793.
Equally complete, kind of an ingenious design which snuggles the
whole fan/motor assembly into the left side trim panel over the
left rear wheel in the tailgate area, and it blows air up at the
rear window from a small square outlet at the side. Design dated
5/3/74, "Initial run approved 8/5/74".

When you look at this stuff, especially the amount of effort that
went into just producing the instruction sheet, you get a sense
that even though it was a cheesy option that no one would get that
interested in, they took it seriously and put a lot of engineering
effort into it. I have no idea what these things are worth (okay,
I do ;-) but will accept any reasonable offers.

Don't all jump at once.  :-)

Andrew C. Green            (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606         Fax: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Chris Fair <ChrisFair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:52:38 -0300
Subject: Re: 39' cam in a 45' engine

This was a 425 Super Rocket in a 98, not the Toro, not the Starfire, the
next one down: 10.25:1 compression, Qjet, single exhaust (now factory dual),
y'know a 98 motor - smooth torquey and never gets above 3000 RPM

cf

------------------------------

From: Dan Lacey <lacey@dsea.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 21:58:48 -0300
Subject: Re: [2] Handling Problem

[SNIP]

>OL>'95 Chrysler Intrepid 3.3
>
>Rear control arm bushings?
>
>Daren
>
>O.C.A. ª023571

I'll go with this one. When I replaced my rear bushings, the front end
practically quit wandering...


*************************************************************************
* THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY  *       Dan Lacey ( lacey@dsea.com )        *
*                           *       Dainippon Screen Eng. of America    *
* LEFT BLANK                *       3700 W. Segerstrom Ave.             *
*                           *       Santa Ana, CA. 92704                *
*************************************************************************

------------------------------

From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:46:53 -0300
Subject: Re: Synthetic Motor Oil Again

At 03:58 AM 4/16/97 -0300, C.R.F. wrote:

>I don't quite understand all the data that has been posted about much lower
>engine operating temps when using it.  Why don't these engines run at the
>t'stat temp, instead of lower.  Unless of course they are attempting to say
>that they get t'stat op temps with synthetic and raised temps with
>conventional oil.  The logic of this, either way, is fleeting for me.  And I
>would appreciate a substantial post explaing the concepts, even if I don't
>agree.

When I switched to Mobil 1 5w-30 in my 93 LT-1 I didn't notice any drop in
operating temps, same as always. I will not use it in my 80 442 with 92,800
miles because I am worried of leaks. It already leaks oil at a very slow
rate, hardly noticable. I figure that if I put synthetic in the leak would
become much more noticable. My 442 will only see 250 to 750 miles a year so
I can't justify the cost for such little use. Sure the synthetic would help
due to the fact that the car sets long periods of time before starts, but I
figure at 92,800 it already has quite a bit of engine wear internally anyway
and I am looking to rebuild it at the 100,000 mark.
- - - - - - - - - - - -
Jason Labay (z28cfi@gwis.com)  Akron, Ohio  F-body list since 5/95
93 Camaro Z/28: Patriot Red, A4, GU5 (3.23), PEG2
89 Mustang GT: Blue, 5.0, M5, many mods...12.78@111mph
80 Oldsmobile 4-4-2 W-30:White/Gold, 5.7L, A3, showcar, 1 of 346
75 Hurst/Olds W-25: White, 5.7L, A3,project car, 1 of 1293

------------------------------

From: hanthorn <hanthorn@inwave.com>
Date: Wed, 16 Apr 1997 20:57:41 -0300
Subject: RE: ZL-1.

Jason Labay wrote:
>
> At 03:12 AM 4/16/97 -0300, JPADA@Orbital.COM wrote:
> >The good Dr. Robert Barry wrote:
> >
> >...If your car has *four* _round_ headlights and 400 or more cubic inches
> >under the hood, you ARE driving a musclecar!
> >
> >     Excellent!  I couldn't have said it better myself!  I tried to think
> >     up a factory 64-72 musclecar (as opposed to ponycar) that didn't have
> >     four headlights, and all I could come up with were some of the early
> >     Super Stock Chryslers.
>
> 1969 ZL1 Camaro, wouldn't this classify as a muscle car as opposed to the
> rest of the Camaro's (Z/28's, RS/SS) being ponycars. All aluminum 427 was a
> beast.  I am glad this topic was brought up as I never thought of all those
> cars having 4 headlights. Hmmmm, learn something new everyday:-)
> - - - - - - - - - - -
> Jason Labay (z28cfi@gwis.com)  Akron, Ohio  F-body list since 5/95
> 93 Camaro Z/28: Patriot Red, A4, GU5 (3.23), PEG2
> 89 Mustang GT: Blue, 5.0, M5, many mods...12.78@111mph
> 80 Oldsmobile 4-4-2 W-30:White/Gold, 5.7L, A3, showcar, 1 of 346
> 75 Hurst/Olds W-25: White, 5.7L, A3,project car, 1 of 1293


68 Hurst Olds was faster than the ZL-1 , Think of that!! a stipped down
camaro, Aluminum engine and only half a frame?? And the Olds still
kicked its ass........Thats Oldsmobile for ya!!!

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª615
********************************
