To:	oldsmobile-digest @ chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #822


oldsmobile-digest      Wednesday, August 27 1997      Volume 01 : Number 822



Re: DBL scoop air cleaner
UNBOUNCE: 1969 delta 88
RE: Lansing (loooong!)
Re: Parting out 1968 Cutlass Convertiblev
Re: Olds Auto Transmissions
RE: Greg's Diary
Fwd: Lansing Parade Burnouts
Oldsmobile Digest
RE: Olds extravaganza
Re: Lansing event
Springfield '98
Re: Dennis Gage and MCC
Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Hot Steering Column
Re: Remove
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Return-Path: <oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca>
Re: Lansing (loooong!)
Re: Looking for 100th flag !
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Re: Looking for 100th flag ! -Reply
What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Toro Truck
drop top update
Re: What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!
Ignore: Test
Dual Snorkel air cleaner
Re: Lansing (loooong!)
61 Olds For Sale
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
I'm back, with many responses
SPAMMED
Another Lansing Story
Re: SPAMMED
SB-42
Re: DBL scoop air cleaner
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
My photos are up!
Re: More Lansing Pics!
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing
Re: DBL scoop air cleaner
Re: Repo OAI hoods
test - ignore
Re: Lansing (loooong!)
Re: Hot Steering Column
Re: Hot Steering Column
'84 H/O rough idle.
Re: What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!
[none]
Still Another Lansing Story (short)
I'm back, with many responses (fwd)
Re[2]: DBL scoop air cleaner
Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 06:36:14 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: DBL scoop air cleaner

Lloyd W. Culp wrote:
>
>  Mike,
>
> This in no way resembles a Toro aircleaner.  The Toro ones have a thin
> profile & the snorkels are long, thin, tapering items w/a flaring end on
> them as in a trumpet.

Mystery air cleaner.  I didn't think it was from a Toro either, but I'm
no El Toro expert.  Could it even be a Buick/Pontiac???   Maybe it
belongs to the mystery 69 W-32 Public Relations car PR6904 mentioned in
earlier threads.......but I think we know this much, it most likely
didn't come from an Oldsmobile originally.  Still, it doesn't look half
bad.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 08:08:18 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 1969 delta 88

Closed list bounces due to mail aliases... think I'm figuring these out
though... forwarding.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date:Wed, 27 Aug 97 02:39:12 UT
From:"Fred Orcutt" <F_M_O@classic.msn.com>
Subject: RE: 1969 delta 88

Fredall wrote:
>----------
In response to Darryl Wright's question on the value of a 1969 Delta 88
Royal.

Well I thought 4 years ago I found a jem 1969 Delta 88 Custom 4 door HT with
only 27,000 thousand miles real nice.

The car was also a 2b 455ci.

It took me a year and a half to sell it and I think I gave it away at 1,800.

>FREDALL@aol.com      1957 Super88

IMHO, a car like the 69 D88 4dr is not an investment to expect a significant
financial return.  It's an opportunity to own one heck of a significant and
powerful road master -- the kind they don't build in Lansing anymore :(.  I
bought the same model a year ago for $500, and there was no one else
interested. It had 100k on the 455/2v, and a close to mint interior.  I have
driven it every day, and all I've had to do is change the oil every 2500-3000
miles (didn't burn any between changes, either). It's a real cruiser, and
perhaps the best feeling is that I know my family is safe in it. There may be
some lightweight rice burners that are speedier in the short run, but I know
that my Delta could cruise away from any collision that would leave any one of
them a basket case. If some schmuck thinks a 1990 Honda Civic DX with 180,000
miles on it is worth $6,000, let him waste his money. I'll take a car like
yours any day.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 07:51:24 -0400
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: RE: Lansing (loooong!)

Thanks Fred, I knew there was a story there. Sounds like Linda had as
much fun as you. I hope you find someone that has the video. What are
the details on your 442? When are you selling it and have you set a
price yet?


Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the....Past

- -----Original Message-----
From:Hiflyr442@aol.com [SMTP:Hiflyr442@aol.com]
Sent:Tuesday, August 26, 1997 5:50 PM
To:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:Re: Lansing (loooong!)

In response to multiple requests, here's the story on my participation
in the
parade, and the selection of Linda Vaughn to ride in my car (the one
you are
all gonna send me videos of doing those burnouts :-)  )  I simply
wrote a
letter to Bob Jarboe with a copy to Jon Wessel (prez of the H/OCA)
describing
my car, it's historical significance, and my knowledge of Linda's
fondness
for 72 H/Os (she rode in one identical to mine at the race with James
Garner).  Judy Badgley was on the committee that assigned parade cars
to
celebrities, and with her assistence, it was a go.  I have met Linda
several
times before, and once drove my other 72 H/O convertible to Indy for
the US
Nationals (Labor Day weekend, 1994?) for her to ride in for the
parade.  That
parade was rained out, and she always felt bad I'd driven 300 miles to
watch
it rain (almost like Lansing 97!).  Anyway, she was the perfect guest
all
day, from her arrival and posing for thousands of cameras, signing
hundreds
of autographs, and working the crowd in the parade.  In fact, it was
her that
suggested the 'smokies' in front of the review stand, which we
repeated
several times to the crowd's delight.  After the parade, the four of
us
(including my fiancee and Jon Wessel) had lunch together at the
Radisson, and
had a great time hearing war stories about Linda, Jim Garner, Doc
Watson,
Jack Duffy, Dan Gurney, etc.  In  the ultimate gesture of
appreciation, Linda
then gave me her necklace and H/O emblem that was made for her in 72,
and
which she wore at the race that year and in the parade here among
other
places.  I have seen photos of her with that necklace in magazine
articles
several times, and have never seen another one like it!  All in all,
it was
an awesome experience, after which I had her sign the right front
fender of
my car.  My 72 H/O had always been special to me, with only 29,000
original
miles and all it's original "stuff"- but now it's a legend!  Alas, I
am in
the process of selling it, but I'll always have many happy memories,
and a
great video of Linda in my rear view mirror!
Fred Brussee
(314) 532-7576

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 97 07:24:18 -0600
From: "Stephen C. Chuck" <scc@teamquest.com>
Subject: Re: Parting out 1968 Cutlass Convertiblev

 Re: Parting out 1968 Cutlass Convertible

Do you have a console and auto shifter with cable or know where I can get
one?

Is the rear bumper good?  If so, how much?

Thanks!!!

Steve

schuck@fia.net
or
scc@teamquest.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 08:32:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: CarrDuff@aol.com
Subject: Re: Olds Auto Transmissions

As some might have fiqured out I am performing a complete body off
restoration of a 71 442 W30 Conv..  I am performing all the work myself,
including body, engine, suspension, interior, top (??) and all the related
parts.  I have done this type of restoration to several other cars over the
years (70 C/S Conv., 70 442 Conv. & Several other of the other makes).  This
is just a hobby,  "keeps me home but out of the house".  What I never have
done is rebuild a transmission.

What is the popular opinion regarding rebuilding your own Auto Trans. ?
Has anyone here done it ?  Is it difficult for a fairly competent mechanic ?

Another question, I'm not all that up on sizing proper stall speed for the
tourqe converter.  In fact all the different selections of converters
confusses me.   Can anyone help me pick the proper size & rpm tourqe
converter, or do they know what was original in a 71 W-Machine ?

The engine is the stock 455ci bored .030 over 10.1 compression (Using 70 442
Pistons ),  Stock Turbo 400 W-30  "OW" trans. and a 3.73:1 optional rear
axle.

Steve Dietrich
  S/E PA.
     71 442 W30 Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 08:47:10 -0400
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: RE: Greg's Diary

Hey this could be the making of the book "My Lansing Diaries" if you
added some pictures of Linda, every year olds, ..........




Bobby
70 442 Escape Back to the.... Past

- -----Original Message-----
From:M&D Gillespie [SMTP:mgillespie@sprynet.com]
Sent:Tuesday, August 26, 1997 11:59 PM
To:Oldsmobile List
Subject:Greg's Diary

 Fellow List Members,

With Greg's permission, I have posted his great Lansing stories on my
web
site listed below. For those of you who might have missed the
"Lansing
Diaries", it's a must read.
Greg, It would really dress up the stories if you could email me some
relevant pictures for the text. Just tell me where to put them

Mick Gillespie, Columbus, Indiana
69 Cutlass S convertible
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:14:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hiflyr442@aol.com
Subject: Fwd: Lansing Parade Burnouts

Thanks to mike blankenship for the compliment!
- ---------------------
Forwarded message:
From:mike.blankenship@medaphis.com
Sender:oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca
Reply-to:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
To:oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Date: 97-08-27 01:14:44 EDT


The best burnout was done by the 72 H/O pace car with Linda Vaughn in the
back seat...WOW!!!!!!!

Mike
66 442
70 442
70 442 W30
71 442 convt

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 97 08:18:43 -0600
From: "Stephen C. Chuck" <scc@teamquest.com>
Subject: Oldsmobile Digest

RE 68-'69 Olds Parts for sale

What is the website address???  I would like to see the list and pictures.

Steve Chuck
68 Cutlass S conv.
schuck@fia.net
or
scc@teamquest.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:33:09 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: Olds extravaganza

Someone posted that Dennis Guage from MCC. They will air the show in
Feb. I wonder if their web site mentions anything about Lansing? Just in
case you don't have it, here it is :  http://www.myclassiccar.com
Fernando Proietto
Systems Analyst - Informatics

Environment Canada
Ontario Region - Monitoring & Systems Branch
4905 Dufferin St.
Downsview, Ontario
M3H 5T4

> ----------
> From: Daren & Laurie Hendley[SMTP:daren@revealed.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 1997 10:47 AM
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: Olds extravaganza
>
> > I wonder if Muscle Car Magazine or Hot Rod TV will cover the event.
> Hot
> > Rod TV last weekend feature the Woodward Dream Cruise. If so we
> won't
> > see it for a while.
> >
> > Fernando Proietto
> > Systems Analyst - Informatics
> I saw a writer for Car and Driver on thursday. Laurie saw a guy with a
> lot
> of camera equipment wearing a Motor trend shirt. All we can do is
> hope. Saw
> Willard Scott this morning in a '70 442 conv. doing his
> birthday/weather
> report.
>
> Daren
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 06:53:28 -0700
From: "Chris Sparks (Mr. Ada)" <sparks@nfs.aisf.com>
Subject: Re: Lansing event

Hi all,

I didn't see or hear about many or any 1968 4-4-2s at the 100 years
celebration.  Were there any?

Chris Sparks

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 08:58:49 -0700
From: Greg Kalkhoff <gkalkhof@execpc.com>
Subject: Springfield '98

Gang,

Your not gonna believe this, but some of us Toro Listers are already planning
for Nationals next year.

Does anyone know the name of the Host Hotel in Springfield for next year? I 
have
the dates from the JWO, but I didn't find a referrence to hotels.

Thanks,

Sparky
- --
Greg Kalkhoff                                        See the Sparkmobile
Toronado FAQ Administrator                     http://www.442.com/kalkhoff.html
http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/torofaqs.htm
AKA "Sparky"

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:14:47 -0500
From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@LILLY.COM>
Subject: Re: Dennis Gage and MCC

Dennis told me to look for Lansing coverage sometime in February on My
Classic Car.  He offered that information to me without being asked.  It
could be later or sooner, IMHO.  Last year only had 13 episodes and if
this year follows that format, we should get more than one chance to
catch it on TV.

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:21:00 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

For all the Oldsmobiles we did see at Lansing, there were a few that I did
not see, and I was wondering if anyone else who was there might have
spotted any of the following:

1.  1975-1980 vintage Starfire.  These were the little Chevy Monza
knock-offs that were given to Olds dealers so they would have a small car
to sell during the energy "shortages" of the '70s.  I know that there is at
least one person on the planet who collects them because I read an article
about him a few years back.  I think it was in JWO, but I don't know.
Presumably these would have been slotted in the same show field as my car,
which was for 1971-1985's, but I didn't see one there

2.  1971-1976 Custom Cruiser Station Wagon.  These were the ones with the
famous (or infamous, depending on who you ask) "clamshell" tailgate, where
the window retracted into the roof and the tailgate retracted under the
floor.  My dad had two of these when they were new, a 1971 and a 1973.  I
saw several Vista Cruisers and several pre-1965 full sized wagons,
including a very nice 1948-ish (I can't remember the year) maroon woody
wagon that was hanging around the swap meet area along with a  green
version of the same thing needing restoration.  There was also a very nice
1960 Super 88 wagon.  (A picture of this will be on my web pages later
today.)  I also saw some later model-year wagons, but I don't recall seeing
any of the '71-'76 Custom Cruisers.  These cars were interesting in that
the '71 represented Olds's first foray back into the full-size wagon market
since the 1964 Fiesta wagon that was based on the Dynamic 88.  From 1965 to
1970, the largest wagon Olds offered, the Vista Cruiser, was based on the
F-85 chassis.  The Custom Cruisers were based on the 98, I believe.  They
had the same taillights.

3.  mid-1980's era Firenza.  My dad owned two of these, an '85 and an '87.
My brother still has the '87, and it's got 145,000 miles on it.  These were
the little cars similar to the Chevy Cavalier?

4.  1990-1996 Silhouette minivan.  This was the Olds's version of the
"dustbuster" minivans (Chevy Lumina and Pontiac Tranport, too).  They were
first offered in 1990 and were replaced in 1997 with the more tame version
with the anemic-looking (in my opinion!) headlights.  I didn't see a single
one of these vans the whole weekend, not even amongst the general
population of Lansing, although I saw a number of the 1997 version around
town, and there was one in the parade.


I also saw only one Omega the whole weekend, and that was in the parade.  I
think it was a '72 or a '73.


It certainly seems as though there are a few cars that Olds wishes it never
produced!  :)



Dan



**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:15:14 -0700
From: Greg Kalkhoff <gkalkhof@execpc.com>
Subject: Hot Steering Column

All,

The Sparkmobile (66 Toro) ran great on it's 800 mile journey last week. 
However,
there was one thing that concerned me.

After driving for about 3 hours, I noticed that my legs and belly were getting
warm.

I felt the steering column from the steering wheel to the dash and it was hot!
So, hot you could hardly touch it. I believe you could fry the perverbial egg
on it.

Evidently, the new exhaust on the car is routed a bit closer to the steering
shaft. After a few hours of highway speeds, the steering shafts acts like a
heat sink. The heat gets transferred all the way to the steering wheel! Not to
mention the other way towards the steering box. Not good in my estimation.

Whats the best fix for this? Would it be better to wrap the exhaust manifold
pipe with a type of asbestos heat tape or make some type of heat
shroud/deflector there?

Needless to say, it was quite cool last week. I fear that if I run those kind 
of
 distances next year when it's in the 90's, I may melt the wires in the column.


Thanks,

Sparky

- --
Greg Kalkhoff                                        See the Sparkmobile
Toronado FAQ Administrator                     http://www.442.com/kalkhoff.html
http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/torofaqs.htm
AKA "Sparky"

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:23:44 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: Remove

>I thought this was a closed list now to stop this kind of SH*T.

It is. It does. But apparently somebody got hold of that old posting
about the Discount PC scam outfit and decided to "REMOVE" himself from
it -- which of course does nothing because he's simply replying to the
mailing list. He also managed to quote the whole stupid spam posting
in his followup as well. Then someone else saw that, _also_ decided to
"REMOVE" themselves, and _also_ managed to quote the whole stupid spam
posting yet again by means of not bothering to trim followups.

Please, people:

1) Do not hit Reply and Remove if you see a spam message here. It was
sent to the _list_, not to _you_; your address is not the one on the
spammer's mailing list. Just delete it and move on. (If you do send a
complaint back at the spammer, they're quite likely to simply add you
to their mailing list.)

1a) It's also a usually-pointless exercise to do that on any spam you
receive; the headers are usually forged to avoid return-email flames
and you most likely will end up bombing an innocent third party whose
domain name was forged as a reply.

2) Trim your followup message. Every time. You do _not_ need to quote
the entire posting that you are replying to; at most you can probably
pick one or two key sentences or a paragraph from the previous post
which best express the thought that you are following up on.

Now returning you to Olds chat...

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 11:14:40 -0400 (EDT)
From: senko@reston.ans.net (Andrew A. Senko)
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

Did you see any Jetfires?  I never saw one, and at least expected one to be
in the parade.  Bill Culp, I blame you for the fact that I did not see a
Jetfire this year!  You owe us one next year!  ;-)

I admit that I didn't make it to the lot where the early 60's cars would
have been on display.  Were there Jetfire's there?

- --
Drew


> For all the Oldsmobiles we did see at Lansing, there were a few that I did
> not see, and I was wondering if anyone else who was there might have
> spotted any of the following:
>
> 1.  1975-1980 vintage Starfire.  These were the little Chevy Monza...
> 2.  1971-1976 Custom Cruiser Station Wagon.  These were the ones with the...
> 3.  mid-1980's era Firenza.  My dad owned two of these, an '85 and an '87....
> 4.  1990-1996 Silhouette minivan.  This was the Olds's version of the...
>
> It certainly seems as though there are a few cars that Olds wishes it never
> produced!  :)
>
> Dan

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:53:22 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

At 10:21 AM 8/27/97 -0400, you wrote:

>2.  1971-1976 Custom Cruiser Station Wagon.

I'm having fun responding to myself!  There was one of these in the parade,
too.  It was a '71.


Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:50:28 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

At 10:21 AM 8/27/97 -0400, you wrote:
>4.  1990-1996 Silhouette minivan.  This was the Olds's version of the
>"dustbuster" minivans (Chevy Lumina and Pontiac Tranport, too).  They were
>first offered in 1990 and were replaced in 1997 with the more tame version
>with the anemic-looking (in my opinion!) headlights.  I didn't see a single
>one of these vans the whole weekend, not even amongst the general
>population of Lansing, although I saw a number of the 1997 version around
>town, and there was one in the parade.

Here I am responding to my own email.  I did in fact see one of the
dustbuster Silhouettes.  It was in the parade pulling a big cake.  I'll put
a picture on my web page.


Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:44:46 -0600
From: Marc Hartler <MHARTLER@allstate.com>
Subject: Return-Path: <oldsmobile-owner@chebucto.ns.ca>

Howdy...
I have a 1970 442 with a 455 (non- W30) and the RAM air
option. It has a TVS in the intake manifold. Does anyone
have a good diagram (not the tiny one in the manuals) or
picture they can FAX/send to me of the vacuum diagram?
Alsoe, where the trans modulator vacuum connection goes?
And where I might be able to get a tCS solenoid?

Thanks
mh

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 11:42:14 -0400
From: Ray Moriarty <rmoriarty@blairinc.com>
Subject: Re: Lansing (loooong!)

At 05:50 PM 8/26/97 -0400, you wrote:
>In response to multiple requests, here's the story on my participation in the
>parade, and the selection of Linda Vaughn to ride in my car (the one you are
>all gonna send me videos of doing those burnouts :-)  )... Alas, I am in
>the process of selling it, but I'll always have many happy memories, and a
>great video of Linda in my rear view mirror!
>Fred Brussee
>(314) 532-7576

Hey Fred,

That sounds like an awesome experience. Thank you for sharing it, and
thanks to everyone else who has shared their Lansing experience. Allowing
those of us who could not make the festivities to live vicariously through
your stories is a generous gift!

When you find a video of the burnout, give me a holler. I'd be happy to
digitize it so it can be published for all to enjoy. That is, if you
haven't made arrangements already. I don't have a web page just yet, but
I'm sure someone on the list would publish that gem.

.02
Ray

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 00:08:15 -0400
From: mrhell@m1.sprynet.com
Subject: Re: Looking for 100th flag !

>Bill, that is really a crummy thing to have happen. I was looking for one
>myself but what happened to yours is pretty low... anyhow, if anyone has
>a supply of the following items that might be for sale, let me know:
>
>1. the motorcade flag
>2. the volunteer Centennial logo t-shirt
>3. the lamppost banner
>
>Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
>

Well Greg that ford friend of mine, Rob, (that went to Lansing with me), has a
motorcade flag.  I called him and asked if he wanted to sell it.  His reply
was, "how much will he give me?"

I will forward any "offer" to him directly.  Hope you find one.

RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 12:07:15 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

At 11:14 AM 8/27/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Did you see any Jetfires?  I never saw one, and at least expected one to be
>in the parade.  Bill Culp, I blame you for the fact that I did not see a
>Jetfire this year!  You owe us one next year!  ;-)
>
>I admit that I didn't make it to the lot where the early 60's cars would
>have been on display.  Were there Jetfire's there?
>
>--
>Drew

Drew,

Yes, there was.  It was over in one of the distant lots.  It was tan with a
white top.  It was a '63 (which was the only year of the Jetfire, wasn't it?


Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 11:08:08 -0600
From: Marc Hartler <MHARTLER@allstate.com>
Subject: Re: Looking for 100th flag ! -Reply

My wife and I searched and searched for the Flags but to no
avail. We talked to a souvenier stand and they said orders
would be taken for the street banners. They might be in the
catalog or call the Lansing city hall.

>>> <mrhell@m1.sprynet.com> 8/26/97  10:08 pm >>>
>Bill, that is really a crummy thing to have happen. I was
looking for one
>myself but what happened to yours is pretty low... anyhow, if
anyone has
>a supply of the following items that might be for sale, let me
know:
>
>1. the motorcade flag
>2. the volunteer Centennial logo t-shirt
>3. the lamppost banner
>
>Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax,
Nova Scotia, Canada
>

Well Greg that ford friend of mine, Rob, (that went to Lansing
with me), has a
motorcade flag.  I called him and asked if he wanted to sell it.
 His reply
was, "how much will he give me?"

I will forward any "offer" to him directly.  Hope you find one.

RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 11:27:22 -0500
From: "smardale@airmail.net" <smardale@airmail.net>
Subject: What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!

I'm upgrading my '65 442 A-arms to the Hotchkis tubular arm system.  They
recommend upgrading to 72-81 F-body spindles and 11"-12" rotors when doing
the switch. I should know this, but I've been up for over 36 hours already,
and can't think all that clearly. I THINK this family includes the El Camino
and the corresponding cars.  If so, of these types of vehicles, which would
have the bigger 12" rotors?!

Thanks!

Scott

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 09:40:43 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

Daniel A. Gulino wrote:

> For all the Oldsmobiles we did see at Lansing, there were a few that I did
> not see, and I was wondering if anyone else who was there might have
> spotted any of the following:
>
> 1.  1975-1980 vintage Starfire.  These were the little Chevy Monza
>

Actually I sort of like these cars.  I've been looking for one for some time
now, I think it'd make a perfect little beater to drive around when the H/O is
not driveable or the snow is too deep.  There was one in the paper here a while
back for $500, I called the day the ad came out and it was already gone :-(
Someday maybe I'll find one, I'm not in a hurry.

I wonder if you can stuff an Olds small block in one of these?  I know of
Monza's with Ch*vy SB's in them (and you have to jack up the car and remove a
wheel to get at the spark plugs).

> 3.  mid-1980's era Firenza.  My dad owned two of these, an '85 and an '87.
> My brother still has the '87, and it's got 145,000 miles on it.  These were
> the little cars similar to the Chevy Cavalier?

Ick.  I see tons of these in the junkyards.  Not for me, thanks.

> 4.  1990-1996 Silhouette minivan.  This was the Olds's version of the

"Too new"?  not a "collector's vehicle"?

> I also saw only one Omega the whole weekend, and that was in the parade.  I
> think it was a '72 or a '73.

I don't mind Omegas.  They run and drive nice, and can scoot just great with a
V8 in them.  I still think that front clip is ugly.

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 97 10:06:12 PST8
From: hpnaepflin@CCGATE.HAC.COM
Subject: Toro Truck

Toro heads listenup!  Last week I was driving along a country road near my 
dad's
house in Northern California and spotted a really well done custom Toro-Truck-
Rollon-Car-Carrier.  They'd sawed off the back end of a mid 70's Toro and 
welded
on a 2-axle flatbed.  The rig has 6 identical chrome Toro wheels with drums in
back.  This was no crude hack job.  The back of the "cab" was neatly closed off
and the vinyl top extended around the new sliding rear window.  There's a small
back seat just like on an extended cab pickup.  The truck was designed to be a
car carrier with a nice low bed recessed between the back wheels and a winch
mounted at the front of the bed.

I went home got the camera and snapped off some shots.  It looks pretty cool
with a ratty old V*tt* parked on the bed. I don't have a web page but can Email
pics if somebody wants em or can post them for the public.

The kid who was home at the time said that the rig might be up for sale!!!

Charley B??  Chris Witt??  Lisa Madsen??  This is the perfect rig for the
serious Oldsmobile "collector".  No more driving a disgraceful brand of truck!!

I don't know the owners and have no interest in seeing that this truck gets
sold.  Just thought it was pretty cool!  If anybody is seriously interested I
can contact the owners next time I head up there.


By the way,  Lisa (Madsen) do you have any details on the Julian event next
week??   Might want to cruise down there.   I'm in El Segundo.

Hans

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:13:03 -0400
From: "Patton" <patton@ComCAT.COM>
Subject: drop top update

Rocketteers,
A while back there were questions about bleeding the pump and the
hydraulic system. I just came across a kit in a (Indian chief) catalog. I
made one
two years ago from a diagram in the Fisher Body Manual and it worked well.
Kit cost is $17.00. I will post to individuals who are interested.

The General.

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:22:24 -0700
From: Erik Nowacki <enowacki@titan.com>
Subject: Re: What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!

At 11:27 AM 8/27/97 -0500, you wrote:
>I'm upgrading my '65 442 A-arms to the Hotchkis tubular arm system.  They
>recommend upgrading to 72-81 F-body spindles and 11"-12" rotors when doing
>the switch. I should know this, but I've been up for over 36 hours already,
>and can't think all that clearly. I THINK this family includes the El Camino
>and the corresponding cars.  If so, of these types of vehicles, which would
>have the bigger 12" rotors?!
>
Scott,

The F-bodies are the Camaro and the Firebird.  The El Camino, I believe,
was built on a Chevelle chassis and would therefore be an A body.

Erik Nowacki
San Diego
72 Vista Cruiser

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 12:33:57 -0500 (CDT)
From: Paul Brillhart <u17058@uicvm.uic.edu>
Subject: Ignore: Test

  Ignore: Test

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:39:55 -0400
From: "Patton" <patton@ComCAT.COM>
Subject: Dual Snorkel air cleaner

Rocketteers,
This may be a dump question or a smart one. When an air filter is
purchased, what does one ask for ????????? They may be the same for other
GM products. Just a thought.

The General

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:43:56 -0400 (EDT)
From: Hiflyr442@aol.com
Subject: Re: Lansing (loooong!)

Happy to send you a copy of whatever I get...we'll see....

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 14:02:16 -0400
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: 61 Olds For Sale

Classifieds2000 sent me the following information:



1961 Oldsmobile super 88 convert, 61K miles, $3,000, clinton, Utah
Day: (801) 773-8258  Eve: (801) 773-8258  Mail: zghd65b@prodigy.com
To view the complete ads, go to:
http://www.classifieds2000.com/cgi-cls/Search.exe?135890+26-AUG-97

I post these for anyone on the list that might have an interest.

Bobby
70 442 Escape Back to the...Past

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 14:11:53 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

At 09:40 AM 8/27/97 -0700, you wrote:
>> 1.  1975-1980 vintage Starfire.  These were the little Chevy Monza
>>
>Actually I sort of like these cars.  I've been looking for one for some time
>now, I think it'd make a perfect little beater to drive around when the
H/O is
>not driveable or the snow is too deep.  There was one in the paper here a
while
>back for $500, I called the day the ad came out and it was already gone :-(
>Someday maybe I'll find one, I'm not in a hurry.

I'll keep my eye out!

>> 4.  1990-1996 Silhouette minivan.  This was the Olds's version of the
>
>"Too new"?  not a "collector's vehicle"?

True, but I would have thought I'd see more than one the whole weekend.


Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:25:16 -0500
From: David Brown <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Subject: I'm back, with many responses

After being off the list since early July, I finally put together a
combination that lets me read and send messages to the list! I performed
a lot of updating to the FAQ during that six week hiatus.

Covering a bunch of posts here:

> Yesterday I was beaten pretty badly by a toyota supra, 1980's vintange.
> Of course I was driving the 82 DRB.
> Chris Sparks
My friend's '86 Supra turbo, posi, high 3.xx gears, 800 lbs less, and
80,000 less miles, beat me ('77 Delta 403, 2.41 gears, open diff,
160,000 miles) after I hit third gear. I blew the 2-3 shift (didn't let
it wind), but it was fun just leaving him standing there until his turbo
kicked in!!

> Approval has been made for a full blown OCA web site, probably w/ the
> url www.oldsclub.com.  Final name will be determined later.
Excellent! Thanks Brad! Thanks OCA!

> Lansing video - Doug Newman
Great idea! Please put me down for one! I have a couple of rolls of
pictures. I'll let you know what I've got.

> 4.4 liter V8
Could be a Cadillac engine. Maybe that was the 4.1L V-8. Anyways, the
4.1's can be made into reliable runners by upgrading to the new style
oil pump.

> welding the center exhaust port is worth about 20-30 hp?
> about 10hp at least.
To get any power increase, you need to be running headers or the divided
exhaust manifolds (most aren't), correct?

> There is a new OCA chapter on the block - The Oldsmobile Centennial Club
> We recieved approval 8/21/97 on Oldsmobile's birthday.
Congratulations!! Quite a significant date to be given a charter.

I know for myself, the significance of Olds' birthday didn't really sink
in until I was driving home. Wish I could move time back a week. Don't
get me wrong, though, I really enjoyed the event and was really looking
forward to it. It really came up fast over the past two weeks, and then
I was there!

> Unusual 442 for sale
Maybe the Olds History Center could shed some light on this car.

> Sparky's hot steering wheel (or the Toro's backup heater)
A whole new chapter in that car cook book (forgot the name)! '65? to '70
Deltas w/dual exhaust used a heat shield to keep heat away from the
steering shaft's fiber/rubber disc. It might be possible to fashion
something similar.

> Car's not at Lansing
Yeah, no Monza-esk Starfires. There was a medium green '71-'73 or so
clam shell Custom Cruiser on Washington, I beleive. Neat seeing wagons,
4 doors, a couple of not quite show cars, at the Centennial.

There were two Omega's at the Delta Engine Plant for the Parade to the
Capitol on Wednesday. One had Olds rallye wheels on it - look a lot like
Chevy rallyes (with the radiating ovals), but had Olds caps. Only saw
one after that through the week. There was a really nice green '63
JetFire out in the MM, OO or PP lots. Sort of out of the way a bit. Then
again, I was in the LL lot - anyone see the gold '77 Delta?

I was really happy that I registered the Delta. Great plaque. Only wish
I would have set the alarm and participated in the parade! What a great
time, great to meet many people from the list! Spent too much time and
maybe money at the swap meet. Passed 199,000 miles on the way home,
17-18 MPG for the whole trip.

Memorable events include (1) Mark Prince's HEI 101 outside the Holiday
Inn, (2) greeting a fellow list member wearing a B-man shirt, and not
realizing it was Chris Witt (whom I've visited more than once) - dooh!,
(3) parade burnouts in front of the Lansing Center, (4) all the cars on
the bridge, (5) putting faces to names at the Mail List gathering, (6)
many more that I forget right now.

Looking forward to doing something similar in five years, and looking
forward to attending shows this fall. I've got to make the Homecoming
and Nationals in '98!

There's my $1.50!
- --
David Brown     Mailto:dbrown@mailhub.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:50:10 -0500 (CDT)
From: Paul Brillhart <u17058@uicvm.uic.edu>
Subject: SPAMMED

  My account has been suspended for the last 24 hours due to too much mail.
Anyone know what happened?

 Thanks.


  Paul Brillhart

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 97 12:04:42 PDT
From: <Sherry_Soball@Douglas.BC.CA>
Subject: Another Lansing Story

Hi there!

Another short story which I found to be very amusing...

Two members from the B.C. Olds Club attended the Lansing celebrations -- they
both flew in.  Member A shipped down a whole load of Cutlass/442 parts to
selll at the swap meet.  Who winds up buying a bunch of it but member B! |)
Apparently member B either slept through A's announcements at the meetings
re: reducing his load of parts, or they never both attended the same
meetings.   My hubby Dave is transporting the parts back for "B" and is due
in today some time!

Another nice little saga is of the two very friendly Lansing police members,
who, after being given a couple of B. C. pins, delivered to Dave's motel
room door a couple of Lansing Police Badges and a L.P. ballcap!  An
unexpected and somewhat special souvenir for both Dave and buddy Al.

It's been great to read about people's experiences at Lansing -- I only
wish, like many others, that I'd been able to be there myself! I don't think
I'll be around for the 200th!

Sherry Soball
Delta, B. C.
B. C. Oldsmobile Club
email:  soballs@douglas.bc.ca
- --

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 14:11:53 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: SPAMMED

>  My account has been suspended for the last 24 hours due to too much mail.
>Anyone know what happened?

(Would have sent this directly but it's unclear whether Paul would
receive it...) Nothing too unusual seen here. What sort of limitations
does your SysAdmin impose? Message count limit? Size limit? Maybe you
could go to digest mode to keep the message count down? Maybe you got
mailbombed by some irate third party unrelated to the Olds list?

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: 27 Aug 1997 11:23:56 PST
From: mjones@dragon.gleep.com
Subject: SB-42

If any of you forgot the nu,ber to the Assembly Appropriations
Committee, it is 916-322-4323.  I know I told someone it was 332-4323, I
got in contact with a rest home!

Mike JOnes
'78 Delta 88 2dr

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:28:35 -0700
From: Greg Pruett <grpruett@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: DBL scoop air cleaner

Greg Kalkhoff wrote:
>
> The Sugarmans wrote:
>
> > http://www.berkshire.net/~sugarman/airclenr.jpg
>
> Definately NOT a Toro air cleaner from 66, 67, 68. Not sure what that thing
is! >

FWIW. I've seen a picture of an engine with an aircleaner like that
before.  It was in a petersen book I have somewhere.  The picture was of
an olds engine mounted on a stand with the OAI ducting and scoops in
place.  The scoops just kinda hung there.  Anywayz, the caption said it
was a 442 engine with cold air ducts in place.

Greg Prett
`72 Vista Cruiser
`67 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:15:38 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

> >I admit that I didn't make it to the lot where the early 60's cars would
> >have been on display.  Were there Jetfire's there?
>
> Yes, there was.  It was over in one of the distant lots.  It was tan with a
> white top.  It was a '63 (which was the only year of the Jetfire, wasn't it?

So did anyone get a pic of this mysterious Jetfire?  I'd like to get a
hold of one to give to an unfortunate soul who didn't make it to Nats.

8)
peg

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:21:33 -0400
From: "Daniel A. Gulino" <gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu>
Subject: My photos are up!

I've posted 26 photos taken during the Lansing celebration.  Go to the URL
below for a list of clickable descriptions.  There is also a link to this
page on my "regular" Olds page.

http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/lansing/lansing.html

Let me know what you think!


Dan


**************************************
Daniel A. Gulino
gulino@bobcat.ent.ohiou.edu
http://ouvaxa.cats.ohiou.edu/~gulino/rides.html
1975 Delta 88 Convertible
**************************************

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 10:39:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: senko@reston.ans.net (Andrew A. Senko)
Subject: Re: More Lansing Pics!

Doh!!  Ok, the URL is

http://members.aol.com/drewinva/olds/lansing

Sorry about that!
- --
Drew


>
> Andrew A. Senko wrote:
> >
> > Hey all!
> >
> > I scanned some pictures today from the Lansing trip.
>
> > That being said, what I've done is place the pictures in a directory with
> > no HTML file.  When you enter the URL in your browser, it will simply
> > display the list of files.
>
> Um, what's the URL?  I couln't find a link from your page.
>
> Greg Pruett
> `72 Vista Cruiser
> `67 Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:24:43 -0500 (EST)
From: Clayton Pierce <zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

I believe that I may actually have gotten a picture of it.  I'll find out
in a few days when I get my film back (can't afford that 1 hour stuff).  I
KNOW I got pictures of a Starfire or two, but I think I got the Jetfire
too.  If I've got the pic.  I'll get it scanned and post it asap as final
proof that there actually was one of these cars there :-)

Incedentally, I was looking specifically there for a car of the type I
used to own, but couldn't find it.  No 4 door 1974 Delta 88's.  In fact, I
don't think there were any '74 Delta 88's at all.  Don't tell me I had a
RARE car crushed...  it was wrecked anyway... and pretty ugly at that.

There was also no '49 98 Club Coupe (fastback) but there were at least a
couple of 51's of the same model.

Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
Clayton Pierce,
zcwp11@Access.ETSU-Tn.Edu
the_rocketeer@rocketmail.com


On Wed, 27 Aug 1997, Peg O'Connor wrote:

> > >I admit that I didn't make it to the lot where the early 60's cars would
> > >have been on display.  Were there Jetfire's there?
> >
> > Yes, there was.  It was over in one of the distant lots.  It was tan with a
> > white top.  It was a '63 (which was the only year of the Jetfire, wasn't 
it?
>
> So did anyone get a pic of this mysterious Jetfire?  I'd like to get a
> hold of one to give to an unfortunate soul who didn't make it to Nats.
>
> 8)
> peg
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:26:59 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: DBL scoop air cleaner

The picture was of
> an olds engine mounted on a stand with the OAI ducting and scoops in
> place.  The scoops just kinda hung there.  Anywayz, the caption said it
> was a 442 engine with cold air ducts in place.
>
Sure was a ram-air engine.  But it was a W-30 dual snorkel intake, which
is similar, but different than the one in question.  The mystery one has
no provisions for ducting, since it has the flared ends on the snorkels.

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 12:44:59 -0700
From: Erik Nowacki <enowacki@titan.com>
Subject: Re: Repo OAI hoods

>Anyone out there ever used/had a repro OAI hood?   Let us know what you
>think.
>
I would also be interested in peoples experiences with the repro stuff.  I
was also wondering if there are any repro OAI hood "skinns" that you can
attach to the frame of a regular hood?  If so, you would end up with
something close to the original setup and be able to use the center latch.

Erik Nowacki
San Diego
72 Vista Cruiser

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 16:00:25 -0500
From: "David Brown (the Olds FAQ compiler)" <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Subject: test - ignore

testing mail server

- --
David Brown     Mailto:dbrown@mailhub.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
- ------------

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 15:53:29 -0500 (CDT)
From: bryceman@442.com
Subject: Re: Lansing (loooong!)

>>In response to multiple requests, here's the story on my participation in the
>>parade, and the selection of Linda Vaughn to ride in my car (the one you are
>>all gonna send me videos of doing those burnouts :-)  )... Alas, I am in
>>the process of selling it, but I'll always have many happy memories, and a
>>great video of Linda in my rear view mirror!
>>Fred Brussee

>When you find a video of the burnout, give me a holler. I'd be happy to
>digitize it so it can be published for all to enjoy. That is, if you
>haven't made arrangements already. I don't have a web page just yet, but
>I'm sure someone on the list would publish that gem.

I would _love_ to publish the burnout in my multimedia section. I have the
capability to digitize from VHS cassette. Let me know if you are interested
Fred. I am still in Michigan BTW. I'll be back in Lansing on Sat. to part
out a car with Mr. Witt.

           Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Oldsmobiles
'66 Dynamic 88 B07 Apprehender  '65 442   '72 Cutlass Convertible
            Email: bryceman@442.com  URL: www.442.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 16:20:24 -0500
From: "John M. Loban" <cyberpsych@worldnet.att.net>
Subject: Re: Hot Steering Column

Greg Kalkhoff wrote:
>
> All,
>
> The Sparkmobile (66 Toro) ran great on it's 800 mile journey last week.
However, there > was one thing that concerned me. > > > > I felt the steering
column from the steering wheel to the dash and it was hot! So, hot > you could
hardly touch it. I believe you could fry the perverbial egg on it. >


My '63 Starfire column seemed to get hot also on the Lansing trip.  I
felt hot air coming out of it so I suspect engine heat is working its
way up the column.  Haven't had a chance to really check it out but
remember some type of steering shaft seal fits up against the bottom of
the column where the steering shaft enters the column - kind of a foam
rubber seal if I remember.  Check it out!    John

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 16:35:52 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: Hot Steering Column

>My '63 Starfire column seemed to get hot also on the Lansing trip.  I
>felt hot air coming out of it so I suspect engine heat is working its
>way up the column.

Just thinking out loud here: Both this car and the '66 Toro do not
have collapsible steering columns, do they? If not, is the steering
column shaft basically one big hunk o' metal running down to the
front end (except for maybe a universal joint or flex coupling).
Is it possible that it's just acting as a big heat sink since it
doesn't have the sacrificial plastic couplings of collapsible
columns, which can act as insulators?

I also thought about the effects of direct sunlight on the painted
metal steering columns of '60's-vintage cars but figured that was
too much of a stretch...

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 14:42:15 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: '84 H/O rough idle.

In the past few weeks my '84 H/O has been running rougher and rougher,
to the point where it almost stalled when starting from a stop
yesterday.  I'm sort of at a loss as to where to start troubleshooting.
Here's the symptoms and diagnosis I've been able to do so far:

- - Idles rough, very lumpy (actually it sounds pretty mean!).
- - All gauges read normal and no computer error codes are stored.
- - A/C on smoothes the idle out some since it idles a bit faster with the
A/C on, but it's still much rougher than normal.
- - Seems to run just fine once off idle.
- - Gas mileage has decreased from 13mpg around town to under 11.  This
may be due to me tending to lead-foot it more in the nice weather :-)
- - Starts as easy as ever, hot or cold, even with the A/C on..
- - Timing is okay (20 degrees, stock setting).
- - TPS voltage checks as okay.
- - I can't locate any vacuum leaks.  Most vacuum tubing was replaced last
year.
- - Plugs are only about 1000 miles old (and it started this on the
previous set of plugs).
- - It idles just fine when the engine is cold, and most of the time (but
not always) it also idles okay when the engine is just started and
already hot (only for a few minutes, like until the computer goes closed
loop???).

- - Recent changes:
   MSD 6AL added about 3 months ago, this started 2 months ago
   Switched to thin 4-hole carb gasket from thick 2-hole stock version 3
months ago to a) get a bit more hood clearance for the air cleaner and
b) get the full benefit out of my performer dual-plane manifold
   New water pump a few weeks ago
   DA Secondary metering rods replaced with AX rods about 2 months ago
(this fixed a lean sputter I was getting on the freeway, but I can't
imagine how 2ndary rods could affect idle).

Any help would be appreciated!  I'm tending to think something is wrong
with the computer system or it's sensors since it idles fine when cold
or when first started hot.

Tom Lentz
tlentz@ior.com

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 17:59:52 -0400
From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Subject: Re: What are 72-81 F-bodies again?!

At 11:27 AM 8/27/97 -0500, you wrote:
>I'm upgrading my '65 442 A-arms to the Hotchkis tubular arm system.  They
>recommend upgrading to 72-81 F-body spindles and 11"-12" rotors when doing
>the switch. I should know this, but I've been up for over 36 hours already,
>and can't think all that clearly. I THINK this family includes the El Camino
>and the corresponding cars.  If so, of these types of vehicles, which would
>have the bigger 12" rotors?!

They are Camaro/Firebirds. The El Camino was an A body til 78 when it
became a G-body.
____________________________________________
Jason Labay - Quality Engineer - TRW Automotive Group
z28cfi@gwis.com  Akron, OH
95 DCM Impala SS.....don't get much better than this
80 Olds 442 W-30.......show car
75 Hurst/Olds W-25...restoration project
85 S-10 Blazer 4x4.......work truck

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 19:47:57 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: [none]

Forwarding a message from Bryceman... a problem with his address, now
cleared up.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:bryceman@442.com
Subject: Re: Lansing (loooong!)

>>In response to multiple requests, here's the story on my participation in the
>>parade, and the selection of Linda Vaughn to ride in my car (the one you are
>>all gonna send me videos of doing those burnouts :-)  )... Alas, I am in
>>the process of selling it, but I'll always have many happy memories, and a
>>great video of Linda in my rear view mirror!
>>Fred Brussee

>When you find a video of the burnout, give me a holler. I'd be happy to
>digitize it so it can be published for all to enjoy. That is, if you
>haven't made arrangements already. I don't have a web page just yet, but
>I'm sure someone on the list would publish that gem.

I would _love_ to publish the burnout in my multimedia section. I have the
capability to digitize from VHS cassette. Let me know if you are interested
Fred. I am still in Michigan BTW. I'll be back in Lansing on Sat. to part
out a car with Mr. Witt.

           Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Oldsmobiles
'66 Dynamic 88 B07 Apprehender  '65 442   '72 Cutlass Convertible
            Email: bryceman@442.com  URL: www.442.com

------------------------------

Date: 27 Aug 97 18:44:10 EDT
From: Michael McDonald CPA <73564.3716@CompuServe.COM>
Subject: Still Another Lansing Story (short)

I could only spend one day in Lansing (too much work - so little time!) - So I
went on Saturday and drove the 72 H/O coupe.  After spending some time in the
reserved H/O parking lot, I went to watch the parade and walked around looking
at other years in other designated parking areas.  So many great looking cars!
After a bite to eat I decided to head for the swap area. On the way to the swap
area (about six blocks from the H/O parking lot) a great looking blond driving 
a
72 H/O convertible pulled up along side and asked directions to the reserved 
H/O
parking.  Man, what more could anyone ask for!  An attractive woman who
appreciates a rare and fine automobile.  After I gave her directions (which I
hope were clear enough) I forgot to look at her license plate to see what state
she was from.  I then turned to my 15 month old son strapped in his car seat in
the back seat of the H/O coupe and said "Say good-by to the pretty lady".  This
"encounter" was the highlight of my one day visit to Lansing.

Mike McDonald
72 H/O Coupe (w/ sunroof)
68 H/O (project car)

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 20:00:44 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: I'm back, with many responses (fwd)

Forwarding from David Brown... a problem with his address still. David,
you're s*bscribed under the address "drown@mailhub.mcis.uchicago.edu" but
your messages show "dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu"... is it possible to
change your mailer configuration?

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date:Wed, 27 Aug 1997 13:25:16 -0500
From:David Brown <dbrown@mcis.bsd.uchicago.edu>
Subject: I'm back, with many responses

After being off the list since early July, I finally put together a
combination that lets me read and send messages to the list! I performed
a lot of updating to the FAQ during that six week hiatus.

Covering a bunch of posts here:

> Yesterday I was beaten pretty badly by a toyota supra, 1980's vintange.
> Of course I was driving the 82 DRB.
> Chris Sparks
My friend's '86 Supra turbo, posi, high 3.xx gears, 800 lbs less, and
80,000 less miles, beat me ('77 Delta 403, 2.41 gears, open diff,
160,000 miles) after I hit third gear. I blew the 2-3 shift (didn't let
it wind), but it was fun just leaving him standing there until his turbo
kicked in!!

> Approval has been made for a full blown OCA web site, probably w/ the
> url www.oldsclub.com.  Final name will be determined later.
Excellent! Thanks Brad! Thanks OCA!

> Lansing video - Doug Newman
Great idea! Please put me down for one! I have a couple of rolls of
pictures. I'll let you know what I've got.

> 4.4 liter V8
Could be a Cadillac engine. Maybe that was the 4.1L V-8. Anyways, the
4.1's can be made into reliable runners by upgrading to the new style
oil pump.

> welding the center exhaust port is worth about 20-30 hp?
> about 10hp at least.
To get any power increase, you need to be running headers or the divided
exhaust manifolds (most aren't), correct?

> There is a new OCA chapter on the block - The Oldsmobile Centennial Club
> We recieved approval 8/21/97 on Oldsmobile's birthday.
Congratulations!! Quite a significant date to be given a charter.

I know for myself, the significance of Olds' birthday didn't really sink
in until I was driving home. Wish I could move time back a week. Don't
get me wrong, though, I really enjoyed the event and was really looking
forward to it. It really came up fast over the past two weeks, and then
I was there!

> Unusual 442 for sale
Maybe the Olds History Center could shed some light on this car.

> Sparky's hot steering wheel (or the Toro's backup heater)
A whole new chapter in that car cook book (forgot the name)! '65? to '70
Deltas w/dual exhaust used a heat shield to keep heat away from the
steering shaft's fiber/rubber disc. It might be possible to fashion
something similar.

> Car's not at Lansing
Yeah, no Monza-esk Starfires. There was a medium green '71-'73 or so
clam shell Custom Cruiser on Washington, I beleive. Neat seeing wagons,
4 doors, a couple of not quite show cars, at the Centennial.

There were two Omega's at the Delta Engine Plant for the Parade to the
Capitol on Wednesday. One had Olds rallye wheels on it - look a lot like
Chevy rallyes (with the radiating ovals), but had Olds caps. Only saw
one after that through the week. There was a really nice green '63
JetFire out in the MM, OO or PP lots. Sort of out of the way a bit. Then
again, I was in the LL lot - anyone see the gold '77 Delta?

I was really happy that I registered the Delta. Great plaque. Only wish
I would have set the alarm and participated in the parade! What a great
time, great to meet many people from the list! Spent too much time and
maybe money at the swap meet. Passed 199,000 miles on the way home,
17-18 MPG for the whole trip.

Memorable events include (1) Mark Prince's HEI 101 outside the Holiday
Inn, (2) greeting a fellow list member wearing a B-man shirt, and not
realizing it was Chris Witt (whom I've visited more than once) - dooh!,
(3) parade burnouts in front of the Lansing Center, (4) all the cars on
the bridge, (5) putting faces to names at the Mail List gathering, (6)
many more that I forget right now.

Looking forward to doing something similar in five years, and looking
forward to attending shows this fall. I've got to make the Homecoming
and Nationals in '98!

There's my $1.50!
- --
David Brown     Mailto:dbrown@mailhub.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 3.0 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 97 19:27:05 -0500
From: "padavano.joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: DBL scoop air cleaner

Greg Prett wrote:

FWIW. I've seen a picture of an engine with an aircleaner like that
before.  It was in a petersen book I have somewhere.  The picture was of
an olds engine mounted on a stand with the OAI ducting and scoops in
place.  The scoops just kinda hung there.  Anywayz, the caption said it
was a 442 engine with cold air ducts in place.

     Nope, sorry.  The closest thing would be the 68-69 O.A.I. air cleaner,
     but that one has straight ends on the snorkels (to allow the hoses to
     fit over ends) and actuators on the snorkels for the hot air flappers.
     The Sugarman mystery air cleaner looks like the ones used on mid-60s
     GM musclecars from other divisions.  It is _not_ an Olds unit.  I had
     a similar unit, which I grabbed off of a GTO in a wrecking yard, on my
     first 68 442.


     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com

     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 27 Aug 1997 07:25:06 -0000
From: "Lloyd W. Culp" <bculp@HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Re: Cars Not Seen at Lansing

 Andrtew,

I wish that my JetFire had been there.  A "burn-out" corm one of those may
have made the list too.  Can't you just see those little 13" tires moving as
that turbo comes on at about 2500 rpm's?  I'm just going to have to get to
that national meet in Illinois.  My business partners have gotten all of the
favors that they are due for a while.

I understand that there may have been 2 or more other JetFires there.  I
would be interested in a description of them including color, options, &
condition.  Most of these were retrofitted w/4-barrel carbs.  I am one of
the few stupid ones who was willing to battle the technical problems of
restoring one.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama




>Did you see any Jetfires?  I never saw one, and at least expected one to be
>in the parade.  Bill Culp, I blame you for the fact that I did not see a
>Jetfire this year!  You owe us one next year!  ;-)
>
>I admit that I didn't make it to the lot where the early 60's cars would
>have been on display.  Were there Jetfire's there?
>
>--
>Drew

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª822
********************************
