
oldsmobile-digest    Wednesday, September 24 1997    Volume 01 : Number 866



Re: 455 heads....again.....
Re: 455 heads....again.....
(fwd) FS: Factory Oldsmobile Shop Manuals
Re: Eastwood stuff
Re: Fubar
Re: rebuilding olds 403
Intrigued???
Re: Cutlass Brake Upgrades
Burn your own chips?
Re: Olds for sale and Free Olds
Looking for a camshaft
Re: INTERIOR: Rear Seat clock in 72 98
Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455
Re: American?
Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455
Posi Identification
Re: Fubar
Re: 67' 442 model from Lindberg
Re: New on list with questions
69 4-4-2 Carb problems
Haunted Delta
Re: American?
Re: Fuel Requirements
Re: Fast-ratio steering box
RE: American?
Model Cars
Model Cars #2
OAI hood mfg'g
Re: 455 heads....again.....
included pix?
Re: Fubar
[Fwd: Another 455 Head Question.]
71 Cutlass Interior Needed
Re: 67' AM/FM radio
Re: American?
4-spd pieces
surging Vista
Re: 2 part on Dynamic 88
Re: Fubar
Re: Looking for a camshaft
UNBOUNCE: Model Cars
UNBOUNCE: 71 Cutlass Interior Needed
Re: 72 stripe colors
Re: Fubar
425 vs 455
425 vs 455
68 big car gas tank
Re: Fubar
Re: American?
Re: Haunted Delta (long)
Included pix-2
Re: Fubar
bothersome H heads
Re: 455 heads....again.....

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:41:13 -0400 (EDT)
From: CRuper1@aol.com
Subject: Re: 455 heads....again.....

In a message dated 97-09-23 10:38:06 EDT, you write:

<< 
 
 Sorry about that guys.....something must have screwed up....
 
 
 Anyway I was wondering if the heads off of a 1971 Delta 88 455, with the
 letter "H" cast on the side were any good........or if I should start
 looking for a set of heads??????
 
 thanks.....Paul
 
 
  >>

Gee, uhhh, those heads are crap, but I'll tell ya what...   I'll give ya a
few bucks (say $50.00 for the pair), and you can apply that towards a new set
of heads.....  Just remember, I've got first dibs on them...

Chris Ruper

(<grinning immensely> large amounts of sarcasm included free)







BTW, good (rare) heads.....  (ok guys, what was that, "H" is a marine
application...?)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:43:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: CRuper1@aol.com
Subject: Re: 455 heads....again.....

In a message dated 97-09-23 10:38:06 EDT, you write:

<< 
 
 Sorry about that guys.....something must have screwed up....
 
 
 Anyway I was wondering if the heads off of a 1971 Delta 88 455, with the
 letter "H" cast on the side were any good........or if I should start
 looking for a set of heads??????
 
 thanks.....Paul
 
 
  >>

Gee, uhhh, those heads are crap, but I'll tell ya what...   I'll give ya a
few bucks (say $50.00 for the pair), and you can apply that towards a new set
of heads.....  Just remember, I've got first dibs on them...

Chris Ruper

(<grinning immensely> large amounts of sarcasm included free)







BTW, good (rare) heads.....  (ok guys, what was that, "H" is a marine
application...?)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 17:19:36 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: (fwd) FS: Factory Oldsmobile Shop Manuals

Saw this on one of the newsgroups, looks interesting, know nothing about 
the sender, etc., reply to him directly...

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Newgroups: rec.autos.antique
From: komet@primenet.com (SWMB)

FOR SALE:

Oldsmobile factory published shop/repair/service manuals.
1940 to 1990, including ALL the Muscle Car years.

These are not reprints or Chiltons.	

E-mail with your specific needs.

komet@primenet.com

- --
Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 14:03:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: Markintime@aol.com
Subject: Re: Eastwood stuff

Hey David,
I would definitely be interested in the paint you described in your post.
Let me know if you plan to pursue this venture.
TIA
Mark Berube
Loganville, GA.
67' 442

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 16:11:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: AllNiteLng@aol.com
Subject: Re: Fubar

       Fubar originated in Hollywood as far as I can tell. It was one of the
lines Kurt Russel said to Sly Stallone in the movie "Tango and Cash"

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 17:05:02 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mikeytvb@aol.com
Subject: Re: rebuilding olds 403

In a message dated 97-09-23 13:29:18 EDT, you write:

> Sorry but I am very confused by the times. A Buick GN with a 4.1 V6 
>  thats been modified to less than 800 hp, Level10 200R4, or TH400,
>  Art Carr 9" convertor (about 3-3.5K stall) 29" slicks w/3.73 rear, etc,
>  will run low nines all day at less than 7000 rpm. Actually I believe
>  that about 700 hp will bring it solidly into the nine at 3400 pounds.
>  Why does the 403 have to work so hard to do nines???TIM
a buick gn has a turbocharger on it giving it tons of top-end.  an olds 403
is a slow turning, torquey motor.

mikey tvb@aol.com
73 cutlass w/403

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:36:35 -0600
From: Charley Buehner <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Intrigued???

Mee too....   Currently staring at a '98 Intrigue GL.  Really ~really~
nice car!  Putting a phone in it.  Rear wing, Bose in dash cassette/cd
with 12 disc changer and amp in trunk...  No supercharger :(  The way
the guy talked, it wasn't an option :o  Too bad.  16" rims, magnasteer,
sunroof...  Oooooh.  Just wanted to share that with you all...  They're
still capable of creating sweet rides.  All this for $24K, too.  If the
dealer would have bothered to ~wash~ it before bringing it over here,
I'd take some pics for ya all, too.  But...  Oh, yeah, ~speedo~ goes to
140!  (I'm sure the gov. cuts it off ~long~ before that, but it looks
really cool)  


             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
             Box 524               | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Sidney, Montana 59270 | http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
	     "TRBO LVR" (Maybe???:)| '83 Turbo Regal
               	     Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 12:47:35 -0700
From: Erik Nowacki <enowacki@titan.com>
Subject: Re: Cutlass Brake Upgrades

The Vista Cruisers have larger rear drums.  I believe they are 1/4 or 1/2
inch wider than the regular (lesser?) Cuttlai.  I don't know how much of
the brakin system you would have to swap out, but if necessary, the entire
rear end should fit your car without any problems.

I agree with your assessment of German brakes.  My other car is a F*rd
powered Mercedes 280SE with 4 wheel discs AND the hubs of the rear rotors
acts as a drum parking brake.  The car therefore has 6 brakes, 4 discs and
2 drums.  It really stops on a dime, or a pfennig.

Erik Nowacki
San Diego
72 Vista Cruiser


At 10:58 PM 9/20/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Has anybody installed bigger rear drums onto an A body rear end?
>Have seen this done with other makes (European) to improve braking at
>moderate cost.
>Are 98 or 88 brake drums bigger? Some other GM application that may bolt on?
>How about front discs--Is there a bigger set that could be installed
>cleanly without major mods?
>I love my '69 442 Conv, but I come from a long string of BMW's and Benzes and
>the Germans do know brakes. The General doesn't do as well. But I'm hoping to
>find some good tricks out there...
>
>Coupe King@aol.com
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 13:23:52 -0600
From: Charley Buehner <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Burn your own chips?

I haven't been following this stuff much lately.  What's
involved/required for burning your own PROMs?  I'd imagine it'd be a
computer based program with an interface for the chip, but I've never
seen any setups advertised.  Four years ago, I would have ~killed~ for
such technology, but never found ~anyone~ interested in doing
true-custom chips.  Are you using some equipment designed by NASA for GM
use, or is this thing readily available now?  Just curious more than
anything, but it is something I'd always wanted to play with...


>  I am still playing with code, but it does help.
>       I would recommend Hypertech Thermo-master chip and not street runner.
>  Street runner chip does not increase timing enough.  Best bet is to get a
> custom chip or make your own (cheaper and better).  
    
             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
             Box 524               | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Sidney, Montana 59270 | http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
	     "TRBO LVR" (Maybe???:)| '83 Turbo Regal
               	     Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 12:39:46 -0600
From: Charley Buehner <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Re: Olds for sale and Free Olds

Dustin Cross wrote:
> 
> Chuck, they said to a home that will put it back together!! 

Umm, didn't say anything about ~when~....  :)

>  besides arent you running out of room?
Has ~that~ ever been a concern?  :)  Ok, Ok, Dustin ~you~ can have it! 
:)

    
             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
             Box 524               | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Sidney, Montana 59270 | http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
	     "TRBO LVR" (Maybe???:)| '83 Turbo Regal
               	     Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 14:50:40 -0700
From: Gary Manton <sasgmm@unx.sas.com>
Subject: Looking for a camshaft

Somehow I am feeling shafted, I have been searching for a non-reground
camshaft for a '64 394 engine.  Does anyone know where to turn?

G
          \\|//
          (o o)                     
~~~~~~oOOo~(_)~oOOo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Gary M. Manton					SAS Institute
Business Solutions Division			Phoenix, AZ  85012
(602) 265-1616 ext. 230 - voice		        (602) 265-8585 - fax

"In business as in life, your chances of being run over are doubled
if you stay in the middle of the road"
~~~~~~oooo~~~~~oooo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 16:46:05 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: INTERIOR: Rear Seat clock in 72 98

> As some may know, I've purchased me a big 72 Olds 98.  When 
> I bought it it had (still does) a clock in the rear seat.

Really! _Where_ in the back seat is it?

> I was told by the seller that this was very rare.

I'll say.

> The clock is not the mid-70's Odomoter style, it's more like a normal 
> clock, with minute hour seconds hands...  Of course, they share some 
> similarities to my other clocks in that they DON'T work.

Is the fuse for interior lights and/or cigar lighter working?
(If two, the one for the cigar lighter is probably the one of 
interest.) If not, just pop a new one in and see if the clock 
comes to life. If it doesn't, take the clock out carefully and 
fog a little WD-40 in the back through the backlighting holes.
Often that's all it takes.

> I've always liked having a nonfunctioning clock in these cars 
> though, since in such a beautiful car, Time Really Does Stand
> STILL!!!!!

(the audience groans; several members look for objects to throw :-)

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 06:56:03 -0000
From: "Rod Beydler" <rodsmobile@mscomm.com>
Subject: Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455

The 425 and 455 use the same block

- ----------
> From: Josh J. Haviland <ea154@cleveland.Freenet.Edu>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455
> Date: Tuesday, September 23, 1997 10:44 AM
> 
> how would a 455 be turned into a 425? i can see a crank swap, but didn't
> they have differen't bore's?
> 
> 
> Reply to message from BobH592058@aol.com of Mon, 22 Sep
> >
> >Gee, I'm reduced to scanning the digests and can't participate in a
timely
> >manner but this discussion (again) gets me interested to the point of
> >_making_ some time.
> >
> >As most of you know I've been runnin' and racin' and funnin' Olds
engines
> >since the early 60's.  IMHO the short stroke Olds big blocks are the
best
> >engines Olds made.  It's a shame they were only made for 3 model years. 
If
> >they had been used in more model years they would be more appreciated
and
> >understood. And more important, maybe there would be more aftermarket
parts
> >for 'em!
> >
> >There have been some pretty good reasons given for the short stroke
engines
> >being at least as good as the larger displacement long stroke 400/455's.
 For
> >one thing the rod used on the earlier big blocks is longer which
positively
> >affects torque production.  There is darn little difference in torque
between
> >'em.
> >
> >According to the published figures in my Olds Parts & Accessories
> >Illustrations books dated September 1973, the following
torque/horsepower
> >ratings are given for 425 vs 455.  
> >
> >A '67 Toro 425 had 480 lbs.ft.of torque and 385 horses.
> >A '68 Toro 455 had 510 lbs.ft of torque and 400 horses.
> >
> >That's a 6% gain is torque and 4% gain in horsepower from a 7% increase
in
> >displacement.  But, as we know, the factory played with these numbers.
> >
> >Comparing the 67 400 with the 68:
> >
> >The '67 400 cid 442 motor had 440 lbs.ft at 350 horses.
> >The '68 400 cid 442 motor had 435 lbs.ft at 350 horses.
> >
> >I don't believe the last torque numbers for the simple reason that the
> >'68-'69 motors were dogs at the track.  Great street motors but they
just
> >don't rev like the short stroke motors.  Anyway, those are the "factory"
> >numbers. On the track the '68-'69's weren't as good.  And that's with
the
> >same displacement.  So what gives?
> >
> >The point I'd like to make is that the "there's no replacement for
> >displacement rule" is generally true but isn't true in all cases.  
> >
> >For instance, I hope it isn't a violation of Olds-list-etiquette to
mention a
> >sister division by using the full name. At least it isn't a Shivy
comparison.
> > 
> >
> >Anybody ever hear of the Buick '70 GS 455 cid Stage I and II cars? 
Those
> >monsters weighed _hundreds_ of pounds more than any other muscle car of
the
> >era and you know what - they blew my doors off and just about everyone
elses,
> >including street hemis. They made gobs more torque _and_ horsepower than
> >either Olds or Pontiac 455's.  So how can that be with the same 455 cid?
> >
> >Because those engines use short stroke cranks, large bores and longer
rods -
> >just like the comparison between the short stroke 400/425 and long
stroke
> >400/455.
> >
> >I would sorely love to build a snorting 425.  Bore it 0.125" over for a
total
> >displacement of 445 ci.  I'll still spot the 455 crowd the 10 cubic
inches.
> > The 445 will make more torque than a 455, be freer revving and
therefore
> >make more HP too.
> >
> >To tell a muscle car wars story, in '68-69 a local Olds dealer in San
> >Antonio, TX ran a stripped down '68 Hurst Olds at the local track.  It
was
> >professionally blueprinted, balanced, hotter cam (AHRA rules), Holley
carb,
> >Hooker headers, etc.  It had the best stuff available at the time.
> >
> >My '67 was running a rescued-from-the-warranty-pile totally stock 425
(not
> >even a Toro motor), stock "C" heads, stock intake, stock Q-Jet carb,
W-30
> >cam, smaller diameter Hooker headers, etc. Spotting a pro built car 30
cubes
> >that short stroke Olds big block still did pretty good.  That car never
beat
> >mine.  Even with different drivers (the dealer's driver-mechanic was
> >summarily pissed!) I never lost. I'm talking about a period of over two
> >years.  The dealer H/O routinely won class and lost to me in elinimator.
 I
> >loved it!
> >
> >I strongly suspect there are darn few people on this list who have
actually
> >built a 425 or raced one either. (Except Chris Witt of course.)  
> >
> >Don't knock 'em 'less your speaking from experience. My experience is
they
> >scream. Add the forged crank and, theoretically, less demand on the
oiling
> >system (shorter stroke) it's a more durable combination as well.  Like I
> >said, I'd sorely love to build a 445 short stroke big block.  I have
three
> >crank/rod sets, all I need is a 425/455 block (either will do) and
custom
> >pistons.  Oh yeah - the money too. :-))
> >
> >My .02 cents worth of bench racin'.
> >
> >Bob Handren (AKA Major Doma)       
> >OCA/OCF# 7728
> >'67 W-30 Modified     '70 SX Convertible
> >Oviedo, FL
> >
> >Handren Associates, Inc.
> >FDA Medical Device Regulatory Affairs
> >Laser/Optical Radiation Safety
> >(407)365-6385
> >
> >
> >
> >
> 
> --
> __/////////\  Budgreen, ea154@cleveland.freenet.edu  /\\\\\\\\\__        
    
>   \\\\\\\\\/      Josh......                         \/////////
> =================================================================

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 04:36:09 -0400
From: mrhell@m1.sprynet.com
Subject: Re: American?

>> And as far as content goes, NO american make is 100% US parts, or even
>> 100% north American.  Not even the highly vaunted 'All American' Saturn
>> can claim this.  Or even (gulp!)  Harley-Davidson.

and now for another opinion, (like one more is needed)...I think the above 
is a good closing statement on this old, boring, non-olds issue that has 
long since boiled over.  I'm a "non-related topic" recovering addict 
myself.  enough said already!  :)

RC Hellebuyck

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 14:52:26 -0400 (EDT)
From: BobH592058@aol.com
Subject: Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455

<< ea154@cleveland.Freenet.Edu (Josh J. Haviland)
Subject: Re: 400 vs. 425 vs. 455

how would a 455 be turned into a 425? i can see a crank swap, but didn't
they have differen't bore's?>>

Nope, same bore, different piston, rod, crank, flywheel and dampener.

Bob Handren (AKA Major Doma)       
OCA/OCF# 7728
'67 W-30 Modified     '70 SX Convertible
Oviedo, FL

Handren Associates, Inc.
FDA Medical Device Regulatory Affairs
Laser/Optical Radiation Safety
(407)365-6385

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 23 Jul 1997 18:14:28 -0400
From: Ray Moriarty <rmoriarty@blairinc.com>
Subject: Posi Identification

Hi All,

I have a question about identifying of differentials with posi. I was under
the impression that a differential with posi could be easily identified by
jacking both rear wheels off the ground and spinning one of them. If the
other wheel spins in the same direction then the differential is posi. If
the other wheel spins in the opposite direction the differential is _not_
posi. However, I have encountered a couple of situations which cause me to
doubt the validity of this test. The first time I tried the test was when I
bought my Bronco (hey, I've got to haul Olds parts with something!). The
wheels spun in opposite directions. Several months later, while I was
preparing to do some brake work, I tried it again and the wheels spun in
the same direction. I chalked the discrepancy up to poor memory and too
much brakleen. :) Even though my truck doesn't have enough horsepower to do
the twin line test, I now know the differential is not open. I *tested* it
in a sizable mud puddle. I encountered the same discrepancy again recently
while looking at a club member's car while it was up on a lift. The first
time I spun a rear wheel the free wheel spun in the opposite direction. A
while later, after asking the owner if the car had posi, I tried again and
the wheels spun in the same direction. I have no idea what changed, but he
was working on the drive train. So, there appears to be a situation where a
differential with posi will let the wheels spin opposite. Can someone
please tell me how to properly test for posi without removing the
differential cover or lighting the tires up? Additionally, are Trac Loc and
Limited Slip different than posi,or are they different manufacturer's names
for posi?

TIA
Ray
70 442 Conv.
70 Cutlass Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 18:30:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: The Sugarmans <sugarman@berkshire.net>
Subject: Re: Fubar

On Tue, 23 Sep 1997 AllNiteLng@aol.com wrote:

>        Fubar originated in Hollywood as far as I can tell. It was one of the
> lines Kurt Russel said to Sly Stallone in the movie "Tango and Cash"
> 

Fubar is old military jargon, along with SWAG, KISS, and SOL.

Don Sugarman


sugarman@berkshire.net

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 19:18:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: BigEJ@aol.com
Subject: Re: 67' 442 model from Lindberg

At 08:54 PM 9/22/97 -0400, you wrote:
>>Can someone that has one (or two) of these please provide the Lindberg
>>p/n?
>>-- 
>>Kurt Heinrich  (mailto:old442@erols.com)
>>71 442         (see it at http://www.442.com/heinrich.html)
>>

>Kurt

>        THe kit number is Lindberg #72171. 

>Jim Chermack

Hi Guys and Gals

I just checked with  a local hobby shop about the 442 model and the story
goes:  Lindberg released the model and there is a dimensional error so the
model has been recalled.  It is to be re-released in November.  Lindberg had
a 1961 Ch*vy model that was incorrect and they took a lot of flack before
recalling it, so they seem to be very sensitive with their new releases.
  The story continues, that some were shipped to distributors and are
available,  however not many slipped thru.  Might just add to the
collectability of the ones out now??  It'd be interesting to know what the
imperfection is?  Have you guys that have one looked it over carefully?
  What do you think??

Elephant Engine Ernie

67-442
50- 88

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 19:28:42 -0400
From: Kurt Heinrich <old442@erols.com>
Subject: Re: New on list with questions

David Brown (the Olds FAQ compiler) wrote:
> 
> HEI, solid state regulator . . .
> 
> If you can wait a couple of weeks, I'll have the next release of the FAQ
> available. With tons of HEI and alternator/regulator conversion
> information.

Dave,
Your a good man!

- -- 
Kurt Heinrich  (mailto:old442@erols.com)
71 442         (see it at http://www.442.com/heinrich.html)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 19:21:00 EDT
From: jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
Subject: 69 4-4-2 Carb problems

I had the 4-4-2 out recently, and took it over to my brothers house. 
 Over-all it has been running pretty good with the exception of lack of 
performance.  It has been really sluggish off the line, and performs about 
like my fathers 350 4bbl ('69 Cutlass Supreme).  Now I have only had the car 
for about 5 months, and only recently gotten it cruise ready.  It has had a 
full tune-up including, new plugs, plug wires, points, Distr. cap, oil 
change, and I cleaned the carb.  This is my second '69 4-4-2, but the first 
one had a 455 with all high performance components including, Edlebrock 
Torker intake, 780 Holley, forged pistons, nitrous power shot kit, and much 
more.  Now, I am not expecting this one to perform like my first '69 4-4-2, 
but I would expect the 400 to put out a heck of a lot more h.p. than it is. 
 I also noticed that the secondaries don't seem to open when I manually 
advance the throttle.  To make matters worse, when I was coming home from my 
brothers house, I was on the highway in the fast lane, and all of a sudden, 
it just started losing power fast.  I barely got it off the highway.  I 
popped the hood, and observed the following:
1) the engine is running REAL hot - so hot, the air cleaner was not 
touchable for any length of time.
2) I could get it started, but as soon as I put it into gear it would have 
no power, and die immediately.
3) I found a bad vacuum hose and replaced it, but it didn't seem to do any 
good.
4) I have a clear in-line gas filter, and I had remembered from my old 4-4-2 
that sometimes when the filter would get clogged, it would really bog the 
engine down, so I removed the filter altogether.  This was what seemed to 
work.  I got it started, and it stayed running long enough to get it home 
(about 10 miles).  I really don't think the filter could cause all of those 
problems, besides, even though I made it home, it still ran like poop all 
the way.

I haven't done anything to it since, but am about to check it out.  I plan 
to check the timing too, but thought I would ask you folks what you thought 
it might be.  I'm already banking on having the carb rebuilt, because I know 
it hasn't been done in a long time (if ever).

So whatayathink?




Jeff Zeilmann
  ^
/ | \
| | |
|/|\|
\ | /
  |
SMTP:jzeilman@stlouis.cp.lucent.com
'68 Cutlass Supreme
'69 Cutlass S Convertible
'69 4-4-2
 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:45:58 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Haunted Delta

Here's one for you to ponder...

Yesterday morning I went to start up the Delta. Interior lights came on
when I opened the door, but when I turned the key I got a couple of *very*
slow cranks, then nothing. Opened the door, no lights. Battery appeared
dead as the proverbial doornail. Fiddled with the cables, interestingly
the battery was warm. Went inside and stewed for a bit, thinking I had
maybe an internal short in the battery because of the warmth. Also figured
maybe I had probably killed it on Sunday while changing bulbs, leaving the
doors and trunk open, etc. After work I went to try it again, same thing.
Checked the battery with a voltmeter, showed 7.5 volts, figured it was
toasted. 

Pulled it out (damn metric bolts!), went and got a new battery. Brian
Smith came by to watch me install it. He got a chuckle out of the little
droplets of acid that dribbled on to my hand when I had to tilt the thing
to get it to fit (he usually is a nice guy). Hooked up the positive cable,
then started to attach the negative. First turn of the bolt, I heard a
little crackle? Saw no sparks, figured maybe it was dirt on the bolt
threads. Second turn, definitely a crackle. We looked at each other...
"hmmmm, must be a load somewhere". Third turn, the engine starts
cranking!! Only problem was, neither of us was in the drivers seat and
there were no keys in the ignition. Man, you never saw me move so quick to
undo that bolt. Brian jumped, the trouble light went flying, lemme tell
you, our hearts were pumping. "Never saw *that* before" we said in unison. 

We pondered for a bit. All we could think to do was to jiggle the ignition
key to the start position a few times then try it again. I got elected to
tighten the bolt again, and did so gingerly. This time it didn't crank on
us, but the engine didn't want to start right away when we turned the key.
I think it was just flooded though, and after a bit it started just fine. 

Needless to say, we were concerned. Tonight I tried it again and 
everything seems fine. Now I'm baffled. What would have caused the thing 
to crank on it's own? Sticky ignition switch? Could a starter solenoid 
subjected to low voltage somehow stick closed? Is this car haunted?

Any assists towards figuring why this happened would be appreciated. 
My confidence right now is a little shaky...

PS: BTW, the dash lights look great though.... :) 

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:55:55 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: American?

There are no reliable answers to the question of reliability, since there 
are always exceptions. On average things like frequency-of-repair surveys 
can give you a good indication but that doesn't mean you'll automatically 
be immune from problems. 

Case in point: back in '85 I bought a new T*y*ta MR2 (back in the days
when I had money). Car got about 40,000 miles in 4 years, always dealer
maintained. Problems abounded, including all sorts of rattles, the
passenger window fell into the door within the first week, factory stereo
needed replacing 3 times, rust problems, persistent exhaust leaks, plus 2
major mechanical problems, both involving the cooling system. That was a
sweet little engine, but I figured all the overheating problems couldn't
be doing much good for it so I got rid of it. So much for the much 
ballyhooed Japanese reliability. 

Funny, back then I never even looked at an Olds. Now I wish maybe I had.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 14:29:41 -0500
From: theogns <theogns@avana.net>
Subject: Re: Fuel Requirements

> Well, I remember watching a program a couple of years ago about lead
> tailpipe emissions. Seems the small kids living within a couple of miles
> of LA expressways had lead poisoning. The lead paint was gone, so that
> wasn't the source. Turns out the kids were getting it from the soil! The
> kids were picking it up from the dirt they got on their hands and toys.
> Of course their poor hygiene (eating the dirt) caused part of the
> problem. 2-3 inches of dirt were removed from around the house, and the
> kids improved.
> 
> I think leaded gas fallout caused what was thought to be primarily a
> lead paint problem. I'm glad both are gone.

If they did a major clean up of leaded paint anything short of a full
blown level three toxic waste operation there would be paint dust
settleing in the area laden with lead. I'm not saying the exhaust
emmisions had nothing to do with the lead levels but I'm really biased.
I'll admit that. However, I'm also a realist. 

Danny

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:05:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: CarrDuff@aol.com
Subject: Re: Fast-ratio steering box

In a message dated 97-09-22 20:10:59 EDT, you write:

 Well, obviously you haven't drivea mid 60's Cutlass which had almost double
 the number of turns your 70 had!  

Bob Handren (AKA Major Doma) >>   

Bob,

  That was my point, only backwards. Old vs. older vs. new, they all handled
different.  I have not driven a mid 60's cutlass to compare againt my 70 or
71 cutlass.

Steve Dietrich
  S/E PA
    71 442 W30 Conv.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:14:04 -0400
From: Jason Adcock <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: RE: American?

- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BCC85D.3E2ECEE0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Greg...

...a Toyota...

...nah!

 Jason Adcock
 jadcock@vt.edu
 http://www.erols.com/adcockjk/jason

- -----Original Message-----
From:	Greg Beaulieu [SMTP:ab348@chebucto.ns.ca]
Sent:	Tuesday, September 23, 1997 7:56 PM
To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject:	Re: American?

There are no reliable answers to the question of reliability, since there 
are always exceptions. On average things like frequency-of-repair surveys 
can give you a good indication but that doesn't mean you'll automatically 
be immune from problems. 

Case in point: back in '85 I bought a new T*y*ta MR2 (back in the days
when I had money). Car got about 40,000 miles in 4 years, always dealer
maintained. Problems abounded, including all sorts of rattles, the
passenger window fell into the door within the first week, factory stereo
needed replacing 3 times, rust problems, persistent exhaust leaks, plus 2
major mechanical problems, both involving the cooling system. That was a
sweet little engine, but I figured all the overheating problems couldn't
be doing much good for it so I got rid of it. So much for the much 
ballyhooed Japanese reliability. 

Funny, back then I never even looked at an Olds. Now I wish maybe I had.

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada


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- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BCC85D.3E2ECEE0--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:15:33 -0700
From: LARRY POLESNAK <ham@fan.net>
Subject: Model Cars

Here are some model cars I found when I was looking for a 1962 Starfire.
53 Fiesta
58 98 Conv.
68 Toro
70 442 Indy Pace
70 Cutless  S 
They have an Olds keychain also.     1-800-EWA-4454
"http://www.ewacars.com/modbig.html"
 Hope this is interesting to some of you.....Larry Polesnak
       6    2    S    T     A    R    F     I    R    E

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:24:22 -0700
From: LARRY POLESNAK <ham@fan.net>
Subject: Model Cars #2

Here are some more..
        "http://www.442.com/toys.html"
                                            Larry

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 20:51:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: OAI hood mfg'g

On the OAI hood repro idea, it occurs to me that a couple years ago, when MSU
was building a Hybrid Electric Vehicle... they made the body out of a
carbon-fiber composite much like fiberglass, but  stronger. Well, that'd be a
great alternative to 'glass, but not the point of this missive. Point is... the
body shape was carved, life-size, out of a molding material by a CNC machine
at... DEMMER!

So, now  all we need is an original hood to cnc the specs to blueprint, a
student with time to spare to rub elbows w/ the big-wigs at Demmer, etc. [what
a resume' builder!], and an overseer to coordinate all the orders, supplies,
etc.

The mold for that HEV body, btw, got sold at MSU salvage about a year after
its 1 & only use. Cute little car body, hope it gets used again. Went for
cheap, too, like $300 or so?

- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 00:55:08 GMT
From: Robert Barry <RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu>
Subject: Re: 455 heads....again.....

>Anyway I was wondering if the heads off of a 1971 Delta 88 455, with the
>letter "H" cast on the side were any good........or if I should start
>looking for a set of heads??????

"H" on a '71? The only car that was *supposed* to get the "H" heads was the
'71 W-30 442 motor! If in fact you have a pair of matching "H" heads on that
engine ("G" heads were standard), you might want to check the stamped ID
number on the block, and the details of the engine (does it have an aluminum
intake? What's the carb #? distributor #?). If you've got a 442 number on
that block, then it's just possible that someone replaced the original
engine with a "slightly" more powerful one.  Or, they may have replaced one
or more of the heads at some point (are both sides "H" heads?), and the "H"
heads were what was available. Does the car have a rather "lumpy" idle?

Oh, and yeah, those "H" heads are good heads, though probably worth more to
a restorer than to you (big-valve "C" heads with a mild port job would serve
you just as well in your Delta).
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:20:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: included pix?

I hear some geek posted a message to the list with about 1000 lines of BS that
looks like an included picture. Which got me a 4500 line digest for ONE DAY.
Wonder why my mailbox is full...?

I hear these geeks come a dime a dozen.

I'm lookin' fer the feller supplyin' the dimes.
- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:28:50 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: Fubar

AllNiteLng@aol.com wrote:
> 
>        Fubar originated in Hollywood as far as I can tell. It was one of the
> lines Kurt Russel said to Sly Stallone in the movie "Tango and Cash"

Yeah, is means

F **ked
U p
B eyond
A ll
R ecognition / Repair

- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoftİ Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:38:08 -0400
From: Joe Artwell <tjf26@gte.net>
Subject: [Fwd: Another 455 Head Question.]

Message-ID: <34284779.5BC2@gte.net>
Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 18:49:30 -0400
From: Joe Artwell <tjf26@gte.net>
Reply-To: tjf26@gte.net
Organization: The Artwells
X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-KIT  (Win95; I)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: Another 455 Head Question.
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Are Ka heads good on a 1970 455 motor. That's Capital "K", Lower case
"a". Bryceman's page says they are W-30/Marine/Toro heads. Any
comments/Facts. 
                  Joe

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 03 Jul 1997 06:26:29 -0500
From: Greg Skonberg <skonberg.g@mail.lchs.lake.k12.il.us>
Subject: 71 Cutlass Interior Needed

I'm looking for two black bucket seats, front and rear black door panels, a
black headliner, black rear dash and black lower front dash.  I guess I'm
looking for as much black interior excluding the front dash pad for a 71
cutlass S.  Any info on interchangeable parts between years would be helpful
also.  I am also looking for a rear bumper in good shape for the same car.

Thanks in advance!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:42:58 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 67' AM/FM radio

Markintime@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi Everyone,
> Was AM/FM radio available in the 67 Cutlass/442?
> I've seen ads for 67 AM radios but don't recall having seen AM/FM.

Option U69 was the AM/FM radio, available to F-85, Cutlass, Cutlass
Supreme and Vista-Cruisers.

This was a different option from U58 AM/FM Stereophonic Radio and U59
AM/FM Signal Seeker Tuning Radio.  These were only available on full
sizers and Toronados.  I don't know if a full size radio will fit in an
A-body.  I know the Toronado radios won't fit, because the faces are
slanted.

> While we're on the subject, what about 8 tracks that year?

Yes, '67 was the first year for the U57 Stereo Tape Player, but it too
was only available in full sizers and Toronados.

Paul  
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:46:22 -0400
From: Dave Ward <ward@ptbo.igs.net>
Subject: Re: American?

> GM owns Opel, of course.  They also own 100% of Saab, AND a chunk of
> Toyota, though I think their percentage of ownership has dropped in
> recent years.  Then there's Isuzu.

GM owned about 80% of Lotus in the past, but I'm not sure if the still
do.  Yes, GM owns Saab, but they also own Geo and Saturn, too...
 
> Chrysler no longer has a majority ownership in Mitsubishi, but it's >still a sizeable percentage. 

I heard that Chrysler was part owner of Lamborghini, too!  Honest!  It
said so in a 1992 issue...it's worth reading. 

 
S. Dave Ward

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:54:17 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: 4-spd pieces

What is broken on your 4 spd?  I have a 69 S 350 4-bbl 4-spd that fourth
gear syncro is out on and have been looking for the appropriate pieces
reasonably priced (is this really possible?).  If you junk out the
trans, would these parts be good?  Just curious about that and if the
trans is interchangeable with mine.  If you don't make the switch, sorry
to bother you.  Either way good luck with yours.

Don Sowers
================
Folks, National Automotive Lines carries Muncie parts.
 Said it before, I say it again.

GET AN ANAL CATALOG. Just call 'em up & request it. IT's that easy. If you have
ever tooled on ANY car, and intend to in the future, get this catalog.

- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:56:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: surging Vista

The newest addition has a very subtle 'surge' when driving.  Its basically
there all the time.  This is a 330-4bbl.  Would that possibly be carb or
fuel pump?  Its rythmic - starts and stops evenly.  Car has 180,000 & most
everything looks original (honest).

Any ideas?
=============

Hmmmm... 180K miles, could it be that your plastic timing sprocket teeth are
all gone, and you're using up the metal parts now?
- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:56:54 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 2 part on Dynamic 88

Gary Manton wrote:
 
> 1.  On the rear arm rest on the drivers side is a little black switch, does
> anyone know what it is for?

I think that's supposed to turn on your back seat courtesy lights.  My
'61 Ninety Eight had a switch like that in the back.

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:07:02 -0400
From: Dave Ward <ward@ptbo.igs.net>
Subject: Re: Fubar

Matt Cremean wrote:
> 
> AllNiteLng@aol.com wrote:
> >
>>Fubar originated in Hollywood as far as I can tell. It was one of the
>>lines Kurt Russel said to Sly Stallone in the movie "Tango and Cash".

It's one of my favourite movies...I was thinking of getting 'FUBAR' on
my license plate.  So far it looks like I'll stick with "GOOD2GO", or
maybe "2NABOAT".  A few people call the '78 Delta the "Tuna Boat", and
I'm known as Skipper Dave...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 21:12:36 -0500 (CDT)
From: Paul Brillhart <u17058@uicvm.uic.edu>
Subject: Re: Looking for a camshaft

At 02:50 PM 9/23/97 -0700, you wrote:
>Somehow I am feeling shafted, I have been searching for a non-reground
>camshaft for a '64 394 engine.  Does anyone know where to turn?
>
>G
>          \\|//
>          (o o)
>~~~~~~oOOo~(_)~oOOo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>Gary M. Manton					SAS Institute
>Business Solutions Division			Phoenix, AZ  85012
>(602) 265-1616 ext. 230 - voice		        (602) 265-8585 - fax
>
>"In business as in life, your chances of being run over are doubled
>if you stay in the middle of the toad"
>~~~~~~oooo~~~~~oooo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>
>

  Gary,


  Try Isky Cams.  My uncle had a '63 Tempest with a straight 4(made 3 years
and not a whole hell of a lot of demand for 'em) and got a new, not
reground, cam from them.  It had a lot of dust on it and wasn't in their
catalog, but they went looking for it and charged him around $100-$120 for
it back in the mid eighties.  Naturally, I don't have their number handy.
Sorry, but good luck.


  Paul Brillhart

P.S.  I found my '65 442 in your neighborhood and had it semi-trucked up to
Illinois.  Christmas in Arizona, hicking amoung the Suaro(?sp.), temp. in
the upper eighties.......fantastic. I'll be down your way again in December
with my wife's family. 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:22:29 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: Model Cars

Forwarding... Larry, you want to s*bscribe from this address?

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	LARRY POLESNAK <ham@fan.net>
Subject: Model Cars

Here are some model cars I found when I was looking for a 1962 Starfire.
53 Fiesta
58 98 Conv.
68 Toro
70 442 Indy Pace
70 Cutless  S 
They have an Olds keychain also.     1-800-EWA-4454
"http://www.ewacars.com/modbig.html"
 Hope this is interesting to some of you.....Larry Polesnak
       6    2    S    T     A    R    F     I    R    E

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:24:06 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 71 Cutlass Interior Needed

Don't believe this person is on the list, better reply directly...

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Greg Skonberg <skonberg.g@mail.lchs.lake.k12.il.us>
Subject: 71 Cutlass Interior Needed

I'm looking for two black bucket seats, front and rear black door panels, a
black headliner, black rear dash and black lower front dash.  I guess I'm
looking for as much black interior excluding the front dash pad for a 71
cutlass S.  Any info on interchangeable parts between years would be helpful
also.  I am also looking for a rear bumper in good shape for the same car.

Thanks in advance!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:25:27 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 72 stripe colors

Al Sutton wrote:
> 
> I am repainting the trunk of my 72 W-30 convert. Looking for paint #'s/codes
> etc.. for the "white trim"
> 
> Help appreciated, Al

From the '72 Assembly Manual:

Color: White
Sales Code: A
W Code: 4338
GMAD Code: 11
Inmont: L55WD014
DuPont: 898-AF658

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:43:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: COUPEKING@aol.com
Subject: Re: Fubar

Definitely NOT a Hollywood term. 
Military origin, circa Viet Nam era.

Coupe King

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:44:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: 425 vs 455

Dang, my mailbox musta got filled again, I missed Bob H's 425 vs. 455 info,
glad it was quoted.

The race car I worked on:
Engine 1
'69 Toro 455, BV C heads, simple vavle job, some sorta Summit-esque cam,
Torker? intake, Holley 750 [all together,now, "ooooooooooooh!"] carb, HEI,
prepped TH400. Stock HC pistons, except for that *one* LC unit...
  Timed best at 14.5, about 98 mph

Next motor:
Used, unrebuilt '69 LC 455. Spun bearing right away, never got a good time on
it. Had the above intake setup on it.

Let 'em borrow the Toro parts-car motor:
'66 425 [30 fewer cubes!], 112K miles old, stock lo-rise intake, stock Qjet,
stock cam, BV-B heads. Changed the water pump to match their pulleys. Installed
MSD 6-AL. Ran 13.7 or so right off the bat, easy fiddling with carb got her
down to 13.5.

Next motor:
455 block with 425 innards ==> a 425 with 39-degree cam bank angle & 0.842
lifters. Used old pistons. New rings, bearings, JM-28-29 cam, their same heads,
intake, carb. Got a valve job, still no porting at ALL. Main cap girdles.
Uni-flexplate. Shimmed rocker pedestals. Roller timing set, indexed cam, HV oil
pump, Toro oil pan, restrictors, etc. etc.
  Ran about the same... started out at about 13.5, then got down into the 12's
after a few more fiddles. That carb was holding it back, and the trans too, it
refused to shift on command, revved up against the rev limiter...
- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:46:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: 425 vs 455

how would a 455 be turned into a 425? i can see a crank swap, but didn't
they have differen't bore's?
- -----

Noper, the bore's about the only thing the SAME.

Different lifter dia. else cam bank angle, diff rod-l, diff piston compression
height, diff stroke.
- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:47:31 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: 68 big car gas tank

Kevin O'Brien wrote:
>
> MiLit... wrote:
> > While on the freeway today, my '68 Delmont was assaulted by a piece of
> > retread off the truck in front of me, creating a large gash in the fuel
> > tank.  Does anyone know a good source for a new tank?  The car has a
> > rear (license plate) filler tube.
===================

Well, I can't tell who wrote what first, but I have a fine 68 98 fuel tank,
off a car that spent most of its life in FLA.

- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:00:39 -0400 (EDT)
From: STemple909@aol.com
Subject: Re: Fubar

I hate to disagree on this topic but I have been in the military (US Army/US
Air Force) for the last almost nine years and the term FUBAR has been around
since before I entered the military in 1988. From what I can decipher of it's
history, it appeared sometime before WW I (maybe by a early F*ord
owner?-nothing personal). 

Just my $0.02 worth, 

Shawn L. Temple
72 Cutlass "S" (455/TH-400) "Passes Everything But A Gas Station"
Birmingham, AL

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:01:12 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: American?

Dave Ward wrote:
> Yes, GM owns Saab, but they also own Geo and Saturn, too...

Just a side note here, Geos have always been titled as Chevrolets, at
least in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.  But as of '98, the Geo name
is gone.  The Prizm, Tracker and Metro are now part of the Chevrolet
family.  The Geo name was used to side-step an apparent image problem
Chevrolet was having about 10 years ago...

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 22:05:13 -0500
From: "M&D Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Haunted Delta (long)

Haunted (?) Cutlass
 Two weeks ago I was at a car show in Nashville (Indiana), and a guy came up
to me because he recognized my car. A friend of his had bought this car from
the original owner and did a ground up restoration. Apparently he was a
fanatic about finding "correct" parts. It turned out he committed suicide 3
or 4 years ago and no one knew what happened to the car. This guy told me
that the friend is buried near here and there is a picture of him and the
car on the grave. Learned other details as to what shops were used etc.
Got home and when I turned off the car the lights on the front and rear of
the console stayed lit when the door was closed, and so did the light over
the conv top switch. They all glowed dimly.
Went out after dinner to try and solve the problem. The car wouldn't crank
over. Trying to jump start it wouldn't work.
I removed the bulb from the front console light and the car immediately
cranked and started right away. The conv. switch light and the rear console
light still glowed however.
Tried removing the rear console bulb and now the conv. switch light works
correctly IE; on when the door is open, off when closed.
The  sockets look clean (are new), and the bulbs look fine.
Baffled too!!
What kind of problem does this indicate? (The car isn't called Christine).
TIA

Mick Gillespie, Columbus, Indiana
69 Cutlass S convertible
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

- -----Original Message-----
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>



>
>Here's one for you to ponder...
>
>Yesterday morning I went to start up the Delta. Interior lights came on
>when I opened the door, but when I turned the key I got a couple of *very*
>slow cranks, then nothing. Opened the door, no lights. Battery appeared
>dead as the proverbial doornail. >
>Snip>
>Needless to say, we were concerned. Tonight I tried it again and
>everything seems fine. Now I'm baffled. What would have caused the thing
>to crank on it's own? Sticky ignition switch? Could a starter solenoid
>subjected to low voltage somehow stick closed? Is this car haunted?
>
>Any assists towards figuring why this happened would be appreciated.
>My confidence right now is a little shaky...
>
>PS: BTW, the dash lights look great though.... :)
>
>Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia,
Canada
>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:11:21 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: Included pix-2

Mr Adcock, is this your doing? Seems to follow your postings...

This really must stop. 25 pages of this spew, or more, per digest, really
SUCKS.

To quote:
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ERnidCTTlTTQIEYyQBHQdGc7UjMsYiGqTXlLMDJgLVA3JfZTgRbDdQMgLAB0cEg6Ly8sNS9+K/Ev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- - ------ =_NextPart_000_01BCC819.8659C920--



- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:13:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: DEOVIVERE@aol.com
Subject: Re: Fubar

You wrote
"Fubar originated in Hollywood as far as I can tell. It was one of the
lines Kurt Russel said to Sly Stallone in the movie "Tango and Cash""

Dick Marchinko of Vietnam-era Navy SEAL fame (all colorfully recorded in his
famous autobiography "Rogue Warrior" with a several fictional sequels) has
been using the term FUBAR (flogged up beyond all recognition) for years - as
well as SNAFU (situation normal...) and a couple of others that have
momentarily slipped my mind.  I think this terminology is Nav. talk, perhaps
also Marine and Army, that goes pretty far back.  Maybe to WWII?  It
definitely didn't originate with "Tango and Cash" in the mid-eighties.  

My lexicographical $.02

Tom Simmons
71 SX and (soon) 70 SX

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:14:24 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: bothersome H heads

Anyway I was wondering if the heads off of a 1971 Delta 88 455, with the
letter "H" cast on the side were any good........or if I should start
looking for a set of heads??????

thanks.....Paul
===================
Paul, get rid of those bothersome nasty old H heads off that boat anchor of a
motor. Send them to me with a check for $150 and I'll send you a nice set of
freshly done big valve C heads. Yep, those elusive and fabled C heads can be
yours!
Tell ya what, I have a nice 455 here, all fresh, bv C heads, I'll bring it to
you and trade it for your nasty old motor and, oh, say, $500 cash. 'kay?
- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 23 Sep 1997 23:08:39 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: 455 heads....again.....

> Anyway I was wondering if the heads off of a 1971 Delta 88 455, with the
> letter "H" cast on the side were any good

H heads were standard fare ONLY on the 71 442 W-30, as far as I've ever
known.  Rare as hell, since not many were made anyway. (What, something
like 7900 TOTAL 442's for 71?[don't quote me here])  Pretty good flow
characteristics, but desired mostly by 71 W-30 restorers.  Everyone else
will wait for Edelbrock.....hee hee.

However, they will work fine as frog hair on your application.  They are
definitely worth more than C, E, or G heads.

Dr. Bob Barry wrote about checking the block numbers to determine if it
was a 442 engine?  DOC!!  Seriously, where are these numbers?  I've
never found numbers, or are not aware of numbers on the block to signify
the model of car it came out of.   The only numbers (other than cast-in)
I know of are the ID numbers stamped in the pad under #1 cylinder.  This
will tell you that it's an Olds, year, manufacturing plant of the car,
and the last six numbers of the VIN.  


Good luck on your project,

Mike Rothe

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #866
********************************

