
oldsmobile-digest       Monday, October 6 1997       Volume 01 : Number 888



Re: PLEASE READ AND HELP MEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!
Re: Blinker speed
Replacement Rear View Mirror Glass
Re: W25
Re: W25
Optimum shift points for Drag Racing
Info on the "Seiko,Citizen,Movado 35-75% Off" Spammer
Re: convertible top
OCA Events Calendar
Re: convertible top
Re: W25
Re: steering wheel question
Re: What did you find about the Cutlass?
Re: Dig Camera for sale
rusted out battery pan replacement
Can i replace a gas tank myself??
Re: Rallye 350 a Hurst?
Re: W25
Re: Optimum shift points for Drag Racing
SOLD '67 442
Re: W25
Re: W25
Re: rusted out battery pan replacement
Heck yea!...was Re: Can i replace a gas tank myself??
Re: Need stock valve covers for 71' 455
Re: rusted out battery pan replacement
Re: Need stock valve covers for 71' 455
Re: engine rebuild questions
Rechroming - recommendations?
Re: Blinker speed
Re: PLEASE!! Need Advice On Ignitions
Re: Installed HEI
Lansing Photos
Re: W25
Re: PLEASE!! Need Advice On Ignitions
Re: Lansing Photos
Y'all can stop now.
cutlass
Re: W25
Electronic Ignition
UNBOUNCE: 1970 Cutlass S
Re: W25
Hey! Where is everybody? (my ramblings)
The list people and their cars
Re: Blinker speed
Re: W25
Re: The list people and their cars
Re: Replacement Rear View Mirror Glass
Re: The list people and their cars
Re: Can i replace a gas tank myself??
Re: The list people and their cars
Re: W25
Re: Rallye 350 a Hurst?
Re: Hey! Where is everybody? (my ramblings)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 10:35:33 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: PLEASE READ AND HELP MEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!

> The flasher does not work, even after replacing all bulbs and 
> checking my ground.

I assume you're talking about the turn signal flasher, and not the
four-way emergency flasher activated by the button on the side of
the steering column.

> I haven't had a chance to replace the flasher itself,

Based on what you said below, I wouldn't either.

> When I hit the brake when the car is not running, the parking lights
> turn on and my lights on alarm sounds. If I release the brake, it stops.

You have a problem in the rear brake lamp sockets. The only place where
the brake and parking/taillamp circuits come together is in the rear
brake lamps, where the two circuits go through the same bulbs to a
common ground. If the ground is broken there, current coming through
the brake lamp filament doubles back through the taillamp circuit and
all sorts of weird things start happening.

To find the offending socket(s), remove all four taillamp bulbs. Check
that all four bulbs you take out are double-filament #1157 bulbs. If
you find, for instance, a single-filament bulb such as an #1156, stop
right there; you've probably found your culprit.

With all four bulbs out, you should now be able to step on the brake 
without having the problem occur.

Next, use known-good #1157 bulbs. Install them in each socket, one at
a time. Test the brake pedal after installing each bulb. When the
problem returns, you've found the bad socket. Fix its ground connection
(might be bad at the socket or bad at the body connection in the left
rear corner) and you're all done. (Remember that simply replacing the
socket isn't going to fix things if the ground problem is where the
ground wire meets the body.) Good luck. You should have this thing
nailed in about a half hour.


Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 11:08:08 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Re: Blinker speed

Date: Thu, 2 Oct 1997 19:41:19 -0500
> My 69 442's turn signals blink pretty quickly..  How might I slow 
> 'em down to 'standard' speed?

You may have the wrong blinker unit installed. The two commonly-found
blinker units are #552 and #323. Both are physically interchangeable
and will probably work, but if I remember right, #552 is for a 2-light
circuit (counting only the big #1157 bulbs, one front and one rear)
and #323 is for a 3-light setup (usually one front bulb, two rear).

I think your car would require a #552, right? If you find a #323 in
the dash, that might be your problem.

Andrew C. Green                   (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Drive, Ste. 1800    Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301           FAX: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 11:09:15 -0500
From: Brett Chaveriat <brett@mcs.com>
Subject: Replacement Rear View Mirror Glass

I am interested in replacing the glass in the rear view
mirror on my 72 Cutlass.  Some of the silvering is coming off.
I have a lighted mirror.  I have seen the new replacement 
mirror assemblies available, and have been tempted to buy one
and transplant the mirror from it and put it into my housing.
These are pretty costly.  Does anybody know of a source for the
mirror glass?  Will a glass shop resilver them?  Any help would
be greatly appreciated.

- -- 
Brett Chaveriat                                    Arlington Hts, IL 
mailto:brett@mcs.com

72 Cutlass Supreme Convt. (Radiant Green)
92 Harley Davidson Electra Glide (2-tone blue)
96 Impala SS (black)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 12:12:27 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: W25

>	A guy at the local pizza shop has a mid 70's Cutlass with W25 badges.
>Can anyone tell me what it is ?????

It's likely a 1975 Hurst/Olds (is it black or white? Should have T-tops, I
think) with the 350 engine. The 455-powered versions got the W-30 badges. I
think they only started offering the 350 in '75. Jason Labay has one; you
may have noticed his sig:

>Jason Labay - Quality Engineer - TRW Automotive Group
>z28cfi@gwis.com  Akron, OH        
>95 DCM Impala SS.....14.66 @ 95.5 ; 1.917 60 ft ; 4400lbs
>80 Olds 442 W-30.......15.70 @ 88.7 ; 2.200 60 ft ; 3300lbs
>75 Hurst/Olds W-25 - (2)..one parts car, one resto car
               ^^^^
W-25, like the other "W"'s, has meant a lot of things over the years; this
is one of them, and I believe the only time you'll get an exterior badge
designating the fact that the car is equipped with that option.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 22:16:53 -0500
From: tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us (Tony Waldner)
Subject: Re: W25

>The W-25 was the code for the Outside Air Induction (OAI) package you
>are thinking about for 70-72 Cutlass/442/Vista Cruiser. (Yes, Vista
>Cruiser!)  It could have been had on any A bodied Oldsmobile during
>those years.  Came with the fiberhood, ram-air cleaner, and hood scoop


I know that I might start a war of wits here but W-25 was NOT available on
Cutlass Supreme models in 1970. I know that we have all seen a zillion
Cutlass SX models with OAI but it was probably added on by the owner or
even the dealer.

I don't know about 4-doors or Vista wagons but I have the April 1970
vehicle order sheet for my W-30 and it says that W-25 was unavailable for
4200 body cars.

Tony

70 442 W-30
70 Toro GT W-34

 _/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/+++\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_


                                        Tony Waldner
tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us                   Northeast Metro 916
                                         3300 Century Ave. N.
                                         White Bear Lake, MN
                                                       55110

 \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_+++_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 11:47:07 -0500
From: "Easton,Jeffrey" <Jeff.Easton@abbott.com>
Subject: Optimum shift points for Drag Racing

As many of you know, Last year I took my 442 to the track
for the first time (me and the car :-), and pretty much
waxed the 6 speed Mustang my friend had.  Well, he's spent
most of the summer doing "upgrades" to his 'stang and has
challenged me to a rematch.  So this Sunday we are
headed to Union Grove for another round.  Also  tagging
along is my brother w/ his '71 GS and a couple of friends
who are driving an '86 T-type and '94 Z-28.

Its looks pretty grim for the 442 this year. The one
thing I have done is buy a cheapie tach.  It seems to
be working fine, but it brings up the question of
shift points.

Any of you racers have a philosophy for shifing a
manual trans car?  What RPM's should I be hitting?
ie. whats the peak HP and torque curve for this 455?

Keep in mind this is a stock 442 4-speed w/ the
close ratio M-21 box and a 3.42 posi out back.

- -Jeff Easton
jeff.easton@abbott.com

1970 442  4-speed
Grayslake, ILL

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 11:58:13 -0500
From: "Andrew C. Green" <acg@dlogics.com>
Subject: Info on the "Seiko,Citizen,Movado 35-75% Off" Spammer

mo@watchesandmore.com wrote:
> To Be removed from this mailing send email to
> mo@watchesandmore.com with the word remove in the subject line

Remember, DO NOT reply to this scam; they do not have your email
address, only that of the Olds list. (Greg, I thought we closed
this thing?) This offer is probably a complete fraud.

The site in question is listed under the name of Ezekiel Moses,
but the contact information traces to a K. A. Coyle, 1297 Manor
Court, Fort Lauderdale, FL  33326-2819; phone (954) 389-9011. 
You can also share your views with them at mokim@mindspring.com
(Moses + Kim, perhaps :-) if that provider hasn't yanked their
account yet. Finally, their web page has a comments form on it
at http://www.watchesandmore.com/more_information.htm which will
forward your views to not only mo@watchesandmore.com but also
mokim@mindspring.com as well.

Note that the domain is administered by one John Hufnal Smith,
aka Dan Hufnal, a nutcase of the first order, so complaints to
him would be a complete waste of time.

Andrew C. Green
Datalogics, Inc.
101 N. Wacker Dr., Ste. 1800     Internet: acg@dlogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301

------------------------------

Date: Thu, 02 Oct 1997 12:12:53 -0500
From: hitson@leadbelt.com
Subject: Re: convertible top

>>This behavior sounds an awful lot like a circuit breaker popping;

>
>
>Suggestions on what to check?  The top didn't do this at all for the first 
>month-and-a-half I owned it. 
>
>RC Hellebuyck
>1971 4-4-2 covt.
>
>
I don't know electronics from a hole in the ground, but I know there is a 
relay on the firewall in my Cutlass conv.  Might start there -- but I 
wouldn't know how to test it.

Roger Hitson

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 97 13:12:47 -0500
From: brad.nicholson@ssa.gov
Subject: OCA Events Calendar

From the OFFICIAL OCA Web Site @ http://www.erols.com/brad442/oca
(It's own true URL coming soon !!!)


Oldsmobile Club of America National Calendar of Events
( Updated October 1, 1997 )
=======================================================
OCTOBER
=======================================================

October 5, 1997 - 4th ANNUAL TRUCKEE DONNER CLASSIC. 
Hosted by the Northern California Chapter. At the Best Westerm Motel, 1131 
State Hwy. 267, Truckee, CA. 8am-3pm. Cars to be judged must be on the show 
field no later than 9am. Pre-registration required. No entries accepted day 
of show. Entries must be in by Sept. 26, 1997 - The entry fee is $15. You 
must be an Oldsmobile Club member to show your Oldsmobile. Awards will be 
presented after the show. For more info: Ken Van Gundy, Jr. (916) 782-3637. 
Reservations available at the Best Western Motel at (800) 824-6385. Mention 
Olds Club for special rates.

October 11-12, 1997 - FIRST ANNUAL REGIONAL OLDSMOBILE SHOW AND GO DAY. 
Hosted by the Rallye 350 Club. At Raceway Park in Englishtown , NJ. Racing 
and People's Choice for muffled cars on Saturday. Racing only on Sunday for 
unmuffled and muffled cars. There will be a flea market also. Saturday 
night will end with a buffet and awards dinner at a nearby hotel. For more 
info: JoAnne Latorre (908) 276-8008 or (908) 276-4395. Registration forma 
available now.

October 12, 1997 - 9th ANNUAL ALL OLDSMOBILE FALL SHOW.
Hosted by the Capitol City Rockets Chapter. At Templeton Oldsmobile, 8598 
Leesburg Pike (Rt 7), Vienna, VA 22182. Help CCR wind down Oldsmobile's 
birthday. Music by "Oldies 100 WBIG", food & drink, door prizes, OCA 
judging available and parts department may be open w/ show specials. 
Pre-Reg $10 if postmarked before 10/4/97, $12 day of show. Registration 
includes dash plaque, event t-shirt, goodie bag and door prize ticket. 
Please make payment to "Capitol City Rockets". Send registration to: Dio & 
Barbara, Attn: CCR Fall Show, PO Box 332, LaPlata, MD 20646. Info: (301) 
934-2586 or leave a message.

=======================================================
NOVEMBER
=======================================================

November 15, 1997 - EVOC's 5th ANNUAL VETERAN'S DAY SHOW
Hosted by Eastern Virginia Oldsmobile Club at Greenbrier Oldsmobile, 
Chesapeake Virginia. Open to all Oldsmobiles; registration from 9:00-11:00 
am. Judging by 3:00 pm. OCA Tech classes and Non Tech classes, In-progress 
class. Swap spaces available. For more info call Jim Chermack at 
(757)474-0869.

=======================================================
1998
=======================================================

July 15-18, 1998. OCA 1998 NATIONAL MEET.
Hosted by the Illinois Valley Olds Chapter. Our host hotel is the Crowne 
Plaza (or on the same property) the sister hotel Holiday Inn East - 
Springfield IL. Be sure to tell them you are with the Oldsmobile Club of 
America to get our group rates. For the Crown Plaza call (217) 529-7777 or 
for the Holiday Inn East call (217) 529-7171. For event information contact 
Bill & JoAnn Wagaman, 816 13th St., Rockford, IL 61104. Chapter Phone: 
(815) 398-6698


THIS LISTING is limited to events hosted by the Oldsmobile Club of America 
and it's officially recognized chapters. In order to use this listing a 
chapter must be in current compliance with OCA bylaws. Event submissions 
should be sent at least 60 days prior to the event to: OCA Events, PO Box 
80318, Lansing, MI 48908. Event listings must be typed and may be FAXED to: 
(517) 321-8770. Please note: the deadline for an event is the first of the 
month prior to when it will be published (ie; event listing recieved by 
January 1 will be in the published in the February issue of "Journey with 
Olds".) An event listing will continue to be published until the month of 
the event.
=======================================================================
 ---
| | | Brad Nicholson
| | | 1987 442 W-42
|/|\| 1994 Eighty Eight LSS
| | | Oldsmobile Club of America #18984
 ---  Oldsmobile Centennial Club - Newest Chapter of OCA
(W) brad.nicholson@ssa.gov   (H) brad442@erols.com
Personal Web Page - http://www.erols/com/brad442
OCC Web Page - http://www.erols/com/brad442/occ
OCA Web Page - http://www.erols/com/brad442/oca

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 13:32:35 -0400
From: "Patton" <patton@ComCAT.COM>
Subject: Re: convertible top

> >Suggestions on what to check?  The top didn't do this at all for the
first 
> >month-and-a-half I owned it. 
> >
> >
> I don't know electronics from a hole in the ground, but I know there is a

> relay on the firewall in my Cutlass conv.  Might start there -- but I 
> wouldn't know how to test it.
> 
	Those relays are prone to water contamination. I picked one up at
Carlisle for $15.00. They have a set of contact points inside that can
become
mis-aligned over time. Try jumping out the relay with a 30 amp fusible link
from
the local parts house. If this works, replace the relay.

				The General 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:36:56 -0400
From: "Adcock, Jason K." <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: W25

Mike Rothe wrote:

> Cruiser!)  It could have been had on any A bodied Oldsmobile during
> those years.  Came with the fiberhood, ram-air cleaner, and hood scoop
> stripes.  That's it.  It was a "standard" option with the W-30/31
> packages.

Oops, I got my terminology wrong.  I thought it was the other way
around...I thought the W-30 was an option on top of the W-25, whereas the
W-25 was included in with the W-30.

Now, see what college does to you? :-)  My apologies.

- -- 
Jason K. Adcock
jadcock@vt.edu

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:52:04 -0400
From: Dave Heilala <dheilala@wwnet.com>
Subject: Re: steering wheel question

BMAN6771@aol.com wrote:
> 
> hi, i have a 1967 cutlass convertible. i was wondering if a 70-72 sport
> steering wheel would fit on my car. would this be possible or would something
> on the steering wheel hub be totally different than the 70-72 hub?????? any
> info on this matter would be welcomed.
> thanks
> 
> brent
> 1967 cutlass convertible
It will fit with thehuband horn contacts from the later wheel, but the
hub is much larger diameter than your steering column. Have the hub
machined down with a nice taper, repaint, and it'll look like it was
made for it. Did this on my 65 442 convertible.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:55:21 -0400
From: Aaron D Eoff <sheep542@mindspring.com>
Subject: Re: What did you find about the Cutlass?

At 08:15 AM 10/7/97 -0500, you wrote:
>Aaron, what did you find out about the electrical problem on
>the 77 cutlass?
>Chuck Lundin
>
 I'm often amazed how accurate the warning systems are in my Olds. i'm no
technician or anything just a guy who loves driving his '77 and reads alot
about it in the service manual. Anyway per diagnosis from the manual the
culprit was the voltage regulator. Went to NAPA and exchanged the whole
alternator for a rebuilt. Replaced my car battery with a newbie (not
neccesary but was time for a new one) and wala!!! she runs again.  As far as
the fuel guage needle being way oast the "F" mark i suspect a wire has come
loose. This make sense because recent construction on a nearby highway that
i use regularly probally jarred it loose. Need anymore info please fell free
to ask.


Aaron D Eoff
   ///////  ///////
       //       //
      //       //
     //       //
    //       //  'twas a goodyear

1977 Olds Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:50:23 -0700
From: Bill Gochenour <3STICKS@stjohns.edu>
Subject: Re: Dig Camera for sale

Teresa Stump wrote:
> 
> I thought someone on the list might be interested is this..
> I am selling my Kodak DC 40 digital camera.
> I hope it this ok to post this here.
> They come in real handy for getting pictures up
> on the web ( Like of your Olds an stuff:))
> Hope I haven't offended anyone, cuz you guys
> have been good to me.
> 
> Contact me if interested.
> Teresa Stump
> 63 Dynamic 88
> You can see a picture I took with the camera at
> http://members.tripod.com/~tstump/olds.html
> tstump@pacbell.net

How much are you asking for it, and can you give me some specs. How many
pics does it hold, resolution, flash, LCD viewfinder, accessories ?
- -- 
                                                     
Bill !                                         

                                              _           _       ___
1986 442 "The Perfect 10"                   /  |        /  |    /  _  \ 
1983 Hurst/Olds 15th Anniversary Edition  /    |      /    |   |_|   | |
     Oldsmobile 100th Centennial # 2218 /    | |_   /  / | |_      /  / 
                                       |_____   _| |_____   _|   /  /__ 
1993 Chevrolet Lumina Z-34                   |_|         |_|   |_______|
1997 Chevrolet Monte Carlo Z-34
                                              


        http://area51.stjohns.edu/~toychest     (updated 9/1/97)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:59:40 -0400
From: Aaron D Eoff <sheep542@mindspring.com>
Subject: rusted out battery pan replacement

I recently replaced the my car battery and discovered the pan is rusted out
really bad. Can these be replaced??? Would a plastic replacement last
longer??? Or is the junkyard my only hope??
TIA for the help!!!

Aaron D Eoff
   ///////  ///////
       //       //
      //       //
     //       //
    //       //  'twas a goodyear

1977 Olds Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:04:22 -0400
From: Aaron D Eoff <sheep542@mindspring.com>
Subject: Can i replace a gas tank myself??

HAs anyone on this list ever replaced a gas tank with limited equipment?? My
77 needs one and i like to get it done before winter. I don't have a garage
with a lift just a jack, stands, and car ramps.
Drove to a local parts place and they quoted me $120 for the new tank and
$80 labor for installation. If i had to go this route are those fair prices?? 


Please let me know.

Aaron D Eoff
   ///////  ///////
       //       //
      //       //
     //       //
    //       //  'twas a goodyear

1977 Olds Cutlass Supreme

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:10:33 -0400
From: Dave Heilala <dheilala@wwnet.com>
Subject: Re: Rallye 350 a Hurst?

Mike Rothe wrote:
> 
> W30442CS@aol.com wrote:
> >
> >   rallye 350 and several years of hurst shareing the w-45 code? maybe there
> > is a reason for that mike. it could be that way because the rallye was
> > designed by hurst, but never given credit?
> 
> Steve, the 70 Rallye 350 is a Rallye 350(W-45).  Just as the 85 442 is a
> 442 (W-42).   The W-codes were assigned by Oldsmobile, not Hurst. You
> are correct in that Olds wanted a 70 H/O, and the Rallye 350 was the
> modified end result of the original 70 H/O design, but for whatever
> reason, Hurst and Olds had a love/hate relationship through the years,
> and the 70 H/O never was to be.  Olds figured they could do this
> themselves in-house (note: the spoiler/ram air, wild graphics), but also
> try to rub snake-oil on the insurance carrier's backs at the same time
> by offering a performance car, but with a "smaller" and still potent
> engine.  So they built the Rallye 350.
> 
> Case in point, the 85 442 was originally supposed to be a follow through
> year with the H/O also, but because of whatever tiff (I heard back then
> that Olds wasn't going to pay Hurst a bunch of money to use the name),
> the 442 got replanned in the final hours, and was scheduled for "442"
> production.  It the more sedate look, but with somewhat similar paint
> scheming.  The drive train was exactly the same as the 84 H/O, with the
> 5500 rpm WOT shift-point OZ trans, and "hi-lift" flat-tappet camshaft
> (not roller like the "Y" engine).  Heck, I bought mine new and it even
> has a "5" stamped over the "4" on the carb year!!!  So they didn't run
> out of H/O carbs in 84!
> 
> Jon Wessel, the director of the H/O Club of America, and also has been
> working at Olds dealerships forever, said that when the 70 Rallye came
> in, nobody wanted it.  In stark contrast to the 68 and 69 H/O's, it was
> not a good seller.  That was unfortunate, since I think they are a super
> cool car myself.  But people weren't going to pay the price tag when
> someone could pay a few bucks more for the W-30.  He said some dealers
> reverted to replacing the yellow bumpers with chrome ones, just to try
> and move the cars off the lot.  What we all wouldn't give to take a time
> machine to 1970 to pick up a car that seemingly "nobody wanted"!!!!
> 
> If Hurst was going to do the car in 70, do you think they would have
> abandoned the 455 after 2 successful sellout years, and people clamoring
> for more?  The design concept may have been Hurst's, but I believe the
> engine choice was Olds'.  The 350 is a definite respectable V-8 in it's
> own right, but it would have been much easier to tweak a 455 for a
> little more umph.  The H/O's were supposed to be a specially prepared
> "upgrade" for the 442.  NOT designed to take the place of the W-30,
> however.
> 
> The Rallye holds a special place, for there weren't many of those
> produced either.  But if you find an original with chrome
> bumpers.....don't misjudge it as a fake right away.....
> 
> Mike Rothe
There was a new snack food that came out ironically the same time as the
Rallye that was called "Sreaming Yellow Zonkers". The Rallye 350's were
unaffectionately called that in the assembly plant due to the high scrap
rate on the bumpers. Not surprising that the dealers replaced some with
chrome ones. Unfortunately the Rallye 350's were not up to par with most
of the small block muscle cars and none of the big blocks. A Delta 88
with a 455 stock would blow them away. They didn't offer the W-31
package on them (too bad) and sadly were a forerunner of what the 442,
GTO, roadrunner and other great badges turned into in the later 70's:
(Decal duds).

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 01:13:06 -0000
From: "Lloyd W. Culp" <bculp@HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Re: W25

 I am speaking from faded memory also, but I think that W30 on these cars
meant 455 & W25 meant 350.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama




>Patton wrote:
>
>>         A guy at the local pizza shop has a mid 70's Cutlass with W25
badges.
>> Can anyone tell me what it is ?????
>
>Doesn't W-25 designate a "scaled-down" 442 (ie. not a W-30)?  From posts on
>the list, I gathered that the W-25 was kind of an appearance package,
>including the OAI hood, spoiler, etc.  Not sure about the engine.   Might
>be a 455.
>
>--
>Jason K. Adcock
>jadcock@vt.edu
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:25:28 -0500
From: david wyatt <Wyatt_David_L@LILLY.COM>
Subject: Re: Optimum shift points for Drag Racing

I shift my car at 5400 rpms.  I am running the W-30 "stick" camshaft
which does seem to have a bunch more power on the top end.  I would
think 5000 rpm would be reasonable for your car.  I have the same
transmission and rear gear as you.  My biggest problem is total lack of
traction, even when shifting into second gear.  I have to shift to
second with a gentle clutch release or the tires literally go up in
smoke.  The drag strips that I have ran at are all fairly slick when
using street tires.  I hope you can make use of this info and show your
tail lights to the non-believers.

Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 13:19:19 -0500
From: Paul Brillhart <u17058@uicvm.uic.edu>
Subject: SOLD '67 442

> I finally parted ways with my '67 442.  I'll keep my rust free '65
> till I die, although I made a similar oath about a Muastang when I was
> in high school and it curretnly resides in the afterlife of autos, and
> just ordered a CenterForce Dual Friction Clutch and a Hooker Crossover
> pipe kit for it.  Back to the '67, it had all new suspension,
> alternator, regulator, re-core radiator, front brakes, master
> cylinder, P.S., P.brakes, redone interior(back seat torn), counsel,
> Turbo 400, 425 engine(with correct intake..go figure), 3:23 open, lots
> of bondo and rust in the trunk.  The body looked nice, but it couldn't
> hold a magnet with a crowbar.  Anyway rust was surfacing and one of
> the frame members was going, so I sold it.  Damn sad to see it going
> down the alley.  I love how cherry my '65's body is(and it's a
> 4-speed), but the '67 hardtop body style is handsdown my favorite.  Oh
> well, rust never sleeps.  I just wish I could have kept the 425
> crank.  Later.

Paul Brillhart
1965 442 4-spd.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:23:11 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: W25

Hey Tony, you're right.  Didn't even think about the Supreme.  Correct,
it wasn't available as a FACTORY option for those cars ONLY. (Except 72
H/O, then it was included) But for a few hundred bucks, you could have
one dealer installed.  I remember some old guy in NC that had a 70
Cutlass "S" 2 dr with a 350, 4bbl, with the W-25.  He said he ordered it
because he thought the hood scoops looked pretty cool.  

I don't really classify the Supreme as an A body anyway (opinion)
because it was sort of a "G" body attached to an "A" frame.(a la Monte,
Grand Prix, etc.)  Not saying they weren't cool, but Ch*velle and Bu*cks
and LeM*ns didn't have a "notch-back" version, making the Supreme
unique.

> I know that I might start a war of wits here but W-25 was NOT available on
> Cutlass Supreme models in 1970.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:25:35 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: W25

It was included with the W-30.  It's just that you could order the W-25
without the W-30, but not the other way around.  Still confused?
Mike Rothe
 
> Oops, I got my terminology wrong.  I thought it was the other way
> around...I thought the W-30 was an option on top of the W-25, whereas the
> W-25 was included in with the W-30.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:28:30 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: rusted out battery pan replacement

Try one of the restoration companies.  The battery trays were pretty
standard for a lot of years, though mount holes may be slightly
different.  Slight modifacations MAY  be necessary, but doubtful.  But
unless you want to stay "original looking", a plastic one won't rot. 
It's up to you.

Mike Rothe
 
> I recently replaced the my car battery and discovered the pan is rusted out

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 13:00:45 -0600 (MDT)
From: Scott R Clark <mickeyd@selway.umt.edu>
Subject: Heck yea!...was Re: Can i replace a gas tank myself??

> HAs anyone on this list ever replaced a gas tank with limited equipment?? My
> 77 needs one and i like to get it done before winter. I don't have a garage
> with a lift just a jack, stands, and car ramps.
> Drove to a local parts place and they quoted me $120 for the new tank and
> $80 labor for installation. If i had to go this route are those fair prices?? 

	Sounds like you have pretty much all you need to drop a tank
already.  The easiest way I've found to do it is (first)  to drive it
empty (or at
least as empty as possible).  If the car is'nt drivable, you need to find
a way to get the gas out of it (siphoning the outlet line is probibly the
easiest way to do it.)  If there is a lot of gas left in the tank, there
is a chance it will put a serious dent in it when you lower it, and that
it will spill everywhere.  Second, just put the back of the car up on
stands, disconnect the fuel lines, sender wire(s), etc, unbolt the suport
straps, and lower it.  The biggest problem I've found when doing this is
all the dirt that falls in your eyes when you start wrenching on the bolts
holding up the straps!!  That, and the fact that there is often gobs of
undercoating on the bolts, making them kind of a pain to remove.  It's
really a pretty simple opperation.  The only time I could see this being a
*really* big pain is if it's setup like some f-bodies, where the tank is
right over the rear axle, which has to be removed to get access to the
tank (fortunatly, I think that setup is pretty rare) most cars have pretty
good clearence back there.  
	As for the prices, the $120 dosn't sound too bad for a new tank.
A used junkyard tank would prbobily run half that and come with the
sending unit, if thats a factor.  $80 for labor seems kind of steep to
me...a garage with air tools and a lift could probibly get it done in less
than an hour.  If at all possible, I'd suggest you do it yourself and
spend that $80 on something else for your Olds :)  

	Anyway, good luck with it, whichever way you decide to go!

				Scott
			1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98  

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 11:56:41 -0700
From: Erik Nowacki <enowacki@titan.com>
Subject: Re: Need stock valve covers for 71' 455

At 10:32 AM 10/4/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Looking for "stock or original" valve covers for my 1971 4-4-2, 455 
>engine.  I'm told both should have a "dent or notch" to accommodate the 
>A/C and power brake booster.  I want the correct ones!  
>
I have a 455 in my 72 VC and only the right valve cover is notched.  This
is essential to clear the AC.  There is no notch in the driver's side valve
cover since there is plenty of clearance for the brake booster.  Should we
start a thread on this :-)

Erik Nowacki
San Diego
72 Vista Cruiser

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 15:04:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: GPMTRADER@aol.com
Subject: Re: rusted out battery pan replacement

Contact Year One.  They have an 800 number.  Their catalog make for good
"dreamin'".  The battery pan should be replaced to avoid further acid damage
and electrical problems.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 11:56:41 -0700
From: Erik Nowacki <enowacki@titan.com>
Subject: Re: Need stock valve covers for 71' 455

At 10:32 AM 10/4/97 -0400, you wrote:
>Looking for "stock or original" valve covers for my 1971 4-4-2, 455 
>engine.  I'm told both should have a "dent or notch" to accommodate the 
>A/C and power brake booster.  I want the correct ones!  
>
I have a 455 in my 72 VC and only the right valve cover is notched.  This
is essential to clear the AC.  There is no notch in the driver's side valve
cover since there is plenty of clearance for the brake booster.  Should we
start a thread on this :-)

Erik Nowacki
San Diego
72 Vista Cruiser

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 97 14:44:12 EDT
From: Doug Ahern <doug@cobra.cosmic.uga.edu>
Subject: Re: engine rebuild questions

Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com> wrote:
>What should I expect to pay to have a 69 or 70 350 engine rebuilt with some
>minor performance parts at an engine shop? I would like to achieve 350-370
>hp but I am more concerned with a good flat torque curve as this will be
>a strip engine. 

General machine costs alone, parts not included might run you
something like (and I'd do them roughly in this order):

clean, bore & hone and deck resurface is about $200-225  total= $225
long block assembly might run $350-400 ........................  625
reconditioning rods is about $75...............................  700
crankshaft regrind $75.........................................  775
file fit rings $125 or so .....................................  900
heads reworked, bigger valves, machine guides, $250............ 1150

and thats parts alone,  I wouldn't build an drag strip engine  without
paying close attention to the bottom end  (balance, crankshaft and rod recond').
If you are assembling the engine yourself, you'll say a lot of money.
engine yourself, you'll say a lot of money.  

new pistons, cam, lifters, gaskets, etc with run you $1000-1200.
So you are looking at $2500-3000 total. thats provided you have a good
intake/carb/exhaust/ignition system.

To stay under $2000,  your best bet, imho, is go for cubes...  the cheapest
way to get an olds 350 to 350hp, is to replace it with a 455 :-)  A running
455 could be had with a transmission for $500.  Add a little cam (like
a comp cams 268/268 .456/.456) and you could be at your target hp, for
1/2 what building a 350 would take.    Don't forget
the rest of the car in your dragstrip build up... a higher stall torque
converter and eat up 1/2 a grand easy,  then there is tires, shocks,
and maybe new springs.

I'm interested in hearing what other list readers think.  good luck!


Doug Ahern      doug@cosmic.uga.edu  1964 F-85 Cutlass 
http://www.cosmic.uga.edu/doug.html  1969 Dart 
Sys Admin, COSMIC, Univ. of Georgia  1974 Satellite ex-cop car

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 14:51:12 -0400 (EDT)
From: Frank Iezzi <fiezzi@freenet.columbus.oh.us>
Subject: Rechroming - recommendations?

Can anyone make a recommendation for a shop (Ohio maybe?) that does
quality rechroming work on bumpers (triple plated or "show chrome")?
Any help appreciated!
Frank Iezzi
Columbus OH

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 12:53:49 -0600
From: Tim Rudolph <trudolph@frii.com>
Subject: Re: Blinker speed

At 11:08 AM 10/6/97 -0500, you wrote:
>Date: Thu, 2 Oct 1997 19:41:19 -0500
>> My 69 442's turn signals blink pretty quickly..  How might I slow 
>> 'em down to 'standard' speed?

>I think your car would require a #552, right? If you find a #323 in
>the dash, that might be your problem.

Been busy with work and school as of late and just got a chance to look
around.  I have to be honest, but I don't see a blinker unit anywhere.. I
see the hazard one, but it would seem that is different.  Anyone have an
idea where it would be 'mounted' on a '69?

Thanks,

Tim Rudolph
trudolph@frii.com
'69 442 Convertible

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 14:53:05 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: PLEASE!! Need Advice On Ignitions

Mike Krumwiede MIS Technician wrote:
> 
> Watch the duration on the cam, thats how I killed my 78 Olds 88. You
> going be changing the pistons out I asume? If thats the case, I
> wouldn't worry about it too much. I was in the MORE POWER greed phase
> and had a little to much cam for the stock equipment.

It's only got a little over 46,000 on it. I really don't think the
pistons would be a problem. Besides, I don't know of any good piston
companies that manufacture Olds pistons. Can you tell me who does? I'm
looking for something along the lines of shallow dish to flat top,
forged would be a + also.

- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoftİ Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 16:05:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mikeytvb@aol.com
Subject: Re: Installed HEI

did you change spark plugs?  with an hei you can gap the plugs at about .60
 instead of .35   this will give you better fuel economy.

mikey tvb@aol.com
73 cutlass w/403 w/hei

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 15:16:47 -0500
From: "M&D Gillespie" <mgillespie@sprynet.com>
Subject: Lansing Photos

Hello Listers,
I've finally added some Lansing photos tp my web page. I didn't get too many
before my camera died, but there are some really nice cars included, mostly
of the 70's on the bridge.

Mick Gillespie, Columbus, Indiana
69 Cutlass S convertible
mgillespie@sprynet.com
http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mgillespie/oldspage.htm

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 16:32:50 -0400
From: "Adcock, Jason K." <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: W25

Mike Rothe wrote:
> 
> It was included with the W-30.  It's just that you could order the W-25
> without the W-30, but not the other way around.  Still confused?

Nope, thanks for clearin' it up.

- -- 
Jason K. Adcock
jadcock@vt.edu

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 15:33:23 -0500
From: "Mike Krumwiede MIS Technician" <krumwiede@mis.highland.cc.il.us>
Subject: Re: PLEASE!! Need Advice On Ignitions

> 
> It's only got a little over 46,000 on it. I really don't think the
> pistons would be a problem.

I only had 72,000..... I just dont want to see all that time and 
money gone to waste on a good engine like I did, I have the spark 
plug that shot out of the housing  still hanging from my rear view  
mirror to remind me power corrupts, and pay attention to detail. 

> Besides, I don't know of any good piston
> companies that manufacture Olds pistons. Can you tell me who does? I'm
> looking for something along the lines of shallow dish to flat top,
> forged would be a + also.
> 
Check out
 www.summitracing.com 
 www.kanter.com
 www.smothers.com

They can probably help you out with pistons/rods, also, summit makes 
a really good intake/carb/cam combo's specifically designed for 
engine sizes/manufacturors,  might want to check that out too, its 
the best bang for the buck for all three. my 2 cents.

1975 Olds 98 Regency 455 4bbl, racing cam, headman headers, dual 
exhaust, glass packs

1978 Olds Delta 88 Royale 350 4bbl

1977 Olds Cutlass Supreme 350 4bbl

- -------------------------------------------------------
Mike Krumwiede - MIS Technician
Highland Community College
Phone (815) 235-6121
Mailto:Krumwiede@mis.highland.cc.il.us
- -------------------------------------------------------
"Every man dies...not every man really gets a chance to live"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 18:06:25 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: Lansing Photos

I just picked up the roll of film that I shot at the list get-together in
Lansing. Some not-bad shots of folks like Mark Prince and Mike Hall (the
Street Rockets!), Mick Gillespie, Chris B. Witt, Bryceman (including the
"Lansing or Bust" minivan he drove), Brad Nicholson, Tom Stoner, David
Brown, Jeff Easton (he's a little fuzzy... must have been after my second
beer!), the Handrenmobile, the Chermackmobile, the Sparkmobile, etc. A few
others are lost in the recesses of my memory.  Anyhow, I have a second set
of prints I could send someone if they are interested in scanning the and
putting them on a web page. Any takers? 

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 17:56:27 -0400
From: tgstoner@umich.edu
Subject: Y'all can stop now.

I'd like to thank everyone who worked so hard to keep the discussion thread
going about the individual who quit the list because someone had bashed
(literally) one of his beloved Volkswagen Beetles (Re: Getting off of this
list).

I have no idea how y'all found out that I had fallen behind in reading my
messages from the list, but all those easy to skip postings which continued
as that thread refused to die its natural death really made it easier for
me to catch back up in my reading.  Again, thanks to everyone who
participated.

Anyway, since I'm caught back up now, you can let it finally suffer its
overdue death.

Speaking of death, and in a weak attempt to keep this Oldsmobile related,
I'll mention a recent news item concerning Michigan's infamous Jack
Kavorkian (the state revoked his medical license; it isn't proper to call
him "doctor" anymore), who seems to favor older Oldsmobiles, probably
because they can be cheaply obtained and still are basically reliable.
There's probably little worse to happen to Jack than to have the car break
down on the way to the nearest hospital parking lot with his latest vict,
er, customer on board.  And there for awhile, that's how he was leaving
them all - sitting in a car parked in the hospital's parking lot until his
lawyer called and told police where to find 'em.

It seems that the city of Pontiac Michigan recently granted Jack a
concealed weapon permit, allowing him to carry the handgun of his choice
for "personal protection".  Shortly after this happened, Jay Leno commented
on it during his opening monologue for The Tonight Show, claiming that Jack
was a long-time supporter of the NRA.  As proof, he offered a photograph,
said to be the rear view of Jack's car.  I don't believe it was an
Oldsmobile, but the bumper sticker on it read "Guns Don't Kill People - I
Kill People".

Tom Stoner
Oldsmobile Club of America #3943
Ann Arbor, MI
tgstoner@umich.edu

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 16:56:03 -0500
From: Travis Shelton <mindmaster@pdq.net>
Subject: cutlass

I need to know what a 1970 Cutlass S is worth.  I'm looking in to buying
one and I am wondering what it is worth.  It is in great condition.  The
interior is great, no rips, cracks or anything like that.  The body is
in good shape, the only rust is on the trunk lid which I've been told
can be replaced for about $200.  The rest of the car is solid.  It has
the original 350 rocket with only 75,000 original miles.  If anyone
could give me an estimate price on the worth of the car or somewhere
where I could get one before Oct. 10th, I would greatly appreciate it.
 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 18:11:12 -0400
From: tgstoner@umich.edu
Subject: Re: W25

On Mon, 6 Oct 1997 "Patton" <patton@ComCAT.COM> wrote:
> Rocketmen (and Lisa   et al)
>
>       A guy at the local pizza shop has a mid 70's Cutlass with W25
badges.
>Can anyone tell me what it is ?????
>
>
>                                       The General

**************************
The 1974 and 1975 Hurst/Olds could be ordered with either a 350 or 455 V-8.
While the cars with the 455 carried the familiar "W-30" decals, those with
the 350 had a "W-25" decal.  Either version could be ordered in black or
white, with gold trim.  As I recall, aside from the engines, both versions
were quite similar if not identical.

Tom Stoner
Oldsmobile Club of America #3943
Ann Arbor, MI
tgstoner@umich.edu

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 15:15:25 -0700
From: Gary Manton <sasgmm@unx.sas.com>
Subject: Electronic Ignition

Just wanted to get the viewpoint of the majority on switching from points to
electronic?

Thanks,

Gary

ps..Thanks for all of your help on the numerous questions I have been asking
over the last month.  I'm new at this and trying to learn.
          \\|//
          (o o)                     
~~~~~~oOOo~(_)~oOOo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Gary M. Manton					SAS Institute
Business Solutions Division			Phoenix, AZ  85012
(602) 265-1616 ext. 230 - voice		        (602) 265-8585 - fax
						(888) 982-4079 - Pager

"In business as in life, your chances of being run over are doubled
if you stay in the middle of the road"
~~~~~~oooo~~~~~oooo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 19:36:57 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: UNBOUNCE: 1970 Cutlass S

Not a list member, so reply directly...

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:	Travis Shelton <mindmaster@pdq.net>
Subject: cutlass

I need to know what a 1970 Cutlass S is worth.  I'm looking in to buying
one and I am wondering what it is worth.  It is in great condition.  The
interior is great, no rips, cracks or anything like that.  The body is
in good shape, the only rust is on the trunk lid which I've been told
can be replaced for about $200.  The rest of the car is solid.  It has
the original 350 rocket with only 75,000 original miles.  If anyone
could give me an estimate price on the worth of the car or somewhere
where I could get one before Oct. 10th, I would greatly appreciate it.
 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 18:38:32 -0400
From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Subject: Re: W25

Yep I do have a 75 Hurst/Olds W-25. Two of them to be exact, one being a
parts car.  The front of the fenders above the turnsignal lens has "W-25"
emblems in gold.  In 1975 the difference betweeen a H/O W-25 and a H/O W-30
was the following:

W-25 = 350 engine / TH-350 trans.
W-30 = 455 engine / TH-400 trans.

It basically stood for the engine/tranny choice. 


At 12:12 PM 10/6/97 -0400, you wrote:
>It's likely a 1975 Hurst/Olds (is it black or white? Should have T-tops, I
>think) with the 350 engine. The 455-powered versions got the W-30 badges. I
>think they only started offering the 350 in '75. Jason Labay has one; you
>may have noticed his sig:

____________________________________________
Jason Labay - Quality Engineer - TRW Automotive Group
z28cfi@gwis.com  Akron, OH        
95 DCM Impala SS.....14.66 @ 95.5 ; 1.917 60 ft ; 4400lbs
80 Olds 442 W-30.......15.70 @ 88.7 ; 2.200 60 ft ; 3300lbs
75 Hurst/Olds W-25 - (2)..one parts car, one resto car
85 S-10 Blazer 4x4.......work truck, 1,625 watt sound system

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 19:01:20 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Hey! Where is everybody? (my ramblings)

Did j'y'all just vanish or what? Oh well. Just thought I'd bring you up
to date on some stuff. I guess you can say I've all but lost my job. The
boss shut down the weekday night shift because we weren't being
efficient. It's all because we work after school. Now we can only work
on weekends. I say screw that, I'm finding another job. I always get so
messy at this one anyways. I just love having DRIED FOAM sticking to the
hair on my arms and legs and face. Besides, this leaves me with no time
to do anything on the weekends if I want to get at least $80 a paycheck.
I'd have to work 10 hrs/day making $5.15. BS!!! Maybe if I got $8-10,
I'd say forget weekends, I'll work. But mi. wage for two 10 hr. days
just ain't cuttin' it.
	So, that means that I have temporarily lost my cash flow, whose main
purpose was to fund my 350 rebuild this winter, pay off my beater, and
the exhaust I put on my Cutlass. But, I suppose I can do a lot with
$1900. I already have the cam and heads, so all that's left is the rest
of the valvetrain, intake manifold, posi, maybe some pistons, and some
new tires. This sucks! I need to find another job that pays better. I
was planning on making some conversions and drivetrain mods, but all
that just went out the window. Oh well.
	I'll probably get a(some) detention(s) tomorrow. I left a pretty hefty
one-wheel cloud of smoke from my car today while I was pulling out of
the school parking lot. Unfortunately, I was seen by somebody in the bus
garage. Oh well, not like it hasn't ever happened before =p. Darn sticky
throttle ;-).

Just my ramblings, sorry if I wasted your time.
- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoftİ Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 19:11:03 -0400 (EDT)
From: DROLDS350@aol.com
Subject: The list people and their cars

Write down your name, state you live and car or cars that you own. ABC order.

People                                        State
                                        Car or Cars 
Jim                                               IL
                                     1970 Cutlass W31

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 19:36:38 EDT
From: dlwels@juno.com (David L. Welsh)
Subject: Re: Blinker speed

Tim Rudolph wrote:

>Been busy with work and school as of late and just got a chance to 
>look
>around.  I have to be honest, but I don't see a blinker unit 
>anywhere.. I
>see the hazard one, but it would seem that is different.  Anyone have 
>an
>idea where it would be 'mounted' on a '69?


On my '69 Supreme it wasn't "mounted" anywhere.  It was plugged into some
wires and hung up under the dash 
just left of the steering column.  I had to take the air ducts off to
find it up there.

Hope this helps.

Dave Welsh

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 19:47:31 -0700
From: "David, Terri and Rob" <hoagie@emeraldis.com>
Subject: Re: W25

Patton wrote:
> 
> Rocketmen (and Lisa   et al)
> 
>         A guy at the local pizza shop has a mid 70's Cutlass with W25 badges.
> Can anyone tell me what it is ?????
> 
>                                         The Generalokay boys and girls...lets review our "W" performance options...W-30 442 
performance package for maximum bang for the buck(455 C.I.)..W-31 for 
F-85 and Cutlass "S" coupes those who couldn't quite swing the 
maximum(350 C.I.)..W-25 Outside Air Induction Fiberglass Hood 
performance option...W-27 special order aluminum carrier and 
cover....W-26 sports console made in combination with hurst with 
His-nhers dual gate shifter...that covers our W-Machine performance 
options that start with the letter "W"

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 19:57:25 -0400 (EDT)
From: Mikeytvb@aol.com
Subject: Re: The list people and their cars

mike
florida
73 oldsmobile cutlass w/403
70 oldsmobile 442 conv. w/455(restoring)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 97 19:58:38 EDT
From: Glenn Connors <gpc442@buffnet.net>
Subject: Re: Replacement Rear View Mirror Glass

At 11:09 AM 10/6/97 -0500, you wrote:
>I am interested in replacing the glass in the rear view
>mirror on my 72 Cutlass.  Some of the silvering is coming off.
>I have a lighted mirror.  I have seen the new replacement 
>mirror assemblies available, and have been tempted to buy one
>and transplant the mirror from it and put it into my housing.
>These are pretty costly.  Does anybody know of a source for the
>mirror glass?  Will a glass shop resilver them?  Any help would
>be greatly appreciated.
>
>

    I've replaced side view and rear view mirrors before, usually because of
breakage or being badly scratched.  A glass shop is the way to go.  They
deal in bulk mirror glass so all you need to do is make a decent template of
the piece you need  out of tag board or like material.  They can then cut
you one.  Just let them know what it is for so you get the edges with a
little top taper and then buffed/ground.  Then you remove the old mirror if
you have one, and epoxy the new piece to the housing mounts or frame.
Relatively inexpensive as well.


   Glenn
   '69 4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 19:54:31 -0700
From: "David, Terri and Rob" <hoagie@emeraldis.com>
Subject: Re: The list people and their cars

DROLDS350@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Write down your name, state you live and car or cars that you own. ABC order.
> 
> People                                        State
>                                         Car or Cars
> Jim                                               IL
>                                      1970 Cutlass W31David					1971 442 W-30 convertible
					1970 Cutlass SX convertible
					1971 442 Sports Coupe
					1969 Camaro RS
					1971 Monte Carlo
					1997 Camaro Z-28 6 speed 
					
					greenwood,south carolina

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 19:59:30 -0700
From: "David, Terri and Rob" <hoagie@emeraldis.com>
Subject: Re: Can i replace a gas tank myself??

Aaron D Eoff wrote:
> 
> HAs anyone on this list ever replaced a gas tank with limited equipment?? My
> 77 needs one and i like to get it done before winter. I don't have a garage
> with a lift just a jack, stands, and car ramps.
> Drove to a local parts place and they quoted me $120 for the new tank and
> $80 labor for installation. If i had to go this route are those fair prices??
> 
> Please let me know.
> 
> Aaron D Eoff
>    ///////  ///////
>        //       //
>       //       //
>      //       //
>     //       //  'twas a goodyear
> 
> 1977 Olds Cutlass Supreme80 bucks to replace a tank.....I'd take that 1 in a heartbeat......if 
you've ever replaced 1 you'd know where I'm coming from...all the 
surface rust in your eyes...the brittle gas lines you have to cut to get 
off...the shear weight of the thing...which is not easily handled by 1 
person...so...GO FOR IT!!!...Hoagie

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 20:02:10 -0400
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: The list people and their cars

DROLDS350@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Write down your name, state you live and car or cars that you own. ABC order.
> 
> People                                        State
>                                         Car or Cars
> Jim                                               IL
>                                      1970 Cutlass W31


Mike
Insanity
Oldsmobiles

hahahaha!  I just had to use that somewhere!

Mike Rothe
SC
1969 H/O
1971 442
1985 442

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Oct 1997 20:08:14 -0400
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: Re: W25

- ----------
> From: Tony Waldner <tonwald@eta.k12.mn.us>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Re: W25
> Date: Monday, October 06, 1997 11:16 PM
> 
> >The W-25 was the code for the Outside Air Induction (OAI) package you
> >are thinking about for 70-72 Cutlass/442/Vista Cruiser. (Yes, Vista
> >Cruiser!)  It could have been had on any A bodied Oldsmobile during
> >those years.  Came with the fiberhood, ram-air cleaner, and hood scoop
> 
> 
> I know that I might start a war of wits here but W-25 was NOT available
on
> Cutlass Supreme models in 1970. I know that we have all seen a zillion
> Cutlass SX models with OAI but it was probably added on by the owner or
> even the dealer.
> 
> I don't know about 4-doors or Vista wagons but I have the April 1970
> vehicle order sheet for my W-30 and it says that W-25 was unavailable for
> 4200 body cars.
> 
> Tony
> 
Tony I have to disagree.  the W-25 option was available on any 4bbl
cutlass, cutlass supreme, cutlass wagon, even 4 door cutlasses.

Perhaps on your vehicle order sheet a comprehension problem occurred.  The
W-30 option wasn't available on the supreme body.  Perhaps this is what was
trying to be said. 

But the W-25 option was guaranteed available on Cutlass Supreme's
Hope this helps

Robert Schinkel
1970 W-31 
1970 442 Conv.
1970 Cutlass Conv.
1970 W-30
1970 Rallye 350

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 20:04:23 -0700
From: "David, Terri and Rob" <hoagie@emeraldis.com>
Subject: Re: Rallye 350 a Hurst?

Mike Rothe wrote:
> 
> W30442CS@aol.com wrote:
> >
> >   rallye 350 and several years of hurst shareing the w-45 code? maybe there
> > is a reason for that mike. it could be that way because the rallye was
> > designed by hurst, but never given credit?
> 
> Steve, the 70 Rallye 350 is a Rallye 350(W-45).  Just as the 85 442 is a
> 442 (W-42).   The W-codes were assigned by Oldsmobile, not Hurst. You
> are correct in that Olds wanted a 70 H/O, and the Rallye 350 was the
> modified end result of the original 70 H/O design, but for whatever
> reason, Hurst and Olds had a love/hate relationship through the years,
> and the 70 H/O never was to be.  Olds figured they could do this
> themselves in-house (note: the spoiler/ram air, wild graphics), but also
> try to rub snake-oil on the insurance carrier's backs at the same time
> by offering a performance car, but with a "smaller" and still potent
> engine.  So they built the Rallye 350.
> 
> Case in point, the 85 442 was originally supposed to be a follow through
> year with the H/O also, but because of whatever tiff (I heard back then
> that Olds wasn't going to pay Hurst a bunch of money to use the name),
> the 442 got replanned in the final hours, and was scheduled for "442"
> production.  It the more sedate look, but with somewhat similar paint
> scheming.  The drive train was exactly the same as the 84 H/O, with the
> 5500 rpm WOT shift-point OZ trans, and "hi-lift" flat-tappet camshaft
> (not roller like the "Y" engine).  Heck, I bought mine new and it even
> has a "5" stamped over the "4" on the carb year!!!  So they didn't run
> out of H/O carbs in 84!
> 
> Jon Wessel, the director of the H/O Club of America, and also has been
> working at Olds dealerships forever, said that when the 70 Rallye came
> in, nobody wanted it.  In stark contrast to the 68 and 69 H/O's, it was
> not a good seller.  That was unfortunate, since I think they are a super
> cool car myself.  But people weren't going to pay the price tag when
> someone could pay a few bucks more for the W-30.  He said some dealers
> reverted to replacing the yellow bumpers with chrome ones, just to try
> and move the cars off the lot.  What we all wouldn't give to take a time
> machine to 1970 to pick up a car that seemingly "nobody wanted"!!!!
> 
> If Hurst was going to do the car in 70, do you think they would have
> abandoned the 455 after 2 successful sellout years, and people clamoring
> for more?  The design concept may have been Hurst's, but I believe the
> engine choice was Olds'.  The 350 is a definite respectable V-8 in it's
> own right, but it would have been much easier to tweak a 455 for a
> little more umph.  The H/O's were supposed to be a specially prepared
> "upgrade" for the 442.  NOT designed to take the place of the W-30,
> however.
> 
> The Rallye holds a special place, for there weren't many of those
> produced either.  But if you find an original with chrome
> bumpers.....don't misjudge it as a fake right away.....
> 
> Mike Rotheno truer words have ever been spoken...why settle for 2nd best...if your 
going to fly...why not spend a few more bucks to fly 1st class...Hoagie

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Oct 1997 20:12:55 -0400
From: Dave Ward <ward@ptbo.igs.net>
Subject: Re: Hey! Where is everybody? (my ramblings)

>I'll probably get a(some) detention(s) tomorrow. I left a pretty hefty
>one-wheel cloud of smoke from my car today while I was pulling out of
>the school parking lot. 

Been there...done that....still doing it!

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #888
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