To:	oldsmobile-digest@chebucto.ns.ca @ INTERNET
cc:	 
Subject:	oldsmobile-digest V1 #993


oldsmobile-digest      Saturday, December 6 1997      Volume 01 : Number 993



Re: Olds Centennial stuff!
Re: TH200R-4 durability, shifting question and gear ratios.
Centennial lampost banner
Centennial lampost banner
Re: Centennial celebration plaque
Olds lampost banner
Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)
Triple postings SORRY!
Re: Olds Centennial stuff!
Glove box Owner's Manual
Centennial Plaque ª1962 Looking to trade
Re: Olds Centennial stuff!
Re: Centennial lampost banner
Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl
Re: sounds
425 4bbl and intake
Re: Triple postings SORRY!
Re: Olds Centennial stuff!
Re: sounds
Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl
Re: Olds Centennial stuff!
Re: Propane question
Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl
Wanted: '68 Steering Column
Transmission Models/Ratios
Re: Vinyl top question
My answers... (Re: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)
Which Oil
Olds History Center Fax?
Re: Which Oil
Re: Xmas
Re: Transmission Models/Ratios
Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)
Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)
Re: JWO
Re: Propane question
Painting
1970 Bucket Seats
E4MC Carb for 80's 307
Re: 1970 Bucket Seats
Looking for 76 98 4dr
Re: Painting
Re: Oldsmobile Clipart???
Re: EGR is not A.I.R. (was: olds help, ?'s, info, goodies
Re: olds help, ?'s, info, goodies
Re: car craft / metal thing
90 Calais knockin' bad
OCA request/Movie info
PARTS for sale/trade
new problems, need HELP!
Re: SS wheel questions / gasket question
Parts Question from New Member
66 vs. 68 Toro?
Re: Parts Question from New Member

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:43:38 -0800
From: Larry Polesnak <bullets@sgi.net>
Subject: Re: Olds Centennial stuff!

RC Hellebuyck wrote:
>
> Well my order from Alpha marketing came in yesterday.  Their having a
RC,whats the book about?  Larry Polesnak
                        6   2   S   T   A   R   F   I    R   E


- --
                /\__________________/\_________________/\
           /\__/Amateur Radio Station  WB3KJG  ARES,RACES\__/\
      /\__/Skywarn/ 1O1Oª 459OO /BreezeShooters Number 87-279 \__/\
     / BreezeShooters web site   http://www.users.sgi.net/~wolfie/ \
    / 1962 STARFIRE"http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/downs/6250/" \
   -------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:01:39 -0500
From: Dave Ward <ward@ptbo.igs.net>
Subject: Re: TH200R-4 durability, shifting question and gear ratios.

Igor wrote:

>Another question I have is what is the track record for these
>transmisions, can they last a fair time if diven properly.  Also, can this
>tranny be preped to take a higher tourqe engine like the 350.  Are there
>any known problems and/or bugs in this trans.

The 2004r's are known to be weak(er) transmissions than the TH350's or
400's.  The fourth planetary (for the OD) is known to wear out
relatively quickly, and can cause whines or fluid consumption...and
eventually go VVK.

Yes, the can be built to handle serious power;  just have it completely
rebuilt using hardened and/or full race parts.  If you're looking for a
stronger, but less expensive 2004r, look for one from a Buick GN or
early 80's 4-4-2....the code on it is "OZ", if I'm not mistaken.  These
trannies are more performance oriented...the internal pressures are
increased, giving a stronger shift, and they also have higher shift
points when you've buried the pedal in the firewall.

Thanks to everybody who furthered my education on the 2004r...

S. Dave Ward

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:43:16 -0500
From: RC Hellebuyck <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Centennial lampost banner

Well, they say a fool and his money are soon parted.  I recently
demonstrated this by spending $100. on a silkscreened vinyl banner.  But
ohhh what an awesome banner!

For anyone who "really" wants one of those lampost centennial banners,
(the 8' one), but can't justify the $100. price tag, here's some
"justification" help;  (my "top-ten" list of reasons)

1.)  $100. would buy you and your spouse about one-and-a-half dinners at
a nice restaurant (including tip and assuming you both have drinks)
enjoying the food only lasts a short time and it's gone forever...if
your "regular" that is :)

2.)  $100. - think of it as a one time, state "right to drive your
vintage Oldsmobile" tax.  The "sticker" just happens to be much larger
and must be hung in plain, visible site in your garage.

3.)  The new $100. bills look phony anyway....pretend one of yours is!

4.)  As a goodwill jesture, you buy all your co-workers a drink at a
bar.  They send you an "oversized" thank you card!

5.)  You REALLY want that damn banner and your hundred bucks will be
spent on some X-mas gift you'll love to hate!

6.)  Congress can waste "your money"....why can't you!

7.)  You won't live to see Olds' Bi-centennial celebration

8.)  It's one more thing the wife won't let you hang in the living room.

9.)  Now you can tell that "how you climbed up the lightpole in Lansing
to get a banner" story, and have physical proof!

10.)  The tube it comes in can be used to launch bottle rockets for next
fourth of July.

Hey, these worked for me!  :)

- --
RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:22:06 -0500
From: RC Hellebuyck <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Centennial lampost banner

Well, they say a fool and his money are soon parted.  I recently
demonstrated this by spending $100. on a silkscreened vinyl banner.  But
ohhh what an awesome banner!

For anyone who "really" wants one of those lampost centennial banners,
(the 8' one), but can't justify the $100. price tag, here's some
"justification" help;  (my "top-ten" list of reasons)

1.)  $100. would buy you and your spouse about one-and-a-half dinners at
a nice restaurant (including tip and assuming you both have drinks)
enjoying the food only lasts a short time and it's gone forever...if
your "regular" that is :)

2.)  $100. - think of it as a one time, state "right to drive your
vintage Oldsmobile" tax.  The "sticker" just happens to be much larger
and must be hung in plain, visible site in your garage.

3.)  The new $100. bills look phony anyway....pretend one of yours is!

4.)  As a goodwill jesture, you buy all your co-workers a drink at a
bar.  They send you an "oversized" thank you card!

5.)  You REALLY want that damn banner and your hundred bucks will be
spent on some X-mas gift you'll love to hate!

6.)  Congress can waste "your money"....why can't you!

7.)  You won't live to see Olds' Bi-centennial celebration

8.)  It's one more thing the wife won't let you hang in the living room.

9.)  Now you can tell that "how you climbed up the lightpole in Lansing
to get a banner" story, and have physical proof!

10.)  The tube it comes in can be used to launch bottle rockets for next
fourth of July.

Hey, these work for me!  :)

- --
RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:55:51 -0800
From: Larry Polesnak <bullets@sgi.net>
Subject: Re: Centennial celebration plaque

RC Hellebuyck wrote:
>
> Yes I bought one of these beauties too!  If anyone has a 47' Olds and is
> interested in plaque ª1947, I would be willing to trade even.  You pay
> shipping both ways.
Hi RC, if you had ª1962 Iwould trade with you but I got ª1993..Same deal
if someone wants to trade me let me know...Larry Polesnak ..
                6    2    S   T    A    R   F    I    R    E
- --
                /\__________________/\_________________/\
           /\__/Amateur Radio Station  WB3KJG  ARES,RACES\__/\
      /\__/Skywarn/ 1O1Oª 459OO /BreezeShooters Number 87-279 \__/\
     / BreezeShooters web site   http://www.users.sgi.net/~wolfie/ \
    / 1962 STARFIRE"http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/downs/6250/" \
   -------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:56:48 -0500
From: RC Hellebuyck <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Olds lampost banner

Well, they say a fool and his money are soon parted.  I recently
demonstrated this by spending $100. on a silkscreened vinyl banner.  But
ohhh what an awesome banner!

For anyone who "really" wants one of those lampost centennial banners,
(the 8' one), but can't justify the $100. price tag, here's some
"justification" help;  (my "top-ten" list of reasons)

1.)  $100. would buy you and your spouse about one-and-a-half dinners at
a nice restaurant (including tip and assuming you both have drinks)
enjoying the food only lasts a short time and it's gone forever...if
your "regular" that is :)

2.)  $100. - think of it as a one time, state "right to drive your
vintage Oldsmobile" tax.  The "sticker" just happens to be much larger
and must be hung in plain, visible site in your garage.

3.)  The new $100. bills look phony anyway....pretend one of yours is!

4.)  As a goodwill jesture, you buy all your co-workers a drink at a
bar.  They send you an "oversized" thank you card!

5.)  You REALLY want that damn banner and your hundred bucks will be
spent on some X-mas gift you'll love to hate!

6.)  Congress can waste "your money"....why can't you!

7.)  You won't live to see Olds' Bi-centennial celebration

8.)  It's one more thing the wife won't let you hang in the living room.

9.)  Now you can tell that "how you climbed up the lightpole in Lansing
to get a banner" story, and have physical proof!

10.)  The tube it comes in can be used to launch bottle rockets for next
fourth of July.

Hey, these worked for me!  :)

- --
RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 12:53:16 -0500
From: Jason Labay <z28cfi@gwis.com>
Subject: Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)

Kevin Wong wrote:
>
>  While it may be true that the Porshe flat-6 cylinder banks are more
>  acoustically isolated in comparison to a regular V8, keep in mind that GM
>  chose to use dual knock sensors even on the LT1 engine.

Kevin, curious....does your LT1 have dual knock sensors? I am pretty
sure that 4th generation f-bodies and my Impala do not have dual knock
sensors. A popular mod on these cars is to "desensitize" them so they do
not induce much retard when racing. There has been a great amount of
talk on knock sensors on the f-body list and it is even incorporated in
the FAQ now on how to desensitize them. Many f-bodies suffer from
"false" retard in the lower rpm's by as much as 5-10 degrees which
really hurts the e.t's. This has been confirmed at the track by using
Diacom diagnostic software. At work we have an LT1 designed for a 92
Corvette on our dyno and it contains only one knock sensor. Just curious
as maybe the Roadmasters, Cadillac's with LT1's got dual sensors?

Jason Labay (z28cfi@gwis.com) Akron, OH
Quality Engineer - TRW Automotive Group, Inc.
95 Impala SS
80 Olds 442 W-30
75 Hurst/Olds W-25

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:04:45 -0500
From: RC Hellebuyck <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Triple postings SORRY!

SORRY everyone about posting the banner thing three times.

I sent multiple messages Before AND After the banner post and the
lampost banner message didn't show.  So, I thought it didn't go through
and re-sent it. :(

OK, I'm not allowed to drive my car for a month.

- --
RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:14:35 -0500
From: RC Hellebuyck <mrhell@sprynet.com>
Subject: Re: Olds Centennial stuff!

Larry Polesnak wrote:
>RC,whats the book about?>


As off the back cover;

"More than just a car book, setting the pace is a candid, in-depth look
at America's oldest surviving car company.  This thorough chronicle
examines not only the vehicles Oldsmobile produced, but also profiles
the people and events that shaped the company's long and eventful
history".

Oldsmobiles first 100 years. 496 pages   Larry, buy this book!  It's a
steal for $12.95


- --
RC Hellebuyck
1971 4-4-2 covt.

http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 13:20:26 -0500
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: Glove box Owner's Manual

Hi All

When recently trying to decide what literature to offer for sale I notice
a big difference in glove box owner's manual and would like to ask why so
many differences and which kind belong with which car.

My example:

1970 - I have two very different design manuals
1. Is a pinkish hue with a large Rocket symbol to the left, with Owner's
Manual written in large letters across the top.  Beneath that is written
"Important Operating Safety and Maintenance Instructions".  The manual says
its for 4-4-2 - CUTLASS SUPREME - F-85 - STATION WAGONS.  Across the bottom
is a banner with "1970 OLDSMOBILE"  Written.
2. Is a pinkish color that looks like woodgrain has small boxes in lower
center first one read "GM" second one reads "Important Operating Safety and
Maintenance Instructions" and the third box read "1970 OLDSMOBILE" Below
the boxes is written in small black letters"4-4-2 - CUTLASS SUPREME
- -CUTLASS - F-85 - STATION WAGONS"

Why the two different designs and which belong with my cars.

All my years have two very different designs for basically the same manual
why are there two designs?

Also I seem t have a lot of plastic container for these manuals and other
information manuals the plastic container is called a "Glove box wallet"
these also come in a  many Different design. I have six different ones.

A bunch of these will be forsale but before I sell I want to know what to
keep for my cars.

Robert Schinkel

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:43:23 -0800
From: Larry Polesnak <bullets@sgi.net>
Subject: Centennial Plaque ª1962 Looking to trade

Hi everyone,I am looking for Plaque ª1962..If you have it and don't mine
trading,I will pay shipping both ways.The reason I would like ª1962 I
have a 1962 Starfire.Thank You and have a nice day.. Larry Polesnak
- --
                /\_____1962_________/\____STARFIRE_____/\
           /\__/Amateur Radio Station  WB3KJG  ARES,RACES\__/\
      /\__/Skywarn/ 1O1Oª 459OO /BreezeShooters Number 87-279 \__/\
     / BreezeShooters web site   http://www.users.sgi.net/~wolfie/ \
    / 1962 STARFIRE"http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/downs/6250/" \
   -------------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:47:11 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Olds Centennial stuff!

RC Hellebuyck wrote:

> Hell-of-a-book for $13.00!

Great looking ride RC.  What kind of stuff (highly technical term there)
is in the book?  How long is it and what is covered in it?  Maybe I
missed it being discussed on the list when it went through, but I
haven't seen anything on it.  TIA

Don Sowers

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 13:52:32 EST
From: RCKTPWR <RCKTPWR@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Centennial lampost banner

Yup!!!!  I got the plack and the 100th Banner!!!!!!

ROCKET POWER
   ROCKET OLDS !!!!!!!
Bernie

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 11:53:06 -0700
From: Dustin Cross <livnrt@mssl.uswest.net>
Subject: Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl

> >          When i try to start car, it makes a screaching
noise.Engine will
> not
> >turn over.
>
> Well, you're not going to like this...
>
> You've ground off some teeth from the flywheel on your car; repair involves


is it possible that the starter is merely not engaging?    I had a
couple ch*vy starters that just before they died would occasionly make
some really awful noise
I'd drop the starter and inspect the flywheel before I made plans to
drop the tranny

Dustin

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 11:53:09 -0700
From: Dustin Cross <livnrt@mssl.uswest.net>
Subject: Re: sounds

Mike Rothe wrote:

> "Well, I saved my pennies and my dollars too,
> Before I knew that my dream would come true,
> When I would buy a brand new 442......"
>
> "My 4-barrel, 4-speed, dual exhaust, 442......"


COOL!!    anybody know a band?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 13:59:55 +0000
From: ejhufnagel@juno.com (Edward J. Hufnagel)
Subject: 425 4bbl and intake

      Does anyone know where I can get an intake manifold and a 4 bbl
Q-jet for my '66 425?  Thanks for any and all help.
                  E.J.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:58:26 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Triple postings SORRY!

RC Hellebuyck wrote:
So, I thought it didn't go through and re-sent it. :(
OK, I'm not allowed to drive my car for a month.

RC,

For you to accept a self-imposed sentence that harsh must mean the
weather is really lousy in your area and you don't want to get your baby
out in the mess anyway.  :)

Just sit in the corner for 2 minutes and repeat, I didn't mean to, I
didn't mean to....

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 13:59:29 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Olds Centennial stuff!

RC Hellebuyck wrote:
>
> Larry Polesnak wrote:
> >RC,whats the book about?>
>
> As off the back cover;
>
> "More than just a car book, setting the pace is a candid, in-depth look
> at America's oldest surviving car company.  This thorough chronicle
> examines not only the vehicles Oldsmobile produced, but also profiles
> the people and events that shaped the company's long and eventful
> history".
>
> Oldsmobiles first 100 years. 496 pages   Larry, buy this book!  It's a
> steal for $12.95
>
> --
> RC Hellebuyck
> 1971 4-4-2 covt.
>
> http://home.sprynet.com/sprynet/mrhell/driving.htm

Where and how do we get copies?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 13:58:51 EST
From: RCKTPWR <RCKTPWR@aol.com>
Subject: Re: sounds

In a message dated 97-12-06 10:28:40 EST, you write:

<<
 "My 4-barrel, 4-speed, dual exhaust, 442......"

 Just a thought...

 Mike Rothe
  >>
Hey, how did you know thats how I sing it!!!!!!!
Bernie (whats a 45??)  Just kidn, hell, Im 32!!

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:05:44 EST
From: RCKTPWR <RCKTPWR@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl

Ummm, just another opinion, you might get lucky and it could be just the
starter solinoid, but probably the flywheel teeth are a little chewed up, but
the teeth might be good enough to still work.
But sooner or later............it will be flywheel time.

2 cents worth
Bernie

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 15:16:15 -0400 (AST)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: Re: Olds Centennial stuff!

On Sat, 6 Dec 1997, Don Sowers wrote:
> >
> > Oldsmobiles first 100 years. 496 pages   Larry, buy this book!  It's a
> > steal for $12.95
> > --
> > RC Hellebuyck
>
> Where and how do we get copies?

Alpha One marketing has them -- leftovers from their booth in Lansing,
along with all of the other stuff we've talked about. Pins, shirts,
banners, etc.

800-338-2955

The book is excellent. Olds sent all OCA members a complimentary copy
last year. It's a history of the company more than the cars, but still
an excellent read for Olds buffs. Pictures are fabulous. Get it.

Greg Beaulieu    ab348@chebucto.ns.ca    Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:54:39 EST
From: Dan442Olds <Dan442Olds@aol.com>
Subject: Re: Propane question

In a message dated 97-12-06 03:07:48 EST, you write:

<<  If anyone has had any experiences with Propane, plese tell me
 what to do and what not to do.  I live in Calgary, Alberta so it gets
 pretty cold up here.  I have a heated garage (private 2 car).  So, can I
 put the car in the garage over night. The reason why I ask is if there was
 a  Propane leak from the Regancy, then would the furnace not blow up the
 car with a half of block taken down from Oldsmobile shrapnel. >>
I have ran various engines on propane for about 30 years.  Never,never, never
park a propane vechicle in any closed structure (garage, barn, etc.).  You are
right about what can happen - it can leak and blow up when sparked.  The local
shop in my area that does these conversions will always ask if you intend to
park the vechicle in a garage.  If you say yes, they will refuse to install
the system.  Also, propane is heaver than air.  It will sink to the lower part
of your garage.  So you may walk in and not smell it, but, light up a
cigeratte and you'll find out real fast.  I have seen 2 garages blown up from
leaking propane systems but the most heartbreaking of all happened to a
neighbor in 1992.  He had a barn on his farm in which he had 6 57 Chevys, 2
hardtops and 4 convertibles.  All were originial fuel injected, documented,
and immaculately restored.  He had won a lot of shows with those cars.   Also
he had a lot of farm and shop equipment in that barn.  One night a storm was
getting close so he and his son parked 2 propane pickups in that barn.  They
were loaded with seed that they did not want to get wet.  Apparently one of
the pickups had a leak.  Lightening struck and the rest is history.  The
pickups were parked at the front of the barn so that when the propane hoses
burned off, it was like a blowtorch going right everything else in that
building.  A lot of the sheetmetal actually melted.  Everything in the barn
was a loss, even the anvil.  It got so hot that when it was hit with a hammer,
it broke into several pieces.
I know I got off track a little bit but remember propane has its place.   Just
be extra careful.

Sincerely,

Dan442Olds
1770 442 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 15:00:04 -0800
From: "David, Terri and Rob" <hoagie@emeraldis.com>
Subject: Re: 1977 oldsmobile omega 305 v8 2bbl

RCKTPWR wrote:
>
> Ummm, just another opinion, you might get lucky and it could be just the
> starter solinoid, but probably the flywheel teeth are a little chewed up, but
> the teeth might be good enough to still work.
> But sooner or later............it will be flywheel time.
>
> 2 cents worth
> Bernie


1 last option...could be the teeth on the starter also.....usually its
the flywheel....but lightning can strike twice in the same spot...Hoagie

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 16:07:02 -0400
From: "Robert J. Lavey" <rjlavey@rmci.net>
Subject: Wanted: '68 Steering Column

Hi Gang,

I'm looking for a floor shift steering column for my '68 442.  I don't care
if it's tilt or not.  Has anyone got one?

Thanks,
Bob
- -----------------------------------------------------------------
 Robert J. Lavey                         email: rjlavey@rmci.net
 13243 W. Dahlia Dr.                     Home:  (208) 939-5418
 Boise, ID  83713-1302                   Fax:   (208) 939-5452
- -----------------------------------------------------------------

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 14:45:22 -0500
From: Steve Ochs <Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com>
Subject: Transmission Models/Ratios

Message text written by INTERNET:Igor
>The third question is if anyone knows, what are the gear ratios of the
TH200R4. Also, if you know, what are the ratios of TH250, 350, 400 trans<

I posted this information before and it is in the Olds Faq, here is an
abbreviated version:


     Here are some common tranmission gear ratios:

     Transmission
        Model           First   Second   Third   Fourth   Reverse
     Rear Wheel Drive:
     TH-180C (3L30)     2.400   1.479    1.000     ---     2.000
     TH-200-4R          2.741   1.568    1.000    0.674    2.067
     TH-350             2.52    1.52     1.00      ---
     TH-400 (3L80)      2.482   1.482    1.000     ---     2.077
     TH-700-R4 (4L60)   3.059   1.625    1.000    0.696    2.294
     4L30-E             2.400   1.479    1.000    0.723    2.000
     4L30-E Optional    2.860   1.620    1.000    0.723    2.000
     4L60-E             3.059   1.625    1.000    0.696    2.294
     4L80-E             2.482   1.482    1.000    0.750    2.077

     Front Wheel Drive:
     TH-125C (3T40)     2.840   1.600    1.000     ---     2.067
     TH-440-T4 (4T60)   2.921   1.568    1.000    0.705    2.385
     4T60-E             2.921   1.568    1.000    0.705    2.385
     4T65-E             2.921   1.568    1.000    0.705    2.385
     4T80-E             2.960   1.626    1.000    0.681    2.130

    Steve Ochs aka N8TYS- Mfg. Engineer - GM Powertrain - Parma Plant
Transmission Division (4T60/65-E) - Steve_Ochs@compuserve.com
The statements and opinions expressed here are NOT an official
statement of General Motors or the GM Powertrain Division

'97 Chevy Blazer LT 4x4 4.3L V6    '96 DCM Impala SS 5.7L V8
'87 Olds Cutlass 442 307 V8        '61 GMC 1500 Fleetside 305 V6

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 17:02:17 -0500
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: Vinyl top question

Igor wrote:
> The car is a frost metalic green with
> a light green interior and a light grey top.

Igor,

I believe that you will find that not only is the vinyl top on the
Regency cracked, it is badly faded.  The color you are referring to is
called Light Jadestone Metallic (code 45), which is also the vinyl roof
color (code J).  Interior color is also Jadestone.  The only gray vinyl
top color they had that year was Slate and it was rather dark.  I'm sure
a local upholstery shop can find (or dye) vinyl to match what you need.
I'm thinking you'd spend $500?  Don't know, I've never had one replaced.

Paul
- --
Paul Hartlieb
Myerstown, PA
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

Is it true that cannibals don't eat clowns because they taste funny?

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 17:40:08 EST
From: CRuper1 <CRuper1@aol.com>
Subject: My answers... (Re: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)

In a message dated 97-12-05 23:11:49 EST, you write:

<<
 BIGJERMES@aol.com wrote:
 >
 > do yourself a favor and do not go over 9.0:1 compression!!!  trust me on
this
 > one, i have 9.0:1 and it is absolutely on the virge of detonation all the
 > time, even on 93 octane amoco.

 Something's definately not right...the Porsche 911 3.3L V6 (non-turbo)
 is making 282bhp, and running at 11.3:1 compression. If a high-winding,
 air-cooled engine run fine at over 11:1 with 93 octane, but you can't
 with 9:1?  C'mon....that's ignition problems all the way.>>

Actually, it's most likely due in part to engineering.  I would bet that the
Porche has spent a little extra time doing the combustion chamber/piston face
up to allow them to increase compression.  It may also have to do with layout
of the valves/head also.    There are ways of making an engine "work" with the
higher compression, but it takes money, and time.

Also, one other thing to point out is that with the higher compression, and
the knock sensor playing with the timing, the engine may not be allowed to run
at "optimal" timing, at all times.  Meaning the computer may change the spark
timing so that you don't get knock.  My guess.....  I'd bet it's the
combustion chamber/piston face work.
(BTW, motorcycles have been running up above 10:1 on the street for quite some
time (alot of high performance bikes run near 12:1 actually), and I'm sure
that has something to do with head/valve/combustion chamber/piston face
combination.)

 Here's a question for the more mechanically inclined...how would dual
 knock sensors (in the Porsche) operate better than just one?  Is it
 because of the high compression?
 S. Dave Ward  >>

Here again, it may have something to do with the design.  Is this motor
aluminum, with cast iron sleeves?  It may be that the material doesn't allow
the vibration to transfer over to the other side (too much dampening effect of
the material).

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 17:03:21 -0600
From: "Craig & Terry Gilbert" <74comet@email.msn.com>
Subject: Which Oil

I may show my ignorance here, but I have a question about motor oil grade. I
live in Texas where temperatures get quite warm in the summer, and we never
have extremely cold weather. I ahve always believed that the best oil to use
in my cars, both old and new, was good quality straight 30W. I have never
used multi-grade because to me they feel awfully thin. I have heard
arguments from well meaning friends both for and against my position. I
would like to know what some of you think. Am I thinking wrong? Won't a good
thick oil protect better than a thinner one?

Craig Gilbert
74Comet@Email.msn.com
'41 Dynamic Cruiser (I hope)

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 18:01:54 -0500
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Olds History Center Fax?

I inadvertantly erased, or just plain can't find, the post that
contained the numbers to the Olds History Center.  Wasn't there a fax
number and phone number?  E-mail me privately with the numbers to make
sure I'm not wasting more bandwidth.

Thanks,
Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 18:40:15 -0500
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Which Oil

> I may show my ignorance here, but I have a question about motor oil grade. I
> live in Texas where temperatures get quite warm in the summer, and we never
> have extremely cold weather. I ahve always believed that the best oil to use
> in my cars, both old and new, was good quality straight 30W.

It's not completely about whether the oil feels thin or not, it's
whether the oil can stand the heat, pressure, shear forces, and maintain
the "wedge".  A tight clearanced engine wouldn't NEED heavier oil, where
as a loosely clearanced engine probably would need it.  Like Castrol 50W
racing oil.  It is designed to be used in high performance competition
engines that have large, sloppy clearances.  With the oil thicker like
this, it has enough "wedge" in the larger clearances.  Today's oils are
far superior to the older versions, actually, the oil's the same, but
the additives are better.  Keeping the oil flowing past the bearings,
removing heat, and maintaining a wedge of oil in the journal areas are
it's main goal.  As long as it keeps the metal from touching, it is
effective.  Thinner oils are used in the newer cars, because let's face
it, many are low on horsepower and torque, and heavy oils will increase
fluid friction, thus robbing a little more horsies from the underpowered
engines.  Essentially, the 30W oil used in your climate should work ok.

I personally follow the manufacturer recommendations, for they have
spent a grunch of money on research, while I haven't.  After all, if you
are using the wrong oil, your engine will tell you sooner or later.
Regularly changed, you should experience a long life from your engine
oil-wise.  Consumer Reports found in their NY cab real world oil tests,
that "regular" oils work completely fine if changed regularly even under
severe use, such as in the taxis, and even recommended that the oil
change intervals could even be increased.  However, 3K or 3 months is
what I do, better safe than sorry.

Opinion,
Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 17:42:14 -0600
From: "Charles F. Kemp" <bloom@gorilla.net>
Subject: Re: Xmas

John,
 You are an excellent writer and are correct on all points.





At 06:47 AM 12/5/97 -0800, you wrote:
>---"Richard E. Hart" <rehartsr@oregontrail.net> wrote:
>Well Friend,
>If you really prefer the intellectual approach and choose not to hear an
>occasional XXXX, then you have probably never turned a wrench; it comes
>from the skinned knuckles.<SNIP>
>
>>>I take GREAT offense at the mechanical slam. I do ALL of my own work
>and always have! How do you think I can keep so many cars running! OK,
>I'll give on the creative spelling/language....wouldn't want this to
>become a Barney list ;) BTW I have skinned my knuckles plenty of times!
>
>And (Please note that beginning a sentence with "and" is incorrect
>grammar) regarding the "mine is faster than yours" debates, those were
>created when Dr. Oldsmobile produced his first muscle car, it comes
>with the territory.  Further, we all know 4 4 2 is pronounced 4 4 2.
>
>>>AND :) I don't mine a car debate but what I was really complaining
>about is dissention among our ranks and the babyish remarks and
>personal attacks in ~some~ of the posts! You may not remember the
>infamous 4 4 2 pronuncation debate but it was UGLY!
>
>Since you appear to NOT be happy, may I recommend you try one of those
>places whose E-MAIL address ends in edu.
>
>>>WRONG! I am very happpy with the Olds list (as well as the Toro
>list!). To finally find so many folks with like interests is
>refreshing......there's few if any Olds fanatics in our town!
>
>Warmest personal regards, your friend, Rick
>
>>>Thanks! Maybe you can come over sometime: we can turn some wrenchs
>and cuss a bit!
>
>===
>John Pajak                            JSPajak@rocketmail.com
>Lexington Park, Maryland  HTTP://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak
>
>65 Delta 88 2dr    70 Cutlass S 2dr       72 Cutlass conv
>66 Toronado deluxe 70 Cutlass S W31       72 Delta 88 conv
>69 Cutlass S 2dr   70 442 W30 conv        72 442 W30 conv
>70 Cutlass S 2dr   71 Cutlass Supreme 2dr 86 Cutlass Supreme
>
>_________________________________________________________
>DO YOU YAHOO!?
>Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 19:05:00 -0500
From: "Jason K. Adcock" <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: Transmission Models/Ratios

Steve Ochs wrote:
>
>      Transmission
>         Model           First   Second   Third   Fourth   Reverse
>      Rear Wheel Drive:
>      TH-180C (3L30)     2.400   1.479    1.000     ---     2.000
>      TH-200-4R          2.741   1.568    1.000    0.674    2.067

Can I assume that my TH-200-C would have the ratios of the TH-200-4R, just
without the fourth gear?  Or would it be closer to the TH-180-C?  It FEELS
closer to the TH-180-C!
_____________________________

Jason K. Adcock
mailto:jadcock@vt.edu
http://www.erols.com/adcockjk

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:04:24 -0500 (EST)
From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Subject: Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)

Hi Jason,

> Kevin, curious....does your LT1 have dual knock sensors? I am pretty
> sure that 4th generation f-bodies and my Impala do not have dual knock
> sensors. A popular mod on these cars is to "desensitize" them so they do
> not induce much retard when racing. There has been a great amount of

Yes, my '95 Fleetwood has dual knock sensors, as well as every late
model Impala I've looked under!  I'm fairly certain that all B/D LT1 cars
have a KS screwed into each side of the block, which also serve as coolant
drain plugs.  I am familiar with the desensitizing circuit you mentioned,
and have had the opportunity to put it to the test on my uncle's '88
Caprice.  This particular car has a bad lifter from when the aluminum
intake/gasket junction was leaking coolant internally; the resulting
valvetrain noise at 1800 rpm and over is of sufficient intensity to
induce a false positive signal.  The 25% reduction circuit restored some
lost power in this case.  My Diacom readings on B/D LT1's and an '88 Olds
307 do not indicate that the KS circuit receives false readings.
Sometimes when the throttle is flipped open quickly, not allowing
time for the computer to compensate, there can be a bit of transient
detonation.  I'm amazed at how quickly the PCM/ECM reacts to knock counts
and reinstates timing when conditions permit.  On '88+ 307's, the ECM can
retard the spark up to 12 degrees, after which audible detonation occurs.
Lately, the low-grade fuel around here seems to have much lower knock
resistance compared to a few months ago - a seasonal formulation change?

Kevin Wong       mailto:brougham@geocities.com       Toronto, Ontario, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 20:07:35 -0500
From: "Jason K. Adcock" <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: Knock sensors (was: Rebuild/Upgrade kits....)

Kevin Wong wrote:
>
> Lately, the low-grade fuel around here seems to have much lower knock
> resistance compared to a few months ago - a seasonal formulation change?

Well, we have an additive in the gasoline around here in the winter that is
supposed to "both reduce the chance of freezing and reduce emissions".  I
suppose this different additive might make the pinging worse.  It certainly
has on my 84 307.  I'm going to change the EGR valve over Christmas break,
so hopefully that will stop all the knock noise!
_____________________________

Jason K. Adcock
mailto:jadcock@vt.edu
http://www.erols.com/adcockjk

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:16:14 -0500 (EST)
From: "Peg O'Connor" <peg@grove.ufl.edu>
Subject: Re: JWO

Greg, I just got my copy yesterday.  It looks great!  They didn't do much
editing, if any at all, and it's just wonderful.  I still like my "Longest
Treadlife" award, although that may change in May if I finally graduate
from UF, despite my best efforts.  <G>
PS -- When you get yours, let me know whose car that is with the black
Calais emblem on the right-hand page!  Or didn't you have any say in those
pics, either??

8)
peg

------------------------------

Date: 6 Dec 1997 20:20:56 EDT
From: Wyatt@jobax.net
Subject: Re: Propane question

The fork lift mechanic at work tells me that propane goes to liquid
somewhere around -30 degrees F.  He claims you can actually pour it out
of the tank onto the ground at that point.  This issue came up
concerning our LP powered truck that we use and keep out side.  He added
the parts to make it dual fuel, gasoline or propane.  It will run in
cold weather now.  We had a tough time with it in the winter.  Now it
runs great on gasoline in cold weather.


Dave Wyatt
70  4-4-2

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:38:08 EST
From: DR OLDS350 <DROLDS350@aol.com>
Subject: Painting

Hi All,

       I am looking for a place to have my car painted. I called up a few
places and thier prices were around 3-4000 dollars. I was on my way to a place
to see if they would repair my hood and I noticed Macco. I went inside and
asked a few questions. They said that they can blast the car and paint it with
a base coat clear coat for 599 dollars. Has anyone on the list had any
expierence with Macco at all? If so, how did you like the job they did on your
car? How much does a good paint job run for a car that has no rust?


Jim / DROLDS350@aol.com
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/w31pictures.html">1970 Cutlass W31
</A>
1970 Rallye 350
Check out my web page at:
<A HREF="http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html">
http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html</A>
http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/w31pictures.html

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:42:19 EST
From: DR OLDS350 <DROLDS350@aol.com>
Subject: 1970 Bucket Seats

Olds List Members:

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 19:48:03 -0600
From: Thomas & Jodie Martin <jmartin@NetwurX.net>
Subject: E4MC Carb for 80's 307

I found out today why I could not adjust my TPS easily.  The airhorn and
floatbowl are warped due to overtorquing of the carb to intake bolts.  I do
not know if I did or the previous owner, I don't think I did, but the previous
owner, my dad, did have an assembly problem where something got pinched.  Does
anyone have one that they would be willing to part with?

I would prefer a 85, but probably any from 83-90 would be fine.  (I do not
know what the 81-82's were like)  If it from another CCC engine that is fine,
as long as it has the straight fuel inlet, not like the Chªvy's.

If  anyone has any advice, please let me know.  I'm sure there are plenty of
people out there who have ditched the CCC.  I do not mind if it needs to be
rebuilt.

Please email me privately so we don't take up too much bandwidth.

Thanks!
Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 20:47:08 EST
From: DR OLDS350 <DROLDS350@aol.com>
Subject: Re: 1970 Bucket Seats

Olds List Members:
For the first time I was taking off the 1970 seat covers on my passenger
bucket and the back seat. When I was doing the front bucket I noticed that
there was a wire or hook that was almost like a twisted rope that was attached
to the foam by the hog rings. Do I cut the hog ring or cut the blue fabric?
Can any one offer me any tips on putting in upholstery. I plan on going to
Tamaraz because they are in the neighorhood. Has anyone ever delt with them?
Please Help, I am a real beginner, but excited to learn.

Jim / DROLDS350@aol.com
1970 Cutlass W31
1970 Rallye 350
Check out my web page at:
http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/W45.html
http://members.aol.com/DROLDS350/w31pictures.html

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 19:56:43 -0600
From: Thomas & Jodie Martin <jmartin@NetwurX.net>
Subject: Looking for 76 98 4dr

I am starting to look around for a decent shape 76 98.  I want a nice car for
highway cruising on trips.  It is either a big land yacht or a minivan,
someone please help!!!  I have 2 kids now, and my wife wants 1 more.  I also
want a car that can tow easily if I want.  The rated towing capacity of a 76
Delta 88 and 98 is 7000 lbs with the towing package.  Works for me!

I had a 76 Delta 88 Royale, and miss it, and would like to find a nice 98 from
the 1976 year.  I am not concerned if the engine runs, but I do want the 455
there.  In 76 the EPA rated the 455 in the Delta 98 and Toro at 12 city and 18
highway.  That is not too bad in my book.

If anyone has one that they would be willing to part with in the next year or
so, please let me know.

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 21:40:53 -0500
From: Don Sowers <dstaxpro@lex.infi.net>
Subject: Re: Painting

DR OLDS350 wrote:
I noticed Macco. I went inside and
> asked a few questions. They said that they can blast the car and paint it 
with
> a base coat clear coat for 599 dollars. Has anyone on the list had any
> expierence with Macco at all? If so, how did you like the job they did on 
your
> car? How much does a good paint job run for a car that has no rust?

I helped my father repaint cars for about 8 years when I was growing up,
so I feel I know a little about a good paint job vs bad.  I have never
had a car painted there, but have seen a few of their jobs here in
Lexington, Ky.  Let me put it this way, I wouldn't take a daily beater
there let alone one I planned on keeping for a long time.  In my
opinion, it just isn't very well done.  The money is cheap enough
generally, but in this case I think you actually DO get what you pay
for.  If you are thinking of going that way, read their guarantee VERY
carefully.  Notice what it omits as well as what it covers.

In my area, you can generally figure out the anticipated labor by
subtracting the cost of paint and supplies and dividing the remaining
money quoted by the prevailing labor rate in your area (here it is
around 30/hour).  That will give you the approximate number of hours the
body man expects to spend on your pride and joy.  If that seems like
ample time, then you will probably be happy.  Understand, though what
you figure is not necessarily what WILL be spent on it.  They get in a
hurry, the potential for half stepping is there.

Let me put it this way,  a member of my family got his Olds painted by
MAACO, Earl Scheib or one of them and looked like crap a week later.
Hope this is of some assistance.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 18:58:50 -0500
From: "W-MACHINES" <W-MACHINES@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Oldsmobile Clipart???

Cecil- Check the FAQs  there are several.  I have a scanner- maybe I'll
make some W-41 ones!

Kurt    W-MACHINES@prodigy.net
'65 Jetstar 1 4-speed                   '70 Toronado GT W-34 4-sale
'66 442 Sport Coupe 4-speed       '92 Achieva SCX W-41
'66 442 F-85 Deluxe factory L-69  '90 Trofeo

- ----------
> From: NotDads442@aol.com
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Oldsmobile Clipart???
> Date: Thursday, December 04, 1997 7:53 AM
>
> Does anybody about there have any Oldsmobile related clipart??
>
> I bought this little business card making program and would like to put
some
> Olds stuff on them.
>
> Thanks
> Cecil
> 1991 W41
> OCA ª29604

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:13 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: Re: EGR is not A.I.R. (was: olds help, ?'s, info, goodies

I think I have ceated a monter!  I never intended this thread to do in this
direction.  In fact, just forget the whole EGR vs. AIR business, ok?  I posted
what I thought were several other more important topics and questions.  I
thank everyone for providing some type of input, but it is far from what I
expected.

==========
To make my own rocket roadworthy agian, it needs all new tires, ball joints
and new tie rod ends too. (The steering's real loose.) I really would like to
get this fixed soon at the least cost to me.  I understand that the car has
to be aligned as the final step to all this work, but can I do the other
stuff myself?  What all is involved in replacing upper and lower ball joints
and tie rod ends?  What special tools do I need?  I know a lot more than
average for my age, but not as much as I would like to.  I was thinking about
maybe doing the tie rod ends and ball joints then letting the shop do the
tires and stuff.  Plus, the recent cold damp weather makes me think that I
will not get the time to do the ball joints myself outside. (I have no
garage.)  If I do them myself I am on a VERY limited budget.

==========
I saw the part in the FAQ about how to ID your exhaust manifolds, and I
decided to check on mine.  The FAQ says they should be (driver's side) W
402295 but mine is Y 380001LH... does that mean I have the first ones cast
from some unknown year?  I know my car did come with single exhaust but it
has duals now.

Also I checked my carb and intake numbers, and they both appear to be from
1975.  I know from the VIN that it came with a 2bbl, so I figure that whoever
converted it to a 4bbl swapped in a 75 setup.  My question is- Does this
affect the flow any?  Would converting it to a 4bbl put any more stress on
the engine if it came stock with 2bbls?  Probably not.  I've also heard that
there were two versions of the quadrajet in '75- 750 cfm and 795 cfm.  If
this is true, then how do you tell them apart?

My intake has an EGR on it, but I figure that since the '72 heads aren't set
up for an EGR valve that it did not matter.  I disconnected and plugged the
hose anyway.  I also noticed that underneath the grime, my intake and water
neck are painted bright blue (kinda metallic bright blue).  I know that some
of the BB Olds engines were painted blue, but BB intakes should be quite a
bit wider than SB ones, so I am wondering what this intake came off of.


==========
After my car warms up, some blue smoke eminates from the pipes (mostly the
driver's side one).  I know that somehow it is burning oil, but it was never
that bad before.  Now, when I got the car, the hose from the breather cap to
the air cleaner was a piece of garden hose.  I tossed it, thinking that it
was no better than nothing.  All the recent talk about draft tubes and PCV
systems makes me wonder did the removal of this tube affect the blowby in
this side of the engine.  Also, when I changed the plugs, the one from
cylinder ª5 had some burnt oil deposits.  Could my valve seals be gone,
causing the burning of oil in cyl ª5? If they are too complicated to replace,
I will just keep putting new oil in until rebuild time.  I replaced that old
garden hose and that did not help.  I also have replaced the PCV vlve and the
breather element.

==========
One last question, why would my car have a driveshaft from '70?  It looks to
have come from a junkyard because it says "70 OLDS" in yellow paint.  Also, I
cannot find the stamped letter code on my axle.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:09 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: Re: olds help, ?'s, info, goodies

In a message dated 97-11-21 09:51:52 EST, you write:

<< What does the 72 have for gauges? And does either have a power seat rack?
If
 so let me know $$Thanks for your help joe. >>

It has standard guages, and neither one has power seats.

Sorry,
Joel

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:28 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: Re: car craft / metal thing

In a message dated 97-11-26 03:23:23 EST, you write:

>On a completely unrelated note, I have a 72 cutlass supreme w/ the 350, and
>on the front portion of the intake manifold to the right of the carb
>(if you are standing in front of the car looking at the engine) there is
>a metal loop attached to the manifold that kind of looks like a coil strap,
>but it's not the coil strap since that's behind the carb- so what the heck
>is that thing for anyways?
>The 'metal strap' you are referring to is (or at least I've been told)
>an engine hoist strap. They must have used this thing forever as my
>uncle's (soon to be my brother's) '85 Cutlass 307 sports the same piece. >>


Yes, it sounds like an engine hoist strap.  However, there were many straps
that came on engines off the assembly line.  From what I saw in the factory
assembly manual it seems that there were pieces for holding down wiring
harnesses or vaccum lines or heater hoses or whatever.  Looks like something
used to tidy up the engine compartment which was thrown away after whatever it
held was disconnected or replaced.  A good way to tell a completely unmolested
engine would be to look and see these straps/clips with whatever they are
supposed to hold still in there.  So I think that it is a good thing to have
these clips.  I wish all of these were still on my car, along with the factory
wire looms.  They would look great chromed as detail peices.  Anyway, that's
what I get from reading the facory assembly manual, which has never been
wrong.(at least not that I know of)


Joel
'72 Cutlass S
350 4v  TH350

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:36 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: 90 Calais knockin' bad

Here I am agian asking another question.  The 1990 Cutlass Calais has the
Pontiac 4cyl engine and it knocks a lot of the time.  (Regularly up hills, but
not all the time.  Sometimes it knocks no matter what you are doing.)  Is this
possibly a bad EGR valve? (I hate to bring that up agian)  Could the coil pack
be messing up the timing?  I checked for trouble codes and got nothing from
the computer.  FWIW, a while back we thought we had lost an oil seal but it
turned out to be the tensioner for the timing chain had broke, allowing the
chain to swing out and cut a hole in the timing chain cover.  Lost most of the
oil, but everything was fixed.  I am also pretty sure that it has original
plugs and wires.  The TCC seems to act up sometimes as well, such as going 35
up a slight incline and occasionally even on flat roads at the same speed.  My
Father: "It shifts into overdrive too early!"  Maybe its a bad computer.
That's a bad (read: expensive) thought.

I would be greatly thankful to anyone who might have any advice for me.  Also,
does anyone know if these engines have a history of dropping head gaskets?

PLEASE: I am asking for help from people who have experience with this sort of
thing.  Do not reply with any personal opinions on the usefulness 4cyl
engines.  Do not reply saying, "make it a boat anchor!" or "I know what's
wrong- you're missing half the engine!".  Do not reply and quote my whole
message.  Everyone already got it once.

Joel
'72 Cutlass S
350 4v

'90 Cutlass Calais
151 TBI  -- this IS my father's Oldsmobile!

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:42 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: OCA request/Movie info

Anyone here on the list know what chapter of OCA North Carolina would be in?
How do I join up and how much is it?

To mix a few messages into one, everyone should check out the cover of the
Winter 1998 California Car Cover Co. catalog.  Looks like Santa's got him a
new sled... and it's an early 50's Olds convertible.  (www.calcarcover.com)
Saw some movies recently on TV, and as always I was on the lookout for Oldses.
"Crooklyn" (a Spike Lee joint) should definitely be added to the FAQ.  In one
of the early scenes there is a black 442 from the early 70's.  Looks like a
Vista is parked on the same street, but it is easier to spot in other scenes
later in the movie.
Does anyone know if that's a Delta that Dirty Harry drives in, well, "Dirty
Harry"?
Im sure that everyone has seen "A Christmas Story" on TV and we all remember
the part where the narrator says something like, "some men are methodist, but
my father, he is an oldsmobile man".  But does the guy's dad really drive an
Olds?
How about "Back to the Future II" about 3/4 through the movie, they end up in
a world where everyone drives old cars.  Then there is a drive by shooting out
of what looks like an A-body.  Could be a Pontiac, but I can't tell.
Also, on Hot Rod TV today, they had a special segment from Roy Hill on how to
do a burnout and showed a early 70's red Cutlass Supreme with OAI hood doing
just that.

Just thought you would like to know.

Joel
72 Cutlass S
350 4v

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:31 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: PARTS for sale/trade

These parts are mostly for  '71-'72 Cutlasses (they came of a '72), and
exceptions are noted.

USED but good condition

- - LH Front Turnsignal Lens
   w/screws                        $15
- - RH Front Turnsignal Lens
   w/screws                        $15
- - LH/RH Front Tunsignal Housing,
  reconditioned                   $20
- - Grille 'Oldsmobile' Script   $25
- - AM Deluxe Radio             OFFER
- - AM/FM  Mono Radio        OFFER
- - Bumper Jack, complete
  with lugwrench                 $60
- - Chrome Window channel
  (between 1/4 glass and door
   glass) pass. side            $30
- - 2 spare tire or hubcap wheels
  both 14in                        $20ea
- - side marker lens gasket
  new                               $4
- - 4X10 front speaker           OFFER

Email me for detailed descriptions on any of these parts and any questions
you may have.

BTW, I am in North Carolina, and you pay shipping please.  Although we can
negotiate.

Thanks,
Joel
1972 Cutlass S
350/4v

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:34 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: new problems, need HELP!

Help!  My power steering pump is leaking!  What are some common problems with
power steering pumps that may cause it to leak?

Also, I have to jump start my car to get it to run.  I think the alt is
probably bad, so how do I test it?  From what my literature says, it is the
integral regulator type, but that can't be right because it is a '72 Cutlass
and the integral reg type were not used on Cutlasses untill 73. (but it says
442's used them starting in '70) Anyway, I see a regulator on the firewall and
it looks brand new.  Also, the alt has 1 plug and one red wire out the back.

Thanks,

Joel
72 Cutlass S
350 4v  TH350

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 21:48:05 EST
From: Crown14 <Crown14@aol.com>
Subject: Re: SS wheel questions / gasket question

In a message dated 97-11-22 18:53:16 EST, you write:

<< Hehe, I got mine off an a Old Camaro.. Goes to show you olds are
 best... >>

I've seen Olds wheels on lots of other makes around here.  For example, a VW
Beetle and a M*nte C*rlo.  Lots of people say I should put Cragars or
Keystones on my Cutlass instead of my SSII's.  I laugh and say, "nahhh... I'll
just keep these."


Joel
72 Cutlass S
350 4v

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 06 Dec 1997 19:21:20 -0800
From: aguilars@pacbell.net
Subject: Parts Question from New Member

Hello all,

I just bought a 1970 4-4-2 that is all original, numbers matching, and
documented.  It is going to need a lot or work to restore it to its
original condition, but that is why I got it.  The interior is pretty
shot up but the body is in great condition.

Anyway, my brother has located a 1972 4-4-2 at a parts place that has an
interior that is in good shape.  My question is how compatible are the
interior, and all other parts for that matter, between a 1972 and 1970
4-4-2?  I am just starting and learning about olds, so any information
would be appreciated.  Thank you.

Joseph
1970 4-4-2, in the long process of restoration

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 22:47:02 -0500 (EST)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: 66 vs. 68 Toro?

Forwarded message:
>From wittchri Sat Dec  6 22:46:36 1997
Message-Id: <199712070346.WAA168584@pilot12.cl.msu.edu>
Subject: 66 vs. 68?
To: wittchri@pilot (me from myself), toro@armchair.mb.ca
Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 22:46:30 -0500 (EST)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25]
Content-Type: text/plain


Greetings fellow Toroists. The following feller sent me the inquiry, I don't
know that much about the diffs, anyone can help, please

- ---email HIM DIRECTLY at the address shown below. ---

NOTE that he is NOT a list member, so unless you cc him he will not get the
benefit of your wisdom. Thanks. -RS-

> From athong@students.wisc.edu Fri Dec  5 00:38:58 1997
> Date: Thu, 4 Dec 1997 23:38:55 -0600
> To: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
> From: Ted Edin <athong@students.wisc.edu>
> Subject: Re: Oldsmobiles
>
> >Greetings. I got a call from one Ted Edin today, said to contact him thusly.
> >Something about a 66 vs. 68 Toro?
> >
> Yessir, considering a '68.  I have a '66 (temp out of service), but was
> wondering about some of the developments after '67; performance, handling
> etc.
> -Ted


- --
Chris  B. Witt :=: wittchri@pilot.msu.edu :=: Location: Mecca [Lansing, MI]
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...


- --
Chris  B. Witt :=: wittchri@pilot.msu.edu :=: Location: Mecca [Lansing, MI]
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 22:50:00 -0500
From: "Robert Schinkel" <docbob@caninet.com>
Subject: Re: Parts Question from New Member

>
>
> My question is how compatible are the
> interior, and all other parts for that matter, between a 1972 and 1970
> 4-4-2?  I am just starting and learning about olds, so any information
> would be appreciated.  Thank you.
>
> Joseph
> 1970 4-4-2, in the long process of restoration

Hi Joseph

For the most part all parts are compatable.  The interior will have diffent
patterns to the seats and doorpanel but the interchangeable.  If you want
the car propper and origanal then you would iether reapolster or find the
right pattern seats, and door panel.

The seats in 70 have four large squares to them with buttons in center.
The 72 has many ribbed and buttons I think 8 but not sure with out going
outside (BRRRRRRRRRRR).  The door panels in 72 have large grab handles and
the woodgrain like pine (straight lines).  In 70 the woodgrain is burls (
circular shapes).

But they are interchangable

Robert Schinkel

docbob@caninet.com

1970 W-31 4 gear
1970 Rallye 350
1970 442 Convertible
1970 Cutlass Conv. (13.4 et's)

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 ª993
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