
oldsmobile-digest      Tuesday, October 14 1997      Volume 01 : Number 905



Re: Tri-Carb Set-up (was: For Sale: 66 442 Track-Pac)
'72 442 air cleaner decal
Re: FS:1980 Olds Cutlass Supreme (fwd)
Re[2]: Tri-Carb Set-up
Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!
Re: Tri-Carb Set-up
Re: A story I heard
Re: '72 442 air cleaner decal
RE: curving the distributor?
Re: Olds 307 Dual Snorkel Intake
Roller Rockers - Steel Tip Vs. Al 
Sunday at the Races - the results
RE: possible problems?
Re: A story I heard
RE: UNBOUNCE: WTB Muscle Car
Re: Old Car Magazines
Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!
Re: Roller Rockers - Steel Tip Vs. Al 
[none]
[none]
[none]
Re: speaker ohm question?
Re: Re[2]: CCR All Olds Show
Dave's back
Re: distributors
Re: Olds 307 Dual Snorkel Intake
Re: coolant overflow
Re: Tri-Carb Set-up (was: For Sale: 66 442 Track-Pac)
MY day at the races
Re[4]: CCR All Olds Show
Re: Catalogs...
Re: Trans Troubles (fwd)
Re: question about rear end gearing
Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!
How do I get off This List
crankcase pressure
Re: 350 Head Gaskets
Re: Delta 88 Wheels
65 <4|4|2> List Only
65 <4|4|2> LIST ONLY
Re: A story I heard
Re: Numbers question?
Re: The list people and their cars
1970 Toronado GT W-34 For Sale
Re: 1963 Starfire spare tire / jack stowage
Re: '61 Starfire Top Question
Re: '61 Starfire Top Question
'78 Delta: Shot Myself in the Foot
Re: MY day at the races
Date:	Tue, 14 Oct 1997 18:06:54 -0000
dessicant?
Tuscon 70 88 f/sale
Cyl.'s 3&5, steady miss...
Re: speaker ohm question?

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 14:05:22 -0400 (EDT)
From: CRuper1@aol.com
Subject: Re: Tri-Carb Set-up (was: For Sale: 66 442 Track-Pac)

In a message dated 97-10-14 12:53:26 EDT, you write:

<< Chris,
 
 I think you're thinking of the late 50's J-2 tripower setup.....this is the 
 '66 version of which approximately 2120 were made, one year only.  I run one

 on my street 455 setup, but they came on the 400's of that year from the 
 factory or as a dealer option.
 > <snip>
 >I've got a question for everyone.  I thought the tri-carb set-up was for
the
 >394's, not the newer style blocks (455's, etc.).  Is this an aftermarket
 >manifold, or an original tri-carb set-up (thought you've said before that
you
 >had an original tri-power, but could be wrong). <snipped again...>
 >Chris Ruper >>

Ok, that's right, now I remember.  You're right, I was thinking J-2 option,
and I do remember him (us) talking about the '66 option.  I guess I was kinda
right in al accounts (just making 2 manifolds into one...).

Chris Ruper

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 14:13:24 -0400
From: Joseph Gambaccini <jgambaccini@ci.richmond.va.us>
Subject: '72 442 air cleaner decal

Unfortunately, when i bought my '72 442/455/t400/3:23 a while back, the
air cleaner was gone.  i've since found another off of a '72 delta but
i'm not sure whether the air cleaner decal should read "oldsmobile
rocket 455" or "oldsmobile 442".  I've heard that the automatics got the
"rocket 455" version and standards got the "442" version.  is this
true?  once i'm sure, i will call year one and order the correct decal.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 18:16:31 GMT
From: Terry Ford <terry@trades.net>
Subject: Re: FS:1980 Olds Cutlass Supreme (fwd)

At 04:18 PM 10/13/97 -0400, you wrote:
>In a message dated 97-10-12 18:19:50 EDT, you write:
>
><< 
> Greg Beaulieu wrote:
> > 
> > Anyone see this? Thought it might be of interest to someone...
> > 
> 
> >  As most of you know, the 80 and 81 Cutlass Diesel had an aluminum
> > hood,
> 
> Is this true?  I'd never heard this before...
> -- 
>     
>              Charley Buehner >>
>
>I've got an aluminum hood for my car (yet to install), and I've heard they
>were the Calais models.  Man are these things light (feels like about 15 to
>20 lbs. is all).  Yes, I did get the hood hinges that go with it.  It'll be a
>nice replacement for mine since it's in excellent shape (no dings, etc.), and
>since mine is rusted at the front portion of the hood (around the emblem,
>etc.).
>
>Chris Ruper
>
>
I bought an '81 2-door Cutlass Diesel for parts, but mine did not have an
aluminum hood!

This is very interesting!

Is this true?????

Let me know!
Thanks,
Terry

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 97 14:00:51 -0500
From: "padavano.joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re[2]: Tri-Carb Set-up

Drew Senko wrote:

..Also, I am told, GM made some sort of rule after 66 that you couldn't 
install tri-power on a factory car (except C*rvette).  If this is true, 
this would explain why the option was for 1966 only, and wasn't available 
in 1967.
     
You can treat this all as heresay, if you are worried about receiving 
incorrect info.  It is correct to the best of my knowledge...
     
     You are absolutely correct, Drew.  This is also why the GTO was 
     limited to a single Q-jet after the 1966 model year.  By the way, the 
     66 W-30s cleaned up in C/Stock in NHRA that year, so that tri-carb 
     O.A.I. combination really made some HP.  I meant to add this to my 
     other post and forgot.  Thanks for finishing the story.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 11:17:05 -0700
From: Tom Lentz <tlentz@ior.com>
Subject: Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!

When you shut the engine off the door should open.  It closes when vacuum is
applied.  If it opens when you shut off the car, then just disconnect the
vacuum hose from it (plug the hose with something) until you can get it fixed.
The hose should go from there to the little thermac valve thingie in the
housing, then out from there to a vacuum source (carb or manifold).  If it's
hooked up correctly, and if the door opens when vacuum is removed and closed
when applied, then that thermac valve is your problem.  You can get a new one
from NAPA or most other parts places.  GM probably still has 'em too.

Andy Geeting wrote:

> Eneryone,
>      Can someone please help me?!! This past weekend I decided to paint the
> air cleaner housing on my '87 Cutlass Supreme. After finishing and hooking
> everything up, the little vacum controlled door in the snorkel won't open!
> It stays in hot air mode constantly! It has no pick up and go anymore and I
> used almost a half of a tank of gas to go 50 miles!! I don't believe it's
> stuck because the door does move. Could it be the two vacum hoses that hook
> up to the sensor in the air cleaner? Please someone help!! I can't afford
> to fill the tank up every two days!
> Thanks.
>
> Andy Geeting

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 97 13:46:11 -0500
From: "padavano.joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re: Tri-Carb Set-up

Chris Ruper questioned:

..I thought the tri-carb set-up was for the 394's, not the newer style blocks 
(455's, etc.).  Is this an aftermarket manifold, or an original tri-carb 
set-up (thought you've said before that you had an original tri-power, but 
could be wrong)...

     This is the relatively rare L-69 tri-carb setup offered only on the 1966 
     442s.  Something like 2000 of these units were made, with 54 of them 
     serving as the basis for the W-30 option that year (when fitted with the 
     O.A.I. setup).  It is based on a cast-iron manifold with progressive, 
     fully mechanical throttle linkage (didn't the J-2 operate the outboard 
     carbs with vacuum diaphragms?).  Three individual small chrome open 
     element air cleaners were used, but were replaced by the large chrome 
     O.A.I. shroud on the W-30.  The other unique feature of this manifold is 
     the block-off plates for the carb heat riser.  A small removable plate on 
     either side of the carb flange can be unbolted and repositioned to block 
     or open the center carb heat riser passage without removing the manifold 
     or resorting to epoxy or aluminum filler.

     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 97 13:53:21 -0500
From: "padavano.joe" <padavano.joe@Orbital.COM>
Subject: Re: A story I heard

..He made the statement that there was a strike at GM in 71 and that 
forced the 72 models to be identical to the 71's except for a few cosmetic 
changes...
     
     
     Your friend is correct.  Prior to that time, GM had operated on a 
     cycle of mild redesigns every two years and major every four (witness 
     the 64-65/66-67 bodies and the 68-69/70-71 bodies).  The opera window 
     styling released in 73 was actually due to come out in 72, but the 
     strike put this off a year.  Look closely at the 71s and 72s, and 
     you'll see that except for the grilles and taillight lenses, the cars 
     are externally identical.  Contrast this to prior years, where major 
     parts like hoods and bumpers are not interchangeable between even the 
     "common" years (ie, 68-69 and 70-71).  I'm of the opinion that the 
     73-75 cars were not exactly styling successes for GM, so I guess we 
     should be thankful.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 14:57:58 -0400
From: Mark Cornea <mcornea@ford.com>
Subject: Re: '72 442 air cleaner decal

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

- --------------14464EBC2F14
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Joseph Gambaccini wrote:
> 
> Unfortunately, when i bought my '72 442/455/t400/3:23 a while back, the
> air cleaner was gone.  i've since found another off of a '72 delta but
> i'm not sure whether the air cleaner decal should read "oldsmobile
> rocket 455" or "oldsmobile 442".  I've heard that the automatics got the
> "rocket 455" version and standards got the "442" version.  is this
> true?  once i'm sure, i will call year one and order the correct decal.


	Joe,
		Should say "Oldsmobile 442" for NON ram-air cars. I carry the decal,
e-mail at the address below for info.

- --------------14464EBC2F14
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline; filename=".csignature"

       ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
          Mark Cornea (Dr Decal) `70 W30 stick ~ Red (of course)

              (drdecal442@aol.com) or (mcornea@.ford.com)

            OCA# 4903 
       	    OPC# 14
       ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

- --------------14464EBC2F14--

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:08:04 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: curving the distributor?

RC Hellebuyck,
	I'm not sure that re-curving the dist. will help solve your
knock problem. In fact I think rec-curving the dist will actually
enhance the problem even more. Remember that the knocking is occurring
because you have too much advance too soon for some reason. By putting
in the re-curve kit, you will only get more of this happening. I would
strongly suggest that you find the problem first that is giving you the
knocking and then add the re-curve kit. Your best bet would be the
vacuum advance.  A test you can do, mind you it's very rudimentary.
Unplug the vac. adv and see if the engine slows down. then plug the vac
adv back in, the engine should speed up. If this happens it might give
you an idea of whether/not the vac adv is at least functional. Also make
sure that the vac adv  line is connected to a port on the carb/intake
that is meant to be for the vac adv. You can try the adv re-curve kit
but I honestly don't think that it will cure your problems.

Fernando Proietto
Systems Analyst - Informatics

Environment Canada
Ontario Region - Monitoring & Systems Branch
4905 Dufferin St. 
Downsview, Ontario
M3H 5T4

> ----------
> From: 	mrhell@m1.sprynet.com[SMTP:mrhell@m1.sprynet.com]
> Sent: 	Sunday, October 12, 1997 11:45 AM
> To: 	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: 	Re: curving the distribitor?
> 
> >I'd recommend something like the Crane kit; follow its instructions,
> and
> >you'll likely be happier with how the engine runs afterwards.> 
> 
> Thanks Doc, I will.  Even if I have bad luck with the crane kit, it
> will be a 
> learning experience anyway!  I didn't even know "curving a
> distributor" 
> existed until my friend mentioned it this summer.
> 
> My car seems to lack little performance.  IT "knocks" when under a
> heavy 
> load.  Such as when I'm doing 45 and floor it.  I know, I know, the
> timing.  
> I played with the timing till the cows came home.  I'm convinced
> there's a 
> distributor problem, (needs to be curved), or perhaps my vacuum
> advance is 
> bad.  I moved that damn timing mark, triple checked the dwell more
> times than 
> I would care to remember.
> 
> Just for good measure, I'm going to have the carb rebuilt this winter.
> I 
> can't seem to get "normal" reactions to my adjustments.  The guy I
> bought it 
> from really didn't drive it enough.  So need it or not, the carb will
> be 
> rebuilt.  I know this guy that's a carb guru, especially Q-jets.  For
> a $130. 
> I'll at least have piece of mind about the carb.  I realize a
> do-it-yourself 
> rebuilt kit is much cheaper, but carbs and I don't get along!  I'll
> pay the 
> $130.  
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 14:21:43 -0500
From: Thomas Martin <Thomas_Martin@css.mot.com>
Subject: Re: Olds 307 Dual Snorkel Intake

Think of it this way, cold air if denser, denser air needs more fuel,
more fuel and air packed in the chamber means more power.  With the
computer cars, the ECM can adjust easily to the changes, as it is not
too drastic.  I think it is a 7% HP increase for a 100 degree drop in
intake temp.  So that means just dropping 10 degrees is worth something,
and that is for free!

Chris is right, too much of a good thing is bad, if it gets too cold
(below 50 at those Venturi air velocities) icing can occur and that
would cause a problem if it was on the throttle when you had it at WOT.
So far, I have run cold air induction, and no heat under carb and NEVER
had an icing problem.  The aircleaner gets hot enough from engine heat
in most cars to keep icing down.  I did have some minor trouble with the
choke setting back up after a long highway cruise at 65 mph, that was
with the old 4M carb with the divorced choke (1969 428 HO carb, 70 455
Pontiac, and that was the original carb installed), so the ones out
there with this type carb know the choke setup.

The factory OEM Thermac aircleaner maintains approx. 100 degrees inlet
air to the carb.  So just disabling that in cold weather is worth some
power.  But that is disabling an emissions device, no one would ever do
that, right?

just my .02

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 14:35:14 -0500
From: Lucas Frick <lfrick@fibersystems.com>
Subject: Roller Rockers - Steel Tip Vs. Al 

I have made up my mind to go with some kind of Roller Rocker assembly.
The options are:

1. Mondello 7200 full roller Al with no machining needed for studs.
Doesnt need guide plates and uses std pushrods $399
2. Crane Al full roller, includes guideplates and pushrods Jegs $360
3. Magnum steel roller tip. Includes guideplates and pushrods. Jegs $300


The problems are :

The price on number 1 and 2.  Also wouldn't you need guideplates on the
Mondello 7200?  If I go with option 2 I would have to machine the heads
to accept large studs - this would bring the price up in line with
Mondello's. Number 3 wouldn't reduce friction as much and I hear they
are louder.

How much better are the full Al rockers than the ball mounted steel tip
rockers?  If I am going to spend this much money I want to do it right.
I dont  really want to do any machine work to the heads because they are
the rare F castings.  

I am tempted to go with Mondello now but after talking with a guy over
there I think they tend to inflate some of their engine results.

Any one out there know about these things.  Thanks

Luke & 71 442

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 09:37:45 -0500
From: "Easton,Jeffrey" <Jeff.Easton@abbott.com>
Subject: Sunday at the Races - the results

I made it to the track on Sunday w/ several friends driving
the following, '71 GS 455, '86 Turbo Regal, '95 Mustang GT
6-speed, and '94 Z-28 AT.  I had raced the Mustang last year,
but the others were out for the first time.

Here is the results of my racing;

PASS        ¦1   ¦2     ¦3      ¦4      ¦5      ¦6      ¦7

Reaction: .646   .868    .697    .919    .914    .772    .720
60'  2.434   2.338   2.343   2.298   2.495   2.424   2.522
330  6.315   6.124   6.148   6.273   6.524   6.335   6.402
1/8  9.426   9.197   9.234   9.387   10.229  9.794   9.485
MPH (1/8) 79.41   79.44   78.71   79.47   71.72   73.50   79.70
1000  12.069  11.840  11.895  12.037  13.118  12.592  12.125
1/4 ET: 14.309  14.086  14.154  14.272  15.461  14.902  14.368
MPH:  100.73  99.46   97.99   101.11  96.61   98.30   100.76

Notes:

Pass¦1: First run of the day.  Drove around the burnout box.
 Rev'd up to 2500 rpm, dumped the clutch and stood on the gas.
 Massive wheel spin off the line until it hooked up.  Sounded
 impressive but not very smart. :-)  Was encouraged that I hit
 100 mph on the first try, but disappointed at the ET.
 Lined up against friends '94 Z-28 AT. He cut a bad light but
 by the 60' time was out in front of me.  I passed him right
 before the 1/4 ended, beating his 14.367@96.86mph by
 a thin margin.  He'd never been to the track before either.
 Hmmm...

Pass¦2:   Tried starting at 2200 rpm.  Cut the amount of wheel spin
 in half.  Stayed in the gears longer before shifting, up
 to around 5000rpm.  Lined up against the friends '94 Z-28
 again.  He cut a better light, and again was out front
 by the 60' mark.  I caught him at the 1/8 mile mark and
 won again, this time by a big margin (his et 14.416@95.92).
 I got my best ET of the day, but not in the 13's as I had
 hoped.  mph was off from first pass.

Pass¦3: Lined up against some unknown '90 mustang.  He redlighted
 (.305) but I passed him by the 330' mark.  I tried making
 it to the 1/4 in 3rd, to save time lost in shifting to 4th.
 Bad idea, as the pull just "went away" at 5500 rpm. and I
 limped across the finish line.

Pass¦4: Did my first burnout, figuring to help traction somewhat.
 Launching at 2000rpm now, but still moderate wheel spin
 off the line.  Got my best mph on this pass, but the ET's
 are creeping up again.  Lined up against a tubbed pro
 Chevelle, who easily won at 9.881@137.97mph

Pass¦5:  Lined up against friend's '86 turbo Regal.  He spent the
 last hour changing out his coil pack, as his first run
 was in the 16's with missing at WOT.  I was trying too
 hard and missed the shift from 1-2 (ouch).  He continues
 on to an amazing 13.676@98.58mph.  I'm embarassed. :-)

Pass¦6:  Missed 1-2 shift again.  I'm starting a trend... The
 blown GTO I lined up against does a 13.111@104.52

Pass¦7: I sneak into line just as they are closing the staging
 lanes for the day.  I vow to feather it off the line
 w/ no wheel spin.  I do manage to accomplish that, but
 my 60' times are really bad.  I do hit 100 mph again
 but the ET's are bad again.


So the only conclusion I can draw from this is that I have a
massive traction problem. :-)  It seems that I have the HP
at the top end to catch people, but the "off the line"
performance is not stellar.

The Mustang and '71 GS turned out to be non-competitive,
each only running in the 16's.  I beat the Z-28 but not by
much.  The Turbo Regal was out of my league...

- -Jeff
jeff.easton@abbott.com
Grayslake, ILL

1970 442  4-Speed.
see the archives at http://www.calcon.net/~easton

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:30:22 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: possible problems?

Sounds more like you would have bad valve seals or a burned out valve,
if the oil filler tube was on the valve covers. If the oil filler tube
is located on the block, like on our older engines, then you would have
a better chance of feeling the blow by the piston rings.

Fernando Proietto
Systems Analyst - Informatics

Environment Canada
Ontario Region - Monitoring & Systems Branch
4905 Dufferin St. 
Downsview, Ontario
M3H 5T4

> ----------
> From: 	Matt Cremean[SMTP:ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu]
> Sent: 	Saturday, October 11, 1997 6:44 PM
> To: 	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: 	Re: possible problems?
> 
> clarence wirtz wrote:
> > 
> > Well I noticed today that when I stepped on the gas fairly hard I
> saw blue smoke
> > coming out of the right tail pipe.  I did not notice it at
> decelaration.  If
> > i rember correct this indicates possible worn rings.   Also my drive
> side
> 
> I found out a cool trick about worn rings, I don't know if anybody
> else
> knows this. If your oil filler is on your valve cover, then you start
> your engine, open it and put your hand over it. If you feel air
> puffing
> out, you have bad rings. It works too!
> 
> -- 
> **********************************
> Matt Cremean
> +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
> CreamerSoft© Software
> http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
> +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
> 1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
> http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
> **********************************
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:30:52 -0400
From: "Adcock, Jason K." <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: A story I heard

Don Sowers wrote:
> I don't want to irritate anyone, but I think the 72 Cutlass is one of
> the prettiest packages Lansing ever put out.

Personally, my favorite is the 1969 Cutlass (and H/O, of course).  I think
those big vertical tail lights on the back of a 69 look really sharp (kinda
like my big vertical tail lights on my 84, I guess.  However, I'm going to
have to say that I like the G-Bodies the best.  They are (in my opinion)
the perfect combination of size, performance, and mileage.  But, that's not
to say that I won't have a tire-shredding A-Body when I get a little more
money, because you can be sure that I will!
- -- 
Jason K. Adcock
jadcock@vt.edu
OCA #028044

http://www.erols.com/adcockjk
1984 Cutlass Supreme Calais
1992 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:49:01 -0400
From: "Proietto, Fernando [Ontario]" <Fernando.Proietto@ec.gc.ca>
Subject: RE: UNBOUNCE: WTB Muscle Car

A wheely in a rag top. Can you can sandwich...?

Fernando Proietto
Systems Analyst - Informatics

Environment Canada
Ontario Region - Monitoring & Systems Branch
4905 Dufferin St. 
Downsview, Ontario
M3H 5T4

> ----------
> From: 	Greg Beaulieu[SMTP:ab348@chebucto.ns.ca]
> Sent: 	Friday, October 10, 1997 8:27 PM
> To: 	Oldsmobile
> Subject: 	UNBOUNCE: WTB Muscle Car
> 
> Not a list member, so reply directly...
> 
> Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia,
> Canada
> 
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From:	Geo679@aol.com
> To:	oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: H*LP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> I'M LOOKING FOR AN OLD MUSCLE CAR IN GOOD OR DESCENT SHAPE. CHEVELLES
> IMPALAS
> CUTLASS, SUPREMES, 442'S, BUICK GS OR WILDCATS, MALIBUS, CAMAROS, OR
> ANY
> OTHER GM MUSCLE CAR IN A RAG TOP PREFERABLY. I GREW UP IN MY POP'S 66
> CHEVELLE SS RAG TOP AND IT WAS FAST. HAD A 396 PUSHING 450 HORSE, A 4
> SP.
> HEADERS W/ MUFFLERS, NO PIPES, 8IN. LIFT TO IT. HAD A 4:11 POSI REAR.
> WOULD
> DO WHEEL STANDS FROM STOP SIGNS. IF ANYONE CAN FIND A CAR LIKE I
> LISTED
> PLEASE MAIL ME BACK. I'D PREFER A RAG TOP BUT HARDTOP WILL DO. THANKS.
>                                         GEORGE
> 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:48:10 -0400 (EDT)
From: DEOVIVERE@aol.com
Subject: Re: Old Car Magazines

Tom -

Are you selling any of that old media material?

Tom SImmons
71 SX and (soon) 70 SX W-32

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 15:51:04 -0400
From: "Adcock, Jason K." <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!

Andy Geeting wrote:

>      Can someone please help me?!! This past weekend I decided to paint the
> air cleaner housing on my '87 Cutlass Supreme. After finishing and hooking
> everything up, the little vacum controlled door in the snorkel won't open!
> It stays in hot air mode constantly!

I'm going from the diagrams in the Rochester Book by Doug Roe...

Inside the air cleaner, on the bottom, is a thermostat, if you will.  A
vacuum hose is hooked between this thermostat and the base of the
carburetor.  There is also a hose from this thermostat to the vacuum
diaphragm spring, in the air cleaner snorkel.  The thermostat has an air
bleed valve.  From the looks of the drawing here, the valve is closed as
long as the engine is cold.  When it warms up, the bleed valve starts to
open, which in turn, lets vacuum in to start to open the snorkel flipper. 
Maybe if this valve or thermostat is bad, the flipper will never receive
the vacuum and will never open to let in cold air.  Did you cover it when
you painted the air cleaner?  Maybe IT got stuck up with paint.  Also, go
ahead and check all the vacuum lines, if you haven't done so already.

An aside: all of a sudden, my Cutlass started acting weird, idling fast and
running dumpy.  I looked under the hood, with the engine running, and heard
a hiss.  Sure enough, one of the vacuum hoses on the bad of the carbuetor
was frayed and had come off.  Went to the parts store and bought like 5
feet for 50 cents or so.  I can't imagine what GM would've charged me for
that!

Hope this helps, Andy.

- -- 
Jason K. Adcock
jadcock@vt.edu
OCA #028044

http://www.erols.com/adcockjk
1984 Cutlass Supreme Calais
1992 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 16:07:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: WMACHINES@aol.com
Subject: Re: Roller Rockers - Steel Tip Vs. Al 

In a message dated 97-10-14 15:36:06 EDT, you write:

<< I am tempted to go with Mondello now but after talking with a guy over
 there I think they tend to inflate some of their engine results.
 
 Any one out there know about these things.  Thanks
 
 Luke & 71 442
  >>
I am currently using the Mondello 7200 Rockers.  The actual manufactor of
these
rockers is Harland Sharp.  I have been using the rockers for two full race
seasons.

No complaints here.  I love them.  no guide plates, no special pushrods, just
using
the standard 455 TRW replacements.  I shift the car at 5600 RPM and go
through the traps at 6000 RPM.  My vavletrain is also quiet with these
rockers.
Usually, roller rockers tend to make a little noise.

Just my opinion, I am stick with the 7200's.   Fortunately for Mike Hall aka
OLDSMIKE@   he just pickup a set of rockers at the Northern Ohio meet and
paid only $200.00 for the same rockers with all the hardware, and there was 
no wear marks on any of the surfaces.


W MACHINES (Mark Prince)
72 442 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 18:36:21 -0500
From: gilly24-7@juno.com (Gabe G Gilsrud)
Subject: [none]

unsubscribe *

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 18:35:40 -0500
From: gilly24-7@juno.com (Gabe G Gilsrud)
Subject: [none]

unsubscribe *
- -Gabe G. Gilsrud
Gilly24-7@juno.com

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 13 Oct 1997 18:33:26 -0500
From: gilly24-7@juno.com (Gabe G Gilsrud)
Subject: [none]

sorry guys, but I guess it's g-bye...
thanx for all the help...
sob, sob!
- -Gabe G. Gilsrud
Gilly24-7@juno.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 16:37:30 -0700
From: Mike Frederick <edison3@cpeq.com>
Subject: Re: speaker ohm question?

Daniel R. Gerow wrote:

> Most car speakers are usually 4 ohms, and even if they are, you should
> still be in the clear.

Not so sure about that, Dan.  Most modern speakers are 4 ohms but older 
cars used 8 and even 10 ohms.  I agree with what you said about higher 
ohms being safer but going from 8 to 4 ohms doubles the load on the amp. 
If the amp was built for a 4 ohm load, fine -- if not...

Best bet is to add a power amp.  Even a cheap one will have better specs 
than the original radio and it should be 4 ohm safe.

Still not sure I followed that other comment about more power at lower 
frequencies though.
	
    66 Toro 
The /\   /\ and Mike     http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/torolist.html


- --
Michael R. Frederick, CEO           Edison3, Incorporated
     Tampa, Florida           Data Translation & Communication
     (813) 210-8649             http://www.cpeq.com/~edison3/

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 13:48:41 PDT
From: "Brent Pinkstaff" <fear_of_tomorrow@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: Re[2]: CCR All Olds Show

  
>     Yupper.  I _did_ wash it before the show!  :-)
>     
>     
>     Joe Padavano
Joe,
I got to tell you, your car was my favorite at the show. My best friend 
and I loved the hell out of it. If you develop some sort of mental 
deterioration and ever decide to sell it give me a call first.

Brent Pinkstaff
70 Cutlass S

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 16:59:55 EDT
From: dpauliso@juno.com (Dave Paulison)
Subject: Dave's back

Hey folks, I'm back.  Had a little 'puter trouble; kept me out of the
loop for a while (for those who may have been wondering...)


Dave Paulison                    1969 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
Palm Bay, Florida                1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GS
dpauliso@juno.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 16:56:44 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: distributors

>> well I can't afford a distributor now...... but as soon as I can I guess I
>> might be able to let my points one go..
>
>Wouldn't it be pointless to go with HEI?  Sorry I couldn't resist the
                                                            ^^^^^^

OK, who's going to work in a smarty comment about that wire that has to be
replaced in this swap...?  ;^)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 16:59:13 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: Olds 307 Dual Snorkel Intake

>> snug between the inner fender and a shield facing the ground.  This picked
>> up a slight ram-air effect while driving (on a cool night the hose and
>> snorkel are cold after driving).
>
>I am a little confused.  A fellow coworker informs me that cold air
>coming
>into the carb is not good.  He says that compressed air is what needs to
>come
>in.  Which is it?

Both cold *and* compressed air, if you can get it (e.g.: turbo
w/intercooler). But, if you only have to settle for one, then it's better
than warm, uncompressed air.
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:09:44 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: coolant overflow

>Some new information, just got off the phone with a guy who is selling an
>Olds 350 Engine (Intake through Pan) with TH350 Tranny for 175 it is still
>running fine (so he says).  

The engine mounts would be the same for a 1964 Jetstar 88, which came with
the 330; you might have to fabricate or adapt a transmission mount, and
adapt the driveshaft. But other than that, it would work. In addition, that
would form the basis for a nice 455 swap... :)
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:07:37 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: Tri-Carb Set-up (was: For Sale: 66 442 Track-Pac)

><<  has a
> fresh 455 w/Tri-Carb setup, correct 400 if wanted goes with car. 455 has
> ..030 forged pistons, Manley valves, 3 angle valve job, 328 degree .475 lift
> cam, M-21 4spd, 3.73 Anti-Spin rear >>
>
>I've got a question for everyone.  I thought the tri-carb set-up was for the
>394's, not the newer style blocks (455's, etc.).  Is this an aftermarket

The J-2 was for the 371, and supposedly doesn't bolt onto the 394
(differences in the heads is it? I don't work with these engines). Of
course, there *is* a tri-power unit that was produced for the 394, but it
was aftermarket (Offenhauser?); someone on the list posted that they had
found one of these 394 manifolds.

So, you could get a factory tri-power for a 371, or a later big-block Olds,
but not for the small-block or the 394. Hmmm, do you think Offy might
produce a 6-pack intake for the Aurora 4.0L engine...? ;)

__________________________________________________________
Bob Barry  	     MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu

1969 Toronado		 455/TH425
     See it at http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/drbob69.htm
1970 Cutlass Supreme SX	 455/TH400
1978 Electra Limited	 409/TH400

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:18:15 -0400
From: "Adcock, Jason K." <jadcock@vt.edu>
Subject: MY day at the races

OK, here's my day at the races.  I line up next to a...Caravan.  My heart
starts racing.  I think, "Can I win?  Will he choke?"  I can hear all the
muscle cars roaring down the track in the back of my mind.  I can invision
myself pouncing on the relentless 307, sailing past the finish line in 3rd
gear, my 2.29's in the rear axle pleading for mercy.  Yes, I'm going to
KILL this Caravan!  I look up from the tach, which seems to be acting up
again; the RPM's say 1200 and my foot's not even on the gas...hmmm...  I
look up from the tach at the vast expanses of pavement ahead, just begging
not to be ripped up by my 215/70's.  I can almost hear the burnout strip
pleading for the race to be called off; it can't handle the 307's power,
compounded by the fact that my AT-200-C puts power to the ground so well. 
Never mind all that, the race is about to start.  We stage at the line.  My
307 humming, ready to pounce.  The van pulls up, the driver looks over.  I
say, "Gee, ma'am.  Aren't all your kids going to weigh you down?"  She
looks back at the track.  I can see the top light come on.  Here it is! 
The lights make their way down the tree.  I rev the engine to about 4000
rpm...the lights make it down to...GREEN!  I throw it into Drive and listen
for the tire squeal..."CHIRP".  YESS!!  The cars gain speed, the Taurus and
I are DEAD even!  I have some time before the finish line...I pour a cup of
coffee and whip out the laptop.  Sneakingly, I look both ways and plug it
into the lighter.  I turn the thing on and wait for Windows 95 to boot;
MAN, this is slow...the computer isn't in any hurry, either!  SECOND GEAR! 
Yess!!  We're still dead even--alright!  Open Netscape mail and log in and
read some email list posts.  Sip some tea and answer some posts, yep, life
is great!  THIRD GEAR!  Alright!  Man, that finish line is far away!  Oh,
yeah, I had to study for the Math test.  Hmm, digging around in the back
seat for that book sure is tough when you're trying to beat a Caravan in a
drag race!  Here it is!  Yep, 1+1=2, woah--the finish line is finally
here!  We pass the line dead even!  I slam on the brakes and look back for
my time...19.0 seconds!  Yess!!  My best yet.  :-)
- -- 
Jason K. Adcock
jadcock@vt.edu
OCA #028044

http://www.erols.com/adcockjk
1984 Cutlass Supreme Calais
1992 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 97 16:31:52 -0500
From: "padavano.joe" <padavano.joe@orbital.com>
Subject: Re[4]: CCR All Olds Show

..Doh! Anyway, before you start the restoration we should get our W-30s 
together for a "bookends" photo. My W-30 convertible is the same color 
(Sebring Yellow?) and in similar shape. Although, yours has more sheet 
metal. :)

     Ray,
     
     Console yourself in the fact that lighter=faster!  ;-)
     
     Yes, mine _used_ to be Sebring Yellow, before the oxidized, faded 
     color it is now.
     
     Joe Padavano
     padavano.joe@orbital.com
     
     66 442
     68 W-30
     69 H/O
     70 W-30

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:21:45 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: Catalogs...

>Is there any other Olds catalogs other than Mondello...I saw something 
>around here about Oldsmobile USA, and I also know about Batten...could 
>anyone tell me how to get a hold of 

I've also had good experiences with Dick Miller Racing (DMR), Fusick's
Automotive, and Year One

Fusick Automotive
P.O. Box 655
East Windsor, CT 06088
(860) 623-1589
Cutlass/442 & 88/98
mailto:dj442@ix.netcom.com
Click on the MailTo link above
to order free catalog. Specify
year and model of car.

Year One, Inc.
P.O. Box 129
Tucker, GA 30085
(800) 950-9503
Cutlass/442  
http://www.yearone.com

Dick Miller Racing
2374 Windemere Drive
Jackson, MI  49202-1236
Phone: 517-782-2012 EST
FAX: 517-782-2232

The above are the few suppliers whom I have dealt with, and with whom I've
been satisfied. Others will share their opinions, both positive and
negative, about these and other places, I'm sure. Oh, I've also dealt with
Olds Parts USA, and have been very satisfied with their service as well. I
haven't bought anything from Mondello in ages, though I've had his catalog
around, and I bought his stuff through DMR when he was still the Eastern
Distributor.

These and many other suppliers can be found on Bryceman's most excellent
web-page, at http://www.442.com/oldsparts.html .
__________________________________________________________
Bob Barry  	     MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu

1969 Toronado		 455/TH425
     See it at http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/drbob69.htm
1970 Cutlass Supreme SX	 455/TH400
1978 Electra Limited	 409/TH400

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:25:30 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: Trans Troubles (fwd)

>>     OK, please provide a little more info.  Do you mean it won't shift up 
>>     to second (thus the engine RPM just keeps building until you let off 
>>     the gas)?  Or does the trans actually start slipping at a certain RPM, 
>>     causing the engine to suddenly increase revs dramatically with no 
>>     increase in speed of the car?
>It will stay in low then go straight into neutral until the gas is let off
>& then it will go back in low (at an understandably low RPM).
>
>>     Will the car finally upshift at a high speed?  If the vacuum modulator 
>>     is not working properly, the trans will think the engine is at WOT and 
>>     will upshift on governor command only.  This will be a pretty harsh 
>>     shift.
>No, not at all.  

If it simply stayed in first forever, then I'd suspect that the Governor
was shot (either the gear was stripped or the shaft was stuck). Maybe it
is; since this can be removed with the tranny in the car, I'd pull it to
see if it is working first, before doing anything else.
__________________________________________________________
Bob Barry  	     MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu

1969 Toronado		 455/TH425
     See it at http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/drbob69.htm
1970 Cutlass Supreme SX	 455/TH400
1978 Electra Limited	 409/TH400

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:28:34 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: question about rear end gearing

>> mph=tire radius/168*engine rpm/gear ratio
>
>I was trying this formula out and am a little confused.  If I have
>245R60/14s going 5000 rpm with a 3.08 gear ratio what is the mph?
>I believe the tire I have are 25 inches in diameter.  Therefore:
>mph = 12.5 / 168 * 5000 / 3.08 = 120.7 mph.  Is this right?

That sounds about right, though you'd also need the hp to turn at that rpm.
My SX, with it's 2.56 rear, has an astronomical theoretical top-end, though
I'd imagine it's hp limited to around 130mph. Of course, reducing drag
would reduce the need for hp, so some aerodynamic tricks might get it up to
the 140-150mph range, but I'd run out of Rhode Island quickly if I tried
doing that here...
__________________________________________________________
Bob Barry  	     MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu

1969 Toronado		 455/TH425
     See it at http://www.execpc.com/~gkalkhof/drbob69.htm
1970 Cutlass Supreme SX	 455/TH400
1978 Electra Limited	 409/TH400

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:32:12 -0400
From: Robert Barry <rbarry@sequent1.providence.edu>
Subject: Re: Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!

>Need help with Thermac air cleaner!!
>
>Eneryone,
>     Can someone please help me?!! This past weekend I decided to paint the
>air cleaner housing on my '87 Cutlass Supreme. After finishing and hooking
>everything up, the little vacum controlled door in the snorkel won't open!

It opens when it sees manifold vacuum, which that little thermostatic
switch on the underside of the air cleaner provides once the air is warm
enough. Run that flap to straight manifold vacuum; if it opens, it's not
the problem; oh, wait, isn't that flap normally open, and closed by vacuum?
If so, you may have bypassed that thermostatic switch, which makes the flap
think it's constantly cold, and unwilling to open.

>It stays in hot air mode constantly! It has no pick up and go anymore and I
>used almost a half of a tank of gas to go 50 miles!! I don't believe it's
>stuck because the door does move. Could it be the two vacum hoses that hook
>up to the sensor in the air cleaner? Please someone help!! I can't afford
>to fill the tank up every two days!
>Thanks.
>
>Andy Geeting
>
_______________________________________________________
Dr. Robert Barry  MailTo:RBarry@Sequent1.Providence.Edu
Theology Dept, Providence College, Providence, RI 02918

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:43:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: RISHIG@aol.com
Subject: How do I get off This List

Anyone Have information on getting of this list?

RISHIG@aol.com

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 23:49:49 +0100
From: Roland Klinger <Roland.Klinger@bonn.netsurf.de>
Subject: crankcase pressure

Hello all, especially Robert Berry

Robert, you mentionned my scientific experiment about excessive crankcase
pressure ( can't quote it because I didn't find it any more in all those
digests):

Before the results will be published in the "Journal of Experimental
Crankcase Physics", I can tell everybody here in The Olds List that cutting
off crankcase ventilation enables you to 

1) have a complete rust protection under the car because of the oil being
brought to every place including the inner rear bumper and trunk hood.

2) have all gas station managers clap their hands because you are marking
the point with a big oil mark where everybody is supposed to stop for
fuelling up.

3) having all followers on the Autobahn remember that they wanted to fill
their windshield washer fluid container with a real washer fluid instead
with pure water.

4) remember that a quart of oil every 50 miles costs money

5) never make an oil change any more: you got the ideal free flow lubrication.

6) think about a change because it's a real damage for environment.( :-{ )

No Nobel Price!!

Greetings, Roland

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:33:56 -0500
From: Thomas Martin <Thomas_Martin@css.mot.com>
Subject: Re: 350 Head Gaskets

I have been told that the McCord gasket for a Pontiac V8 is .038
compressed, it is not a copper gasket.  

Maybe someone can verify it, I have got good prices and service from
Columbus Performance Products in Columbus, MD.

My 455 Pontiac rering kit with oil pump, bearings, rings, gaskets was
only $115.  Might be worth checking out.

Thomas Martin
85 Cutlass Supreme Rocket 350 CCC

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 19:05:24 -0400
From: "DAVID  BETZ" <dbetz@netwalk.com>
Subject: Re: Delta 88 Wheels

I have not been able to look at my mail for a while.  What was your
question about Delta 88 wheels?

David Betz
dbetz@netwalk.com


- ----------
> From: John S.Shelp <shelpj@noln.com>
> To: oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca
> Subject: Delta 88 Wheels
> Date: Thursday, August 14, 1997 3:37 AM
> 
> I am still waiting for a answer to my wheel question.
> John Shelp 
> 

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 18:50:04 -0400
From: gbro@juno.com (Glenn B Brobeck)
Subject: 65 <4|4|2> List Only

The 1965 442 has been my only four wheeled love since 65.  Dominated the
strip straight out of the box and with a little engine work (well I
usually went overboard in those days. I made enough money on the streets
to finance what it needed.) so that tells you it ran pretty darn good on
the street too.Not that I have anything against the later 442's (other
than they weren't as quick) I'de just like to see a list of ONLY the
65's.Name:Address: "optional"State:Phone: "optional"     This is mine.   
                                        65 <4|4|2>                  
color:    Black   AA65 <4|4|2>                Interior:    White65
<4|4|2>Buckets or bench:    Buckets65 <4|4|2>   4 speed or auto:    4
Speed65 <4|4|2>     Coupe or Post:    Holiday CoupeIf you know of any out
there for sale or any parts, include them in your reply.Thanks,BRO   
GBRO@juno.com65 <4|4|2>

------------------------------

Date: Sun, 12 Oct 1997 19:25:21 -0400
From: gbro@juno.com (Glenn B Brobeck)
Subject: 65 <4|4|2> LIST ONLY

Am I Putting this on this thread the right way? If not ream me out and
then tell me the way to do it right.

The 1965 442 has been my only four wheeled love since 65.  Dominated the
strip straight out of the box and with a little engine work (well I
usually went overboard in those days. I made enough money on the streets
to finance what it needed.) so that tells you it ran pretty darn good on
the street too.Not that I have anything against the later 442's (other
than they weren't as quick) I'de just like to see a list of ONLY the
65's.Name:Address: "optional"State:Phone: "optional"     This is mine.   
                                        65 <4|4|2>                  
color:    Black   AA65 <4|4|2>                Interior:    White65
<4|4|2>Buckets or bench:    Buckets65 <4|4|2>   4 speed or auto:    4
Speed65 <4|4|2>     Coupe or Post:    Holiday CoupeIf you know of any out
there for sale or any parts, include them in your reply.Thanks,BRO   
GBRO@juno.com65 <4|4|2>

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 17:56:00 -0600
From: Charley Buehner <buehner@lyrea.com>
Subject: Re: A story I heard

>
>        Your friend is correct. There was a strike at GM in 71 and it did
>make them just warm the cars over for 72. The new body style was slated for
>72 vice 73.

Wow!  Kinda makes ya wonder what happened in '81!!!!!
    
             Charley Buehner       | mailto:buehner@lyrea.com
             Box 524               | mailto:charley@rocketship.com
             Sidney, Montana 59270 | http://www.lyrea.com/~buehner
             "Rockit 1"            | '81 Olds Cutlass 425
             "BT UR 4D"            | '70 Buick GS 455
	     "TRBO LVR" (Maybe???:)| '83 Turbo Regal
               	     Real Cars ~Don't~ Wear Bowties!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:21:25 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: Numbers question?

Gary Manton wrote:
 
> 64    3467BODYLA  3833
> TRIM 993  PAINT W

64 = 1964
3467 = Oldsmobile (3) Dynamic 88 convertible (467)
BODYLA 3833 = Lansing built body and sequence number
TRIM 993 = two tone blue all-morocceen interior, Dk blue carpeting,
blue  convertible boot
W = Midnight Mist (dark blue metallic)
convertible tops were available in white, black, light blue and saddle.

Paul 
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

If you throw a cat out a car window, does it become kitty litter?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:14:56 -0400
From: "W-MACHINES" <W-MACHINES@prodigy.net>
Subject: Re: The list people and their cars

Kurt Shubert
Wickliffe OH
W-MACHINES@prodigy.net

'65 JetStar 1,  factory 4-speed, posi, build sheet
'66 442 Sport Coupe,  4-speed
'66 442 F-85 Deluxe, factory Tri-Carb
'70 Toronado GT W-34, 4-Sale
'92 Achieva SCX W-41,  Centennial parade car
'90 Trofeo, VIC computer. daily driver

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:14:03 -0400
From: "W-MACHINES" <W-MACHINES@prodigy.net>
Subject: 1970 Toronado GT W-34 For Sale

Very original W-34 for sale.  Jade Green, blk vyn top, green cloth Deluxe
interior. Excellent condition, drive anywhere.  At Norwalk, OH last 6 years
for Mondello's Olds Nationals. $4,800.00

Kurt Shubert
Wickliffe, OH
(216) 944-8807
(216) 288-5551
W-MACHINES@prodigy.net

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:30:39 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: 1963 Starfire spare tire / jack stowage

Ted Loranz wrote:
 
> Does anyone now how the spare tire & jack are stowed in the 1963 88
> series. I think I have all the parts but can't figure out how to put
> them together and the trunk label is illegible.

If you've got a hardtop, the spare tire goes up on that shelf above the
axle.  The left side of the tire pushes against a stop and the right
side is held in place with the foot of the jack put over bolt connected
in that area and held in place by a wing nut.  The jack should bolt to
the trunk floor, on the ledge right inside the trunk opening, on the
right side.  There should be a bold mounted to the floor in this area
and a bracket that goes over of it, held in place by a small wing nut. 
Can't help you if you've got a convertible, have no experience with
those.

Paul 

> 1963 Starfire Coupe

Guess I should learn to read...
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

If you throw a cat out a car window, does it become kitty litter?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:32:35 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: '61 Starfire Top Question

ANTIQOLDS@aol.com wrote:
> 
> Hi Paul
>   I was at Hershey also about 10 cars down the row from the 61 Starfire. I
> showed her some pictures of my 61 Starfire but none of them showed the silver
> stripe on the roof. My car is an original 50,000 mile car and has this
> stripe. Starfire was the only model to use it and 61 was the only year. If I
> had the equipment I would scan in a picture to you, want me to mail you a
> picture?
> 
> Everett   OCA# 1961   1961 Starfire

Yeah, that would be neat, I'd like to see one of these with the stripes,
but I'd rather that you send a photo to someone that can post it to
their web site so we can all see it.

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

If you throw a cat out a car window, does it become kitty litter?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:39:08 +0000
From: Paul Hartlieb <plh@nbn.net>
Subject: Re: '61 Starfire Top Question

Robert Barry wrote:

> Oh, yes, this is how to tell an original top, as no replacements are
> available with that "stripe". Actually, it's more like a colored vinyl band
> that's part of the top vinyl; it's not raised, embroidered, ironed on or
> anything like that, and would be *very* difficult to duplicate. It followed
> the contour of the side windows, and was a couple inches wide.
> 
> The two '61 Starfires I've seen in person (Everett Horton's '61, and
> Berejik's '61) have the origiinal tops, and this band. I don't know where
> else I've seen this, but I don't think the color was limited to silver; I
> think it was body-color, as Berejik's '61 was blue, and if I recall what I
> saw that day, I believe the edge of the top was a shade of blue as well.
> Everett Horton can help you out more on this one, though.

... and he has...

Well, this stripe thing has been confimed by three people on this list,
so it must be Gospel, right?

This list can always teach you something new about Oldsmobiles, even to
us know-it-alls.

Paul
- -- 
Paul Hartlieb
plh@nbn.net
'67 Ninety Eight Holiday Coupe
'72 Cutlass Supreme Convertible

If you throw a cat out a car window, does it become kitty litter?

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 21:47:36 -0300 (ADT)
From: Greg Beaulieu <ab348@chebucto.ns.ca>
Subject: '78 Delta: Shot Myself in the Foot

OK, so yesterday I devoted to doing chores on the Delta. Started out real 
good by replacing the rear bumper with the one I bought at the swap meet 
in Lansing. Good thing I did. The old aluminum inner bar that bolts to 
the rams was just about totally rotted away behind the brackets. No more 
than a tap would have totally knocked it off. The problem is with the 2 
dissimilar metals (steel brackets and aluminum beam) working against each 
other. With the replacement I shot the better part of a can of Rust Check 
inside the thing, hopefully that will buy a little time. The swap 
couldn't have gone any easier. 

Then I did a little body repair, went real good. Emboldened by my success 
so far, I then decided to clean up and adjust the carb. The Delta always 
had a little bit of a rough idle, part of which I attributed to a leaky 
power brake booster grommet I discovered last week. Replacing that helped 
some, but I figured I could get it even smoother. Big mistake.

I had bought some new PCV and vac hose just in case. Inspecting the 
engine the PCV hose looked a little questionable, so that got replaced. 
The valve is new too. The vac hose didn't look bad and had no obvious 
leaks. I did note that the TVS switch on the air cleaner had been 
disconnected, but I don't know if I knocked it off in removing the 
cleaner or not. It controls vacuum to the choke vacuum break and to the 
air cleaner thermac valve.

I started the engine and started in with the carb cleaner. The carb was 
quite dirty and I removed a lot of varnish from the choke plates and 
presumably inside too. While the air cleaner was off I cleaned it up 
inside and out. I hooked up my tach (took me a while to figure out how to 
do that with HEI -- you use pin #6 and the ground on the diagnostic 
connector). The mixture screws had previously been played with and the 
sealed caps removed. The mixture responded a little to adjustment (I made 
it leaner), but not dramatically so. Didn't touch the choke or the idle 
screw.

Put the air cleaner back on, car is idling nicely. Put it in gear, it 
starts to chug badly. Hmmm. Sounded like it was going to die, idle 
dropped way down. Never did that before. Back under the hood, checked and 
rechecked everything. Nothing obvious. Vac hoses all present and 
accounted for, no visible leaks, nothing visually wrong. At that point 
the heater core which went bad 2 weeks ago, then fixed itself, decided to 
give up the ghost for good. Nice timing. I had to repair that, so I 
abandoned the engine situation and dove into that. That went surprisingly 
well, but that killed the evening.

Tonight after work I got into the engine again. I cannot adjust the idle
speed enough to stop the slow, chuggy rough idle in gear. I am stumped. 
Can't figure what might cause something like that to develop given the
relatively minimal changes I made. 

It makes me wonder if there aren't other problems (EGR valve maybe?) that
the previous owner worked around somehow, and by returning everything to
spec I recreated the original problem. Any thoughts on this one? I really
need to get this fixed ASAP. I have visions of it dying on me in traffic. 
Thanks in advance... 

Greg Beaulieu        ab348@chebucto.ns.ca        Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 20:49:40 -0500
From: Matt Cremean <ccremean@edcen.ehhs.cmich.edu>
Subject: Re: MY day at the races

Adcock, Jason K. wrote:
> 
> OK, here's my day at the races.  I line up next to a...Caravan.  My heart
> starts racing.  I think, "Can I win?  Will he choke?"  I can hear all the
> muscle cars roaring down the track in the back of my mind.  I can invision
> myself pouncing on the relentless 307, sailing past the finish line in 3rd
> gear, my 2.29's in the rear axle pleading for mercy.  Yes, I'm going to
> KILL this Caravan!  I look up from the tach, which seems to be acting up
> again; the RPM's say 1200 and my foot's not even on the gas...hmmm...  I
> look up from the tach at the vast expanses of pavement ahead, just begging
> not to be ripped up by my 215/70's.  I can almost hear the burnout strip

Man, that's gotta hurt! Jason, that was an absolute waste of my time,
but it was still pretty humorous. I can't believe you wasted all that
precious BANDWIDTH!!! ;-)

- -- 
**********************************
Matt Cremean
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
CreamerSoft© Software
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Park/5988/creamersoft.html
+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=
1973 Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme
http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Vista/3973/73olds.html
**********************************

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 18:06:54 -0000
From: "Rod Beydler" <rodsmobile@mscomm.com>
Subject: Date:	Tue, 14 Oct 1997 18:06:54 -0000

unsubscribe oldsmobile

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 21:24:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Jon442@aol.com
Subject: dessicant?

I am sandblasting some parts, and putting them in baggies as soon as they are
blasted, but they are rusting in the baggies. I'm trying to get all of the
motor brackets blasted so I can take them to be powdercoated, but at this
rate they will all be rusty again before I can get them all finished.

Anyone have an idea of anything I can put in the baggies to use as a
dessicant until I can get them all blasted and taken to the powdercoat shop?

Thanks,

Jon Wessel

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 21:29:58 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Chris Brown Witt" <wittchri@pilot.msu.edu>
Subject: Tuscon 70 88 f/sale

For you folks in the Sw or needing a '70 88...


> From wittchri@pilot.msu.edu Sat Oct 11 23:46:57 1997
> Message-ID: <344048D8.359B@pilot.msu.edu>
> Date: Sat, 11 Oct 1997 23:49:44 -0400
>
> Date of Posting: 8/9/97
> Email Address: rvanh@goodnet.com
> Description: 1970 delta 88 car runs perfect every thing works 99%
> originalcallon phone at
> 520-887-3271 priced to sell quick
> City: tucson
> State: Arizona

- --
Chris  B. Witt
*the* Rocket Scientist, fleet includes '68 Toro, 442, and 442...
wittchri@pilot.msu.edu

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 21:32:46 -0400
From: Dave Ward <ward@ptbo.igs.net>
Subject: Cyl.'s 3&5, steady miss...

After all of the time, effort, and money that I've put into my '78 Delta
(350 4bbl.), I can't seem to shake a steady miss in cylinders 3 and 5. 
When I had the car in at the auto shop, I had it hooked up to the engine
analyzer, and it ran through it's normal battery of tests.  There is one
test where the analyzer will shut off one cylinder at a time, and then
calculate how many revs the engine dropped. 

For most cylinders, it ranged from -19 to -55, but on cylinders three
and five, the results were +1 and +5!  What that says is that when
cylinder five is shut off, the engine speeds up 5rpm!  So, I pulled all
the plugs out of the left bank, and they all look the same (less than
1200km on them).  They all were showing normal burn patterns!  I
compression tested all cyl.'s in that bank, and here are the results:

#1--136
#3--140
#5--142
#7--135

Doesn't that eliminate a faulty head gasket?  There's no coolant in the
oil, and it only shoots white smoke at cold start-up, so that ~has~ to
rule that out.  The dist. cap, rotor, wires and plugs are all new (cap &
rotor el cheapo), and I just finished having the carb professionally
rebuilt.  

I'm calling on all of the top brains for an answer to this one...

Any answers would ge greatly appreciated, because I'd like to avoid
professional attention if possible....no payola ($$$)!

S. Dave Ward	(Ennismore, Ontario, CANADA)

'78 Delta 88 (350 4bbl.)
'85 Delta 88 (307 4bbl.)
'91 GMC 4x4  (305 TBI)

P.S.--Greg...I think we may have similar troubles regarding a rough idle
when in gear!

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 21:57:33 -0400
From: dgerow@student.stonehill.edu (Daniel R. Gerow)
Subject: Re: speaker ohm question?

Mike Frederick wrote:

> Most modern speakers are 4 ohms but older
> cars used 8 and even 10 ohms.  I agree with what you said about higher
>
> ohms being safer but going from 8 to 4 ohms doubles the load on the
> amp.
> If the amp was built for a 4 ohm load, fine -- if not...

You got it.  Older speaker setup got as high as 16 ohms...a 4x10
straight outta my 66 C*ddy had one.  I assumed the deck was relativly
new, but that is a bad on my part.

> Best bet is to add a power amp.  Even a cheap one will have better
> specs
> than the original radio and it should be 4 ohm safe.

Crutchfield is selling a BLAUPUNKT amp in two models:  the Velocity 220
or 420.  The 220 being 2 x 20 watts and the 420 being 4 x 20 watts at a
rated THD of 0.03 %.  Not bad for $39.99 and $59.99 respectively.  I
have the 420 in my car right now and it is damn good.

Daniel

- --
Daniel R. Gerow
WSHL-FM 91.3
General Manager
Stonehill College Radio
- -----------------------
http://www.stonehill.edu
http://www.stonehill.edu/wshl
http://www2.stonehill.edu/~dgerow
- ---------------------------------

------------------------------

End of oldsmobile-digest V1 #905
********************************

