To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #714


oldsmobile-digest         Wednesday, 11 June 1997      Volume 01 : Number 714

Re: Mondello Olds Nats
Dixie Oldsmobile OCA Chapter
Re: Master Cylinders - disc vs drum
Re: Remove me from this list
Re: Update on Freon-12 Replacements
Re: Radio Troubles
Re: Back to Holley Jetting
Service manual needeed
Re: Esko's Niney and Merry Salvaging.
Re: 3 to 4 row radiator swap
Re: Mondello Olds Nats
Re: Yet another Body Plate request
Re: Remove me from this list
Olds for sale
Re: 66 Cutlass Help ( Fuel Tank & Power Steering Blues)
Re: Radio Troubles
Date:Tue, 10 Jun 1997 20:57:57 -0300
Rear bumper interchangability
Re: Rear bumper interchangability
Trans coolers
Battery
Re: Remove me from this list
Re: Yet another Body Plate request
Re: Mondello Olds Nats
Found a '69 442 for sale
August Oldsmobile Meeting
Re: Trans coolers
Re: Esko's Niney and Merry Salvaging.
Read this beauty about a 442......
Re: Mondello Olds Nats
Mondello Olds Nats ª2
Re: Found a '69 442 for sale
Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations
Re: Johnny Lightnings
Found a '69 442 for sale
re:  smog check II
73 and up parts?
Re: Remove me from this list
Re: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations
Re: Radio Troubles
Re: smog check II
Re: Rear bumper interchangability
Re: Master Cylinders - disc vs drum
Re:  Source for '70 442/sx dual exhaust? Req. for recommendations
Re: 66 Cutlass Help ( Fuel Tank & Power Steering Blues)
RE: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations
Re: Remove me from this list
RE: Found a '69 442 for sale
Re: August Oldsmobile Meeting
Re: Found a '69 442 for sale

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: CRuper1@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 15:06:59 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello Olds Nats

In a message dated 97-06-10 13:58:17 EDT, you write:

<< Anybody been to the Olds Nats at Norwalk?  I've never been and was
thinking
 of taking my boy and making a weekend of it.  Not racing of course, just
 hanging out, watching the cars, enjoying some food, doing the road trip
 thing.  Looks like about a 6 hour drive from the Wash DC area, which is
 manageable.  Any hotel suggestions?  Any other sites to see
 around northern Ohio?

 Todd Morris >>

When is this?  I thought I remember talk about it happening sometime soon
(could have happened by now, I dunno).

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

From: Patrick Flowers <patri63@ibm.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 15:25:17 -0300
Subject: Dixie Oldsmobile OCA Chapter

Anyone on the list a member of the Dixie Chapter?  You can reply by
direct email to preserve list bandwidth.
- --
Patrick Flowers    Mailto:patri63@ibm.net

------------------------------

From: padavano.joe@Orbital.COM
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 16:22:43 -0300
Subject: Re: Master Cylinders - disc vs drum

Chris Smetana asked:

I have a question about master cylinders.....Is there a difference between
non power drum and non power disc disc master cylinders as they relate to a
69 Olds Cutlass?  Or any other Olds out of curiosity?

     There is no difference between power and non-power master cylinders.
     There _is_ a difference between drum and disc master cylinders!!

     The drum master cylinder is divided into two reservoir compartments
     (for front and rear brake circuits); each reservoir is the same size.
     The disc master cylinder is also divided into two compartments,
     however they are different sizes.  The reservoir for the disc circuit
     is much larger than that for the drums.  The reason for this is
     different way that drum and disc brakes adjust for pad/shoe wear.

     Drum brakes incorporate a self-adjuster mechanism which mechanically
     makes up for wear in the brake shoes.  This self-adjuster is a screw
     mechanism which is positioned between the lower ends of the shoes and
     expands outward (like a turnbuckle) as the shoes wear to maintain the
     proper distance from the shoe to the drum.

     Disc brakes typically position the caliper piston(s) directly behind
     the pad(s).  As the pads wear, the piston must extend further out from
     the bore in the caliper, resulting in a larger volume behind the
     piston.  This volume must be filled with brake fluid drawn from the
     master cylinder to prevent the inclusion of air bubbles in the system.
     This is why the fluid level in the master cylinder of a disc brake
     system will drop as the pads wear, even though the system is not
     leaking.  Obviously, this additional fluid needed to backfill behind
     the piston requires a larger reservoir on the disc side of the master
     cylinder.

     While a drum master cylinder may work (and I would be concerned about
     differences in piston diameter), the fluid level would need to be
     checked frequently to avoid depleting all the fluid in the normal
     course of driving.  Another way to think about it is that GM is always
     looking for ways to cut costs.  If a single master cylinder design
     would have worked for both discs and drums, they would have taken
     advantage of the cost savings of only having to design and inventory
     one type.  They still chose to have two different designs.

As a side note, when I converted my Skylark from power front drums to power
front discs, I was told by Midas, actually a guy who worked there, there
was no difference in the master cylinders.

     In my experience, Midas is one of the worst places at which to have
     brake work performed.  Based on observations in California and now in
     Virginia, I have repeatedly seen them do scary things (such as
     squeezing the hose to a caliper with a vice grip pliers to avoid
     losing fluid while honing the caliper!) as well as unscrupulously
     overcharge unsuspecting customers (in one case, a friend was charged,
     as a part of a complete brake job, for brand new rotors and drums
     _in_addition_to_being_charged_for_turning_the_rotors_and_drums_!!).

I am now led to believe otherwise as I have seen different master cylinders
for sale for disc and drum applications.

     That is correct.

Thanks for any insight you can provide.
     Hope this helps.

     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com

     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     79 W-30





------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 16:31:46 -0300
Subject: Re: Remove me from this list

>I am asking that my e-mail address be removed from this list IMMEDIATELY

Posting a graphic to the list is one way.

>I will not tolerate this junk cluttering up my harddrive any longer.

"It's interfering with my Teri Hatcher jpgs..."

>If you have not taken any action by the next 24 hours I will be contacting
>my lawyer to see what kind of legal action can be taken against you,

"...since I personally have no clue..."

>so it would be in your best interests to do so.

"...before I make a fool of myself."

Seriously, we really should consider putting new signups on the digest
only, then letting them do their own upgrade to real-time distribution
from there. That way they'll have a clear idea on what sort of feed
they're signing up for.


Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 17:30:47 -0300
Subject: Re: Update on Freon-12 Replacements

I don't think this is right. I've heard mixing R-12 and R-134a, even with a
properly evacuated system, produces a solid. Ouch!! From what I've read
(Auto textbooks, etc), the refrigerants and lubricating oils are
incompatible.

Do some research, investigate the product and company before committing
your dollars.

David Brown       Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com  OR  http://www.en.com/users/thall

Get the zip file for local viewing from:
          ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
- ------------

What he says below is correct.  You can not legally mix the two.  However,
by removing the old Freon, you can legally add the new substitute.

I ran into an auto body teacher who recently sponsored a Snap On seminar on
air conditioning and the new R-134.  I asked him about the new substitutes
for the old Freon.  He was told that the new R-134 worked fine in the old
systems.  He was also told to stay away from the substitutes.  When it
first came out, eveyone thought it would be very expensive to retrofit with
new hoses, etc.  What they have found is that the only requirement,
generally, is to add new O rings for the hoses.  If a hose has to be
replaced, it would leak with the new or old refrigerant.  Some oil may have
to be replaced also (I am not an air conditioning expert, but this is what
I was told).  The upside is that they find it only takes about 80-85% of
the new R-134 to run the old systems.  The cost difference between Freon
and the new R-134 is $50 vs. $15 per pound I am told.  So if you have to
get your system redone, it will probably pay to change it over.  The only
problem mau be to find a good shop to do it, but that is no different that
getting any car repaired.  It might pay to go to a shop specializing in air
conditioning repairs.

Has anyone had any experiences converting over to the new refrigerants?

lewman@mindpulse.com

------------------------------

From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 16:42:46 -0300
Subject: Re: Radio Troubles

>My '89 Delta 88 has an irritating problem with the radio volume.  The
>radio is the factory digital AM/FM/Cassette.  The volume control is a
>rocker switch.  While driving, the radio volume will suddenly go
>inaudible. [...] Next step is to
>open the case and look for bad solder joints.

>From what a Delco repairman told me once, you may well find them. Look
especially closely at edge connectors where one board is connected to
another; I'm told those are the usual failure points. You can re-melt
the solder connections with a pinpoint soldering iron.

>I'm tempted to replace it
>with an aftermarket unit, but the face of the factory radio is huge and
>I don't like the looks of the filler plates.

There are a couple aftermarket stereos with especially large faceplates
made specifically for this big GM cutout. I forget the brand(s) offhand
but saw them listed in the Crutchfield catalog, FWIW.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

From: Christian Fair <cfair@fairisaac.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 00:55:20 -0300
Subject: Re: Back to Holley Jetting

Karl,
You're shooting for precisely the setup I have on my 66 98. The metering
block is the piece sandwiched between the bowl and the main body of the
carb. With the
3310, you get one on the primary side, but the secondary side has a metering
_plate_ which fits inside the bowl, instead of a metering block like the
primary (i.e. front) side. Holley makes a kit to swap these bits and you can
then easily tune the secondary with jets just like the primary.

Some carb rebuild basics
1) don't reuse old gaskets
2) spray gaskets with WD-40 before you put 'em on, then they won't stick when
you taken 'em off again during tuning later.
3) stock up on gaskets
4) beware gas leaking on the intake manifold, not good. Be sure to tighten
(snug, not torqued) the four looong screws that hold the bowl to the metering
block to the body of the carb. Don't miss gaskets on these screws, you will
have leaks then.

The secondary springs which came in my tuning kit had colors even the color
blind like me could see. I think the out of the box spring was bare metal,
though others may know better.

>Sorry to dredge up old stuff.
>
>I am still (was off at A&B doing other stuff) reconstructing my 650cfm vac.
>Sec. Holley, and I have a question or three.
>
>What is a metering block? I think I know what you mean by metering valve
>(carb has been in pieces on my coffee (read as Pepsi) table for two weeks,
>but would appreciate an adequate description of metering valve just to be
>certain.
>
>I know what is meant by the vacuum secondary spring, but how do I tell which
>one (or as you have described, color) mine is? Should I assume it is the out
>of the box spring?
>
>It is my intention to rebuild it completely, including replacing the float
>springs, as I cannot determine how old it is. I live relatively near an
>authorized Holley dealer, would any one need anything that may be difficult
>to get through other sources?

Be sure to replace the needle and seat assemblies too, if these leak gas
they'll pump 7 PSI of gas right into your crankcase. Not good, this
happened to me once.
Car ran like sh*t going home, mechanic figured it out, drained the 'case
and I was back in bizness.

Oh, one more thing, these are great for power, but expect to visit your
petroleum retailer more often than before.

More queestions? Ask
cf
>
>
>  Karl Aune
>  1965 Dynamic 88
>  Chicago, IL
>  Member, OCA
>
>  http://members.aol.com/KarlAunan/index.html
>
>Erstwhile Grab for the Ring?

------------------------------

From: "box 29560" <bemi@megabaud.fi>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 16:58:00 -0300
Subject: Service manual needeed

Hi all folks,

My friend asked if I could inquire a service manual for his -63 98 series
Oldsmobile. He has also problem with the heater. It only gives hot air so
it's unconfortable to cruise in hot car. Please reply to my e-mail address
bemi@megabaud.fi.

Thanks,

- -mikko-

------------------------------

From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 18:48:21 -0300
Subject: Re: Esko's Niney and Merry Salvaging.

Forgot the notepad today . . . maybe have time tomorrow to transcribe.

As a summary, there was a lot of older stuff there. Like the '61-'64
fullsize. About 4 394's. The place is woodsy, so you never know what is
hidden in some spots. There's even a mossy trunk mat on the one 98! And
don't forget the sprigs of mint!

Saw a nice<?> 4x10 speaker. Both Toro's door's were good on the bottom.

Two Vistas with perfect Vista glass! A number of '68 - '73 full size.

Met Chris Ruper's wife Angie and son and daughter. The rain dried
eventually, over pizza and beer (yum).

David Brown       Mailto:dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com  OR  http://www.en.com/users/thall

Get the zip file for local viewing from:
          ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

From: Dan Lacey <lacey@dsea.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:08:44 -0300
Subject: Re: 3 to 4 row radiator swap

>Hi Everyone...
>

[SNIP]

>
>Second ques...I am also installing a fairly large tranny cooler (I
>figure now is the time to do it) the car is equipped with a TH350 and
>the stock 12" converter (from a '69) with a shift kit...I am going to be
>installing in the near future a built TH 400 with a 10" converter and I
>was wondering should I run the external cooler by itself or tie it into
>the factory cooler in the radiator??? The car is mainly street/strip and
>only gets driven in the spring/summer (not a daily driver).
>
>Thanks in advance!!!!
>
>Steve
>71 Cutlass S 455
>93 Mustang LX 5.0

Go with the new tranny cooler in series with the radiator. This will bring
the tranny fluid up to operating temp. faster. You "could" have a worse
situation by having the fluid temp. unstable. The radiator will act like a
"buffer" or "condensor" (pick your lingo).


*************************************************************************
* THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY  *       Dan Lacey ( lacey@dsea.com )        *
*                           *       Dainippon Screen Eng. of America    *
* LEFT BLANK                *       3700 W. Segerstrom Ave.             *
*                           *       Santa Ana, CA. 92704                *
*************************************************************************

------------------------------

From: "Jason Labay" <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 21:03:04 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello Olds Nats

Well there is Summit Racing's headquarters in Tallmadge just outside of
Akron. In Canton there is the Pro Football Hall of Fame,  Canton Crocodiles
Pro Baseball Club.  In Cleveland there is the Cleveland Indians (doubt you
will find tickets), Rock-n-Roll Hall of Fame, Crawford Auto and Aviation
Museum.  In Akron there is the Akron Aeros AA baseball club, Inventors Hall
of Fame and my house ;-) All of these sites are within 1-2 hours of
Norwalk.
- --------
Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com)
93 Z/28...patriot red, A4, G92, PEG2
80 Olds 442 W-30
75 Hurst/Olds W-25


- ----------
>
> Anybody been to the Olds Nats at Norwalk?  I've never been and was
thinking
> of taking my boy and making a weekend of it.  Not racing of course, just
> hanging out, watching the cars, enjoying some food, doing the road trip
> thing.  Looks like about a 6 hour drive from the Wash DC area, which is
> manageable.  Any hotel suggestions?  Any other sites to see
> around northern Ohio?
>
> Todd Morris
> 71 442
>

------------------------------

From: dhamlett@mitec.net
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:22:32 -0300
Subject: Re: Yet another Body Plate request

Robert Barry wrote:
>
> At 12:45 AM 6/10/97 -0400, you wrote:
> >Paul Hartlieb wrote:
> [snip]
> >> > 5Y
> >>
> >> (5) accessory group 5, (Y) deluxe front and rear seat belts.
> >
> >Excellent actually!  On everthing but power windows.
> >It has air, black buckets, console automatic with factory manifold
> >vacume gadge on the console.  It has front and rear belts with the
> >fisher logo, not sure what deluxe means though.  Thanks a ton!
>                             ^^^^^^
>
> That means that the latches were metal; no, wait, color-keyed to the
> interior <Bob scratches his head...> I dunno, I *am* sure that it means they
> aren't just black. We discussed this a while back, and came to a conclusion
> about it (actually, I believe we came to a couple different conclusions...)
> _______________________________________________________
> Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
> Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918
Yopur right, they are not black. ( the body of the latch) They are kind
of chrome or maybe a brushed aluminum color.
That makes sense then, thanks again!
Dan Hamlett
66 Cutlass convertible

------------------------------

From: dhamlett@mitec.net
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:23:51 -0300
Subject: Re: Remove me from this list

Erik Nowacki wrote:
>
> >> I am asking that my e-mail address be removed from this list IMMEDIATELY
> I will not tolerate this junk cluttering up my harddrive any longer. If you
> have not taken any action by the next 24 hours I will be contacting my
> lawyer to see what kind of legal action can be taken against you, so it
> would be in your best interests to do so.
> >
> >
> As an attorney I feel that this opportunity is too good to pass up.  I am
> hereby offering my services to anyone who wants to get off the list.  For
> $500 I will make sure you get removed from this list.  Hey Greg, you wanna
> split this fee with me.......
>
> Erik Nowacki
> 72 Vista Cruiser
Typical lawyer ;)  <Grin>

Dan Hamlett
66 Cutlass convertible

------------------------------

From: dhamlett@mitec.net
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:36:39 -0300
Subject: Olds for sale

Was in Kearny NE today and saw a cherry 84 H/O for sale.  The guy is
asking $8500.00 for it.  Looks great.   I also saw two late sixties (I
THINK) Toro's sitting in a field next to the highway, both were real
straight, all the glass etc.  If anyones interested I'll inquire next
time I'm up there.  It's 3 hours away from me.

Dan Hamlett
66 Cutlass convertible

------------------------------

From: "jones" <jones@morgan.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 20:37:18 -0300
Subject: Re: 66 Cutlass Help ( Fuel Tank & Power Steering Blues)

> >Please find out exactly how he flushes it out, or romoves the can..I
need
> all the specifics u can get please...
OK Robert I ask him. He said to FIRST make sure that when you put the
return line back on that a piece of it didnt fold back blocking off the
nipple on the pump. Then check to make sure both lines are open. If all
that is ok remove the return line and put it in a container to catch the
fluid. Pour new fluid in the pump and run engine. Keep pouring in new fluid
till the fluid comeing out is clean. Dont use anything but ATF or P/S
fluid. If it still doesnt work the vanes in the pump are stuck. Remove the
pump take the can off by removing the bolts and the nut on the HP fitting.
There is a O ring that seals the can to the pump. You will probably have to
replace it. Once the can is off free the vanes. I guess you have to take
the pump apart to do this. he said " there is nothing to it once you get it
apart" Thats all I could get out of him. Good Luck
BTW were you at the parade lap at the Texas Motor Speedway? I counted 39
Olds's there ( including ours and list member Art Fuller ) There were some
great looking cars there and it was a lot of fun.
Walter

------------------------------

From: DJV442@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 20:59:40 -0300
Subject: Re: Radio Troubles

i would try the solder joints first.if you don't find any bad ones, i would
suspect the
front panel membrane circuitry is bad(common on these units)if you remove the
radio
front panel,there will be a flexible membrane laying over the
buttons/controls.you should be able to purchase this from gm or a authorized
servicer.haven't bought one in a while so i can't give you a price
range....hope this helps...djv442@aol.com

------------------------------

From: "outraged.com" <Bobness@outraged.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 20:57:57 -0300
Subject: Date:Tue, 10 Jun 1997 20:57:57 -0300

unsubscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

From: dpauliso@juno.com (Dave Paulison)
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 21:24:36 -0300
Subject: Rear bumper interchangability

Are the rear bumpers of '70, '71, & '72 Cutlasses interchangble?  I saw
what appeared to be (from the front end) a nice '71 or '72 Cutlass
convertible the other day, but as it drove by, I noticed the rear bumper
was from a '70.


Dave Paulison                    1969 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
Palm Bay, Florida                1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS
dpauliso@juno.com


------------------------------

From: daveleck@atlcom.net (David Leck)
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 22:55:04 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear bumper interchangability

>Are the rear bumpers of '70, '71, & '72 Cutlasses interchangble?  I saw
>what appeared to be (from the front end) a nice '71 or '72 Cutlass
>convertible the other day, but as it drove by, I noticed the rear bumper
>was from a '70.

71 and 72 rear bumpers are identical.  70 bumpers have the taillights
oriented vertically (as opposed to horizontally for 71-72 cars).  A bumper
from any 70-71-72 will bolt onto any 70-71-72.

Hope this helps,
Dave

daveleck@atlcom.net
www.atlcom.net/~daveleck/olds

------------------------------

From: BobH592058@AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 22:07:34 -0300
Subject: Trans coolers

Bob Barry wrote:

<<I believe the aftermarket coolers are designed to supplement, not
necessarily replace, the in-radiator cooler.>>

That's my understanding as well, all installation include use of the
radiator.

<< I plan on running mine right after the lines exit the radiator, as that
will have cooled it off a bit, and then the external cooler can chill it down
even more before it enters the transmission again.>>

I _think_ it's supposed to be the other way. Someone told me years ago that
in the frozen North (anything North of Georgia ;-)), you can actually get the
trans fluid too cold doing that. The warm engine coolant in the radiator will
ensure adequate warmth.

Probably makes little diference elsewhere. If not I trust we will hear other
opinions.

Bob Handren        OCA/OCFª 7728
'67 W-30 Modified     '70 SX Convertible
Oviedo, FL

Handren Associates, Inc.
FDA Medical Device Regulatory Affairs
Laser/Optical Radiation Safety
(407)365-6385

------------------------------

From: <D.G.Vanderlee@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 22:23:03 -0300
Subject: Battery

Looking for a battery for my 1956 Oldsmobile Make- Delco-Remy
      Model- 60ea3r

------------------------------

From: mefco@sprynet.com
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 22:37:34 -0300
Subject: Re: Remove me from this list

Erik,
I think $500 is too high. I don't think it worth a penny more than $200 to
remove a person from the list.

Art Fuller

------------------------------

From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 18:42:07 -0300
Subject: Re: Yet another Body Plate request

Robert Barry wrote:

> >fisher logo, not sure what deluxe means though.  Thanks a ton!
>                             ^^^^^^
>
> That means that the latches were metal; no, wait, color-keyed to the
> interior <Bob scratches his head...> I dunno, I *am* sure that it means they
> aren't just black. We discussed this a while back, and came to a conclusion
> about it (actually, I believe we came to a couple different conclusions...)

Oh, God, here we go again.  In this case, I believe that it means that
the seat belt webbing is color keyed to the interior, which in this case
is black anyway, and that the buckles are chrome or brushed chrome
finished.  Deluxe seat belts were available in 8 colors is '66.

Standard belts would have black webbing regardless of interior color, as
well as black buckles.

- --
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

From: SRB442@aol.com
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 23:02:31 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello Olds Nats

Todd,
       I have been to the Mondello event several times and it is a excellent
event. Norwalk is a very nice track. As far as other things to do there is
Cedar Point ammusnent park about 20-30 minutes north of Norwalk. I haven't
had much luck with hotels there the nicer ones are near cedar point but cost
a lot more. The ones near norwalk are more of the mom and pop variety. If you
like Oldsmobiles and drag racing it don't get any better than this.   Steve
1967 442
1970 442
1973 442
1985 Delta 88 Royale Brougham

------------------------------

From: Brad Baker <bjbaker@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 02:46:04 -0300
Subject: Found a '69 442 for sale

Hello again. I haven't been on the list for a while like some other
folks. You know, nice weather,yard work,house work,...
 Anyway, I found a '69 Cutlass Convertible 442 for sale here in CT. The
guy says that it was purchased here and has lived in CT all its life.
 The car has 115,000 miles on the speedo and has a new top.The interior
needs some work,but the owner says that the rear quarters were replaced
with no body filler(I checked the bottoms and they are metal.)
 The front fenders seem to be all metal,and the car has a new paint
job(dark green). Good tires and nice rims(not SS,but look good anyway).
 I popped the hood and looked in. Can't really remember, but I think the
engine was gold(dirty and oily). New radiator,belts and tune up,I think.
I air cleaner is red and I think it said Rocket 350.
 The guy said that they put new body bushings on not too long ago, and
had some frontend work done. All in all,the car looked pretty good.
 Then I had to ask him the last question,,,, How much?? $6500.
 "Or best offer??" I asked. Nope. Says he has over $8000 in receipts for
work done. Oh well. Have to ask my financial adviser. NO WAY!! she said.
 So,I guess this car will be made available to the list. If anyone is
interested, I can give you the guys phone number.
 Also, I got these numbers off the car. Can anyone figure them out for
me? Thanks in advance...

Engine numbers= 396026G
Heads= C
Oil dip stick tube= QR
Oil filler tube= 9357816
Body Tag= ST69  33667LAN282405
  TR 934   61  P  02A
VINª= 344679M280089

Please let me know if this is a good find, or should I let it go :(
Thanks again....

Brad  '68 Cutlass S Convertible
MailTo:bjbaker@worldnet.att.net

------------------------------

From: Brad Baker <bjbaker@worldnet.att.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 02:49:25 -0300
Subject: August Oldsmobile Meeting

Hey Tim C. I think you said something awhile ago about a car show in
Epping NH. this August. Is this show still on? I am planning to go the
Seabrook Beach NH. this summer and would like to go to the show. Any
more info about this would be helpful. Thanks alot...

Brad  '68 Cutlass S Convertible
MailTo:bjbaker@worldnet.att.net

------------------------------

From: Eric Aksomitis <aksomi@cs.uregina.ca>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 00:04:25 -0300
Subject: Re: Trans coolers

On Tue, 10 Jun 1997 BobH592058@aol.com wrote:

> Bob Barry wrote:
>
> << I plan on running mine right after the lines exit the radiator, as that
> will have cooled it off a bit, and then the external cooler can chill it
down > even more before it enters the transmission again.>> > > I _think_
it's supposed to be the other way. Someone told me years ago that > in the
frozen North (anything North of Georgia ;-)), you can actually get the > trans
fluid too cold doing that. The warm engine coolant in the radiator will >
ensure adequate warmth. Yes, up here in Saskatchewan, you basically have-to
run it through a radiator.  For one winter (portion of) I ran a straight
cooler with cardboard covering it, and the tranny did die, but for other
reason's it wasn't a fair test.

Definitely run it through the cooler first, for lots of reasons:
1) Eliminates most of heat to air, not rad
2) keeps fluid warmer for us winter people

At any rate, I really don't know a lot, but that's my experience...

...............self-promo sig file Version 2.2...............
Eric Aksomitis:
Virtual Junkyard: Current count -> 5 vehicles
Oldsmobile Index: Current Count -> 8 vehicles
http://www.cs.uregina.ca/~aksomi/       mailto:aksomi@cs.uregina.ca
Last update: 970504
..............................................................

------------------------------

From: CRuper1@aol.com
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 00:23:19 -0300
Subject: Re: Esko's Niney and Merry Salvaging.

In a message dated 97-06-10 16:53:20 EDT, you write:

<< Met Chris Ruper's wife Angie and son and daughter. The rain dried
 eventually, over pizza and beer (yum).

 David Brown >>

I think you meant that Karl dried.......  :)

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

From: "Jason Labay" <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 02:42:24 -0300
Subject: Read this beauty about a 442......

This is a post from the f-body list that I just had to forward to the Olds
list. Try and find the HUGE Oldsmobile blunder in this post ;-)  Please
don't e-mail the author of the post, he knows he made a mistake. I took
care of him ;-)
- --------
Jason Labay  Akron, Ohio (z28cfi@gwis.com)
93 Z/28...patriot red, A4, G92, PEG2
80 Olds 442 W-30
75 Hurst/Olds W-25



> To: F-Body@f-body.org
> Subject: Re: [f] Nose to Nose with a C5 Vette...
>
> I was at the dealer today looking at White '97 Z rims possibly for my red
TA
> <comment?>.  Anyways, I was in the service prep area when there was a
couple
> taking delievery of a C5.  It looked nice but when they started it up I
kind
> of laughed to myself.  I've never ran up with one on the road so I don't
> know how I'd hang but...they revved it and there were some ooohhs ans
ahhhs.
> Man I wish I had my TA there with SLP headers and Open Borla!! Sounded way
> better.  However, when I was having my Borla installed, there was a '70
442
> Cuda that would make me sound like a chump. SO......I was happy with how
my
> car sounds now :]
>
>                         later,

Name withheld to protect this poor sole....haha!

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 00:53:21 -0300
Subject: Re: Mondello Olds Nats

In a message dated 97-06-10 13:58:17 EDT, you write:

<< Anybody been to the Olds Nats at Norwalk?  I've never been and was
thinking
 of taking my boy and making a weekend of it.  Not racing of course, just
 hanging out, watching the cars, enjoying some food, doing the road trip
 thing.  Looks like about a 6 hour drive from the Wash DC area, which is
 manageable.  Any hotel suggestions?  Any other sites to see
 around northern Ohio?

 Todd Morris
 71 442 >>
Hey Todd, me about 14 other of my buddies are going to Norwalk, I will be in
the King of the Hill race which is show and go.  EconoLodge and the HoJo are
the two best places to stay at in Norwalk.  As for attractions, Norwalk is
only 20 miles from
Cedar Point.  Its an amusement park with 9 roller coasters and two Water
Rides.  Well worth the $$$$ going to the Point.

W MACHINES (Mark Prince)
72 442 W-30

------------------------------

From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 00:56:24 -0300
Subject: Mondello Olds Nats ª2

The Mondello Olds Nats will be held on July 13th at Norwalk Raceway, in
Norwalk Ohio.  They serve a pigroast at noon and there are at least 300
Oldsmobiles in
participation.  Please come and enjoy the weekend.  Friday the 11th is test
and tune night and Saturday is the Norwalk regular racing program.  It starts
at 10:00 am and finishes up at about midnight to 1:00 Am

W MACHINES (MARK PRINCE)
72 442 W-30

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <RBarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 01:24:56 -0300
Subject: Re: Found a '69 442 for sale

At 01:46 AM 6/11/97 -0400, you wrote:
>... found a '69 Cutlass Convertible 442 for sale here in CT...
>the owner says that the rear quarters were replaced
>with no body filler(I checked the bottoms and they are metal.)
> The front fenders seem to be all metal,and the car has a new paint
>job(dark green). Good tires and nice rims(not SS,but look good anyway).
[snip]
> Then I had to ask him the last question,,,, How much?? $6500.
> "Or best offer??" I asked. Nope. Says he has over $8000 in receipts for
>work done. Oh well. Have to ask my financial adviser. NO WAY!! she said.

That's not a bad price for a 442 ragtop with all-steel in the body. Even
assuming the engine needs a rebuild, it's a good price.

> Also, I got these numbers off the car. Can anyone figure them out for
>me? Thanks in advance...
>
>Engine numbers= 396026G
>Heads= C

Those are the correct codes for a '69 400ci 442. Could you read the carb ID
ª? It should read 7029251.

>Oil dip stick tube= QR

That's the proper code for a 1969 400ci with automatic transmission, without
air conditioning. This is a non-air car I'm assuming? Is this on a little
paper sticker? Does it look original, or reproduction? (if original, it'd be
a first for me to see that!)

>Oil filler tube= 9357816

I dunno...

>Body Tag= ST69

1969

>33667LAN282405

3=Oldsmobile
36=Cutlass series body (don't worry; it's the VIN that counts)
67=Convertible body style
LAN=produced at Lansing, MI plant (were all 442's assembled there and at
Fremont? There was a Framingham, MA plant at that time; wonder why a CT car
wouldn't come from that plant)
282405=unit production number for the body

>  TR 934

I dunno... I don't have the interior codes (Phil?)

>61  P

Sable (what is that color?), with an "Antique Parchment" top

>02A

Produced second week of Feb.

>VINª= 344679M280089

3=Oldsmobile
44=442 series
67=convertible body style
9=1969
M=Lansing (Michigan...)
280089=sequential production number (not related to body number)

>Please let me know if this is a good find, or should I let it go :(
>Thanks again....
>
>Brad  '68 Cutlass S Convertible

As much as I hate to say this, Brad, $6500 for a solid matching-numbers 442
convertible is a real bargain. A full interior would run you $1000, and a
stock engine rebuild about $2500, after which you'd have a potential
show-quality, investment-quality car.

Lets put it this way: You'd have to invest at least $4000 in the bodywork
for your '68 if it has the normal rust (and if I recall, it does...), and it
still wouldn't be a 442.

In the long run, the 442 will be much cheaper car. Now, GO CONVINCE YOUR
WIFE! (er, financial advisor, I mean...)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <RBarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 01:39:25 -0300
Subject: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations

Well, the day is finally approaching! I've got a running engine to drop in
my SX (finally! coming intact from a '68 Toro), so I've got to get it in
shape to accept the engine. Besides redoing the brakes (lines, cylinders,
etc.), I've got to get the exhaust prepared.

I'll be using the stock manifolds, and I'm not looking for sound beyond what
it came with from the factory, so a stock setup would be fine for me. I'll
have to install it myself where the car is at, so having a shop bend it up
is out of the question. I'll be looking, then, at buying a full system, and
have found a few places that I'd like to get your advice on.

Fusick's is the top contender: $299 for a complete system, including
mufflers and trumpets (lacking tailpipe hangers). Plus, it's in CT, where
the car is located, so I can pick it up myself and return it if there's any
problems.

Kanter's lists them, but that would involve shipping, and I'm leery of
shipping pipes. The same would apply to other suppliers as well.

One final option is getting them over-the-counter at an auto-parts store.
Does anyone know whether Walker or anyone else still lists the pipes and
mufflers? I recall someone claiming that the trumpets can be had through
NAPA, but how about the other parts? And if so, would the whole setup
(headpipes, intermediate pipes, mufflers & hangers, tailpipes and trumpets)
match that $299 figure from Fusick's?
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

From: "dayc" <dayc@ix.netcom.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 19:05:34 -0300
Subject: Re: Johnny Lightnings

I haven't seen it yet either(CA resident), although I got a nifty Olds
"Pro-Street" one from the Hotrod mag series.  It however is a crossbreed.
The taillights are '69 but the grill is '70.  It has a tubbed look and I
was excited to find an Olds hotwheel.  I Have the W-30 scheme "hotwheel"
model it is yellow and black.  If I come across some I will let you Jonny
Lightning lovers know!  I have a Walmart employee in the family and I have
them looking out for one.

Corey D
dayc@ix.netcom.com
70 Olds Cutlass S - 455!!!!
 ----
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: Tuesday, June 10, 1997 2:20 AM
Subject: Re: Johnny Lightnings

Rick Kromeich wrote:
>
> Has anyone seen the next supposed set of Indy Pace Cars from Johnny
Lightning?
> I think that would be series 4.  I started collecting them, but I
haven't
> seen anything new at the stores for months now, and my 1970 pace car
> convertibles were looking for company on my shelf.
>
> Rick
> 72 Cutlass Supreme Convert.


Actually, I'm looking for set 4 also.  I missed that one.  Picked up set
5 on Mother's Day at a local department store.  '70 is champagne, '74 is
grabber blue, '77 is orange and black.  Having a devil of a time finding
set 4.

Paul
- --
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

From: STVF11D@prodigy.com (MISS HEATHER K HUMPHRIES)
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 05:08:41 -0300
Subject: Found a '69 442 for sale

Brad,
         If the body plate read off as ( ST69  33667LAN282405 )
and the vin was ( 344679M280089 ) then it looks like you found
a 69 cutlass that has melded with a 69 442.
My books only go back to 70 but I know the chassis designation
number should match the first five numbers of the vin. Am I right?

Any luck with a deep direct drum? Anybody?


Mark Graff
70 442 W-25
71 Cute ass
Minneapolis,MN

------------------------------

From: Amy Zidell <amylzid@concentric.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Jun 1997 21:44:34 -0300
Subject: re:  smog check II

Dear Fellow Oldsmobile enthusiasts,

As a fellow car lover, I am passing this information on ...  I've heard
rumblings of this for years but actually was sent a newsletter about
SMOG CHECK II. A lady investigative reporter, Karen-Lee Bixman,
uncovered this story. An excerpt..., "The Organge County Register
reported that 'tailpipe emissions are only 6.7% of the smog in the LA
basin' while '10 percent of the cars account for 90% of the smog.' "
The plans described would
target older cars especially but would include cars even 4 years old.  I
found a few sites on-line that discuss this situation further.

http://www.iwe.com/ksfo/list.htm

http://www.californiagold.com/politics/smogg2/smog3.htm

http://www.iwe.com/ksfo/index2.shtml

Spread the word...

------------------------------

From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 02:10:16 -0300
Subject: 73 and up parts?

Why is it that every aftermarket parts catalogue that I've looked
through (that even has Olds stuff to begin with) always stops at '72?
Rarely do you see a parts manufacturer list "Oldsmobile-'73-77". What is
the deal? Will they start producing parts when these cars become
classics? (like in 98?)
- --
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoft) Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 06:18:03 -0300
Subject: Re: Remove me from this list

On Tue, 10 Jun 1997, Erik Nowacki wrote:
> As an attorney I feel that this opportunity is too good to pass up.  I am
> hereby offering my services to anyone who wants to get off the list.  For
> $500 I will make sure you get removed from this list.  Hey Greg, you wanna
> split this fee with me.......

Sounds like a real deal to me. I'd encourage anyone currently thinking of
uns*bscribing to contact Eric immediately... ;-)

Seriously, I am wondering if anyone can help me. There seems to be some
percentage of folks who somehow believe when they get on here that this is
either a newsletter or at least something other than a mail list.  Is
there a link from a web page or something that may be leaving this
impression? I gotta think there is something misleading somewhere...

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 06:25:19 -0300
Subject: Re: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations

On Wed, 11 Jun 1997, Robert Barry wrote:
> One final option is getting them over-the-counter at an auto-parts store.
> Does anyone know whether Walker or anyone else still lists the pipes and
> mufflers? I recall someone claiming that the trumpets can be had through
> NAPA, but how about the other parts? And if so, would the whole setup
> (headpipes, intermediate pipes, mufflers & hangers, tailpipes and trumpets)
> match that $299 figure from Fusick's?

Bob, I don't know about the 4-4-2 system or how different it is from a
regular Cutlass setup, but I do know that Walker makes a dual setup for
my car because that's what got put on it. I bought the whole deal from my
parts store. I think it was under $300 but I also got it wholesale, so I
can't be 100% certain.

Someone told me that certain models (4-4-2? SX?) had 2 different sizes of
exhaust: 2 1/4 inch on one side, 2 1/2 of the other. I have only ever
heard this from one person. Anyone else know about this?

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

From: Jay Britt <Jbritt@nas1.360.cdpd.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 08:44:47 -0300
Subject: Re: Radio Troubles

Andrew C. Green wrote:
> There are a couple aftermarket stereos with especially large faceplates
> made specifically for this big GM cutout. I forget the brand(s) offhand
> but saw them listed in the Crutchfield catalog, FWIW.

The company that manufactures these radios is Audiovox. They make OEM
look-alikes for GM and F*rds.
I installed one in my company vehicle, a F*rd Econoline 150 van, about a
year ago. It looks like a factory radio and the installation was simple,
largely in part to Crutchfield's excellent install kits.
However, I am disapointed with the performance of the radio, especially
the cassette portion. I didn't purchase the external CD changer, maybe I
can convinvce the boss that its really test equipment ;-)
Anyway, these radios might look like the originals but they sure don't
sound like one.

just my $.02 worth,
Jay
'67 Cutlass Supreme

- --
__________________________________________________________
Jay Britt                        3600 Communications
Systems Engineer             Wireless PBX & Data Services
(757) 687-3317              One Columbus Center, Suite 530
(757) 473-0063 Fax          Virginia Beach, Virginia 23462
mailto:jbritt@nas1.360.cdpd.net           USA
mailto:jay.britt@360.com
__________________________________________________________
This message was sent from a wireless data device using
3600 Communications' CDPD Wireless Data Services.

------------------------------

From: mrada <mrada@catalina-inter.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 07:46:26 -0300
Subject: Re: smog check II

Amy Zidell wrote:

> uncovered this story. An excerpt..., "The Organge County Register
> reported that 'tailpipe emissions are only 6.7% of the smog in the LA
> basin' while '10 percent of the cars account for 90% of the smog.' "

So what is being said here?  Does this imply that a verrrry small
percentage
of the smog is due to cars?  So who are the gross polluters?  Why aren't
they being picked on.

> The plans described would
> target older cars especially but would include cars even 4 years old.  I
> found a few sites on-line that discuss this situation further.
>
> http://www.iwe.com/ksfo/list.htm
> http://www.californiagold.com/politics/smogg2/smog3.htm
> http://www.iwe.com/ksfo/index2.shtml

I checked these out and got very angry.  No one is going to disallow me
the privilege to drive my car, no one!  If this is trying to promote
throw
away cars, then the prices should come down to a couple of thousand for
a
car and not 25000!  I think this who smog check is ridiculous and should
be
rescinded.

Later

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

From: padavano.joe@Orbital.COM
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 10:00:13 -0300
Subject: Re: Rear bumper interchangability

Dave Paulison inquired:

Are the rear bumpers of '70, '71, & '72 Cutlasses interchangble?  I saw
what appeared to be (from the front end) a nice '71 or '72 Cutlass
convertible the other day, but as it drove by, I noticed the rear bumper
was from a '70.

     Yes, they are.  Of course, the front end sheet metal is
     interchangeable as well (with significantly more work), which explains
     the 69 Cutlass I once saw with 68 front sheetmetal.

     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com

     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30


------------------------------

From: Patrick Derkacz <patrickd@wwnet.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:56:45 -0300
Subject: Re: Master Cylinders - disc vs drum

Chris R. Smetana wrote:
>
> Hello everyone,
> I have a question about master cylinders.  I have been talking with Chris
> Witt a little bit about this and wanted to get some other opinions on the
> subject.  First the car in question, it is a 69 W-31 with manual front
> drums and I'm considering converting to manual front discs. I asked Mr.
> Witt if he happen to have a non power disc brake master cylinder and he
> said the masters are the same for drum and disc, that the only thing I
> would need are the spindles and related parts and the combination valve,
> and I assume the disc brake hose brackets that bolt to the frame.  So the
> million dollar question is....Is there a difference between non power drum
> and non power disc disc master cylinders as they relate to a 69 Olds
> Cutlass?  Or any other Olds out of curiosity?
>


- --- Thet are different for power drums and power discs, so I would think
they would be different for manual also.

> As a side note, when I converted my Skylark from power front drums to power
> front discs, I was told by Midas, actually a guy who worked there, there
> was no difference in the master cylinders.  I am now led to believe
> otherwise as I have seen different master cylinders for sale for disc and
> drum applications.
> Thanks for any insight you can provide.
>
> Chris Smetana
> Terre Haute, IN
> chris_r._smetana@dadc.com
> or
> csmetana@disc.sony.com
>
> 1969 Cutlass W-31
> 2 1966 GTO's - one is a parts car
> 1971 Skylark custom convertable
> 1989 Mustang LX 5.0 hatchback
> 1977 Ford LTD - hey it was free
> 1977 Buick LeSabre - parents bought brand new and it has been bequethed to
> me - again, but at least it's Olds powered

------------------------------

From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@LILLY.COM>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:27:29 -0300
Subject: Re:  Source for '70 442/sx dual exhaust? Req. for recommendations

Years ago when I last bought replacement exhaust from NAPA for my 4-4-2,
(it was either a parts store or the dealer back then, no custom bending
at that time) there was a difference from side to side.  The pipe that
runs from the manifold to the muffler is larger by 1/4 inch on one side.
The tail pipes were the same size.  When getting mufflers you had to
specify right or left.  They even had glasspacks that fit exactly.  The
pipe size may have very well been 2 1/4 and 2 1/2 inlet with 2 inch
outlets.  (Fuzzy Memory)  I personaly think the over the counter stuff
is way too expensive compared to having it custom bent.  $300 for NAPA
stuff sounds about right for that type of system.  I had 2 1/4
alumanized pipe with turbo mufflers bent and installed from the headers
(aka headaches) back for under $170.  The alumanized pipe will hold up
better and longer than the standard muffler moly used for over the
counter stuff.

My $.02
Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

From: Robert Knowles <bigrob@flash.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:21:49 -0300
Subject: Re: 66 Cutlass Help ( Fuel Tank & Power Steering Blues)

At 08:37 PM 6/10/97 -0300, you wrote:
>
>> >Please find out exactly how he flushes it out, or romoves the can..I
>need
>> all the specifics u can get please...
>OK Robert I ask him. He said to FIRST make sure that when you put the
>return line back on that a piece of it didnt fold back blocking off the
>nipple on the pump. Then check to make sure both lines are open. If all
>that is ok remove the return line and put it in a container to catch the
>fluid. Pour new fluid in the pump and run engine. Keep pouring in new fluid
>till the fluid comeing out is clean. Dont use anything but ATF or P/S
>fluid. If it still doesnt work the vanes in the pump are stuck. Remove the
>pump take the can off by removing the bolts and the nut on the HP fitting.
>There is a O ring that seals the can to the pump. You will probably have to
>replace it. Once the can is off free the vanes. I guess you have to take
>the pump apart to do this. he said " there is nothing to it once you get it
>apart" Thats all I could get out of him. Good Luck
>BTW were you at the parade lap at the Texas Motor Speedway? I counted 39
>Olds's there ( including ours and list member Art Fuller ) There were some
>great looking cars there and it was a lot of fun.
>Walter
>
>  Art sold me a set of 70' SS1's about a month ago, and he told me that he
was gonna be in the parade. I missed it. Well the good news is I drove my
car on the freeway for the first time day before yesterday and the pump
cleared out and now works fine. Thanks for your help. Do u have an Olds, and
do u go to any parking lots shows. I am gonna bring my car to the Alta Mesa
show. It's not finished but I just love to drive it now. Anyway thanks a
bunch.
                                                                 Robert

------------------------------

From: Etzel Bobby <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:33:23 -0300
Subject: RE: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations

Year One list the complete exhaust system for $269.95 set. It includes 2" =
tailpipes, 2 1/4" headpipes, mufflers. and all neccessary universal type =
hangers and clamps. They are aluminized on the outside. No trumpets. =
There number is 1-800-950-9503.

I checked with NAPA a few months back for the trumpets, they had them in =
stock. I think they should have the complete system.

We have a few local muffler shops (not Midas) that say they can fit a =
system to any car. Some of them do good work. You might check with them =
in your area.


Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the...Past
__________________________________________________________________________=
_____
From: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca on Wed, Jun 11, 1997 12:49 AM
Subject: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

Well, the day is finally approaching! I've got a running engine to drop =
in
my SX (finally! coming intact from a '68 Toro), so I've got to get it in
shape to accept the engine. Besides redoing the brakes (lines, cylinders,
etc.), I've got to get the exhaust prepared.

I'll be using the stock manifolds, and I'm not looking for sound beyond =
what
it came with from the factory, so a stock setup would be fine for me. =
I'll
have to install it myself where the car is at, so having a shop bend it =
up
is out of the question. I'll be looking, then, at buying a full system, =
and
have found a few places that I'd like to get your advice on.

Fusick's is the top contender: $299 for a complete system, including
mufflers and trumpets (lacking tailpipe hangers). Plus, it's in CT, where
the car is located, so I can pick it up myself and return it if there's =
any
problems.

Kanter's lists them, but that would involve shipping, and I'm leery of
shipping pipes. The same would apply to other suppliers as well.

One final option is getting them over-the-counter at an auto-parts store.
Does anyone know whether Walker or anyone else still lists the pipes and
mufflers? I recall someone claiming that the trumpets can be had through
NAPA, but how about the other parts? And if so, would the whole setup
(headpipes, intermediate pipes, mufflers & hangers, tailpipes and =
trumpets)
match that $299 figure from Fusick's?
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918



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From: Robert Barry <RBarry@SEQUENT1.PROVIDENCE.EDU>
Subject: Source for '70 442/SX dual-exhaust? Req. for recommendations
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From: Patrick Flowers <patri63@ibm.net>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:30:00 -0300
Subject: Re: Remove me from this list

Greg Beaulieu wrote:
>
> Seriously, I am wondering if anyone can help me. There seems to be some
> percentage of folks who somehow believe when they get on here that this is
> either a newsletter or at least something other than a mail list.  Is
> there a link from a web page or something that may be leaving this
> impression? I gotta think there is something misleading somewhere...

Well, speaking as a relative newbie to the list, the only real surprise
to me was the daily volume of email.  Still, it's not unmanagable, but,
if you're a newcomer to the net and you've never been in a maillist
before, it might be overwhelming.  Maybe the suggestion that the default
s*bscribe should be the digest is the way to fix this(at least
partially).

My $.02,
Patrick
- --
Patrick Flowers    Mailto:patri63@ibm.net

------------------------------

From: Etzel Bobby <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 09:41:31 -0300
Subject: RE: Found a '69 442 for sale

The first five numbers of my VIN and body plate match on my 70 442.


Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the ....Past
__________________________________________________________________________=
_____
From: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca on Wed, Jun 11, 1997 3:16 AM
Subject: Found a '69 442 for sale
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca

Brad,
         If the body plate read off as ( ST69  33667LAN282405 )
and the vin was ( 344679M280089 ) then it looks like you found
a 69 cutlass that has melded with a 69 442.
My books only go back to 70 but I know the chassis designation
number should match the first five numbers of the vin. Am I right?

Any luck with a deep direct drum? Anybody?


Mark Graff
70 442 W-25
71 Cute ass
Minneapolis,MN



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From: STVF11D@prodigy.com (MISS HEATHER K HUMPHRIES)
Subject: Found a '69 442 for sale
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------------------------------

From: tchurchill@draper.com (Timothy A. Churchill)
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 10:19:46 -0300
Subject: Re: August Oldsmobile Meeting

> Hey Tim C. I think you said something awhile ago about a car show in
> Epping NH. this August. Is this show still on? I am planning to go the
> Seabrook Beach NH. this summer and would like to go to the show. Any
> more info about this would be helpful. Thanks alot...

Tweren't me who said it; this is the first I've heard of it.  Anyone?

BTW, I saw a real nice '66 convertible a couple of years ago, doing
the 'cruise' at Hampton Beach (in Seabrook NH)... I *think* it was just
a Cutlass, not a 4-4-2... the kid driving it claimed it had the triple
carb set up.

Maybe you'll see it there...




Tim Churchill
- -------------
'67 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme Convertible, a.k.a. 'Big Red'
'89 Cadillac Fleetwood, a.k.a. 'Der KinderWagen'
'91 Mazda Protege, a.k.a. 'The Next Car to be Replaced'

------------------------------

From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Date: Wed, 11 Jun 1997 11:28:41 -0300
Subject: Re: Found a '69 442 for sale

At 04:08 AM 6/11/97 -0400, you wrote:
>         If the body plate read off as ( ST69  33667LAN282405 )
>and the vin was ( 344679M280089 ) then it looks like you found
>a 69 cutlass that has melded with a 69 442.
>My books only go back to 70 but I know the chassis designation
>number should match the first five numbers of the vin. Am I right?

In theory, they should match, but right after the discussions of
defroster-grid installation and open-thermostat overheating (NO! Stop the
madness now!), we've beaten the horse about the correspondence between the
body plate and the VIN ª's on the '68-'69 442's. Apparently, for some reason
Lansing 442's (at least) came off the line with regular Cutlass body plates,
even though the VIN is correct for a 442. This has been verified by some
original-owners of '68-'69 442's on this list.

There is a similar, though not identical, situation with the '68-'69
Toronados. The '66-'67 Toros had two "models": Standard and Deluxe, and this
was reflected in both the body numbers and the VIN's: 9400 series for the
Standard, 9600 for the Deluxe. In 1968, Olds went to a single Toronado
"model", not given a name but designated by the series number 9400.
"Standard" and "Deluxe" came to refer, not to separate models, but to
options on the one "9400" model. Thus, the VIN will always begin "394...",
but the body plate will designate "94.." or "96..", depending on whether the
car was equipped with the Standard or Deluxe interior trim option.

I don't know how it was for the big cars, but it seems to be a matter of
record here on the list that Olds was kind of "loose" with the
correspondence between the series designation in the VIN and the style
number on the body plate, in the period of 1968-1969. As much as we would
like to think that Olds inscribed those numbers on the cars purely for the
sake of collectors verifying the correctness of these cars thirty years
after the fact, the real purpose of them was convenience and record-keeping
in the production process. So, if the Lansing plant was able to produce
442's efficiently, with the right parts, by simply installing all the parts
in the regular Cutlass bodyshell (which would differ from the 442 shell by
only two digits in that data plate), then there's no reason for them not to.
Of course, the VIN would have to reflect the models that the dealers
actually ordered, and since different prices were given for the different
models, a dealer who was expecting a VIN beginning with 344... would feel
cheated if he got a list of an incoming car beginning with VIN 336...

One other way to think about this car that Brad was looking at: if someone
did alter the car to look like a 442, why would they add the VIN, but not
the body plate, from a 442? A body plate is a lot simpler to replace; would
someone with an original 442 try to pass it off as a regular Cutlass by
installing a "336..." body plate?

Brad, if I had the $$$, I'd buy the car. Of course, if you *don't* have the
$$$ to spend, then you may as well dream about your '68...
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª714
********************************
