
oldsmobile-digest      Monday, November 17 1997      Volume 01 : Number 959



Re: Web Page Pictures(Rallye 350)
Re: 59 Olds
Re: removing T'stat
Re: Edelbrock head problem
82/83 Olds 98 tranny question
Re: 82/83 Olds 98 tranny question
Re: Cooling topics
Re: Starting Problems
Instrument Panel Lamp Holders
Convertible Windlace
Thermostat Housing Leak
Re: Convertible Windlace
Re: removing T'stat
Re: 59 Olds
Re: Cooling topics
Re: rear diff/diff
Re: the Quad 442
no mail and oldsmo-snow
Re: Carb question
Build Sheet Question
Woodgrain on dash
Re: Woodgrain on dash
Re: Xmas Gifts Wanted (fwd)
Re: Xmas Gifts Wanted (fwd)
455 in a pickup
how do I remove EGR components?
Re: how do I remove EGR components?
69 H/O XMAS Ornament
Where to Put the Toll Money (Was Re: transmission problem)
Re: 68 front bumper/bill culp
Re: Oldsmo-snow
Re: 455 in a pickup
Re: Looking for 62 Alternator bracket
FW: Off the frame restoration (Long reply)
Re: 455 in a pickup
G-body rear axle swap.
q4
FW: ADVANCE AUTO PARTS AND BATTERIES FIRST ANNUAL SHOW AND SHINE
98 Intrigue
need a mirror
Re: G-body rear axle swap.
bad thermostats, no heat, clogged heater core
Car Craft Top Ten Oldses
Re: bad thermostats, no heat, clogged heater core
Re: 59 Olds
Re: oldsmobile-digest V1 #958
Re: 98 Intrigue
Supertuning '71 and '72
Re: 98 Intrigue
Re: the Quad 442
RE: Edelbrock head problem
'77 442 body for sale
Info - '78 Olds Cutlass Supreme Brougham w/T-tops
Re[2]: 455 in a pickup
Re: Used Cars
Re: Info - '78 Olds Cutlass Supreme Brougham w/T-tops

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 23:18:32 -0500 (EST)
From: OldsGuyGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Web Page Pictures(Rallye 350)

Awesome pages! My wife is helping me put together a page here too. "Jeff's
Old's Page". I don't know how to link it here.

Do you have a emblem for a sports steering wheel horn button? I'm also
looking for '70 sport mirrors.

thanks
jeff.

------------------------------

Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 22:46:56 -0000
From: "Lloyd W. Culp" <bculp@HiWAAY.net>
Subject: Re: 59 Olds

 Welcome Butch.  Those 50's Oldsmobiles are just so nice.  The 2-doors are
the best of the lot.  I don't have one & so do not know of parts
availability.  Others on the list will get some information to you very
soon.  I do know that the engine is supposed to be a 394 2-barrel.

Bill Culp
Decatur, Alabama




>I am new to this list and I live in Hastings NE.
>I have a 59 Olds Dynamic 88 2dr HDTP. I have no Idea about availability of
>parts for this car.
>I also would like to know what size of motor it has in it.
>Please help
>Butch Lyons
>ll62539@navix.net
>
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:00:07 -0500 (EST)
From: AGUY4RUMLI@aol.com
Subject: Re: removing T'stat

In a message dated 97-11-16 11:39:10 EST, you write:

<< >- Removing the thermostat *will* make your car run cooler. > >>
I have read that removing it will cause water to flow through the radiator to
fast and not give it a chance to disapate heat. There are high flow thermo's
on the market. 2 other options would be to take it apart but leaving the bace
of it in.And another would be to drill to holes in the base i think it was
1/8 to increase flow. Read it in HotRod or something. You can also add a
plate to the back of your water pump depending on the blade style to increase
flow. I believe summit sell it, its just a piece of sheet medal .

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:50:22 -0500 (EST)
From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Subject: Re: Edelbrock head problem

Hi Chris,

> "except the 68-9 W30's" !?

Do you think they were referring to the long stroke 400's?  Perhaps the
3.87" bore isn't compatible with their heads; my guess is "W30"
should have read "442".

Kevin

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:51:46 -0500
From: Peter Teubel <pteubel@tiac.net>
Subject: 82/83 Olds 98 tranny question

I have an '82 98 with a 403, auto.  Was a diesel, but converted before I
got it.  I believe the tranny is a TH350, but not absolutly sure.  My
question is this:  I have an opportunity to pick up an '83 98 for parts.
According to the "Standard Catalog of American Cars", the '83 98 came with
4-spd autos.  I assume this means overdrive.

Is this just a basic TH350 w/OD or is it a different tranny altogether?
I'd like to grab it for my '82 but don't know if it will bolt up to my 403.

Also, what's the part interchangability for a "limited-slip" rear end for
my '82 98?  What other years will fit?  And from what other cars?

Thanks in advance!

- - Uncle Pete
'51 98
'82 98
'86 Ciera

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 03:13:27 -0800
From: Greg Pruett <grpruett@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: 82/83 Olds 98 tranny question

Peter Teubel wrote:
> 
> I have an '82 98 with a 403, auto.  Was a diesel, but converted before I
> got it. 
<snip>
>  I have an opportunity to pick up an '83 98 for parts.
> According to the "Standard Catalog of American Cars", the '83 98 came with
> 4-spd autos.  I assume this means overdrive.
> 
> Is this just a basic TH350 w/OD or is it a different tranny altogether?
> I'd like to grab it for my '82 but don't know if it will bolt up to my >403.

Different tranny alltogether.  If it's used with a Ch*vy(Gasp!) engine
then it could be a TH700-R4.  If it's bolted to an olds or buick engine
than it's probably the TH200-4R.  The TH200-4R will bolt to your 403.  
It's slghtly weaker than the TH-350 and it's a little more tempirmental.
It's rated for about 330 lb of engine torque stock.  I've read in
magazines that an 83 is not the best year transmission to use because
it's slightly weaker than that later models.  85 and newer trannies are
the best cores.  If the 83 tranny is in good shape now and you take it
easy with a stock 403 you can probably make it last a few years, but I
wouldn't guarantee it.  You probably shouldn't get it unless it's cheap,
and you feel like experimenting.  Otherwise you're better off holding
out for a younger 200-4R or just slapping in another TH-350.    

To get full advantage of the overdrive you probably need a lower(higher
numerically) rearend gear. Anything higher than a 3.08 is too much, and
your 98 probably has something like a 2.56.

Greg Pruett
72 Vista Cruiser
67 Cutalss Supreme
80 Cutlass Calais

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 02:18:35 -0500 (EST)
From: Kevin Wong <brougham@geocities.com>
Subject: Re: Cooling topics

Hi Bob,

> relative efficiency are irrelevant. In fact, it would be _ideal_ if the
> coolant stayed in the radiator until the rate of heat transfer reached zero;
> then, you would be pumping water back into the engine as cool as it possibly
> could be!

This would be desireable if there was a limited supply of
non-circulated (i.e. use once, throw away) coolant available.  Maximizing
the heat transfer per unit of coolant appears to be at odds with moving
heat quickly, which would necessitate each unit moving less heat, but
circulating at a higher rate.

> What would happen to the time component in terms of actual quantity of heat
> transferred, if the time of the coolant in the radiator could be reduced to
> zero (which an infinitely fast flow would do)? Show me an actual formula for

As Hans noted, the extreme case of an infinitely fast coolant flow would
result in a uniform coolant temperature.  The heat aborbed by each unit of
coolant in the engine instantaneously shows up in the radiator where it is
expelled; the change in time and the amount of heat energy transferred are
both infinitesimally small.  The equilibrium temperature should be
dependent on the internal engine and radiator surface areas, temperatures,
etc.  Of course, moving coolant at an infinitely fast rate would require
an infinite amount of energy!?  <g>

Kevin

------------------------------

Date: 16 Nov 1997 23:33:16 PST
From: mjones@gleep.com
Subject: Re: Starting Problems

Dave

Have you checked the starter itself?  I had a starter go out when the
bushing on the end of that shaft that the gear rides on ate itself,
causing VERY hard starts and draining my battery dry.  Infact one time
it took my 700 cca and my father's 1100cca (maybe 1000cca) to turn my
starter over, and it barely turned then.

Mike Jones
'78 Delta 88 2dr

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:21:07 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <cutlass69@usa.net>
Subject: Instrument Panel Lamp Holders

I fished up under the dash of my '69 to determine why some of my warning
lights weren't working and found several burnt out bulbs and one broken
bulb holder.  Does anyone know (aside from the wrecker) where to get the
plastic piece which holds the bulb?  Also what is the difference between
the grey and the black (or dark brown) holders, my car seems to use both.

Lloyd Ferguson
cutlass69@usa.net

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:32:51 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <cutlass69@usa.net>
Subject: Convertible Windlace

I am replacing the carpet in my '69 Cutlass convertible and the windlace
(the piece that goeas along the front edge of the rear trim panel (door
jamb) and ends under the door sill) is pretty shotty looking.  I would like
to replace it but the Year One catalog lists it as "Discontinued".  I got a
set from a '69 Skylark at the wrecker but it is quite different (the lip
goes in a different direction).

Does anyone know another source for this part or have a good used set (in
Parchment).

Lloyd Ferguson
cutlass69@usa.net

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 00:25:17 -0500
From: Lloyd Ferguson <cutlass69@usa.net>
Subject: Thermostat Housing Leak

I notice that I have an antifreeze leak around the thermostat housing in my
'69 350.  I replaced the thermostat and gasket a couple of weeks ago.  I
used RTV on the bolts, torqued them to spec and everything looked clean
before installation.  This is not the first car (all GMs) I have had
problems with so I assume there is something I am not doing correctly.

Does anyone have any hints or tips??

Lloyd Ferguson
cutlass69@usa.net

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 05:08:24 -0500
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Convertible Windlace

Lloyd Ferguson wrote:
> 
> I am replacing the carpet in my '69 Cutlass convertible and the windlace
> (the piece that goeas along the front edge of the rear trim panel (door
> jamb) and ends under the door sill) is pretty shotty looking. 

Lloyd, I know Fusick had them for the 69.  I ordered a set of them, but
mine were in black.  I've put them away, so I don't remember the name of
the company that made them, but they are out there.  I think they were
talking about other colors too, but I'm not sure.

2 cents.
Mike Rothe

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 05:25:28 -0500
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: removing T'stat

This thread has been beaten before.  I think the formula Q=mc(Th-Tc) is
what Doc Barry was referring to for heat transfer.  Time of course IS
involved in the mass flow rate (lbm/second).  Q is for the total heat
transfer, m= mass flow rate, c= heat transfer constant, Th is hot temp,
Tc is cold temp.

The c is constant for the fluid, so it can't change.  Increasing the
mass flow rate or the temperature differential will increase the heat
transferred.  Now, that means moving MORE water through the radiator in
a given amount of time.  Velocity isn't really the issue.  What counts
is the size of the radiator.  If you're radiator is large enough, you
can safely run without a thermostat, BUT, remember, if GM could've left
it out, they would have.

I have to go to work, but there is a lot of engineers out there who
would gladly delve into this farther.

my 2 cents
Mike Rothe



AGUY4RUMLI@aol.com wrote:
> 
> In a message dated 97-11-16 11:39:10 EST, you write:
> 
> << >- Removing the thermostat *will* make your car run cooler. > >>
> I have read that removing it will cause water to flow through the radiator to
> fast and not give it a chance to disapate heat.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 21:43:42 +1030
From: "Scott " <scott@tplex.com.au>
Subject: Re: 59 Olds

Get in contact with Fusicks for a copy of their parts catalogue. It costs a
couple of dollars buts its got a hundred pages or so of parts, badges
accessories etc.  

>>>>>>>>>>>>>
East Windsor

Fusick Automotive Products, Inc.
22 Thompson Road
(860) 623-1589
Our catalogs contain a wide range of parts for Oldsmobiles from 1935 thru
1977...cosmetic chrome emblems and mouldings, interior & exterior plastics,
all rubber parts, mechanical and electrical components and select new old
stock, including many difficult-to-find items.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

For info on the engine size etc check out the following link  

http://www.442.com/tech.html

relevant info thanks to Scott Clark...


Cheers

Scott Clisby
60 Olds Coupe  (Thunder Down Under)

Ps. I need a few more votes in this months Virtual Car Show - Pleeeeeeeese
check out the link and cast your vote.......
http://auto4world.com/interactive-car-show/november/showroom3.html     :-) 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 06:50:20 -0400
From: hitson@leadbelt.com
Subject: Re: Cooling topics

>>> >>  >- The faster the coolant moves through the radiator the better.
>>> >
>>> >I tend to agree, but I also think that the faster you can "shove air
>>> >down it's throat" the better it cools...  Have you ever overheated doing
>>> >65MPH, even if the car constantly runs warm at a stand still?
>
>Boy, seems like there's six or seven topics on this list that occupy 90% of
>the discussion! (we had a pretty big discussion about thermostats that went
>on and on and on and....).
>
>I think we came to agree that the faster the coolant moves through the
>block, but the slower it moves through the radiator, and the faster the air
>passes through the radiator, the cooler the engine will be.
>
Pardon my redundance. I have a GM truck with EFI big block motor. Truck has 
new radiator, thermostat, & water pump. It runs cooler at idle (approx 
190-195) than it does at 70 mph & above (210-220). I am convinced it is the 
air fuel mix (lean for economy at speed),  about which I can do nothing. 
Without a thermostat, the heater does nothing but blow cold air on one's feet.

Roger Hitson

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:53:03 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: rear diff/diff

Clarence R. Isaacks II wrote:
> 
> As I said before I just rebuilt my rear diff and changed to 4:11 gears.
> The diff is not posi.  Is it possible to utilize my existing housing and
> change the inards to posi parts?  If so what would be a good donor
> vehicle?

Yes, it is. And you really don't need a donor car either. If you know
exactly the specs on your diff., (ex: 8.5" 10-bolt 28 spline pinion)
then you can look in Jeg's and find an AuburnGear posi unit for your
differential. They cost about $265 for the regulars and about $370 for
the Pro Series.

- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoftİ Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:56:05 -0500 (EST)
From: RCKTPWR@aol.com
Subject: Re: the Quad 442

In a message dated 97-11-17 06:51:09 EST, you write:

<< Pocket rockets rule!  definitely a car worthy of the 442 logo!!
  >>
For what they are, there not bad, but give a classic olds anyday, hell id
take an 88 and up c/s any day. just my two cents.         c-ya at the drags
or stoplites........:-]
Bernie

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 05:08:48 -0800 (PST)
From: <the_rocketeer@rocketmail.com>
Subject: no mail and oldsmo-snow

If anybody has tried sending me anything at my campus address, I have
not, and probably will not recieve it... I've had a horrible time with
my campus mail lately.  My Rocketmail account is still working fine
though.  

Hey, Northern Olds Owners, please... take back your weather, it's
unwelcome in the south... seriously, it was snowing yesterday and this
morning I woke up to 18 degree temperatures... This is Tennessee isn't
it?  I'm a bit worried for Lucille as I can't remember if she had much
anti-freeze in her or not... I know she had some though.

Peace, Goodwill, and Happy Oldsmobilling,
Clayton (brrrrrr... cough cough...) Pierce,
zcwp11@ETSU.edu
the_rocketeer@rocketmail.com




__________________________________________________________________
Sent by Yahoo! Mail. Get your free e-mail at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:13:42 -0500
From: Jim & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Carb question

At 06:07 PM 11/15/97 -0500, you wrote:
Mark

        Your welcome. As for the value of the carb, no it would probably be
a jewel for a Ch*vy guy needing it. As for using it on your Olds it will
probably need to be recalibrated for your engine. It also has a different
side inlet. Olds only had those for 66 and 67 then they went to a front
inlet on their Q-jets.

Jim Chermack

>Thank you Jim.  Is this carb of "less" value when it comes to performance.  I
>recently purchased a 1970 Olds 455 and the carb I have is from a 1967 chevy
>whatever...is this carb just as good as any other stock Q-Jet?  I don't know
>why the OEM carb was removed.
>
>Mark
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:18:01 -0500 (EST)
From: DROLDS350@aol.com
Subject: Build Sheet Question

I ripped out the back seat of my 70 rallye 350. Where would I find the
buildsheet? Is it underneath the upholstery? It wasn't in the foam. I found
two little tags on the rear door panel. It said "33687" on blue paper, and
the other one read off, "LAN 6, or JAN 6." I know what the 33687 means, but I
don't know what the other one is? Any ideas?

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:21:08 -0500 (EST)
From: DROLDS350@aol.com
Subject: Woodgrain on dash

I peeled off the woodgrain on my 70 dash and noticed that the back of it was
metal. Is this normal? Are the reproduction woodgrain sets from the parts
suppliers metal?


Jim

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:35:05 -0500
From: Jim & Joanne Chermack <chermac@exis.net>
Subject: Re: Woodgrain on dash

At 08:21 AM 11/17/97 -0500, you wrote:
Jim

        Yes they are available from most suppliers. Make sure you have a
very clean surface before applying the new woodgrain.

Jim Chermack


>I peeled off the woodgrain on my 70 dash and noticed that the back of it was
>metal. Is this normal? Are the reproduction woodgrain sets from the parts
>suppliers metal?
>
>
>Jim
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:39:12 -0500 (EST)
From: OldsGuyGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Xmas Gifts Wanted (fwd)

  i have a clock for 70-2....  I'll take $15 plus shipping $5.00
   call me at 770 -723-9345 and i'll get all the info thanks jeff
    Olds guy   Atl,Ga

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:52:53 -0500 (EST)
From: OldsGuyGA@aol.com
Subject: Re: Xmas Gifts Wanted (fwd)

  i have a nice clock for 70-2  i'll sell for $15 + $5 shipping..

  thanks olds guy Ga

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:01:25 -0700
From: Dustin Cross <livnrt@mssl.uswest.net>
Subject: 455 in a pickup

I'm toying with the idea of puttin a 455 into my '80 ch*v (ducking in anticipation of 
flames!)   I was wondering if anyone had done a similar project?   I'm mostly wondering 
about the motor mounts, if the Olds ones will just bolt up or if I'll have to do some 
"moderfercations"    I think I have a t400 from a deisel lined up if I do the swap

In my defense (since I know I will need to defend this)  I need (want) a good 4x4 pickup 
for pulling trailers, projects, f*rds, ect.  I figure with a 455,t400,4:10s the ch*v 
will be almost acceptable     I will have to make a new grill with a "rocket" emblem so 
I can ditch the "bowtie"  ;)

Dustin

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:25:34 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: how do I remove EGR components?

When my engine gets rebuilt, it's going to get the Edelbrock RPM
manifold. It says that it is not for EGR. Obviously, I'm going to have
to remove all that crap.

My question is: What exactly am I removing and what do I have to change
to make this work? 
- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoftİ Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:09:54 -0800
From: Chuck Noppe <oldsnut@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: how do I remove EGR components?

Matt Cremean wrote:
> 
> When my engine gets rebuilt, it's going to get the Edelbrock RPM
> manifold. It says that it is not for EGR. Obviously, I'm going to have
> to remove all that crap.
> 
> My question is: What exactly am I removing and what do I have to change
> to make this work?
> --
> **********************************
> Matt Cremean
> +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
> CreamerSoftİ Software
> http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
> +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
> 1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
> http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
> **********************************An EGR valve (exhaust gas Recirculation) recycles some of the exhaust 
gasses back through the engine to be reburned with the new air and fuel 
headed for the cylinder, It alows a fiffering degree of gasses back in 
depending on running condition. If your intake manifold specifies not for 
egr it is designed to run on a system (pre 73) that did not require the 
egr valve. While simple to remove and better running charictoristics will 
be found, If you live in CA (or most likely any state) It is illegal to 
remove emissions control (smog) equipment from your car. It is likely 
that the only way anyone would know is if you went for a bilinial 
inspection (of which 73 and older will be exempt from after JAN 1, If you 
were stopped for a random inspection, if someone reported your car to the 
1(800) smog police , or you went to sell your car.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:50:44 -0500
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: 69 H/O XMAS Ornament

I was in the mall this week end, and went in the Hallmark store. They
have a 69 H/O XMAS ornament. It is a little bigger then the Hot
Wheels/Matchbox cars. It cost $13.95. It has a Christmas present in the
back seat. Thought I would pass this along so everyone thetas
interested, can get it on there Christmas list. :-)


Last weekend my wife and I when to Savannah and was walking around
Savannah Mall. There is a really nice store to do some shopping in
there. At first I thought it was a museum for cars. At the front
entrance was a 1960 Corvette, to the left was a 1966 Mustang Conv, in
the back of the store was a T-Bird. Off to the left was another room
with more cars. A real nice 57 Chevy Bel-Air and a real old Jeep, 55
Chevy and a lot of other cars. All of the cars were for sale and were
fully restored. I think the store was called Memory Lane. I know this
list of cars is of no interest to a lot of the people on this list, but
it was a nice store and a great ideal, who knows they may have a few
Olds later on. I can here me now "honey look what I brought at the
mall". :-)



Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the....Past

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:06:06 -0600
From: "Green, Andrew" <acg@datalogics.com>
Subject: Where to Put the Toll Money (Was Re: transmission problem)

> The only problem in removing the ash tray
> is I'd have to try to find somewhere to put all my toll money!  :-)

Been there, done that. Finally I got a few plastic 35mm film canisters,
filled each with 40 cents (good opportunity to get rid of a ton of
pennies; each canister can hold just that much) and tossed them in the
center console. So when I'm approaching the tollbooth and busy trying to
evade the morons that cut across six lanes as soon as they realize they
don't have exact change, it's trivial to reach in, grab a canister, flip
the lid off with a thumb, stick it out the window and dump the whole
thing in the basket at once. Piece o' cake.
- --
Andrew C. Green             (312) 853-8331
Datalogics, Inc.            email: acg@datalogics.com
101 N. Wacker, Ste. 1800    http://www.datalogics.com
Chicago, IL  60606-7301     Fax: (312) 853-8282

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 10:34:07 -0500 (EST)
From: W30442CS@aol.com
Subject: Re: 68 front bumper/bill culp

bill 68 frt. bumper=125$ plus shipping.  please reply steven.
 w30442cs@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:41:12 -0800 (PST)
From: John Pajak <jspajak@rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: Oldsmo-snow

John, with that many cars it had better be a very LARGE garage.  It's
nice to see someone with more problems/opportunities than me from time
to time.  Good luck on getting it enclosed and under roof before the sky
starts falling.

You could always park them at my place until then...:o)

S.D.W.

!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's 30' x 40' but obviously not big enough to hold all the
cars/trucks! A circus tent might have been more appropriate :)

===
John Pajak                            JSPajak@rocketmail.com
Lexington Park, Maryland  HTTP://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak

65 Delta 88 2dr    70 Cutlass S 2dr       72 Cutlass conv   
66 Toronado deluxe 70 Cutlass S W31       72 Delta 88 conv
69 Cutlass S 2dr   70 442 W30 conv        72 442 W30 conv 
70 Cutlass S 2dr   71 Cutlass Supreme 2dr 86 Cutlass Supreme
+ 2 F*rds, 1 C*evy, and 5 parts cars
 

__________________________________________________________________
Sent by Yahoo! Mail. Get your free e-mail at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 97 11:21:52 -0500
From: "Padavano.Joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re: 455 in a pickup

I'm toying with the idea of puttin a 455 into my '80 ch*v
     
     Dustin,
     
     This is exactly what I intend to do with my 85 Crewcab Dually this 
     spring.  The Olds 350 Diesel was an option in these trucks starting in 
     79, so you should be able to just use those motor mounts.  The 
     problem, of course, is the transmission bolt pattern.  If you don't 
     want to replace the entire trans with a BOP unit (mine's a 4x4, so it 
     would be even harder), a number of transmission shops sell adapter 
     plates.
     
     Naturally, you'll need to use the Olds accessory brackets.  PS pump 
     will bolt right up, but the alternator and A/C compressor mount on 
     opposite sides of the motor from the Ch*vy configuration.  Lengthening 
     of wires and hoses (or getting the Olds diesel A/C hoses for your 
     application) will be required.  I haven't checked on the exhaust 
     manifolds yet, which is especially a problem for my application due to 
     the 4WD.  I'd suspect that stock 455 manifolds will be no problem with 
     a 2WD truck.  You may need to have custom bent pipes, however, as I 
     don't think the diesel pipes will fit a 455.
     
     Let me know how it goes.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:44:46 -0700
From: Gary Manton <sasgmm@unx.sas.com>
Subject: Re: Looking for 62 Alternator bracket

I have just dropped in a '62 394 engine into my '64 Dynamic 88, and the
alternator mounting bracket from the '64 to the '62 is different.  Does
anyone have a '62 mounting bracket for the 394?

Thanks,

G
          \\|//
          (o o)                     
~~~~~~oOOo~(_)~oOOo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Gary M. Manton					SAS Institute
Business Solutions Division			Phoenix, AZ  85012
(602) 265-1616 ext. 230 - voice		        (602) 265-8585 - fax
						(888) 982-4079 - Pager

"In business as in life, your chances of being run over are doubled
if you stay in the middle of the road"
~~~~~~oooo~~~~~oooo~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 23:49:14 -0500
From: "Kerr, Brian (R)" <kerrb@basf-corp.com>
Subject: FW: Off the frame restoration (Long reply)

How do you lift the body off of the frame of the car?  I was
thinking of doing it myself.

Thanks
Clay
69 442 convertible

Clay (and the rest of the list)

Having just completed lifting the body off the frame of my 69 Cutlass Conv 
this weekend, I have the steps and pit falls at my fingertips.

 My car is completely stripped off all components including the windshield.

Before removing the body from the frame I would suggest getting all the 
structural repairs to the sheet metal, particularly to the rear quarters and 
trunk done to reduce the possibility of sagging, flexing or twisting of the 
sheet metal, as the shape may not be the same when it goes back on the 
frame. This is also reason you want to brace the body properly before 
removing from the frame.

My car was already on a body rotisserie attached to the frame, so the floor 
of the car was elevated about 45 inches off the ground.
Previously, after removing the doors, I had bolted a piece of square steel 
tubing to from the top hinge bolt hole to the most forward of the 3 conv top 
mount holes just above and in front of the rear wheel wells. You have to 
weld these braces  up with an off set to get from inside the car (at the 
back) to outside the car ( at the hinge mounts).  I cant remember with out 
looking at it wether or not it is 1.5 or 3 inches of offset. You'll figure 
it out when you do some measurements. From this brace, I ran another brace 
down to the seat belt bolt. This bracing will prevent the body of the conv 
from bending across the floor pan.

On the other two top mounting holes I bolted a plate across them that I had 
welded a U shaped piece of steel rod to make a loop.

Placing the car under a beam in the shop, I ran a rope from each steel loop 
up to  the beam, snugging up any slack in the ropes, and tying them off. I 
placed a 200 litre plastic drum (45 gallons ) on each side of the car even 
with the windshield. and found a 4X4 that would span the distance between 
the barrels.

Next I undid the body mount bolts, and slowly began to lower the frame about 
10 inches. Once the weight of the body was taken by the ropes, it only took 
about 70 or 80 pounds of lift to lift the front of the body and place the 
4X4 across the barrel. (leave the windshield in and increase your lift by 
another 40 or so pounds) Drop the body the rest of the way down and you're 
free!

I suppose that my caution with bracing, support etc may be a bit excessive, 
but no one ever accused me of underbuilding anything!
The rottisserie I built can handle any car body still on the frame, out to 
about 18 feet in length, longer with some modification and I would guess 
that some smaller cars could be safely mounted with out removing the drive 
train.

In addition, I have built a subframe to mount the body on to put just the 
body back on the rotisserie (sans frame) . After my frame off work is 
finished  (approx April 98) the rotisserie, sub frame and bracing will be 
available for rent or sale. Let me know if any one would like a set of hand 
drawn plans or the loan of some photos.

The best part of all this, is I only spent about $200 Canadian on buying 
steel, most of the frame etc is built from discarded ware house racking, and 
my metal fabrication skills were learned in 2 part year credit welding 
courses in high school 25 years ago. Until I started this project , I had 
not 'burned a stick ' in  15 years.


Brian Kerr
69 Cutlass conv
Cambridge, Ontario

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 10:43:01 -0700
From: Dustin Cross <livnrt@mssl.uswest.net>
Subject: Re: 455 in a pickup

Padavano.Joe wrote:
> 
> I'm toying with the idea of puttin a 455 into my '80 ch*v
> 
>      Dustin,
> 
>      This is exactly what I intend to do with my 85 Crewcab Dually this
>      spring.  The Olds 350 Diesel was an option in these trucks starting in
>      79, so you should be able to just use those motor mounts.  The
>      problem, of course, is the transmission bolt pattern.  If you don't
>      want to replace the entire trans with a BOP unit (mine's a 4x4, so it
>      would be even harder), a number of transmission shops sell adapter
>      plates.

mine is a 3/4t 4x4      right now it has a ch*v 350 and a 4spd (manual) but I know a guy 
who has a '82 with a 6.2 and a t400  he wants to switch to gas  so I was going to trade 
him my 350 for his tranny and some cash

>      Naturally, you'll need to use the Olds accessory brackets.  PS pump
>      will bolt right up, but the alternator and A/C compressor mount on
>      opposite sides of the motor from the Ch*vy configuration.  Lengthening
>      of wires and hoses (or getting the Olds diesel A/C hoses for your
>      application) will be required.  

my 455 is still in the ~donor car~ so I'll probably be able to use the AC hoses from it 

I haven't checked on the exhaust
>      manifolds yet, which is especially a problem for my application due to
>      the 4WD.  I'd suspect that stock 455 manifolds will be no problem with
>      a 2WD truck.  You may need to have custom bent pipes, however, as I
>      don't think the diesel pipes will fit a 455.

I hadnt really thought about the exaust, what do you think that the 455 manifolds will 
hit on a 4x4 

 
>      Let me know how it goes.

soonest I'll get to it is January, but probably I wont get to it until spring
 
Dustin

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:48:01 -0800
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: G-body rear axle swap.

If anyone out there has experience in swapping the rear axle out on a G-body
cutlass (specifically, a '78), could you please e-mail me with any
tips/pointers/instructions you might have.  How long should this task take?  Tools
I'll need?  What would a reasonable cost be for someone to do it for me?  I have
access to a garage, jack stands, and an impact wrench.  I suspect I'll probably at
least need to buy/rent a spring compressor too?  The car is high mileage and
rusty, so I don't expect all the bolts to come out easily.

The rear end on the '78 just started making some nasty noises.  Topping up the
fluid (pint low) helped some, but I think the damage has been done.  This is just
my winter beater and I don't want to put a lot of money in it so I figure I have
three options 1) drive it till it's completely broke and won't move another inch
2) go to the tranny shop and max out my credit card :-(  3) yank the whole rear
axle out of a junkyard car and swap it out.  I think I'll go with option 3, it'll
probably be the cheapest, and I'm not sure I'm up to taking apart the rear and
fixing whatevers wrong.  Just replace the whole bloody thing.  I don't care too
much what gear ratio I end up with, and it doesn't have to be that strong (it's
only a Chevy engine).
- --
Tom Lentz, tlentz@ior.com                          '84 Hurst/Olds
http://www.ior.com/~tlentz                         '78 Cutlass Supreme
Network Admin, CPM Corp, Spokane, WA.              '78 Chev 1/2ton (Olds 350)

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:08:28 -0500 (EST)
From: Shaun Miller <smille02@astro.ocis.temple.edu>
Subject: q4

mike, all q4 owners,

Hey mike that was great.  two of my favorite cars.  How does the 442 with 
126000 miles run?  Mine has 125000 and runs like it was brand new.  you 
must be a q4 guy.  Anyone who owns one knows how great they are.  You 
have alot of the same sort of parts i have.  what are you running quarter 
mile?  Sadfully my 89calais gold edition is losing all the performance 
parts right now.  i dont want to chance blowing up the motor shes getting 
old.  Either way im gonna eventually build a better q4 motor and drop it 
into an achieva or calais.  Just wondering--does anyone else know of the 
aerotech and the q4 that was in there?  1100 hp and it went 267 mph by aj 
foyt (but that dosent suprise me-- its a quad 4!!)  Again good luck jeff 
and lets show these people what the q4 is all about.

shaun
89 calais
81 Custom cruiser

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:20:27 -0500
From: "VanSant, David CWO" <DVanSant@lantd5.uscg.mil>
Subject: FW: ADVANCE AUTO PARTS AND BATTERIES FIRST ANNUAL SHOW AND SHINE

	It is with deep regret and a severe case of embarrassment that I must
announce the cancellation of our Show and Shine.  Look for it again
around the middle of April.

>----------
>From: 	VanSant, David CWO
>Sent: 	Friday, 1997 November, 14 15:47 14:21
>To: 	'oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca'
>Subject: 	ADVANCE AUTO PARTS AND BATTERIES FIRST ANNUAL SHOW AND SHINE
>
>	Hello all fellow Oldsmobile Lovers.
>
>	The Advance Auto Parts, Store 2106, at 113 S. George Washington Highway,
>Chesapeake, VA, will be holding it's First Annual Show and Shine Car Show on
>Saturday, November 22, 1997.
>
>	This will be a no judge show with a People's Choice selection.
>
>	The entry fee is $10.00 and the first 50 entries receive a dash plaque,
>t-shirt and grab bag.
>
>	Contact Damian Krull or Kerry Wilkerson at (757) 558-1390 for more
>information.
>
>
>Dave Van Sant
>dvansant@lantd5.uscg.mil
>'71 Topless Cutlass Supreme
>'88 Plymouth Sundance
>'89 Chevrolet Astro
>'96 Plymouth Neon DOHC
>

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:57:02 -0500
From: "Etzel, Bobby" <Bobby.Etzel@GSC.GTE.Com>
Subject: 98 Intrigue

There is a interesting article on the 98 Olds Intrigue at the below web
site. I know we all want the old days back, but could Olds have a good
ideal here? I think someone on the list has a 97. Do you like the car? 


http://www.edmunds.com/edweb/wardlaw/98OldsIntrigue.html


Bobby

70 442 Escape Back to the ....Past

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 11:27:20 -0700
From: Dustin Cross <livnrt@mssl.uswest.net>
Subject: need a mirror

just got off the phone with my dad, aparently my grandmothers car was hit & run...by a 
deer!   worst of the damage is the drivers side mirror    hoping someone might see one 
in a 'yard    her car is a '86 "98" Regency Broughm   it is a power mirror and 
(according to dad its ~heated~)     

I'd really appreciate it if someone could find me one in good shape

thanks 
      Dustin

BTW  as it always is with ~luck~ in my family   the car just got completely repainted 
less than 4 months ago!!

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:27:47 -0500 (EST)
From: The Viking <avar@infinet.com>
Subject: Re: G-body rear axle swap.

Swapping a rear axle is relatvely simple...there are only six bolts 
holding it to the frame.. two shocks. two upper control arms and two 
lower control arms... unbolt..remove... replace and rebolt... you will 
need some help to manhandle the axle  and a floor jack... the springs 
will come out easily and you do not need a spring compressor.. go slowly 
and once the shocks are removed tilt the axle toward one wheel and the 
spring will slide out.the only other prob is the driveshaft but that is 
straight forward also... good luck


Al







On Mon, 17 Nov 1997, Tom Lentz wrote:

> If anyone out there has experience in swapping the rear axle out on a G-body
> cutlass (specifically, a '78), could you please e-mail me with any
> tips/pointers/instructions you might have.  How long should this task take?  Tools
> I'll need?  What would a reasonable cost be for someone to do it for me?  I have
> access to a garage, jack stands, and an impact wrench.  I suspect I'll probably at
> least need to buy/rent a spring compressor too?  The car is high mileage and
> rusty, so I don't expect all the bolts to come out easily.
> 
> The rear end on the '78 just started making some nasty noises.  Topping up the
> fluid (pint low) helped some, but I think the damage has been done.  This is just
> my winter beater and I don't want to put a lot of money in it so I figure I have
> three options 1) drive it till it's completely broke and won't move another inch
> 2) go to the tranny shop and max out my credit card :-(  3) yank the whole rear
> axle out of a junkyard car and swap it out.  I think I'll go with option 3, it'll
> probably be the cheapest, and I'm not sure I'm up to taking apart the rear and
> fixing whatevers wrong.  Just replace the whole bloody thing.  I don't care too
> much what gear ratio I end up with, and it doesn't have to be that strong (it's
> only a Chevy engine).
> --
> Tom Lentz, tlentz@ior.com                          '84 Hurst/Olds
> http://www.ior.com/~tlentz                         '78 Cutlass Supreme
> Network Admin, CPM Corp, Spokane, WA.              '78 Chev 1/2ton (Olds 350)
> 
> 

Al Varhus
Columbus, Ohio 
http://www.infinet.com/~avar
 
  

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:44:21 -0600
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: bad thermostats, no heat, clogged heater core

Keep in mind there is some sort of heater control valve in line that
controls the amount of coolant circulating through the heater core. If
the internal valve has expanded, it could cause problems that you might
look for elsewhere. 

You can do a hand feel test to see if it is completely stuck closed, but
I've found it's hard to make a determination if any coolant is getting
through. Just a bit is enough to heat the heater core inlet the same.
If over 10 years old, it might be good to replace it anyways. Careful,
the "universal" replacement (eg. for Chevy) doesn't have a long enough
vacuum hose connection. You need about 3/4", not 3/8".

Check the heater core by disconnecting the hoses, then flushing water
from a hose (with a close to decent fitting nozzle). If there's any flow
other than a dribble, I think it's ok. Catch the overflow and dispose of
properly.
- --
David Brown     Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.0 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/oldsfaq4.htm

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/zip/oldsfaq4.zip

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:08:41 -0600
From: "David Brown" <dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu>
Subject: Car Craft Top Ten Oldses

Anyone read the December issue of Car Craft?  They list the 66 Toro as
one of
the 10 ten olds muscle cars.  Now this isn't too bad, but according to
them
it came with dual quads.. oh well..

DrkSole
- ----------
Yeah, that was even better than the turbo charged "Turbo Fire" (should
be Jetfire)!! Is that a chevyism or what?
- -- 
David Brown     Mailto:dbrown@mh1.mcis.uchicago.edu
         Oldsmobile Mailing List FAQ 4.0 at:
http://www.442.com   OR   http://www.en.com/users/thall
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/oldsfaq4.htm

Conserve some bandwidth, get the zip file for local viewing:
             ftp://arl.arizona.edu/lists/olds
  http://nero.dyn.ml.org/~da_bomb/oldsfaq/zip/oldsfaq4.zip

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 11:03:33 -0800 (PST)
From: John Pajak <jspajak@rocketmail.com>
Subject: Re: bad thermostats, no heat, clogged heater core

     Reminds me of an an experience from my earlier (dumber) days. I
had a car that would give off little or no heat. Being a non AC car it
didn't have a heater control valve. So, I though the heater core MUST
be clogged....and I flushed it with a garden hose.........it wasn't
stopped up but flushing it twice did not help! 
     After a while I figured out the real problem. I had used Bars
Leaks (looks like bat s%it!) to "repair" a leaking freeze plug. It did
not stop up the heater core but it did ruin it's ability ro transfer
heat. You guessed it.......a new heater core solved the problem :)

Brings to mind an old adage:

"There's never enough time to do it right the first time but always
enough time to redo it"

===
John Pajak                            JSPajak@rocketmail.com
Lexington Park, Maryland  HTTP://members.tripod.com/~JSPajak

65 Delta 88 2dr    70 Cutlass S 2dr       72 Cutlass conv   
66 Toronado deluxe 70 Cutlass S W31       72 Delta 88 conv
69 Cutlass S 2dr   70 442 W30 conv        72 442 W30 conv 
70 Cutlass S 2dr   71 Cutlass Supreme 2dr 86 Cutlass Supreme




__________________________________________________________________
Sent by Yahoo! Mail. Get your free e-mail at http://mail.yahoo.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:06:57 -0700 (MST)
From: Scott R Clark <mickeyd@selway.umt.edu>
Subject: Re: 59 Olds

> >I am new to this list and I live in Hastings NE.
> >I have a 59 Olds Dynamic 88 2dr HDTP. I have no Idea about availability of
> >parts for this car.
> >I also would like to know what size of motor it has in it.
> >Please help


	Welcome to the list!

	If there are any parts you need, I might be able to help, since
I've already gone through much of the headache of finding stuff for the
'60 98.  If there is anything you need let me know.  Also, as others have
suggested, get a Kanter catalog (good prices on mechanical stuff) and a
Fusik and Olds USA catalog.  I think both Kanter and Fusik have web pages,
but I don't know about Olds USA.  Addresses for all thoes guys can be
found at www.442.com.  Hope this helps!

				Scott
			1960 Oldsmobile Rocket 98

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:18:15 -0600
From: Mike Schlottman <mschlott@rsn.hp.com>
Subject: Re: oldsmobile-digest V1 #958

I have this same problem, or is it a feature, with my 70 442.  It has a
455 and runs great.  The timing mark lines up perfectly when #1 is at
TDC.  The engine fires at least 35-40 degrees BTDC.  I don't know what
the problem is but I'm ignoring it untill I rebuild it.

	mike


>Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:16:47 +0000
>From: ADRIAN CARROLL <adrian.carroll@virgin.net>
>Subject: Re: timing problems
>
>I have an olds 350 with a comp cams 270 degree cam. The problem i have
>is that i can not get the timing light to register at tdc or on the
>pointer marks.if i adjust the timing light it reads 64 degrees and then
>corresponds with the timing marks on the engine. If i connect the >timing
>light on no 5 plug lead it appears to correspond with the timing marks.
>I have tried both hei and mallory points distributor and the timing has
>not come on to the timing marks.the engine runs ok , but i cannot get >it
>on the marks, could the cam be this far advanced and still run. If so
>how can this be so, and how much performance could be lost.

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 14:47:28 -0500
From: Joseph Gambaccini <jgambaccini@ci.richmond.va.us>
Subject: Re: 98 Intrigue

c'mon bobb

Etzel, Bobby wrote:
> 
> There is a interesting article on the 98 Olds Intrigue at the below web
> site. I know we all want the old days back, but could Olds have a good
> ideal here? I think someone on the list has a 97. Do you like the car?
> 
> http://www.edmunds.com/edweb/wardlaw/98OldsIntrigue.html
> 
> Bobby
> 
> 70 442 Escape Back to the ....Past

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 14:55:40 -0500
From: Joseph Gambaccini <jgambaccini@ci.richmond.va.us>
Subject: Supertuning '71 and '72

why does the bryceman's olds page say "watch for supertuning olds 350
455 w-machines for '71 and '72"?  was there a "supertuning" publication
available in '71 and '72 like in '70?

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 15:10:25 -0500
From: Joseph Gambaccini <jgambaccini@ci.richmond.va.us>
Subject: Re: 98 Intrigue

> Etzel, Bobby wrote:
> >
> > There is a interesting article on the 98 Olds Intrigue at the below web
> > site. I know we all want the old days back, but could Olds have a good
> > ideal here? I think someone on the list has a 97. Do you like the car?
> >
> > http://www.edmunds.com/edweb/wardlaw/98OldsIntrigue.html
> >
> > Bobby
> >
> > 70 442 Escape Back to the ....Past

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:20:42 -0500 (EST)
From: Cnvrtbl442@aol.com
Subject: Re: the Quad 442

In a message dated 97-11-17 06:50:52 EST, you write:

<< but we replace him with me and i aint going anywhere.  this q4 guy can be 
 found on the q4 list of growing numbers.  All us q4 guys stick together.  
 Pocket rockets rule!  definitely a car worthy of the 442 logo!!
  >>

This is just my opinion so take it for what its worth.... The 68 thru 72
442's were
a breed of their own, their predecessors being the brutes that were refined
into these cars and the post 73's being mere reminders of what was.  Then 
there is the marketing use of the name by Olds in the late 80's/early 90's
era.  With the last 88 rear wheel drive G body went all the reminders of the
A Body dream cars.  When Olds built these front wheel drive 4 cylinder
screamers the only department that made a mistake was the marketing guys.
It is my belief that the use of the "W" is and has been synonomous with Olds
performance and should always be.  However the use of "442" was a 
msitake. But so be it they did and we have this do deal with.  Its really too
bad that Olds wasn't able to come up with a new name for the 90s performance
cars based on Calais's and Achieva's and the sort. I personally think a 93
Cutlass Convert with a 3.4 5 speed and a special 442 package would have
 been a great car too but would have had nothing to do with the days of old.
I think that its rediculous to try and compare the two cars with each other.
The cars from circa 1990 were simply Old'ses way of competing with the
Import Market and if anything this shows just how good Olds is at being the
best at something.  I do not believe however that any of these cars even 
came close to running 13's as SEVERAL of the pre 73 cars did. I hope we 
dont start comparing Toronado's to 98's for some reason not yet established.
                                                                          TIM

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:57:00 -0500
From: urbanch <urbanch@magi.com>
Subject: RE: Edelbrock head problem

Hey Kevin!

		Haven't heard from you in a while. I really can't understand at this point what they mean by that remark, perhaps an emitions problem for the US?

- ----------
From: 	Kevin Wong[SMTP:brougham@geocities.com]
Sent: 	Sunday, November 16, 1997 7:50 PM
To: 	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
Subject: 	Re: Edelbrock head problem

Hi Chris,

> "except the 68-9 W30's" !?

Do you think they were referring to the long stroke 400's?  Perhaps the
3.87" bore isn't compatible with their heads; my guess is "W30"
should have read "442".

Kevin

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:53:11 -0600
From: dnewman@wcbi.com (Doug Newman)
Subject: '77 442 body for sale

Hi All,
           Usual disclaimers apply:  don't know the seller, don't know the
condition of the body, don't stand to profit, etc.

For Sale:  1977 Olds 442 (body only)  $150
                   Batesville, MS
                   (601)  563-8951

Hope this can be helpful to someone.

Doug Newman
Columbus, MS
1987 442
                
http://www.442.com/newman.html
http://wcbi.com     

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 17:27:41 -0600
From: "Wayne L. Dake" <wldake@execpc.com>
Subject: Info - '78 Olds Cutlass Supreme Brougham w/T-tops

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01BCF37E.1B88A4A0
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all,

I have a 1978 Oldsmobile Cutlass Brougham, V8 (350), loaded w/T-tops.  I =
have gotten conflicting stories from several people on whether or not =
the car is worth collecting.  Some say that it has a lot of value =
because there weren't that many made with the T-tops and others say that =
the only thing that really makes it a collector car is its age.  So I =
pose these questions:

Is it a collectors car?
What is it worth?
How can I find out how many were made and how many might be left on the =
road?
Is there any place on the internet that I can post the VIN and get some =
answers?

The main thing is the collector part, but any info would be appreciated. =
 Thanks in advance.

Wayne
     Email        - wldake@execpc.com
     Homepage - www.execpc.com/~wldake
**********
A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject.
     -Winston Churchill
    =20

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<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>Hi =
all,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"Comic Sans MS" =
size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>I have a 1978 Oldsmobile =
Cutlass=20
Brougham, V8 (350), loaded w/T-tops.&nbsp; I have gotten conflicting =
stories=20
from several people on whether or not the car is worth collecting.&nbsp; =
Some=20
say that it has a lot of value because there weren't that many made with =
the=20
T-tops and others say that the only thing that really makes it a =
collector car=20
is its age.&nbsp; So I pose these questions:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>Is it a collectors =
car?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>What is it =
worth?</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>How can I find out how many =
were made and=20
how many might be left on the road?</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>Is there any place on the =
internet that I=20
can post the VIN and get some answers?</FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2>The main thing is the =
collector part, but=20
any info would be appreciated.&nbsp; Thanks in advance.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=3D#000000 face=3D"Comic Sans MS"=20
size=3D2>Wayne<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
Email&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; - <A=20
href=3D"mailto:wldake@execpc.com">wldake@execpc.com</A><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;=20
Homepage - <A=20
href=3D"http://www.execpc.com/~wldake">www.execpc.com/~wldake</A><BR>****=
******<BR>A=20
fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the=20
subject.<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; -Winston=20
Churchill<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Date: Mon, 17 Nov 97 17:06:52 -0500
From: "Padavano.Joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: 455 in a pickup

     ...Lengthening of wires and hoses (or getting the Olds diesel A/C 
     hoses for your application) will be required.  
     
my 455 is still in the ~donor car~ so I'll probably be able to use the AC hoses 
from it 
     
     Uh, maybe.  I meant that you'd probably need the A/C hoses for a Ch*vy 
     truck with the 5.7 liter diesel.  On the other hand, the donor car 
     hoses may fit.  Worth a try before spending the money.
     
I hadnt really thought about the exaust, what do you think that the 455 
manifolds will hit on a 4x4 
     
     Can't say that I know for sure.  Only know that the passenger side 
     exhaust manifold on the 454 currently in my truck has very little 
     clearance to the frame rail.  Don't know for sure that a 455 is better 
     or worse.  Obviously if you were going to put a small block Olds 
     engine in the truck, the diesel exhaust manifolds would bolt right up. 
     I doubt you'd want to use them for a big block, however.
     
soonest I'll get to it is January, but probably I wont get to it until spring
     
     Another cool bit that I forgot to mention is the oil filter adapter 
     used on the diesel truck engines.  The Olds diesel in this application 
     used an oil filter adapter which had fittings in place to route the 
     oil to an external oil cooler.  I've got the part number at home and 
     will provide it tomorrow.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 16:46:42 +0000
From: Charley Buehner <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Re: Used Cars

Dustin Cross wrote:

> Used Cars is available, I think I got mine at a Target (not sure when)  has Kurt Russell

Directed by Steven Spielberg, too!  That was kinda suprising.  It's an
old show!

Charley Buehner (aka the Oldsmobile Magnet!)
mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:01:09 -0500
From: Mike Rothe <MROTHE@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: Info - '78 Olds Cutlass Supreme Brougham w/T-tops

Wayne L. Dake wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I have a 1978 Oldsmobile Cutlass Brougham, V8 (350), loaded w/T-tops.
> Is it a collectors car?
> What is it worth?
>

Wayne, you are gonna get as many different answers from this as there
are list members.  My question to you is, how much is it worth to
you???   I'm serious here.  If you tag no value to the car, then it
isn't worth much to you.  But, since it IS an Oldsmobile, IMHO it's
priceless.  It isn't considered a real live "collector" car in the
strictest sense of the term, however, it is rather unusual with the
T-tops.  Is it a keeper?  You bet.  Remember way back when, about 10
years ago, you could buy almost any mid 70's 442 for a song.  Now, they
are starting to become hot items on the market.  Just as the mid 60's to
early 70's 442s  were then.  When I bought my 85 442, I never gave two
thoughts about its future collectibility.  I still don't.  Because I'm
not gonna sell it.  But, I'm sure in a few years, it too will probably
become "hot" market-wise.

The 78's aren't in that groove as of yet.  Not really sure if they ever
will be, but the market is real finicky.  I wouldn't worry though.  For
every "old" car, there is always someone out there saying, "Boy, if I
could just find someone who had a '78 Cutlass with T-tops..."   If you
ever wanted to sell it, I'm sure someone would buy it.  The problem is,
that they made a GRUNCH of '78 Cutlasses, so the mere fact of yours
having T-tops may not be enough to thrust it as being rare or
different.  Take the AMC Pacer X for instance.  Rare indeed, but
collectible???  Maybe only to a Pacer club. 

Now, if yours was a 20,000 mile original, with all the original
paperwork and was in showroom condition, the market price would be
substantially higher, but not as much as say, an '83 Hurst/Olds. 

If the car was as stated above, I would probably consider paying $2500
for it.  Supply and demand dictate the price of just about everything
that isn't government regulated.  68 H/O's aren't plentiful, but the
demand is still there, so, the price is reflected accordingly.

I say, don't worry about it.  If you are happy with the car, then by all
means, fix it, drive it, and enjoy it.  Because they just don't make
the  '78 Cutlass anymore.

My opinion.
Mike Rothe

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End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #959
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